Imprison. All Imprison users learn protect but most don't learn Detect (Zoroark and Azelf being the excepts). Most Imprison users hit for nothing but Kyurem-B learns Imprison and their partner can also attack. Rule of thumb, if your pokemon learns detect, use it over protect.Is there a particular reason why detect is used over protect? i did some battles and i've seen it sometimes
TR is certainly a good play style, but I don't know if I would call it unstoppable. In the context of the current ladder meta, it's probably the strongest archetype, but I would guess that's largely due to the singles players typically using teams with lots of fast frail Pokémon and inexperienced players in general not knowing how to deal with it.Also, I just started trying out trick room... it is unstoppable.
Cradily gets Storm Drain, not Water Absorb. So you could gain Sp.Atk with surf abusers so it may be worth using AncientPower/HP Rock over Rockslide. But then again Rock Slide does hit 2 foes so it may be more useful especially when you don't have a boost in Sp.Atk. Also Giga Drain is legal with Storm Drain now thanks to the BW2 tutors now. It does get recover but with Stealth Rock it's difficult to fit into a moveslot. Cradily does seem like an underated pokemon to use to combat many rain pokemon though, a water immunity is a great thing to have in this meta, I find.Perhaps something like this?
Cradily @ Sitrus Berry/Expert Belt
Water Absorb
Sassy
(i'm bad at EVs, but probably something with HP/SpD)
0 Spe IV
-Stealth Rock
-Rock Slide
-Energy Ball
-Protect
Surprisingly useful two-move coverage that serves to more or less demolish a lot of common Rain Pokemon such as Gastro, Politoed, Skymin, Thundurus. SR is useful in beating out Sun and Hail teams, cradily's absurdly low speed is useful in combatting Trick Room, and it gets easy recovery if you use it on a rain team with surf abusers. This is more or less talking out of my ass, but in theory this could be a potent set.
That, pretty much. Chandelure (who easily murders Psychics not named Cresselia) and Cresselia are good for either reversing or Imprisoning it, if not setting it up yourself (like against a Rain team.) Uxie might be good, since it's got the fastest Imprison afaik (note: in my limited experience, it was not), but Cress does the anti-TR job better.TR is certainly a good play style, but I don't know if I would call it unstoppable. In the context of the current ladder meta, it's probably the strongest archetype, but I would guess that's largely due to the singles players typically using teams with lots of fast frail Pokémon and inexperienced players in general not knowing how to deal with it.
One of if not the best dragons in VGC 12. Don't see any initial reasons why it still wouldn't be although time will tell what effect the 6 member party and lack of item clause will have on this meta. Dark stab and it synergizes well with two of the best pokemon in vgc cress and metagross.I am curious what you guys think about one of my favorite Pokemon in this metagame:
Hydreigon (F) @ Life Orb
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Dark Pulse
- Flamethrower
- Draco Meteor
- Protect
Overall I prefer Hydreigon over Latios for a couple of reasons. The first is that it is overall a much stronger attacker since it can use a Modest Nature. Hydreigon is particularly devastating on Sun, since it gives Flamethrower a Pseudo-STAB. I have never encountered a situation where I really missed the speed, since there are so many way to make yourself faster than the opponent (Tailwind, Thunder Wave, and Icy Wind particularly). Secondly, that Dark-STAB is incredibly helpful against Creeselia. Considering it holds the #2 spot in the metagame right now, Hydreigon doesn't miss out on actually using its Dark-STAB. It is also helpful against Trick Room, since most Trick Room users are weak to Dark.
You could pair it off with Scizor or Mamoswine, depending on if you're trying to hit Chomp or Lati@s too I think, who are faster and can really stop Hydregion.One of if not the best dragons in VGC 12. Don't see any initial reasons why it still wouldn't be although time will tell what effect the 6 member party and lack of item clause will have on this meta. Dark stab and it synergizes well with two of the best pokemon in vgc cress and metagross.
Harvest Exeggutor can be very deadly under the right hands. Wolfe used it in his World's team last year, and he earned 2nd place. He said it was his MVP.I'm loving Harvest Exeggutor right now on my TR team, full Sp. Attack and then investing in his bulk and practically nothing KO's that you can't work around with Protect/partner deals with.
Under sun it's extremely potent and very demoralising for your opponent to see the berry used, harvested and then used again.
Another replay from my TrickSun team: http://www.pokemonshowdown.com/replay/smogondoubles9347756
I particularly liked my opponent's comments at the end.
Another thing that Hydreigon has over Lati@s is that it has access to Taunt, which is great vs TR teams. It makes for an interesting mix of Darkrai and Lati@s. It has similar bulk to Darkrai (although it has noticeably more HP than Darkrai), but it is much slower than both (98 is nothing compared to 125 and 110). Again, Speed isn't that big of a deal in Doubles due to the many ways to lower opponent speed / increase your own speed, but it's still something to note. A physical set also looks viable, as it has both Earthquake and Rock Slide for spread moves and Dragon Claw / Outrage / Crunch for STAB. Notably Earthquake could be used on a mixed set.I am curious what you guys think about one of my favorite Pokemon in this metagame:
Hydreigon (F) @ Life Orb
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Dark Pulse
- Flamethrower
- Draco Meteor
- Protect
Overall I prefer Hydreigon over Latios for a couple of reasons. The first is that it is overall a much stronger attacker since it can use a Modest Nature. Hydreigon is particularly devastating on Sun, since it gives Flamethrower a Pseudo-STAB. I have never encountered a situation where I really missed the speed, since there are so many way to make yourself faster than the opponent (Tailwind, Thunder Wave, and Icy Wind particularly). Secondly, that Dark-STAB is incredibly helpful against Creeselia. Considering it holds the #2 spot in the metagame right now, Hydreigon doesn't miss out on actually using its Dark-STAB. It is also helpful against Trick Room, since most Trick Room users are weak to Dark.
Thanks for the tip and the replay, loved watching it take those Ice Beams like a boss. My current Exeggutor setup is:Harvest Exeggutor can be very deadly under the right hands.
Try running Lilligant over Venusaur, with a spread of Modest 76 SpA, 252 Speed, and the rest in HP with Giga Drain/Sleep Powder/Quiver Dance(or Stun Spore)/Protect and give it a Lum Berry. It outspeeds Venusaur, and has a higher base Special Attack (110), and is almost as bulky.I have been tinkering with a Sun team a bit. It seems rather standard and I think the only remarkable thing I have is using Sableye for Gravity support to be able to spam Will-O-Wisp and have a sure-hit Sleep Power. But from what I've played the team overall hasn't been able to pull it's weight, more specifically Hariyama and Heatran and sometimes Cresselia, although that's probably me not being able to use it's set properly.
I really like the Sableye/Ninetales/Venusaur thing I have going, and it has worked pretty well so far, but the other half of the team is so-so and I'd appreciate some advice on how to change my team for the better. I was thinking on trying at least one more Gravity user and more Pokemon with moves that mix well with it to be able to abuse it fully but I haven't gone too deep into it.
Ninetales (F) @ Iron Ball Trait: Drought
EVs: 252 HP / 124 Def / 132 SAtk
Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Spd)
- Heat Wave
- Will-O-Wisp
- Energy Ball
- Protect
Hariyama (M) @ Sitrus Berry
Trait: Guts
EVs: 216 Atk / 100 Def / 100 SDef / 92 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Cross Chop
- Fake Out
- Rock Slide
- Wide Guard
Sableye (M) @ Lagging Tail
Trait: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SDef
Sassy Nature (+SDef, -Spd)
- Will-O-Wisp
- Sunny Day
- Gravity
- Taunt
Venusaur (F) @ Life Orb
Trait: Chlorophyll
EVs: 68 HP / 252 SAtk / 188 Spd
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Giga Drain
- Sludge Bomb
- Sleep Powder
- Protect
Cresselia (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spd
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Psyshock
- Icy Wind
- Moonlight
- Calm Mind
Heatran (M) @ Shuca Berry
Trait: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Heat Wave
- Earth Power
- Stealth Rock
- Protect