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Gastrodon (GP 0/2)
- Thread starter GtM
- Start date
Why no mention of Grass Arceus ? It OHKOes with Judgment even when unboosted and laugh's at Kyogre who is somewhat frequently paired with Gastrodon.
paper lantern fish check (unofishial)
remove
a comment or 2
please change LO to Life Orb
[Overview]
<p>Gastrodon can do one thing and one thing alone in Ubers: wall the most popular Pokémon in the metagame, Kyogre. With access to Recover, Toxic, Mirror Coat, Yawn,[comma] and other annoying moves, Gastrodon can come in for free on Kyogre and provide team support, spreading status or just being annoying in general. Whilst Gastrodon faces competition from Shedinja and Quagsire in the anti-Kyogre-annoyer field, it requires less team support than Shedinja to be successful,[comma] and has far better superior special bulk than Quagsire, arguably making it the best option. Not only that, but Gastrodon can also hit surprisingly hard if it manages to get a Storm Drain boost. Surprisingly hard means it can actually dent stuff. By surprisingly hard I mean it can dent stuff at all. Gastrodon can also check other special attackers such as Palkia and even some Dialga through the use of Mirror Coat.</p> this seems more like a OO sentence, so I personally would remove it
[Set]
name: Tank
move 1: Scald
move 2: Recover
move 3: Toxic
move 4: Mirror Coat / Earthquake / Clear Smog
item: Leftovers
ability: Storm Drain
nature: Calm
evs: 252 HP / 248 SpD / 8 Spe
[Set Comments]
<p>One of Gastrodon's best qualities is its ability to come in on offensive Kyogre variants and stop it in its tracks. With immunities to both Water Spout and Thunder, and taking only 22.1% - 26.4% from an unboosted Ice Beam, Gastrodon can simply Toxic Kyogre and spam Recover until Kyogre dies or switches out. Needless to say, this set is most effective against Choiced Kyogre, but it can also deal with other sets in a pinch. Support sets which that run Thunder Wave over Water Spout are easily dealt with, and offensive Calm Mind sets also run into trouble. Even a +6 Ice Beam isn't guaranteed an OHKO, at which point Toxic will likely have likely killed Kyogre. Rest Talk sets are troublesome since they can PP stall Gastrodon successfully, although if Sleep Talk selects Surf persistently then Gastrodon can boost bolster the power of its own Scald to devestating levels, steamrolling on top of the rain boost boosted further by the opposing Kyogre's rain.</p>
<p>Scald is used as Gastrodon's primary attacking move, since the Special Attack boost gained from switching into Kyogre's Water-type moves allows it to hit neutral targets hard. thanks to the various boosts to Water moves gained by switching into Kyogre, Scald can hit neutral targets hard. It also has the advantage of potentially being able to statusing Steelhyphentypes, who can otherwise come in on Gastrodon fairly easily. Recover is godly for Gastrodon and vastly increases its stalling power against many special attackers. Toxic is used to stack up residual damage and to help Gastrodon stall in the first place, although if Toxic Spikes support is provided then Gastrodon can possibly afford to run an extra attacking or utility move in its place. Mirror Coat is the primary option for the last slot since it allows Gastrodon to check many other special attackers, such as Palkia and Dialga. With the given EV set, Gastrodon is never 2HKO'd by Timid Lustrous Orb Palkia's Spacial Rend, and thus Gastrodon can rebound the attack with Mirror Coat for an easy OHKO on Palkia, recovering the damage off at some other point whilst recovering off the damage at some other point. Dialga's Draco Meteor also fails to 2HKO Gastrodon, letting it switch in and recover off the damage. However, Gastrodon has several other viable options for the last slot. Earth Power provides useful secondary STAB and can hit Dragon types harder than Surf Scald after the Storm Drain boost that Kyogre will often provide. Clear Smog can be used to deal with Calm Mind users more directly; although it fails against Steel Arceus. On the other hand, Mirror Coat is arguably more effective against some CM users, since they will often fail to OHKO you with their attacks and you can bounce back the damage for an easy OHKO of your own. For example, a +6 Steel Arceus Judgment only deals 57.7% - 68.3% to Gastrodon.</p>
[Additional Comments]
<p>The speed EVs are used to outspeed uninvested Forretress, saving you a layer of hazards in certain situations, which is always nice. Furthermore, if Gastrodon has absorbed one of Kyogre's attacks and they opponent switches to Forretress in response, a rain, Storm Drain boosted Scald can even 2HKO specially defensive variants. with the Rain and Storm Drain boosts even the specially defensive set is easily 2HKO'd by Scald. A physically defensive EV spread is also usable, and helps to make Gastrodon with Clear Smog a more reliable check to many physical attackers. With 252 Def EVs and a Calm nature, Gastrodon can take a +2 LO ExtremeSpeed from Arceus and or two Outrages from Lustrous Orb Palkia. It can also survive a Hi Jump Kick from 252 Adamant LO Blaziken. It's Such as spread is not particularly good though, since most teams that use Gastrodon to ward off Kyogre would be using its antithesis Groudon, which obviously outclasses Gastrodon as a physical wall. Ice Beam can also be used as a secondary attacking option, since it hits Grass[hyphen] and Dragon[hyphen] types that resist Scald hard.</p>
[Other Options]
<p>Yawn lets you try and to phaze or induce Sleep, but fails to be useful against the somewhat common RestnospaceTalk Kyogre, and synergises poorly with Toxic's and Scald's chances to inflict status. Memento is a somewhat interesting option, or at least it would be if Gastrodon was fast enough to use it well. Counter can also be used somwhat effectively; Scarf Zekrom's Outrage will always fail to OHKO, but don't ask me how the poor sea slug would switch in on it. you'd get Gastrodon to switch in on it. The mixed set's Dragon Claw will also fail to OHKO,[comma] but its Outrage stands a 50% chance, so be warned. Defensive investment is highly required in this case so that you can survive all manner of LO Outrages; Gastrodon still deals fairly well with Kyogre even without Special Defense investment. Stockpile is also available, present, but inevitably leaves Gastrodon you as setup bait to the multiple Calm Mind users in the tier, and other boosters such as Extremekiller Arceus.</p>
[Checks and Counters]
<p>In one and a half words, two words, Grass[hyphen]types. Shaymin-S completely destroys Gastrodon no matter what it attempts to do, easily setting up Substitute if Gastrodon lacks Ice Beam. Ferrothorn can OHKO all Gastrodon variants with an uninvested Power Whip or set up Spikes and Stealth rock with impunity. , whilst Ferrothorn can OHKO all Gastrodon with an uninvested Power Whip. Shaymin-S can easily get a Substitute up if Gastrodon lacks Ice Beam, whilst Ferrothorn can set up Spikes or Stealth Rock with impunity. Grass Arceus poses an enormous threat since it can force Gastrodon out for a free boost. Even if Gastrodon stays in and uses Toxic, if Arceus has Refresh it can often get multiple boosts at no real cost. Groudon can hit Gastrodon hard and set up on it, although if Groudon is present on the opponent's team, Kyogre will most likely not be there, giving your team a small advantage. Particular variants of Kyogre can also prove annoying to face, namely RestTalk and Substitute+Calm Mind: the former easily PP stalls Gastrodon, while the latter blocking status effectively. with Rest[nospace]Talk and Substitute Calm Mind being able to block status effectively and be able to PP stall Gastrodon if necessary.</p>
<p>Generally speaking, however, Gastrodon just isn't effective in the tier at all outside of its niche of dealing with certain special attackers. If Gastrodon is being used in a situation where it isn't reacting to a special attacker, chances are it isn't going to pose a threat to your team.</p>
no need for DW section anymore, but maybe, maybe mention Sand Force in OO
[Dream World]
<p>Gastrodon's hidden ability, Sand Force, has been released. Unfortunately, using Sand Force prevents you from using Storm Drain, which is the primary reason for using Gastrodon in the first place. Even with Sand Force, Gastrodon is largely inferior to Pokémon like Landorus, Excadrill and Ground or Rock Arceus.</p>
♫
addremove
a comment or 2
♫
please change LO to Life Orb
[Overview]
<p>Gastrodon can do one thing and one thing alone in Ubers: wall the most popular Pokémon in the metagame, Kyogre. With access to Recover, Toxic, Mirror Coat, Yawn,[comma] and other annoying moves, Gastrodon can come in for free on Kyogre and provide team support, spreading status or just being annoying in general. Whilst Gastrodon faces competition from Shedinja and Quagsire in the anti-Kyogre-annoyer field, it requires less team support than Shedinja to be successful,[comma] and has far better superior special bulk than Quagsire, arguably making it the best option. Not only that, but Gastrodon can also hit surprisingly hard if it manages to get a Storm Drain boost. Surprisingly hard means it can actually dent stuff. By surprisingly hard I mean it can dent stuff at all. Gastrodon can also check other special attackers such as Palkia and even some Dialga through the use of Mirror Coat.</p> this seems more like a OO sentence, so I personally would remove it
[Set]
name: Tank
move 1: Scald
move 2: Recover
move 3: Toxic
move 4: Mirror Coat / Earthquake / Clear Smog
item: Leftovers
ability: Storm Drain
nature: Calm
evs: 252 HP / 248 SpD / 8 Spe
[Set Comments]
<p>One of Gastrodon's best qualities is its ability to come in on offensive Kyogre variants and stop it in its tracks. With immunities to both Water Spout and Thunder, and taking only 22.1% - 26.4% from an unboosted Ice Beam, Gastrodon can simply Toxic Kyogre and spam Recover until Kyogre dies or switches out. Needless to say, this set is most effective against Choiced Kyogre, but it can also deal with other sets in a pinch. Support sets which that run Thunder Wave over Water Spout are easily dealt with, and offensive Calm Mind sets also run into trouble. Even a +6 Ice Beam isn't guaranteed an OHKO, at which point Toxic will likely have likely killed Kyogre. Rest Talk sets are troublesome since they can PP stall Gastrodon successfully, although if Sleep Talk selects Surf persistently then Gastrodon can boost bolster the power of its own Scald to devestating levels, steamrolling on top of the rain boost boosted further by the opposing Kyogre's rain.</p>
<p>Scald is used as Gastrodon's primary attacking move, since the Special Attack boost gained from switching into Kyogre's Water-type moves allows it to hit neutral targets hard. thanks to the various boosts to Water moves gained by switching into Kyogre, Scald can hit neutral targets hard. It also has the advantage of potentially being able to statusing Steelhyphentypes, who can otherwise come in on Gastrodon fairly easily. Recover is godly for Gastrodon and vastly increases its stalling power against many special attackers. Toxic is used to stack up residual damage and to help Gastrodon stall in the first place, although if Toxic Spikes support is provided then Gastrodon can possibly afford to run an extra attacking or utility move in its place. Mirror Coat is the primary option for the last slot since it allows Gastrodon to check many other special attackers, such as Palkia and Dialga. With the given EV set, Gastrodon is never 2HKO'd by Timid Lustrous Orb Palkia's Spacial Rend, and thus Gastrodon can rebound the attack with Mirror Coat for an easy OHKO on Palkia, recovering the damage off at some other point whilst recovering off the damage at some other point. Dialga's Draco Meteor also fails to 2HKO Gastrodon, letting it switch in and recover off the damage. However, Gastrodon has several other viable options for the last slot. Earth Power provides useful secondary STAB and can hit Dragon types harder than Surf Scald after the Storm Drain boost that Kyogre will often provide. Clear Smog can be used to deal with Calm Mind users more directly; although it fails against Steel Arceus. On the other hand, Mirror Coat is arguably more effective against some CM users, since they will often fail to OHKO you with their attacks and you can bounce back the damage for an easy OHKO of your own. For example, a +6 Steel Arceus Judgment only deals 57.7% - 68.3% to Gastrodon.</p>
[Additional Comments]
<p>The speed EVs are used to outspeed uninvested Forretress, saving you a layer of hazards in certain situations, which is always nice. Furthermore, if Gastrodon has absorbed one of Kyogre's attacks and they opponent switches to Forretress in response, a rain, Storm Drain boosted Scald can even 2HKO specially defensive variants. with the Rain and Storm Drain boosts even the specially defensive set is easily 2HKO'd by Scald. A physically defensive EV spread is also usable, and helps to make Gastrodon with Clear Smog a more reliable check to many physical attackers. With 252 Def EVs and a Calm nature, Gastrodon can take a +2 LO ExtremeSpeed from Arceus and or two Outrages from Lustrous Orb Palkia. It can also survive a Hi Jump Kick from 252 Adamant LO Blaziken. It's Such as spread is not particularly good though, since most teams that use Gastrodon to ward off Kyogre would be using its antithesis Groudon, which obviously outclasses Gastrodon as a physical wall. Ice Beam can also be used as a secondary attacking option, since it hits Grass[hyphen] and Dragon[hyphen] types that resist Scald hard.</p>
[Other Options]
<p>Yawn lets you try and to phaze or induce Sleep, but fails to be useful against the somewhat common RestnospaceTalk Kyogre, and synergises poorly with Toxic's and Scald's chances to inflict status. Memento is a somewhat interesting option, or at least it would be if Gastrodon was fast enough to use it well. Counter can also be used somwhat effectively; Scarf Zekrom's Outrage will always fail to OHKO, but don't ask me how the poor sea slug would switch in on it. you'd get Gastrodon to switch in on it. The mixed set's Dragon Claw will also fail to OHKO,[comma] but its Outrage stands a 50% chance, so be warned. Defensive investment is highly required in this case so that you can survive all manner of LO Outrages; Gastrodon still deals fairly well with Kyogre even without Special Defense investment. Stockpile is also available, present, but inevitably leaves Gastrodon you as setup bait to the multiple Calm Mind users in the tier, and other boosters such as Extremekiller Arceus.</p>
[Checks and Counters]
<p>In one and a half words, two words, Grass[hyphen]types. Shaymin-S completely destroys Gastrodon no matter what it attempts to do, easily setting up Substitute if Gastrodon lacks Ice Beam. Ferrothorn can OHKO all Gastrodon variants with an uninvested Power Whip or set up Spikes and Stealth rock with impunity. , whilst Ferrothorn can OHKO all Gastrodon with an uninvested Power Whip. Shaymin-S can easily get a Substitute up if Gastrodon lacks Ice Beam, whilst Ferrothorn can set up Spikes or Stealth Rock with impunity. Grass Arceus poses an enormous threat since it can force Gastrodon out for a free boost. Even if Gastrodon stays in and uses Toxic, if Arceus has Refresh it can often get multiple boosts at no real cost. Groudon can hit Gastrodon hard and set up on it, although if Groudon is present on the opponent's team, Kyogre will most likely not be there, giving your team a small advantage. Particular variants of Kyogre can also prove annoying to face, namely RestTalk and Substitute+Calm Mind: the former easily PP stalls Gastrodon, while the latter blocking status effectively. with Rest[nospace]Talk and Substitute Calm Mind being able to block status effectively and be able to PP stall Gastrodon if necessary.</p>
<p>Generally speaking, however, Gastrodon just isn't effective in the tier at all outside of its niche of dealing with certain special attackers. If Gastrodon is being used in a situation where it isn't reacting to a special attacker, chances are it isn't going to pose a threat to your team.</p>
no need for DW section anymore, but maybe, maybe mention Sand Force in OO
[Dream World]
<p>Gastrodon's hidden ability, Sand Force, has been released. Unfortunately, using Sand Force prevents you from using Storm Drain, which is the primary reason for using Gastrodon in the first place. Even with Sand Force, Gastrodon is largely inferior to Pokémon like Landorus, Excadrill and Ground or Rock Arceus.</p>
So since this has not been touched in a while, I guess the author is no longer interested as he said in the other thread.
http://www.smogon.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3880961&postcount=24
Also Nexus said I could push it through GP. So this can be locked i guess ?
http://www.smogon.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3880961&postcount=24
Also Nexus said I could push it through GP. So this can be locked i guess ?
