Pokémon Infernape

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TheBritishMafia said:
I mean't sun nuking in particular, and Infen-rape actually had a place on rain teams, as it was often one of the few pokemon that could function in rain bar one of it's STABs while countering / checking Sun too (no sun sweeper wanted boosted flare blitz to it). but yeah, I suppose you could be right.
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No, Infernape was NOT used on rain teams to check sun teams. Volcarona was used on rain because it had Hurricane, so it wasn't completely useless against weatherless and sand teams. Moltres was used in the no-SR meta because it checked Volcarona very well, and it too had Hurricane. Infernape's only use was as a sun nuke last gen, and it faced stiff competition from Darmanitan and Victini.
 
It's worth noting that SD GK Infernape pretty much 6-0's standard stall (Chansey - Quag - Aegislash - Venusaur - Heatran - Skarm/Zapdos/Mandi) with just Rocks up.


+2 252 Atk Life Orb Infernape Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 1154-1360 (163.9 - 193.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
0- SpA Life Orb Infernape Grass Knot (80 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Quagsire: 395-468 (100.2 - 118.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 Atk Life Orb Infernape Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Aegislash-Shield: 616-725 (190.1 - 223.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 Atk Life Orb Infernape Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 164+ Def Thick Fat Mega Venusaur: 291-346 (79.9 - 95%) -- 50% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252 Atk Life Orb Infernape Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Heatran: 829-977 (214.7 - 253.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 Atk Life Orb Infernape Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 232+ Def Skarmory: 502-593 (150.2 - 177.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 Atk Life Orb Infernape Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Zapdos: 348-411 (90.6 - 107%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252 Atk Life Orb Infernape Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mandibuzz: 304-359 (71.6 - 84.6%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

Infernape @ Life Orb
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 Def
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Close Combat
- Flare Blitz
- Grass Knot
 
What are peoples opinions of infernape as a lead?

Infernape @LifeOrb/@FocusSash
252 atk / 252 spe / 4 hp
Jolly
-Stealth Rock
-Taunt/CC
-Flare Blitz/Fire Punch
-U-turn

Iv'e ran this set and it works decently well but there are much better roles for leads with Taunt + U-Turn (a.k.a. Crobat). What I like about this is its something Players usually don't expect infernape to set up rocks and a life orb'd,blaze flare blitz hurts a good amount of the tier.
 
I like running fire punch over flare blitz, solely because of recoil. That amount of HP lose can literally mean life or death for infernape against a lot of pokes especially considering the low bulk that this thing carries (74/71/71) his decently high attack can crush more pokes than a flare blitz can allow, because of recoil.
 
eriados said:
It's worth noting that SD GK Infernape pretty much 6-0's standard stall (Chansey - Quag - Aegislash - Venusaur - Heatran - Skarm/Zapdos/Mandi) with just Rocks up.


+2 252 Atk Life Orb Infernape Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 1154-1360 (163.9 - 193.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
0- SpA Life Orb Infernape Grass Knot (80 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Quagsire: 395-468 (100.2 - 118.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 Atk Life Orb Infernape Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Aegislash-Shield: 616-725 (190.1 - 223.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 Atk Life Orb Infernape Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 164+ Def Thick Fat Mega Venusaur: 291-346 (79.9 - 95%) -- 50% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252 Atk Life Orb Infernape Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Heatran: 829-977 (214.7 - 253.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 Atk Life Orb Infernape Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 232+ Def Skarmory: 502-593 (150.2 - 177.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 Atk Life Orb Infernape Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Zapdos: 348-411 (90.6 - 107%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252 Atk Life Orb Infernape Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mandibuzz: 304-359 (71.6 - 84.6%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

Infernape @ Life Orb
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 Def
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Close Combat
- Flare Blitz
- Grass Knot
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GREAT POST! This is the exact set i run

Mcdoodles said:
I like running fire punch over flare blitz, solely because of recoil. That amount of HP lose can literally mean life or death for infernape against a lot of pokes especially considering the low bulk that this thing carries (74/71/71) his decently high attack can crush more pokes than a flare blitz can allow, because of recoil.
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Flare Blitz OHKO's Gliscor at +2 but Fire Punch doesnt
 
Mcdoodles said:
I like running fire punch over flare blitz, solely because of recoil. That amount of HP lose can literally mean life or death for infernape against a lot of pokes especially considering the low bulk that this thing carries (74/71/71) his decently high attack can crush more pokes than a flare blitz can allow, because of recoil.
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But the damage difference is extremely noticeable, and although it gets the Iron Fist boost, it's just not as powerful as Flare Blitz, even if blitz has recoil.
 
Infernape can be Physical, Special, or even a Mixed Sweeper. But mostly, It's handled as a Scout.
Because of its 76/71/71 defenses, it's not gonna last long in battle, but thanks to its speed, 108, Infernape can outrun most sweepers below 100 base speed.

On Infernape's 4 weaknesses; Water, Psychic, Ground, and Flying, it's pretty hard to switch into Infernape on a battle because it could be fatal for Infernape to receive some random attacks.
 
Here's what I'm running:
Infernape @Muscle Band (Prob change that to expert belt.)
Iron Fist
Jolly Nature
252 Atk, 252 Speed, 4HP
Close Combat/Considering T-Punch
Mach Punch
Swords Dance
Fire Punch

This set forms an extremely effective lure+destructor to Aegislash, which funnily enough, people will use their free switch to send in against Ape. They KS, and I predict it, use SD, and OHKO with Fire Punch, w/o hazards. The rest is pretty simple. Close Combat for a "Last Resort" sort of nuke attack, Mach Punch for priority + it gets STAB, Iron Fist, and Muscle Band to hit pretty hard. SD for boosting, and Fire Punch for Fire STAB. It usually wrecks face and takes out 2-3 pokes just SR plus hitting them with the appropriate attack. Max speed allows you to outspeed most threats, and get in two hits before they can even retaliate (Except Scarfers). Most of the time, unless they resist both attacks, two hits plus SR is sufficient to KO any opponent, especially if boosted. If they have a defensive poke that takes more hits, seeing as Ape is a good wallbreaker, they usually fail to stall him out. God I love this guy. Just make sure Talonflame is nowhere to be found before you send him in.
 
It's not as simple as thinking that they'll always use king's shield. If they use shadow ball on the SD turn, then you lose your infernape to shadow sneak next turn.
 
alphatron said:
It's not as simple as thinking that they'll always use king's shield. If they use shadow ball on the SD turn, then you lose your infernape to shadow sneak next turn.
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Well, yes. That is true. On the other hand, if they use Shadow Ball, my logical answer would be switch to Porygon-Z, since I use him as well. And after their Shadow Ball, a Shadow Sneak would be pretty easy to predict. Though they would get serious damage on Ape. Maybe should've mentioned this in my first post. Good point though.
 
Woah I love that SD grass knot build. It's a shame fire punch+iron fist doesn't provide enough power as LO + Flare Blits recoil would seem to make sweeping multiple pokes much harder. I still love it though. I've been looking for a good 'Nape set to try and that is definitely it. It helps that I have a burning hatred for Quagsire.

I'm going to look into a team that puts a lot of pressure on Gliscor / Mandibuzz and similar defensive flyers to test the effectiveness of fire punch+iron fist. Seems like a decent enough way to get around the biggest problems of the reduced damage in fire stab.

With rain all but gone and defensive teams shaping up the way they are I could see Infernape maintaining a decent amount of relevance in OU with both SD and mixed sets very possible and adding danger to many pokemon who can only switch in on one or the other.

Just had a thought spurred on by Mandibuzz/Gliscor being slightly problematic. Nasty Plot. Coverage is tough to figure out but getting close combat to kill the blobs and tyranitar you would lure back in seems sweet.

Maybe something like this:

Infernape @ Life Orb
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 4 Att / 252 SpA / 252 Spe Naive/Hasty
-Nasty Plot
-Fire Blast
-Close Combat
-Grass Knot

You're walled by dragons, but the SD set seems to be as well so it would take similar partners for that problem. This would be a good way to surprise defensive ground types.

Stab close combat is what would separate it in my mind from every other special sweeper

4 Atk Life Orb Infernape Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Heatran: 330-393 (85.4 - 101.8%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

4 Atk Life Orb Infernape Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 463-546 (65.7 - 77.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

4 Atk Life Orb Infernape Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Blissey: 632-743 (88.5 - 104%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

4 Atk Life Orb Infernape Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Mega Tyranitar: 489-582 (121 - 144%) -- guaranteed OHKO


Thunderwave Chansey would be a problem with no prior damage, but without lefties getting chansey to OHKO levels with prior damage is more than doable with the right pressure support. I've done it with other mons that need similar HP levels to beat chansey so I don't see why it couldn't be done with infernape. I love that Infernape can use all of these pokemon to win the the turn to nasty plot and then lure them back in after the boost.

Any thoughts?
 
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Ogami said:
Maybe something like this:

Infernape @ Life Orb
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 4 Att / 252 SpA / 252 Spe Naive/Hasty
-Nasty Plot
-Fire Blast
-Close Combat
-Grass Knot

...

Any thoughts?
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Here are a few Grass Knot calculations;

252 SpA Life Orb Infernape Grass Knot (60 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Azumarill: 177-208 (43.8 - 51.4%) -- 6.6% chance to 2HKO

252 SpA Life Orb Infernape Grass Knot (100 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Cloyster: 455-536 (188 - 221.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252 SpA Life Orb Infernape Grass Knot (100 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Assault Vest Donphan: 244-289 (63.5 - 75.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252 SpA Life Orb Infernape Grass Knot (120 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Mega Gyarados: 234-276 (70.4 - 83.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252 SpA Life Orb Infernape Grass Knot (120 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Mamoswine: 439-517 (103.5 - 121.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252 SpA Life Orb Infernape Grass Knot (20 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Rotom-W: 34-42 (11.1 - 13.8%) -- possibly the worst move ever

252 SpA Life Orb Infernape Grass Knot (80 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Starmie: 221-263 (84.6 - 100.7%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO

I was skeptic about Grass Knot when I saw your post, and though I checked to see if it was useful at all, it looks like it doesn't do a whole lot. It gives you a way to OHKO Cloyster (who fears Close Combat anyway and can usually be taken down by any special move at all,) and Mamoswine (which is kind of useful, but he's not a terribly difficult foe to force out by other means, and he too fears Close Combat.) Not guaranteeing an OHKO against Starmie is pretty bad, and the Pokemon you're 2HKOing otherwise can either take a huge chunk out of Infernape (if not OHKO,) anyway or, in Azumarill's case, 2HKO with Aqua Jet anyway. Rock-types like Tyranitar and Terrakion are hit harder by Close Combat, and using one of your STABs is preferable on all neutral targets.

So, yeah. Grass Knot doesn't look like its worth it.
 
Seiterman: I'm really not buying your argument with the calc support you've given. First of all, you mention nothing of +2 calcs which are kind of the point of the build. To nasty plot. If you're not playing to nasty plot with an NP Infernape then a mixed set with further coverage would simply be better. Secondly, no mention of stealth rock. As with the SD build, stealth rock is really important to beating certain pokemon and should be prioritized. With stealth rock you win the predicted starmie and gyarados switch ins.

+2 252 SpA Life Orb Infernape Grass Knot (120 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Gyarados: 291-343 (87.6 - 103.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

252 SpA Life Orb Infernape Grass Knot (120 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Gyarados: 147-173 (44.2 - 52.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock or you can still go for the 2hko if you're not nasty plotting for some reason.

You also use some suspect sets/pokemon as an argument. Azumarill is a bad example because I'm rarely going to stay in on an azumarill and setting up while it is still around is just silly, unless you don't think it will switch in for some reason. Chunking it for half (most don't run full HP, but around 168) on the switch is actually great, hampering the ability for the azu to use infernape as set up bait which is the most dangerous thing an azu could do against an infernape user. AV Donphan is a nice try but not only is Donphan an unpopular choice in OU, but AV on him is even more so.

Honestly +2 Fire Blast is fine for 2hko'ing or ohko'ing most of what you listed, but +2 grass knot gives you better accuracy (actually really important when relying on a move with fire blast's accuracy as your main sweeping move) and nice coverage on select threats that don't give a crap about fire blast or close combat (gastrodon/quagsire/jellicent, there are probably a few others but that's what I got off the top of my head). Rotom-Wash is mostly physically defensive or scarfed at this point so I don't see much use in that calc you've presented either.

+2 252 SpA Life Orb Infernape Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Rotom-W: 187-222 (61.5 - 73%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

Not too hard to build a team that gets a Rotom-W down to that HP level. If this is your plan then it is not too hard to scout which set it is. If the Rotom-W is in fact specially defensive, then this:

4 Atk Life Orb Infernape Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Rotom-W: 165-195 (54.2 - 64.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

Again, with how much action the average workhorse Rotom-W sees it is relatively easy to knock it down to such an HP level.

All of this is just theory though, so after testing grass knot may prove to be lack luster. It seemed to be the best coverage move on paper and was the reason why I like the SD set, but maybe another move would be better for NP. HP Rock is one alternative that is interesting, giving nice coverage on a couple dragons, the charizards and hitting any talonflame switch ins.

I'm not sure but I'm definitely not deterred from grass knot yet and see a lot of upside to its use on Infernape.
 
Jhon said:
Pretty much the set I'd been trying out. Though I opted for Fire Blast instead of Overheat and used a 168Atk/88SpAtk spread, which is the minimum attack investment needed to 1HKO 252/0 Heatran with Close Combat (168 Atk Life Orb Infernape Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Heatran: 390-460 (101 - 119.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO). Gunk shot is surprisingly useful against faeries with its new buffed accuracy (70 -> 80) certainly more notable than Poison Jab and significantly stronger than 252 Iron Fist Thunder Punches against the likes of Azumarill and Togekiss.

168 Atk Life Orb Infernape Gunk Shot vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Azumarill: 328-387 (81.1 - 95.7%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Life Orb Iron Fist Infernape Thunder Punch vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Azumarill: 265-312 (65.5 - 77.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
168 Atk Life Orb Infernape Gunk Shot vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Togekiss: 283-335 (75.6 - 89.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Life Orb Iron Fist Infernape Thunder Punch vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Togekiss: 229-270 (61.2 - 72.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
168 Atk Life Orb Infernape Gunk Shot vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Sylveon: 385-455 (97.7 - 115.4%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO
252 Atk Life Orb Infernape Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Sylveon: 309-367 (78.4 - 93.1%) -- 37.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
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I run that EV spread cuz its fun to watch a Landorus(ether form) and gliscor just melt down from the HP ice. Not too sure on the calcs on that though... But it seems like I'm missing quite a bit not running 168 Atk.
 
Infernape is actually a good PKMN, but the thing isn't Infernape, but the metagame around it last generation with rain being a common weather, however, Infernape is much better this generation because of the addition of Aegislash (top 5 usage iirc) and rain being nerfed to a point of getting 1.7% usage. The two massive new things it needs to play around and do massive damage on the switch to is Talonflame and Azumarill, but Thunderpunch can dispatch them with prior damage to the latter. These are the best sets this gen: Blaze should be used on CB since Flare Blitz wheres it down to a point where Blaze CB Flare Blitz OHKOs pretty much anything. Infernape is B Rank for a reason, the metagame.

Infernape | Life Orb | Iron Fist
Naive | 168 Atk / 88 SpA / 252 Spe
Fire Blast | Close Combat | Hidden Power [Ice] | Thunderpunch

Infernape | Choice Band | Blaze / Iron Fist
Naive | 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Flare Blitz | Close Combat | Gunk Shot | Mach Punch / U-turn
 
Ogami said:
Seiterman: Thiiiiiings.
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The main point is that Grass Knot does a crappy job of hitting things that are actually weak to it. Of course +2 hits are going to hurt. That's how sweepers should work. The fact that it can't OHKO frail Pokemon that are weak to it consistently (ie. it needs SR support to take out Starmie of all things,) is pretty suspect. Sure, taking a chunk out of Azumarill on the switch is neat, but not as neat as Azumarill taking an Infernape-shaped chunk out of your team if you don't switch him immediately. It doesn't particularly matter that Grass Knot doesn't do much to Rotom-W; the point of the calc was to show how your Fighting STAB is tremendously better no matter what type of Rotom-W you're up against.

And AV Donphan is almost certainly the best Donphan set you could run. Unless you really, really want Donphan to run SR instead of any of the myriad things that could use it instead there's literally no reason to not give him an Assault Vest. I don't particularly care for the mon either way, but don't argue that AV Donphan isn't the Donphan you should be looking out for. It is literally the only Donphan you should be looking out for.

Honestly, Grass Knot is one of the better options for a Special coverage move on Infernape. That in itself should be telling though. I'd go with other Special sweepers, and leave Infernape to things he's better at like full mixed sets.
 
Vertex said:
Infernape is actually a good PKMN, but the thing isn't Infernape, but the metagame around it last generation with rain being a common weather, however, Infernape is much better this generation because of the addition of Aegislash (top 5 usage iirc) and rain being nerfed to a point of getting 1.7% usage. The two massive new things it needs to play around and do massive damage on the switch to is Talonflame and Azumarill, but Thunderpunch can dispatch them with prior damage to the latter. These are the best sets this gen: Blaze should be used on CB since Flare Blitz wheres it down to a point where Blaze CB Flare Blitz OHKOs pretty much anything. Infernape is B Rank for a reason, the metagame.

Infernape | Life Orb | Iron Fist
Naive | 168 Atk / 88 SpA / 252 Spe
Fire Blast | Close Combat | Hidden Power [Ice] | Thunderpunch

Infernape | Choice Band | Blaze / Iron Fist
Naive | 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Flare Blitz | Close Combat | Gunk Shot | Mach Punch / U-turn
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I believe that that sums it up quite nicely. Infernape is quite awesome, but is currently hindered by the metagame. And so, Porygon-Z makes a nice partner to physical Ape. With them, you have excellent coverage with BoltBeam+FireFight, and special and physical wallbreaking abilities. Porygon-Z with BoltBeam covers all of Ape's checks and counters that I can find, and Ape covers all of Porygon-Z's checks and counters I can find. They really are quite the dream team. Btw, I do realize this is in singles.

...I just have this really bad feeling that there is something incredibly wrong with this post, and then it will get pointed out, and I will feel pretty stupid.
 
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I've been using this set as a mixed anti lead:
Infernape @ Life Orb
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 252 Spa / 252 Spe / 4 HP
Timid Nature
-Taunt
-U-turn
-Flamethrower
-Brick Break

Taunt something like Forretress, burn Skarm, Brick Break screeners, and U-turn Smeargle and go into a Spore absorber. Has so far been moderately effective, although I'm not entirely happy with the U-turn life orb combo, as it can cause more recoil than damage with this EV spread.
 
88 SpA Life Orb Infernape Hidden Power Ice vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Gliscor: 322-385 (90.9 - 108.7%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO

88 SpA Life Orb Infernape Hidden Power Ice vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Landorus: 307-364 (95.9 - 113.7%) -- 75% chance to OHKO

88 SpA Life Orb Infernape Hidden Power Ice vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Landorus-T: 307-364 (80.3 - 95.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
 
The_Derpy_Chicken said:
I believe that that sums it up quite nicely. Infernape is quite awesome, but is currently hindered by the metagame. And so, Porygon-Z makes a nice partner to physical Ape. With them, you have excellent coverage with BoltBeam+FireFight, and special and physical wallbreaking abilities. Porygon-Z with BoltBeam covers all of Ape's checks and counters that I can find, and Ape covers all of Porygon-Z's checks and counters I can find. They really are quite the dream team. Btw, I do realize this is in singles.

...I just have this really bad feeling that there is something incredibly wrong with this post, and then it will get pointed out, and I will feel pretty stupid.
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Might be Keldeo. Speed ties Infernape at worst (a lot run Scarf it seems), easily KOs with Surf/Hydro Pump. Outspeeds Porygon-Z and OHKOs with Secret Sword.

252 SpA Keldeo Surf vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Infernape: 386-456 (131.7 - 155.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Keldeo Secret Sword vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Porygon-Z: 372-438 (119.2 - 140.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
 
Groombridge said:
Might be Keldeo. Speed ties Infernape at worst (a lot run Scarf it seems), easily KOs with Surf/Hydro Pump. Outspeeds Porygon-Z and OHKOs with Secret Sword.

252 SpA Keldeo Surf vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Infernape: 386-456 (131.7 - 155.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Keldeo Secret Sword vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Porygon-Z: 372-438 (119.2 - 140.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Click to expand...
Nice find. I wouldn't have thought of Keldeo as counter to both, since it's water type, and weak to T-bolt. But I guess since it's fighting type, it has a super effective STAB on both, and it's apparently also faster. So nice find. However, if that is the only counter to the two of them, (which I highly doubt,) then you would have four slots on your team just to counter Keldeo. Not very good odds for Keldeo. But then they have five other guys to counter your counters... and I'm going to stop there.
 
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