• Check out the relaunch of our general collection, with classic designs and new ones by our very own Pissog!

Ask a Simple Question; Get a Simple Answer & General Resources (OU Edition)

Status
Not open for further replies.
Honkalculator

a lot of people are talking about how it's down but i'm pretty sure that's just the old freehosting link which was honestly deprecated months ago. iirc honko only closed that account a short time ago; that's why it actually went down. the kalashnikov one is also good, look a few pages back though cause i don't use it so i got no links
 
With Max attack and a naive nature, does Zebstrika do more damage to standard Ferrothorn with Flame Charge or Overheat?
Would Zebstrika be more useful with Wild Charge/Bounce/Flame Charge/Pursuit and an Adamant nature or with a naive nature and overheat over flame charge? Or would it be better off with specs and Thunderbolt/Volt Switch/Hidden Power Grass/Overheat?

Simply put, if I HAD to use Zebstrika on my team, what would be the least sucky moveset possible for it?
 
I don't play NU, but I guess you're referring to a spread like 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252+ Spe. In that case...

4 SpA Zebstrika Overheat vs. 252 HP / 168 SpD Ferrothorn: 256-304 (72.72 - 86.36%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Zebstrika Flame Charge vs. 252 HP / 88+ Def Ferrothorn: 124-148 (35.22 - 42.04%) -- 84.64% chance to 3HKO

This is without any boosting item, with LO you're guaranteed to OHKO Standard Ferrothorn outside Rain with Overheat, after SR damage. The NU analysis for Zebriska seems to suggest that the most appropriate moveset is a Special one; if you're forced to use a Zebriska in OU (well, good luck) I guess the best set resembles the one in the analysis.
 
If I have a grounded Pokémon and my opponent switches in Dugtrio (or any applicable trapper+trappee) as I switch out on the same turn, but my opponent switches "first" (as is the case when the Pokémon they originally had in is faster than mine), is my first Pokémon trapped?

i.e. My opponent switches in Dugtrio on a grounded Pokémon, Magnezone on a Steel-type, Gothitelle on anything that doesn't have Shadow Tag
 
Lord of Bays said:
If I have a grounded Pokémon and my opponent switches in Dugtrio (or any applicable trapper+trappee) as I switch out on the same turn, but my opponent switches "first" (as is the case when the Pokémon they originally had in is faster than mine), is my first Pokémon trapped?

i.e. My opponent switches in Dugtrio on a grounded Pokémon, Magnezone on a Steel-type, Gothitelle on anything that doesn't have Shadow Tag
Click to expand...

There is no such thing as "first" or "second" switch. That is to say there is no "priority" about switchs as it's a move coming from trainers.
Hence, no, you obviously will not get trapped if you switch on the same turn, but the pokemon you chosed to switch will be trapped instead (assuming he has no special ability/typing/item to avoid traps). You just can't stop your enemy from switching his on pokemon during Turn X by switching your trapper at Turn X.

The fact is that the animation show you switching first all the time if both player make a switch. Although this can be confusing, simultaneous switches occur exaclty at the same time !

Oh god this is so long an answer just to say no. But I just like to make things clear and explain the logic ;P
 
Lord of Bays said:
If I have a grounded Pokémon and my opponent switches in Dugtrio (or any applicable trapper+trappee) as I switch out on the same turn, but my opponent switches "first" (as is the case when the Pokémon they originally had in is faster than mine), is my first Pokémon trapped?

i.e. My opponent switches in Dugtrio on a grounded Pokémon, Magnezone on a Steel-type, Gothitelle on anything that doesn't have Shadow Tag
Click to expand...

If you switch out the same turn they switch in, regardless of the order you're not "trapped".

EDIT: ninjaed, and

Remedy said:
There is no such thing as "first" or "second" switch.
Click to expand...

This is not true, switching is considered a move with very high priority by the game, so if both players switch, the one who has the fastest poke on the field switches first. This has actually an impact on the game itself: for example, imagine that player 1 has a Jolteon on the field, and player 2 a Garchomp; if player 1 goes to Politoed and player 2 switches to Hippowdon, the weather will be sandstorm at the end, because the player 2's switch actually happened last.
 
ganj4lF said:
If you switch out the same turn they switch in, regardless of the order you're not "trapped".

EDIT: ninjaed, and



This is not true, switching is considered a move with very high priority by the game, so if both players switch, the one who has the fastest poke on the field switches first. This has actually an impact on the game itself: for example, imagine that player 1 has a Jolteon on the field, and player 2 a Garchomp; if player 1 goes to Politoed and player 2 switches to Hippowdon, the weather will be sandstorm at the end, because the player 2's switch actually happened last.
Click to expand...

Sprite_3_r_Ninja_Fan.png


Yes, sorry I didn't explain myself well. The action of withdrawing your pokemon is neutral to speed. However the action of putting into the battle your pokemon is indeed governed by the speed of the pokemons you put in (however in the topic of trapping, it doesn't really matter).
Given switching is divided in two actions (withdrawing and putting in) my speech was confusing.

The link shows priorities related to the action of withdrawing. But my point was, if we both withdraw, we do it at the same time because anyway the order doesn't matter here.
 
ganj4lF said:
I don't play NU, but I guess you're referring to a spread like 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252+ Spe. In that case...

4 SpA Zebstrika Overheat vs. 252 HP / 168 SpD Ferrothorn: 256-304 (72.72 - 86.36%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Zebstrika Flame Charge vs. 252 HP / 88+ Def Ferrothorn: 124-148 (35.22 - 42.04%) -- 84.64% chance to 3HKO

This is without any boosting item, with LO you're guaranteed to OHKO Standard Ferrothorn outside Rain with Overheat, after SR damage. The NU analysis for Zebriska seems to suggest that the most appropriate moveset is a Special one; if you're forced to use a Zebriska in OU (well, good luck) I guess the best set resembles the one in the analysis.
Click to expand...

Would access to bounce improve its physical set at all?
Hah, would it prefer hidden power ice or hidden power grass? Timid or Modest? Specs or LO?
 
I think Close Combat is pretty core for Arcanine. It's one of the things that sets it apart from Heatran as a flash fire user and I don't think I'd ever use an offensive Arcanine set without it. If you're using a more bulky Arcanine, You could get away with not having it and relying mostly on Flare Blitz and Extremespeed with the other two slots being support moves.
 
Lady Alex said:
I think Close Combat is pretty core for Arcanine. It's one of the things that sets it apart from Heatran as a flash fire user and I don't think I'd ever use an offensive Arcanine set without it. If you're using a more bulky Arcanine, You could get away with not having it and relying mostly on Flare Blitz and Extremespeed with the other two slots being support moves.
Click to expand...

What moves/nature would you suggest?
 
This is the set that I used for the dark horse project

Arcanine (M) @ Life Orb
Trait: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd
Adamant Nature
- ExtremeSpeed
- Flare Blitz
- Wild Charge
- Close Combat

If you're going to use a more defensive set, I would go for a specially defensive set replacing wild charge and close combat with Morning Sun and W-o-W or Toxic. I recommend the offensive set much more than a support set, though.
 
To to add a little to the switching discussion since this wasn't brought up, The order of switches actually does sometimes matter. I'm fairly sure this is the case, but feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.
Say you have Jolteon and your opponent has Garchomp. You switch to Genesect as they switch to a Blissey. You switch first, and since Garchomp has higher defense, Download gives you a special attack boost. If Garchomp was scarfed, they would switch first, so you would get an attack boost, as Blissey obviously has lower physical defense.

It's same story with something like Imposter Ditto afaik.
 
It used to be a glitch on showdown, but im not sure if it's fixed. It works like this on PO
and the only glitch on PO AFAIK is where you're able to switch up your moves on a choice locked pokemon (only if thats the first time it used that move when it was brought in) if the opponent switches to something that does to to hazards or if they use a move like memento or self destruct.
and in game. the faster pokemon always switches out first. It's the same with abilities as well. That's why people make their Politoed slower than Tyranitar on purpose occasionally so that Tyranitar's sand stream will go first and Politoed's drizzle will go last, making that the dominant weathe.
 
FastFlygon said:
To to add a little to the switching discussion since this wasn't brought up, The order of switches actually does sometimes matter. I'm fairly sure this is the case, but feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.
Say you have Jolteon and your opponent has Garchomp. You switch to Genesect as they switch to a Blissey. You switch first, and since Garchomp has higher defense, Download gives you a special attack boost. If Garchomp was scarfed, they would switch first, so you would get an attack boost, as Blissey obviously has lower physical defense.

It's same story with something like Imposter Ditto afaik.
Click to expand...

pretty sure thats wrong because abilities activate after switching.
 
I want an OU team based around Slaking, Heracross and Metagross. I know so far Ill be destroyed by any team with an Infernape or Blaziken, so anything to counter them or anything else that could plague me would help thanks :)

I know its not exactly a question but help would be appreciated

EDIT: Should of mentioned that I play HG and NOT B/W
 
hera is pretty good shit but there's a reason why it's UU. the classic scarfmoxie might serve you okay in OU, but really scarf hera is not all that fast by OU standards so you will make for an unremarkable revenge killer - you'll have to experiment to see what set fits best; hera is flexible.

as for slaking, i have seen katakiri having success with scarf slaking, check the creative sets thread for more on that. choice slaking is almost definitely the right way to use it - running without a choice item means slaking won't hit especially hard or especially fast, and you'll still have to switch out right afterwards due to truant =/ if you're gonna switch anyway might as well be choiced
EDIT: http://www.smogon.com/forums/showthread.php?p=4410222&highlight=slaking#post4410222

metagross is bottom OU for a reason as well - your best bet there is a specially defensive tank (252 HP / 252 sdef careful with SR, meteor mash, and some coverage moves) since meta has pretty good defense and useful resistances. i've seen this set proposed in one of the big threads, but i frequent the big threads so often that i can't remember which - check the OU viability ranking, for starters.
EDIT: http://www.smogon.com/forums/showthread.php?p=4446033&highlight=metagross#post4446033

tbh this combination has a lot of serious teambuilding flaws and i doubt you're going to have much luck in OU - slaking, hera and metagross are all lackluster in OU and running all 3 on the same team crushes your space that you need for metagame checks. your team is going to take an offensive slant so teammates should focus on facilitating a heracross sweep. alternatively you can use hera to wallbreak as a support for the sweep of another fighting type. experiment and see what works.
 
I thought Heracross was quite the sweeper, has good coverage and decent stats all round. Slaking is there because of its massive attack and I got some good Ivs out of it. Metagross I have in my team because I got good IVs and with its resistances thought Id be able to sponge and destroy a couple of Pokemon before it fell. I much prefer sweepers that are already set up or take little time to set up rather than Tanks or them Spikes teams

Thanks for the advice on Heracross though Ill try out a few movesets and see what works
 
"decent stats" is definitely an overstatement, 85 speed is pretty much the bottom of the barrel offensively in OU. hera has punch, and it has moxie, but it is slow. moreover it has no way to boost its speed. you will basically never sweep any team in this meta with hera unless it's scarf... even then common things like tornadus-T will check you comfortably if you're choiced, because there is no shortage of flying types to resist hera's stabs. you would think SD hera could wipe stall except there is no stall lol

you are also seriously overestimating metagross's niche and firepower. the metagame is increasingly slanted towards special attacks with the rise of rain and metagross's inferior special defense means it will be washed away. its main edge over jirachi in this regard is that it takes physical hits better so it can handle the likes of tyranitar, but otherwise jirachi is generally superior - it can also set up SR but it lasts longer (wish) and is much more versatile (broader movepool by far).

and as for slaking.... well truant should really say it all lol but do take a look at kata's post, he makes a fair argument for using it in OU

and as a shameless plug you might also want to check the dark horse hall of fame (link in my signature), metagross and heracross have both been taken there this month so you can get an idea of what has worked for some people in OU
 
Do you have any suggestions for a team thats based around hitting hard and fast? I dont care much for walls as Im quite impatient when it comes to battling. And considering I play HG I dont think Tornadus will be any problem :) I dont know much about the OU Metagame as you can see, so any advice on strategy is also welcome
 
And considering I play HG I dont think Tornadus will be any problem :)
Click to expand...

oh i see this is for heart gold on carts? that's VERY different from what the meta is right now. if you're thinking about wifi competitive on heart gold you might want to investigate elsewhere... we're all in BW2 mode over here. ruins of alph is the forum for old-generation metas and smogon also has a wifi section. that might be more helpful
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top