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Conkeldurr

546.png

http://www.smogon.com/bw/pokemon/conkeldurr

QC Approved: Solace, Kinneas
GP Approved: Eraddd, NixHex

[Overview]

<p>Conkeldurr draws many comparisons to its fatter cousin Hariyama. Both are bulky, slow Fighting-types with access to Guts and priority, and both make excellent attackers. Conkeldurr's main draws over Hariyama are STAB Mach Punch and a bone-shattering Base 140 Attack stat. Conkeldurr does have problems against common Psychic-types however, and is very easy to wear down through recoil damage. Due to its low base Speed, Conkeldurr functions best on a Trick Room team, where its teammates can more effectively deal with fast Psychic-types such as Latios that can make life difficult for Conkeldurr. It can be difficult to use, but Conkeldurr's raw power will often make up for the effort needed to utilize it.</p>

[SET]
name: Status Abuser
move 1: Drain Punch / Hammer Arm
move 2: Rock Slide / Payback
move 3: Mach Punch
move 4: Detect
item: Flame Orb
ability: Guts
nature: Brave / Adamant
evs: 212 HP / 252 Atk / 44 Def
ivs: 0 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>Guts is a fantastic ability in VGC. With a status Orb equipped Conkeldurr gains an immunity to sleep and a permanent boost in Attack, a major advantage over Gems. Guts also negates the decrease in Attack burn causes, making Flame Orb the preferable item over Toxic Orb, as switching is often disadvantageous in VGC. This means that in the long run a burn will generally do less damage to Conkeldurr than severe poisoning. Drain Punch helps offset the burn recoil damage, and is also a decently powerful STAB move. Hammer Arm hits much harder though, and makes Conkeldurr "faster" under Trick Room. Rock Slide provides good coverage, especially on Flying-types. Payback is an option on a set being used outside of Trick Room, as it is Conkeldurr's strongest option against Latios. Mach Punch is a powerful priority move and is Conkeldurr's main niche. Detect is an excellent move in VGC, and its higher success rate when compared to Protect is very noticeable. It is also essential for guaranteeing that Conkeldurr has a turn for Flame Orb to activate.</p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

<p>The given EV spread reduces passive damage due to the HP number that the HP EVs give, meaning Conkeldurr has better survivability than it would with a simple 252 HP spread. Attack is of course maximized, and a 0 Speed IV helps Conkeldurr to move first under Trick Room. Facade is an extremely powerful move with good neutral coverage alongside Conkeldurr's chosen Fighting-type STAB move, only missing out on Ghost-types. Wide Guard is also an option over Detect, as many common moves in VGC, such as Surf and Blizzard, hit both Conkeldurr and its teammate.</p>

<p>As stated earlier, Trick Room support is highly recommended. Conkeldurr can support Psychic-type Trick Room users, such as Reuniclus, by handling the Dark-types that plague them. Dark-type Pokemon themselves, such as Bisharp or Weavile, pair well with Conkeldurr for their ability to deal with Ghost- and Psychic-type Pokemon. Tyranitar is a notable exception to this, as its Sand Stream ability further decreases Conkeldurr's longevity. On that note, Politoed and Ninetales can also be used alongside this set, as their respective weather-inducing abilities alleviate Conkeldurr from the passive damage of sand or hail. Conkeldurr works especially well with rain teams for its ability to threaten Ferrothorn, a common threat to the playstyle.</p>

[Other Options]

<p>Conkeldurr can use an Iron Ball and Fling to deal tremendous damage to Psychic- and Ghost-types, but this is often an impractical choice since Guts is one of Conkeldurr's biggest draws. Conkeldurr has considerable physical bulk, so Counter can be used to get the upper hand against physical attackers. Coba Berry is a gimmicky option alongside Counter, as with it Conkeldurr can survive an Acrobatics and KO back in retaliation. Brick Break isn't any stronger than Drain Punch, but its ability to remove the effects of Reflect and Light Screen can be very useful in certain situations. Earthquake is also a possible coverage move, but Rock Slide is generally superior in terms of the targets that it hits, and does not have the unwanted side-effect of hurting Conkeldurr's grounded teammates. Foresight takes away Ghost-type Pokemons' immunity to Fighting-type attacks, but VGC is generally too fast-paced for Conkeldurr to make any use of this.</p>

[Checks and Counters]

<p>Reuniclus is the biggest threat to this set, not being overly bothered by Conkeldurr's standard moves and OHKOing with Psychic. Psychic-types in general such as Latios and other fast special attackers also provide problems, since Conkeldurr does not have the special bulk required to take repeated special attacks, especially when considering burn damage. Ghost-types can often deal with Conkeldurr with little risk as well, assuming that they aren't as frail as Gengar. A Flight Gem-boosted Acrobatics from most Pokemon will OHKO or severely damage Conkeldurr, and burn damage is soon to finish it off almost immediately if Conkeldurr does survive. Intimidate diminishes Conkeldurr's strength and therefore its usefulness, meaning Conkeldurr can become dead weight, especially if the opponent brings out two Pokemon with Intimidate at the same time. Lastly, if Conkeldurr is burned and a damaging weather is in effect, then it will be losing 3/16th of its HP per turn, causing it to faint fairly quickly.</p>.
 
What Alaka is trying to say is that the move order should look like this:

move 1: Drain Punch (remove Superpower)
move 2: etc
move 3: etc
move 4: Detect (protect moves should always be last in the move order)

Not really something for the main set, but Conkeldurr does get access to Wide Guard. Conkeldurr also has access to Earthquake should you want it. Trick Room + Rock Slide works fantastic together.
 
hitmon___ family can give detect, drain punch, and mach punch (or wide guard, mach punch, and detect).

asdf ninjas bs
 
Can't 252 atk, 252 sp.def spread be used, to take less damage from burn.


EDIT: Im sorry let me elaborate more. With 252 atk, and 252 sp.def he is able to take more hits from the special side as he already got a nice def. Giving him bulk on both sides.(i believe he reaches max:116 sp.def like this). The burn damage would still do 12.5%, but being able to take sp.atks a little easier is always welcomed.
 
The burn damage is 12% of HP, it'll be doing as much whether you use 252 HP or 252 SpD, and the loss in physical bulk is noticeable.
 
I'm not sure if this is what soul_survivor meant, but removing 4 HP EVs will make Conk take less from both Burn and Sandstorm/Hail (meaning it will be as bulky as normal conks after 1 turn of damage and more bulky after), if I'm looking at it correctly.

EDIT: I had the wrong number for HP (320 and not 212); ignore this.

The EVs do seem to be inefficient, though, from what x-act defense tells me. not sure how to fix that. I think 224/24/20 is a bit more efficient.
 
Actually due to level 50 mechanics, you need to remove 8 EV at a time to efficiently reduce Conk's HP.

In theory:

At level 50, 31 HP IV and 252 HP EV, Conkeldurr has 212 HP, and burn/sandstorm damage would be 26/13 respectively (exact values are 26.5 and 13.25).

However if you reduce the EVs to 212, then total HP is 207, burn damage becomes 25.875 (rounded down to 25) and Sandstorm damage becomes 12.9375 (rounded down to 12). For a reduction of 5 max HP (2.4% HP), you reduce each round's damage from burn and sandstorm by 2 (5.13%).

That would leave you with 40 EV to spend either on Defense or Special Defense instead.

Right? Or is my math off?
 
Well, aside from Conkeldurr having 212 HP at max at level 50, I think it's correct.
So it does. Fixed.

The question is, is 5 max HP worth 2 sandstorm and burn damage? On the other hand 5 extra points in Defense or Special Defense could make a difference.
 
5 extra points in any stat does not make any significant difference unless it helps against a crucial KO. In Conkeludurr's case, it doesn't. I'm not saying to not use the EV spread, but the difference between that and 252 HP / 252 Atk is unnoticeable.
 
5 extra points in any stat does not make any significant difference unless it helps against a crucial KO. In Conkeludurr's case, it doesn't. I'm not saying to not use the EV spread, but the difference between that and 252 HP / 252 Atk is unnoticeable.
That's what I suspected.
If using Hammer Arm, Wide Guard then becomes an option since Conk can't have both Drain Punch and Wide Guard
Actually the only combination that is incompatible is Wide Guard + both Drain Punch and Mach Punch.

The otherwise legal combinations are Wide Guard + Drain Punch (Mienshao), Wide Guard + Mach Punch (Hitmontop), and Drain Punch + Mach Punch (Hitmonchan). And in all three cases you can also learn Detect if you want.

But yeah, Wide Guard + Mach Punch/Drain Punch + Hammer Arm + Filler.

While Conk has a lot of offensive options, the main set (Drain Punch + Mach Punch/Hammer Arm + Payback/Rock Slide + Detect) is probably his best.

Conk is the best user of Focus Punch + Fighting Gem due to its monstrously high Attack and Fighting STAB, but Rage Powder / Follow Me support is needed.
 
Helping Hand Hammer Arm is as powerful as Focus Punch, and Fighting Gem is kinda pointless when Flame Orb/Toxic Orb gives the same boost. In addition, Mach Punch is one of the main reasons to use Conkeldurr, and Hammer Arm and Drain Punch do just about the exact same thing, so there's very little reason to use both on one set.

Let's stop posting and let Tobes get up a skeleton at least before giving more suggestions, this is kind of ridiculous.
 
[Checks and Counters]
  • Psychics in general.
  • Anything with Flight Gem Acrobatics is a problem.
  • Special attackers give it some serious trouble; anything faster that isn't weak to Mach Punch will usually win.
  • Intimidate mons weaken it a bit.
  • Can be worn down through burn and weather.
Flying types in general (not just Flight Gem Acrobatics) are a problem (though most Flying Pokemon are 2HKO'd by Rock Slide). Toxicroak resists all of Conkeldurr's common moves, and can hit back with STAB Drain Punch (It must beware the surprise Earthquake however, and shares the same counters as Conkeldurr). Psychic types should use Psychic instead of Psyshock versus Conkeldurr for slightly more damage.
 
Psychic vs Psyshock is unnecessary to point out in this analysis since literally nothing commonly uses Psyshock over Psychic, and most Psyshocks 2HKO Conkeldurr anyway.
 
I think that this set has some potential:

move 1: Bulk Up
move 2: Rock Slide / Drain Punch
move 3: Mach Punch
move 4: Detect
item: Leftovers
ability: Sheer Power
nature: Brave / Adamant
evs: 212 HP / 252 Atk / 44 Def
ivs: 0 Spe

This set is not easily worn down by weather and adds longevity in a battle unlike the guts set. Once it get's one bulk up in, it's hard to stop.
 
The problem is that with Fighting as your only attacking type, you are completely shut down by Ghosts, and you're setting yourself up to be bait for things that resist Fighting. You absolutely need Rock Slide or Payback for a second attacking type to prevent that situation.
 
yea thats why conkeldurr's teammates should be pokemon who crush ghosts and psychics, so the dark type partners that tobes mentioned.

QC 1/2
 
546.png

http://www.smogon.com/bw/pokemon/conkeldurr

QC Approved: Solace, Kinneas

[Overview]

<p>Conkeldurr draws many comparisons to its fatter cousin Hariyama. Both are bulky, slow Fighting-types with access to Guts and priority, and both make excellent attackers. Conkeldurr's main draws over Hariyama areSTAB Mach Punch and a bone-shattering Base 140 Attack stat. Conkeldurr does have problems against common Psychic-types however, and is very easy to wear down through recoil damage. Due to its low base Speed, Conkeldurr functions best on a Trick Room team, where its teammates can more effectively deal with fast Psychic-types such as Latios that can make life difficult for Conkeldurr. It can be difficult to use, but Conkeldurr's raw power will often make up for the effort needed to utilize it.</p>

[SET]
name: Status Abuser
move 1: Drain Punch / Hammer Arm
move 2: Rock Slide / Payback
move 3: Mach Punch
move 4: Detect
item: Flame Orb
ability: Guts
nature: Brave / Adamant
evs: 212 HP / 252 Atk / 44 Def
ivs: 0 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>Guts is a fantastic ability in VGC. With a status Orb equipped, Conkeldurr gains an immunity to sleep and a permanent boost in Attack, a major advantage over Gems. Guts also negates the decrease in Attack that burn causes, making Flame Orb the preferable item over Toxic Orb, as switching is often disadvantageous in VGC. As the damage from Toxic increases as turns go by, Conkeldurr, in the long run, will have a greater longevity being burned as opposed to being poisoned. Drain Punch helps offset the burn recoil damage, and is also a decently powerful STAB move. Hammer Arm hits much harder though, and makes Conkeldurr "faster" under Trick Room. Rock Slide provides good coverage, especially on Flying-types. Payback is an option on a set being used outside of Trick Room, as it is Conkeldurr's strongest option against Latios. Mach Punch is a powerful priority move and is Conkeldurr's main niche. Detect is an excellent move in VGC, and its higher success rate when compared to Protect is very noticeable. It is also essential for guaranteeing that Conkeldurr has a turn for Flame Orb to activate.</p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

<p>The given EV spread reduces passive damage due to the HP number that the HP EVs give, meaning Conkeldurr has better survivability than it would with a simple 252 HP spread. Attack is of course maximized, and a 0 Speed IV helps Conkeldurr to move first under Trick Room. Facade is an extremely powerful move with good neutral coverage alongside Conkeldurr's chosen Fighting-type STAB move, only missing out on Ghost-types. Wide Guard is also an option over Detect, as many common moves in VGC, such as Surf and Blizzard, hit both Conkeldurr and its teammate.</p>

<p>As stated earlier, Trick Room support is highly recommended. Conkeldurr can support Psychic-type Trick Room users, such as Reuniclus, by handling the Dark-types that plague them. Dark-type Pokemon themselves, such as Bisharp or Weavile, pair well with Conkeldurr for their ability to deal with Ghost- and Psychic-type Pokemon. Tyranitar is a notable exception to this, as its Sand Stream ability further decreases Conkeldurr's longevity on the field. On that note, Politoed and Ninetales can also be used alongside this set, as their respective weather-inducing abilities alleviate Conkeldurr from the passive damage of sand or hail. Conkeldurr works especially well with rain teams for its ability to threaten Ferrothorn, a common threat to the playstyle.</p>

[Other Options]

<p>Conkeldurr can use an Iron Ball and Fling to deal tremendous damage to Psychic- and Ghost-types, but this is often an impractical choice since Guts is one of Conkeldurr's biggest draws. Conkeldurr has considerable physical bulk, so Counter can be used to get the upper hand against physical attackers. Coba Berry is a gimmicky option alongside Counter, as with it Conkeldurr can survive an Acrobatics and KO back in retaliation. Brick Break isn't any stronger than Drain Punch, but its ability to remove the effects of Reflect and Light Screen can be very useful in certain situations. Earthquake is also a possible coverage move, but Rock Slide is generally superior in terms of the targets that it hits, and does not have the unwanted side-effect of hurting Conkeldurr's grounded teammates. Foresight takes away Ghost-type Pokemons' immunity to Fighting-type attacks, but VGC is generally too fast-paced for Conkeldurr to make any use of this.</p>

[Checks and Counters]

<p>Reuniclus is the biggest threat to this set, not being overly bothered by Conkeldurr's standard moves and OHKOing with Psychic. Psychic-types in general such as Latios and other fast special attackers also provide problems, since Conkeldurr does not have the special bulk required to take repeated special attacks, especially when considering burn damage. Ghost-types can often deal with Conkeldurr with little risk as well, assuming that they aren't as frail as Gengar. A Flight Gem-boosted Acrobatics from most Pokemon will OHKO or severely damage Conkeldurr, and with its burn, Conkeldurr will surely fall soon. Intimidate diminishes Conkeldurr's strength and therefore its usefulness, meaning Conkeldurr can become dead weight, especially if the opponent brings out two Pokemon with Intimidate at the same time. Lastly, if Conkeldurr is burned and a damaging weather is in effect, then it will lose 3/16th of its HP per turn, causing it to faint fairly quickly.</p>.

contrib_gp.png

GP 1 / 2
 
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