Doubles Teambuilding Workshop Sessions - (SEE POST 139)

Electrolyte

Wouldn't Wanna Know
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Posting to update:

The official date for the next teambuilding session will be on TUESDAY, JUNE 24th, at 9:30 PM GMT -4 (8:30 GMT -5.)

PinoyPwnage will be hosting most of it, and I will be able to stay for the first half hour or so to kick things into gear. If you can, please try to attend :)

For now, I'll keep the voting up until that day (even though the winner is pretty obvious at this point)
 
Doubles Teambuilding Workshop Session #2 Summary
Hey, everyone! This is a post to summarize the results of the second Doubles Teambuilding Workshop we had on PS Tuesday night.

We ended up voting for Pocket's Choice Band Kyurem-B, which was the basis of the team.



Kyurem-Black @ Choice Band
Ability: Teravolt
EVs: 200 HP / 252 Atk / 56 Spd
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Claw
- Fusion Bolt
- Outrage
- Ice Beam

Venusaur @ Life Orb
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 180 HP / 252 SAtk / 76 Spd
Modest Nature
- Giga Drain
- Sludge Bomb
- Sleep Powder
- Protect

Terrakion @ Life Orb
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 SDef
Jolly Nature
- Close Combat
- Rock Slide
- Quick Guard
- Protect

Tornadus (M)
Ability: Defiant
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 HP
Jolly Nature
- Tailwind
- Acrobatics
- Superpower
- Protect

Charizard @ Charizardite Y
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 HP
Timid Nature
- Overheat
- Heat Wave
- Solar Beam
- Protect

Landorus-Therian (M) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 212 Spd / 252 Atk / 44 HP
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- U-turn
- Rock Slide
- Stone Edge



Looking at Kyurem-B, we saw that he had noticeable a Fairy-type weakness, leading us to originally choose Aegislash as his partner-in-crime. Aegislash could assist Kyurem-B in taking out those pesky Fairy-types with its STAB Flash Cannon and could also nullify an incoming Pixilate Hyper Voice from Mega-Gardevoir and Sylveon with Wide Guard.



We then proceeded to use Terrakion as the third Pokemon due to the fact he could hit hard with his dual STABs in Rock Slide and Close Combat; he was great for taking care of threats such as Talonflame, Thundurus, Heatran, Tyranitar, and Mega Charizard Y.



The next choice was a little unorthodox, but we decided to utilize Defiant Tornadus to punish Intimidaters and Icy Wind users. He took care of the team's Fighting-type weakness with the ability to resist with his Flying typing, while dealing a significant amount of damage against those Fighting-types with STAB Acrobatics. Not only that, he provided speed control with Tailwind to enable Kyurem-B and Terrakion to pull off a potential sweep late in the game.



After that, we looked over the team and saw that we had three physical attackers and only one special attacker, leading us to pick Charizard Y as our Mega Pokemon. He took care of Kyurem-B's and Terrakion's Steel-type weakness with his STAB Overheat or Heat Wave and he was a great check against Water-types such as Rotom-W with Sun + Solarbeam. I'd also like to note a STAB Overheat from Timid Mega Charizard Y in Sun OHKOs 4 HP / 0 SpD Mega Kangaskhan 100% of the time, which was helpful in several situations.



Finally, we chose Landorus-Therian as the sixth member for added coverage against Fire-types (notably Heatran), Rock-types which threatened Charizard, and Flying-types. We gave him a Scarf to outspeed the majority of the Pokemon in the Smogon Doubles metagame and he could potentially flinch the opponent with a fast Rock Slide.



We tested this team among ourselves, and we found that Aegislash didn't really possess great synergy with the other members of the team. Thus, we replaced Aegislash with Venusaur; he was a great partner with Mega Charizard Y as he could utilize his Chlorophyll ability and put threats to sleep with a fast Sleep Powder. Venusaur provided this team with extra coverage against Water-types and coverage against Fairy-types with STAB Giga Drain and Sludge Bomb. He could also switch into an incoming Water, Fairy, Fighting, or Steel-type attack if needed. Plus, the Chlorosaur combo allowed to handle Trick Room teams surprisingly well, with Charizard hitting hard with his STAB Fire-type moves and Venusaur putting TR teams to sleep.


I tested this team myself on the ladder, and I'm pleased to say that I did fairly well! I went 20-3 and I managed to defeat a few players who were pretty high on the ladder. I also saved various replays of notable battles I found using this team.

workshop.PNG


Replays

vs. rdmd - Trick Room Team (won 4-1)
vs. Carlucci - Sun Team (won 4-0)
vs. flynn10 - Semi-Trick Room Team (won 2-0)
vs. PhalangePants - Goodstuffs Team (won 2-0)
vs. marichal - Goodstuffs Team (won 5-0)
vs. champetero Game 1 - Semi-Perish Trap (lost 0-3)
vs. champetero Game 2 - Semi-Perish Trap (won 4-0)
vs. champetero Game 3 - Semi-Perish Trap (won 2-0)


What We Focused On:
  • How to construct a team
  • Threats in the Smogon Doubles metagame and how to handle them
  • Pokemon which are usable and not usable in Doubles
  • Team synergy
  • Speed Control - Tailwind

There was a pretty good showing concerning the number of people who attended the workshop, but unfortunately there were many others didn't show up even though they said they would be able to attend. We still managed to have an active and efficient discussion, although I'd like to see more people participating in the next Doubles Teambuilding Workshop. Anyway, thanks to everyone who showed up and come back next time!

If would you like to provide feedback or rate the team, feel free to comment below with your suggestions.
 
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I guess I'll rate the team. But before I do, gotta say that you did an awesome job running this Pinoy Pwnage, especially for picking up the project last minute. This RMT & follow-up is a great idea that I hope is incorporated into future commmunity teambuilding projects.
Okay now for the rate. Sorry Gen 5 lovers but Tornadus has gotta go. It gives the team its 3rd Ice weakness without a resist, and the coverage it offers is pretty sparce. Also the team is pretty Trick Room weak, especially after replacing aegislash. All in all, it seems obvious that you replace Tornadus for Bisharp, who offers a check to Trick Room, and valuable resists to rock, dragon, psychic, flying, and ice. 4 of which you have weaknesses to but no resists.

standard af (Bisharp) @ Life Orb or Focus Sash
Ability: Defiant
EVs: 32 HP / 252 Atk / 224 Spd
Adamant Nature
- Knock Off
- Iron Head
- Sucker Punch
- Protect

Typing Synergy with Tornadus (fairy is omitted but you're good on fairy coverage obv)
teamwtorn.PNG


Typing synergy with Bisharp (oh look a resist for every type :3)
bisharp.PNG
 
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finally

how can you swallow so much sleep?
is a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
hihi frens
Now we will be revising the team.
kyle's bisharp would be a prime example of how to change the team. just make little edits and provide reasoning (dosent have to be as long as kyles)
feel free to make edits of edits, so like start off from kyles base (torn-->bisharp) and go from there
 

Pocket

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If you have a Charizard Y and Venusaur (and Kyurem-Band) you want a solid answer to Heatran. Charizard Y itself can be a solid check to Heatran if it carries Focus Blast, so I would consider Focus Blast > SolarBeam. Blasting Steel-types is essential for spamming Cube's STAB move, and Heatran is one of such targets. Even from the replays, you see this team struggling a lot with Heatran.

I'd consider Rock Slide > Ice Beam on Kyurem-B, because Chandelure is another annoying Pokemon to face for a team that is heavily leaning towards Sun. With Focus Blast > SolarBeam, Flash Fire Chandelure is totally immune to Charizard Y, and Chandelure resists Venusaur's STAB moves and can block Sleep Powder with a Substitute. I guess its other attacks can also take out Chandelure, but Rock Slide lets Kyurem-B bypass potential Follow Me or Rage Powder support that may accompany the elusive ghost.

Replacing Tornadus for BIsharp means that Landorus-T would even have less of an opportunity to spam its main move EQ. I would personally want to see a Pokemon with Levitate or a Flying-type to replace Tornadus. Cresselia is a Pokemon that comes to mind. Although it cannot offensively threaten Trick Room summoners like Bisharp, it can easily reverse it with a Trick Room of its own. We lose Defiant support, but seeing how we can hit hard from the special spectrum with Charizard Y and LO Venusaur, I hardly find this a problem. Kyurem-Band still hits hard after an Intimidate attack drop anyways, easily scoring a 2HKO on most Landorus-T with a -1 CB Dragon Claw (-1 CB Outrage does 80+% lol).

This team doesn't really need more offensive punch from BIsharp imo. What it needs is some defensive backbone, which currently only consists of Landorus-T (and Kyurem-B, which we would like to keep it healthy). Cresselia accomplishes this imo.
 
Wait why would you use focus blast when you can use HP ground? While a lot of heatran use shuca berry it's still better to get a 2HKO then miss with Focus blast plus you hit chandelure with HP ground
 

Ununhexium

Orange Vanilla Coke
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I personally like tornadus where it is. It makes Landorus' STAB move much more spammable and the tailwind can really come in handy sometimes, something bisharp can't provide. One problem that I noticed with this team were opposing venusaur because then I have to play around it and either play with protect until I can KO with heat wave or annoy it until I can set up tailwind. Though kyu-b and tornadus can handle it to an extent, sleep powder is really annoying.

Excuse me if I have no idea what I'm talking about as I am new to doubles.
 

finally

how can you swallow so much sleep?
is a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
It seems like there is a general movement to swap tornadus for bisharp. (i saw pwne runnin around with a bisharp>torn)
i saw your post unun, but im p sure more people want bisharp (riot if im wrong). will be posting final team version soon unless others have some new ideas :^)
 

Stratos

Banned deucer.
.buzzkill but im really not a fan of pockets two first suggestions. For one, Zard absolutely needs solarbeam, because grass perfectly covers fire defensively (hits water, rock, & ground types SE) and more importantly is reliable. A focus blast miss could fuck u in the ass. If anything, we should be dropping Overheat for Focus Blast, though I'm not sold on that one either; the only things Focus Blast really hits are ttar (a shitty mon and one that is manhandled by most of the team) and heatran. Heatran is shrekt by terrakion and landorus and 2hkoed by bisharp and cube; i know this isnt perfect but its hardly terrible either. frankly theres no logic behind rock slide at all when 252+ Atk Choice Band Teravolt Kyurem-B Dragon Claw vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Chandelure: 288-339 (110.3 - 129.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO so uh yeah, id rather be able to kill lando-t which buttfucks a lot of our team.

as for cress > tornadus, this i could get behind i guess; though it leaves us without a solid dragon killer, it provides icy wind and helping hand support which turn zard and cube from very strong to literal buttrape in the anus hole. however, if we were to do this we may want to consider making further changes to the team so we aren't so dragon-weak (especially latios)
 

finally

how can you swallow so much sleep?
is a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
And don't forget about Cresselia loves. A strong suggestion and generally good support mon for the hyper/medium-hyper offensive team
Pocket:
Replacing Tornadus for BIsharp means that Landorus-T would even have less of an opportunity to spam its main move EQ. I would personally want to see a Pokemon with Levitate or a Flying-type to replace Tornadus. Cresselia is a Pokemon that comes to mind. Although it cannot offensively threaten Trick Room summoners like Bisharp, it can easily reverse it with a Trick Room of its own. We lose Defiant support, but seeing how we can hit hard from the special spectrum with Charizard Y and LO Venusaur, I hardly find this a problem. Kyurem-Band still hits hard after an Intimidate attack drop anyways, easily scoring a 2HKO on most Landorus-T with a -1 CB Dragon Claw (-1 CB Outrage does 80+% lol).

i got the vibe that the team really liked having a defiant fighting resist that flew around for lando to spam eqs (at least thats what i think pinoy et company were aiming for). post ideas here about what you think that slot should do? defiant support? bulkier wall like cress that still has levitate for lando eq spam?
right now im thinking an okay set for cresselia would be a more defensive build with psychic, icy wind, helping hand, trick room that leaned towards the specially defensive side because we already have landot's intimidate.
feel free to post your own cress sets and evs
 

finally

how can you swallow so much sleep?
is a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
Alrighty, thanks for participating in the second doubles teambuilding workshop session everybody!
Our final product will keep tornadus because of its use as a defiant flying type (ground immunity and fighting resist)
The final team is what Pinoy's original:

Kyurem-Black @ Choice Band
Ability: Teravolt
EVs: 200 HP / 252 Atk / 56 Spd
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Claw
- Fusion Bolt
- Outrage
- Ice Beam

Venusaur @ Life Orb
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 180 HP / 252 SAtk / 76 Spd
Modest Nature
- Giga Drain
- Sludge Bomb
- Sleep Powder
- Protect

Terrakion @ Life Orb
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 SDef
Jolly Nature
- Close Combat
- Rock Slide
- Quick Guard
- Protect

Tornadus (M)
Ability: Defiant
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 HP
Jolly Nature
- Tailwind
- Acrobatics
- Superpower
- Protect

Charizard @ Charizardite Y
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 HP
Timid Nature
- Overheat
- Heat Wave
- Solar Beam
- Protect

Landorus-Therian (M) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 212 Spd / 252 Atk / 44 HP
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- U-turn
- Rock Slide
- Stone Edge

a special s/o to Pinoy Pwnage for hosting
KyleCole for being a bae
Pwnemon and Pocket for commenting (and champetero and Ununhexium )
and the community who made this team

stay tuned for the next session sometime eventually
 

BLOOD TOTEM

braine damaged
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Looks like I'm set to host...

Doubles Teambuilding Workshop Session #3
Now is the time to post set submissions for what we want to build around, an official time and date for when it will be hosted will be posted closer to the time =]

Set submissions don't have to be fully detailed (see bellow) but they can be if you wish =]

btw I wasted post 500 on this so you figs better be appreciative
 
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Anty

let's drop
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Mega Lucario. Its surprisingly good when you try it

E: Probably a sweeper set, nasty plot or swords dance

Lucario @ Lucarionite
Ability: Inner Focus
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Close Combat
- Bullet Punch
- Protect

Lucario @ Lucarionite
Ability: Inner Focus
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Nasty Plot
- Vacuum Wave
- Protect
- Flash Cannon

In both of them i chose the stabs as coverage as with adaptability they become as strong as super effective coverage, they only majour things you loose out on neutral coverage is thundi, aegislash and sirskit charizard. This will require team support to take out counters, especcially aegi and talon, and also to ware down the opp's team

e: Nollans set is better and more reliable. ITs rly hard to set up with this thing "/
 
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Pocket

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Heart Swap Tail Glow Manaphy


Manaphy @ Focus Sash / Sitrus Berry (open to changes)
Ability: Hydration
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe (open to changes)
Timid Nature (open to changes)
- Tail Glow
- Heart Swap
- Scald
- Protect

This is a set I recently wanted to try out, but never got around to actually using. Basically, Manaphy uses Tail Glow and then Heart Swaps to transfer its +3 SpA boost to a more threatening Special Attacking partner. Manaphy doesn't mind giving away its boosts, because it can just Tail Glow again to go up to +3. I'd say to make the most out of the Heart Swap, the partner should be able to use a spread move (ie. Heat Wave, Dazzling Gleam, (Pixilate) Hyper Voice, Sludge Wave Landorus-I, Blizzard Abomasnow, etc), but not necessarily. Preferably Manaphy would have more than one Heart Swap recipients for flexibility. Manaphy would appreciate some Fake Out / Follow Me support to facilitate setting up.

EVs, nature, and item are open to changes, since I haven't actually employed this to optimize these customization. I figured an offensive spread would be the way to go; I want Manaphy to be threatening on its own without needing to rely on passing Tail Glows to be useful.
 

Stratos

Banned deucer.
Heart Swap Tail Glow Manaphy


Manaphy @ Focus Sash / Sitrus Berry (open to changes)
Ability: Hydration
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe (open to changes)
Timid Nature (open to changes)
- Tail Glow
- Heart Swap
- Scald
- Protect

This is a set I recently wanted to try out, but never got around to actually using. Basically, Manaphy uses Tail Glow and then Heart Swaps to transfer its +3 SpA boost to a more threatening Special Attacking partner. Manaphy doesn't mind giving away its boosts, because it can just Tail Glow again to go up to +3. I'd say to make the most out of the Heart Swap, the partner should be able to use a spread move (ie. Heat Wave, Dazzling Gleam, (Pixilate) Hyper Voice, Sludge Wave Landorus-I, Blizzard Abomasnow, etc), but not necessarily. Preferably Manaphy would have more than one Heart Swap recipients for flexibility. Manaphy would appreciate some Fake Out / Follow Me support to facilitate setting up.

EVs, nature, and item are open to changes, since I haven't actually employed this to optimize these customization. I figured an offensive spread would be the way to go; I want Manaphy to be threatening on its own without needing to rely on passing Tail Glows to be useful.
The only real heart swap manaphy is heart swap / scald / psychic / protect;;
 

Pocket

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I'm confused... what exactly are you heart swapping?

@ BLOOD TOTEM: ?.? what did Pwnemon's Manaphy do to fangame???
 
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I'll nominate Dragon Dance Mega Gyarados :]



Gyarados @ Gyaradosite
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Waterfall
- Earthquake
- Protect​
 

Pocket

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252+ Atk Parental Bond Mega Kangaskhan Return vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Quagsire: 306-361 (77.6 - 91.6%)

So basically Quagsire has one shot to Scald burn Mega Kangaskhan before it hits the dust. I suggest maxing out its Defense / Impish Nature if you want a second chance.

It's also worth noting that Unaware can bite Quagsire in the ass by ignoring opponent's Attack drop from Intimidate / Special Attack drop from Draco Meteor / Overheat, too. j/s

EDIT: fufufufuk kyle D:>
 

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