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Kaizer's Sandstorm Setup.

Kaaizer

Kaaizer's Sandstorm Setup



tyranitar.png
latias.png




Intro:

Weather, a now prominent effect in the 5TH Gen Metagame. Something alot of people aren't very please about, Me being one of them. However it seems that the only way to really succeed now is to have a weather, to combat another weather. Personally in 4th Gen i loved to play aggressively, making the opponent have to switch to take my attacks. But I've decided to take a different approach to the New Metagame with a Sandstorm Stall orientated team. The team I've created however uses no New "5th Gen toys" but instead goes back to the 4th gen Basics of Setup & Rape. I Built my team around a Scarf Tyranitar as i have loved the Pokemon since the 2nd Gen.

Building a Sandstorm team for the New generation proved quite difficult as the current Metagame consists of Weather abusing whores. I personally don't like to abuse weather because i find it cheap. That is why i don't use Excadrill or any other unfair cheap weather Pokemon. I tried to create a Core Offence, mixed with a solid defensive structure. I am defiantly looking for a way to Better this team and am open to all "Constructive Criticism" and am willing to take all opinions on Board. The team i have created has defiantly proved efficient on the Pokemon Online Server, however i Haven't had enough time to make its true potential felt.


In Depth-Analysis:


485.gif



Heatran (M) @ Air Balloon
Trait: Flash Fire
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Fire Blast
- Earth Power
- Stealth Rock
- Hidden Power [Ice]

An amazingly useful Lead / Attacker suggested by LK.
I absolutely love using this Heatran, with air balloon i can either take an offensive or defensive roll, which i love in any Pokemon. I use Heatran as my lead because of it's plethora of resistances and ability to Hit the opponent extremely hard from the get-go if i so choose. If Heatran can manage to come in on a predicted fir move and get the flash fire boost, his Fire Blast hits like an absolute monster. After the flash fire boost it has a 70% chance to One HKO Max HP, Max SDef Swampert, which is no easy feat considering it resist the move.

Heatran can be quite the Potent early game & late game attacker, I attempt to take out Heatran And Scizors weaknesses before i worry about other opposing enemy's because they are extremely powerful when there Checks are gone, Hidden power ice One HKO's Salamence, does 50% to Multiscale Dragonite and Does 70% to 128 SDef Latias. I have found it incredibly useful with Air balloon because i can normally One HKO dragon types before they can earthquake me for the One HKO.

Earth power gives me solid coverage and allows me to destroy opposing Heatran and other fire types.



205.gif



Forretress (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SDef
Sassy Nature (+Def, -Spd)
- Spikes
- Toxic Spikes
- Rapid Spin
- Volt Switch

First off all i would like to point out that. Forretress > Ferrothorn: Why?
First off, Forretress new 5TH Gen toy is Volt Switch which i really love to use, plus I find that Forretress has far more opportunities to set up spikes / toxic spikes because i find it better in General. I use +Def, Max Def Ev's so i can wall Choice Band dragons and set sup psychical attackers. I think that Forretress only takes 40-50% damage from Choice Band Haxorus Outrage and can volt switch to Tyranitar for the K.O.
Rapid spin because my team is vulnerable to Spikes / Stealth rock, plus i love luring out Jellicent because out and volt switching to Tyranitar for the Crunch / Pursuit One HKO.

I find that Forretress can wall a majority of new Metagame Weather threats, It takes Psychical hits all day and the only real problem it has is with damn Excadrill.



380.gif



Latias (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Psyshock
- Dragon Pulse
- Recover

Latias, how i love this monster. One of my new favorite Dragon types. It reaches 250 Spd with the Ev Spread, It takes water hits all day, something my team has a serious weakness with. After 1 calm mind Black Sludge Max SAtk Gengar's shadow ball only deals around 48% - 53 %, allowing for a speed tie for the One HKO from Psyshock.
Why Psyshock over Psychic? So i can Obliterate Pink blobs named Blissey / Chansey. It can also do some serious damage to more frail defensive Pokemon, and i find it to work better in conjunction with Dragon pulse then psychic. Recover because Sandstorm damage is a pain, and i like for Latias to stay healthy so i can check Damn water moves. I have noticed recently that the only real threat to Latias is very strong psychical dark attacker / dragon attackers, something a Majority of Weather teams in particular seem to lack, Bar from Tyranitar. Latias also serves as a very, very nice check to Rotom-W / Calm Mind Virizion and Thundurus, 3 threats my team would otherwise crumble to, this is why it is essential to keep my Latias alive, and with proper team support it can sweep mid-late game.



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Scizor (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Technician
EVs: 248 HP / 92 Atk / 120 Def / 48 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Swords Dance
- Bullet Punch
- Roost / Brick Break
- Bug Bite

What can i say? Since Platinum's release this thing has Been an absolute Boss, One of the greatest late game sweepers i have ever used, this thing has replaced Lucario and does such a better job at cleaning up the Opponents weakened threats. Simple strategy of make the opponent switch, set up swords dance, use Bullet punch. This easy strategy works amazingly well when Scizors main threats have been destroyed.
You may be wondering why im using a spread of 248/92/120/0/0/48: I find that my "Bulky Scizor" works better then your average Smogon Set. This set allows me to outspeed opposing Scizor and some other slower Steel types so i can hit with Brick break before they hit me with something. I can normally manage 1 - 2 swords dances, and depending on the situations i either spam Bullet punches or cause switches, i had Pursuit over Bug Bite before, but realized i need a strong stab to hit Water types harder, plus it gains the Stab Boost.

Scizor main Roll on my team is Late game sweeper and early game Fire scouter.



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Tyranitar (M) @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Sand Stream
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Crunch
- Stone Edge
- Pursuit
- Superpower

Nobody, i mean Nobody uses ScarTar anymore. At-least No-one i have faced, i don't know why though, maybe there are better Scarfed Offensive attackers out there, but Tyranitar fills the roll of Killing Latias / Latios so damn efficiently. Plus he can hit damn hard with Stab Stone Edge & Stab Crunch. The main reason i use Tyranitar on a team that already has a Sandstorm starter in Hippowdon is because Tyranitar can fill 3 Roles; Offensive Threat, Special Sponger and Secondary weather inducer. He plays each role so Efficiently i couldn't pass up using Him, Plus he is a massive Dinosaur made of rock, Nuff Nuff Jigglypuff.

Max Spd, Max Atk to Be fast and hit hard. Superpower is so i can kill opposing Steel Types who would otherwise cause me trouble if they were running some form of Boosting set. Pursuit & Crunch because Trapping Latias / Latios after they have used Draco Meteor is way to much fun. The wow factor of using this set is enough for me to be pleased with it, I am however considering an alternative to using Tyranitar, as my fighting type weakness is far to great when Gengar is dead. However to do this i would have to be far more conservative with Hippowdon, Any Suggestions?


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Excadrill (M) @ Air Balloon
Trait: Sand Rush
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
Lonely Nature (+Atk, -Def)
- Swords Dance
- Earthquake
- X-Scissor
- Rock Slide

Ah, the Pokemon i hate the most make it's way onto my team.
I used to have a Gengar Here, but it wasn't doing alot except blocking rapid spin. I still need a spin blocker, but am not sure who to replace.
Everyone knows what this damn mole does, after one swords dance he reaches 810 attack coupled with 550 speed in the sand you would think he would be Uber, but no he is aloud to destroy every Pokemon that doesn't have defensive Ev's and isn't names Gliscor / Skarmory. I don't love this thing, but it is defiantly useful paired with Latias in the sand, they have both proved to work extraordinarily well together, because Excadrill is tankier then your average sweeper. He makes his appearance after sandstorm has been brought into play so i can check his counters and destroy them for a late game sweep! Yay for Overpowered Excadrill.

Air Balloon > Life orb because 810 attack is going to be 2 Hit KOing everything, plus the added ground resistance sometimes fools people into using earthquake on me which mean i get an extra swords dance, if i get +4 then the only way to stop me is with priority aqua jet, which does nothing anyway.


In Conclusion:
I feel as though my team is pretty solid, however not solid enough to reach the Top 50 as most top 50 teams are total weather destruction teams. My fighting attack weakness is clear, i have attempted to use Gyrados on this team before to no help as i couldn't set up with him using the dragon dance set and was killed far to quickly using the Sleep - RestTalk Set.
 
Threat List Here.

(Post's with Constructive criticism Are very, very welcome! I am in need of some definite changes as i keep losing to Hyper Offensive teams)
 
I have only ever been 1 HKO'd By a Choice Specs Politoads Hydro Pump
Click to expand...
Politoed is definately a threat to your team, as your best chance is to revenge with T-Tar. Gliscor could also be problematic. It could switch in on T-Tar or Lucario, Swords Dance, and punch large holes in your team. Heatran cannot safely switch in, so your best bet is probably Gengar.

i keep losing to Hyper Offensive teams
Click to expand...
A great way to counter Offensive teams is to try Gliscor.

Gliscor@Toxic Orb
Nature: Impish (+Def, -SAtk)
EVs: 252 HP, 184 Def, 72 Speed
-Swords Dance
-Protect/Taunt
-Earthquake
-Ice Fang/Facade

Basically, switch in on physical attacks and set up with Swords Dance. With Max HP and a lot ofDef, Gliscor can continue your team's stall and set-up theme. Shifting some EVs from defense to attack could increase damage output, but it's up to you.
This is not my moveset. This is taken from Iconic's post in the OU Analyses thread. The only change I made was slashing Protect over Taunt to better counter Offensive teams.
 
you might want to use a gastrodon and celebi/rotom on your team for water resistances as you have none and 3 weaknessess, celebi also gets stealth rock so it can fully replace hippowdown as two weather inducers is a bit unecessary. You might want to replace heatran with a sd excadrill as it is a great revenge killer and you are already a "weather abusing whore" for using ttar anyway.
 
Threats
  1. 186.png
    water.png
    Rain Teams, Lack of Water- type resist
  2. 640.png
    Calm Mind Virizion
  3. Ani479WMS.png
    Rotom-W

So this is an unorthodox team, but it seems like you have some major issues with threats and synergy issues as well. Rain teams are an absolute nightmare for your team, Specs or Scarf Politoad from the leading position can rip through your team alone. Rotom-W by itself or on rain is troublesome as well. Nothing can safely switch into a Hydro Pump, and it can also burn Tyranitar and Lucario. Calm Mind Virizion can also be problematic, as it can switch in on Pursuit / Crunch- locked Tyranitar get in a Calm Mind and cause problems. Your best hope is Heatran whose Fire Blast fails to KO (55.2% - 65.6%) and goes down to Focus Blast. Gengar can Disable Giga Drain, but then it has to deal with Hidden Power Ice, or vice versa. You're also heavily dependent on Gengar to go up against Calm Mind Reuniclus who otherwise rips through. Swords Dance Excadrill can also sweep coming in on Tyranitar's Pursuit / Crunch, only thing saving you is Lucario's Balloon, and with that gone, it's "gg" right there. With Hippowdon being a Specially Defensive variant, it just needs to be sitting at ~75% to be taken out. It also can't tank hits from other sand sweepers such as SD Landorus.

Solutions:

  • Solution A: CM Latias over Hippowdon
Hippowdon and Tyranitar on the same team is redundant. IMO Tyranitar should stay as it is your check to the Lati twins, Thundurus, and Scrafty. Hippowdon really isn't cutting it with Sdefensive spread. Calm Mind Reuniclus, Virizion, both Specially based threats hit it like a truck, while added Water- type weakness and vulnerability to many Rain sweepers also hurts. This also seems like an offensive team, Hippowdon doesn't really look like it fits. CM Latias however acts as a good answer to rain with support from its other members, and can take on Water- type attacks really well with its natural bulk and can exploit on them via Calm Mind. Rotom-W and Virizion also become manageable, both acting as set-up fodder for the eon Pokemon. It can also work as Pursuit bait to bring out an opportunity for Lucario to sweep. Without Hippowdon your team doesn't like to face Sand sweepers; Hippowdon already couldn't attacks from them too well without the proper Defense investment, but I will suggest way(s) to handle them.
  • Solution B: Choice Band Scizor over Forretress
Trickroom Reuniclus becomes more threatening than it already was with Hippowdon, Rock Polish Terrakion, Rock Polish Landorus also become problematic. They already were capable of hurting Hippowdon badly with the lack of Physical Defense. Scizor helps as a way to go up against Trickroom Reuniclus as well as Terrakion. It also brings pressure with boosted U-turns and a way to revenge kill with Bullet Punch and Quick Attack. Scizor can bait out Fire- type attacks for Heatran just like Forretress, but it also brings good offensive synergy with Lucario, weakening its checks and counters and allowing it to sweep. Scizor doesn't set-up hazards however, which is the only cons. Though your team already has powerful attackers to kind of compensate for the lack of hazards. Its basically a trade off of setting-up entry hazards for being able to check the threats that are problematic along with better offensive pressure and offensive synergy.
  • Solution C: Air Balloon Heatran over current set
With Latias taking care of waters, Tyranitar taking care of fast threats such as NP Thundurus, you might want to change Heatran to the Air Balloon variant. This variant gives you insurance against SD Excadrill along with Lucario as well as against RP Landorus. It also brings with it the freedom to choose attacks and is a special attacking powerhouse, while setting-up Stealth Rock for your team. IMO, both Heatran and Tyranitar scarfed, brings redundancy, and Heatran could do more as a Balloon variant.


Movesets:

380.png

Latias (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 Spe
Timid nature (+Spe, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Psychic / Psycho Shock
- Dragon Pulse
- Recover
---

212.png

Scizor (F) @ Choice Band
Ability: Technician
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Spe
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Bullet Punch
- Superpower
- U-turn
- Quick Attack
---

485.png

Heatran (F) @ Air Balloon
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spe
Timid nature (+Spe, -Atk)
- Fire Blast
- Hidden Power Ice
- Stealth Rock
- Earth Power
---

So to summarize:
  • CM Latias > Hippowdon
  • CB Scizor > Forretress
  • Air Balloon set on Heatran

GL
 
Hey there.

As LK mentioned, you have a huge problem with rain teams, Rotom-W, and CM Virizion. To fix all of these issues, I recommend an LO Latios.

Latios @ Life Orb
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Recover
- Surf
- Draco Meteor
- Psyshock

This Latios hits very hard, and with Recover, it can heal up after it switches in on water attacks from pokemon such as Politoed. It also walls Rotom-W pretty well, and can ohko it easily with Draco Meteor. Psyshock destroys Virizion, but can also dent pokemon such as Blissey. Surf ensures that you wont be walled by the likes of Heatran.

You don't need Jolly on Lucario, so run Adamant so you can get even more power. Adamant allows you to ko Skarmory after most of the time after a Swords Dance and Stealth Rock damage. Adamant Lucario still outspeeds most of the things it can (and can ko) with Jolly.

Since you do not have any real special walls, change Heatran to a specially defensive set. It can help out Latios, and also set up Stealth Rock.

Heatran (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 SDef
Calm Nature
- Protect
- Stealth Rock
- Roar
- Lava Plume

Roar allows you to phaze dangerous set up attackers, and also sets you rack up entry hazard damage. Protect allows you to scout your opponent's moves and get Leftovers recovery, which is more useful than say, Earth Power.

Change Forretress' ev spread to 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef with a Bold Nature. With Latios and Specially Defensive Tran now, you don't need a specially defensive Forretress. Also, replace Payback with Volt Switch, as the most common spin-blocker in OU is Jellicent, and Payback won't be doing much to it. Volt Switch will allow you to gain switch advantage, which is very important.

Good luck.
 
LK said:
Threats
  1. 186.png
    water.png
    Rain Teams, Lack of Water- type resist
  2. 640.png
    Calm Mind Virizion
  3. Ani479WMS.png
    Rotom-W

So this is an unorthodox team, but it seems like you have some major issues with threats and synergy issues as well. Rain teams are an absolute nightmare for your team, Specs or Scarf Politoad from the leading position can rip through your team alone. Rotom-W by itself or on rain is troublesome as well. Nothing can safely switch into a Hydro Pump, and it can also burn Tyranitar and Lucario. Calm Mind Virizion can also be problematic, as it can switch in on Pursuit / Crunch- locked Tyranitar get in a Calm Mind and cause problems. Your best hope is Heatran whose Fire Blast fails to KO (55.2% - 65.6%) and goes down to Focus Blast. Gengar can Disable Giga Drain, but then it has to deal with Hidden Power Ice, or vice versa. You're also heavily dependent on Gengar to go up against Calm Mind Reuniclus who otherwise rips through. Swords Dance Excadrill can also sweep coming in on Tyranitar's Pursuit / Crunch, only thing saving you is Lucario's Balloon, and with that gone, it's "gg" right there. With Hippowdon being a Specially Defensive variant, it just needs to be sitting at ~75% to be taken out. It also can't tank hits from other sand sweepers such as SD Landorus.

Solutions:

  • Solution A: CM Latias over Hippowdon
Hippowdon and Tyranitar on the same team is redundant. IMO Tyranitar should stay as it is your check to the Lati twins, Thundurus, and Scrafty. Hippowdon really isn't cutting it with Sdefensive spread. Calm Mind Reuniclus, Virizion, both Specially based threats hit it like a truck, while added Water- type weakness and vulnerability to many Rain sweepers also hurts. This also seems like an offensive team, Hippowdon doesn't really look like it fits. CM Latias however acts as a good answer to rain with support from its other members, and can take on Water- type attacks really well with its natural bulk and can exploit on them via Calm Mind. Rotom-W and Virizion also become manageable, both acting as set-up fodder for the eon Pokemon. It can also work as Pursuit bait to bring out an opportunity for Lucario to sweep. Without Hippowdon your team doesn't like to face Sand sweepers; Hippowdon already couldn't attacks from them too well without the proper Defense investment, but I will suggest way(s) to handle them.
  • Solution B: Choice Band Scizor over Forretress
Trickroom Reuniclus becomes more threatening than it already was with Hippowdon, Rock Polish Terrakion, Rock Polish Landorus also become problematic. They already were capable of hurting Hippowdon badly with the lack of Physical Defense. Scizor helps as a way to go up against Trickroom Reuniclus as well as Terrakion. It also brings pressure with boosted U-turns and a way to revenge kill with Bullet Punch and Quick Attack. Scizor can bait out Fire- type attacks for Heatran just like Forretress, but it also brings good offensive synergy with Lucario, weakening its checks and counters and allowing it to sweep. Scizor doesn't set-up hazards however, which is the only cons. Though your team already has powerful attackers to kind of compensate for the lack of hazards. Its basically a trade off of setting-up entry hazards for being able to check the threats that are problematic along with better offensive pressure and offensive synergy.
  • Solution C: Air Balloon Heatran over current set
With Latias taking care of waters, Tyranitar taking care of fast threats such as NP Thundurus, you might want to change Heatran to the Air Balloon variant. This variant gives you insurance against SD Excadrill along with Lucario as well as against RP Landorus. It also brings with it the freedom to choose attacks and is a special attacking powerhouse, while setting-up Stealth Rock for your team. IMO, both Heatran and Tyranitar scarfed, brings redundancy, and Heatran could do more as a Balloon variant.


Movesets:

380.png

Latias (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 Spe
Timid nature (+Spe, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Psychic / Psycho Shock
- Dragon Pulse
- Recover
---

212.png

Scizor (F) @ Choice Band
Ability: Technician
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Spe
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Bullet Punch
- Superpower
- U-turn
- Quick Attack
---

485.png

Heatran (F) @ Air Balloon
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spe
Timid nature (+Spe, -Atk)
- Fire Blast
- Hidden Power Ice
- Stealth Rock
- Earth Power
---

So to summarize:
  • CM Latias > Hippowdon
  • CB Scizor > Forretress
  • Air Balloon set on Heatran

GL
Click to expand...

Thank you for your extremely enlightened post.

I am currently using Latias > Hippowdon, i have changed Heatran to air ballon and stealth rock as i dont have Hippowdon. Lucario wasnt doing anything for me so i changed him to a choice Band Scizor.

I just faced a Rotom-W & Calm mind virizion and totally played around them with this new team, thank you for your latias suggestion, after one calm mind it 2HKO's Max SDef Spiritomb and Gliscor, +2 gliscor with 4 Atk only does 49-53%.

I will update my thread soon.
 
TheMasterOfOz said:
Hey there.

As LK mentioned, you have a huge problem with rain teams, Rotom-W, and CM Virizion. To fix all of these issues, I recommend an LO Latios.

Latios @ Life Orb
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Recover
- Surf
- Draco Meteor
- Psyshock

This Latios hits very hard, and with Recover, it can heal up after it switches in on water attacks from pokemon such as Politoed. It also walls Rotom-W pretty well, and can ohko it easily with Draco Meteor. Psyshock destroys Virizion, but can also dent pokemon such as Blissey. Surf ensures that you wont be walled by the likes of Heatran.

You don't need Jolly on Lucario, so run Adamant so you can get even more power. Adamant allows you to ko Skarmory after most of the time after a Swords Dance and Stealth Rock damage. Adamant Lucario still outspeeds most of the things it can (and can ko) with Jolly.

Since you do not have any real special walls, change Heatran to a specially defensive set. It can help out Latios, and also set up Stealth Rock.

Heatran (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 SDef
Calm Nature
- Protect
- Stealth Rock
- Roar
- Lava Plume

Roar allows you to phaze dangerous set up attackers, and also sets you rack up entry hazard damage. Protect allows you to scout your opponent's moves and get Leftovers recovery, which is more useful than say, Earth Power.

Change Forretress' ev spread to 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef with a Bold Nature. With Latios and Specially Defensive Tran now, you don't need a specially defensive Forretress. Also, replace Payback with Volt Switch, as the most common spin-blocker in OU is Jellicent, and Payback won't be doing much to it. Volt Switch will allow you to gain switch advantage, which is very important.

Good luck.
Click to expand...

Thank you for your Forretress input, He know causes just about every psychical threat to switch out, allowing me to gain momentum with a switch advantage, i am currently using the Spread and volt switch and love it far more then Payback.
 
Well since you decided to replace Lucario with Scizor instesd of with Forretress, you could try a SD set to fill in Lucario's shoes and capitalize on Latias being pursuit bait. Up to you
 
Hello you have a huge victreebell weakness. if it has hp fire it kills forry and luke, if it has hp ground it kills Heatran. STAB grass kills ttar and hippo while gengar is frail. try an Infernape somewhere to kill it with fire-type attacks (super effective).
 
Nosferalto said:
Hello you have a huge victreebell weakness. if it has hp fire it kills forry and luke, if it has hp ground it kills Heatran. STAB grass kills ttar and hippo while gengar is frail. try an Infernape somewhere to kill it with fire-type attacks (super effective).
Click to expand...
Victreebell is not an OU threat, and the rare times people use it is when it's on sun teams. He has Tyranitar for sun so it's not a problem.
 
LK said:
Well since you decided to replace Lucario with Scizor instesd of with Forretress, you could try a SD set to fill in Lucario's shoes and capitalize on Latias being pursuit bait. Up to you
Click to expand...

I am kind of torn between swords dance and choice band, I personally prefer a choice band so I can deal heavy damage off the bat, but I defiantly need a potent strong setup sweeper.

I will give a bulky swords dance set and try and use my new latias as set up bait. I'm also torn between using a gastrodon or not, my water weakness I's no were near as great noe though.

@nostafelto: victerebell Is hardly a threat to heatran unless it has HP ground, even then I have air balloon and I can just send out Tyranitar to take anything it has, as it has 364 defense in the sand plus it can 1hko with stealth rock and spike support. Plus that pokemon isn't a particular threat of I send Out Tyranitar.
 
Have now changed.

Bulky Swords Dance Scizor > Lucario
Calm Mind Latias > Hippowdon.
Stealth Rock Leadtran @ Balloon > Scarfed Tran.
 
Run Hidden Power Fire over Psyshock on Latias. Killing Scizor and Ferrothorn is the most important thing, as Scizor can just Pursuit you for the easy 2hko and kill you eventually. Psyshock won't be killing Blissey regardless, and it definitely won't be killing Chansey; they can both switch in on the calm mind and Toxic stall Latias out.

On Scizour, run Roost over Brick Break. Something can't really be setting up when it's bulky and has no recovery move.
 
@ above: Not true, Latias is actually there to handle Rotom-W, who is used as set-up fodder and can't do much to Latias with a few Calm Minds in.

Vaporeon isn't that common, and Will-O-Wisp doesn't really hinder Latias (Recover)
 
Hi,

First off with the nitpicks, Gengar needs Leftovers because anything that tricks for your current black sludge can potentially trick it to something like Latias, which would not be good. Second, Heatran can use a Modest Nature to do more damage overall, since its speed tier isn't really the greatest anyway.

Now to the important stuff!

Excadrill really has a field day with this team, with Latias not doing enough to KO with a Dragon Pulse, and Excadrill can return with a powerful +2 Return or Rock Slide. Since it looks to me your team is leaning toward being stall based, I would suggest a Gliscor over your current forretress.

Gliscor @ Toxic Orb
Trait: Poison Heal
EVs: 244 HP / 176 Def / 88 Spd
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Swords Dance
- Protect
- Earthquake
- Ice Fang

This Gliscor will not only fix your problems with problem with Excadrill / Landorus / Terrakion, but it will also offer you some insurance vs. a very big threat to your team, Conkeldurr. The given EVs allow it maximum Posion Heal recovery and to speed creep on 244 speed mons. The reason I want to remove forretress is that for me, the spikes and toxic spikes support isn't particularly beneficial, and that it opens up more weaknesses than anything.

I would recommend running Pain Split over Disable on Gengar, since with Sand Storm running, Gengar's lifespan will be depleted heavily over time.

Another thing to consider is replacing Psyshock on Latias with Refresh, since the offensive CM role you have latias filling at the moment is better left to Latios.This will make it much more effective at countering Rotom-w with Will-o-wisp and being bulky overall.

If you want, you can run a Bulkier Scizor with 252 HP / 40 Atk / 216 SpDef and Roost over Brick Break to counter strong pokemon usually used in rain like Latios or a last resort check to Thunderus.

Good Luck!
 
Hi there, this team is fairly unorthodox and in this case that's a good thing. However at this point you seem to have a weakness to Dragon Dance Scrafty, as it can easily come in on Forretress on the turn it starts setting up hazards and use Dragon Dance. It also has the oppurtunity to set up on a Choice-locked Dark-type move on Tyranitar, allowing it to get two Dragon Dances and wreck our team with a combination or Drain Punch, Crunch, and Ice Punch, easily 2HKOing or OHKOing every memeber of your team, seeing as it hits almost everything on your team super effectively and everything neutrally. Another problem I can see is Volcorona; it can come in either when Heatran is setting up Stealth Rock (Volcorona can hit it with HP Rock) or later in the match when Heatran is down and they have a Rapid Spinner, allowing it to set up a Quiver Dance. Even if you immediately switch in Tyranitar, it can't take a Bug Buzz at +1 if Volcorona is running max Special Attack, meaning it can run right through the rest of your team without a care.

Now there are some solutions for this. Both Scrafty and Volcorona can be checked by one Pokemon. I strongly recommend you try Gyarados over your Gengar. Gyarados can use Intimidate to reset Scrafty's Attack, and it resists both of Volcorona's main STAB moves; considering that very few run HP Rock, you sould be fine! You empasized in the conclusion that you could not find a place for Dragon Dance Gyarados to set up; have you tried Bulky Dragon Dance Gyarados? A set of 152 HP | 168 Def | 188 Spe with Waterfall | Dragon Dance | Taunt | Bounce holding Leftovers allows Gyarados to set up very easily on most Fighting-type Pokemon, carrying a great deal of power while still having decent bulk to set up thanks to Intimidate. Alternatively, you could use the same set except with 152 HP | 72 Atk | 96 Def | 184 Spe to give Gyarados a bit more offensive power.

If you still find yourself slightly weak to Volcorona with Gyarados you can try Choice Scarf Landorus over one of your team members. Choice Scarf Landorus can come in on Volcorona as it uses Quiver Dance and proceed to rip it to shreds with Stone Edge. Landorus also provides a nice check for other setup sweepers as well, such as Nasty Plot Celebi, thanks to U-turn. In addition it takes great advantage of the sandstorm Tyranitar provides with Sand Force, essentially giving you a boosted Stone Edge. A set of Earthquake | Stone Edge | U-Turn | Hammer Arm with 252 Atk | 4 Def | 252 Spe and a Jolly nature would most likely work best for this team seing as you lack any real Fighting-type moves, which can be useful in a pinch against Pokemon like Hydreigon and the previously mentioned Scrafty, as well as Pokemon with Air Balloon. Hope this rate helped, and good luck!
 
Shining Latios said:
They usually carry Will-o-Wisp though. And Vapreons will have Toxic.
Click to expand...

1st; I have decided to change Gengar to your average Excadrill (nooby) set. I noticed I didn't have a sandstorm abusing pokemon, seeing as I cant use Garchomp and other sandstorm abysses can't do anything. I feel like a scrub, but I need a hard hitter because I'm lacking an offensive mind set at the moment.

I'm currently debating Skarmory > Forretress. if fills the same roll, but can whirlwind opposing set up pokemon out, it can also take on opposing sandstorm teams almost by it's self and it is the best Excadrill counter and I need one because I keep getting destroyed late game by it.


Latias destryos Rotom-w carrying Will-o-wisp as it can set up atleast 3 calm minds on it and do lerge amounts of damage.

Psyshock One HKO's Vaporeon at +2 if it has No Defensive Ev's i think.

@ThemasterofOz: I was thinking about that actually, but Psychock has been working a treat, i will defiantly try HP Fire, as it seems very logical.

@Jle1076: Because scarf Tyranitar is my Latios/Latias trapper, plus i find that scarfed Tyranitar is a great revenge killer mid-late game.

@San_Pellegrino: I was thinking about that actually, but i seriously need spikes. im thinking about changing him to spikes - whirlwin - bravebird - roost Skarmory, what do you think? i need a good phazer and spike layer.

I dont want to use gliscor because he only offers me some small resistances, i have changed Gengar to an Excadrill, to see what all the fuss about that damn thing is.
 
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