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Counter-Sash Weavile?

Can Counter-Sash Weavile be used?

  • Total voters
    103
Thats how I thought of it exactly. Even after Counter (and with 1 HP left), if there is no Sandstorm or hail, or Stealth Rock, etc, you still have a Weavile. And with its amazing Speed and Attack, its still not to be messed with. It should look something like:

31/31/0/x/25+/31

0 Defense would be interesting.

I bred a Weavile for my thread with 0 Sp. Attack lol.
 
There are better countersashers. Weavile's defenses aren't absolutely terrible, and weavile also tends to draw out its own countersashers.
 
Why is anyone mentioning Alakazam, the only thing that does is draw out Tyranitar for predicted Tricks/Psychics, or Blissey for any other move, which would in fact, make Counter+Focus Sash useless on it.
 
Interesting, I didn't think of that, it makes sense.

But what I want people to notice is that Weavile can still be useful after Counter.
 
gay said:
Why is anyone mentioning Alakazam, the only thing that does is draw out Tyranitar for predicted Tricks/Psychics, or Blissey for any other move, which would in fact, make Counter+Focus Sash useless on it.
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Blissey with Choice Item is fun, T-tar loves to eat focus blast. Your arguement depends entirely on if the person with Zam can predict or not. Unlike Weavile with counter, zam with counter has 2 uses which makes it better.
 
Yoko Rains said:
Weavile can still have use after Counter though with no weather in play or any setup moves.
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Not really as much. Without a CB Weavile is wanting for power much of the time, since its attacks are pretty low in base power (ie Ice Punch only 112.5 power off 339 attack isn't all that much in the grand scheme of things), and without CB Pursuit is much less threatening. It's still fast, but it can't really revenge kill most moderately healthy opponents and lacks the power to do anything to big walls. It's also pretty hard to say "no weather" in this metagame where Hippowdon/Tyranitar run rampant and sandstorm-clearing isn't really a viable option much of the time unless you have a Rain/Hail team of your own.

Sorry =/
 
I don't think Pursuit is the greatest idea on such a set. Logically, if you get a surprise KO on something with Counter, which you will (Weavile's minimum HP with an IV of as low as 19 will OHKO Snorlax) why would the opponent switch in a Pokemon only to switch out out again. You want to be packing as much power as possible into the set for it to be as effective as possible.

I agree with the notion of many better Counter-sash users existing though. You claim that this set isn't useless, and you're right, but personally I think Weavile has better things to be doing.
 
Blue Kirby, since its not expected as much, it can be useful. Most people think Band or SD [Swords Dance]. Here was what I was thinking:

Infernape used Close Combat.
Its Super Effective!
Weavile held on with its Focus Sash!
Weavile used Counter!
X's Infernape fainted!

If theres no weather or setups, then you can still do damage after that via Ice Punch, Brick Break, Night Slash, Aerial Ace, etc.
 
The example you just listed can be done with anything that can learn Counter and have focus sash....

To Strengthen Kirby's point about Pursuit, nothing will run from a 1 hp weavile because after you counter something they will bring in a counter to weavile and it would be dead then. Most teams use spikes/SR anyways so once you switch, your weavile is a good as dead.

Also without CB, weavile's attacks are weak. BB won't even do 50% on standard blissey and pursuit won't ohko gengar so there's no reason to switch unless they think you have night slash. If they decide to stay in, your weavile is dead.
 
Surprisingly enough, I'm actually familiar with how the move Counter is used, but thanks for reiterating that for me. Like I said, the set has its merits, but Weavile has better things to be doing.

It comes down to personal preference, of course, but I'd honestly prefer something like a Focus Sash Swords Dance if you were really that way inclined.
 
I wish Shoddy would work for me. I'd like to give this set a shot so I can give accurate feedback whether positive or negative.

And how about this...it'd be interesting, though it'd only give Weavile two attacking moves:

X sent out Weavile!
Y sent out Dugtrio!

Since you can predict Dugtrio will most likely switch out..

X's Weavile used Swords Dance!
Y withdrew Dugtrio!
Y sent out Metagross!
Y's Metagross used Meteor Mash!
X's Weavile held on with it's Focus Sash!
X's Weavile used Counter!
Y's Metagross fainted!

Though it'd only have one HP, it'd still pack a punch with a Swords Dance. Mastadi recommended this, I think that'd be interesting, though it'd only give Weavile two real attacking moves.

You'd SD if you can predict you're opponent will switch out.
 
Mix pokemon, sandstorm/hail, stealth rock/spikes, first-hit moves (Mach Punch especially), and obviously, special sweepers all take this down, so this may be useful, but I'd say it's too risky.
 
This is a Good Idea, but wouldnt you want most of your IV's in Def and HP? or HP and Spd?

And if possibly, Mach Punch on Weavile, incase the counter hit doesnt kill.
 
It's a set with not too much surprise considering how prevalent counter-sash-vile is in the wifi tower. The buggers are all over
 
Yoko Rains said:
Thats how I thought of it exactly. Even after Counter (and with 1 HP left), if there is no Sandstorm or hail, or Stealth Rock, etc, you still have a Weavile. And with its amazing Speed and Attack, its still not to be messed with. It should look something like:

31/31/0/x/25+/31

0 Defense would be interesting.

I bred a Weavile for my thread with 0 Sp. Attack lol.
Click to expand...

Hail doesn't affect Weavile....
 
@ Ooka, my bad. What I meant was any outside damage. Weather, Stealth Rock, Spikes, and status.

@ forbidden, way to advertise for yours lol =D
 
forbidden said:
Blissey with Choice Item is fun, T-tar loves to eat focus blast. Your arguement depends entirely on if the person with Zam can predict or not. Unlike Weavile with counter, zam with counter has 2 uses which makes it better.
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Okay, then if it's Tricking Choices, that clearly means it has no Focus Sash, therefore is totally 100% removed from this topic at all. So what are you trying to say now..? That a Trick Alakazam is better than a Counter-Focus Sash Weavile..?
 
Possibly, but you'd have to be real careful. Granted, you have the element of surprise since you ram them with Counter as opposed to getting in a SD or attack, but then you're left for dead to a priority move, SS, Hail, or anything of the like.
 
No, imo it doesn't work, except for rare cases where they use Cscarf Heracross as starter or else. Weavile is too fragile and using Counter means not having another Attack for sweeping, like Pursuit/ Swords Dance/ Brick Break which can be very useful. There is also the Stealth Rock problem, you can't carry a Rapid Spinner just to help Weavile at doing this trick, it's nonsense and noobish, you lose too many turns. Also 40% of the starters are Special so Counter doesn't work and most of guys bring in their physical wall to WoW, Stealth Rock and Whirlwind you.
 
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