Erm buddy you're just hating okay so um shut up this isn't a metagame based on Pokemon ZA now is it
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Pet Mod Legends Z-A OU
- Thread starter dhelmise
- Start date
This thing needs Magic Guard to be usable. Making your Clefable Stealth Rock weak just for slight boost to its stats and decent boost to SpA is not worth it, let alone using up a Mega slot.
The only alternative ability I could think of would be something that does Anti-Gravity, which would require coding a whole new field effect.
Thematically, Victreebel should get something similar to Gulp Missile. Its entire stick is that its oozing out poison and touching it cause more poison to spill.
Specifically if Victreebel is hit and has the move Belch, it will use Belch immediately. Since it doesn't learn any biting moves, I'm opting to not having any move requirements, which really buffs the ability. Call it "Gag Reflex"
In terms of positives, Dragonite losing the ability to Tera makes Mega Dragonite more appealing. And honestly it's pretty hard judging what it should get based on design. Some potential abilities for it would be No Guard or even Gale Wings. There is also the possibility for brand new abilities. Like one that cause Charge/Recharge moves to not require a charge/recharge, or something that has to do with boosting Wind moves by 50%.
Meganium should have been a physical attacker with Flower Veil imo. A bulky Sword Dancer immune to Burns and Intimidate would be great.
But Special Attacker is fine I guess. Still immune to all status and stat drops from Snarl, Sticky Webs, random SpD.
I also feel like Flower Veil would also be more viable than Triage because of that. Triage is nice, but without Calm Mind it doesn't sound as appealing as only Giga Drain and Synthesis get priority.
Give it Sheer Force. We can pretend Skibidi Feraligatr doesn't exist and pretend its just using Sheer Force as God intended.
I feel like it'll get Sharpness in the actual game with new slicing moves, but Touch Claws is good for now.
Snow Warning on Mega Froslass might be a bit strong.
100% accurate Blizzards
1.5x Def
(for reference: 252 Atk Great Tusk Headlong Rush vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Froslass-Mega in Snow: 177-208 (62.9 - 74%) -- guaranteed 2HKO)
Aurora Veil
All with Nasty Plot, 140 SpA, 120 Speed, Thunderbolt, and Shadow Ball.
But honestly Idk what else to put that fits.
Alternative ability being Def Supreme Overlord, getting a 1.2x boost for every fainted ally. That would be better for Emboar's stats since its otherwise still slow.
Sand Rush or we riot.
Tinted Lens (or renamed Tinted Lens) or we riot.
I'd say give Scrafty Shield Dust. The shed skin looks like a white Covert Cloak. Plus dead skin cells are part of dust too.
The Pokedex says it outputs 10 times as much electricity with its fake Eelektrike. So there is a bunch of ideas for abilities related to electric. Like making Electric moves bypass immunities, having Electromorphosis, Electric based Parental Bond, Electric Surge, etc. It's honestly looking to be dukie anyways with so much of its base stats being wasted to make it a SFMA.
The Pokedex mentions that Chandelure gets a special eye that lets it see our world and the after life at the same time.
My bad thought SO boosted only Atk.
Give it Old Dauntless Shield. Dauntless Shield should have never been nerfed when Zacian was the problem in Gen 8 and Zamazenta did nothing wrong.
Alternatively, I always thought Intrepid Sword and Dauntless Shield should be like Download (and Zacian being a mixed attacker). Defensive Download would also be a big boon for Chesnaught as it would appreciate either side being boosted but prefer Def when using Body Press.
Levitate would ironically be somewhat bad since Delphox would lose out on Expanding Force in Psychic Terrain, which would be big for it. It does make the most sense thematically at least.
Battle Bond is a bit much, don't you think? It gets Nasty Plot now and you want +3 SpA +1 Spe Mega Greninja running around?
It doesn't even fit since Battle Bond was all about Ash and his Greninja's bond.
Mega Greninja should instead get something related to that stealth aspect. Being that X ability causes the first time Greninja uses a move to deal 1.3x boost. Kind of like Stellar Tera but better since you if you use Hydro Pump then Water Shuriken you still get the 1.3x boost to Water Shuriken if it was your first time using it.
idk what to call it thought.
Give it Moxie as a joke. ZU will thank us with such a strong Mega.
Adaptability or we riot.
Reckless or Rockhead (or a renaming of those abilities) or we riot
Give it Suction Cups as a joke. What ever is below ZU will not care because it's that horrible.
Skill Link is a fine addition. Rock Blast after a Shell Smash sounds solid. I can't think of any other fitting ability.
H ability that gives it Focus Energy apon switching in. Stamina could also work since promotional material mentioned how much bulkier it was.
D ability that causes moves affected by Weather to activate like they are in the respective weather. Thunder and Blizzard always hits, Aurora Veil always activates without fail, Solar Beam is one turn, ect. In the case of Weather Ball, it's doubled in power but is Normal type.
If that's too much, Drizzle is probably the best and most fitting option.
I feel like Falinks would do the exact opposite since its multiple Pokemon that become 1 Pokemon. it should have F ability that's Defiant for what stat gets lowered. If Atk is lowered, +2 Atk. Def is lowered, +2 Def, and so on. Same rules so no Close Combat giving you +1 Def/SpD. This would synergize with its tool kit better and frankly not be as stupid to fight against with +3 from using Trailblaze and Iron Head having better odds to flinch you than with Serene Grace.
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The Pokedex mentions that Chandelure gets a special eye that lets it see our world and the after life at the same time. SpA Supreme Overlord anyone?
Supreme Overlord already does this. It affects all moves used, not a specific offensive stat.
blunder, 3d, and I have done a LOT of data collection on the new megas on blund's channel, so I have a few thoughts
first of all, thanks for creating this format. it's really fun to have the creative freedom to see how certain pokemon would perform with speculative abilities. no idea if there's enough interest for it, but a long term ladder in which it's SV OU dex + ZA dex would be really damn cool if it's not too difficult to do. maybe with champions coming out, that'd create a full need for it anyways but this is amazing stuff and really hype anyways
Lemme clarify that this is from a competitive standpoint which GF often ignores lol. so who really knows what'll happen
Malamar is so extremely bad it's not even funny. it has to get some super insane ability to be viable at all, so our proposal is a combination of Simple + Contrary. It's pretty insane how it has a single high stat even with the +100 boost and our early tournaments showed a lot of Malamar attempts that ended in it quite literally doing nothing. with the power of the other megas, I don't know if this As One combination would be broken, but it's worth giving the silly squid a try. I say this without even knowing how easy or possible it is to make this ability, but just wanted to point out how badly Malamar needs the help...
Gallade: I'm very convinced it is extremely insane LOL (plug) I uploaded a very fast video trying this meta, and this guy just hits like an absolute truck. I'm honestly not sure if it's Too broken cuz there's a lot of other ridiculous mons, but this is absolutely a fan service ability update and I love it. inner focus is definitely jokes, but maybe a more balanced ability is needed..
For the other ones open to suggestion:
Skarm - Tough Claws makes way too much sense design-wise and also as a very strong power boost to its attacks. Good as Gold is fun too, though, but wouldn't be as fitting for its current kit
Scolipede - idk what GF was cooking, but damn lol. Tinted lens is probably the "best" option or some kind of defensive filter ability
Scrafty - I kind of like Regenerator with Scrafty, but it's another hard one to fit. Lots of speculation that it gets some Fairy Absorb insane new ability, which I think is the main way to make it viable tbh.
Excadrill - probably should keep sand rush, but I can also see GF make a new ability and move for drill attacks + a boost given its design. it would pretty quickly be one of the best mons with sand rush, though
Eelektross - also a combination of earth eater + electric terrain or levitate + transistor. it definitely needs a major upgrade to be viable, but it might just be GF's designated RU/NU mega
Barbaracle - keeping tough claws is probably really good, likely, and probably also really busted
Chandelure - shadow tag... it got a lot of defenses so levitate or filter make sense too tbh
Besides these nitpicks, I think a lot of the ideas are very on point in flavor and viability increase. looking forward to new changes and making more vids on the metagame! I'm also in favor of retaining original abilities for most of the old megas except stuff like Ampharos or ones who really need a boost
Yap over, thanks to everyone involved in making this happen it's a lot of hype
meme suggestion:
Psykick for Starmie. 120 Power 95 Acc same as HJK.
first of all, thanks for creating this format. it's really fun to have the creative freedom to see how certain pokemon would perform with speculative abilities. no idea if there's enough interest for it, but a long term ladder in which it's SV OU dex + ZA dex would be really damn cool if it's not too difficult to do. maybe with champions coming out, that'd create a full need for it anyways but this is amazing stuff and really hype anyways
Lemme clarify that this is from a competitive standpoint which GF often ignores lol. so who really knows what'll happen
Malamar is so extremely bad it's not even funny. it has to get some super insane ability to be viable at all, so our proposal is a combination of Simple + Contrary. It's pretty insane how it has a single high stat even with the +100 boost and our early tournaments showed a lot of Malamar attempts that ended in it quite literally doing nothing. with the power of the other megas, I don't know if this As One combination would be broken, but it's worth giving the silly squid a try. I say this without even knowing how easy or possible it is to make this ability, but just wanted to point out how badly Malamar needs the help...
Gallade: I'm very convinced it is extremely insane LOL (plug) I uploaded a very fast video trying this meta, and this guy just hits like an absolute truck. I'm honestly not sure if it's Too broken cuz there's a lot of other ridiculous mons, but this is absolutely a fan service ability update and I love it. inner focus is definitely jokes, but maybe a more balanced ability is needed..
For the other ones open to suggestion:
Skarm - Tough Claws makes way too much sense design-wise and also as a very strong power boost to its attacks. Good as Gold is fun too, though, but wouldn't be as fitting for its current kit
Scolipede - idk what GF was cooking, but damn lol. Tinted lens is probably the "best" option or some kind of defensive filter ability
Scrafty - I kind of like Regenerator with Scrafty, but it's another hard one to fit. Lots of speculation that it gets some Fairy Absorb insane new ability, which I think is the main way to make it viable tbh.
Excadrill - probably should keep sand rush, but I can also see GF make a new ability and move for drill attacks + a boost given its design. it would pretty quickly be one of the best mons with sand rush, though
Eelektross - also a combination of earth eater + electric terrain or levitate + transistor. it definitely needs a major upgrade to be viable, but it might just be GF's designated RU/NU mega
Barbaracle - keeping tough claws is probably really good, likely, and probably also really busted
Chandelure - shadow tag... it got a lot of defenses so levitate or filter make sense too tbh
Besides these nitpicks, I think a lot of the ideas are very on point in flavor and viability increase. looking forward to new changes and making more vids on the metagame! I'm also in favor of retaining original abilities for most of the old megas except stuff like Ampharos or ones who really need a boost
Yap over, thanks to everyone involved in making this happen it's a lot of hype
meme suggestion:
Psykick for Starmie. 120 Power 95 Acc same as HJK.
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Alright I thought it was just Atk.
So Spooky renamed Supreme Overlord then.
Adding boots just kinda makes the metagame idea pointless? Instead of a model of ZA in traditional battles, now its just a weird fake-meta where we're just arbitrarily just adding and removing whatever we like or dislike. Its like adding ferrothorn to OU, sure it might make the metagame better by countering certain overpowered threats, but its also just adding something that was never intended to be in the game in the first place. Why not add loaded dice now, or red card, or weather rocks? We might as well just turn this into Natdex with new megas if we add boots.
I’m really not gonna lie here, but with the expectations people have at this point for a meta with the ZA Megas being usable:
I agree, I think it's kinda like how lax was saying we could make a PLZA + SV, but I also think that we might want to preserve the purity of PLZA, aside from the abilities. I think this should be voted by either the council of this OM or just by the community, but I definitely don't think we should just pick and choose what we want, like duckycrater was saying.
This is in pet mods for a reason. If we wanted to preserve the purity of PLZA entirely, this wouldn't have any abilities either. We already have expanded movepools because with PLZA-specific movepools, we wouldn't have any hazard removal. Adding one or two items does not mean the integrity of this format is destroyed and that we must immediately add the entire national pokedex. Please stop being doomer.
I think every Item except Z moves should be there cause we're in a metagame where the most dangerous threat has 142 speed and most teams just can't outspeed it. Add choice Items If you add boots
I just don't see why we're not including other items as well. Scarf would probably help speed control, dice would help scale shot users, red card would help phase out boosted threats, plenty of other items would help, no reason why we should exclude the other items.
Surely you're allowed to have this confusion without metabashing by calling some weird fake meta filled with arbitration when we're literally in the pet mods forum
Perhaps I should rephrase, its less confusion and more "why are we being so arbitrary for these things?" I guess the answer is "its a pet mod we can do whatever we want" but in that sense it really does feel kinda fake(especially since the poll wasn't even announced in the pet mod discord, by the time I was made aware it closed an hour ago)
Specifically introducing only Boots to a tier that has a metric dick ton of strong removal options, only a handful of viable blockers (which, in fairness, are pretty good ones) and no way to block the copious defoggers is a little thoughtless. If you were to add any item(s) Scarf and Red Card would absolutely make the most sense. Ultimately, the tier doesn't necessarily need any of these, and the addition of Boots would only serve to make it that much harder to progress for no solid reason.
I'd like to propose a new custom ability for Mega Clefable: Magic Wings. It combines Aerilate and Magic Guard. Clearly Clefable would still like to have Magic Guard, but also it being a Flying type mon and having no good Flying type moves doesn't sit right with me. Magic Guard is the ability it wants competitively, but Aerilate is the ability I feel like it deserves. So why not have both?
Don't allow boots ngl, this metagame literally states in the OP "based on the Pokemon and items currently usable in Pokemon Legends: Z-A, in a what-if on them being allowed in the turn-based battle mode.". Allowing Heavy Duty Boots kinda undermines what the tier is about, and as stated above, removal options are pretty good. Yes, there is stuff like Meowstic which can be kinda demonic, but I'm sure those will become fine in the future as the metagame evolves.
Anyway.
Since a lot of discussion has gone on here, in the Pet Mods room on PS, and in the Pet Mods discord, here's some changes that seemed to have wide support that will be implemented momentarily. From here on out, This will act more accurately like a Pet Mod than a Solomod:
All of the HOME/event-restricted Pokemon are now legal. I realized that Technically only Power Construct Zygarde was legal right now, so it was counter intuitive to remove Greninja-Bond. This combined with the outcry for the new megas being usable made me realize that the meta would be more fun with everything usable.
(Don't Worry, mewtwo is banned)
Mega Salamence and Mega Lucario are banned. They've been mollywhopping the ladder and roomtours and nobody has had a single good thing to say about them, so they're out.
Water Shuriken on Mega Greninja has been nerfed to be 20 base power and a 3 hit multihit (like ash greninja). A 75 base power +1 priority special water move is kinda a horrible idea.
Brass Bond no longer triggers additional effects on the second and third hits, so Close Combat is viable again. To compensate, The power of the additional hits is now 15% instead of 10%.
Malamar now has a new ability, called Contrarian:
Hopefully it's less horrible now.
Eelektross has a new ability, called Ion Battery:
It is essentially Levitate + Plus + Minus (hence the 1.5x SpA).
I saw a lot of feedback about making Pyroar's ability a special version of Orichalcum Pulse, so that's what it is now. I doubt this makes it good since it still has worse stats than most non-Mega special attackers, but it's a push in the right direction. Leader of the Pride:
Meganium's ability is now Flower Veil, I saw a lot of feedback saying Triage was not good with Giga Drain due to no good setup on Meganium either, which I agree with. Hopefully this improves its defensive capabilities somewhat.
Mega Scolipede's ability is now Tinted Lens. This should improve its usefulness a lot and also matches the dex entry of its venom impacting its lethality.
Mega Scrafty's ability is now Shed Skin. A lot of people suggested this and I agree that it fits somewhat better flavorwise on the mega than Moxie, but there's still so many good choices for this. Open to ideas still.
Mega Barbaracle's ability is now Tough Claws. Skill Link was a good idea in theory, but in practice it doesn't do much.
These items are now usable.
Since a lot of discussion has gone on here, in the Pet Mods room on PS, and in the Pet Mods discord, here's some changes that seemed to have wide support that will be implemented momentarily. From here on out, This will act more accurately like a Pet Mod than a Solomod:
All of the HOME/event-restricted Pokemon are now legal. I realized that Technically only Power Construct Zygarde was legal right now, so it was counter intuitive to remove Greninja-Bond. This combined with the outcry for the new megas being usable made me realize that the meta would be more fun with everything usable.
(Don't Worry, mewtwo is banned)
Mega Salamence and Mega Lucario are banned. They've been mollywhopping the ladder and roomtours and nobody has had a single good thing to say about them, so they're out.
Water Shuriken on Mega Greninja has been nerfed to be 20 base power and a 3 hit multihit (like ash greninja). A 75 base power +1 priority special water move is kinda a horrible idea.
Brass Bond no longer triggers additional effects on the second and third hits, so Close Combat is viable again. To compensate, The power of the additional hits is now 15% instead of 10%.
Malamar now has a new ability, called Contrarian:
This Pokemon has its stat changes inverted and doubled.Hopefully it's less horrible now.
Eelektross has a new ability, called Ion Battery:
This Pokemon floats and has 1.5x Sp. Atk.It is essentially Levitate + Plus + Minus (hence the 1.5x SpA).
I saw a lot of feedback about making Pyroar's ability a special version of Orichalcum Pulse, so that's what it is now. I doubt this makes it good since it still has worse stats than most non-Mega special attackers, but it's a push in the right direction. Leader of the Pride:
On switch-in, summons Sunny Day. During Sunny Day, Sp. Atk is 1.3333x.Meganium's ability is now Flower Veil, I saw a lot of feedback saying Triage was not good with Giga Drain due to no good setup on Meganium either, which I agree with. Hopefully this improves its defensive capabilities somewhat.
Mega Scolipede's ability is now Tinted Lens. This should improve its usefulness a lot and also matches the dex entry of its venom impacting its lethality.
Mega Scrafty's ability is now Shed Skin. A lot of people suggested this and I agree that it fits somewhat better flavorwise on the mega than Moxie, but there's still so many good choices for this. Open to ideas still.
Mega Barbaracle's ability is now Tough Claws. Skill Link was a good idea in theory, but in practice it doesn't do much.
These items are now usable.
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Got so confused when I had literally just finished a battle and suddenly it was illegal to use skill link Barb LOLAnyway.
Since a lot of discussion has gone on here, in the Pet Mods room on PS, and in the Pet Mods discord, here's some changes that seemed to have wide support that will be implemented momentarily. From here on out, This will act more accurately like a Pet Mod than a Solomod:
All of the HOME/event-restricted Pokemon are now legal. I realized that Technically only Power Construct Zygarde was legal right now, so it was counter intuitive to remove Greninja-Bond. This combined with the outcry for the new megas being usable made me realize that the meta would be more fun with everything usable.
(Don't Worry, mewtwo is banned)
Mega Salamence and Mega Lucario are banned. They've been mollywhopping the ladder and roomtours and nobody has had a single good thing to say about them, so they're out.
Water Shuriken on Mega Greninja has been nerfed to be 20 base power and a 3 hit multihit (like ash greninja). A 75 base power +1 priority special water move is kinda a horrible idea.
Brass Bond no longer triggers additional effects on the second and third hits, so Close Combat is viable again. To compensate, The power of the additional hits is now 15% instead of 10%.
Malamar now has a new ability, called Contrarian:
This Pokemon has its stat changes inverted and doubled.
Hopefully it's less horrible now.
Eelektross has a new ability, called Ion Battery:
This Pokemon floats and has 1.5x Sp. Atk.
It is essentially Levitate + Plus + Minus (hence the 1.5x SpA).
I saw a lot of feedback about making Pyroar's ability a special version of Orichalcum Pulse, so that's what it is now. I doubt this makes it good since it still has worse stats than most non-Mega special attackers, but it's a push in the right direction. Leader of the Pride:
On switch-in, summons Sunny Day. During Sunny Day, Sp. Atk is 1.3333x.
Meganium's ability is now Flower Veil, I saw a lot of feedback saying Triage was not good with Giga Drain due to no good setup on Meganium either, which I agree with. Hopefully this improves its defensive capabilities somewhat.
Mega Scolipede's ability is now Tinted Lens. This should improve its usefulness a lot and also matches the dex entry of its venom impacting its lethality.
Mega Scrafty's ability is now Shed Skin. A lot of people suggested this and I agree that it fits somewhat better flavorwise on the mega than Moxie, but there's still so many good choices for this. Open to ideas still.
Mega Barbaracle's ability is now Tough Claws. Skill Link was a good idea in theory, but in practice it doesn't do much.
These items are now usable.
These items are now usable.
Why, though?
These items are now usable.
Something else to note is that Skarmory loses weight after Mega Evolving since gold is much more lighter than steel.
My only minor issue with Mega Froslass getting snow warning is how it conflicts with the other ice type megas, Mega Abomasnow competing as snow setter and Mega Glalie competing with ice type focused abilities (especially since they are counterparts). I would expect something like Magic Guard over Snow Warning for Mega Froslass.
But then again we got Mega Salamance and Mega Pinsir sharing Aerilate, so maybe Froslass will get Snow Warning?
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Mega Evolution: Scolipede
I have two suggestions for the Scoliped:
1. A new ability called Toxic Scale, which passively increases its defense by 1.5, similar to Fur Coat, and has a poison point effect.
2. Another ability option should be Hustle, as stated in its description, which makes it much more aggressive.
I have two suggestions for the Scoliped:
1. A new ability called Toxic Scale, which passively increases its defense by 1.5, similar to Fur Coat, and has a poison point effect.
2. Another ability option should be Hustle, as stated in its description, which makes it much more aggressive.
This isn’t really true, since the speed difference of Abomasnow and Froslass as Megas very much changes their roles on teams (not that you’d use Abomasnow right this moment). The former is a far wallbreaker and the latter is a super speedy breaker that also go for Nasty Plot stuff (and if you’re funny, Spikes or Wisp).
Snow Warning really leans right into its design as a Yuki-Onna and gives it a strong identity.
Anyway.
Since a lot of discussion has gone on here, in the Pet Mods room on PS, and in the Pet Mods discord, here's some changes that seemed to have wide support that will be implemented momentarily. From here on out, This will act more accurately like a Pet Mod than a Solomod:
All of the HOME/event-restricted Pokemon are now legal. I realized that Technically only Power Construct Zygarde was legal right now, so it was counter intuitive to remove Greninja-Bond. This combined with the outcry for the new megas being usable made me realize that the meta would be more fun with everything usable.
(Don't Worry, mewtwo is banned)
Mega Salamence and Mega Lucario are banned. They've been mollywhopping the ladder and roomtours and nobody has had a single good thing to say about them, so they're out.
Water Shuriken on Mega Greninja has been nerfed to be 20 base power and a 3 hit multihit (like ash greninja). A 75 base power +1 priority special water move is kinda a horrible idea.
Brass Bond no longer triggers additional effects on the second and third hits, so Close Combat is viable again. To compensate, The power of the additional hits is now 15% instead of 10%.
Malamar now has a new ability, called Contrarian:
This Pokemon has its stat changes inverted and doubled.
Hopefully it's less horrible now.
Eelektross has a new ability, called Ion Battery:
This Pokemon floats and has 1.5x Sp. Atk.
It is essentially Levitate + Plus + Minus (hence the 1.5x SpA).
I saw a lot of feedback about making Pyroar's ability a special version of Orichalcum Pulse, so that's what it is now. I doubt this makes it good since it still has worse stats than most non-Mega special attackers, but it's a push in the right direction. Leader of the Pride:
On switch-in, summons Sunny Day. During Sunny Day, Sp. Atk is 1.3333x.
Meganium's ability is now Flower Veil, I saw a lot of feedback saying Triage was not good with Giga Drain due to no good setup on Meganium either, which I agree with. Hopefully this improves its defensive capabilities somewhat.
Mega Scolipede's ability is now Tinted Lens. This should improve its usefulness a lot and also matches the dex entry of its venom impacting its lethality.
Mega Scrafty's ability is now Shed Skin. A lot of people suggested this and I agree that it fits somewhat better flavorwise on the mega than Moxie, but there's still so many good choices for this. Open to ideas still.
Mega Barbaracle's ability is now Tough Claws. Skill Link was a good idea in theory, but in practice it doesn't do much.
These items are now usable.
Giving some opinions on the Megas and their ability choices.
New Ability: Soul Siphen - Ghost type moves heal user for 50% of the damage dealt. If target is burnt all moves used heal for 50%.