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Snover
Snover
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LC CCAT (Version III) [Ladder Race won by iss] See Post #236
- Thread starter Electrolyte
- Start date
or have scarfed foo, he can beat both +1 dd Scraggy and Snover since he can keep momentum (or kill it) with u-turn. He can also surprise those scarfed Magnemites if they try to volt switch on it. The main reason I don't like Snover is cause I don't like a 4rth sr weakness, yes Drilbur can spin but hes not bullet proof and sand teams can be somewhat dealt with Tirtouga.
Shouting's (or round 2 hawkstar's) Scarf Foo
Snover
Shouting
Alright, this week's winner is Snover! Congrats to iss, who gets another 0.5 bonus voting points! Here's the set:
Snover @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Snow Warning
Level: 5
EVs: 108 Atk / 188 SpA / 196 Spd
Naive Nature
- Blizzard
- Giga Drain
- Hidden Power Fire / Ground
- Ice Shard
Now, it's time for Nominations for Pokemon number 6!
Here are some things to keep in mind:
Murkrow @ Eviolite
Trait: Prankster
Level: 5
EVs: 36 HP / 236 Atk / 20 Def / 20 SpD / 188 Spe
Jolly nature
- Substitute
- Roost
- Brave Bird
- Sucker Punch
Drifloon @ Flying Gem
Trait: Unburden
Level: 5
EVs: 36 HP / 196 Atk / 196 Spd / 36 SAtk / 4 Def / 4 SDef
Naive Nature
- Acrobatics
- Shadow Ball
- Substitute / Hidden Power Ice / Hidden Power Fire / Hidden Power something else
- Destiny Bond
Tirtouga (M) @ Splash Plate
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 84 HP / 212 Atk / 12 Def / 180 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Shell Smash
- Aqua Tail
- Stone Edge
- Aqua Jet
Drilbur @ Eviolite
Trait: Mold Breaker
Level: 5
EVs: 36 HP / 252 Atk / 212 Spd
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Rapid Spin
- Rock Slide / X-Scissor
- Stealth Rock
Snover @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Snow Warning
Level: 5
EVs: 108 Atk / 188 SpA / 196 Spd
Naive Nature
- Blizzard
- Giga Drain
- Hidden Power Fire / Ground
- Ice Shard
I'll give this nomination session about a week. Good luck guys!
Snover @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Snow Warning
Level: 5
EVs: 108 Atk / 188 SpA / 196 Spd
Naive Nature
- Blizzard
- Giga Drain
- Hidden Power Fire / Ground
- Ice Shard
Now, it's time for Nominations for Pokemon number 6!
Here are some things to keep in mind:
Concept: Overwhelming Offense
Purpose: Create a team that is meant to overwhelm a specific Pokemon's checks and counters (that isn't SandMag and is thus less well checked) in order to set up a sweep for the other thing.
Description: Things are easy to wear down in this tier. I'm sure spamming Fire types or Water types or Fighting types or something can lead to some sort of sweep.
Things to Consider:
Offenses greatest nemeses, Drilbur and Murkrow
Handling the tier
BEING STRONG
Sorry not much detail...just "spam Pokemon checked by the same stuff to WIN IT VIGOROUSLY"
Purpose: Create a team that is meant to overwhelm a specific Pokemon's checks and counters (that isn't SandMag and is thus less well checked) in order to set up a sweep for the other thing.
Description: Things are easy to wear down in this tier. I'm sure spamming Fire types or Water types or Fighting types or something can lead to some sort of sweep.
Things to Consider:
Offenses greatest nemeses, Drilbur and Murkrow
Handling the tier
BEING STRONG
Sorry not much detail...just "spam Pokemon checked by the same stuff to WIN IT VIGOROUSLY"
Murkrow @ Eviolite
Trait: Prankster
Level: 5
EVs: 36 HP / 236 Atk / 20 Def / 20 SpD / 188 Spe
Jolly nature
- Substitute
- Roost
- Brave Bird
- Sucker Punch
Drifloon @ Flying Gem
Trait: Unburden
Level: 5
EVs: 36 HP / 196 Atk / 196 Spd / 36 SAtk / 4 Def / 4 SDef
Naive Nature
- Acrobatics
- Shadow Ball
- Substitute / Hidden Power Ice / Hidden Power Fire / Hidden Power something else
- Destiny Bond
Tirtouga (M) @ Splash Plate
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 84 HP / 212 Atk / 12 Def / 180 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Shell Smash
- Aqua Tail
- Stone Edge
- Aqua Jet
Drilbur @ Eviolite
Trait: Mold Breaker
Level: 5
EVs: 36 HP / 252 Atk / 212 Spd
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Rapid Spin
- Rock Slide / X-Scissor
- Stealth Rock
Snover @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Snow Warning
Level: 5
EVs: 108 Atk / 188 SpA / 196 Spd
Naive Nature
- Blizzard
- Giga Drain
- Hidden Power Fire / Ground
- Ice Shard
blarajan: +1.0
Corkscrew: +1.0
iss: +1.0
Corkscrew: +1.0
iss: +1.0
I'll give this nomination session about a week. Good luck guys!
Trace | Eviolite | Bold / Calm
236 HP / 196 Def / 76 SpD
- Tri Attack
- Shadow Ball
- Thunder Wave
- Recover
Look, I get that we're trying to create an HO team here. But offensive pressure alone can't save you from threats such as opposing SS Tirtouga or Scarf Snover. Currently, we simply have no good switch for a ridiculous number of offensive threats. This is partly due to the nature of HO teams; however, straight-up losing when literally anything gets set up is usually not the best of ideas. If this team fails to get its setup first, it loses instantly.
Such a problem is really difficult to deal with in a single Pokemon. Murkrow should probably be changed to Scarf when we edit this team (or we should replace Tirtouga with Mienfoo/Riolu); without it, we lose to a threat as simple as DD Scraggy. Yet Murkrow alone is certainly not enough to deal with the multitudes of offensive threats that exist in LC. We need a sponge, something that can come in, even against boosted offensive sweepers, and give us a fighting chance. Bulky Porygon has been proven to work extremely well at this role, and is the best bandage for our numerous wounds.
The set itself is very standard, and has been used to success on countless teams. Porygon can serve as anything from a makeshift Misdreavus check to a Pokemon who can Thunder Wave +2 Tirtouga when the chips are down. It is extremely versatile due to its access to Thunder Wave, and Recover gives it forgivability that no other defensive Pokemon in the tier has. It gives us a good switch for SubRoost Murkrow, and its Thunder Waves can set up opportunities for our sweepers to get a free Substitute, Unburden speed boost, or Shell Smash.
Even though Porygon does not necessarily fit our concept, sacrifices are necessary at times. Adding Porygon to this team is a necessary evil, and it is one that we cannot do without.
It's about time i nominated something.
And here it is:
Prankster | Eviolite | Impish
196 HP / 196 Def / 116 SpD
~Copycat
~Drain Punch
~Protect/Roar
~Crunch/Toxic
(Crunch and Protect are preferred IMO)
First I wanna say is that I suck at explaining but i hope you can imagine yourself what it can do for the team.
Riolu gives us a momentum grabber and an additional revenge killer with Prankster Copycat. It let's us beat all Shell Smashers besides Tirt and beats Axew and Dratini with ease. It also beats Scraggy IIRC.
And here it is:
Prankster | Eviolite | Impish
196 HP / 196 Def / 116 SpD
~Copycat
~Drain Punch
~Protect/Roar
~Crunch/Toxic
(Crunch and Protect are preferred IMO)
First I wanna say is that I suck at explaining but i hope you can imagine yourself what it can do for the team.
Riolu gives us a momentum grabber and an additional revenge killer with Prankster Copycat. It let's us beat all Shell Smashers besides Tirt and beats Axew and Dratini with ease. It also beats Scraggy IIRC.
Reserving Scarf Chinchou, will edit soon
EDIT:
Chinchou @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Volt Absorb
Level: 5
EVs: 232 SAtk / 220 Spd / 52 Def
Modest Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Ice Beam / Blizzard
- Hidden Power [Grass]
- Volt Switch
I've been using this team on the ladder a bit with Scarf Chinchou and it works really well for this team. One of the main things that this team needs to do is keep the momentum on its side and Scarf Chinchou is perfect for this. With volt switch it can keep the offensive pressure on our side really well. I know we already have an electric immunity, but Chinchou really prevents Magnemite running rings around this team as Drilbur is 2HKOed by Flash Cannon so scarf beats it and Bulky versions have Magnet Rise. So if Drilbur is down (it isn't hard to wear Drilbur down) then Magnemite will just crap on this team. It also provides a good check for +2 Tirtouga who can set up on Drifloon, Krow and Snover locked into Blizzard and then sweep the team. It is also a good lure for threats like Lileep, Porygon and Chinchou. Ice Beam 2HKOs Lileep in Hail after Stealth Rock. Hydro Pump has a 94% chance to 2HKO Porygon after one round of Hail and Stealth Rock. Hidden Power Grass 2HKOs RestTalk Chinchou after 2 round of hail and Stealth Rock. So with prediction Chinchou can remove some threats that are difficult for our team to handle. Blizzard is also fun but possibly too unreliable.
TL;DR
-gains momentum with volt switch
-counters Magnemite, checks Tirtouga (2 big threats)
-lures in Lileep, Porygon and Chinchou and takes them out with help from hazards with Drilbur and Hail with Snover. (really nice team synergy)
EDIT:
Chinchou @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Volt Absorb
Level: 5
EVs: 232 SAtk / 220 Spd / 52 Def
Modest Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Ice Beam / Blizzard
- Hidden Power [Grass]
- Volt Switch
I've been using this team on the ladder a bit with Scarf Chinchou and it works really well for this team. One of the main things that this team needs to do is keep the momentum on its side and Scarf Chinchou is perfect for this. With volt switch it can keep the offensive pressure on our side really well. I know we already have an electric immunity, but Chinchou really prevents Magnemite running rings around this team as Drilbur is 2HKOed by Flash Cannon so scarf beats it and Bulky versions have Magnet Rise. So if Drilbur is down (it isn't hard to wear Drilbur down) then Magnemite will just crap on this team. It also provides a good check for +2 Tirtouga who can set up on Drifloon, Krow and Snover locked into Blizzard and then sweep the team. It is also a good lure for threats like Lileep, Porygon and Chinchou. Ice Beam 2HKOs Lileep in Hail after Stealth Rock. Hydro Pump has a 94% chance to 2HKO Porygon after one round of Hail and Stealth Rock. Hidden Power Grass 2HKOs RestTalk Chinchou after 2 round of hail and Stealth Rock. So with prediction Chinchou can remove some threats that are difficult for our team to handle. Blizzard is also fun but possibly too unreliable.
TL;DR
-gains momentum with volt switch
-counters Magnemite, checks Tirtouga (2 big threats)
-lures in Lileep, Porygon and Chinchou and takes them out with help from hazards with Drilbur and Hail with Snover. (really nice team synergy)
i concour with iss, this team will greatly improve with the strength of a solid porygon
Hmm. I'd like to nom SD Pawniard, will update with explanation and sets once I get on a comp.
EDIT: Here I am, here's the set:
Pawniard @Eviolite
Trait: Defiant
EVs: 156 Atk / 36 Def / 116 SpD / 196 Spe
Nature: Jolly
-Swords Dance
-Sucker Punch
-Brick Break
-Iron Head
This is yet another sweeper, which functions as an excellent addition to the concept of the team. It has pretty good bulk, and can set up on many of the current metagame threats. Sucker Punch is amazing, and kills after the use of Swords Dance. The other moves are coverage and are useful overall. This guy is very underrated in LC, and I don't know why, but it fits well on this team. It also synergizes decently with the rest of the team, taking Rock type moves well, and also provides a good counter to Scarf Snover, who can otherwise be very problematic for this team to face. Also, I'd like to also mention that the weakness to Scraggy is huge, and Murkrow must become a Scarf variant, otherwise DD Scraggy at +1 tears the team to shreds without even trying. Once Murkrow is Scarfed, Pawniard can provide more reliable priority rather than getting Choice locked into Sucker Punch.
EDIT: Here I am, here's the set:
Pawniard @Eviolite
Trait: Defiant
EVs: 156 Atk / 36 Def / 116 SpD / 196 Spe
Nature: Jolly
-Swords Dance
-Sucker Punch
-Brick Break
-Iron Head
This is yet another sweeper, which functions as an excellent addition to the concept of the team. It has pretty good bulk, and can set up on many of the current metagame threats. Sucker Punch is amazing, and kills after the use of Swords Dance. The other moves are coverage and are useful overall. This guy is very underrated in LC, and I don't know why, but it fits well on this team. It also synergizes decently with the rest of the team, taking Rock type moves well, and also provides a good counter to Scarf Snover, who can otherwise be very problematic for this team to face. Also, I'd like to also mention that the weakness to Scraggy is huge, and Murkrow must become a Scarf variant, otherwise DD Scraggy at +1 tears the team to shreds without even trying. Once Murkrow is Scarfed, Pawniard can provide more reliable priority rather than getting Choice locked into Sucker Punch.
Croagunk @ Eviolite
Trait: Dry Skin
Level: 5
EVs: 212 HP / 28 Atk / 36 Def / 108 SAtk / 116 SDef
Quiet Nature
- Fake Out
- Vacuum Wave
- Drain Punch
- Shadow Ball
Scraggy at +1 is still extremely threatening to this team, especially if Snover has been brought into play since that will negate Tirtouga's sturdy. This guy can revenge Scraggy with a Fake Out + Vacuum Wave combo, as well as handle many of the tiers top threats, like Mienfoo and a weakened Murkrow, which will be a common appearance thanks to our hail and stealth rocks. If you want to see more just look at my nomination last round.
Mienfoo (M) @ Eviolite
Trait: Regenerator
EVs: 156 HP / 76 Atk / 196 Def / 76 Spd
Impish Nature
- U-turn
- Drain Punch
- Knock Off
- Fake Out
Mienfoo would be a great asset to the team. I understand the point of this team is to overwhelm the opponent with offense and Mienfoo provides our team with a few things it needs to do just that. Firstly Knock Off's utility is great because it helps our sweepers wear down walls much easier like Bronzor, who once it is without it's Eviolite will have a much harder time switching into the likes of Drilbur, Drifloon and Tirtouga. U-turn is also very useful for gaining momentum and can give a free switch in to one of our sweepers so they can wreck havoc. Fake Out is good to just get some damage off, perhaps breaking Sturdies if Snovers hail isn't up. Speaking about Snover, hail + Fake Out can actually do a decent amount of cheap damage to the opponent. Drain Punch is for stab and provides pseudo recovery. Mienfoo's typing is also very appreciated on this team because it gives us a 3rd Rock resist to complement our 3 Rock Weakneses. Mienfoo's Dark-type resist also comes in handy and regenerator ensures that Mienfoo can stay around for a long time to Knock Off Eviolites and act as a bulky pivot with U-turn. As Lunatic Lies mentioned Scraggy is very threatening to this team with its Dark/Fighting coverage Mienfoo can take any +1 hit from Scraggy and KO back with Fake Out + Drain Punch. With Fake Out Mienfoo also helps us somewhat against Shell Smashers.
And it just so happens to be that VOTING IS NOW OPEN!
Here are your options:
~iss's Porygon
~Nozzle's Riolu
~Corkscrew's Chinchou
~Dcae's Pawniard
~Lunatic Lie's Croagunk
~Kingmitus's Timburr
~Superpowerdude's Mienfoo
However, we'll run this a little differently this time.
In order to vote, you must PM ME the set and author that you wish to cast your vote for. All 'votes' not through PM will not be counted. This will prevent bandwagoning.
Standard rules, you may not vote for yourself, you can only vote once, you can't change your vote, etc.
Good luck everyone!
Useful info:
Murkrow @ Eviolite
Trait: Prankster
Level: 5
EVs: 36 HP / 236 Atk / 20 Def / 20 SpD / 188 Spe
Jolly nature
- Substitute
- Roost
- Brave Bird
- Sucker Punch
Drifloon @ Flying Gem
Trait: Unburden
Level: 5
EVs: 36 HP / 196 Atk / 196 Spd / 36 SAtk / 4 Def / 4 SDef
Naive Nature
- Acrobatics
- Shadow Ball
- Substitute / Hidden Power Ice / Hidden Power Fire / Hidden Power something else
- Destiny Bond
Tirtouga (M) @ Splash Plate
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 84 HP / 212 Atk / 12 Def / 180 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Shell Smash
- Aqua Tail
- Stone Edge
- Aqua Jet
Drilbur @ Eviolite
Trait: Mold Breaker
Level: 5
EVs: 36 HP / 252 Atk / 212 Spd
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Rapid Spin
- Rock Slide / X-Scissor
- Stealth Rock
Snover @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Snow Warning
Level: 5
EVs: 108 Atk / 188 SpA / 196 Spd
Naive Nature
- Blizzard
- Giga Drain
- Hidden Power Fire / Ground
- Ice Shard
Here are your options:
~iss's Porygon
~Nozzle's Riolu
~Corkscrew's Chinchou
~Dcae's Pawniard
~Lunatic Lie's Croagunk
~Kingmitus's Timburr
~Superpowerdude's Mienfoo
However, we'll run this a little differently this time.
In order to vote, you must PM ME the set and author that you wish to cast your vote for. All 'votes' not through PM will not be counted. This will prevent bandwagoning.
Standard rules, you may not vote for yourself, you can only vote once, you can't change your vote, etc.
Good luck everyone!
Useful info:
Murkrow @ Eviolite
Trait: Prankster
Level: 5
EVs: 36 HP / 236 Atk / 20 Def / 20 SpD / 188 Spe
Jolly nature
- Substitute
- Roost
- Brave Bird
- Sucker Punch
Drifloon @ Flying Gem
Trait: Unburden
Level: 5
EVs: 36 HP / 196 Atk / 196 Spd / 36 SAtk / 4 Def / 4 SDef
Naive Nature
- Acrobatics
- Shadow Ball
- Substitute / Hidden Power Ice / Hidden Power Fire / Hidden Power something else
- Destiny Bond
Tirtouga (M) @ Splash Plate
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 84 HP / 212 Atk / 12 Def / 180 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Shell Smash
- Aqua Tail
- Stone Edge
- Aqua Jet
Drilbur @ Eviolite
Trait: Mold Breaker
Level: 5
EVs: 36 HP / 252 Atk / 212 Spd
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Rapid Spin
- Rock Slide / X-Scissor
- Stealth Rock
Snover @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Snow Warning
Level: 5
EVs: 108 Atk / 188 SpA / 196 Spd
Naive Nature
- Blizzard
- Giga Drain
- Hidden Power Fire / Ground
- Ice Shard
blarajan: +1.0
Corkscrew: +1.0
iss: +1.0
Corkscrew: +1.0
iss: +1.0
Since we're not voting in this thread, I just thought I'd share my thoughts on the nominated mons.
~iss's Porygon
Whilst I agree that Porygon has decent team synergy, I'm just really reluctant to put it on this team. It doesn't necessarily solve all our problems as powerful attackers can still break through it with support. If we were going to add a bulky Pokemon I'd prefer it to be a bulky magnemite .
~Nozzle's Riolu
Nozzle didn't expand too much in his post, but Riolu is a fantastic choice for this team imo. It really gives us a nice check to other HO teams which would otherwise be slightly problematic. With copycat, it does a fantastic job of checking many glass cannons and also beats Scraggy meaning that changing Murkrow to scarf isn't necessary. It's difficult to say what Riolu can do for a team because it always finds itself in random situations that require quick thinking with copycat, but I'm confident it would perform well in this team.
~Corkscrew's Chinchou
Clearly the best choice ;) Just read my post if you want to see my reasoning.
~Dcae's Pawniard
I suppose Pawniard can work quite well with this team, patching up weak points against Lileep and Snover. I feel it would leave us far too weak to Magnemite and Tirtouga though who I believe to be the biggest threats right now.
~Lunatic Lie's Croagunk
Croagunk has some great synergy with this team and I've used it in conjunction with a Murkrow/Drifloon core before as it patches up weaknesses to Shell Smashers, Lileep and it checks Magnemite. It also checks the water types that beat Drilbur, and the fighting and grass types that can beat Tirtouga. Definitely a solid choice for this team, but I don't know if Mienfoo or Riolu would be better fighting type choices because of Riolu's ability to deal with a plethora of random things and Mienfoo's knock off support. Croagunk does have dry skin and poison typing though which sets it apart.
~Kingmitus's Timburr
Despite being my favourite LC mon to use, I just think the other fighting types offer more support for this team than Timburr. Croagunk checks Shell Smashers better and Mienfoo and Riolu give us more offensive momentum.
~Superpowerdude's Mienfoo
Another decent fighting type on the list, with Fake Out and Knock Off, Mienfoo would offer a lot for this team. U-turn will also help keep the momentum on our side of the field which is really nice.
As you can't vote for yourself my vote is really torn between Riolu, Croagunk and Mienfoo. I don't like Porygon on the team, Pawniard leaves us too weak to Mag and Timburr just doesn't fit the style of play. Again, Chinchou is nice but the team may struggle with Lileep so I'd bare that in mind if you're going to vote for it. I'm probably going to vote tomorrow after thinking it over some more, but one of those 3 fighting types is best in my opinion as the main threats at the moment are Lileep, Porygon, Magnemite, Tirtouga and Chinchou. EDIT: and Snover, blarajan.
~iss's Porygon
Whilst I agree that Porygon has decent team synergy, I'm just really reluctant to put it on this team. It doesn't necessarily solve all our problems as powerful attackers can still break through it with support. If we were going to add a bulky Pokemon I'd prefer it to be a bulky magnemite .
~Nozzle's Riolu
Nozzle didn't expand too much in his post, but Riolu is a fantastic choice for this team imo. It really gives us a nice check to other HO teams which would otherwise be slightly problematic. With copycat, it does a fantastic job of checking many glass cannons and also beats Scraggy meaning that changing Murkrow to scarf isn't necessary. It's difficult to say what Riolu can do for a team because it always finds itself in random situations that require quick thinking with copycat, but I'm confident it would perform well in this team.
~Corkscrew's Chinchou
Clearly the best choice ;) Just read my post if you want to see my reasoning.
~Dcae's Pawniard
I suppose Pawniard can work quite well with this team, patching up weak points against Lileep and Snover. I feel it would leave us far too weak to Magnemite and Tirtouga though who I believe to be the biggest threats right now.
~Lunatic Lie's Croagunk
Croagunk has some great synergy with this team and I've used it in conjunction with a Murkrow/Drifloon core before as it patches up weaknesses to Shell Smashers, Lileep and it checks Magnemite. It also checks the water types that beat Drilbur, and the fighting and grass types that can beat Tirtouga. Definitely a solid choice for this team, but I don't know if Mienfoo or Riolu would be better fighting type choices because of Riolu's ability to deal with a plethora of random things and Mienfoo's knock off support. Croagunk does have dry skin and poison typing though which sets it apart.
~Kingmitus's Timburr
Despite being my favourite LC mon to use, I just think the other fighting types offer more support for this team than Timburr. Croagunk checks Shell Smashers better and Mienfoo and Riolu give us more offensive momentum.
~Superpowerdude's Mienfoo
Another decent fighting type on the list, with Fake Out and Knock Off, Mienfoo would offer a lot for this team. U-turn will also help keep the momentum on our side of the field which is really nice.
As you can't vote for yourself my vote is really torn between Riolu, Croagunk and Mienfoo. I don't like Porygon on the team, Pawniard leaves us too weak to Mag and Timburr just doesn't fit the style of play. Again, Chinchou is nice but the team may struggle with Lileep so I'd bare that in mind if you're going to vote for it. I'm probably going to vote tomorrow after thinking it over some more, but one of those 3 fighting types is best in my opinion as the main threats at the moment are Lileep, Porygon, Magnemite, Tirtouga and Chinchou. EDIT: and Snover, blarajan.