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Any Opinions On A Starting Floatzel???

Cycoside

Ok I'm sick of the gengar and weavile starters, so I decided to make an anti-starting pokemon for my rain dance team; Floatzel was the strongest and fastest of the physical attacking swift swimers so I decided to stick with him, so heres my starter/revenge killer set...

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Floatzel @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Swift Swim
Nature: Adamant
EVs: 252 Attack (339 Attack) / 252 Speed (494 Speed + CS)
*Crunch / Pursuit
* Waterfall
* Brick Break / Ice Fang
* Roar

So Choice Scarf is for the scarfed Weviles, Gengars and any other pokes that like to start off fast; Floatzel will beat them to the punch if its opponent isnt running a positive natured, 252 ev'ed, 31 iv'ed beast. I did some damage calcs with a jolly natured Floatzel but the gay otter is very stubburn and fails to OHKO most pokes without adamant... althought adamant isnt as fearsome as hoped, but it does do some damage. Here are the damage specs courtesy of MetalKid's Calulator, done with April's most fequently used starters from Shoddy Battle...

Bronzong
(Roar Out)

Gengar
Floatzel (252 Atk) Vs. Gengar (0 Hp / 0 Def)
Crunch (OHKO or 2HKO)
Damage: 96.55% - 113.41%
Floatzel (252 Atk) Vs. Gengar (0 Hp / 0 Def)
Pursuit (OHKO or 2HKO)
Damage: 49.04% - 57.47%
Damage: 97.70% - 114.94% (Switching Out)

Tyranitar
Floatzel (252 Atk) Vs. Tyranitar (252 Hp / 0 Def)
Waterfall (2HKO)
Damage: 57.43% - 67.57%

Gyarados
(Roar Out)

Salamence
Floatzel (252 Atk) Vs. Salamence (120 Hp / 0 Def)
Ice Fang (OHKO or 2HKO)
Damage: 90.86% - 106.93%
Damage: 99.09% - 116.62% (0 Hp)

Hippowdon
(Roar Out)

Azelf
Floatzel (252 Atk) Vs. Azelf (36 Hp / 0 Def)
Crunch (2HKO)
Damage: 74.33% - 87.67%
Floatzel (252 Atk) Vs. Azelf (36 Hp / 0 Def)
Pursuit (2HKO)
Damage: 37.67% - 44.33%
Damage: 75.67% - 89.00% (Switching Out)

Yanmega
Floatzel (252 Atk) Vs. Yanmega (0 Hp / 4 Def)
Ice Fang (2HKO)
Damage: 49.52% - 58.15%

Ninjask
Floatzel (252 Atk) Vs. Ninjask (176 Hp / 0 Def)
Ice Fang (2HKO)
Damage: 82.41% - 97.07%

Swampert
(Roar Out)

Infernape
Floatzel (252 Atk) Vs. Infernape (0 Hp / 0 Def)
Waterfall (OHKO)
Damage: 112.97% - 133.11%

Jolteon
Floatzel (252 Atk) Vs. Jolteon (4 Hp / 0 Def)
Waterfall (2HKO)
Damage: 69.49% - 81.62%

Weavile
Floatzel (252 Atk) Vs. Weavile (40 Hp / 0 Def)
Brick Break (OHKO)
Damage: 152.58% - 179.73%

Abomasnow
Floatzel (252 Atk) Vs. Abomasnow (252 Hp / 0 Def)
Brick Break (2HKO)
Damage: 51.82% - 60.94%

As you can see most pokemon are 2HKOed by Floatzel and others are knocked out or roared out depending on threat level. I find this set to be an effective starter to phaze any opponent starter and a powerful late game sweeper that no pokemon can outspeed especially in the rain. I hope this Floatzel is to some peoples liking and id like any feedback to make the set stronger.
 
yea but most of those can OHKO them back, i prefer floatzal as a reciever rather then a lead
and waterfall has stab, brick break does not dont think there is much in it, waterfall has flinch though
 
You've presented everything nicely, but I don't know if this will fly. First, all that speed seems redundant. Swift Swim, Choice Scarf, and base 115 speed? As a lead, it's not properly taking advantage of Swift Swim, anyway, so you could just go with a different Pokemon. Second, it's much too weak to do much... it'll 2HKO T-tar, but Tyranitar will OHKO Floatzel. The frailty becomes a problem. Also... I don't know how Roaring out Bronzong is going to help. It's still going to get it's support move off, and it might have wanted to switch after that, anyway. Roar goes after the opponent, no matter the speed.

That being said, I still think that Floatzel, a favourite of mine, can still do well as a lead. The Kristy set works decently, though I've tested it very little. Taunt on a BPer is pretty awesome, and it gives you a real boost over all of the Bronzong leads. You have to switch out against Gengars and many other Pokes, though.
 
Put some of that speed into HP/Defenses, change Roar for Rain Dance.

It should work quite well with that, no?
 
thanks for the comments guys, yea the biggest problem with floatzel is how fagile it is, and i actually didnt know that roar always moves second so theres a big problem >.< but ill keep messing around with this set. Thanks again for the input.
 
Err...quite a bit of the time you're 2HKOing opponents and then getting OHKO'd back (vs things like Tar, Jolteon, or Abomasnow). Roaring against Swampert, Bronzong, and Gyarados is somewhat pointless too, since they'll probably either use a support move or attack Floatzel for solid damage. It has a few favorable matchups, but most of them are cases where you're 2HKOing but getting OHKO'd back or forcing a switch, allowing your opponent to get in a hit/support move AND letting yourself get locked into choice Roar.
 
IMO Floatzel just does not have enough power behind his attacks to be effective with no boost whatsoever. If you look at most successful Choice Scarfers, like Gengar and Garchomp, they have huge attack stats and high BP attacks. Floatzel doesn't really have either, so in the end you'll end up hitting a bunch of things for like 60%, then getting OHKOed as they retaliate. You still might manage to nab some surprise kills on Gengars and Weaviles, but in the end I think you would be better of with Choice Band, Bulk Up/Baton Pass, or even something like LO Rain Dance
 
I considered Floatzel, but since his ability is wasted as a starter I chose Sharpedo instead. They both essentially do the exact same thing as a starter, except for being able to brick break.
 
Choice Scarf is useless against most of the leads you mentioned. You can outspeed the majority of them without it. Floatzel does work as a lead, but as kamikaen mentioned, the "Kristy" set is more effective. Look at the difference it makes to the Pokemon you mentioned. You can Taunt Bronzong, Gyarados (just hope it isn't carrying a CB), Swampert, Hippo, Ninjask and Yanmega.

Taunt / Rain Dance / Waterfall / Brick Break or Ice Fang @ Focus Sash could be a decent lead too if you're running a Rain team.
 
I used Floatzel on my Rain Dance team, running Bulk Up/Waterfall/Crunch/Ice Fang. It was quite effective as a late-game sweeper.
 
Leading Floatzel:
*Taunt
*Waterfall
*Surf
*Rain Dance

There ya go. Give it a sash, and it has more speed and power after rain dance.
 
I used Kristy Floatzel as a lead for my Rain Dance team, and it worked incredibly well when it wasn't forced to switch out, which basically amounted to anything that was faster with an Electric/Grass move, or stuff like Salamence that you just don't want to push your luck with. Dealt with Bronzong, Swampert, and Gyarados quite nicely, though, among others. Pulled off a 6-0 sweep with it once when my opponent decided to let me get off 6 Bulk Ups.

So yeah, I'm supporting Kristy.

</rambling>
 
I myself use a focus sash floatzel lead on my rain dance team. it has waterfall, rain dance, crunch and ice fang. you're pretty much guaranteed a rain dance, and then you can put the hurt on the fragile+fast types that you are leading against. I haven't tried out kristy but it also sounds appealing.
 
Glen, floatzel has base 85 special attack, how the hell is that not doing solid damage? Surf has a higher base power than waterfall. Floatzel can go mixed almost as well has kingdra can. You can run 252 Atk / 16 Spe / 240 SpA, and outdamage waterfall with surf.

With that spread, shit like Forry and Skarm will die to Surf easily.
 
Cycoside said:
Gengar
Floatzel (252 Atk) Vs. Gengar (0 Hp / 0 Def)
Crunch (OHKO or 2HKO)
Damage: 96.55% - 113.41%
Floatzel (252 Atk) Vs. Gengar (0 Hp / 0 Def)
Pursuit (OHKO or 2HKO)
Damage: 97.70% - 114.94% (Switching Out)
Click to expand...

Erm... shouldn't those two have done the same damage?

Tyranitar can simply switch out or hit you hard enough to OHKO with a CB'd attack.

Also, I'd like to point out that you won't simply 'Roar' out Gyarados leads because 'Roar' is a final priority move.

Also, Ice Fang will not OHKO Salamence ever because of Intimidate (I'm assuming you ran it without Intimidate).

Yanmega if it is running Speed Boost can throw up a Protect or use Hypnosis after taking a hit.

You can't do anything to Hippowdon / Swampert / Bronzong leads but all it cares about on the first turn is to set up SR anyways.

Infernape will switch out, can't do much there with a NVE Pursuit either.

Jolteon will take a hit and proceed to do massive damage, possibly OHKO with Thunderbolt, it even has a 50/50 chance of setting up a sub after you hit it.

Brick Break screws Weavile over.

Abomasnow is a possible 3HKO with Brick Break as I have seen some with Protect on them.

Ok... it's great that it can 2HKO most fragile leads but at the same time they can 2HKO or OHKO you back. You don't have a way of shutting down bulky leads and they usually get a free SR in or try to cripple with Hypnosis (Bronzong).

I believe Taunt > Roar because you prevent other leads from setting up SR support and Gyara is kept from Dragon Dancing, Jolt is kept from Subbing among other things.

So many walls can come into this with no fear at all, maybe Surf for a 2HKO on thinks like Skarm and Hippo, you can sacrifice Speed because you have a Scarf anyways.
 
If you are using this for a rain dance team, I would suggest putting rain dance on there somewhere to get your plan started, in which case you would want to remove the choice scarf and go for another item such as leftovers or even focus sash because rain dance would negate any negative weather effects. I think that your case for this pokemon set would be a lot better if you provided calcs on how much damage opposing pokemon do to you.
 
People actually run Scarf Weavile? Uh, lolwut?

EVerything you have listed as a "maybe OHKO" or 2HKO, by the way, will quickly and easily OHKO you if you don't finish them. So yeah.
 
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