Project Break This Team (Week 42)

Thundurus + Manaphy
The team has no real switch-in to electric types which means that something might have to be sacked and is heavily pressured by T wave Thundurus. Manaphy can potentially set up on something paralyzed or Kingdra at -1 after a Draco or on a Hydro.

Ferrothorn+Gastrodon
The team has no way to effectively OHKO both and get free switch-ins on Kingdra's water STAB. Gastrodon is a huge threat as seen in the replay where Martin. was able to setup on the opposing Kingdra. Ferrothorn answers are Tornadus with Superpower (not super good) and Garchomp with SD.
 
Thundy+Mana 'cause it's the one that breaks the team the best. Thundy gives the team a headache even if it's not 6:0ing it as the team lacks any consistent switch-in other than trying to get Kingdra or Kabu in on a HP Ice, and even then that involves getting para'd. Mana is nice 'cause it sets up on stuff really nicely and actively takes advantage of the opposing rain to heal up repeatedly and aquire multiple booosts.
 
thundurus + mana
The problem I have with the elec + water cores is that they all feel more like two individual threats. Regardless, I knew I would vote for one, and this is the most difficult to take down. I've never really struggled with Azu, Manec, or the two together, and Thundurus is imo the most annoying elec to face, even though its certainly beatable if you outpredict your opponent. CM Manaphy, on the other hand, can be an absolute nuisance to take down. Its one of the few situations where I'd rather have perish song on politoed, as encore just isn't useful enough to take mana down (at least not without taking a ton of damage from rain and cm boosted scalds). Thund works ok with mana because it pressures torn and can get that twave off on either kingdra or kabu, which eases up manaphy's set-up and sweep a great deal.

Ferro + Gastro
A very annoying combination to take out, this one actually requires toxic on toad, or a ton of pressure from scizor and torn, neither of whom want to take on gastrodon's rain-boosted scalds, and torn wanting to avoid a t-wave from ferrothorn. Overall, I think this is a very efficient defensive core that the team struggles with, and can also get swept by since it struggles to kill curse gastrodon.
 
Man you know whats really funny? Nobody posted Breloom as anything that gives the team problems in tandem with an electric. I remember awhile back when this team was everywhere I started spamming the "Breloom wins again" line when I would use Breloom on all my squads. I guess you have ways to play around it with Bulky M-Zor and Chomp but the matchup against Torn-T always felt like a cointoss at times in favor of Loom. For what it's worth I don't really like hypnosis on toed I always thought it's a really inconsistent move over Toxic. Food for thought don't feel like voting.
 
Core 2- Thundurus can easily sweep the team and can para the faster 1 or more threats so that manaphy can freely set up.

Core 4 - Ferrothorn walls majority of the team and superpower doesn't kill it so it can fire back with a t-wave making it easier for Gastrodon to set up curses.
 
Core 2
You can see from the replay vs Infernal that I'm at a disadvantage from the very start because of the pressure Thundy exerts on the team. CM Manaphy is also almost impossible to kill using this team unless you try to Encore it which is predictable.

Core 4
Ferro + Water immune mon is a pain for this team to get past. Gastro can also shrug off boosted U-turns from Scizor and heal back up. You aren't winning this unless you have a Status move.

(As for Breloom, I admit I neglected to think of it as a threat because of Mega Scizor and Torn-T being there. Maybe it can achieve something against the Waters, I don't know since I never tried it)
 
Alright, voting is closed. It's a very close week but once again our Breaker Queen Infernal won with her Thundurus + CM Manaphy core. Congratulations!!!

Core 2: 5 votes
Core 4: 4 votes


Anyway, the team for this week is Team Pokepals version of Mega Heracross BO. Good luck and have fun!!

214-m.png
479w.png
485.png
381.png
465.png
385.png

Heracross-Mega (M) @ Heracronite
Ability: Moxie
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Pin Missile
- Swords Dance / Substitute
- Close Combat
- Rock Blast

or

Heracross-Mega (M) @ Heracronite
Ability: Moxie
EVs: 248 HP / 44 SpD / 216 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Substitute
- Swords Dance
- Close Combat
- Rock Blast

Rotom-Wash @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Volt Switch
- Hydro Pump
- Will-O-Wisp
- Pain Split

Heatran (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Lava Plume
- Stealth Rock
- Earth Power / Taunt
- Toxic

Latios @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Psyshock
- Draco Meteor
- Calm Mind
- Roost

Tangrowth (M) @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Regenerator
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 244 HP / 216 Def / 48 SpD
Relaxed Nature
- Sleep Powder
- Giga Drain
- Knock Off
- Leech Seed

Jirachi @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Iron Head
- Fire Punch
- Healing Wish
- U-turn

So at first the set was kinda weird, and I went Rock Blast over Pin Missile cause I didn't wanna get walled by Lando-T and Clefable. Rock Blast also lets Heracross hit flying types like Talonflame and Torn-T, and it can hit Amoonguss/Mega Venusaur better than Bullet Seed can. Rotom-Wash was sort of a no brainer because it can get Heracross in easily, it can switch into flying types and kill Lando-T with Hydro Pump. From there, I decided to add Heatran to handle Fairy types, provide Stealth Rock and help out with defeating opposing Grass types. The team doesn't have many options to kill an opposing Heatran, so you can run Earth Power, though Taunt can also help out since it'll let Heatran handle slower mons like Clefable with more ease. Lava Plume and Will-O-Wisp from Rotom-Wash were both helpful choices at this point because Heracross is able to set up behind a sub against more opponents when they're burned, so it really works out for this set. From there I wanted a Keldeo switch in and added Latios since it also helps with Volcanion and can revenge kill Mega Medicham. I went with the Calm Mind set since I wanted to let Latios be able to severely weaken Clefable for Heracross and it's also a nice win-con late game. Defensive Tangrowth helps out with Mega-Lopunny, bulky waters like Slowbro and it's the main switch into Tyranitar. A Defensive Lando-T could've worked too, but it would've gotten worn down extremely quickly, whereas Tangrowth will take the hits better and can heal with Regenerator. Finally, I needed something to help out with Clefable, Mega Alakazam and also Weavile, so I added Scarf Jirachi. Jirachi can revenge kill faster stuff, kill fairies and provide momentum to get Heracross in safely.

As for threats to the team, watch out for Weavile, Mega Alakazam, Mega Diancie, and opposing Magma Taunt Heatran. The Mega-Heracross, Rotom-Wash and Heatran can all take a hit from Weavile if necessary and then Jirachi can also revenge kill it. Mega Alakazam's probably the biggest threat since you'll need Jirachi to revenge kill it, or you'll need Rotom-Wash or Heatran to tank a hit and then damage it back. Diancie's also annoying as you can switch into Jirachi or go into Tangrowth or Rotom-Wash to take a hit. If it's HP Fire, then Latios will outspeed it. As for Heatran, Heracross can outspeed it before it Mega Evolves, and then you'll need Rotom-Wash to handle it or otherwise set up a Calm Mind or 2 with Latios to wear it down more quickly.

I added a regular Mega Heracross with 3 Attacks since Sub + SD doesn't always work (usually only works if they have an Amoonguss) in case anyone else wants to use it, so you're free to use either set.
 
Last edited:
Dont have much time so I'll just make a few comments. Well designed team here and Heracross is very good rightnow and unlike some other hera teams I've seen doesn't keel over the first time clefable or Klefki successfully fires off a Thunder wave. In addition Tangrowth and rotom are able switch into many of hera's usual answers with ease like talon or Scizor and fire back. Long story short this team is able to force switchs very regularly on the oppenents side and capatilise even in the face of doubles.

1 Weakness I do note however is an over-reliance on jirachi to deal naturally faster threats. Things Like Mega Lopunny, Genger and Alakazam give this team no end of trouble. Nothing outside of Tangrowth wants to Switch into lopunny which can exploit it with pup or Sub, Genger can spam shadow ball everytime jirachi is not in and Life Orb Alakazam just punch's in holes. Now they dont auto win since clever double and this teams ability to force swtichs will make it difficult to land them in but once there in something is going to die. The key I think breaking this team is a faster Threat with Volt/Turn Support.

I'll post more later thats just my thoughts
 
I'm just going to say that this team actually faces issues against strong wallbreakers which can exploit the FWG core behind this team. Mega Charizard-Y, for example forces the team to go to Latios, which is Pursuit weak and trapped by Ttar. Mega Charizard-X doesn't have much chance to set up but if it does get to +1 (against a Jirachi, Rotom-W or Tangrowth-whose only deterrent is Sleep Powder), you pretty much have to click "X" unless you get lucky with Jirachi's flinches. A Substitute Mega Heracross might also be annoying to play against.

On the Offensive side, this team looks relatively slow with Latios at 110 Spe being the fastest (outside of Scarf Jirachi who has like no coverage). What this means is that fast threats such as Weavile, Torn-T and Mega Alakazam is going to pressure you hard because this team doesn't really have Pokemon to want to directly switch in. The over-reliance on Scarf Jirachi can also be exploited by Pokemon who resist Jirachi's coverage. (for example, a Mega Charizard-X setting up a Dragon Dance or Volcarona setting up a Quiver Dance )
 
Last edited:
Although on paper this team looks good versus clefable it kind of struggles as it only really has one thing to deal with it being Jirachi and heatran isnt really a check or counter since clefable can get around it with thunder wave CM and spa drops from moon blast and Jirachi really does not want to be thunder waved as it is the teams only form of speed control. And Jirachi can by easily whittled for late game sweep since it has no recovery.

Also this team has no grounds types so that means electric types on going to have a blast .Also as said by other zard x is very good against the although it has to Earth quake zard x which mean there no roost. And Volcanion or keldeo plus pursuit mon can do very well versus the team . Also its rare but EQ latios can do well versus the team.

One last thought heart stomp over Fire punch my help versus zard x , Although Fire punch is a nice Scizor and ferro lure.
 
Last edited:
This team in general is slow and would literally lose to a lot of Sp.Attacking mons that meet the speed tier or are close for OU such as Mega Diancie, Gengar, Thundurus-I, Zard-Y, etc. that can just 2HKO all the members of the team. The check to those threats are Scarf Jirachi, which gets whittled down due to hazards and having to switch in to moves like Hyper Voice/ Moonblast because coverage on Mega Gardevoir+ Diancie can cover Heatran. A basic core such as Zard-Y + Choice Tyranitar would win just by managing to trap Latios and then proceed to just hit the rest of the team with Zard-Y's coverage. While the team doesn't really have mons weak to hazards it does struggle against hazard stacking which helps the Faster Sp.Attacking threats making it easier for them to just fire a hit and then switch. It also struggles with mons like Dragonite or Mega Zard X which can DDance up and just take out chunks of the team causing Tangrowth to have to hit dat god 75% accuracy Sleep Powder. Wallbreakers tend to just beat dis team once the 2 checks: Jirachi + Latios r down.
 
EQ DD Zard-X + LO Starmie

charizard-mega-x.png
starmie.png

Charizard-Mega-X @ Charizardite X
Ability: Tough Claws
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Dragon Claw
- Earthquake
- Dragon Dance

Starmie @ Life Orb
Ability: Analytic
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hydro Pump
- Ice Beam
- Psychic
- Rapid Spin
Description:

I feel like this one's fairly obvious but I'm not creative so I'll take it lol. EQ Zard-X is a massive headache for this build because Heatran is the dedicated Zard-X check, which can obviously be circumvented by dropping Roost for EQ. With a DD under its belt, the only thing not cleanly OHKO'd after rocks is Rotom, which can only attempt to 2HKO with Hydro Miss:

006-mx.png
vs.
214-m.png
+1 252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Flare Blitz vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Heracross: 678-798 (225.2 - 265.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
006-mx.png
vs.
479w.png
+1 252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Dragon Claw vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Rotom-W: 175-207 (57.7 - 68.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
006-mx.png
vs.
485.png
+1 252 Atk Mega Charizard X Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 4 Def Heatran: 620-732 (161 - 190.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
006-mx.png
vs.
381.png
+1 252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Dragon Claw vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Latios: 612-720 (204.6 - 240.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
006-mx.png
vs.
465.png
+1 252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Flare Blitz vs. 244 HP / 216+ Def Tangrowth: 482-570 (119.9 - 141.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
006-mx.png
vs.
385.png
+1 252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Flare Blitz vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Jirachi: 762-896 (223.4 - 262.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO

The matter of getting a DD isn't terribly difficult either; Tangrowth fails to do anything threatening vs. Zard-X aside from Sleep Powder (once you fodder something, Tang is essentially worthless vs. Zard), Jirachi can potentially lock itself into Iron Head (which does 12% to Zard IIRC), and while risky, Zard can scare out Heracross with a potential Flare Blitz.

Starmie is the partner of choice since it's also quite troublesome for this build to handle. 2/3 of the Analytic LO Hydro Pump switch-ins get promptly Ice Beamed to net a KO (Latios takes 39.1 - 46.1% from the Analytic Hydro, then 66.2 - 78.2% from non-Analytic Ice Beam, which amounts to 105.3% min, while Tangrowth takes 36.5 - 43% from Analytic Hydro, then 61.4 - 72.3% from Ice Beam, which amounts to a 97.8 min—or a clean KO after rocks or some minor chip damage). The only genuinely decent answer to Starmie's coverage is Rotom-W, which can potentially eat 64.6 - 76.2% from an Analytic-boosted Psychic, meaning it will be KO'd by a following Psychic (roll is 50.1 - 59%). Should Starmie get an opportunity to come in on Heatran, there's a good chance something is being KO'd.

Replay
  • In this replay, I borrowed a team AM posted in the OU Bazaar (link here). I lead Ferro anticipating the Rotom-W lead to take advantage of the team's lack of hazard removal with spikes. We switch around until I get Thundurus in on a weakened Heracross, and then proceed to punch a few holes into the team with LO-boosted attacks. From there, Starmie and Zard-X clean up the opposition relatively unopposed thanks to how underprepared the team is for them after Lucario softens up Tangrowth and Lando-T is sleep foddered.
Shoutouts to Infernal for testing with me! :]
 
Last edited:
volcarona.gif

Volcarona @ Lum Berry
Ability: Flame Body
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Fire Blast
- Quiver Dance
- Bug Buzz
- Hidden Power [Ground]

diancie-mega.gif

Diancie-Mega @ Diancite
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 8 Atk / 248 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Moonblast
- Diamond Storm
- Earth Power
- Protect

Volcarona is super brainless to use versus this team and honestly doesn't have any viable counter play here. All you have to do is grab a QD against one of the several team members it's capable to taking advantage of and then watch everything drop afterwards. There are a few reasons Volc performs really well versus this team. For starters, the team is rather slow, lacks priority, and relies on Jira as its main form of speed control. Volc heavily threatens the team's main revenge killer and can only be taken down by Jira via extreme luck after reaching +1 (meaning winning every speed tie and flinching each time). The other reason Volc does well here is because its STABs run through the team. Between Mega Hera, Tangrowth, Latios, and Jira, the team stacks weaknesses to Bug and Fire and Volc abuses this excellently. Finally, Volc excels versus this team for one more reason: it's able to QD up comfortably against the team's defensive core of Tran and Tangrowth. Lum shields you from any status conditions they can throw at Volc, allowing you to safely QD and then sweep by clicking the appropriate moves.

Mega Diancie is mainly here to deter Tran from using SR. It's also able to do a good number to the team just by clicking Moonblast, as every member aside from Jira is 2HKOed by this move. Earth Power is preferred over HP Fire versus this team because you can cleanly OHKO Tran and nail Jira on the switch for a 2HKO. In terms of synergy and overall viability, Mega Diancie is a classic partner with Volc and contributes even more than hazard control by checking threats like Talon. Overall, this core will likely win versus this team every time unless something unimaginable happens. Volc is the Pokemon to use if you're looking for a mindless win here, and its ability to take advantage of the team's structure in several ways contributes to this. I think HP Ground Volc is a strong pick in this metagame in general, mainly because 1. Tran is around every corner, and 2. tons of teams rely on cores with Latios, Jirachi, and so on, which Volc exploits well.

Replay 1
  • Thank you daddy's kisses for the match! I bring Volc in on a double on turn 8. From there, I QD up on Tran as Lum protects me from poison. Tran proceeds to die to HP Ground and then Volc goes on to sweep cleanly. I decided to QD another time versus Rotom-W to avoid any possible funny business with Jira speed ties and flinches. Overall, there wasn't much the team could do once Volc powered up.
Replay 2
  • Here is another replay where AM tries Volc versus the team in question. After Latios Draco's the Chomp on turn 16, Volc was free to come in and QD up with nothing to fear. After the QD, Volc goes on to sweep effortlessly.
 
Last edited:
clefable.gif
+
landorus-therian.gif
+
latios.gif

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 240 Def / 16 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moonblast
- Thunder Wave
- Calm Mind
- Soft-Boiled

Landorus-Therian (M) @ Rocky helmit
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Impish Nature
- Earthquake
- Stone edge
- Stealth Rock
- U-turn

Latios (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
- Draco Meteor
- Surf
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Recover

So basically Clefable wall all of the pokemon on team other than jirachi and heatran if you dont thunder wave it on the switch so surf latios can help with heatran and lando-t with rocky helmit also helps whittle down jirachi latios also helps clefable with rotom-w since it bold clefable to deal with Mega heracross so surprising heatran with surf and whittling down jirachi lets clefable sweep late game with Calm mind , also HP fire latios help whittle jirachi since that is the main switch in to latios as this latios set can do alot to this with the coverage moves on this set.
 
Last edited:
reserving lop + gengar

lopunny-mega-1-gif.61311
+
gengar.gif


Sets
Playgirl of Demise (Lopunny) (F) @ Lopunnite
Ability: Limber
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Return
- High Jump Kick
- Substitute
- Fake Out

Ghost of Ending (Gengar) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Shadow Ball
- Sludge Wave
- Icy Wind
- Trick

Explanation: As good as this team is at breaking past bulky stuff (Excluding clef and other Calm minders) and taking the odd hit 1 weakness is hugely obvious. Its over reliance on jirachi for speed control leaves it vulnerable to naturally fast mons like lopunny who outspeed the team and balance breakers like gengar who can spam Shadow ball like it going out of fashion.

Pair the 2 up togethor and the team literraly melts. Lopunny can easily come in on heatran, rotom or a locked jirachi and just start spamming high jump kick or Set up Sub which force's the team to make hugely complex plays to get around her. Only tangrowth can switch into her and that gives you either a shot at subbing or exploiting and doubling to gengar. Once gengars in something will almost certainly die as nothing wants to take shadowball and jirachi can only come in after something dies which itself is easily exploitable by teammates like rotom.

Meta viability: Tho Somewhat rare the 2 are proven partners in crime able to break teams easily on both sides of the offensive equation

Replays:

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-403120930

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-403125691
 
Last edited:
i'm going to go ahead and start voting now

vote for one core
justification for your vote is encouraged but not necessary. edit: we'd also appreciate if you didn't bandwagon when voting, of course there might be a situation where everyone happens to like a particular core for a particular reason, but if you're voting for a core because everyone else did, that isn't very helpful; this is why we really encourage posting reasons for your votes.
 
Last edited:
Core 1 - Zard X after a dragon dance virtually destroys the entire team and there's plenty of oppurtunities to set up here. Starmie is icing on the cake beating trick locked jirachi, taking out tran and keeping hazards clear
 
Sobi said:
Core 4: Both Lopunny and Gengar both have a really easy time against the team if they safely get in, Choice Specs Gengar hits like a truck, though I've never used it before :0
Click to expand...

Specs Gengar is under-rated. although it lacks the move changability of LO it does have stronger shadow balls which face it you'll click 90% of the time anyway, Your slightly bulkier and have access to trick for crippling swtich ins like Tyraniter and chansey.
 
Voting is now closed. Not a lot of activity this week but we'll see. The result is a tie for Infernal and Creator of Chaos who obtained 2 votes each. Infernal's core is Mega Diancie + Volcarona while CoC's core is Mega Lopunny and Gengar.

Core 1: 1 vote
Core 2: 2 votes
Core 4: 2 votes

This week, I am ripping off AM's submitted Sand team from the Teambuilding Competition thread. Enjoy and have fun.
282-m.png
248.png
530.png
647.png
663.png
579.png

Gardevoir-Mega @ Gardevoirite
Ability: Trace
EVs: 16 HP / 8 Def / 232 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hyper Voice
- Psyshock
- Focus Blast
- Will-O-Wisp

Excadrill @ Air Balloon
Ability: Sand Rush
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Iron Head
- Rock Slide
- Rapid Spin

Tyranitar @ Chople Berry
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 248 HP / 80 Def / 172 SpD / 8 Spe
Relaxed Nature
- Pursuit
- Stone Edge
- Ice Beam
- Stealth Rock

Keldeo-Resolute @ Coba Berry
Ability: Justified
EVs: 56 HP / 200 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Secret Sword
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

Reuniclus @ Life Orb
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 232 Def / 16 SpA / 8 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Psyshock
- Focus Blast
- Recover
- Calm Mind

Talonflame @ Leftovers
Ability: Gale Wings
EVs: 248 HP / 228 SpD / 32 Spe
Careful Nature
- Brave Bird
- Will-O-Wisp
- Roost
- Swords Dance

Not a whole lot to say other than every M-Garde sand team is either gonna be a crappy version of Enders XY M-Gard Sand team, something that gets demolished by every fighting type ie those kyurem-b sand teams, or just some random sand balance which is what this is more or less (probably still the first point lol). There's a lot of directions you can take a team such as this but I felt like using Reuniclus + water here and Keldeo fit for not being too Bish / Weavile weak. Talonflame helped with some speed control and threats like Serperior, Volcarona, and grasses and while I kind of dont like the SD SpDef set that much I think the immediate pressure as opposed to Bulk Ups slower long term pressure seemed more useful here. RestTalk Keld gives it some longevity. Keldeo can be annoying so just don't play like booty around it and if Slowbros annoy you Shadow Ball Reuniclus is an option over Focus Blast. That's really it enjoy.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top