D/P Meta Game: 1 Year Later Disscusion

Ambitions

EDIT: The point of this is to see who has benefited/flopped over the course of the year.

EDIT: The word ADVANCE (as in last gen) has now place in this discussion!

SO its been nearly one whole year since D/P was released in the US, and things sure have changed a bunch since last April. Deoxys E and Wob are Limbo, Weavile isn't everyones lead anymore, and every single poke on a team isn't holding a Life Orb now a days. But anywho, now that the Smogon Community has had a whole year to look at, play, and adapt to the D/P Meta Game,


Which Pokemon do you think have benefited the most / are the best new additions in D/P over the course of the year?
And which Pokemon do you think straight up lucked out over the course this year?




THE RESULTS ARE IN!

After the first 100 posts I tallied up who thought gained the most and who thought lost the most over this past year.....and the winners are...


PROPS! :happybrain:
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1.Lucario/Garchomp

Who's surprised? Really. Well I kind of am. Has the Garchomp stratagem really changed since the beginning of D/P? Scarf it, CB it, fuck shit up is the way this poke has rolled since I can remember.

Mirza said:
No one expected it to be argued for ubers a year later, nor did they think it could destroy a metagame with less than 10 moves.
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IggyBot said:
Garchomp went from really hyped, to mediocre, to the most dominant attacking force in all of OU. So dominant in fact, there have been arguements to make it uber. Sand Veil is a trait that is arguably one of the best, forcing 100% accurate attacks to drop down to Stone Edge accuracy in the sand. Not to mention Garchomp has the ability to 2HKO literally everything in OU. Garchomp does it all, with just a few attacks.
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Some great points....I say ban the fucker to ubers, not like its relevant or anything.

Now for Lucario, we all saw this coming. The SD set basically owns the shit out of most of the OU tier. Luke also is one of the few special sweepers that can 2HKO your standard Blissy. It packs a handful of resistances, the element of surprise, and it looks cool.

IggyBot said:
Many people may be saying "what the fuck, SD Life Orb is where it's at!", but really, look at Specs Lucario again. All the SD Life Orb rage in the last 4 months has really opened the metagame up for Specs Lucario domination. All of the things sent in to beat SD Lucario are beaten by specs. Actually, everything sent in to beat Specs Lucario is beaten by Specs, so yeah.....
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These speak for them selves, brought to you from the Smogon Strategy Dex.
Close Combat vs Max HP/Def Skarmory 84.43% - 99.70%
Close Combat vs Max HP/Def Bronzong: 95.27% - 112.13%
Close Combat vs Max HP/Def Hippowdon: 75.71% - 89.29%
Close Combat vs Max HP/Def Forretress: 79.66% - 93.79%
Close Combat vs Max HP/Def Donphan: 82.03% - 96.88


2. Celebi/Tyranitar/Heatran
3. Gengar
4. Mamoswine
5. Tentacrul



FLOPS:pirate:
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1. Electivire

Stright up got replaced by Lucario and Garchop since the begining. Lack of SD just screwed it over. This thing still hits 14 types super effective and needs to be feared, just not so much. I am so tiered of writing, skate time.

2. Rhyperior
3. Tauros
4. Claydol/Cresslia/Azelf
5. Porygon-z/Regice

So what do you think of this list? Surprised? Anyone you think this list is missing, or doesn't belong? Discuss. Go!
 
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Adamant
212 HP/16 attack/180 defense/100 speed
Waterfall
Return
DD
Taunt

IMO,Gyara is one of the brighter stars in this metagame with the ability to counter several common threats,Intimidate,and an EQ immunity,it's just gotten better this gen,IMO
 
Benefited:

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Lucario: Life Orb
Adamant
EVS: 252 ATK / 252 Spe / 4 HP
-Bullet Punch / Crunch
-Extremespeed
-Swords Dance
-Close Combat

Nothing in the world of pokemon could have benefited from D/P then Lucario. The rise of stall teams made him more used. Then being able to beat azelf, Tar, Nape and others with a SD under his belt and extremespeed shut down offenses. Soon People realized his decent defensive spread and his shitload of resistances. And new sets were made for him like the more popular then ever CM set or the specslucario that is getting more popular. The amount of switch ins make this thing incredible. Now 1/3-1/2 of teams run lucario because he can almost guarentee ohkos on so many pokemon.

Biggest Flop:

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Tauros

Poor Poor Tauros. Once a beast in Adv you are now so uncommon it is not even funny. Garchomp, Tar, and other pokemon new or with improvements just threw tauros to the curve. He got nothing new except anger point which is not worth it and should be intimidate. Now most physical sweepers outshine tauros or do it better or they are mixed like infernape.
 
Salamence has improved a lot with the addition of Choice Specs. It can be very easy to surprise your foe when they don't know which Choice item you're holding.

As for the Pokemon becoming worse, Regice would have to be my choice. I remember when Regice was used about as much as Blissey. But, because of the increase in offense in D/P, it doesn't do a great job as a wall anymore.
 
Yeah I was border line on giving Tauros the biggest flop or not. Tauros can still get some surprise kills with a CB on it though, and its ability is fucking sweet. Def took one hell of a flop though.

Gyara took one bad blow this gen, being Stealth Rocks. However, its used as a lead 80% of the time, nullifying SR damage. I'd still hold Garchomp over it thought when it comes to sweeping ability's.
 
I think that Tentacruel got a huge boost in DP.
don't know why, but it went from UU to OU within the generation jump. Weavile took sneasel from nu to ou, also.

Can't say much about the biggest flop... though tauros DID get pretty screwed
 
cool idea

benefitted:
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Bold
252 HP/ 176 or 216 def / 36 speed, whatever else
~Grass Knot
~Recover
~Twave/Recover/U-Turn/
~Twave/Recover/U-Turn/

remember when everyone said that yanmega/weavile/tar/hera pretty much spelled death for celebi?
lol.


honorable mentions apart from those mentioned above:
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Flopped:


flopped:
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doesn't pack the necessary offense
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despite being the "best" spinner on paper it can't really wall shit.
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cant do shit =\
 
Yeah Chomp and Azelf would be better picks then gyarados. My top 5 for both actually were

lucario
garchomp
azelf
mamoswine/infernape
gengar

flops:

tauros
claydol
moltres
regice
ninjask

Gorm Umbreon can at least wish and cursepass for some use. he is pretty much useless now but he does somewhat ok. tauros is just outshined by everything else though at what it does.
 
if anything moltres has gained status 1 year later thanks to sarenji's set.

regice though =\\\\\\\\
 
honorable mentions apart from those mentioned above:
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The only reason I didn't make this my choice is because all it got was a sick new ability. But I'll have you know I typed out a whole analysis for it, then went back and changed my mind hahaha.
 
I think SR killed it from last gen though. It was actually somewhat very popular sometimes during adv. Then usage went down and then was roller coaster like. However the fact it can almost never switch in thanks to stealth rock is not helping it.

But yes we both can agree Regice is X_X
 
Benefitted:
Togekiss
Huge step up from Togetic. Serene Grace and Air Slash coupled with Thunder Wave is annoying.

Flopped:
Shedinja
With the rise of Sandstorm and Hail teams, increased use of Spikes and the addition of Stealth Rock, it's pretty much pointless to run this
 
Benefited:
Mamoswine
Yache Berry Garchomp
Lucario's epic set
Heatran


Flopped:
Tangrowth
Rhyperior
Electivire
Weezing
Breloom - I honestly think so.


A few others are on the edge, but not worth posting.
 
Benefited/New Additions:
Tyranitar (sandstorm's Special Defense boost, Stone Edge, physical Crunch, physical Pursuit)
Salamence (Draco Meteor is extremely good for it)
CHOMP, CHOMP, CHOMPCHOMPCHOMPCHOMP, CHOMPCHOMP, CHOMPCHOMPCHOMP, CHOMPCHOMPCHOMP, CHOMP, CHOMP

Flops:
Claydol, Tauros, RHYINFERIOR, basically stuff people have said
 
Pokerade said:
Flopped:
Breloom - I honestly think so.
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Why? Breloom didn't seem to lose anything important from Adv to DP (physical HP Fighting?), but it gained that sexy Poison Heal recovery, Seed Bomb, and Stone Edge.

As for my response to the thread, I would say that the biggest fall would be Rhyperior.
 
I actually think Alakazam was a huge flop.

No more special based elemental punches, and he is no longer the top tier OU I assume he was (I did not play competitively in ADV.)
 
Tyranitar/Garchomp most definitely affected the metagame the most. As for Benefiting, I'd say Tyranitar by far was the most beneficial to the metagame. All Garchomp has created is even more centralization, and since the term "benefit" refers to making better, the metagame has benefited from Tyranitar more. With Tyranitar's improvements and Rock Type's boost in sand, Tyranitar made some Pokémon who were previously almost unusable.. usable. (Example: Cradily.)

And now I just realized the question was which Pokémon benefited from the metagame the most. Still TTar/Garchomp. Tyranitar got all sorts of new tricks, and Garchomp... I won't start ranting as I don't want this great topic to go off course.


As for who was hurt the most, it was definitely Tauros. Poor guy. T_T The most overhyped new addition was probably Electivire, who proved to be rather lackluster in D/P.
 
Garchomp is definatly the most improved it only uses 10 moves or so and is one of the most veristile pokes. Mew improved because of the addition of nasty plot to its movepool. Breloom gained fame with poison heal. the least improved would be tarous he just stinks now.
 
Mike Rotch said:
Why? Breloom didn't seem to lose anything important from Adv to DP (physical HP Fighting?), but it gained that sexy Poison Heal recovery, Seed Bomb, and Stone Edge.

As for my response to the thread, I would say that the biggest fall would be Rhyperior.
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I'm talking about how Breloom use to run all over the place. Now, there are so many Pokemon that just stop it cold. I'm not talking about abilities and moves. Just the general usage and effectiveness.
 
i thought this thread was about most improved over the span of the year, not most improved adv--> dp which has been done to death.
 
Everstone said:
Flopped:
Shedinja
With the rise of Sandstorm and Hail teams, increased use of Spikes and the addition of Stealth Rock, it's pretty much pointless to run this
Click to expand...

Ehh, that's really not that true. Gaining an new STAB priority move to work with Swords Dance and compensating for his terrible speed. Will-O-Wisp is a huge help, because he can come quite easily if you have a weather changer/spinner, and with that support, he's extremely annoying. A better STAB Bug move is nice with X-Scissor. Most importantly though, is the addition of Focus Sash, which basically gives Shedinja an extra life, which is just plain awesome. You just have to make sure you bring him out later in the game, when you think you've destroyed the opponent's Shedinja killers.

He's not that bad in OU, but ubers is where he truly shines. If you want to see the true potential of Shedinja, then use him in ubers, where Stealth Rock/Spikes/Toxic Spikes/Sandstorm/Hail are pretty much non-existant (compared to OU), especially seeing as the only Spikers/Stealth Rockers used in ubers very much are Forretress and Deoxys-D. Shedinja gained so many new weapons to bust many of the uber pokemon up, while very few of them gained options to beat him, unless they use Toxic.
 
Just about every dark type won massively in DP with all the old dark moves going physcal and those who were fine with special dark moves don't even really feel the effects with dark pulse being the same BP of the old special crunch

for who suffered its Flareon it just gets more left behind every generation :( i wonder if if GF forgot about this pokemon at times
 
Tentacruel went from UU to OU. That's enough of a boost for me.

I think people finally realize Shaymin's potential as well.
 
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