• Check out the relaunch of our general collection, with classic designs and new ones by our very own Pissog!

DD Lapras

Turismo2029

LAPRAS @ Leftovers/Shell Bell/Lum Berry*
Shell Armour
ABILITY: Jolly (+ spd, - sp.atk)
EVs: 124 HP / 44 Atk / 56 Def / 228 Spd / 56 SDef

- Dragon Dance
- Return
- Waterfall
- Ice Shard/Rest*

Dragon Dance for buffing up, Return and Waterfall covers all pokemon besides Empoleon/Dialga/Shedinja/Giratina, Ice Shard is for beating down Salamence/Dragonite/Garchomp before they can say squat.

*Lum Berry and Rest go together, if you pick Rest, use a Lum Berry, then you can Dragon Dance up, Rest when you need to, you'll wake straight up and be ready to start sweepin' assuming you were able to get in some DD's before you rested.

For the EV's, only important ones are:
124HP bring his HP to 432 which is for more leftovers health, and even with the Lum Berry, the health will still be handy.
228SPD bring his speed to 351 after a single Dragon Dance, meaning he can outspeed the base 110 pokes who have a speed enhancing nature and max speed IV/EV's, these pokemon include Gengar, Tauros, Lugia, Froslass, Espeon, Lati@s and Jumpluff but I will also note that you will outspeed Infernape aswell (his base speed is 108), after a Dragon Dance of course.

The defence and special defence EV's are just so his defence reaches 210, and his special defence reaches 240. I'm not sure what this means it'll survive, I just thought I'd put some in his defences rather than more in his HP.

Comments/thoughts? I think it'd work quite well, maybe not as a lead but a mid-late game sweeper.
 
With 44Atk EVs and no DD, it still doesn't 2HKO Garchomp with Ice Shard, unless Garchomp is using Life Orb. It will need more than that
 
Well is Garchomp even going to OHKO it?

Either way, the Lum Berry version will no doubt beat Garchomp - DD until you'll die next turn, Rest - Lum wakes you, sweepin'.

I think it's a perfectly viable set, and Ice Shard is an integral part of it since the other moves won't OHKO the dragons when you need them to (straight away >_>).

Yeah, I saw the Lapras set after I made this, either way I honestly believe I put more effort into this set, but whatever the admins/mods do is up to them.
 
56 Defs isn't going to save you from choice scarf garchomps, which outspeeds you even after 1 DD (which is tough to get in already) and is likely to OHKO you with outrage/stone edge.

Yes, garchomp can easily OHKO lapras. No calcs, but an SE stone edge from 130 base attack against 80 defs doesn't look promising for lapras. I think even an outrage OHKO's.
 
Turismo2029 said:
Well is Garchomp even going to OHKO it?

I think it's a perfectly viable set, and Ice Shard is an integral part of it since the other moves won't OHKO the dragons when you need them to (straight away >_>).
.
Click to expand...

No, but Garchomp will 2HKO while Lapras can't 2HKO it first.

And I know Ice Shard is important, I was just saying that you would need more Atk EVs. I didn't say Ice Shard shouldnt be there
 
Oh dear...

First of all, while I can appreciate that you are trying to hit those magic speed numbers by giving it a speed nature and considerable amounts of speed EVs, you are really doing more to hamper its overall ability. Lapras has poor speed and only mediocre attack. By going that far out of your way to get that speed number, you've left it at 217 attack. That gives it only 326 after one DD and 434 after two. Those are not the numbers you want to see on something that is trying to sweep. For comparison's sake, the EV spread I proposed gives Lapras 432 after just ONE Dragon Dance, compared to the two it needs for yours. Obviously this huge gap widens the more boosts you get under your belt.

Shell Armor is vastly inferior to Water Absorb as a trait. Something that only works 1/16 times only on attacking turns is not as valuable as the constant ability to recover HP switching into water attacks.

Most importantly though, this thread has deteriorated into a fear of Garchomp thread. Using Ice Shard on a DD'er is pretty pointless, as the main element of the attack is negated by the fact you have already raised your speed. Assuming you have already used a DD or two, the speed you have earned makes Ice Shard's priority modifier useless, and you're simply using a base 40 move. Not so good. And without even bothering to run damage calcs on my sets Waterfall vs. your Ice Shard, I ask you this: who the hell is going to switch a dragon in on Lapras anyway? Garchomp and company just LOVE running in on STAB Ice Beams, which surely more than 50% of Lapras' will carry, enough to ensure they never take that chance.
 
Yeah, but you're guy gets outsped and owned by those base 110 pokemon even after he's DD'd once.

I chose Ice Shard since DD powers it up, it doesn't power up Ice Beam since Ice Beam is a special attack.

You obviously don't use Ice Shard on everything just the things that have a 4x weakness to it, Waterfall and Return beat down everything else.
 
Everything that's 4x weak to Ice will die to Ice Beam more easily than Ice Shard, Dragon Dance or not. The only Pokemon that reaches 350 Speed that poses a real threat to Lapras is Gengar, who still fails to OHKO a 0 HP/Special Defense Lapras with a Timid Choice Specs Thunderbolt. Not to mention that with barely any Attack Lapras will not come close to a OHKO on Gengar, whereas 432 Attack stands a good chance to OHKO.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top