Metagame AG Metagame Discussion


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Welcome to Sword and Shield Anything Goes! This thread will be used for all things related to the new metagame - theorymonning, metagame observations, and set sharing are all encouraged! Since we're entering a new generation, I'll clarify exactly how AG is going to work:

  • No Megas, Primals or Z-moves: This should go without saying, but since these mechanics have been removed in Sword and Shield they will not be usable in the gen 8 metagame. Bye-bye Mega Rayquaza, Primal Groudon and Ultra Necrozma!
  • Galar Dex and Released Pokemon only: This is probably the most significant change from last generation. No more Arceus, no more Primal Groudon, no more Ultra Necrozma, etc. In addition, Pokemon or movesets that are coded into Sword and Shield but aren't yet available ingame will not be usable.
  • In-game Restrictions only: As it's always been in Gen6 and Gen7 of Anything Goes, you're allowed to use whatever you want provided it's available via normal cartridge play. That means you can run OHKO moves and Evasion to your heart's content, but you still can't put Fissure on a Pichu since it doesn't learn it normally.
Early Metagame Impressions


This is metagame defining, it outspeeds basically everything, has an insane special attack stat, gets good STABs, coverage moves and Nasty Plot, can hold items and even Dynamax. This will probably be a staple in the metagame due to which revenge killers like Ditto and Marshadow might become popular options.

Kyogre seems to be one of the most dangerous pokemon in this metagame without Primal Groudon and Mega Rayquaza. Choice Specs Kyogre can easily break through bulky and stall teams. The Life Orb CM set continues to be a massive threat, but HP Flying not making it past DLC2 does harm its viability a bit. The Choice Scarf variant can outspeed nearly the entire unboosted metagame and does a fine job as a breaker or late-game sweeper.

Zygarde-Complete has always been a solid defensive wall. Support Arceus formes not existing anymore boosts its viability by a lot - the Dragon Dance set is likely to extremely popular as there aren’t many viable Zygarde-C checks.

Necrozma-DM, Yveltal and Zacian
These 3 will likely continue to be the premier pokemon of the metagame. Zacian-C’s viability might be hurt a little because of Calyrex potentially taking its spot as the 'best pokemon' but only time will tell.

In a metagame with viable weather setters and sweepers, and no permanent weather (Harsh Sunlight, Primordial Sea and Delta Stream), weather is bound to flourish. Sand and Rain seem to be really good and will possibly become a really common playstyle.

Ditto loves an offensive metagame. This metagame is flooded with breakers and sweepers and we lack solid defensive walls to check these. Ditto might be our lord and saviour for this generation.

Thats all - Feel free to discuss!
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Calyrex-Shadow @ Life Orb
Ability: As One
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Nasty Plot
- Leaf Storm / Draining Kiss
- Psyshock
- Astral Barrage

+2 252 SpA Life Orb Calyrex Astral Barrage vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Kyogre: 454-536 (133.1 - 157.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 SpA Life Orb Calyrex Astral Barrage vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Zacian-Crowned: 539-637 (165.8 - 196%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 SpA Life Orb Calyrex Astral Barrage vs. 12 HP / 48 SpD Zygarde-Complete: 604-711 (104.8 - 123.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 SpA Life Orb Calyrex Leaf Storm vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Tyranitar in Sand: 424-499 (104.9 - 123.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 SpA Life Orb Calyrex Psyshock vs. 0 HP / 252 Def Eviolite Chansey: 586-691 (91.4 - 107.8%) -- 50% chance to OHKO
+2 252 SpA Life Orb Calyrex Draining Kiss vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Yveltal: 385-455 (97.9 - 115.7%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO
+2 252 SpA Life Orb Calyrex Astral Barrage vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Multiscale Lugia: 419-493 (100.7 - 118.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
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lets get started shall we?

zap zap zap zap zap

zap zap zap zap


252+ SpA Choice Specs Transistor Regieleki Rising Voltage (140 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Necrozma-Dusk-Mane in Electric Terrain: 565-666 (141.9 - 167.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Transistor Regieleki Rising Voltage (140 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Dynamax Calyrex-Shadow in Electric Terrain: 735-865 (107.7 - 126.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Transistor Regieleki Rising Voltage (140 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Zacian-Crowned in Electric Terrain: 543-639 (166.5 - 196%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Transistor Regieleki Rising Voltage (140 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Dynamax Kyogre in Electric Terrain: 914-1076 (134 - 157.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Transistor Regieleki Thunderbolt vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Dynamax Yveltal in Electric Terrain: 798-942 (101.5 - 119.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Transistor Regieleki Rising Voltage (140 BP) vs. 4 HP / 252+ SpD Eviolite Chansey in Electric Terrain: 285-336 (44.3 - 52.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

koko + this beats pretty much everything that isn't a ground type, amazing mon i love it


Where all is set.
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Guess who's back....

That's right! Dem Kyogres have returned and this time, with no sight of Primal Groudon! :v4:

Unfortunately there's no way this Pokemon is gonna get back to being as good as it was before XY. With more special walls, Dynamax, and the newly revealed Regieleki being brought into the format there are a lot more obstacles it has to face nowadays, especially in comparison to the likes of Dusk Mane, Yveltal, and Calyrex-Shadow Rider. However, I assume it's safe to say Kyogre is back to being a big threat again. This Pokemon will be useful if players using it can fish dynamax from a Pokemon earlier in a match and be able to break stuff by spamming Water Spout afterwards. It could clean a lot of games.

Here are some Timid Nature calculations. Be aware that Regieleki still outspeeds Choice Scarf Kyogre.

252 SpA Kyogre Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Blissey in Rain: 313-370 (43.8 - 51.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252 SpA Kyogre Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Blissey in Rain: 313-370 (43.8 - 51.8%) -- 12.5% chance to 2HKO
252 SpA Kyogre Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Xerneas in Rain: 415-490 (105.5 - 124.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Kyogre Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Zacian-Crowned in Rain: 364-429 (111.6 - 131.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Kyogre Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 136 HP / 52 SpD Groudon in Sun: 278-330 (74.1 - 88%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252 SpA Kyogre Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Necrozma-Dusk-Mane in Rain: 379-447 (95.2 - 112.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
252 SpA Kyogre Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Necrozma-Dusk-Mane in Rain: 306-360 (76.8 - 90.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Kyogre Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 12 HP / 48 SpD Zygarde in Rain: 406-478 (112.7 - 132.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO // 252 SpA Kyogre Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 12 HP / 48 SpD Zygarde-Complete in Rain: 406-478 (70.4 - 82.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
*252 SpA Kyogre Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Calyrex Shadow Rider in Rain: 409-483 (119.9 - 141.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO

*Mew was used as the base

The calculations above were of it against some of its fiercest competition in the offense department, Blissey, Groudon, and some other metagame titans Kyogre will have to be dealing with.

Down below is a Modest spread. In addition to Regieleki it will notoriously be outsped by Zacian-Crowned and Calyrex-Shadow Rider. This will hinder the Pokemon significantly but once those titans are cleared out Kyogre will do a lot more damage.

252+ SpA Kyogre Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Blissey in Rain: 345-406 (48.3 - 56.8%) -- 90.2% chance to 2HKO
252+ SpA Kyogre Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Blissey in Rain: 345-406 (48.3 - 56.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252+ SpA Kyogre Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Necrozma-Dusk-Mane in Rain: 417-492 (104.7 - 123.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Kyogre Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Lugia in Rain: 309-364 (74.2 - 87.5%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

These are a couple defensive walls.

Specially defensive Dusk Mane and Groudon sets still get 2HKOed. Blissey always gets 2HKOed. This could hurt Kyogre's chances of inflicting consistent damage on its foes since having it chipped lowers Water Spout's BP. Stealth Rock like always, is also still around and Kyogre will have to rely on a reliable defogger to help maximize its potential to the fullest. In addition, Yveltal has become an absolute monstrosity and will gladly Sucker Punch Kyogre's Water Spout BP to being out of the equation if needed. Using Kyogre is higher maintenance than it was prior to XY despite pdon being gone but under the right conditions the vast majority of offense Pokemon are done for.

What I have posted is specifically for Choice Scarf. It will still be able to run Choice Specs and Calm Mind sets to break what it can't. However it'll struggle by being slower than the many offense threats it can defeat with Scarf.
My thoughts so far.

Please be aware my only AG experience is in ndag.

:yveltal: :xerneas: :calyrex: :kyogre: :zacian-c: :zygarde-complete:

These all look absolutely terrifying. Calyrex has a ridiculous offensive power and Stab, Zacian-c does zacian things and zygod is incredibly hard to counter and ygod while it still has t tar and diancie it appreciates arceus going bye bye.

:ss/rayquaza: This looks like a pretty potent cleaner and breaker with options like v create and Stab airstream.

:shedinja: this hasn't been given nearly enough credit. The loss of hidden power and other checks and counters is rlly nice. You can compress a blanket check to non crunch Zacian, zygod, xern, kyogre, palkia, dialga.

Now that's all said. Let's go!


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I know everyone has a lot to talk about with the cool new mons being released with this new DLC, but I just wanted to quickly draw your attention to a few quirky facts x]

1. Dracovish is capable of dealing an insane amount of damage with Fishious Rend boosted by Strong Jaw, STAB, Choice Band, and Fishious Rend's 2x damage multiplier if it moves first. The total damage multiplier is [1.5 * 1.5 * 1.5 * 2 = 6.75]

2. The only reliable Dracovish switch-ins were Primal-Groudon and defensive Arceus-Water

3. Primals and Arceus forms have been removed with this new DLC

Yep. There are now zero reliable switch-ins to Dracovish. Under Trick Room, not only does Dracovish sweep pretty easily barring an enemy Dynamax, but it is also immune to getting Ditto'd. Even if Trick Room wears off, a scarfed minimum speed Dracovish with -spe nature and 0 speed ivs will only have 209 speed, which can be easily threatened by something on your team.

Furthermore, paraspam might be decent on balance teams without ditto thanks to removal of Arceus-Ground and Primal-Groudon and the introduction of a lot of fast sweepers and dynamax abusers that boost their own speed with stab moves. Dracovish can also abuse paralysis and claim a free kill here or there.

:dracovish: vs. defensive :ferrothorn:
252+ Atk Choice Band Strong Jaw Dracovish Fishious Rend (170 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Ferrothorn: 210-247 (59.6 - 70.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

:dracovish: vs. defensive :necrozma-dusk-mane:
252+ Atk Choice Band Strong Jaw Dracovish Fishious Rend (170 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Necrozma-Dusk-Mane: 324-382 (81.4 - 95.9%) -- 12.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

:dracovish: vs. defensive :yveltal:
252+ Atk Choice Band Strong Jaw Dracovish Fishious Rend (170 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Yveltal: 397-468 (87 - 102.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

:dracovish: vs. defensive :zygarde:
252+ Atk Choice Band Strong Jaw Dracovish Fishious Rend (170 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Zygarde: 336-396 (80 - 94.2%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

:dracovish: vs. :rayquaza-mega:
252+ Atk Choice Band Strong Jaw Dracovish Fishious Rend (170 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Rayquaza-Mega: 264-312 (75.2 - 88.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

:dracovish: vs. :kyogre:
252+ Atk Choice Band Strong Jaw Dracovish Fishious Rend (170 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Kyogre in Rain: 434-511 (127.2 - 149.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO

:dracovish: vs. :zacian-crowned:
252+ Atk Choice Band Strong Jaw Dracovish Fishious Rend (170 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Zacian-Crowned: 472-556 (144.7 - 170.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO

:dracovish: vs. Calyrex-Shadow
252+ Atk Choice Band Strong Jaw Dracovish Fishious Rend (170 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Calyrex-Shadow: 637-751 (186.8 - 220.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
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formerly mc56556
Hey, all!

I just wanted to share a few early thoughts/observations about Galar Dex AG so far. I'm curious to know what you all are thinking as well!

The biggest focus so far has been on Calyrex-Shadow. Its offensive stats are insane, along with its movepool (including access to Nasty Plot) and ability, which essentially is a combination of a Special Attack version of Moxie and Unnerve. It's early in the meta, of course, but I've even seen some people running Sash and Scarf Calyrex-Shadow to try and offset the power of Ditto Impostering it.

:Groudon::Venusaur: I've really enjoyed building a couple of Sun teams so far. We're reintroduced in this meta to the best weather-setters there are: Groudon and Kyogre. Having Groudon is nice because it serves as an Electric-immune Pokémon for Electric spam teams with Regieleki and Tapu Koko. Venusaur is a fun and powerful sweeper with access to Sleep Powder, Growth (which automically boosts Venusaur's SpA stat by 2 levels under Sun), great STABs, and of course Chlorophyll to give it a near unbeatable Speed tier under Sun. Sun also allows for a variety of options, like Ho-Oh, Reshiram, even fun options like Volcanion, Volcarona, or Centriskorch if you so choose.

:Kyogre::Barraskewda: Important note: Kyogre no longer has access to any Flying-type moves. Why is this important? Because it means that Kyogre can no longer boost its Speed during Dynamaxing, unlike in Nat Dex AG where it has access to Hiden Power Flying. I'm really curious to see if this will affect the viability of Kyogre's Kyogre as a Dynamaxer. I highlighted that last part because I wonder if we might come to distinguish between Kyogre as an offensive Dynamaxer and Kyogre as a Rain-setter. Yes, it can certainly do both, but if the Dynamaxing set becomes supoptimal with an inability to boost its own Speed, the focus might shift to just setting Rain for Rain teams (or for other purposes as well, which are still to be explored).

:Tyranitar::Blissey: What will the future of stall/semi-stall be in Galar Dex AG? Going into the return of Galar Dex AG, I thought we'd have some viable options like HDB/Shed Shell Blissey or Chansey, SpD Ttar, NDM, and then new additions of course like Lugia and Ho-Oh. Chloe made a great Incineroar set for checking Calyrex-Shadow, so maybe there is some hope, but the start to Galar Dex AG Part 2 has been decidedly offensive. Ditto stall is something familiar to most of us from Nat Dex AG (and even from Gen 7 AG as well), and with Calyrex-Shadow as intimidating as it is, I have a feeling we'll see Ditto pretty often around. The stall enthusiast I am, I'll try to make some teams work. :psysly:

:Rayquaza: :Lugia: I'm excited to check out Dynamax Rayquaza when we're able. It's certainly going to be frightening to check, but if it starts seeing a lot of usage, I have a feeling Lugia's usage will go up considerably. Things could also get messy if we're seeing offense vs. offense slugfests consistently.

That's all for now! Happy exploring, all. :)
popping in to say regieleki is overrated and you should use koko instead

fullroom however

:jirachi::regice::yveltal::kyogre-primal::audino-mega::exeggutor-alola: - NatDex
:jirachi::regice::yveltal::kyogre::carbink::regice: - Gen 8
(regice is a stand-in for calyrex-ice and lunala is a stand-in for calyrex-shadow)

I worked on these teams with my friend, janetplaysag, who some people in the AG community know. What we have discovered is that fullroom is actually a very viable playstyle now, due to the new options.

:jirachi: is a super busted Trick Room setter that switches directly in on :zacian-crowned: at full health and sets Trick Room. It actually checks nearly every physical attacker due to a great type and its 100/100 bulk. It also has Stealth Rock for chip, Iron Head to not be setup and also stop :xerneas:, and U-turn to pivot out. Another good trick room setter is :audino-mega:, which was then replaced with :meloetta:, but was reverted back to :audino-mega:. The purpose of both was to set up trick room on :lunala:, who destroyed Psychic-type setters completely as they couldn't even run :kasib-berry: for the former due to Unnerve. However, :audino-mega: sports an immunity to Trick, has Healing Wish, and can set Trick Room on :yveltal:, while :meloetta: has room for an item slot. and reliable pivoting with U-turn. It was originally used to run :safety-goggles: to set Trick Room on :smeargle:, but after the introduction of :exeggutor-alola:, this was no longer needed. The purpose of :exeggutor-alola: is to be a Trick Room setter that defeats :groudon-primal:, while having offensive presence. For this reason, :uxie: was not used, as it can defeat :groudon-primal: but has no offensive presence and would mostly stack with :jirachi:. Before this, it was :regice:, who is an incredible offensive Trick Room setter, but sadly most :groudon-primal: can work around it. Finally, :carbink: is a great Trick Room setter due to Sturdy, which allows it to run :heavy-duty-boots: and take any non-Mold Breaker attack and set up Trick Room. However, it loses to Taunt due to :mental-herb: being unavailable.

As for the actual Trick Room abusers, :regice: and :kyogre:/:kyogre-primal: are musts. :regice: is an incredibly powerful physical attacker that can OHKO almost the whole metagame after just one or two boosts, and :kyogre:/:kyogre-primal: breaks down walls easily with superpowered Water Spouts, including the Pokemon that get in :regice:'s way like :necrozma-dusk-mane:. :yveltal: is also there, which used to be a :hoopa-unbound:. This is to counter :lunala: and provide a method of speed control outside of Trick Room with Max Airstream. 15 Speed IVs outspeed Jolly :zacian-crowned: at +2, while being as slow as possible, hitting 218 Speed. :stakataka: and :necrozma-dusk-mane: are other great options, functioning the same way as in Gen 7. :aegislash: is a decent option, threatening both :xerneas: with Gyro Ball and :lunala: with Shadow Sneak, as well as having safe setup. Finally, :dracovish: is good in Trick Room for the reasons WSun1 said.

the end use fullroom


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Hello everyone! I have been playing and theorizing about this metagame for the past couple of days and thought I'd post my thoughts here.

To put it bluntly, teambuilding balanced / bulky offensive teams has been fairly one-dimensional in my experience, and this can be boiled down to a multitude of factors.

:sm/xerneas::sm/zacian-crowned: -------> :sm/necrozma-dusk-mane:
Necrozma-DM is, unfortunately, still borderline mandatory. Zacian-C is not the metagame warping threat it was in National Dex AG, but it still very much requires the necessary attention in the teambuilder, and the reality of the matter is that Necrozma-DM remains the only realistically splashable form of counterplay. Beyond that, Xerneas is definitely still among one of the most restricting Pokemon in the metagame, and Necrozma-DM is the most convenient form of counterplay to it. With Primal Groudon's departure, fitting Necrozma-DM also happens to be the most convenient way of fitting a Stealth Rock setter, which further mandates usage.

Eternatus is the next culprit, and no, it is not primarily because of having to fit a Kyogre check, although that is definitely a nice trait. Rather, it is because of the sheer prominence of Toxic Spikes. On one hand, Eternatus is the most viable Toxic Spikes setter and beats every relevant Defogger, but on the other hand, it is also the only viable Poison-type capable of removing them. I don't think it is hard to see why this leads to awkwardly linear and one-dimensional intricacies in the teambuilder. While there are definitely a few outs versus Toxic Spikes, such as utilizing Gothitelle to trap and get rid of Eternatus, or simply minimizing the amount of Toxic Spikes-prone Pokemon on your team, using an Eternatus yourself has definitely been the most practical solution to Toxic Spikes in my experience.
-------> :sm/ditto::sm/ho-oh::sm/yveltal::sm/tyranitar:
Calyrex-Ghost is another major offender of diversity. Courtesy of its astronomical Speed and an immunity to Extreme Speed, it quite literally forces a Choice Scarf user (or Sucker Punch Yveltal) on your team if you aren't using a defensive Dark-type such as bulky Yveltal or Tyranitar. I haven't found these two to be that effective at checking Calyrex-Ghost, however; Nasty Plot sets blow through them with +2 Max Starfall after just about any chip, whereas Choice Specs and Choice Scarf variants simply click Trick and render them obsolete for the remainder of the match. This has been too problematic for me, so I've instead elected to rely on the core of specially defensive Ho-Oh + either Choice Scarf Ditto or Choice Scarf Calyrex-Ghost as my counterplay. There's no other way to properly punish Calyrex-Ghost other than threatening to snowball a sweep with your own Calyrex-Ghost.

:sm/zygarde-complete::sm/zekrom: -------> :sm/lunala:
Lunala is another Pokemon I've been using on a majority of my teams, as it happens to check what I believe to be two of the most dangerous setup sweepers in the metagame: Zygarde-C and Zekrom. Both of these Pokemon lost some of their best checks with the shift to Galar Dex. Zygarde-C is no longer limited by the abundance of Ice Beam and Perish Song Arceus formes, whereas Zekrom hugely benefits from the lack of Arceus-Ground and Primal Groudon, with Groudon not being nearly as splashable of an alternative for a bulky Ground-type. Zekrom is particularly worth emphasizing and the main reason I've been preferring Lunala over defensive Zygarde-C or Lugia; there's quite frankly no good check to Zekrom other than Lunala. Groudon is whittled down very quickly with Toxic Spikes dominating a vast portion of the metagame, and you can't really afford to run physically defensive Ferrothorn due to Kyogre's prominence. On top of this, Lunala also happens to offer a check to some more dangerous Dynamax sweepers, with Swords Dance Rayquaza and Groudon being prime examples.
Ho-Oh remains the most convenient Defogger in the metagame, and therefore mostly a nigh necessity while teambuilding. While there are definitely a few other Defoggers that are capable of keeping off entry hazards from Necrozma-DM, such as bulky Yveltal and Giratina, these do come with several drawbacks that make them unappealing on the whole on a balanced / bulky offensive team. Specially defensive Ho-Oh also offers a catch-all pivot to Calyrex-Ghost, specially oriented Yveltal, and Xerneas, which I find to be too valuable to pass on more often than not.


At the end of the day, this is still AG, so some form of centralization is a given. However, what I'm most annoyed at is that this metagame is shaping up to be even more centralized than National Dex AG due to the lack of Arceus formes, which has taken away a major component in team diversity. This, coupled with Calyrex-Ghost's introduction and the prominence of Toxic Spikes, has narrowed down the amount of different ways one can viably build a team that can still handle / offer some degree of outplaying most relevant offensive threats to an uncomfortable minimum. Never thought the day would come, but I miss National Dex AG ;-;


Banned deucer.
Ye this metagame is definitely more centralized then NatDex AG which is honestly surprising. Guardsweeper put it best as I basically feel that this is the way it is cause of 1) :Arceus: the lack of Arceus formes to check threats like Yveltal, Zygarde-C, and Zacian-C and 2)
Calyrex-S lol. Teams just need to rely on the same defensive cores and due to the lack of Arceus and the diversity it can bring with its multiple SupportCeus formes that can be used in tandem with eachother and offer some level of uniqueness to teams with the multiple type combinations that you can run on a typical balance / bulky offense team. Anyways, here are some teams that I been having fun with:

Calyrex Bulky Offense
  • Specially defensive Yveltal + Ho-Oh + Eternatus + Necrozma-DM is just an amazing defensive core and is like mandatory on almost every bulky offense haha. Sucks that it takes a good 4/6th of ur team tho lol.
  • Calyrex-S and Zacian-C are best formes of speed control besides scarfers like Ditto and Kyogre. Any other speedy revenge killer that does not boost Speed really just can't compare to these two.

Full Stall
  • Really fun stall that can deal with most things kinda well lol. Lugia and Necrozma-DM act as main Zacian-C checks while Chansey and Ttar handle Calyrex-S to an extent lol.
  • Ditto can replace either Ho-Oh or Giratina, but I personally feel this version of the team is quite efficient enough.

Excadrill Hyper Offense
  • Lead Exca and profit lol. Beware of Ditto though since that of course can be a pain.

All in all, National Dex AG is the better and more stable metagame, but I guess if we still going to continue on this Galar AG route then I think we can reach a place of stability down the pipeline (like we did in National Dex). Just please free Arceus soon GF lol
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I've been experimenting with psychic terrain teams and believe that:
A) they are viable
B) Indeedee-F is a better setter than lele:

Indeedee-F (F) @ Terrain Extender
Ability: Psychic Surge
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Expanding Force
- Healing Wish
- Calm Mind
- Baton Pass

This is just the set I use, but you also have access to other options like Aromatherapy, Mystical Fire, Shadow Ball, and even Screens. Access to Healing Wish is great for hyper offense as a setter and baton pass acts as a Teleport that can sometimes pass a Calm Mind boost.

Setting terrain for psyspam is better than ever now that pokemon like Mewtwo and Calyrex-Shadow can spam Expanding Force and become immune to two of their main counters: Sucker Punch and Shadow Sneak.

Access to a ghost immunity and psychic resist in this Calyrex meta is a godsend especially for your psychic teammates and full bulky lives quite a few things:

252 SpA Calyrex-Shadow Max Flutterby vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Indeedee-F: 324-382 (94.1 - 111%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO

(It doesn't like they even run Pollen Puff anyway since the main dark is Yveltal.)

+1 252 Atk Zacian-Crowned Behemoth Blade vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Indeedee-F: 282-333 (81.9 - 96.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252 Atk Groudon Precipice Blades vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Indeedee-F: 205-243 (59.5 - 70.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

On hyper offense you generally only need to live one hit comfortably to set terrain, Baton Pass to get a sweeper in safely, and be able to set again later in the game.

I generally find more offensive setters to be subpar due to their lack of actual power and low speed and bulk. Slow Baton Pass is also a godsend regardless.
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I have actually found this set really useful for Caylrex Shadow:

Calyrex-Shadow @ Focus Sash
Ability: As One (Spectrier)
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Astral Barrage
- Psyshock
- Draining Kiss
- Nasty Plot

Caylrex Shadow is amazing in total but with a sash, it can survive another Caylrex and it can survive ditto. Plus with a Nasty Plot, it can basically tank out a whole team. The only problem is Yveltal and Tyranitar. But if you use a Nasty Plot and get a good streak with As One then you can probably one-shot or nearly destroy them.
If you get a Nasty Plot set up then you can:

+2 252 SpA Calyrex-Shadow Draining Kiss vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Tyranitar in Sand: 174-206 (51 - 60.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+2 252 SpA Calyrex-Shadow Astral Barrage vs. 12 HP / 48 SpD Zygarde: 465-547 (129.1 - 151.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 SpA Calyrex-Shadow Astral Barrage vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Zacian-Crowned: 415-490 (127.3 - 150.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 SpA Calyrex-Shadow Draining Kiss vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Yveltal: 296-350 (75.3 - 89%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+2 252 SpA Calyrex-Shadow Astral Barrage vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Kyogre: 349-412 (102.3 - 120.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO

A few of these mons can OHKO Caylrex but with a sash, it will manage to survive and kill them. Though this is with Nasty Plot if you find a good opening you can defiantly destroy a lot of mons. So I find this set really good and I would recommend using it.


formerly skooma
idk how useful this actually is to some of u, but if ur like me who never clicks on that little "smogon analysis" link in ur builder when u wanna cop a set and instead just copy one from ur previous built teams, this gonna be mad helpful. thanks to the new box feature, I've compiled almost all the relevant mons in ag that has at least 1 set that isn't in the recommendations or smogon analysis. for the sake of it, i have included some of the more viable mons and sets even if they have all their viable stuff on smogon. its alphabetical btw <--- from A to H starting letter <--- I to U <--- V to Z

again, idk how useful this will be to most since like 65% of em can be found on smogon analysis but yh i was bored. if u don't find some of ur own sets there, its probably bad!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (or I'm just dumb and forgot;;)

pichus edit: PM Fardin if you want to suggest additions or changes.
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formerly skooma
posting here over baazar cause this talks about my opinion on the current meta and unique mons that can do well in em

built some squads during this ssnl and i dont want them to rot away in my builder
built this for fc. probably my fav team rn. 2 of the mons are unranked, other 2 is d but it still slaps. lot of the team purely relies on plays and the popularity of SDless zacian. rocky helmet spam does an incredible job of shutting it down especially with regen and my own zac was made jolly vs sd varients that are looking to just sd up. the team heavily relies on plays but if used right, could win a lot of mu
one of my other fav teams. this team was built for the yve spammed times which i guess still applies; where people just dont have anything else for caly except that mon. the ev allows caly to live a 36+ ada sucker from yve while ohking any bulky varients. with some doubles, it can easily set up and literally win from preview. porygon is there for the improof vs ditto and rest of the team is pretty generic that allows u to make progress in long games
this team is purely about abusing goth to make stall broken. ive noticed that the biggest downfall stall has this gen is the lack of mbounce which can stop opposing team's progress with hazard, especially ferro. if u just slap goth on a stall and focus the rest of ur attention to walling bo/ho, u can end up building a pretty dope and consistent squad.
this team is around abusing mew with its block set. uturn yve has been becoming increasingly popular and many people use it as their main pivot for any uncommon mon they see. this mew set takes advantage of that and traps any unsuspecting yve that wants to come in on mew because they believe its the safest option. rest of the team rounds out the other threats u have to wall. the mew set is also extremely useful in ho mu, especially vs leads like exca or in midgame when they want to bring in their zac on mew and u transform in their face and now u have a 400 hp zacian at +2 ;;
one more thing is haze on scarf caly. imo its the best filler it can have as the 4th move cause it just stops a lot of mons that take advantage of the lack of power caly has, such as dd ndm after spdef boost, dd zyg, caly, speed boosted yve thats about to sweep, geo xern and many more. just a cool emergency thing.
my double ditto team. double ditto is an amazing core to mess around with. with caly and zacian, improofing is really hard in ag even if u do ur best not to lose to ditto. double ditto is just makes people's live worse. it gives u extremely good longevity for stallish games, allows u to wall and reverse sweep 90% of the time vs bulky set up sweepers like cm oger and coil zyg by just going back and forth with dittos among many other cool strats. started as a meme but ended up being super consistent and won me a game this snnl.
the infamous double porygon team. people like to laugh at this but its unironically good. lapras just puts unbelievable pressure on most teams and gives u the best sheer cold/cm poger check in the game. double porygon is there mainly because caly is just too big of a threat for any bulky team to only have 1 wall against it. plus with power swap, porygon becomes an amazing general wall to most of the meta on both the physicial and special side, such as dd ndm, dd zyg. np caly and even geo xern and etc. this team is way more consistent than most people give it credit for, altho there is a few weakness, such as LO etern which it was used against in ssnl and took an L
this is more of a generic team that was built around staying as consistent as possible while not losing to goth, and i think it succeeded. biggest problem for teams that want to not lose to goth but still be able to wall most of the meta is the long games vs hazards and especially that annoying etern which just never dies. decided to have hone claw yve as one of my wincoins because the amount of people that just blindly switch in their etern on yve has become way too much for me to not take advantage of . after rocks, at +1 u ohko etern with dyna and that point, games are typically over. i was lucky to get the goth mu i expected vs nevelle in ssnl and the team did exactly how i wanted it to do, defo one of my better teams.
this one is just a generic team with twave zyg as a very cool wincoin.

this meta overall definitely gets more shit from the playerbase than it deserves but i do agree that its not necessarily as versatile compared to other gens. ended up having a lot of cool techs that were pretty unexplored and i dont think people should just settle for the generic stuff cause there are many other cools ways that can guarantee u the same level of consistency ;;
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Following up on the post above, wanted to give some of my thoughts on the meta as well after seasonal. While the meta is obviously quite restricted, I do think there's still quite a bit of room for innovation and there's still a lot to explore outside of the top heavy things, so I wanted to highlight some of my favourite things and things I noticed.

First off, OHKO moves are broken. They're not just like other metas where they're somewhat inconsistent gimmicks that are hard to justify and make work, OHKO moves are extremely legit and super game changing most of the time. If you get your hits good enough you're almost sure to win, while if you miss you're just wasting turns. Kyurem-W has to be the biggest showing of this, being a super good mon rn that I think is only getting better, as it's incredibly hard to take on and Sheer Cold is only stopped by other Ice-types which are few in numbers. Even Lapras which Fardin showed off to great success in our finals series is super threatening, since it can just claim random kills while also being a counter to Sheer Cold Kyogre and Kyurem-W. I think OHKO moves and dealing with them is going to be a fairly large problem since I don't see this trend just dying out, but it's an annoying one to face to say the least.

(Click sprites of pokemon for sets)
I love Marshadow currently. 4 attacks is the best set imo, usually with Ice Punch last since Ho-oh usage is generally low but I've been saved by Rock Tomb before in tours so that's a good option as well. Poltergeist hits so hard as does CC, and Sneak is incredibly useful for revenging Calyrex-S, something that I think you have to be able to do if you run dittoless balance, and Marshadow is great at that job. Super hard to switch into and really punishes cores of Zygarde, Dusk Mane, Yveltal, and slow Eternatus if you're running the coverage for them, so I think it's a great mon rn.

Best mon in the meta. While that may be a slight exaggeration, I feel like genuinely building with Ditto is the best way to play currently. Dynamax just allows for way too many set up mons that can snowball way too easily, making Ditto insanely useful against that. Calyrex-S can just Max Starfall Yveltal and Zacian-C can just Assurance Necrozma-DM, so having a backup measure to those super fast mons is never a bad thing. I find things super finnicky to deal with if you don't have a Ditto in the back, and things like bulky Lunala or Kyogre feel like must-haves on balance lacking Ditto.

Demon Zygarde, the Coil Scale Shot Thousand Waves Rest set, is an incredible pick rn that if it manages to get a good trap off can just instantly win games. I used it a bit during earlier ssnl and it won turn 1 once by just trapping an ndm that would normally be safely getting up rocks instead of losing the game because they set it up. I'm really not sure on ev spreads, this defensive one hits speed for Calyrex-S at +2 while in complete form with the defense hitting a jump point then the rest in HP, while I made the offensive one Jolly to outrun Calyrex-S at +1 when in complete form while also hitting the defensive points the standard Impish set does. I don't know what those evs are for so they could be customized and might be suboptimal, but that's what I've been rolling with recently. Zygarde overall is pretty great though, I really liked sub Toxic which I used in finals that cleaned up game 3, so both offensive and defensive with multiple sets have a really good place in the meta rn.

I wanted to bring this mon more but didn't get the chance to since I had other ideas, but it's essentially impossible to switch into. Shedinja and Gastrodon are some of the most niche picks in the meta that it can also just beat with coverage, and Sp.def Eternatus and Ferrothorn potentially drop on switch in to Fishious Rend in rain. Protect may seem weird on banded, but I like it just in case you're really needing to Max Guard, since 95% of the moves it makes are Fishious anyway. Super fun to use while being a really solid pick against standard defensive cores, so I like Dracovish a lot rn. If Lapras does actually pick up which I could genuinely see it might be hurt a bit, but still solid regardless.

I showed off a lot of things I liked in my replays from the last few rounds of seasonal if there's interest in how they actually function, but I think they're all fun mons to test out regardless. I do look forward to how the meta evolves, since I think new mons are still being discovered and tested outside of the top few mons, and a lot of anti meta picks are rising, which may change the meta itself. Stuff like Darm-G, Giratina-O. and Tyranitar may have a lot more potential than they currently get used for, I especially like how darm can sometimes jut run through teams while being good speed control, but for now they're just underused tech mons and maybe they'll stay that way, but there's potential for anything in this meta since all the changes are in the players hands. Interested to see how it plays out and I'll definitely try and bring more things to the next seasonal that can push the meta, but these are some of my thoughts on it currently.


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NUPL Champion

Eternatus-Eternamax @ Power Herb / Black Sludge
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dynamax Cannon / Sludge Bomb
- Flamethrower
- Meteor Beam
- Recover

With Eternatus now having the massive added bulk it can afford to get off multiple Meteor Beams and boosts its Special Attack to insane levels.

Eternatus-Eternamax @ Power Herb / Black Sludge
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Meteor Beam
- Flamethrower
- Cosmic Power
- Recover

This is the good set. Cosmic Power allows Eternatus-E to fire off even more Meteor Beams and increase its Special Attack. Misses out on coverage but Rock-type has no immunities and it's not like anyone is killing you anyway especially at +6/+6. Unless you run into Protect Heatran or something completely unviable like Gothitelle you will be fine.

+6 252+ SpA Fairy Aura Xerneas Max Starfall vs. +6 248 HP / 0 SpD Eternatus-Eternamax: 138-163 (19.3 - 22.8%) -- possible 5HKO
+6 252 SpA Life Orb Mewtwo Max Mindstorm vs. +6 248 HP / 0 SpD Eternatus-Eternamax: 276-328 (38.6 - 45.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

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