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Hello everyone. Very excited to start the Battle tree, something I've been holding off until PokeBank is released so I can properly SR a few legends in sun and moon and bring over my babies from Oras to have the ideal team. I had a decent amount of success in the Battle Resort obtaining all five trophies and a 250 win streak in super triples that I decided to just leave alone once the new games came out. I just wanted to post my idea for a singles team and also ask advice for a doubles team. It's a cool F/D/S core I believe I've seen a few people on here post about and since I love Metagross and Dragonite and have used them a ton in the Battle Resort, I figured it was perfect. So the singles team I had in mind was:
Metagross @ Metagrossite
Jolly
Ability: Clear Body / Tough Claws
6 HP / 252 Attack / 252 Speed
-Bullet Punch
-Zen Headbutt
-Iron Head
-Earthquake/Hammer Arm/Ice Punch
So this is the team in my head. The big questions I have are is Fire Punch or Earthquake preferred on Dragonite, is there another item other than Choice Scarf for Tapu Fini to prevent being locked in and is Surf or Scald superior and for Metagross what should be the fourth move between Earthquake, Hammer Arm and Ice Punch. Also I see a lot of people running Meteor Mash over Iron Head and I've always preferred the perfect accuracy over the bit of power and the flinch rate over the possible attack raise. Any of suggestions for this team are highly encouraged besides just than the questions I have listed.
I also wanted to come up with a cool doubles team and figured these three were a great start. Can anyone recommend me a good fourth member to compliment this team and/or any possible set changes that might be necessary being it's a different format?
Hello everyone. Very excited to start the Battle tree, something I've been holding off until PokeBank is released so I can properly SR a few legends in sun and moon and bring over my babies from Oras to have the ideal team. I had a decent amount of success in the Battle Resort obtaining all five trophies and a 250 win streak in super triples that I decided to just leave alone once the new games came out. I just wanted to post my idea for a singles team and also ask advice for a doubles team. So the singles team I had in mind was:
Metagross @ Metagrossite
Jolly
Ability: Clear Body / Tough Claws
6 HP / 252 Attack / 252 Speed
-Bullet Punch
-Zen Headbutt
-Iron Head
-Earthquake/Hammer Arm/Ice Punch
So this is the team in my head. The big questions I have are is Fire Punch or Earthquake preferred on Dragonite, is there another item other than Choice Scarf for Tapu Fini to prevent being locked in and is Surf or Scald superior and for Metagross what should be the fourth move between Earthquake, Hammer Arm and Ice Punch. Also I see a lot of people running Meteor Mash over Iron Head and I've always preferred the perfect accuracy over the bit of power and the flinch rate over the possible attack raise. Any of suggestions for this team are highly encouraged besides just than the questions I have listed.
I also wanted to come up with a cool doubles team and figured these three were a great start. Can anyone recommend me a good fourth member to compliment this team and/or any possible set changes that might be necessary being it's a different format?
Standard set for Dragonite seems to be a d-dance one: Dragonite @ Lum Berry
Adamant
Ability: Multiscale
52 HP / 252 Attack / 12 Def / 4 SpD / 188 Spe
- Outrage
- Earthquake
- Dragon Dance
- Fire Punch
Setup I hear is preferred for longer streaks.
As for Metagross, Zen and Bullet are staples, but I see differing sets when it comes to swapping around stuff like Meteor Mash, EQ, and Hammer Arm. Iron head would be preferable for long streaks, I'd presume, as misses / crits are the actual opponents in these places.
Tapu Fini@Leftovers
Misty Surge
Timid, 252 Special Attack, 252 Speed, 6 HP
Scald
Moon Blast
Calm Mind
Ice Beam
I saw someone use the set above in the thread; again, favoring setup but anyway Surf vs Scald is a continuous debate I've been seeing, and it seems to depend on what you want your Tapu to do. Setup lasts long enough for burn chance to be a reality, but surf enjoys extra power til then, which I could see being more important to your scarf variant.
Trainer VS images added, for aesthetic purposes. Link is in my signature and the main post.
Please report any misclassified Trainer classes. On the Tree Trainers sheet, I put question marks (?) next to Trainers I haven't actually met. I only made educated guesses based on their relative position on the list, and if that fails, I deduce it from their quotes.
Gengar @ Gengarite
Cursed Body
Timid
4 Def/ 252 SpAtk/ 252 Spd
Focus Blast
Shadow Ball
Sludge Bomb
Thunderbolt
I know that a lot of people think that Mimikyu is overrated but boy, that mon rocks in Singles. Most of the time you're guaranteed to set up at least a SD and then end up 3-0ing most battles. But even when that wasn't the case, Neverending Nightmare guaranteed at least one KO. What also helped alot are the new Mega evolution mechanics, allowing M-Gengar to outspeed crucial matchups and win battles. You'd probably deal more damage with a life orb (Haven't done the calcs) but the increase in speed ended up being more beneficial for this team. The Yache Berry on Chomp was pretty useless, should've probably replaced it with a Life Orb but w/e.
Most battles were pretty one-sided with this team but it does struggle against bulky physical attackers, most notably Hippowdon.
So I've been trying out a Tapu Koko/Aegislash/Mega Salamence team with Koko as lead... Got destroyed by lead Nidoqueen3. How am I supposed to deal with it?
So I've been trying out a Tapu Koko/Aegislash/Mega Salamence team with Koko as lead... Got destroyed by lead Nidoqueen3. How am I supposed to deal with it?
Hello everyone. Very excited to start the Battle tree, something I've been holding off until PokeBank is released so I can properly SR a few legends in sun and moon and bring over my babies from Oras to have the ideal team. I had a decent amount of success in the Battle Resort obtaining all five trophies and a 250 win streak in super triples that I decided to just leave alone once the new games came out. I just wanted to post my idea for a singles team and also ask advice for a doubles team. It's a cool F/D/S core I believe I've seen a few people on here post about and since I love Metagross and Dragonite and have used them a ton in the Battle Resort, I figured it was perfect. So the singles team I had in mind was:
Metagross @ Metagrossite
Jolly
Ability: Clear Body / Tough Claws
6 HP / 252 Attack / 252 Speed
-Bullet Punch
-Zen Headbutt
-Iron Head
-Earthquake/Hammer Arm/Ice Punch
So this is the team in my head. The big questions I have are is Fire Punch or Earthquake preferred on Dragonite, is there another item other than Choice Scarf for Tapu Fini to prevent being locked in and is Surf or Scald superior and for Metagross what should be the fourth move between Earthquake, Hammer Arm and Ice Punch. Also I see a lot of people running Meteor Mash over Iron Head and I've always preferred the perfect accuracy over the bit of power and the flinch rate over the possible attack raise. Any of suggestions for this team are highly encouraged besides just than the questions I have listed.
I also wanted to come up with a cool doubles team and figured these three were a great start. Can anyone recommend me a good fourth member to compliment this team and/or any possible set changes that might be necessary being it's a different format?
Overall that is a really solid team, I've been running a similar setup with M-Salamence, Metagross, and Tapu Fini. People are running Meteor Mash, since Metagross doesn't get Iron Head until bank (same with Extreme Speed on Dragonite), because of it's current move pool consisting of 90% accurate moves, I have been running wide lens on my set with Bullet Punch - Zen Headbutt - Meteor Mash - Hammer Arm. Once bank comes in though I had a lot of success with M-Metagross running Bullet Punch - Iron Head - Ice Punch - Thunder Punch. For Tapu Fini, I'm currently running a bulky set with leftovers using Moonblast - Scald - Ice Beam - Calm Mind. And I'm not an expert on Dragonite, but found good success with Dragon Dance - Outrage - Roost - Earthquake
For doubles I also ran a solid doubles team built around this with Hitmontop / M-Metagross as leads, with Hydreigon and Garchomp as back up. Hitmontop makes an effective partner for M-Metagross, but i would switch protect for bullet punch from the move set i mentioned above.
So I've been trying out a Tapu Koko/Aegislash/Mega Salamence team with Koko as lead... Got destroyed by lead Nidoqueen3. How am I supposed to deal with it?
If you're leading with Koko, you know that the Queen will Earth Power, so switch to Salamence, then to Aegislash (if Ice Beam freezes, at least the mon who can most afford to be frozen is stuck), and back to Salamence.Basically, you have to switch-stall out Ice Beam and Earth Power between Mence and Slash, then switch-stall out Flamethrower and Sludge Bomb with the same two (make sure one or both of these can heal). Long process, but once the Queen is down to just Sludge Bomb or Flamethrower, either one of Mence or Slash have some breathing room to set up.
Don't Mega-Evolve during this process--you never know if you'll need the Intimidate handy for Nidoqueen3's backup, whatever it might be.
If you're leading with Koko, you know that the Queen will Earth Power, so switch to Salamence, then to Aegislash (if Ice Beam freezes, at least the mon who can most afford to be frozen is stuck), and back to Salamence.Basically, you have to switch-stall out Ice Beam and Earth Power between Mence and Slash, then switch-stall out Flamethrower and Sludge Bomb with the same two (make sure one or both of these can heal). Long process, but once the Queen is down to just Sludge Bomb or Flamethrower, either one of Mence or Slash have some breathing room to set up.
Don't Mega-Evolve during this process--you never know if you'll need the Intimidate handy for Nidoqueen3's backup, whatever it might be.
No, you don't know whether it will use Earth Power or Sludge Bomb on turn 1 - the one time I faced it as a lead it had used Earth Power at least 5 times in a row in a row on Chansey and then poisoned Salamence with Sludge Bomb the turn I switched to it, so I had to go back to Chansey and straight PP stall it. You would almost certainly get both Salamence and Aegislash statused switching back and forth between Ice Beam and Flamethrower that many times. Also Nidoqueen would switch out on Aegislash if it only had Sludge Bomb remaining. It's a tough lead made even tougher by the fact that Tapu Koko is not very good past the first 20 or so battles in Singles.
No, you don't know whether it will use Earth Power or Sludge Bomb on turn 1 - the one time I faced it as a lead it had used Earth Power at least 5 times in a row in a row on Chansey and then poisoned Salamence with Sludge Bomb the turn I switched to it, so I had to go back to Chansey and straight PP stall it. You would almost certainly get both Salamence and Aegislash statused switching back and forth between Ice Beam and Flamethrower that many times. Also Nidoqueen would switch out on Aegislash if it only had Sludge Bomb remaining. It's a tough lead made even tougher by the fact that Tapu Koko is not very good in past the first 20 or so battles in Singles.
I'm sure it would KO, but that would mean you had to sacrifice your lead, give up Intimidate, take recoil damage, and possibly get poisoned by Poison Point just to KO the opposing lead with unboosted Salamence.
No, you don't know whether it will use Earth Power or Sludge Bomb on turn 1 - the one time I faced it as a lead it had used Earth Power at least 5 times in a row in a row on Chansey and then poisoned Salamence with Sludge Bomb the turn I switched to it, so I had to go back to Chansey and straight PP stall it. You would almost certainly get both Salamence and Aegislash statused switching back and forth between Ice Beam and Flamethrower that many times. Also Nidoqueen would switch out on Aegislash if it only had Sludge Bomb remaining. It's a tough lead made even tougher by the fact that Tapu Koko is not very good past the first 20 or so battles in Singles.
See, this is the type of shit that happens when you have no real interest in the Alohamons...I forgot about Koko's typing there.
MQJinx , please disregard whatever I said, listen to the guy who, you know, plays Singles.
On the plus side, being educated in this fashion does have me interested in the NidoRoyals' potential in the Tree/Royal. I hadn't noticed until now, but they currently have very low representation on the leaderboards.
I'm sure it would KO, but that would mean you had to sacrifice your lead, give up Intimidate, take recoil damage, and possibly get poisoned by Poison Point just to KO the opposing lead with unboosted Salamence.
True, but I didn't see any other way around the problem (using these three Pokemon). Koko has both STABs resisted or nullified, so it's virtually useless here. Salamence can do solid damage but is then OHKO by ice beam, so setup is by all means in a bad position. Aegislash can't take Earth Power or Flamethrower well, and PP Stalling is, at best, a coin flip between Salamence taking a neutral hit with chance of status or being immune (edit: as someone said earlier). I don't think HP Ice and EQ are even a 100% chance to OHKO after Black Sludge, so the recoil is unfortunately necessary for the "optimal" situation.
Without knowing what sets these Pokemon are running, knowing only that Nidoqueen is the lead, all I can do is minimize the damage that a solid Pokemon can do to the team with SE STAB on two Pokemon and OHKO coverage for the other. The best case scenario here is unfortunately losing one pokemon and crippling the value of your main wincon, barring some hail-mary like Salamence switching in and getting a crit. Luck shouldn't be a strategy on any team.
This sheet has been really useful, thanks for making it! I've been lurking since gen V and resources like this have been incredibly helpful.
I've made a copy of the sheet and alphabetised all the possible pokemon lists for each trainer, so that when you view each trainer on the lookup it will display the possible sets alphabetically. I got sick of having to search for the variants in each list, and i figured someone else might like that as well.
I'm sure it would KO, but that would mean you had to sacrifice your lead, give up Intimidate, take recoil damage, and possibly get poisoned by Poison Point just to KO the opposing lead with unboosted Salamence.
Guys, could someone watch my battle video and explain me why my Gyarados Jolly 31/31/31/xx31/31 was outspeed by a turtonator after a single shell smash??? In the calculator, my gyarados still outspeeds it....just wtf. Note: Trick room was already over as seen in the video.
Guys, could someone watch my battle video and explain me why my Gyarados Jolly 31/31/31/xx31/31 was outspeed by a turtonator after a single shell smash??? In the calculator, my gyarados still outspeeds it....just wtf. Note: Trick room was already over as seen in the video.
Your Gyarados was unboosted so you were easily outrun. Max Jolly Gyarados: 146 speed. Max Timid +2 Turtonator: 192 speed. Shell Smash raises stats by 2 stages, not 1.
I will say I managed to smash through the normal 20 in doubles with little trouble with this team here:
Tapu Fini @ Terrain Extender
Misty Surge
Impish
N/A EV Training
-Dazzling Gleam
-Scald
-Aqua Ring
-Ice Beam
Celesteela @ Misty Seed
Brave Boost
Brave
N/A EV Training
-Smart Strike
-Flamethrower
-Acrobatics
-Earthquake
A-Marowak @ Assault Vest
Lightning Rod
Brave
N/A EV Training
-Stone Edge
-Stomping Tantrum
-Shadow Bone
-Flare Blitz
Mega-Kangaskhan @ Kangaskhanite
Early Bird/Parental Bond
Brave
252 Atk/4 Def/252 Spd
-Crunch
-Dizzy Punch
-Fake Out
-Shadow Claw
Most of the Pokemon I didn't even touch with the EV's, as my A-Marowak was one I raised from a Cubone without training and Fini/Celesteela were set as when I caught them, just with moves I added myself. I just wanted to throw some mons together to see how far I could get and it seemed ok with a few troubles against some grass and rock types.
With Fini and Celesteela starting the matchup I can drop Misty Surge for some protection and use up the Seeds on Celesteela so as to immediately give +1 to SpD and max Acrobatics power at the same time. If there's an electric type out, swap with A-Marowak for first turn coverage (I left most Jolteon teams only using Swagger on my mons without the confusion thanks to Terrain protection, effectively having the opponent buff me at the same time). Assault Vest is mainly just for added survival on A-Marowak. Kangaskhan comes out and Megas as needed using Fake Out for obvious reasons. I really do need to drop either Shadow claw or Crunch though, should I replace it with EQ? Or would another move be better used to fill that spot? I like to keep Fake Out and Dizzy Punch for STAB and flinching/confusion, so the other two are up in the air ATM.
Your Gyarados was unboosted so you were easily outrun. Max Jolly Gyarados: 146 speed. Max Timid +2 Turtonator: 192 speed. Shell Smash raises stats by 2 stages, not 1.
Thanks for your answer. I forgot the 252 ivs in speed for the calc.
Damn, I had no problems with singles and doubles but multi battles are being so hard for me because its just one option to switch for each person. How r people doing in multis? Just going for tapu combos?
Ill share my team here for super singles and super doubles 50+ streak:
Singles
Classic Dragon-Water-Steel
Dragonite @Lum Berry ---- Lead
Multiscale
Adamant 252 atk/ 252 speed/ 4 hp
Dragon dance
Outrage
Fire punch
Earthquake
Toxapex @ Black Sludge
Regenerator
Bold 252 hp / 180 def / 76 spdef
Oranguru @ Lum Berry/ Mental herb ----- Lead
Telepathy
Sassy 252 hp / 164 def / 92 spdef
IV: 31/x/31/31/31/0
Instruct
Light screen / Reflect / Psychic / Energy ball
Protect
Trick Room
Alolan Marowak @ Thick Club
Rock Head / Lightningrod (if conservative)
Brave 252hp /140 atk / 12 def /104 spdef
IV: 0 speed
Flare Blitz
Shadow bone
Earthquake
Stone edge
Porygon 2 @ Eviolite
Trace
Quiet 252 hp / 160 def / 92 spdef /4 spatk
IV 0 speed
Ice beam
Thunderbolt
Recover
Trick Room
Strategy : Fake out + trick room 95 % of the time then sweep Close Combat or Earthquake + Instruct. If CC or EQ is not viable -> Knock off and/or "soft" them for marowak as much as possible. Porygon2 is there more for emergency trick room, ice beam to clean garchomp, mence, gliscor, thunderbolt for gyarados and weak waters.
Exceptions: Trick Room/ Slower enemy team. (Its fatal if u give a slower enemy team trick room) .If not using mental herb -> Check for taunters in database and eliminate them ASAP.
Threats : Thick Fat Snorlax and Swampert if Hariyama is fainted and no energy ball / Hammer arm Rhyperior and Conkeldurr since they become "faster" in Trick Room/ Anything slower, bulky and with good offenses if you give them trick room (meet your demise). Always think before setting trick room, check speeds, sets if possible.
Here's a team I came up with and my cousin is beta testing for me. He currently has an ongoing >50 streak. I'm working on breeding my own and I'll post some streak later.
Team Garcizorini <-- placeholder until I think of something I like
This set is pretty self explanatory. Substitute to be used as needed to scout the opponent's set, block status/OHKO moves from slower status users and set up in front of the weaker or more passive opponents. Jolly nature and max speed to ensure you can OHKO or set up the Substitute in front of as many opponents as possible. Max attack investment with Outrage and EQ are chosen to hit as hard as possible. The 4 Def EV as opposed to HP ensure you can survive an Ice Fang from Gyarados3 which is somewhat random but potentialy useful. Swords Dance is to boost as fast as possible since Garchomp doesn't have access to recovery, power through Curse users, and because you only have 3 turns of status immunity from a Tapu Fini pivot to reach +6 in front of Swagger/Flatter users that Substitute can't block or status users than can actually break your Substitute. My favorite part of the set is hands down the Dragonium Z. The 190 Base Power + STAB gives you a OHKO option on a lot of Pokemon you can't set up on that Outrage misses. This makes it a 3v2 with a perfectly fresh team, and it also doesn't lock you in if a Fairy or Steel comes in to ruin your sweep, especially without a Lum Berry to cure the confusion. For that reason alone, Devastating Drake should be used to KO all first or second Pokemon that can't be taken down with EQ regardless if Garchomp is +0 or +6. The second use is to guarantee a KO on those annoying Bright Powder/Lax Incense sets that can hax you over. Also, did I mention that the character's Dragonium Z jaws pose goes really well with GarCHOMP? That alone makes it worth using! Nothing like the feeling when you KO the last Pokemon with a +6 Devastating Drake while hiding behind a Substitute.
I prefer Garchomp over Dragonite because of the STAB EQ giving you other KO options besides locking yourself into Outrage. It also makes short work of some faster leads that Dragonite has issues with such as Charizard34 which I always hated seeing. Charizard-X either OHKO's or Dragon Dances as well and Charizard Y can flinch and neuter Dragonite with Air Slash, then has no trouble sweeping the Steel and Water/Fairy backups thanks to Drought. Garchomp also provides an electric immunity and is able to benefit from the Misty Terrain status immunity to set up and KO with a STAB move, something that Dragonite cannot do.
Scizor @ Scizorite
Ability: Technician
EV: 252 HP / 144 Atk / 112 SpD (currently in use by cousin)
EV: 252 HP / 76 Atk / 180 SpD (recommended)
Adamant Nature
- Bullet Punch
- U-turn
- Roost
- Swords Dance
My cousin's spread adds a rather arbitrary amount into SpD and dumps the rest in attack. Heavy SpD investment is required to allow Scizor to set up on special attackers as safely as possible. Thanks to Technician, Scizor generally has more than enough power to sweep at +6, even against some Steel resists types. I saw this particular set OHKO Red's Charizard34 at +6 with Bullet Punch after setting up on Mega Venusaur. I ran the calculations later, and it wasn't a guaranteed OHKO, but that is impressive nonetheless.
Right now I am leaning toward the second spread. The 76 Atk lets you OHKO Gengar4 at +2 while the 252 HP / 180 SpD gives you special bulk and a decent chance(>50%) to switch in regular Scizor on a Gengar34 lead, mega evolve Swords Dance and survive a second Shadow Ball from a Gengar4 while you boost to take it out if you really don't want to risk losing Garchomp. If Scizor is already mega evolved and at full health, it is guaranteed to survive 2 Shadow Balls from Gengar4 without any critical hits or SpD drop on the first one, which is pretty impressive. Scizor uses Bullet Punch most of the time, so it's not that important to hit an empty Speed tier. The only ones available to Scizor are 73, 74 and 77 if you use Brave, and 82, 83 and 89 for Adamant with imperfect IVs. The next open one is 107 which is not worth the sacrifice in bulk.
U-Turn is a bit of a filler move. I think it could be replaced with Brick Break or Superpower(post-bank) to aid in taking down opposing Steel types which can be a pain. However, U-turn does give you a free switch to Garchomp on Magnet Pull Magnezone while simultaneously breaking Sturdy. Garchomp and Tapu Fini don't have any recovery, so avoiding having to sack Scizor is a huge plus. I like U-turn just for that reason. Swords Dance lets Scizor boost as high as possible during the 3 turns of status immunity he is given by Tapu Fini.
Bulky Scizor makes short work of Fairy/Ice/Grass types that threaten your team. Able to switch in on the thorn that is Altaria3, Roost, Swords Dance and Bullet Punch OHKO at just +2. He can even set up further if you can tolerate the risk of consecutive critical hits. He is also the team's best answer to Ice types that threaten Garchomp after a pivot through Tapu Fini to set Misty Terrain and provide freeze immunity.
Max SpA to hit as hard as possible when necessary and 240 Spe to outrun the base 130 crowd. Since Garchomp can't Dragon Dance, it's nice to have all the extra Speed you can get. The rest just maximize bulk.
Fini's main role is to pivot into predicted status moves that Garchomp can't block with Substitute and set up Misty Terrain. From here Tapu Fini can either take out the other Pokemon or switch back out to Scizor or Garchomp to give them a chance to set up without worry for status. In the case of Swagger users, they get a free +2 attack boost to help them set up. More often than not, Scizor will come in after Fini because access to Roost makes setting up easier and safer.
This is my Gen VII remix on the Dragon/Steel/Fairy core. It doesn't use any Intimidate switching or PP stalling, but is still effective due to its flawless type synergy. Garchomp is weak to Ice, Dragon and Fairy. Scizor resists all 3, and Tapu Fini has Dragon immunity and resists Ice with an added status immunity. Scizor's only weakness is Fire which is resisted by both partners. Fini is weak to Poison, Grass and Electric. Garchomp has electric immunity plus Poison resist, and Scizor has Poison immunity and 4x Grass resist. Because the team doesn't rely on Intimidate switching or PP stalling, matches tend to go fairly quickly. However, since Scizor is the only team member with access to recovery, it generally requires good prediction to use effectively since it can be worn down quickly. Scizor sees a lot of use as a result.
The general team strategy is:
1) If Garchomp can Substitute or set up on the first Pokemon, do it. Fire and Electric types generally fall into this category along with slow & passive sets.
2) If the first Pokemon is not something Garchomp can set up on, can Scizor set up either through direct switch in or Tapu Fini pivot? Or is Scizor the safer set up option in general? Most Ice, Fairy, Grass, Poison, Bug and Psychic fall into this category.
3) Can Garchomp EQ/Devastating Drake OHKO? Mostly anything EQ hits for super effective that is not a passive set like Arcanine and Typhlosion. Charizard34 is a good example of straight up Devastating Drake OHKO.
4) Can Fini switch in and KO it safer with minimal damage? Water and Dragon types usually.
5) "Oh ****, none of these are possible!" This happens every once in a while. Haven't encountered any leads yet that can't be beat, but some do require a little luck to not get critical hit.
Gourgeist34 is an example is an example of an annoyance. The best play is do Devastating Drake turn 1. If Gourgeist3, you will take ~40% and finish with EQ. If Gourgeist4, it will Trick-or-Treat, so EQ can't finish it with Garchomp as Ghost type. Free switch to Scizor for turn 1 of Phantom Force. Gourgeist4 is faster than Scizor, so mega evolve Roost to keep full health and finish with Bullet Punch.
Aggron3 is another example or one that can leave a big dent or a hole. Garchomp can't even EQ 2HKO, so free switch to Fini on the Dragon Rush, then hope for a Surf 2HKO(58.6% chance). The best outcome is Fini 2HKO and 60% or 100% remaining after 1 Stone Edge or Stone Edge miss, which it uses instead of Heavy Slam for some reason. The medium outcome is Fini 3HKO and barely survive 2 Stone Edge. The worst outcome is Aggron3 with barely any health and Fini dead from a Stone Edge critical. This team doesn't like Mega Aggron, but with Filter and max HP investment with mono-Steel typing, I can't think of too many Pokemon that can power through him.
Primarina34 is another example of a serious pain. Similar to the experience HeadsILoseTailsYouWin ran into using Dragonite/Aegislash/Tapu Fini, there is no great way past this Pokemon. Scizor can slowly set up to +2 2HKO or +4 OHKO Bullet Punch on Primarina4 if you don't fear critical hits, but Tapu Fini has to take a 20% Blizzard to ensure no freeze on Scizor. If Primarina3, Sizor can switch in directly and PP stall it out of Hydro Pump if no critical hits, then set up with ease, but since most trainers can carry both sets, Tapu Fini must eat a up to ~57% Moonblast before Scizor comes in. At least this team wrecks Mega Altaria and Incineroar leads thanks to Scizor and STAB EQ, respectively.
Gyarados34 leads are annoying if they have Intimidate. Without it Gyarados3 is OHKO'd by Devastating Drake, and Gyarados4 is left with minimal HP while doing about 50% to Garchomp. If it Dragon Dances, switch to Scizor and Bullet Punch. If it has Intimidate, it gets more tricky, but haven't seen them yet. The team can get past them, but not without some bruises.
Starmie4 is not too much of hassle unless it is a lead, but if it is, the safest way is Tapu Fini on the Ice Beam to set up Terrain to prevent freeze, Garchomp on the Thunderbolt, Scizor on the Ice Beam and U-turn OHKO. Else Fini can 2HKO with Grass Knot while taking 59-71% damage, but no chance for flinch hax. Bullet Punch is a 70% OHKO if Scizor is already at +6 with the 76 Atk spread.
Seems doable with this team, failed at 47 due bad luck(parahax 2stronk and retarded AI):
Minior @ White Herb
Ability: Shields Down
EVs: 172 HP / 252 Atk / 84 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Shell Smash
- Acrobatics
- Power Gem
- Earthquake
Golisopod @ Assault Vest
Ability: Emergency Exit
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Adamant Nature
- First Impression
- Liquidation
- Leech Life
- Sucker Punch
Comfey @ Big Root
Ability: Triage
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Calm Mind
- Draining Kiss
- Synthesis
- Aromatherapy
I was trying with golisopod as leader but if they started to set up it was really hard to win, with minior is easier, just check if the enemy can oneshot him, if it does change, if not set up and win
IMO tree is much harder than maison, I could reach 50 easily with just 3 mons with a bit of synergy but here you can lose even with just a bit of bad luck
I cant upload any battles now, dunno why, ill try again later
I've been running into issues ~BT35. Any suggestions? I have a bunch of pokemon I can switch any of these two out for. So any suggestions would be nice.
I've been running into issues ~BT35. Any suggestions? I have a bunch of pokemon I can switch any of these two out for. So any suggestions would be nice.
I had Candy's Latias as a partner too, except she used Terrakion-3 instead of Azelf.
I found it much more useful to lead with Tapu Lele, since Latias benefits from the boost. Had Dazzling Gleam instead of Moonblast, and Protect instead of Tbolt.
As for Salamence, I ran Draco Meteor instead of Dragon Claw (NVE Double-Edge still does almost as much damage). I think I lost my streak at 88 over an unlucky flinch.
So am I the first to beat Super Singles without using any old mons, UBs, or Tapus? Sorry if I missed one earlier.
Red battle: XT2W-WWWW-WWW3-7VZH
I did get insanely lucky after the unexpected Dragon Rush KO, and the rest is hilarity. If I was smarter I'd bring Haze to the fight, maybe chunk Zard with Power Gem first, but it worked out anyway.
Sadly I can't upload my Toxapex stalling a Dragonite and Megamence to death, too many turns I guess? Here are a couple of others
4LYG-WWWW-WWW3-7VTB - Power of Minior
YTRG-WWWW-WWW3-7VTP - Vet battle with PP stall (correction, regular stall)
Team:
Minior @ White Herb
Ability: Shields Down
EVs: 172 HP / 252 Atk / 84 Spe IVs: 31/31/31/31/31/31 (Hyper Trained)
Adamant Nature
- Shell Smash - Acrobatics - Power Gem - Earthquake
Toxapex @ Black Sludge
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
IVs: 31/x/31/31/31/31
Bold Nature
- Scald - Toxic - Recover - Baneful Bunker
Marowak-Alola @ Thick Club
Ability: Lightning Rod
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
IVs: 31/31/31/x/31/31
Adamant Nature
- Flare Blitz - Shadow Bone - Earthquake - Flame Charge
Several battles came down to PP stalling enemy Earthquakes and electric moves with switching, as you can see in the Red battle. Toxapex regenerates the neutral damage while teammates absorb the attacks.
Minior's EV spread is modified from GMars' build, which runs 188/236/84. I opted for full attack. As he discusses in the Minior thread, even with no special investment and negative nature, Power Gem nets many of the same KOs as Stone Edge or Rock Slide, on top of perfect accuracy and hitting physical tanks harder.
The extra HP helps it survive its setup.
With 84 in speed, shield form outspeeds neutral nature base 70 at +0, and +nature base 145 at +2. Core form outspeeds +nature 85 at +0, and scarfed +nature 130 at +2.
The rest is pretty straightforward.
So, if I'm looking for the strongest Alolan non-legends, what comes to mind? Toxapex of course.
It's a stall monster as you'd expect, and outstalls many of the tree's bullshit builds. Physical bulk seemed to handle more threats. 252 HP gives odd health at level 50. I would switch Bunker to Haze if only for the Red fight. Regenerator PP stalling is really tedious but it's sometimes the only way to win with a handicap.
There is probably a more optimal spread for Marowak, but I didn't really do any calcs. Flame Charge started as a filler move, since I didn't want to rely on Will-O-Miss, but ended up really useful even with no speed investment, often leading to sweeps. This thing also deals with a lot of notorious tree threats, and the endless Twave spam.
Most of you guys probably noticed that the tree's AI doesn't register abilities like the Maison did, so it will often spam status on shielded Minior, electric on Marowak, etc. This team often relies on abusing the AI like that when it can't just straight up kill it. You'll also want to find setup opportunities when you can; even if your current mon can net a kill, setting up may secure your next enemy.
I tried several different builds, including Mimikyu, A-Persian, Golisopod, Primarina, Turtonator, but this is the one that pulled through, probably by using Toxapex and allowing me to lame out its weaknesses with PP stall.
It was actually pretty tedious and I wouldn't recommend it, but I'm happy to prove you can beat the tree using only regular Alola mons.
I eschewed boltbeam and dragon STAB so I could handle Ice/Steel/Rock/dual Water more easily. It might seem redundant with A-Marowak but it works, especially since Hyper Voice handles boltbeam targets anyway whereas Steel and Rock resist it.
Unfortunately, I quickly learned that Berserk does not trigger from indirect damage such as Life Orb recoil. Odd HP generally gives me an extra attack.
"What the fuck are these apeshit EVs" you might be asking. 130 Defense guarantees a 2HKO from Bisharp 3's crit Night Slash. That's the benchmark. I wanted more all around tankiness than just special, as most of tree's heavy hitters seem physical. In case you're wondering, a Relaxed 252/148/108 build, which gets 130 Def, actually results in 1 less SpD.
16 SpD is redundant so 4 free points in SpA. Though Foul Play is an option I guess, but Psychic is nice for Fighting and Poison types.
You might be tempted to use Telepathy meme builds, but Inner Focus + Mental Herb gets Trick Room up much more reliably, and reliability is really the key to battle facilities I think. Not to mention the tree's love of flinch hax.
Marowak is pretty straightforward.
Mimikyu is probably the most confusing. I wanted a second Trick Room setter, another switch-in on Drampa's weaknesses, and something to KO pesky dark types. I debated a fast build in case of TR failure, but figured I'll try minimum speed, which ties with 31 IV neutral nature base 70 (outslowing Mega TTar by 1 point). Of course Disguise makes setting easier too, and Shadow Sneak allows for some tricky plays coupled with Instruct.
I strongly considered Comfey here, with its disregard for speed, fast TR setting, healing Drampa and Marowak's recoil, maybe even stacking Berserks or triggering them with priority Draining Kiss. But I was hesitant to have two supports, and Z-Play Rough did clinch it a few times.
Sadly my choice of Alolan TR setters is limited.
Unlike my singles win, I know for a fact I'm not the first to win Doubles with this handicap. I saw a team of Oranguru/Primarina/A-Marowak/A-Exeggutor, which honestly is probably more reliable than this one. I tried to make something different for its own sake, and I'm glad it worked out. Nice to know that even within these limits there is some variety.
Doing Multi next and I don't think my AI partner will be Alolan only, but as long as I am that's good enough for me.
