CAP 9 Colossoil Playtesting

[TekkenStorm]

Colosoil is pretty good, but I think it failed at it's original concept, "stop the secondary"

They are as common as ever, their usage haven't been reduced atall. Colosoil didn't do much good as it was supposed to do, but it does very well in other areas like a bulky heavy hitter.

 

[Azule]

Agreeing with TekkanStorm, Sucker Punch is such a threat to secondary users, that they simply dont attack, and spend the turn getting the last of their spikes/using leech seed/recovering/encoring Collossoil. Selfdestruct is also an immensly powerful move, aiding it in a Guts sweep. Once playtesting has died down, Collossoil should be an immensly powerful Guts sweeper within the CAP metagame.
Whilst Collossoil isnt sweeping through teams, it can dent them, and play mindgames with several Pokemon in order to net 1-2 kills a match. I found the most effective set is Blue_Tornado's, since with prediction, you can tear through a few Pokemon.

 

[Golbez_743]

I'm one of those weirdos who actually tried Colbur Berry Celebi, and even though most people regard Celebi as a user of the secondary, Colossoil is unable to stop it. This Celebi has taken as little as 27% from a Guts Flame Orb Crunch, and easily KO'd back with Grass Knot.

 

[polelover44]

I've been running this so far, with success:
Colossoil @ Choice Scarf
Rebound
Jolly
4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spe
Earthquake
Crunch
Aqua Tail/Brick Break
Megahorn

Thoughts?

 

[Scoopapa]

I've been running this so far, with success:
Colossoil @ Choice Scarf
Rebound
Jolly
4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spe
Earthquake
Crunch
Aqua Tail/Brick Break
Megahorn

Thoughts?

Colossoil does seem like a cool Scarf user because of the good STAB's and base 122 Atk. One thing I would personally change about the set is the ability: Guts + Choice Scarf seems too tempting to pass up, and it affords you many of the same switch-ins as AMC, just with different payoff.

In general, I like Colossoil, but it doesn't seem to fit the concept very well. I think it needed more bulk (with it's poor defensive typing, it could have had wallish stats without becoming a wall) and less Attack (to make it less tempting to just use it as a sweeper). It seems like a recurring theme that we give a bulky CAP enough attack power to hit hard with no EV's, and in so doing give it the potential to just be an attacker instead (Cyclohm is mainly what I'm thinking of here). Also, Sucker Punch is so common and so predictable that it seems to encourage secondary. I generally use Torterra to set up Stealth Rock on Collosoil whenever I see it, because very few run Taunt and Sucker Punch = free switch. That said, it's a cool pokemon that makes a presence in the metagame without overwhelming it.

I tested a sub-punch set (among others) and found it to be very underwhelming. Comparing it to sub-punch Tyranitar, I initially thought that Sucker Punch and higher speed would be a solid advantage for Colossoil to exploit. However, Tyranitar's huge boosted Special Defense, higher Attack, and access to a usable Fire Blast seem to make him easier to switch in and harder to wall. I'm not going to say it could never shine above Tyranitar as a Dark-type sub-puncher, but it would certainly take some team building finesse.

 

[Blue_Tornado]

I tested a sub-punch set (among others) and found it to be very underwhelming. Comparing it to sub-punch Tyranitar, I initially thought that Sucker Punch and higher speed would be a solid advantage for Colossoil to exploit. However, Tyranitar's huge boosted Special Defense, higher Attack, and access to a usable Fire Blast seem to make him easier to switch in and harder to wall. I'm not going to say it could never shine above Tyranitar as a Dark-type sub-puncher, but it would certainly take some team building finesse.

Have you forgotten about Encore? Encore means that Soil can come in on its resistances/immunities and Encore, while subbing on the weak attack/switch-in. Tyranitar can't do that.

 

[mudkip72]

I've been running this so far, with success:
Colossoil @ Choice Scarf
Rebound
Jolly
4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spe
Earthquake
Crunch
Aqua Tail/Brick Break
Megahorn

Thoughts?

I would say replace Megahorn with U-turn, and consider for the 3rd slot Self-Destruct or maybe Stone Edge.

And yeah, it seems like we may not have succeeded in stopping the secondary. Due to Collosoils power and wide array or attacks, no one wants to waste a moveslot for Rapid Spin or Taunt, when you could use that move slot for Sucker Punch, Self-Destruct, and other powerful attacks. Still, CAP9 can be viewed as a sucess as Collosoil is a fine and still reletively balanced addition to the OU metagame in my opinion.

 

[Blue_Tornado]

I've been running a Perish Trap set that, to be honest, varies with its results. It can be very effective though it can be useless too. It works on the surprise factor though.

Colossoil @ Leftovers
Nature: Jolly
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpD / 252 Spd
-Perish Song
-Mean Look
-Protect
-Substitute

The EVs make it easier to trap and kill incoming Vaporeon, along with other stuff, such as Hydro Pump Rotom-W and what not.

 

[Superkid11]

I'm one of those weirdos who actually tried Colbur Berry Celebi, and even though most people regard Celebi as a user of the secondary, Colossoil is unable to stop it. This Celebi has taken as little as 27% from a Guts Flame Orb Crunch, and easily KO'd back with Grass Knot.

Don't forget, Colossoil also learns u-turn and Megahorn... which are bug type moves.

 

[Scoopapa]

Don't forget, Colossoil also learns u-turn and Megahorn... which are bug type moves.

And seeing as Celebi can take a Crunch and kill you with Grass Knot, running Megahorn is a good idea if you intend to beat Celebi.

 

[eggwhoa]

How about this Colossoil lead?
Colossoil @ Flame Orb
Nature: Adamant
Ability: Guts
EVs: 224 Atk / 32 HP / 252 SpD
- Fake Out
- Earthquake
- Megahorn
- Sucker Punch

This set lets Colossoil get the burn status with Fake Out, and can kill most leads with Sucker Punch. With 554 Atk and strong STABs, he can certainily dent most teams.

I noticed Celebi is a problem for Colossoil, but the EV spread and Megahorn takes care of the problem. You have enough SpD and HP so that Celebi can't OHKO Colossoil even with 252 SpA, and can OHKO Celebi.

so how's this set?

 

[familyguyman]

How about this Colossoil lead?
Colossoil @ Flame Orb
Nature: Adamant
Ability: Guts
EVs: 224 Atk / 32 HP / 252 SpD
- Fake Out
- Earthquake
- Megahorn
- Sucker Punch

This set lets Colossoil get the burn status with Fake Out, and can kill most leads with Sucker Punch. With 554 Atk and strong STABs, he can certainily dent most teams.

I noticed Celebi is a problem for Colossoil, but the EV spread and Megahorn takes care of the problem. You have enough SpD and HP so that Celebi can't OHKO Colossoil even with 252 SpA, and can OHKO Celebi.

so how's this set?

Umm, if he's using Flame Orb, what is the point of trying to survive a Celebi Grass Knot?



Also, is Colossoil getting Fire Blast or is that not happening any more?

 

[Elevator Music]

I've been testing a fast Encore Collosoil. It's very nice to be able to switch in on something like a Tyranitar or Magnezone and watch them use Sub. Unfortunately it has 4MSS, but I think we all knew that lol. I think the other 3 moves I have do just what I need it to though (but they're secret for now!)

Also I'm running stall because Fire Blast-less Collosoil has some stall issues... and because I can

(I actually like Collosoil without Fire Blast a shitload moer than I think I will with it.... but whatever this is the movepool we voted on!)

 

[viol and bass]

I think I can say pretty definitively that swagger/psych-up Soil isn't particularly effective.

Also, why exactly doesn't Colossoil have fire blast yet? And when will it get it? :s

 

[?Riddle?]

Stall Ludicolo actually does quite well against Collosoil who have Life Orb and 4 attacks. Leech Seed/Toxic and Surf wear him down pretty fast and protect gets you some healing while he gets hurt.

 

[Blue_Tornado]

I think EM hit upon what I was tying to explain earlier. Encore on Soil is a wonderful move. You can outspeed many Pokemon and Encore a NVE attack. Then you can do whatever you want!

 

[Ritsi_Time]

Also, why exactly doesn't Colossoil have fire blast yet? And when will it get it? :s

Because the winning movepool didn't have it as far as I know... so never.

 

[Golbez_743]

Because the winning movepool didn't have it as far as I know... so never.

Oh, it had it, I think. I'm pretty sure it was just an error, but that's the best of my memory.

 

[Ritsi_Time]

Oh, it had it, I think. I'm pretty sure it was just an error, but that's the best of my memory.

Oh yes it did, as a TM. My mistake

 

[Zach]

How about this Colossoil lead?
Colossoil @ Flame Orb
Nature: Adamant
Ability: Guts
EVs: 224 Atk / 32 HP / 252 SpD
- Fake Out
- Earthquake
- Megahorn
- Sucker Punch

This set lets Colossoil get the burn status with Fake Out, and can kill most leads with Sucker Punch. With 554 Atk and strong STABs, he can certainily dent most teams.

I noticed Celebi is a problem for Colossoil, but the EV spread and Megahorn takes care of the problem. You have enough SpD and HP so that Celebi can't OHKO Colossoil even with 252 SpA, and can OHKO Celebi.

so how's this set?

colosoil can outspeed defensive celebi and ko with megahorn anyway. offensive celebi will outspeed colossoil and ko with Leaf Storm. Just put the hp / spd into spe imo.

 

[Objection]

So far, the only thing I've been able to prove is that a Rest Talk set sucks. Pokemon that switch into Colossoil when he uses Rest are resistant to one of his STABs, meaning Sleep Talk then only has a 1 in 3 chance of picking a good move for the job. Given that Colossoil is easy to 2HKO, it's just not worth the risk.

In theory, I would think the standard set would be

Colossoil @ Flame Orb
Guts
Jolly nature
252 Attack/220 Speed/38 Defence or Special Defence
- EQ
- Crunch
- Sucker Punch
- Stone Edge / Megahorn

Gets decent all-around coverage coupled with the power its ability brings. I based the EVs on the fact that Gliscor run 216 EVs to outspeed Jolly Lucario so Colossoil is one point ahead of those. I will have to see if that set is effective later on.

 

[FlareBlitz]

Colossoil is like a combination of Swellow and Honchkrow. It makes a fantastic late game cleaner and can soften up all the common walls in OU. It has great synergy with DD Gyarados; Colossoil removes all the scarf Rotom and Latias that give Gyra trouble, is immune to electric and resitant to ground, and softens Skarm, Pert, Hippo and Celebi to the point where they can't successfully phaze or wall. And...can't count the number of times I've been Tricked or had a Latias recover because they expect Sucker Punch...

 

[hydrolphin]

I have been using the SubPunch set w/ Encore and I must say, it really is amazing, for the circumstances. It is hard to set up when everyone and their mother is running 3 Colossoil checks, but when you have the opportunity to Encore something, you can take out 3-4 pokemon easily.

As for teammates, I've found SpecLens Yanmega to be quite effective. It kills off Celebi, Machamp, and Colossoil with ease, and makes big dents into teams. With all the Grass Knots being thrown around, Yanmega will have plenty of opportunities to come in, which has always been its biggest problem. If you decide to go down that route, Colossoil can spin away SR, making Yanmega even more deadly.

Also noting that Guts/Flame Orb has been pretty underwhelming, but my Subpuncher did enjoy a WoW very much.

 

[Elevator Music]

taunt bounce gyarados works very well in combination with collosoil

rotom-a is one of the few pokemon who can even dare stand up to gyara, and collosoil basically takes that away

and if you're lucky you'll even buttfuck the rest of gyarados's "counters" with flinch or para (which pretty much happens every time against me lol)

 

[Nitzleplick]

I went on the CAP Server fully expecting to make a Guts + Flame Orb + Rock Polish Colossoil.. also no Stealth Rock, all in all I wasn't too impressed with him :/