Electric
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Pet Mod [Gen 1] RBY CAP [Feature-Complete]
- Thread starter Sabelette
- Start date
Bug/Ice
Water/Ground
Water/Ground
Electric
Water/Ground
Water/Ground
The winning type is Electric!
Slate 2 Part 3A: Stats
You will have 5 days to submit a stat spread for this Pokemon. Please give an HP, Attack, Defense, Special, and Speed stat and specify which is which. Some guidelines:- Keep the concept in mind! Since the concept is reverse archetype this Pokemon should have different traits from a stereotypical electric-type. For example, Electric-types are commonly associated with high speed, so a good concept could be to make this mon slow.
- Be careful not to go overboard with the stats. Remember that the goal is for the CAP to be somewhere in the range of 9th-20th in power on a theoretical viability rankings.
- Similarly, be careful not to directly outclass Jolteon, or anything else relevant in OU. There should be reasons to use Jolteon over this mon, and vice versa.
Defensive Pivot V2
After some feedback, I moved stats around a little bit to make it more inline with existing rby mons like cloyster.
HP: 45 -> 50
ATK: 70
DEF: 200 -> 180
SPC: 90
SPE: 55 -> 45
GOALS:
After some feedback, I moved stats around a little bit to make it more inline with existing rby mons like cloyster.
HP: 45 -> 50
ATK: 70
DEF: 200 -> 180
SPC: 90
SPE: 55 -> 45
GOALS:
- Physical wall despite eq weakness
- Specially frail
- Recover/Drain viable without being OP
- Walled/threatened by zam egg chans unike zapdos/Jolt
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HP: 110
ATK: 130
DEF: 90
SPC: 50
SPE: 35
Idea was to make this a bulky physical attacker which I imagine isn't what comes to mind when you hear something is an electric-type. The idea for the movepool of this mon is a strong physical movepool + Thunderbolt and Thunder Wave. Lack of physical STAB means 130 base attack isn't as strong as it seems (it's near Clefable's physical power). However, this mon is able to bully Zapdos and Chansey which is pretty nice. Speed is so it's faster than Lax but slower than Rhydon, and the other stats are for the following calcs:
3HKOed by Starmie STAB, 3HKOes in return with Thunderbolt
3HKOed by Zam/Eggy Psychic, 2HKOed if first one drops
3HKOed by Tauros/Lax EQ,
5HKOed by Zapdos bolt, 3HKOes in return with Rock Slide
2HKOed by Rhydon EQ, but 3HKOes Don in return
105 HP subs for Chansey Seismic toss, 4HKOed by Ice Beam
ATK: 130
DEF: 90
SPC: 50
SPE: 35
Idea was to make this a bulky physical attacker which I imagine isn't what comes to mind when you hear something is an electric-type. The idea for the movepool of this mon is a strong physical movepool + Thunderbolt and Thunder Wave. Lack of physical STAB means 130 base attack isn't as strong as it seems (it's near Clefable's physical power). However, this mon is able to bully Zapdos and Chansey which is pretty nice. Speed is so it's faster than Lax but slower than Rhydon, and the other stats are for the following calcs:
3HKOed by Starmie STAB, 3HKOes in return with Thunderbolt
3HKOed by Zam/Eggy Psychic, 2HKOed if first one drops
3HKOed by Tauros/Lax EQ,
5HKOed by Zapdos bolt, 3HKOes in return with Rock Slide
2HKOed by Rhydon EQ, but 3HKOes Don in return
105 HP subs for Chansey Seismic toss, 4HKOed by Ice Beam
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HP: 80
ATK: 80
DEF: 95
SPC: 80
SPE: 65
Jolteon is a fast Special Attacker, so this Pokémon aims to wall the threats that neither it nor Zapdos could defend themselves from. This stat spread aims to cripple opponents enough with Paralysis and Confusion to make them vulnerable to another Pokémon.
ATK: 80
DEF: 95
SPC: 80
SPE: 65
Jolteon is a fast Special Attacker, so this Pokémon aims to wall the threats that neither it nor Zapdos could defend themselves from. This stat spread aims to cripple opponents enough with Paralysis and Confusion to make them vulnerable to another Pokémon.
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HP: 100
ATK: 70
DEF: 90
SPC: 110 > 100
SPE: 50
Total BST : 530 > 520
Idea was to propose a bulky and slow special electric wall*, able to retaliate with a pretty good special attack but also a good physical bulk. Speed stat is roughly equal to Wigglytuff (standard blob) and slower than Exeggutor, but higher than Rhydon.
(*I got my stat inspiration from 9g Bellibolt.)
Calcs :
2HKOes Starmie with Thunderbolt, is possibly 4HKOed by Psychic,
Is 4HKOed by Exeggutor Psychic,
3HKOed by Tauros EQ, but can also 3HKO Tauros with Tbolt.
6HKOed by Zapdos Tbolt, 4HKOes in return with Tbolt
2HKOed by Rhydon EQ, but 2HKOes Don in return by Bubblebeam (if it can learn it)
ATK: 70
DEF: 90
SPC: 110 > 100
SPE: 50
Total BST : 530 > 520
Idea was to propose a bulky and slow special electric wall*, able to retaliate with a pretty good special attack but also a good physical bulk. Speed stat is roughly equal to Wigglytuff (standard blob) and slower than Exeggutor, but higher than Rhydon.
(*I got my stat inspiration from 9g Bellibolt.)
Calcs :
2HKOes Starmie with Thunderbolt, is possibly 4HKOed by Psychic,
Is 4HKOed by Exeggutor Psychic,
3HKOed by Tauros EQ, but can also 3HKO Tauros with Tbolt.
6HKOed by Zapdos Tbolt, 4HKOes in return with Tbolt
2HKOed by Rhydon EQ, but 2HKOes Don in return by Bubblebeam (if it can learn it)
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Quick personal feedback on the above:
RAALightning - I like the idea, but I'd love to see it not have the exact same HP and Defense as Cloyster. Would even like 55/175 work just so it looks a little more unique?
gastlies - no notes, cool design to use the defensive typing and free it up to have good but non-STAB offense
Ubertrainer2000 - No offense, but between thinking that Electric-types are immune to paralysis and that Toxic is a viable move in RBY I'm questioning the basis of these submissions. My main issue with this is that it has obscene physical bulk to the point it easily pivots into Snorlax Earthquake and can force it out. That combined with not being walled by Starmie and walling Zapdos/Jolteon kind of makes Cloyster obsolete and also makes me wonder if it eclipses Jolteon; it has a slightly worse matchup into Starmie because it's slow but it tanks Tauros and Snorlax so well that that might not matter. It also gets >100 HP Substitute and it can sub on all three of Chansey's attacks, with only Ice Beam having a minuscule chance to break sub in one hit. That's all just assuming it gets only Electric and Normal-type moves; give it any coverage and things get nasty. It's pretty passive, at least, but the fact that it completely stuffs the biggest means of progress in the tier very safely means I would veto this if it doesn't lose some physical bulk.
Bedal Roscoe - I'd be pretty worried about giving a Pokemon STAB Electric and also giving it Ice or Water coverage (Raichu doesn't count, it sucks).
My main concern with this one is that it's got great bulk combined with 110 Special STAB Tbolt; it can sit on Chansey all day and even EQ Snorlax only 3HKOes it, so I'm a little bit worried about also letting it have almost Zapdos levels of special attacking power. My recommendation would be to knock 5 HP off so it doesn't get 101 HP subs and then lower Special by 5 as well, and definitely do not give this Ice Beam.
RAALightning - I like the idea, but I'd love to see it not have the exact same HP and Defense as Cloyster. Would even like 55/175 work just so it looks a little more unique?
gastlies - no notes, cool design to use the defensive typing and free it up to have good but non-STAB offense
Ubertrainer2000 - No offense, but between thinking that Electric-types are immune to paralysis and that Toxic is a viable move in RBY I'm questioning the basis of these submissions. My main issue with this is that it has obscene physical bulk to the point it easily pivots into Snorlax Earthquake and can force it out. That combined with not being walled by Starmie and walling Zapdos/Jolteon kind of makes Cloyster obsolete and also makes me wonder if it eclipses Jolteon; it has a slightly worse matchup into Starmie because it's slow but it tanks Tauros and Snorlax so well that that might not matter. It also gets >100 HP Substitute and it can sub on all three of Chansey's attacks, with only Ice Beam having a minuscule chance to break sub in one hit. That's all just assuming it gets only Electric and Normal-type moves; give it any coverage and things get nasty. It's pretty passive, at least, but the fact that it completely stuffs the biggest means of progress in the tier very safely means I would veto this if it doesn't lose some physical bulk.
Bedal Roscoe - I'd be pretty worried about giving a Pokemon STAB Electric and also giving it Ice or Water coverage (Raichu doesn't count, it sucks).
My main concern with this one is that it's got great bulk combined with 110 Special STAB Tbolt; it can sit on Chansey all day and even EQ Snorlax only 3HKOes it, so I'm a little bit worried about also letting it have almost Zapdos levels of special attacking power. My recommendation would be to knock 5 HP off so it doesn't get 101 HP subs and then lower Special by 5 as well, and definitely do not give this Ice Beam.
HP: 65
ATK: 130
Defense: 60
Special: 50
Speed: 115
BST: 415
A fast physical STABless attacker with a wide movepool.
Electrics in this gen are overwhelmingly Special and with very, very little coverage. This pokémon would break these molds - it would not be special and instead Phyiscal and, rather than only having access to normal and electric type moves would instead have a big varity of moves available.
Due to its lack of STAB it needs to rely on landing super-effective hits and critical hits - critical hit rate is based on your speed in gen 1 so this guy has a whopping ~22% crit rate. This makes him have a very high potential damage and a very intimidating presence while simultaneously not being hard to switch into, making for a very dynamic and skill-intensive gameplay as you need to accurately read switches to land super effectiee hits.
This stat spread also opens a lot of fun options we could add on the moveset stage.
ATK: 130
Defense: 60
Special: 50
Speed: 115
BST: 415
A fast physical STABless attacker with a wide movepool.
Electrics in this gen are overwhelmingly Special and with very, very little coverage. This pokémon would break these molds - it would not be special and instead Phyiscal and, rather than only having access to normal and electric type moves would instead have a big varity of moves available.
Due to its lack of STAB it needs to rely on landing super-effective hits and critical hits - critical hit rate is based on your speed in gen 1 so this guy has a whopping ~22% crit rate. This makes him have a very high potential damage and a very intimidating presence while simultaneously not being hard to switch into, making for a very dynamic and skill-intensive gameplay as you need to accurately read switches to land super effectiee hits.
Offensively it can deal quite a lot of damage:
Jolteon Earthquake vs. Rhydon: 154-182 (37.2 - 44%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Jolteon Rock Slide vs. Zapdos: 144-170 (37.5 - 44.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Jolteon Submission vs. Chansey: 379-446 (53.9 - 63.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Jolteon Drill Peck vs. Exeggutor: 154-182 (39.1 - 46.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
However, a bad read can leave it in a very dire spot:
Jolteon Earthquake vs. Exeggutor: 47-56 (11.9 - 14.2%) -- possible 8HKO
Jolteon Rock Slide vs. Chansey: 177-209 (25.1 - 29.7%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
Jolteon Submission vs. Alakazam: 54-64 (17.2 - 20.4%) -- possible 5HKO
Jolteon Drill Peck vs. Zapdos: 38-45 (9.9 - 11.7%) -- possible 9HKO
If you read a switch correctly you get massively rewarded - you deal a lot of damage on the switchin and outspeed and can finish the job. If you read it wrong you get punished - the damage tickles the opponent and, since they can survive an extra turn or two, they can hit you back for an immense amount of damage.
It makes for a very execution-based mon: Used correctly it can be an incredibly valuable asset used to wallbreak and revenge kill. Used incorrectly it falls apart, rewarding the better player.
Jolteon Earthquake vs. Rhydon: 154-182 (37.2 - 44%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Jolteon Rock Slide vs. Zapdos: 144-170 (37.5 - 44.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Jolteon Submission vs. Chansey: 379-446 (53.9 - 63.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Jolteon Drill Peck vs. Exeggutor: 154-182 (39.1 - 46.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
However, a bad read can leave it in a very dire spot:
Jolteon Earthquake vs. Exeggutor: 47-56 (11.9 - 14.2%) -- possible 8HKO
Jolteon Rock Slide vs. Chansey: 177-209 (25.1 - 29.7%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
Jolteon Submission vs. Alakazam: 54-64 (17.2 - 20.4%) -- possible 5HKO
Jolteon Drill Peck vs. Zapdos: 38-45 (9.9 - 11.7%) -- possible 9HKO
If you read a switch correctly you get massively rewarded - you deal a lot of damage on the switchin and outspeed and can finish the job. If you read it wrong you get punished - the damage tickles the opponent and, since they can survive an extra turn or two, they can hit you back for an immense amount of damage.
It makes for a very execution-based mon: Used correctly it can be an incredibly valuable asset used to wallbreak and revenge kill. Used incorrectly it falls apart, rewarding the better player.
Defensively it gets dealt massive damage by most attacks however it can leverage its Electric typing to get safe switches vs Tbolt, once again playing to the theme of rewarding good predictions and punishing bad reads.
Snorlax Body Slam vs. Jolteon: 135-159 (40.5 - 47.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Snorlax Earthquake vs. Jolteon: 211-248 (63.3 - 74.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Starmie Psychic vs. Jolteon: 148-174 (44.4 - 52.2%) -- 16.2% chance to 2HKO
Starmie Thunderbolt vs. Jolteon: 51-61 (15.3 - 18.3%) -- possible 6HKO
Chansey Ice Beam vs. Jolteon: 108-127 (32.4 - 38.1%) -- 97.8% chance to 3HKO
Chansey Thunderbolt vs. Jolteon: 53-63 (15.9 - 18.9%) -- possible 6HKO
Zapdos Thunderbolt vs. Jolteon: 91-107 (27.3 - 32.1%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
Zapdos Drill Peck vs. Jolteon: 55-65 (16.5 - 19.5%) -- possible 6HKO
A careless electric-type move can invite him in while switching it onto a non-electric move can be a death sentence. Its frailty means it can't be switched willy-nilly, requiring good double switches and predictions to get in, alongside revenge killing. Electric is a interesting defensive typing in how neutral it is - very few things hit it for not very effective and even fewer for super effective. This neutrality means you need good positioning and fundamentals to position the mon rather than merely switching it vs a move it resists, further increasing its skill ceiling.
Snorlax Body Slam vs. Jolteon: 135-159 (40.5 - 47.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Snorlax Earthquake vs. Jolteon: 211-248 (63.3 - 74.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Starmie Psychic vs. Jolteon: 148-174 (44.4 - 52.2%) -- 16.2% chance to 2HKO
Starmie Thunderbolt vs. Jolteon: 51-61 (15.3 - 18.3%) -- possible 6HKO
Chansey Ice Beam vs. Jolteon: 108-127 (32.4 - 38.1%) -- 97.8% chance to 3HKO
Chansey Thunderbolt vs. Jolteon: 53-63 (15.9 - 18.9%) -- possible 6HKO
Zapdos Thunderbolt vs. Jolteon: 91-107 (27.3 - 32.1%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
Zapdos Drill Peck vs. Jolteon: 55-65 (16.5 - 19.5%) -- possible 6HKO
A careless electric-type move can invite him in while switching it onto a non-electric move can be a death sentence. Its frailty means it can't be switched willy-nilly, requiring good double switches and predictions to get in, alongside revenge killing. Electric is a interesting defensive typing in how neutral it is - very few things hit it for not very effective and even fewer for super effective. This neutrality means you need good positioning and fundamentals to position the mon rather than merely switching it vs a move it resists, further increasing its skill ceiling.
This stat spread also opens a lot of fun options we could add on the moveset stage.
- Thunder Wave could be added to give it extra utility or purpousedly omitted, to further distinguish its role from Zapdos and Jolteon
- Coverage moves could be swapped around - remove Drill Peck and give it Sludge, remove Submission and give it Pin Missile, remove Rock Slide and give it Stomp. There's a lot of room for niche matchup-dependant moves that we could add.
- This aspect also means we can very easily curate which matchups we want it to win or lose
- Remove Rock Slide so it loses vs Zapdos, add in Drill Peck so it beats Exeggutor, remove Submission so it loses to Snorlax, add in Seismic Toss so it can square against Cloyster, etc
- There's an argument to be made for defensive setup moves in this mon. Reflect, Light Screen or even Substitute could be used as a way to cheat action economy - use it on the opponent's switch out, giving it an extra turn of survivability and nullifying the chance of landing a not very effective hit on the switch-in
- Similarly, a move like Meditate (+1 ATK stage) could be interesting in this mon for that same line of thinking alongside giving it a real sweep potential
Hey Sabelette, thank you for your wise output :)
Well, I pushed the resemblance to Bellibolt a bit too far with water coverage, you're right. And yeah Water/Ice coverage was theoretical but very difficult to justify unless it was a Water/Electric mon. Maybe it could have Bubblebeam (but no Surf nor Ice Beam, it was crazy to even consider it) but we are not at movepool stage.
Regarding stats, at first I had in mind a 100/70/90/100/50 stat spread. Maybe it would be better ?
(I still want to keep the 100HP stat though since it would be its particularity, since I imagine it as quite bulky)
Relevant calcs:
Snorlax Earthquake vs. Jolteon: 166-196 (41.1 - 48.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Tauros Earthquake vs. Jolteon: 156-184 (38.7 - 45.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Tauros Hyper Beam vs. Jolteon: 174-205 (43.1 - 50.8%) -- 2.8% chance to 2HKO
Chansey Thunderbolt vs. Jolteon: 35-42 (8.6 - 10.4%) -- possibly the worst move ever
Chansey Ice Beam vs. Jolteon: 72-85 (17.8 - 21%) -- possible 5HKO
Starmie Psychic vs. Jolteon: 97-115 (24 - 28.5%) -- 98.3% chance to 4HKO
Starmie Blizzard vs. Jolteon: 86-102 (21.3 - 25.3%) -- 0.1% chance to 4HKO
Jolteon Thunderbolt vs. Starmie: 205-242 (63.4 - 74.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Jolteon Thunderbolt vs. Tauros: 130-153 (36.8 - 43.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
(+ still get over 100 HP Substitute)
I edited my post with the slight stat modifications.
(When I'm staring at my CAPmon stats, I just noticed that Exeggutor hits harder and is almost as bulky with its 95/85/125 bulk. Eggy is a defensive monster, I was not enough aware of that.)
(When I'm staring at my CAPmon stats, I just noticed that Exeggutor hits harder and is almost as bulky with its 95/85/125 bulk. Eggy is a defensive monster, I was not enough aware of that.)
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gastlies
Gastlies
Bedal Roscoe
Bedal Roscoe