Black & White Battle Subway Records

[Coeur7]

Looking back at my best Subway teams so far (PKHeX'd, you know it):

JetSawk (291 wins)

Scrafty Triangle (636)

Jump WhimsiTran (325)

And the new contender...

Double Genie Quadrangle (336)

Landorus-T @ Choice Scarf, 252 Atk / enough Spe for 134 stat / rest HP, Adamant, Intimidate; Earthquake / Rock Slide / Fly / U-turn
Thundurus @ Life Orb, 252 SpA / Spe, Timid, Prankster; Thunderbolt / Grass Knot / HP Ice / Protect
Vaporeon @ Sitrus Berry, 252 Def / SpA, Modest, Water Absorb; Scald / Ice Beam / Helping Hand / Protect
Scizor @ Steel Gem, 252 HP / Atk, Adamant, Technician; Bullet Punch / Bug Bite / Swords Dance / Protect

Hey look it's Vappers!! Super cute!!

I remember that turskain called it "an interesting choice" back when I was just starting my Subway adventure and had no idea what I was doing. Now it's finally vindicated.

Backstory: I tried the Gengar team from my last post again but lost very quickly (double RS miss lol) and wondered whether a different structure might work better. JetSawk proved the integrity of the Steel + Water backline with a Scarfer + LOer in front; the Scrafty team showed how good Landorus + Electric upfront with a backline Water-type can be. Do we really need the Water to float? It's usually switching in for Landorus anyway. The frontliner must float, though -- and Thundurus is an easy choice; not only does it provide Grass Knot over Zapdos, but also the coveted 111 Speed tier. What does it matter that my leads are both Blizzard-weak, Froslass -- and by extension most anything else -- won't ever get to attack, and things like Vaporeon or Lapras, which formerly mandated slow play with a Rotom switch, now just get KO'd by U-turn + TBolt too. (Do not ask about Quick Claw Glaceon. It's only on certain trainers since it's set1, but both Ice Workers and Nursery Aides, the latter of which I've learned to respect, use it and it's horrible. But more in a minute.)

Settling on a Water-type was tougher -- gen5 does not lack competition. Obviously it needs to attack with Scald and wield Sitrus Berry, or we could just have Lum Rotom-W again (Electric-type is "pure profit" for it -- there are no downsides at all). Suicune should always be the first consideration -- it's reasonably fast, takes over games with Calm Mind, but also has enough power and bulk off the bat to 2HKO the natural prey of Water-types and live through it. Everything else is measured by its distance to Cune: Milotic has Recover and Haze, but low Defense unless it invests to the detriment of its SpA. Blastoise has Fake Out, but less of everything else (Water Spout is obviously not an argument on TW-less teams). Empoleon dies to EQ -- no thanks (Empoleon is cool on other teams, though; see note at the end). Gastrodon has a great ability for Landorus support and offers more Electric insurance (note how weak the team is to Electric when Lando dies), but is Ice-neutral -- too risky. Politoed powers up opposing Waters and Rain trainers in particular -- really bad (I would have lost at least one particular endgame to Kingdra with Politoed). Starmie is fast, but frail and still kind of weak for the bulk tradeoff. Which leaves us with Vaporeon. It might not seem to do anything special, but it has everything a good Water needs: it is bulky enough to excellently exploit Sitrus Berry while also taking <50% from Lando's EQ (important because it should not die to a crit), hits for more than anything else, and offers "priority" in Helping Hand that leeches off the effective speed and power of its partner. Since the team around Vap is all speedy offense, this is a great fit -- it most commonly boosts Bullet Punch, but sealing endgames can occur with anything next to it.

The choice of Steel is pretty self-explanatory: Scizor kills Ice better than any other Steel except maybe Metagross, which would be weak to EQ. Lum would sometimes be nice to have, but I prefer Steel Gem for versatility (and the HH combo). Freeze to Scizor is usually not the end of the world, either, since it at least stops Ices defensively as well and Vap gets time to soften them up with Scald. The team's "Rock resist" is thus Intimidate, but you can manage; Rock coverage is usually on Grounds and Rocks, which don't get much chance to even fire their attacks, and something like Ampharos Power Gem is pretty much moot because it could just blast the team with Electric moves anyway.

Blizzard is actually still pretty bad. Vap's hour to shine came when it defeated Flareon + Quick Claw Glaceon from a Nursery Aide, Mirror Coat notwithstanding, in a 1-2 situation (which was 3-2 before EXTREME KILLER GLACEON toggled, obviously). Then Battle #300 was vs. a Janitor packing Abomasnow / Absol / Articuno / Empoleon, Swagger plus triple Blizzard (I U-turned T1 for fear of a Fly miss, which might have been overcautious). I barely got out alive and probably only because Thundurus did not hit itself on a crucial turn. If the Eruption Entei / Typhlosion ever crits Lando T1, there is most likely trouble as well.

The loss occurred to Garchomp / Archeops / Haxorus / Salamence (Biker). Garchomp was Scarfed and killed Lando with crit Outrage. Haxorus came in for the KO'd Archeops, and I had no chance against double Outrage spam unless I had gotten lucky with targeting. (Garchomp didn't hit itself and immediately snapped out of confusion right afterwards, Haxorus had Persim Berry).

Anyhow, there you have 300 with Scarf Lando-T -- it can be done, as I had assumed previously. Maybe not with Rotom ;)

tldr: This is my legacy: Water good, Electric/Ground good, priority good, balance good.

PS. I also tried Froslass (with backline Empoleon + Latios, and Scarf Lando-Incarnate -- still with U-turn, though), mostly for curiosity about how much work Destiny Bond does for the Gengar team. It did roughly as well as Froslass will ever do (169 wins). As mentioned, Empoleon is pretty cool, compressing the Water/Steel backline into a single slot, taking SE only from what Lando resists/is immune to, and bashing Ices with Flash Cannon (don't use IB, Scald/Grass Knot/Flash Cannon is best). The loss occurred to a legendary trainer with triple genies and DMeteor Latias -- just too much outspeeding going on (for added fatality, my Latios had 30 Spe IV HP Fire) and Empo being dead to Thundurus TBolt in the endgame.

PPS. I think Sableye is a cool suggestion in a vacuum but unfortunately doesn't seem like the choice for Lando -- takes too much damage from EQ (unless Air Balloon lol -- I guess it could get away with that) and Gravity isn't so great either (you don't want to take away your own team's crucial immunities), if anything I'd use it for FO, priority Leer and guaranteed Froslass dunking with Sucker Punch + Lando's attack. Add Recover in slot 4 (Prankster Recover so good). Still pretty passive, unfortunately -- same reason why I don't like to use things like Alomomola.

 

[Brucolac]

PPS. I think Sableye is a cool suggestion in a vacuum but unfortunately doesn't seem like the choice for Lando -- takes too much damage from EQ (unless Air Balloon lol -- I guess it could get away with that) and Gravity isn't so great either (you don't want to take away your own team's crucial immunities), if anything I'd use it for FO, priority Leer and guaranteed Froslass dunking with Sucker Punch + Lando's attack. Add Recover in slot 4 (Prankster Recover so good). Still pretty passive, unfortunately -- same reason why I don't like to use things like Alomomola.

Yeah, probably Sableye with Gravity would need a bit of a different team (although I think with Landorus-T it still may be a viable combination). Maybe in the subway it would be rather passive. I play it in online battles gen 6 Doubles and Will-O-Wisp is just so good (I win many battles with Charge Beam Blissey in the end, and yes, this is doubles). I guess Knock Off is the other reason why it never feels passive, so yeah, maybe it's too weak in gen5. I just thought of it because the backrows of your teams to me seem to be built a bit more on the defensive, well balanced side and may enjoy some burn or other support, compared to many other teams who just hit hard and fast.

 

[Coeur7]

Gravity is probably better with Lando-I than T. Could be worth trying, but the issue is that I don't see it surpassing the Scrafty team. Lando really appreciates Electric co-leads and Scrafty does much of what Sableye does more reliably / more actively. Intimidate is just better than Prankster WoW for the most part, not least because of accuracy.

You're right that my preferred style has fast offense up front, defensive options in the back. Even 4K kind of does this if you count Kangaskhan as defensive. That said, you can see why I'm not a fan of frontline Sableye from this description. An item-boosted Electric is simply too good with Lando. If I was to try FO with this team, I would probably default to Sitrus Berry Blastoise in Vap's place because the Water + Lando / Water + Scizor synergy is hard to deny. But, consider: Vaporeon cute.

image

I do agree Sableye has potential but I haven't yet found the team for it. Blissey sounds like a cool synergistic wincon, yeah. Could probably even be the classic GG Unit Minimize Chansey, it seems like it takes roughly as long to win as Charge Beam does.

Edit: Btw, the loss mentioned above was probably avoidable by clicking SD with Scizor first (I BP'd Haxorus for <50%, which I definitely didn't expect -- no set lookup "stupidity" / negligence strikes again). Steel Gem +2 Bullet Punch has a range to OHKO the (ridiculous) 168 HP / 168 Def Haxorus, which would have saved me even with Salamence subsequently Intimidating Scizor back down, I think -- Thund might have taken -1 Outrage from Chomp but unless that crit again, it wasn't an OHKO and Thund could have OHKO'd non-Yache Mence before it moved, after which Garchomp should lose alone although I think +1 BP without Gem is a 3HKO.

 

[Brucolac]

Yes, actually I play Landorus-I in that team, with LO and Earthpower, Focus Blast, HP Ice, Protect. Focus Blast also gets the Sheer Force Boost, its insane. Under Gravtiy it OHKOs considerably more mons than Specs Latios, if you take the subway sets for reference. I would play this with Sableye in the subway, but I have no access to Landorus. I played this cool Team here from flav0r a while ago and thought about some variation, as it was weak against fast electrics.

Haha, Vaporeon <3
I see your points with electrics and Scrafty.

For the doubles Blissey, it's not as passive as it may seem. It has 252 SAtk and Blizzard (and Softboiled + Aromatherapy). Landorus-T often think they can switch in on this. A lot of things in this meta don't like to be hit by Blizzards, even when they are weak at first. And due to Gravity they never miss. Blissey is a nice win condition as killing or burning the physical attackers usually is sufficient for the win, but it often already pressures the opponent as the battles goes.

 

[Coeur7]

Gyarados @ Lum Berry, 220 Atk / 124 SpD / 164 Spe, Jolly, Intimidate; Dragon Dance / Waterfall / Return / Protect
Raichu @ Focus Sash, 252 SpA / Spe, Timid, Lightning Rod; Fake Out / Protect / Thunderbolt / HP Ice
Landorus @ Life Orb, 252 SpA / Spe, Timid, Sheer Force; Earth Power / Sludge Bomb / Grass Knot / Protect
Scizor @ Steel Gem, 252 HP / Atk, Adamant, Technician; Bullet Punch / Bug Bite / Swords Dance / Protect

266 wins with Gyaraichu (PKHeX'd as always). Lost an engineered 1v1 with +2 Scizor vs Milotic (Ice Beam froze immediately, no thaw in 5 turns), but had already lived through a miraculous salvage at ~235 where +2 Scizor 1v3'd the opposition thanks to the only mon that could have given the win (?) appearing last, Sitrus Berry Gothitelle (snacking the berry was vital). The computer does not respect Lightning Rod, which gives you free wins every so often. The team features a Water/Electric/Ground triangle + Water/Ground/Scizor triangle once again. Lando also floats, which has obvious synergy with Raichu; Ground is needed because Raichu won't be around forever to deflect Electric. SD Scizor is better than Metagross here (also for opposing Def/evasion boosters). The strangely specific Gyara spread is to reach 134 Speed and get 2HKO'd by Glaceon Blizzard (which I lost the first attempt to) <5% of the time, factoring in Waterfall flinch and accuracy. Water + Normal gives good neutral coverage (of all the Subway foes, only Empoleon and Ferrothorn resist both attacks). While Raichu is seriously weak, it still has enough power to KO Walrein4 with TBolt after +1 Return chip.

 

[Coeur7]

Ninetales @ Focus Sash, 252 SpA / Spe, Modest, Drought; Nasty Plot / Heat Wave / Solar Beam / Protect
Scrafty @ Fighting Gem, 244 HP / 244 Atk / 20 Spe, Adamant, Intimidate; Fake Out / Drain Punch / Payback / Protect
Latios @ Life Orb, 252 SpA / Spe, Timid, Levitate; Dragon Pulse / Psyshock / HP Ground / Protect
Charizard @ Choice Scarf, 252 SpA / Spe, Modest, Solar Power; Heat Wave / Solar Beam / Air Slash / Dragon Pulse

Scrafty's Solar Empire (PKHeX'd) wins 197. This is only the second-best Sun record, but I don't think anyone has tried Charizard, so it's worth reporting. Solar Power Heat Wave is exactly as strong as Typhlosion's Eruption, but it can miss (the trade-off is that Charizard's coverage is much stronger and you can actually switch it into things without worrying about Eruption BP). Dragon Pulse has a ~30% shot to OHKO Latios in sun (guaranteed with Fake Out chip, although I don't like FOing Latios because it's better if it spends Draco Meteor right away), so I chose it over HP Ice. I found that Ninetales is very good at taking 85-90% damage and surviving, thus no Life Orb here -- instead, we have the FO-enabled Nasty Plot, which can amp up the damage to seal a game immediately if both opposing leads are slower than Tales and can't both status it badly. I would have liked HP Rock or Ice but there's no room -- Protect is ultimately much more valuable. The other moveset choices are pretty obvious; HP Ground particularly helps with Flash Fire mons (Heatran foremost, although I think I didn't see a single Heatran on this streak) but is the best choice anyway. Scrafty notably has Payback here because that guarantees an OHKO on uninvested Lati@s (unlike Crunch), Trick Room doesn't really enter the picture (and when it did, Scrafty was usually slower in TR than the Psychic threats).

I played really well on this streak, I think -- lots of close calls where good decisions made the difference. The losing battle is worth a closer description:

Clerk (male) sends out Mienshao / Aerodactyl (set3). I know I'm in danger.
T1: Click FO Aero, Solar Beam Aero. Mienshao FOs Scrafty, Rock Gem RS goes through, Ninetales takes ~75% (Scrafty obviously takes pittance), does not flinch. Solar Beam rolls low, but that doesn't matter (min is 45%).
T2: Click Protect with Scrafty, switch Ninetales to Latios. This may have been a mistake, as Latios is often more worthwhile than Ninetales, but hard to say. In a match where I have to come back from a bad lead, Tales may be better since Heat Wave hits both foes (usually). Still, in all scenarios where Shao does not crit Latios with HJK, this is better because I can sacrifice Tales next turn while Latios Protects, and then Latios can get rid of Aerodactyl and be well-positioned to also chip Mienshao down to Sash on the following turn, while Scrafty doesn't die to -2 HJK.
Aero uses RS, Latios takes chip (20-25%). Mienshao uses HJK... into Latios. Crit! KO (crit does 84% min). Okay.
I send Charizard (what else).
T3: Deliberating that Solar Beaming Aero will lead to All My Friends Are Dead Syndrome, more so since Scrafty cannot Protect this turn and needs to switch into Tales to avoid the (possible, not guaranteed) -1 HJK OHKO (Shao is Sashed, so I cannot prevent it unless Air Slash flinches it, but Air Slash is obviously a bad lock here anyway) and reset Fake Out/Inti, which I might direly need yet, I click Heat Wave and switch, knowing that Wave does 56% min to Aero and this is not the Wide Guard Mienshao.
Heat Wave misses Aero, lol. Rock Slide kills Tales + Zard (Zard had 50% to survive RS but would always have died to Solar Power). No mistake; if I hadn't switched out Scrafty, Tales would have died next turn anyway. Simply bad luck on the right play.
T4: Scrafty alone vs three mons, can it still win? The Clerk sends out Blissey3. This seems almost survivable, but Blissey immediately clicks Counter into my Drain Punch (does not OHKO) and I lose. I might have been better off killing Aero first, but chances were grim either way.

The loss makes Heat Wave look really bad. In truth, consider that it took nearly 200 battles for its miss chance to matter -- that's how good it usually is. Thrower would have lost much earlier. I'm sure Heat Wave won't be cracking 1000 any time soon, but that's not why I play.

 

[Coeur7]

Hitmontop (M) @ Wide Lens
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Spe
Ability: Intimidate
Level: 50
Adamant Nature
- Fake Out
- High Jump Kick
- Sucker Punch
- Stone Edge

Volcarona (F) @ Charti Berry
EVs: 244 HP / 148 Def / 4 SpA / 4 SpD / 108 Spe
Ability: Flame Body
Bold Nature
- Quiver Dance
- Heat Wave
- Bug Buzz
- Tailwind

Suicune @ Sitrus Berry
IVs: 2 Atk / 30 SpA
EVs: 196 HP / 248 SpA / 4 SpD / 60 Spe
Ability: Pressure
Level: 50
Modest Nature
- Calm Mind
- Scald
- Hidden Power [Grass]
- Icy Wind

Latias (F) @ Dragon Gem
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Ability: Levitate
Level: 50
Timid Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Dragon Pulse
- Psych Up
- Protect

"At an angel I hit,
and a demon's entangled
in the haze of my net."
(Nabokov, "The Hawkmoth")

The wonderful, the captivating, the majestic Volcarona allies with a novel Hitmontop build to set new standards. I had previously always used 252 SpA / Spe Focus Sash Volc on minor Doubles streaks, but it could not perform all that well. Yet with the "Ray Rizzo principle" (invest in your bad stats) and an also Rizzo-esque Charti Berry (resist berries remain somewhat underexplored in Doubles across all gens), Volcarona unlocks more of its potential than ever before. 260 wins with MothTop, bolstered by the ever-reliable "CoeurCune" (HP Grass, Sitrus, my favorite) and... this Latios looks strange, doesn't it? I thought that Red Jet was more suited to setup than her brother due to higher defenses; running only Dragon attacks is very feasible when the rest of the team removes Steel-types with acuity. You will often not click Psych Up, either; Gem (i.e. "+1") Draco hits roughly as hard as Latios' LO DPulse anyway, and when accuracy matters, Gem DPulse will probably be enough chip to 2HKO with the next hit (and Latias' defenses make it survive until then).

I have previously always been disappointed with Top -- Mach Punch hits for too little and CC defense drops make it die to the next incoming hit. But when you notice that it has no real use for its common items (Fighting Gem: often overkill; Sitrus Berry: often doesn't prevent 2HKOs, and has competition from other team members who need it more), you might develop the idea to unlock its strongest Fighting STAB with Wide Lens. And, as a bonus, you get a pretty accurate Rock move that rounds out its coverage nicely -- and, together with Intimidate and Tailwind, gives you counterplay against Flying-types, which is direly needed because nothing on the team resists Flying. Hitmontop does get a good priority move over Scrafty; what's more, a weakness to Psychic-types is more manageable with Bug Buzz support than one to Fighting-types (Latias switches into both equally well anyway, except that Psychic is often special and thus hits Latias on its stronger defensive stat). The Rock resistance is, of course, very useful with Volcarona alongside.

Tailwind makes this team much more consistent, especially against legendary trainers (Top happens to hit 91 Speed, a key stat to outspeed base 110+ in TW), I would not even have come close to 200 without it. I also opted for speed control on Suicune to better enable a switched-out Volcarona (which has 134 Speed, so a +1 from QD or a -1 from Icy Wind puts it at effective 201, one point above the base 130+ crew -- you've seen this on the Gyarados team already). Heat Wave is much better than single-target Fire moves, 90% accuracy is not always unviable (but especially not on a spread move).

I lost to Blissey4 lead. The team is kind of asking for that to happen; unfortunately, as much as HJK improves Top otherwise, it is decidedly a liability in this single matchup, and there's really no room for Blissey4 countermeasures apart from that. What I didn't try was to copy the +6 evasion with Latias and hope Toxic would never hit it, maybe that would have gone better? I haven't analyzed the odds. Hitting a single +6 Gem Draco would have won me the game, but alas.

edit: just to make it clear, team is PKHeX'd as always

 

[Brucolac]

The occasional doubles setup <3
Who, if not you, would make Volcarona work in doubles.
Is Draco Meteor so much required? Some more coverage, or Psyshock against this Blissey may be viable, no?

 

[Coeur7]

There's only a 3% chance (accuracy delta) Psyshock would have helped more against +6 evasion Blissey4 than Gem Draco -- both OHKO at +6, and against Policemen it's not hard to set up at least one of Volc/Cune to +6 and copy the boost. Resisted Gem Draco is still stronger than super-effective HP Ground, and nothing 4x resists it. Only when 2HKOing you might be in trouble due to the SpA drop, but Psych Up mitigates this better than any coverage (or you could switch; this team is quite defensive and I found myself switching back from Latias decently often) and Latias probably isn't 2HKOing anything with unboosted HP Ground (I know Latios definitely needs Specs/LO to achieve 2HKOs with it, or OHKOs with Psyshock, aside from 4x weaks). Also consider, as said, that Latias' partners are pretty effective against Steels -- the chance that I need to 1v1 a healthy Steel last is very low. It happened once, the foe was Bronzong (where no coverage helps consistently, since it's a 50/50 to be useless; Draco is actually the strongest sensible move you get against it), and Latias still won (assisted by a single Sucker Punch hit from Top). The "coverage" I have is a move that has 100% accuracy and still gets boosted by the item, which is far more necessary than anything else. If any move is droppable, it's Protect, but that has its uses too (e.g. when Tailwind is not up vs. a legendary trainer who sends out opposing Lati@s), especially given that Latias can tank most hits and thus attract more.

I would definitely say Draco is required. Of course accuracy is a hassle, but really what matters is often the effective chance to OHKO, which will quite commonly be 0% with Dragon Pulse and 90% with Draco. Being backline also makes the SpA drop matter less; Latias is really fulfilling the "Marshadow" role with amazing coverage on a notably strong "Z-move" and the speed and bulk to supplement that.

 

[potatobagel]

Updated the Subway Assistant here to now include Speed instead of the EV Spread. Also deleted around 200 Pokemon that are only seen in non-Super Trains.


EDIT (4-29-2024): Took out the 3 SetPrinter calls, this makes the output more compact.


Sample run against Socialite Saty:

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What trainer are you battling?
Saty
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This trainer has 80 different sets, which constitute 61888 different teams.
There are 7 alarming movesets, and there is a 0.2539 chance of running into at least one of them.
There is 0.0727 chance of finding Alarm1: ['Fake Out', 'Quick Attack', 'Mach Punch', 'Bullet Punch', 'Aqua Jet', 'Ice Shard', 'Shadow Sneak', 'Sucker Punch', 'ExtremeSpeed']
There is 0.1582 chance of finding Alarm2: ['Rain Dance', 'Hail', 'Trick Room']
There is 0.0355 chance of finding Alarm3: ['Counter', 'Mirror Coat']
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
        MOLTRES    0.163101
       ARTICUNO    0.159902
         ZAPDOS    0.158803
       LANDORUS    0.158771
         RAIKOU    0.156412
      TERRAKION    0.155895
        HEATRAN    0.155571
       REGIROCK    0.151403
       VIRIZION    0.150659
      THUNDURUS     0.14956
         LATIAS    0.148268
         LATIOS    0.148268
      REGIGIGAS    0.147201
       COBALION    0.146458
          ENTEI    0.146135
       TORNADUS    0.143776
      CRESSELIA    0.141578
         REGICE     0.14077
      REGISTEEL    0.139833
        SUICUNE    0.137636
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Please enter a Pokemon you have seen.
Latios
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Possible sets:
       Latios 964   0.27452  Choice Specs    Timid  Draco Meteor       Thunder       Psychic   Energy Ball      178
       Latios 944  0.259481    White Herb    Timid  Draco Meteor   Thunderbolt       Psychic       Protect      178
       Latios 984  0.252289      Life Orb  Adamant  Draco Meteor    Earthquake  Dragon Dance       Outrage      162
       Latios 924   0.21371  Chesto Berry     Bold     Calm Mind  Luster Purge  Dragon Pulse          Rest      130
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Which one was it? Enter a number.
964
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
        MOLTRES    0.111949
       ARTICUNO    0.110361
         ZAPDOS    0.109964
       LANDORUS    0.109964
        HEATRAN     0.10917
         RAIKOU    0.108773
      TERRAKION    0.108773
       REGIROCK    0.106788
       VIRIZION    0.106788
      THUNDURUS    0.106391
          ENTEI    0.105597
       COBALION    0.105597
      REGIGIGAS      0.1052
       TORNADUS    0.104407
      CRESSELIA    0.103216
         REGICE    0.102819
      REGISTEEL    0.102422
        SUICUNE    0.101628
         LATIAS    0.080191
         LATIOS         0.0
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
There is 0.0524 chance of finding Alarm1: ['Fake Out', 'Quick Attack', 'Mach Punch', 'Bullet Punch', 'Aqua Jet', 'Ice Shard', 'Shadow Sneak', 'Sucker Punch', 'ExtremeSpeed']
There is 0.1096 chance of finding Alarm2: ['Rain Dance', 'Hail', 'Trick Room']
There is 0.0258 chance of finding Alarm3: ['Counter', 'Mirror Coat']
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Please enter another Pokemon you have seen.
Terrakion
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Possible sets:
    Terrakion 919  0.259124   Expert Belt    Jolly  Close Combat    Earthquake    Stone Edge    Aerial Ace      176
    Terrakion 979  0.255474   King's Rock    Jolly      Bulldoze    Rock Slide    Earthquake  Sacred Sword      176
    Terrakion 939  0.248175  Choice Scarf  Adamant  Sacred Sword    Earthquake    Stone Edge    Aerial Ace      240
    Terrakion 959  0.237226  Sitrus Berry    Jolly  Swords Dance  Sacred Sword    Earthquake    Rock Slide      176
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Which one was it? Enter a number.
959
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       ARTICUNO    0.061538
         ZAPDOS    0.061538
        MOLTRES    0.061538
         RAIKOU    0.061538
          ENTEI    0.061538
      REGISTEEL    0.061538
       TORNADUS    0.061538
        HEATRAN    0.061538
      CRESSELIA    0.061538
       LANDORUS    0.061538
      REGIGIGAS    0.061538
        SUICUNE    0.046154
       REGIROCK    0.046154
         REGICE    0.046154
       COBALION    0.046154
       VIRIZION    0.046154
      THUNDURUS    0.046154
         LATIAS    0.046154
      TERRAKION         0.0
         LATIOS         0.0
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
There is 0.0154 chance of finding Alarm1: ['Fake Out', 'Quick Attack', 'Mach Punch', 'Bullet Punch', 'Aqua Jet', 'Ice Shard', 'Shadow Sneak', 'Sucker Punch', 'ExtremeSpeed']
There is 0.0615 chance of finding Alarm2: ['Rain Dance', 'Hail', 'Trick Room']
There is 0.0 chance of finding Alarm3: ['Counter', 'Mirror Coat']
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Please enter the last Pokemon.
Tornadus
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Possible sets:
!!!  Tornadus 981      0.25     Damp Rock    Timid     Hurricane   Focus Blast         Taunt    Rain Dance      179
     Tornadus 921      0.25      Life Orb    Timid     Hurricane    Grass Knot   Focus Blast    Dark Pulse      179
     Tornadus 941      0.25     Leftovers   Modest    Substitute   Double Team   Focus Blast     Hurricane      131
     Tornadus 961      0.25  Chesto Berry     Bold          Rest     Air Slash    Dark Pulse   Focus Blast      131

 

[Eisenherz]

Reporting an ongoing streak of 1001 wins in Super Doubles!

The Subway revival in recent months hasn't gone unnoticed, particularly the large number of cool and novel teams Coeur7 has been finding success with. I had never given the Subway too much thought, and I can't really explain why; I did enjoy gen 5, but only got into facilities during gen 6 and it kinda just fell through the cracks in my mind. But my curiosity was sparked back in January when Coeur said, on Discord, "i wonder if the eisenherz team could be reduplicated in subway though (tw follow me togekiss / sd scizor / subtect leftovers heatran / specs latios) - i'd leave it to eisenherz to try"... well now, that's too inviting to ignore, isn't it!? That team is one I used in gen 4 Tower, and admittedly, this got me equally curious (ok, probably more) about its potential in gen 5. And thus began a series of attempts...

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T E A M B U I L D I N G
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I started with literally the exact team I ran in gen 4, not because I thought it would be fine as-is, but because I wanted to get a grasp of the new challenges it would face in Subway, and whether it was even viable. I transferred up the team and went in blindly (Super Subway was not even unlocked yet, so this was an annoyingly long process lol). It went way better than I anticipated, and I ended up losing at 128 - don't remember to what - but I was very satisfied with the run. It not only gave me reason to believe there may be a future for this team in Subway, but it also clearly highlighted some of its shortcomings.

V1

The most glaring issue was a particular Pokémon:

Every time it showed up, it was a struggle to maneuver around, and the looming threat of it sweeping me under sand was terrifying, I remember barely scraping by twice against it, with Heatran only winning because I got lucky enough it didn't roll Sand Rush. I also noticed how common trainers with teams built around Sand were to face. In gen 4, similar teams tended to not give much trouble to Scizor + Latios, but they had gotten an upgrade in gen 5.

The second issue was Excadrill-adjacent: Steel types. Klingklang, Bisharp, Escavalier.... Cobalion! Most are things Heatean obviously matches up well against (well, maybe not so much Cobalion), but as leads they were really bad. My leads had no immediate damage and I was sometimes pinned with no chance to easily switch.

Third was a returning issue from Gen 4, and the situation on that front had simply not improved at all: Electrics. No switch-ins (Latios isn't one, because it would end up paralyzed on the switch, which ruins Latios... plus Electrics carry Shadow Ball often enough). Since it was obvious I was gonna make changes to the team, I was hoping I could fix this as well, and stop living in fear of Raikou, Jolteon and co.

Given the team had still performed decently and its general idea seemed solid, I wanted to make small changes to fix the issues rather than go back to the drawing board.
My first thought was that Flamethrower or Aura Sphere on Togekiss could help a lot with the Steels the frontline dislike, Aura Sphere being particularly appealing for hitting Rocks as well. But I realized it couldn't be solved this easily when I considered what move should be replaced...

- Tri Attack? That's the main reliable STAB, the one it spams most, and I use it all the time in tandem with Scizor to remove something instantly. Never mind the favourable hax it obtains, removing Tri Attack meant removing Togekiss' offensive contribution on all neutral matchups (relying on Air Slash for that is not an option unless I want to gamble constantly (I don't)). This would have been a case of resolving a small issue by causing a big one.
- Air Slash? In truth, I was already not a fan of Air Slash, because it can miss... But in gen 4, I needed Air Slash, because Fighting types were a huge issue to the team. And they still are... Air Slash is my only immediate answer until Latios gets a free switch. Infernape, Medicham, Blaziken, and now Emboar require immediate intervention. As annoying as Steel types had been, Fightings were way more threatening to the team in general, and that's because the team functions around Scizor switching into Heatran on Fire moves. If there's a Fighting type in there, or 2, Heatran has an equally bad time as Scizor did.
- Follow Me? That's the reason for using Togekiss at all. If I'm going to use Togekiss without Follow Me, I may as well use another Flying type that offers better speed upfront.
- Tailwind? It crossed my mind, but again, I figured that if I was going to simply not have Tailwind, then another Pokémon could surely take Togekiss' place and do a better job at it, something with better speed upfront.

In practice - and it's something I had noticed in gen 4 as well - Togekiss' 2 support moves were helpful, but not clicked super often. I found myself enjoying Togekiss' offensive prowess more than its support.
So how would things go if I replaced Togekiss with a powerhouse that supports Scizor mostly through offense instead? That's the first thing I decided to try...

V2

I first considered regular Thundurus since it's simply one of the best Pokémon gen 5 has to offer. But then I saw the opportunity to finally fix my Electric weakness issue with Thundurus-T, not to mention the appealing additional SpA. The speed was going to be a big upgrade on Togekiss regardless. I went for Electric Gem (I was very excited to finally use gems!) with Thunderbolt / HP Flying / Grass Knot / Protect. Hidden Power is particularly appealing pre-XY thanks to 70 BP, and coming from Thundurus-T, it was going to fill the role of a more reliable Togekiss Air Slash without issue. Gem Tbolt is a nuke and has no issue dealing with Steels. And with Grass Knot giving me an answer to Rhyperior on the frontline, which has been a pain in the past, all my problems should be solved.

Well... except for Excadrill. Excadrill would still be annoying, and I wasn't sure what to do about it except count on Scizor, which has a pretty even matchup against it...
Ok, no, that's pretty lousy. Heatran is great unless it's Sand Rush, or unless Heatran misses into Bright Powder (it can however buy turns with Sub).
As insurance, I got myself a HP Fighting Latios, which I figured would come clutch into against more things than Fire or Ground (how I wish it had Aura Sphere back then).

This iteration seemed really promising, and got a 167 streak on its first attempt, still without lookup or calcs (I miss being able to casually play in bed ;_;). While I wanted to keep further changes minimal and go for a proper run, alternative ideas came to mind, and I just had to test some more...
One such idea is one I already had back in Gen 4 and had scratched after testing; if I want a fast, heavy damage dealer upfront that can deal with Fighting-types but also set Tailwind... is the answer not right there, in my backline?

V3

As a heavy damage dealer, surely Thundurus-T would have no issue playing Latios' role in the backline instead, and having Latios upfront would give me Tailwind again, which I did miss in front of things like Salamence or Volcarona. I replaced Latios' Specs with a Dragon Gem, so I could get a Specs-equivalent hit without the drawback of the lock (having to lock in Latios also generally felt much worse in Gen 5 than it did in 4 somehow). I also loved the idea of finally having an actual Electric switch-in.

On paper, it all made so much sense to me. Much like it did when I had tried Latios at the front back in Gen 4. And likewise, I really didn't like that lead combo in practice. I'm not sure why, Latios and Scizor should perfectly complement each other, Scizor deals with most of what Latios hates. It felt like I was not getting much value from Latios outside the Gem hit and the occasional Tailwind. Latios really wants coverage, and something to boost damage, but it also wants to set Tailwind, and most importantly be able to Protect because otherwise it gets very few turns on the field, unable to even put its frailty to good use as a bait. Limiting it to an offensive role in the back just worked better.

I don't think I got to battle 50 before deciding this iteration of the team had no future and that I'd rather go back to V2 than finish this run.
But these battles are when I realized what an issue the Ice Workers were for this team. Sure, Lum Scizor is an excellent answer most of the time. But the issue was with the other slot. Heatran wants to come in, but Heatran doesn't want to get Blizzarded on the switch this often, because freezes happen. Most importantly, these Workers use Waters too, which incidentally means sometimes, Scizor can't just do it all alone. So how about a Tailwind setter that shuts down these teams entirely...?

V4

I really liked that idea, because it allowed me to truly put Thundurus' Volt Absorb to good use as a switch-in for Suicune. Moreover, Scizor can swiftly delete Grasses Suicune hates. The downside was obviously losing out on some offensive pressure upfront, so to at least partly make up for it, I opted for a very offensive Suicune, nearly max SpA.

I didn't like that team. Good synergy on paper, but as for Scizor's previous partners, I found myself needing to just attack with Suicune most of the time, and compared to the previous 2 frontliners, Suicune didn't cut it. The damage was insufficient, which reduced Scizor's lifespan. Suicune didn't care so much since it's so bulky, but rather than protecting Scizor like the previous partners, that just meant more attacks went Scizor's way, which really worked against the team overall.

At that point, V2 was still the best version of the team thus far, and I thought I should simply go back to frontline Thundurus-T. However, this time, rather than have Latios in the back, which is too frail to reliably switch-in, how about keeping Suicune there? Backline Tailwind is great to plan for endgames, and most importantly, there's no better Blizzard/Ice Beam switch-in than a bulky Water with Scald. The typing synergy would undeniably be much better than with Latios.

V5

This testing session went way better. For the first time in a while, it felt like the team went in the right direction. I don't remember what number this lost at, pretty sure it was before 100, but I was playing recklessly just trying to find a team that felt solid and gave me chances to make the right plays to rescue things in tougher matchups. I decided I was gonna figure out final movesets and EVs soon and make a proper run with this.

Until a thought I couldn't shake came to mind...
I had been watching a VGC Reg F regional event, and Landorus-I was on a lot of teams. Nothing new, but seeing it in action really got me thinking about how well it might do on my team. The thought had passed before when browsing for options, but I figured it would make Blizzard/Ice Beam too big of an issue... at least Togekiss/Thundurus/Latios can live one, not Lando. But now that I have Suicune... surely that's not a concern anymore? All 3 partners resist Ice, and 2 of them have no issue KOing them.

I didn't like how much this idea stuck with me because I finally had a team I was happy with and wanted to properly run. But I couldn't stop thinking how perfect it would be. Finally I may stop living in fear of Electrics! Thundurus may check them well defensively, but it's not a good offensive answer. I could even KO Excadrill immediately! It seemed like it would actually solve all of my issues. I had to at least give it a shot...

V6

The biggest concern I had with having Landorus was losing a good Flying STAB to quickly KO Fightings. At least Earth Power easily dealt with the Fire starters, but stuff like Poliwrath, Heracross, Conkeldurr, concerned me. I settled for Psychic as coverage rather than the conventional Sludge Bomb for that reason; as neutral coverage, it does exactly the same thing. Sludge Bomb makes more sense usually because of Grass resisting Earth Power, but with Scizor (and Heatran in the back), Grass is really not a concern here. Moreover, Psychic lets me hit opposing Landorus, which otherwise pretty much wall me and apply a lot of offensive pressure. Lando walling Lando is a common occurence in PvP; in Gen 8 DOU Landorus often ran Psychic precisely to deal with the mirror.

In the third slot, I knew I wanted Sub, because I'm generally a huge fan of that set, and figured it would perform all the better in Subway to avoid stuff like the ever-annoying Swagger/Flatter from Mandibuzz, and various other forms of hax. Most importantly, it allows to buy free turn between Protects, which is extra valuable on something with a 4x weakness that will get reliably targeted. This should grant free SDs for Scizor at times, and just a safe wincon at others. It also made dealing with Trick Room a joke.

And at that moment, I thought, wait a second, Heatran has Sub, Lando has Sub... but Suicune doesn't?! Yet Suicune is probably the best Sub candidate on the team! I've seen sub-locking endgames with Heatran this entire time, but now I have an icon of sub-stalling that does it so much more efficiently with Pressure, I would be stupid not to utilize that!
Don't get me wrong, the main idea isn't to stall out things with Sub, that's generally unviable in doubles until you make the endgame come down to it, but Sub accomplishes way more, it buys turns, allows for way more baiting, and just allows for safer planning.
Deciding that both Ice Beam and Tailwind were too important to drop for Sub, I made a compromise and compressed both into one: Icy Wind.

Items became a bit of an awkward issue. Clearly, Suicune was now the prime contender for Leftovers over Heatran - I had been using Sitrus Suicune prior. Sub Heatran without Lefties didn't sound as good, but Sitrus Sub Suicune also sounded really subpar. I gave Suicune the Lefties and decided if Heatran was gonna have anything else, it should be Wide Lens to enable Heat Wave, my 2nd favourite Heatran set in facilities.

And so equipped with triple Sub, I started testing once more. This ended up creating some fun battle boards.

Very quickly, I knew it was close to what I wanted. I loved having Heat Wave, spread moves are one of the most potent weapons in doubles... but as I kinda saw coming, this changed Heatran's dynamic in the team entirely, not because of Heat Wave, but because it didn't have anymore recovery, and couldn't play the defensive role it used to as efficiently, in exchange for a stronger offensive presence. I find it hard to pin the exact reasons why, but Heatran as this offensive piece now felt like a weak link for the first time ever, while it used to be a pillar of stability in the back. That felt really weird. Meanwhile, probably because of the typing distribution in the team, Suicune was actually struggling to live up to that role; I wasn't able to get subs as freely as I did with Heatran, and I was forced to prioritize Icy Winding a lot of the time.

That run died around 180 to Raikou Thunder critting Scizor (Balloon Raikou, so Protect + Earth Power turn 1 was not an option, but I should have Bullet Punched immediately in case of crit), after which I probably kept misplaying (I don't remember exactly what happened - there was a Porygon-Z in the mix). But this was my friendly reminder that simply having Lando didn't mean the team didn't care about Electrics anymore, especially with Suicune over Latios.
That run also made me realize Gyarados was a scary encounter, because it was likely to get several occasions to setup. Suicune walls it to a certain degree, but with Gen 5's 2x crits, that's not safe when Suicune can barely damage Gyarados.

Regardless, I had enough faith in this team that I wanted to do a proper run where I use the lookup, calc as much as necessary and try not to misplay to see how far it could go. I thought it surely had 300-potential.

I started a new run, determined to play well, but shortly after beating Emmet, an idea came to mind that may resolve all my new issues, and give Heatran its beloved Leftovers back... I decided to try it out, ready to go back to the previous version if I didn't work out. The change traded some of Suicune's bulk for a better typing, and a stronger offensive matchups.

And with that change, the final team was completed...

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T E A M
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Timid | Sheer Force
IVs: 31/0/30/31/31/31
EVs: 4 HP / 4 Def / 244 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Earth Power / Psychic / Sludge Wave / Protect

Landorus

I didn't expect to end up with an all-out offensive powerhouse that offers no Tailwind and no support for Scizor on the frontline when I started teambuilding, but here we are. Typing-wise, it synergizes with Scizor better than Togekiss, with Earth Power offering the option for quick removal of Fire types. Obviously, Heatran has a free switch into those, but going Heatran is not always safe or desirable depending on the field, so having many options with the freedom to pick depending on circumstances is so much nicer. Often, KOing the Houndoom (for example) and getting a free SD with Scizor is way more valuable than getting the Flash Fire boost. I guess this is caused partly by the loss of Tailwind; Heatran doesn't have the speed tier to be out there trying to sweep on turn 2. Meanwhile, with Bullet Punch in its arsenal, Scizor is the perfect contender to do just that, and early SDs are incredibly valuable.

In addition to handling pesky Fire types, Landorus solved much of the issues the team had with both Electric and Steel.

The 4x weakness to Ice turned out to be an asset, drawing attacks very predictably while Scizor has a great matchup upfront against both Ice and the Waters with Ice coverage. Meanwhile, the backline provides 2 very different options as switch-ins for Ice, a luxury that offers some flexibility on risking a freeze. Freeze management is crucial: when switching into a Blizzard, I have to assume I'll get frozen, because it will happen eventually, and if I lose to that while using a Pokémon 4x weak to Ice... that's a teambuilding flaw.

In terms of move selection, Earth Power is the obvious STAB that gets spammed, and my pick of Psychic is explained in the teambuilding part (V6), but comes down to Fighting being an annoyance to the team.

Meanwhile, Sludge Wave is a late addition; I used Substitute in that slot for at least the first 200 battles. I don't remember exactly when the change was made, but I meant it as a short-lived experiment of like 14 battles. I enjoyed and used Substitute a lot, and I rarely felt like the coverage was inadequate. But as previously mentioned, spread moves have a very special value in doubles, where even if they're not particularly strong or get OHKOs, the simple fact you can damage a slot for some damage while KOing another is incredibly valuable, and comes into play all the time in ways that rarely get theorymonned. I usually really dislike full spread moves though, as hitting the partner is a major drawback that is often under-acknowledged; Sludge Wave is also particularly weak as a full spread move. But Sheer Force-boosted Sludge Wave partner with not one, but 2 Steel types? Well... there can probably be no better circumstance for this move to actually be good.

It so happened that the period of testing coincided with my first encounter with Hydreigon-3. The fact Hydreigon walled Landorus had not been an issue with the other sets, which the rest of the team handled nicely, and Lando could just focus on handling the partner or be safe behind a sub. But that set has Flamethrower and Earth Power, a combo that greatly limits my options. Depending on its partner, this can be catastrophic. Well, not with Sludge Wave, which does good damage to Hydreigon and allows me to use the partner as bait effectively. After that encounter, I decided Sludge Wave was a keeper, and while I missed Sub at times, having a spread move has been super nice to just distribute damage and put things in range of a partner, or score a double KO while Scizor SDs.

EVs

I had the straightforward 4 HP and 252/252 in SpA/Spe until some battle in the 600s where I lived a (gem-boosted) Espeon Psychic on 3 HP. That Espeon set is a super common encounter, but the roll had always been lower previously, so I decided to run a calc out of curiosity, and discovered the following:

252 SpA Psychic Gem Espeon Psychic vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Landorus: 139-165 (84.2 - 100%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO

After determining no calc of value was lost by going 244 SpA instead, I promptly made the change to this spread, which allows always living Espeon's Psychic (barring a crit, of course). It's an especially big deal because of the Eeveelution trainers, Espeon can be paired with Jolteon/Flareon, and I really want Lando to live the Psychic in those occasions. Now we have:

Defensive calcs:
252 SpA Psychic Gem Espeon Psychic vs. 4 HP / 4 SpD Landorus: 138-163 (83.6 - 98.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
168+ SpA Charizard Heat Wave (spread) vs. 4 HP / 4 SpD Landorus: 69-82 (41.8 - 49.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO (in practice, this keeps critting or burning... or both lol)
0- SpA Life Orb Latios Draco Meteor vs. 4 HP / 4 SpD Landorus: 138-164 (83.6 - 99.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (I know 0- SpA is crazy, but that's Latios-4)
0 SpA Blissey Ice Beam vs. 4 HP / 4 SpD Landorus: 136-164 (82.4 - 99.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (in case I feel like risking a freeze lol)

Offensive calcs:
244 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Psychic vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Zapdos: 87-103 (52.7 - 62.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
244 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Sludge Wave (spread) vs. 124 HP / 0 SpD Lilligant: 161-190 (100 - 118%) -- guaranteed OHKO (screw Teeter Dance!!!!!!!!)
244 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Earth Power vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Haxorus: 157-187 (104 - 123.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO

@

Adamant | Technician
IVs: 31/31/31/13/31/31
EVs: 92 HP / 236 Atk / 12 Def / 4 SpD / 164 Spe
Bullet Punch / Bug Bite / Swords Dance / Protect

Scizor

As a returning member, I don't have too much to say about Scizor. It's still the all-star on the offensive front. I don't know if it's recency bias, but it feels even better in Subway than in did in gen 4 Tower. Bullet Punch's value is incredible, especially when boosted by Swords Dance, and I believe that's the main reason this team is able to get away with no upfront speed control.

In gen 4, I remember saying Bug Bite was clicked even more than BP, but I think the balance tilts slightly the other way in Subway. Regardless, setting up SD whenever the possibility arises almost always pays off, and I tend to use it in the majority of battles.
One of its most impactful uses is the fact it counteracts Intimidate, from Salamence and Gyarados in particular. Scizor can setup fairly safely in front of them, and turn a passive state into a commanding one without switching. Being forced to switch to reset Intimidate can be an awful situation be stuck in, giving free turns to the AI. The switch may also not be safe, forcing Scizor to stay in and do too little damage (-1 is very impactful for Scizor).

Item-wise, Lum is simply goated. I have 4 separate entries in my battle notes stating Lum is the best thing ever. I would approximate it activated in a meaningful way in at least a third (!) of the battles...

• Landorus draws in Blizzard, and Scizor's job is to handle these users, so it gets frozen quite often. That alone makes it worth.
• Will-O-Wisp users are common, particularly Spiritomb, which always targets Scizor with it. A burn is so impactful for Scizor, having to play around that every time would be a large annoyance. Instead, Scizor can SD freely in front of it, and KO with +2 Bug Bite.
• Mandibuzz is another common foe, and it never fails to spread Swagger or Flatter on random slots. Playing confusion roulette is a surefire way to eventually lose out. Huge bonus is when Swagger goes into Scizor for a free boost.
• I can attack into Static or Flame Body without a care.
• Nothing worse than getting forced out by Yawn after getting a SD.
• Thunder Wave is horrible, and if it's upfront, we all know which slot it's going into since the other is immune. Para is one of my biggest fears, since a paralyzed Pokémon might as well be dead (except if it was dead, it would at least not be a passive asset on the field potentially pinned there, unable to ever move, giving free turns to the AI... I'd often rather see it get KOd).
• The biggest downside of Lum is that there's only one...

EVs

This is the same spread I used in gen 4, but I did take time to reconsider it before heading into this run.

The speed is to outspeed Suicune-123. It's pretty obvious, but the fact I have Lando and Heatran means getting to KO Suicune before it gets to move on any given turn is a big deal (it can damage Scizor pretty significantly too). Outspeeding all Cresselia by 1 point is a nice bonus, though Cress is rarely a threat for the team.

Relevant offensive calcs:
236+ Atk Technician Scizor Bug Bite vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Slowking: 204-240 (101 - 118.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 236+ Atk Technician Scizor Bug Bite vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Feraligatr: 168-198 (105 - 123.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 236+ Atk Technician Scizor Bug Bite vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Spiritomb: 157-186 (100 - 118.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
236+ Atk Technician Scizor Bullet Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Aerodactyl: 158-188 (101.9 - 121.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Relevant defensive calcs:
252 Atk Pinsir Close Combat vs. 92 HP / 12 Def Scizor: 66-78 (42 - 49.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO (common among Roughnecks, almost always locks into CC)
252+ Atk Garchomp Fire Fang vs. 92 HP / 12 Def Scizor: 160-192 (101.9 - 122.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO (ensures Scarf Garchomp locks into Fire Fang reliably, gives Heatran a field day)
252+ Atk Cobalion Sacred Sword vs. 92 HP / 12 Def Scizor: 66-78 (42 - 49.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252+ Atk Landorus Earthquake (spread) vs. 92 HP / 12 Def Scizor: 67-79 (42.7 - 50.3%) -- 1.2% chance to 2HKO
168+ Atk Excadrill Earthquake (spread) vs. 92 HP / 12 Def Scizor: 67-79 (42.7 - 50.3%) -- 1.2% chance to 2HKO
252 SpA Gengar Thunderbolt vs. 92 HP / 4 SpD Scizor: 65-77 (41.4 - 49%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252+ SpA Tornadus Hurricane vs. 92 HP / 4 SpD Scizor: 130-154 (82.8 - 98.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

@

Modest | Levitate
IVs: 31/10/30/30/31/31
EVs: 244 HP / 120 SpA / 4 SpD / 140 Spe
Thunderbolt / HP Water / Thunder Wave / Protect

Rotom-W

I was a bit nervous when I replaced Suicune with Rotom. The synergy is undeniably better... Levitate makes it an ideal Heatran partner, and having a second Flying resist is also not insignificant (my options felt thin in front of Tornadus or Braviary, which have Fighting coverage). But the most important part here is the offensive synergy: now it wouldn't just switch into Waters, it would be able to dispose of them in minimal turns. Scizor was my best offensive Water answer previously, and while it does a decent job against most of them, trainers like Fishermen and Parasol Ladies could overwhelm it.

But all of this came at a cost: the bulk is undeniably worse, especially if I want Rotom to contribute offensively. And most importantly, no Scald as a freeze insurance policy; this is what made me most nervous by far. In my short time with Suicune, I already had to thaw a couple times. Would the Lum be a sufficient answer to freezes with a Blizzard magnet upfront?

I guess the answer is that it has been so far...? Though I wouldn't be surprised if this was the cause of a loss in the future. The saving grace is that Rotom isn't the exclusive Ice switch-in, Heatran can easily do it too. So depending on what trainer I'm facing, I can decide what I'd rather risk. In front on a Fisherman with double Ice Beam lead, I'd always switch Heatran into the Landorus slot, because Heatran is very unlikely to help out much in that battle, while Rotom will be scoring KOs, and risking it would be stupid. The reverse applies against Ice Workers, where Heatran is really good. All in all, losing Scald has been ok, though things would obviously be better if Rotom had access to it.

The moveset is straightforward, Thunderbolt is the primary STAB, particularly good in Subway because it still has 95 BP. HP Water is a no-brainer over Hydro Pump for any serious attempt at a long streak, especially in a gen where HP is a respectable 70 BP.

Thunder Wave was a pleasant surprise for me. I strongly considered using Electroweb instead since I enjoyed Suicune's Icy Wind a lot, the spread chip was often significant. But old TWave is just insanely good. The ¼ speed cut makes things like Dragon Dance or Quiver Dance soooo much less threatening, and 100% accuracy to boot for complete peace of mind. It really helped stabilize things and allowed me to properly plan things out in front of tougher matchups (TWave was the hero in a lot of the close battles). But the best part... it can still paralyze Electric types?! I thought that had been fixed (I know it's not a bug, but you know...) by gen 5. Being able to TWave Raikou is a game-changer (yes, despite everything, Raikou was still an issue, in large part because of those stupid Air Balloons). On the flip side, I did not enjoy seeing Rotom itself get paralyzed at times...

Protect is probably a no-brainer on this type of team, but it was particularly important with a Sludge Waving Lando, and more generally to allow Rotom to survive while Scizor or Heatran takes out a Grass type... or really just to buy a free turn by baiting.

The switch from Suicune to Rotom ended up being just what the team needed. My fear of losing out on bulk was unwarranted, as the Sitrus provides just enough to allow Rotom to survive 1 extra hit, which usually converts into a TWave + a free turn being a reliable bait at low HP, all the while having a better offensive presence. An excellent bargain!

EVs

Since I didn't really have a baseline to work from, I adjusted Rotom's EVs many times throughout the streak, the last of which was somewhere in the 400s.

At one point, I EVd to OHKO Infernape-3, which I used to consider a big threat, and that requires 252 SpA. But then I realized how busted TWave is. Why would I need to OHKO with HP Water when I can just TWave it, after which it's not that much of a threat anymore (Heatran's EP even has an 87% OHKO)? Also, Infernape-4 (Sash) is just as common.

Initially, I had gone 116 to outspeed Zapdos-2 (would rather not be Tbolting it after its Roosts), but then speed tying Blaziken felt stupid considering how big of a threat it can be... Ultimately, I ended up with 140 for Gyarados-1 after a battle made me realize it was a threat I would much rather remove right after baiting the Ice Fang with Lando. It shows up on Water rosters where Rotom already has its hands full, and Scizor likely got crippled by Intimidate. I went the one extra point to outspeed Wailord-2, because full HP Water Spout hurts (Quick Claw could activate... but most of the time it won't, so for the extra 1 point cost, it seems worth). And as luck would have it, the offensive calcs I wanted left me with an 8 EVs I didn't absolutely need in SpA :P
Ludicolo-4 is also a nice bonus to outspeed, since it's the only Ludi set that outspeeds Scizor. Fun fact, Grass Knot does less to Rotom than Hydro Pump lol.

244 HP is for the better Sitrus activation number.

Offensive calcs:
120+ SpA Rotom-Wash Thunderbolt vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Feraligatr: 162-192 (101.3 - 120%) -- guaranteed OHKO
120+ SpA Rotom-Wash Thunderbolt vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Gyarados: 204-240 (101 - 118.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
120+ SpA Rotom-Wash Thunderbolt vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Charizard: 158-188 (103.3 - 122.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
120+ SpA Rotom-Wash Thunderbolt vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Glaceon: 72-85 (51.4 - 60.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
120+ SpA Rotom-Wash Thunderbolt vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Salamence: 84-99 (49.4 - 58.2%) -- 96.9% chance to 2HKO

Defensive calcs:
252+ SpA Yanmega Giga Drain vs. 244 HP / 4 SpD Rotom-Wash: 82-98 (52.6 - 62.8%); recovers 41-49 (25.5 - 30.4%) -- 0.4% chance to 2HKO after Sitrus Berry recovery
252 Atk Infernape Close Combat vs. 244 HP / 0 Def Rotom-Wash: 84-99 (53.8 - 63.5%) -- 2.7% chance to 2HKO after Sitrus Berry recovery
252 SpA Raikou Thunderbolt vs. 244 HP / 4 SpD Rotom-Wash: 70-84 (44.9 - 53.8%) -- 6.3% chance to 2HKO
252 Atk Life Orb Tauros Giga Impact vs. 244 HP / 0 Def Rotom-Wash: 133-156 (85.3 - 100%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO

There's a bunch of cool guaranteed survivals but I'm not listing them because I don't think I've ever seen them come into play.

@

Modest | Flash Fire
IVs: 31/2/31/31/31/31
EVs: 4 HP / 4 Def / 236 SpA / 12 SpD / 252 Spe
Flamethrower / Earth Power / Substitute / Protect

Heatran

Good ol' reliable Heatran. Much like on my gen 4 Tower team, it plays a dual role: on one hand, it's a strong offensive piece and gets to score KOs left and right whenever it gets a Flash Fire boost. On the other hand, its defensive typing alone lets it switch into and wall a lot (Ghost and Dark resistance in gen 5 is kinda crazy), it gets free Subs, and closes out games while munching on Lefties. Most crucially, it singlehandedly shuts down many hax machines such as Walrein-4 and Blissey-4. Having peace of mind and being able to ignore those sets is huge and I'm confident the team couldn't get this far without it (pretty sure I had more than 10 endgames of pure PP stalling behind a sub... Latias-1 was a recurring culprit).

If I had any doubts about how this Heatran really is the foundation of the team, the experiment I did where I gave its defensive role to Suicune (along with its Lefties) and instead focused on its offensive prowess with Wide Lens Heat Wave, showed me just how beneficial filling both roles at once had been. It still did its offensive duties really well, arguably even better with a spread move, but it suddenly seemed like a semi-frail piece, a bit like Landorus, prone to folding to an unlucky turn of getting crit by a resisted move for example. This made me really appreciate how much value I'm getting out of it with SubLefties, and I don't know if Heatran would be worth running at all on a balanced/bulky offensive team with a different set. The 99% Heat Wave also made me a bit nervous... why add a potential failing point if I can avoid it?

Admittedly, Heatran seemed pressured more often compared to gen 4 Tower, and couldn't find as many free turns to sub. Because of that, having Rotom as partner really helped take some weight off its shoulders, and TWave support in particular was super good (you can fish for so many free subs on a paralyzed Pokémon, though I was careful to not TWave something I was actively planning to PP stall, because that would be shooting myself in the foot...).

EVs

Unlike Scizor, I did not spend much time re-analyzing the spread specifically for Subway.

I did check speed tiers and immediately knew that needed to stay unchanged upon seeing it outspeed Cobalion-1, Virizon-4 and Emboar-4 by 1 point. Outspeeding as many things as possible is generally the idea anyway with Sub. There are times I wondered if maybe Timid would be worth, maybe Modest is a bit greedy? I haven't really looked into it, because it's been working good, and honestly RNGing a new Heatran just for that sounds like a pain.

Here are few calcs that came into play during the streak.

Offensive calcs:
236+ SpA Flash Fire Heatran Flamethrower vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Electivire: 153-180 (102 - 120%) -- guaranteed OHKO
236+ SpA Heatran Flamethrower vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Vanilluxe: 186-218 (104.5 - 122.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
236+ SpA Heatran Flamethrower vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Occa Berry Abomasnow: 204-240 (103.6 - 121.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
236+ SpA Heatran Earth Power vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Infernape: 148-176 (98 - 116.6%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO (I have yet to not get this roll, though I never bank on it)
236+ SpA Heatran Earth Power vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Raichu: 136-160 (100.7 - 118.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
236+ SpA Flash Fire Heatran Flamethrower vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Zapdos: 112-133 (56.9 - 67.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (this is demon Zapdos-2)

Defensive calcs:
252 Atk Electivire Earthquake (spread) vs. 4 HP / 4 Def Heatran: 156-184 (93.4 - 110.2%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO (this may not seem great, but it's really nice because it means it always prefers Ice Punching Landorus for a guaranteed OHKO)
252+ SpA Tornadus Focus Blast vs. 4 HP / 12 SpD Heatran: 138-164 (82.6 - 98.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
124+ Atk Feraligatr Earthquake (spread) vs. 4 HP / 4 Def Heatran: 136-164 (81.4 - 98.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Wailord Water Spout (150 BP) (spread) vs. 4 HP / 12 SpD Heatran: 140-168 (83.8 - 100.6%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Gyarados Waterfall vs. 4 HP / 4 Def Heatran: 138-164 (82.6 - 98.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

–––––––––
N O T E S
–––––––––

Though I was quietly hopeful about the team's potential, I really didn't think it would actually manage 1000. My highest hopes were somewhere in the 500 ballpark, especially since the original gen 4 streak didn't even make it to 1k. I only started taking notes around battle 300 since I didn't really expect I'd end up writing a report for it. But for the past few hundred battles, I took a ton of notes. I'll try to keep it short and sweet (not my forte)...!

Thoughts / yapping

• Generally, the team relies on baiting moves to provide the partner with a free turn, whether it be for a KO or a free SD/Sub, all of which are high value. The three 4x weaknesses, paired with the reliable gen 5 AI (compared to later gens) really work in its favor, making this more predictable. However, this is obviously a double-edge sword at times, where for example an Infernape + Feraligatr lead exerts a ton of pressure, since I can't remove one without trading (which I really don't wanna do turn 1). A lot of the streak has been learning the right pivots and patterns in order to handle these situations, and I found it's almost always achievable reliably without too many losses (though in dire circumstances, risking a freeze can be necessary...).
• One indicator I found that this team was better than my previous test teams was the battles resulting in a 4-0. As obvious as it is that 4-0'ing is desirable, I think building teams that do it the majority of the time is really difficult, at least the vast majority of my teams can't achieve that. The only other team I built where 4-0 was by far the most common outcome was ZapFini in the Battle Tree. In a way, the way this team plays reminds me of it a lot, despite it being pretty different on paper. I hadn't thought about the 4-0 thing back in Tree, but it really hit me this time, because my other teams often had 2-0's and 1-0's. A win is a win, but if a team wins by a slimmer margin often, as more offensive teams often do, it's only logical that bad things like a crit, or a miss, will be more impactful, and things will fall apart more easily even if the winrate is generally high. I remember saying flexibility / second chances are an important attribute of a successful (doubles) team on a long streak in my ZapFini report, and this is the first time I realize this attribute can perhaps be measured by 4-0 outcomes. Certainly not an accurate science, but it's something I'll pay attention to more in the future when testing.
• Despite the team's success, I had a lot more close calls early on than recently, and didn't think it had this much potential at first. I had several sessions of sitting down to review battles where I barely scraped by, and I found new patterns of play I hadn't considered, which was super useful in future battles. The number of close calls has significantly decreased over time, but there's certainly a large part of luck involved in getting this high.
• One thing I realized from early close calls is that since the team has bulk and offers many options, I should be trying to play as carefully as possible. For example, sometimes, my instinct is that trading Lando for a big threat upfront is worth. But I found that if I take a step back and explore many lines of play, I can often find a really safe, less obvious one that prevents the trade. This takes way more time and part of me wants to be lazy and say it'll be fine anyway, because it usually is. But I've been trying to force myself to slow down and make the extra effort as often as possible. I don't know why, but I often play facilities as if I was on a PvP timer between turns. I feel the pressure to think and click quickly. I find it really hard to fight that tendency, but I think it probably was a factor in getting to 1k, as I regularly found better lines of play I otherwise wouldn't have.

Subway AI

• Baits are very reliable when the AI has a guaranteed KO, definitely way more than in Tree, and maybe even more than Maison too? (unsure)
• The AI is happy to try to status a Substitute that was already there at the start of the turn, though it won't necessarily do it repeatedly.
• Swagger and Flatter are spammed to no end whenever possible, but interestingly, I've never seen the AI use Confuse Ray from sets that have it.
• If a partner will be hurt, even minimally, by a spread move (EQ or Surf), it pretty much never uses it. However, if the AI partner has an immunity (Levitate, Water Absorb...), it will borderline refuse to use anything other than the spread move, even if it's bad against my Pokémon. If it has no partner, it will surprisingly avoid using spread moves as if it had one... lol (I've had Vaporeon-1 repeatedly Helping Hand rather than Surf while alone on the field with my Heatran/Landorus in front).
• Similarly, I've never seen the AI be so shy of clicking Explosion in any other facility. I've seen maybe 3 Explosions during all 1001 battles.
• If the AI outspeeds, it will happily Encore into the void on turn 1. This could probably be annoying for Fake Out users lol.
• Trick has always been used on the first possible turn. Metagross-4 always gives its Toxic Orb to Lando, Alakazam-4 and Manectric-4's target seems pretty random. I'm always flabbergasted by Manectric turning down an Overheat into Scizor (I have never risked it before confirming it locked into Switcheroo though, who knows, one day...).

Threats

Pokémon threats:

• Electivire-4 is probably the biggest threat overall (it has a Shuca). If I have the luxury of being able to double it up without having to trade turn 1, then BP + Earth Power KOs, and the world is a happy place with beautiful flowers growing on Electivire's grave. But if I have to play around it, it has an OHKO on both Lando and Scizor, making it a pure 50/50, and it also has EQ for Heatran if I want to pivot. It outspeeds everything except Lando, and most annoyingly, I can't TWave because of Motor Drive. If it comes from the back and it has a threatening partner, it's a nightmare.
• Raikou is still is a threat. If taking a Thunder/Thunderbolt with Scizor is a reasonable option, I can always pop the balloon with BP for Lando to EP it. But this can be tricky depending on the partner... in bad situations, I may have to trade something for it before I know the full opponent backline (scary).
• Medicham-4 outspeeds and OHKOs the entire team barring Lando with HJK. Needs to be EP'd asap (thankfully a guaranteed OHKO), though in a pinch, I double-protect to make it crash, which puts it in range of BP. So far, it has always skipped Fake Out in order to HJK Scizor.
• Seismitoad-3, unlike all the other Water/Grounds, outspeeds everything except Lando. Muddy Water can be catastrophic because of accuracy drops, and playing defensively around it gives it chances to set rain, which it does very unpredictably. When possible, the best move is to BP + EP for a guaranteed KO immediately.
• Lucario and Gallade are both incredibly annoying because of Follow Me/Ally Switch. I usually target them with priority to ensure I can reliably plan my following turns.
• Hydreigon-3 has Earth Power AND Flamethrower. All I can do with my right slot is buy turns, unless I'm willing to let it Draco Rotom. In itself, not difficult to handle, but with any other threatening partner it's a nightmare to play around.
• Tauros-3 has outrageous damage output and outspeeds the whole team. May force a trade, or at least take 90% off something.

Trainer threats:

• Pilots. My frontline doesn't do great against Flying defensively, and a lot of them outspeed (and have Fighting coverage for Heatran). The Genies, particularly Tornadus, are super annoying. I often have to trade like 90% of HP on something for Staraptor. Lando's Sludge Wave usually shines against these, scoring double KOs or putting things in BP range.
• Maids with all starters. They have high odds of getting a combo of typings/moves that threaten both of my Pokémon at once and force difficult repositioning.
• Bikers (Philipo and Pedro) are probably the worst. They use a bunch of high BST/pseudolegends and have a high concentration of Pokémon that give me trouble and are likely to be on the field at the same time. The worst part? They run all 4 sets of each!!! Thunder Wave usually ends up being the saving grace against them (or if they have a useless Garchomp I can ignore).
• Full legends rosters (Colombo, Leron, Saty, Kavan...). There are a lot of combos that can threaten both of my slots at once among these, many of which include Balloon Raikou, so these are the battles where I'm most often forced to make convoluted plays.

––––––––––––
R E P L A Y S
––––––––––––

The fact BW only allows saving 1 replay at a time is really annoying and certainly hinders video collecting. I saved battles I found most noteworthy, and tried my best to remember to record them in between sets. It feels a bit bad to showcase the team in some of its worst moments, but easy battles are boring. Here were some of the most exciting battles:

Battle 297 vs. Breeder Manford

This lead is a good showcase of how threatening Electivire-4 can make things.

Battle 345 vs. Veteran Colombo

I really struggle to predict the AI properly in this one and Scizor gets caught by a surprise double-up + crit on the switch.

Battle 439 vs. Veteran Leron

An insane battle where I thought I had certainly lost. Heatran gets frozen and I spend most of the following turns trying to buy time to allow it to thaw, but it doesn't.
Initially, I want to target his Heatran with Rotom in order to free up Scizor, which could in turn free up Landorus. But once Rotom takes way too much damage immediately, I have to abort that plan.
Meanwhile, if Regice decided to go for more than one Focus Blast into Heatran, this most likely would have been an actual loss.
I think this could probably have been played better if I hadn't been so set on trying to make Heatran thaw. Switching back and forth between Heatran and Lando, whith a Lando Protect turn in between, could probably have stalled Regice out of Blizzard PP, though I don't know if Rotom could've remained around long enough to pull it off. A simple trade of Lando for Heatran would have been a decent idea if Heatran wasn't so Protect-happy. In any case, I was playing very fast, and this is a perfect example of the fact I should take a step back more often to take the time to find alternative lines of play.
I could not believe the streak was still alive afterward! (probably undeserved)

Battle 564 vs. Veteran Risha

A showcase of how problematic Latias can be if Scizor isn't around anymore. Heatran clutches up with a beautiful session of riveting PP stall.

Battle 616 vs. Veteran Hecate

Incredibly threatening team with a nightmare lead. I once again took a way too hasty decision, thinking this kind of lead warrants a trade to ensure removing Electivire, so I give up Scizor for it.
I think switching Scizor into Heatran + Protect, into a Lando switch into Rotom + Flamethrower to Electivire, into HP Water Electivire + Protect Heatran was the play. After that, if Volcarona has been QDing, I can TWave to keep it under control, though it admittedly would be getting scary.

In any case, the battle takes even more of a terrifying twist once Heatran, my only reliable Volcarona check, gets frozen.

Battle 626 vs. Veteran Leron

The 600s were very eventful. This one is just a solid battle against threatening opponents.

Battle 669 vs. Gentleman Kavan

Double Genie leads are never fun. Turn 1 goes very badly as I expect at least 1 hit into Scizor; a lazy assumption based on just a few previous instances. Realistically, it was probably a 50/50. The rest of the battle is me trying to recover from that turn 1 blunder.

This battle had me one Leaf Blade crit away from surely losing. I was acutely aware of it and sweating profusely as I saw the Lead Blade damage happen.

Battle 676 vs. Scientist Shan

Seriously, I just couldn't catch a break in the 600s! Electivire lead strikes fear once again. I was taken by surprise by the AI self-targeting Thunder Punch to activate Motor Drive, and it certainly threw a wrench into my plan.

Battle 934 vs. Veteran Donta

I saved this battle as a example of the fun of being granted the chance to SD multiple times upfront. Thanks to the safety net of the Lum, I can leave Scizor in on Volcarona safely.

+4 236+ Atk Technician Scizor Bullet Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Volcarona: 78-93 (40.6 - 48.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
244 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Earth Power vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Volcarona: 114-136 (59.4 - 70.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Battle 953 vs. Veteran Leron

Leron keeps delivering the threats. This battle shows the power (and importance) of scouting sets with Protect when it's useful. I used to do it less, sometimes out of laziness. It's worth!!

–––––––––––
T H A N K S
–––––––––––

A few shoutouts I wanted to make:

• Coeur7 for stirring my interest in Subway.
• SadisticMystic for the Subway lookup spreadsheet.
• SilverstarStream for doing the bulk of the work on eisencalc.com
• The entire Facilities community for being the best group of people to hang out with!

And thank you for reading!

 

[Rupstart01]

Up to 553 in Super Doubles so far. I've not lost a team member in any battles for the last few hundred wins. Sometimes I will win with all pokes at full health.

If you don't mind gaming the system a bit, then you cant really lose with this:

Togekiss @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
Bold Nature
- Tailwind
- Roost
- Air Slash
- Aura Sphere

Machamp @ Shell Bell
Ability: No Guard
Adamant Nature
- Protect
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- DynamicPunch

Dragonite @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Multiscale
Adamant Nature
- Protect
- Fire Punch
- Dragon Dance
- Outrage

Raichu @ Air Balloon
Ability: Lightening Rod
Modest Nature
- Nasty Plot
- Protect
- Hidden Power Ice
- Thunderbolt

Tailwind + Protect with Togekiss/Machamp. Then flinch and confuse everyone. If anyone comes out and looks to put an electric attack on Togekiss then Raichu comes in and with Lightening Rod + Nasty Plot is then absolutely unstoppable. The Air Balloon is there so you can still use Earthquake if you need it. Dragonite is not used often but sometimes a Trick Room will require he takes some hits and Outrages his way out of trouble.

Honestly, most of the time you will run through all 7 without even needing to change Togekiss/Machamp out.

I've also used Breloom and Omastar to good success, but Machamp can pretty much handle both of those jobs.

 

[Level 51]

me when i "game the system a bit" (manipulate battle rng and load save states)

 

[Rupstart01]

After a while it becomes quite predictable what they will do and when.

Like the previous Raichu lighteningbolt abuser said, they will just keep using electric attacks on you 90% of the time even after the first lighteningbolt is triggered.

Serene Grace + Air Slash and No Guard + Dynamic Punch is a reasonably filthy tactic, but a legitimate one. The AI gets hacky sometimes with secondary effects, critical hits, hitting Fissure and Sheer Cold regularly as well as avoiding 100% accurate attacks, so you need something to balance the field. A Battle Train AI using Double-Team or Minimize can make you sweat sometimes for sure.

 

[PinkFreakCrystal]

Could we also get the EV spread for this team?

 

[Rupstart01]

Sure. I finally lost a pokemon from an Archeops + Exeggutor Head Smash + Ancient Power combo where nothing I could change out to would survive the attacks, so have been using this team instead now which has proven to rip through the trainers even quicker than using Togekiss/Raichu and has a bit more bulk to it:


Zapdos (Modest) @ Leftovers:
Ability: Pressure
252 SpA /252 Spe / 4 SpD
Hidden Power Ice
Thunderbolt
Tailwind
Roost

Machamp (Adamant) @ Shell Bell:
Ability: No Guard
252 Atk /120 SpD /128 Def /8 HP
Protect
Earthquake
Stone Edge
DynamicPunch

Heatran (Quiet) @ Sitrus Berry:
Ability: Flash Fire
252 Atk / 252 HP /4 Def
Protect
Earth Power
Dragon Pulse
Eruption

Vaporeon (Bold) @ Chesto Berry:
Ability: Water Absorb
252 SpA / 252 Def / 4 HP
Rest
Shadow Ball
Ice Beam
Muddy Water

 

[lovelyeterna]

I edited the Battle Subway Pokemon/Trainer Lookup Spreadsheet posted to have a nicer UI with sprites for pokemon and items. It's also simplified to give only pertinent info and load faster. Here's the link if anyone else could benefit from this!

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/113EI7OkMEHS7bkjCqmsaW5BWrdRmKY4APttG6N0iu34/edit?usp=sharing

 

[Ziggmiceter]

I edited the Battle Subway Pokemon/Trainer Lookup Spreadsheet posted to have a nicer UI with sprites for pokemon and items. It's also simplified to give only pertinent info and load faster. Here's the link if anyone else could benefit from this!

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/113EI7OkMEHS7bkjCqmsaW5BWrdRmKY4APttG6N0iu34/edit?usp=sharing

Thank you so much! I just came to this thread and was going to start looking up trainers and their sets and this was right here.

 

[Ziggmiceter]

I just lost my run on battle 47 to some pretty bad luck. It's not the worst you've ever seen, but I really thought I was going to finish the Subway today and was pretty excited about it.
My team was Scizor/Starmie/Dragonite with random IVs (though Dragonite I rolled a couple times and ended up with 27 Atk 30 Spe). I plugged my exact sets into the showdown calculator from PkHeX afterwards, but had been calc'ing with incomplete info on my IVs for this entire run.

vs Clerk Bank
Lead Honchkrow vs Scizor, I plan to SD into Steel Gem Bullet Punch to KO it. It uses Air Cutter and KOs with a crit. Assuming this had Super Luck to go with the raised crit chance, the crit was 25% and Air Cutter was 43.3% chance to OHKO after the crit, which added up to a 10.75% chance to be killed.

I send out Starmie and revenge kill with Ice Beam.
He sends out Crobat, which is a disaster for me. Crobat is one of the top 10 or so percent of Pokemon that outspeed a max speed neutral nature Starmie here. However, with perfect IVs in the calc, it says Brave Bird does 93% at the max roll. Brave Bird goes through and KOs without a crit. Plugging in the numbers later, the Crobat was actually 25% to kill.

I have to send out Dragonite here. I debate for awhile between going for Dragon Dance or just pressing Outrage and praying. It seemed like Brave Bird wasn't going to 2hko through Multiscale, but I couldn't be sure at this point. So, I clicked Outrage, and took the Brave Bird through Multiscale. The real calc showed that the 2nd Brave Bird would have been around a 1% chance to KO (outside of Razor Claw crit, which would have added another 1/8 roll) if I had chosen to DD then outrage.

Bank's final Pokemon was Beartic. My Outrage does about 2/3, and it clicks Avalanche, hits the 90% acc move, and my run is over. If I had DD'ed, the +1 Outrage would have been 50% to KO on the Beartic, but I don't know the roll that I ended up getting on the Outrage I actually used. This sequence of events added up to a 2.4% chance.

Oh well, will go again soon and beat Super Singles so I can move on to PWT.

Edit: I have been thinking about this way too much, but I realized that despite the 10%, my best move was actually to go straight to Starmie and click Ice Beam to guaranteed KO after the Honch's Life Orb recoil. I don't know the odds it would have randomly clicked Dark Pulse instead of Air Cutter that turn 1, it may have been 0. I didn't know the next 2 Pokemon, but then I would have been able to bring Scizor back in on Crobat, SD up then bullet punch for the KO, then clean up the Beartic.
Edit again: The Air Cutter crit still killed Starmie no matter what actually, so going for SD there was really my only play

 

[Brucolac]

Hello,
I am reporting a streak of 204 battles with my Hail team. I made a few optimizations: Whimsi now is Calm, and survives Charizards Heatwave + Kangaskhans Fake Out + Hail, aside from 2 max rolls (or crits). Also it has Giga Drain now, which also worked fine. I only missed Grass Knot sometimes against Terraktion. Furthermore, I now have a 5x31IVs Machamp, and put a bit into defense, because then he survives QC Bronzongs Zen Headbutt. In fact, iirc, no QC user now is able to OHKO it!

TEAM

Abomasnow @ Focus Sash
Ability: Snow Warning
EVs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Blizzard
- Giga Drain
- Hail
- Protect

Whimsicott @ Lum Berry
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 20 Def / 236 SDef
Calm Nature
- Tailwind
- Encore
- Fake Tears
- Giga Drain

Rotom-Frost @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Blizzard
- Thunderbolt
- Electro Ball
- Protect

Machamp @ Expert Belt
Ability: No Guard
Level: 50
EVs: 252 Atk / 12 Def / 244 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dynamic Punch
- Stone Edge
- Earthquake
- Protect

Speeds: Rotom 138, Whimsi 136, Abomasnow 123, Machamp 116

Battle

Sawk and Flareon. Usual Protect + Tailwind, both attacks in Protect.
Fake Tears + Blizzard kill Sawk, Flareon misses Firefang.
Volcarona comes in. FT on Volcarona, Blizzard. Heatwave + sth from Flareon. Abo dead, Whimsi almost.
Machamp in. SE kills Volcarona, Flareon kills Whimsi. Don’t know what I did with Whimsi anymore.
Gallade and Rotom in, very bad, as Tailwind is over. Gallade only had a guaranteed OHKO on Rotom, so I protect it, which was the right call and only winning option. EQ kills Flareon. Then cleanup Gallade next round, 1-0.

Battle 190

Against a Battle Girl.
Arcanine4 and Heracross4. Usual Protect + Tailwind, both attacks go in Protect. -2 Heracross may survive Blizzard, so I go for Fake Tears into Arcanine, to maybe kill both afterwards with Rotom. Blizzard, then Flareblitz kills Whimsi, Megahorn brings Abo to the Sash. Rotom in. Protect Abo against Extremespeed, and double KO with Rotom as planned.
In come Flareon and Volcarona. Flareon is no problem because it is outsped and OHKOed with EQ on the fly. But Volcarona is bad, because Tailwind will peter out next turn (easy win if Machamp was already in). I need every bit of damage on Volcarona, so Thunderbolt + Blizzard. Heatwave kills both of mine.
Machamp in. Hurricane must not crit or confuse, then I win with EQ, and this is what happened. EQ just did enough on Volcarona. 1-0

Battle 205

Against a Psychic.
Chandelure4 and Bronzong4. A tough matchup because TR + Heatwave. If Heatwave crits Whimsi is dead and cannot reset TR with Encore. I prepare for that and already start doing a bit of damage and go for Fake Tears in Chandelure + Blizzard. Heatwave, no crit on Whimsi, TR. That was the best I could hope for.
Now, Protect with Abo and Encore in Bronzong, who resets TR. Shadow Ball finishes Whimsi.
Rotom in. Thunderbolt takes out Chandelure, and I go for Giga Drain on Bronzong, because smartdumb thoughts: Bronzong keeps TRing and is no threat atm. But whatever will come in may be faster or slower than me. So, I want Bronzong to actually set and reset TR, in order for me to attack at the right time. That is why I went for Giga Drain and not for Blizzard which could have frozen (Edit: nevermind, Zong had Lum lol). Bronzong sets TR again.
In comes Metagross4. I protect Abo and go for Thunderbolt into Meta. Metas EQ does nothing. Bronzong removes TR once again.
Now I have a choice: Either finish Bronzong or Meta. Bronzongs Encore wore off, and I definitely did not want to face its Rockslide in TR, so I go for Thunderbolt which kills it, and Blizzard. Here the smarter play maybe was Giga Drain, because then Abo may have survived Metas EQ. It crits anyways though and killed Abo.
Machamp in, hoping something slow comes in. But in comes Espeon, which is very bad, since with Gem boosted Psychic it can kill either of mine. I was not sure whether Blizzard would finish Meta, so I double Protect and let them eat a round of Hail. Now, Blizzard definitely kills Meta. So, both EQ and Blizzard finish Meta, but I need to land two attacks on Espeon… I did not want to attempt a second Protect on Machamp, because Espeon can also OHKO Rotom, so I went for Dynamic Punch into Espeon and Blizzard. However Espeon takes out Champ. Blizzard finishes Meta, and I land in the situation I foresaw 2 turns ago: Rotom with 78 HP against Espeon with wasted Gem, which may fail to kill Rotom and then I win. I actually had landed a high roll Blizzard, and double Protect would kill Espeon now also because Hail. However it also has Morning Sun, so I rejected that. Should have went for it, then I had 50% chance of winning.
Espeon didn’t mess around and gets the Psychic range, which was 14/16 because I have only 22 SDef IVs. Chance would have been 11/16 otherwise. 0-1
Tough and intense battle from start to end. I planned carefully and long ahead, but it was not enough. TR + max SDef Fire type with spread move + max SDef Steel + fast Psychic in the end against Machamp was too much to handle.

Lessons learned

-Resetting Hail against sand has priority, even if you expect 2 attacks against Abo.
-Volcarona deserves a special mention and is one of the most dangerous Fire mons, as it takes not much from EQ and is hard to KO in general aside from Stone Edge.
-Empoleon is tricky, as even with Fake Tears it stays around long, and it tends to kill Whimsi slowly, such that Tailwind runs out soon after Whimsi dies. This happened at least 2 times and lead to tense battles. So, one should not blindly prolong Whimsis life with Giga Drain, but sometimes let it die soon.
-Abomasnow should be even less bulky I think. So frail, that Gardevoir4 oneshots (-> 0HP, 0SDef IVs do the job). And obviously Rotom with 31 SDef IVs, as I maybe still would live now had it had it.
-Pursue double KOs, maybe even at the price of sacrificing something beforehand.
-I noted which FO user likes to go for Abo/Whimsi/None.

I am a bit disappointed, that I could only surpass my previous record with this team by 7 battles, and still could not surpass my personal best (211). I tried 2 or 3 times. One of them I lost at battle 115 due to saving the battle, but then not saving the game, after which I quit for several months :S The awesome records of Eisenherz and Coeur motivated me again. So cool teams! And I thought without R Inanimate we never see 1000 battles here.

Overall this streak was less lucky than my previous streak (one time double confusion saved me there). Aside from the Volcarona Hurricane battle, one other time I also would have lost if the opponent crits, but other than that it was rather solid.

 

[DuckMan(verypro)]

Is it allowed to use pokemon obtained through diamond/pearl ACE? I don't mean like pokemon with impossible stats, moves, and abilities and stuff. This would make obtaining optimal pokemon way easier for any pokemon from gens 1-4. It also enables people to use pokemon that are hard to obtain like eruption heatran

 

[Brucolac]

Is it allowed to use pokemon obtained through diamond/pearl ACE? I don't mean like pokemon with impossible stats, moves, and abilities and stuff. This would make obtaining optimal pokemon way easier for any pokemon from gens 1-4. It also enables people to use pokemon that are hard to obtain like eruption heatran

I would not mind. Some people may mind and argue against leaderboard eligibility. But note, that the leaderboard is not updated anyways since years.
I'd be curious to see with what you come up with.