-
Welcome to Smogon! Take a moment to read the Introduction to Smogon for a run-down on everything Smogon, and make sure you take some time to read the global rules.
-
Congrats to the winners of the 2023 Smog Awards!
In-Game Tier List Discussion
- Thread starter Colonel M
- Start date
- Status
Darumaka definitely outclasses the Tepig line so I can't really disagree with tiering it lower. However, if you're looking for pokemon easy mode, Tepig makes a great Darumaka stop gap between the beginning of the game and when you reach route 4. Correct, no starter has an advantage at gym 1, but all of them are still strong early game and useful there. In Gym 2, Pignite makes quick work of the normal pokemon with Flame Charge + Arm Thrust. Watchog's Hypnosis is a non issue because you're faster after a FC and should ohko with AT at level 17. No additional training of another fighting pokemon necessary because it already occurred on the way. From there you can go find yourself a Darumaka and proceed to bench Pignite for the remainder of the game. That's what I did and haven't looked back.
I know Petlil is at high tier right now but for pokemon black only it should probably get moved to top tier.
You can get it in an in-game trade after the 2nd gym at lv 15 and from there it's smooth sailing setting everything to sleep and draining HP with 1.5x exp gains.
I also got a modest nature on the first try with Chlorophyll (although I think this trade always has it).
If there has been a better ingame trade in all of pokemon history I can't think of it.
You can get it in an in-game trade after the 2nd gym at lv 15 and from there it's smooth sailing setting everything to sleep and draining HP with 1.5x exp gains.
I also got a modest nature on the first try with Chlorophyll (although I think this trade always has it).
If there has been a better ingame trade in all of pokemon history I can't think of it.
My planned team is...
Swanna
Chandelure
Sawsbuck
Sigilyph
Drilbur
???
Any glaring flaws? Suggestions for the last slot? Should HM Fly go to Swanna or Sigilyph, which Pokemon needs the extra slot more?
And yes, I'm not using my starter in my final team. I don't like any of the starter's final evolutions.
Swanna
Chandelure
Sawsbuck
Sigilyph
Drilbur
???
Any glaring flaws? Suggestions for the last slot? Should HM Fly go to Swanna or Sigilyph, which Pokemon needs the extra slot more?
And yes, I'm not using my starter in my final team. I don't like any of the starter's final evolutions.
...And its IVs are 20/20/20/31/20/20. Why thank you Game Freak, now I know at least one of my pokémon doesn't suck stat-wise.
My team so far is:
Sammy the Lvl 19 Quiet Servine
Salsa the Lvl 20 Hasty Panpour
Patricia the Lvl 19 Naughty Swoobat
Ozzy the Lvl 19 Relaxed Roggenrolla
Marco the Lvl 19 Jolly Scraggy
Lester the Lvl 20 Bold (grr...) Darumaka
Currently in Castelia
Planned final team:
Serperior
Scrafty
Archeops
Galvantua
Golurk
?????
What should I use for my last Pokemon? The two I've narrowed it down to are Simipour and Reiniclus.
Sammy the Lvl 19 Quiet Servine
Salsa the Lvl 20 Hasty Panpour
Patricia the Lvl 19 Naughty Swoobat
Ozzy the Lvl 19 Relaxed Roggenrolla
Marco the Lvl 19 Jolly Scraggy
Lester the Lvl 20 Bold (grr...) Darumaka
Currently in Castelia
Planned final team:
Serperior
Scrafty
Archeops
Galvantua
Golurk
?????
What should I use for my last Pokemon? The two I've narrowed it down to are Simipour and Reiniclus.
Since you have Archeops or Golurk as your Flier, I guess you can go with Simipour as your Surfer.
The ridiculous time it takes to level them up and evolve them is still more worthwhile than using, say, Trubbish or Purrloin. You're exaggerating.
Not if you go to all the post-League routes, where the levels are obscenely high.
Okay so I updated this. I also have jumpluff who helped me translate everything and included the pictures. Thanks jumpluff!
The format is slightly changed for now. Eventually it will be re-molded similarly to what it was originally, but I need a lot more discussion flowing that doesn't exactly involve "help me with x and y team". So I'm asking for a lot of help with deciding on what Pokemon goes into what tier. I went off from some of the top of my knowledge and from a few insiders, so obviously this isn't accurate to start.
Here's what we need right off the bat:
- Splitting Mid into two different tiers. One Upper Mid and one Lower Mid should suffice.
- Discussion on any shaky Pokemon. Tympole, Petilil, Cottonee, etc.
- Placing a Pokemon in a specific tier. DO NOT ARGUE ONE POKEMON OVER ANOTHER. At the moment it is in alphabetical order.
I encourage serious tier discussion please.
The format is slightly changed for now. Eventually it will be re-molded similarly to what it was originally, but I need a lot more discussion flowing that doesn't exactly involve "help me with x and y team". So I'm asking for a lot of help with deciding on what Pokemon goes into what tier. I went off from some of the top of my knowledge and from a few insiders, so obviously this isn't accurate to start.
Here's what we need right off the bat:
- Splitting Mid into two different tiers. One Upper Mid and one Lower Mid should suffice.
- Discussion on any shaky Pokemon. Tympole, Petilil, Cottonee, etc.
- Placing a Pokemon in a specific tier. DO NOT ARGUE ONE POKEMON OVER ANOTHER. At the moment it is in alphabetical order.
I encourage serious tier discussion please.
Once again, I have to question the placement of Minccino in low tier. Fast experience gain, solid Rock/Fighting coverage with good Atk and Technician, and available before the fourth gym. Takes a little babying until you get it to level 31 and evolve, but it kicks ass after that.
Mincinno is at least in the Upper Mid tier for sure.
- Petilil NEEDS to be High Teir. It's significantly better than both Snivy and Pansage in-game. Starting out with Growth/Sleep Powder/Mega Drain is good, but it only gets better once you get Giga Drain at Lv 26, and after evolution, at Lv 28, you get Butterfly Dance.
If you get a decent Hidden Power type, all the more power to Petilil. The in-game trade one has Ground at Power 40, which isn't that good. However, seeing as Petilil can even sweep Resistances by setting up in their faces, only the Sap Sippers can really stop her.
- Tympole should be moved down to High Mid when it is created. I've used it, and frankly, wasn't too impressed. I prefer Panpour or Oshawott, frankly. It literally is an inferior Swampert/Gastrodon in-game.
- Sandile should also be moved there. Enough people have said to have issues with it's bulk and/or speed before evolution. I haven't used it, but it dosen't sound that Sandile is in the same leuage as Scraggy and freinds.
- Lillipup needs to go down to High Mid. It's great early game, yes. But starts to drag it's heels later in the game.
- Tepig can probobly go down to Upper Mid as well, if only because it's outclassed by Darumaka
- Cottonee is not an attacker. It generaly sits there seeding and stalling until things die. For in-game, that is not desireable. Low Mid or Low Teir for it.
- I support Maractus being moved up a teir to Low Mid. I'm using one on my current run, and it's actually pretty decent. It works like a somewhat inferior Lilligant, but it was still eough to sweep Clay with, which Snivy or Pansage couldn't do [They can't handle Excadrill]. It also has more raw might than Snivy and Excadrill, right off the bat. Finally, it does provide a Base 120 STAB at only Lv 38, Petal Dance, coming from a Base 105 Sp.attack. Not too bad, especially if you get some defense/speed/evasion boosts from Acupressure [Which Giga Drain helps you abuse]
- Klink to High Mid when it's created. Caught at the same time as Joltic, and arguably MORE useful [Only major fight it dosen't have an advantage in is Renbu. Just too bad he's not Steel/Electric, to get STAB on it, or else he certainly would be High Teir] Worth mentioning is that Gear Grind is effectivly a Base 100 STAB as well. Then there's Body Purge for bosses, and to resolve Speed issues. Charge Beam and Flash Cannon are good too.
- Joltic to Upper Mid. It's too late in the game for high teir. If it stays there, Klink should be raised, because Klink is more useful against in-game bosses.
I'm not a fan of the babying period, but his multi hit moves seem intriguing enough. Its definitely a gamble though. Maybe low mid for him.
Raikaria seems to be just rambling, so I won't bother responding to him. This quote is especially hilarious:
Yeah come back when you've played the game, buddy.
On another note, I will also say that Petilil is the most overrated Pokemon mentioned in this topic. Literally the ONLY moves it learns are grass moves which are resisted by 7 different types. Its by far the worst offensive type in the game, and Butterfly Dance isn't going to save it. Speaking of Butterfly Dance, its essentially a glorified Work Up. The speed boost is largely irrelevant considering Lilligant (and half the Pokemon in High tier for that matter) have no problem outspeeding the enemy. As a matter of fact, a lot of Pokemon in High tier can OHKO without a boost like Butterfly Dance. Oh, and it sucks ass before it evolves.
Petilil isn't bad, but not quite high tier good. Upper Mid is more reasonable (and on that note, I think Cottonee can drop out of high as well)
I find it a bit more hilarious he tried hyping Kliing. Which has 55 base Attack. Comes at Level 27. Doesn't evolve until 11 levels later. Oh did I forget to mention that Gear Change is pretty much his only good move? Even once it evolves it has... 80 base Attack. That's fucking awesome isn't it? He's only lucky Klinklang will happen by the time you reach the Elite 4. I mean I get it's durable and Klinklang isn't terrible but... seriously? Kling over Voltik, who at least has a semi-usable movepool and Charge Beam at least raises his mediocre Special Attack to acceptable?
I mean... come the fuck on. KLING!?! Whoever else wants to step and defend Kling... fine. But you better present damned good evidence as to why to use it over, say, Cobalion who requires about the same detour route as Level 31 Kling but has a much better movepool.
I mean... come the fuck on. KLING!?! Whoever else wants to step and defend Kling... fine. But you better present damned good evidence as to why to use it over, say, Cobalion who requires about the same detour route as Level 31 Kling but has a much better movepool.
What happened to the tier? Alphabetical ordering? Really? :/
Yeah, I think I jumped the gun on him a bit. Talked to Colonel about him and he's convinced me that he should be mid.
The format is to help weed out the good Mid on down Pokemon from the bad and sorting them through easier.
Also to help with the convincing. Minccino at least can come at Level 24, which is 1 level away from Tail Slap. While granted that's 7 levels until it can evolve, it's a bit more forgiving than most Pokemon. Rock Blast is also conveniently placed for the 6th and 7th Gyms.
Pidove is that low on the list? I mean ok, it doesn't really shine until it gets return and fly, but lower than Deino and Larvesta? Really?
It comes really early, has a great in game ability in super luck, combined with air cutter and scope lens, learns roost very early. By Nimbasa city you'll get return, Driftveil has fly.
Unfezant has 105 attack and 93 speed, ingame that's not THAT bad right?
Ok so it's not Sigiliph, nor is it a Staraptor, but come on it's not THAT bad or hard to train either, and as far as flying types go probably the easiest to get.
It comes really early, has a great in game ability in super luck, combined with air cutter and scope lens, learns roost very early. By Nimbasa city you'll get return, Driftveil has fly.
Unfezant has 105 attack and 93 speed, ingame that's not THAT bad right?
Ok so it's not Sigiliph, nor is it a Staraptor, but come on it's not THAT bad or hard to train either, and as far as flying types go probably the easiest to get.
Stop freaking.
The list is in alphabetical order.
Yea ok, sorry, I'm not freaking.
I'm just surprised it's even in the lowest tier to begin with. Surely it's a mid tier flyer.
But I suppose not.
Sigilyph badly outclasses it, even Swanna is better thanks to actual type coverage. >_>
- Status