Okay, so I'm playing HGSS right now and trying to prep a team for the battle frontier and can I just say how annoying it is to go back and forth between the two regions??? I have to fly to the Indigo Plateau/VR and then to the other region. With how often I have to do it it's just an aggravating and pointless middle step. It's either that or I take the Magnet Train, which is only available in two cities and only goes to said two cities. So many things about this game are just annoying ughhhh
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(Little) Things that annoy you in Pokémon
- Thread starter BriarRose
- Start date
Does it bug anyone else how a lot of newer legendary and mythical Pokemon are restricted to being at higher levels?
Was thinking of replaying Ultra Moon and, having used nearly all of the Alola Pokemon already, I was thinking of using Poipole or Type: Null, but they're both restricted to being at level 40. And since they can't be bred, that's all you get.
When I replay Pokemon games I often like to use late-game Pokemon like Clamperl and Bagon (partly for the novelty, partly for the challenge). I've occasionally also done solo runs with mythicals like Mew or Celebi since they can be gotten as low as lv5. But this seems to be less and less possible as time goes on. Gen V was the last gen in which the developers seemed to be encouraging you to use mythicals as part of your team if you wanted to - Victini, Keldeo, Meloetta, Genesect were all available as low as lv15. I actually did use Keldeo as part of my team of six when I first played Black 2 but haven't used any of the others, though I appreciate having the option.
Looking at the more recent mythicals, it does seem like this is a deliberate design choice:
Diancie - never available lower than lv50
Hoopa - the exception, was eventually released at lv15 during Gen VII
Volcanion - never available lower than lv70
Magearna - never available lower than lv50
Marshadow - never available lower than lv50
Zeraora - never available lower than lv50
There are still a number of standard legendaries, like Mewtwo, the legendary birds, Cresselia, and the Tao trio, that aren't obtainable at lower levels, but many that are, like the legendary beasts, the Regis, and Zygarde (all available at lv30), Ho-oh, Lugia, and the Forces of Nature (all available at lv5) and the space/time trio (all obtainable at lv1). I'm honestly unsure if there's any rhyme or reason why some legendaries are gated to higher levels while others aren't, but at least most of the standard legendaries have story significance which necessitates them being incredibly high-levelled.
My gripe is that doing this with mythicals makes a lot of these Pokemon (many of which are already fairly uninteresting) feel even more so since there is almost no incentive to actually use them as part of your team (unless of course you play in battle formats which allow uber legendaries - I don't). Assuming that you receive them before you've finished the game, they're far too overpowered (and won't obey you anyway) and can't be used in battle facilities. Virtually all of the post-gen V mythicals have been received and plonked straight into my PC, never to be touched except for when I need to transfer them over to the next generation's storage system.
Was thinking of replaying Ultra Moon and, having used nearly all of the Alola Pokemon already, I was thinking of using Poipole or Type: Null, but they're both restricted to being at level 40. And since they can't be bred, that's all you get.
When I replay Pokemon games I often like to use late-game Pokemon like Clamperl and Bagon (partly for the novelty, partly for the challenge). I've occasionally also done solo runs with mythicals like Mew or Celebi since they can be gotten as low as lv5. But this seems to be less and less possible as time goes on. Gen V was the last gen in which the developers seemed to be encouraging you to use mythicals as part of your team if you wanted to - Victini, Keldeo, Meloetta, Genesect were all available as low as lv15. I actually did use Keldeo as part of my team of six when I first played Black 2 but haven't used any of the others, though I appreciate having the option.
Looking at the more recent mythicals, it does seem like this is a deliberate design choice:
Diancie - never available lower than lv50
Hoopa - the exception, was eventually released at lv15 during Gen VII
Volcanion - never available lower than lv70
Magearna - never available lower than lv50
Marshadow - never available lower than lv50
Zeraora - never available lower than lv50
There are still a number of standard legendaries, like Mewtwo, the legendary birds, Cresselia, and the Tao trio, that aren't obtainable at lower levels, but many that are, like the legendary beasts, the Regis, and Zygarde (all available at lv30), Ho-oh, Lugia, and the Forces of Nature (all available at lv5) and the space/time trio (all obtainable at lv1). I'm honestly unsure if there's any rhyme or reason why some legendaries are gated to higher levels while others aren't, but at least most of the standard legendaries have story significance which necessitates them being incredibly high-levelled.
My gripe is that doing this with mythicals makes a lot of these Pokemon (many of which are already fairly uninteresting) feel even more so since there is almost no incentive to actually use them as part of your team (unless of course you play in battle formats which allow uber legendaries - I don't). Assuming that you receive them before you've finished the game, they're far too overpowered (and won't obey you anyway) and can't be used in battle facilities. Virtually all of the post-gen V mythicals have been received and plonked straight into my PC, never to be touched except for when I need to transfer them over to the next generation's storage system.
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Stone evo distribution in hgss, there is no reason for it to take so much time to grind for one, i get the concept of not just giving them away on a mart and making you work for it (tho id honestly like more the idea of just being able to purchase them), there are like 25 evos to do for dex and it takes 20 minutes of mashing the touchscreen minigames, seriously i cant believe there are people out there who enjoy pokeathlon, just to get one.
Yeah this has always low-key kind of bugged me. I'm generally not one to use legends in my party, but it would be nice to have a chance and actually use those level up move pools.
I guess it get it for the most part, most legends are obtained in the late game or post game. SO they have appropriate levels; if they're intended for the main story they're usually between levels 30-40. Mythics have really just gone all over the place, sometimes they give them as "defaults" like at level 5 but later on its like they're treated as part of a post game (since they're given out one-three years later) or to dentoe importance (Volcanion is level 70, Diancie is level 50). But these pokemon have full moves and it'd be cool to have the option to take like...an Articuno at level 1. A mewtwo at level 1. Whatever!
The most frustrating and baffling instance of this is when they gave out all those mythical pokemon over the course of a year. All of them were level 100! But many of them had movesets that would place them at much lower levels??
Like take Meloetta for example. Its moves were Round, Quick Attack & Confusion. That would put it approximately at level 15. But no! It was level 100! If you wanted to use it you needed to go to the move reminder to give it actual moves.
?????
Ema Skye
Work!
The only good thing about the Pokeathlon is it's lobby song.
I love how well the official art of each Galar starter conveys its personality and theme.
"Pumpkinz, did you post this in the wrong thread?" No, just bear with me.
Look at Scorbunny. Full of energy that one is.
A nice action pose for Raboot that shows off its speed and athleticism.
Another action pose for Cinderace, this time showing off its soccer inspiration.
It doesn't sell the theme quite as well as Scorbunny, but Sobble looks surprised and not very happy.
Drizzile just screams "suspicious emo teen".
Inteleon has a confident lean and holds its gun(hand) up in front of its face, both hallmarks of a super spy.
Nothing about this really indicates that Grookey uses that stick in its hair to do... anything, but I feel energized looking at this cute little monkey, so I guess I could see it also energizing plants. I actually completely forgot that my avatar is a plant person. That was not intended to be a joke.
Still nothing to indicate that the sticks are anything more than decoration... and Thwackey doesn't really look like the type to get lost in the sauce when drumming.
Finally, we have Rillaboom and... I'm sorry, what the fuck is this?
Grookey and Thwackey had no indication of using their sticks as drumsticks, but they at least, you know, had sticks. Rillaboom doesn't have its drumsticks or its drum. It's just standing there looking pissed.
"Pumpkinz, did you post this in the wrong thread?" No, just bear with me.
Look at Scorbunny. Full of energy that one is.
A nice action pose for Raboot that shows off its speed and athleticism.
Another action pose for Cinderace, this time showing off its soccer inspiration.
It doesn't sell the theme quite as well as Scorbunny, but Sobble looks surprised and not very happy.
Drizzile just screams "suspicious emo teen".
Inteleon has a confident lean and holds its gun(hand) up in front of its face, both hallmarks of a super spy.
Nothing about this really indicates that Grookey uses that stick in its hair to do... anything, but I feel energized looking at this cute little monkey, so I guess I could see it also energizing plants. I actually completely forgot that my avatar is a plant person. That was not intended to be a joke.
Still nothing to indicate that the sticks are anything more than decoration... and Thwackey doesn't really look like the type to get lost in the sauce when drumming.
Finally, we have Rillaboom and... I'm sorry, what the fuck is this?
Grookey and Thwackey had no indication of using their sticks as drumsticks, but they at least, you know, had sticks. Rillaboom doesn't have its drumsticks or its drum. It's just standing there looking pissed.
You know, looking at these now, I think gen 8 might be the first time I like all three middle stages better than the final evos. Gen 2 comes close but sadly Gatr is cooler than Croconaw.
I honestly hate how Scorbunny's ears are both weirdly fused, asymmetrically placed, and blatantly colored in 1 swoop. Also the rectangle patch of fur looking incredibly artificial. The peked face is technically unhealthy if it were a real animal (think persian cats with flat faces) and the triangle tooth that plagued humans is there too
Interestingly the model and the anime fixes the assymetrically placed ears, though them fusing is still iffy
Interestingly the model and the anime fixes the assymetrically placed ears, though them fusing is still iffy
I'm pretty sure the main art just cheats the ears to the side for the sake of a better pose, kinda like how Sonic's mouth is usually on whichever side of his face is closer to the camera.I honestly hate how Scorbunny's ears are both weirdly fused, asymmetrically placed, and blatantly colored in 1 swoop. Also the rectangle patch of fur looking incredibly artificial. The peked face is technically unhealthy if it were a real animal (think persian cats with flat faces) and the triangle tooth that plagued humans is there too
View attachment 254456
Interestingly the model and the anime fixes the assymetrically placed ears, though them fusing is still iffy
In the first one (the official art) it looks like the ears are lagging behind Scorbunny's head as it leaps forward, and they make a nice curve with the feet (line of action and all that). In the second one (edited to straighten the ears) Scorbunny looks much more stiff.
I'm pretty sure the square patch on Scorbunny's face is supposed to look artificial, since it's evoking the whole bandage-across-the-nose thing you see in anime characters.
Honestly, all evolution items should be much easier to get than they currently are, because it's just a pain in the ass for no real reason.
I just realized Gen 5 changed how Sheer cold's accuracy worked for non Ice type users
Outside Smeargle sketching it which should be a low priority anyway given the accuracy (unlike Dark Void, though that got punished unfairly)....why the nerf?
But then you realize, legitimately, the only non ice type that could learn it is Suicune and Kyogre.....
Outside Smeargle sketching it which should be a low priority anyway given the accuracy (unlike Dark Void, though that got punished unfairly)....why the nerf?
The guess is that since it's the only 1HKO you cannot be immune to (outside sturdy/sash) , they wanted to keep it ""limited"" to ice typesI just realized Gen 5 changed how Sheer cold's accuracy worked for non Ice type users
But then you realize, legitimately, the only non ice type that could learn it is Suicune and Kyogre.....
Outside Smeargle sketching it which should be a low priority anyway given the accuracy (unlike Dark Void, though that got punished unfairly)....why the nerf?
alright i initially only had 1 thing to say on this but the more i thought about it the more things i thought of. hope this one doesn't get too long
the design philosophy of evil teams requiring "cannon fodder" pokemon is harmful to pokemon design as a whole.
it seems that every main series game is plagued with this issue. evil team grunts will consistently use the same couple of pokemon lines. the lines in question tend to be some of the weakest, most uninteresting pokemon in the game. it feels like these pokemon are intentionally gimped in the design phase to allow the player to fight large numbers of them at the same time.
a good example of this is patrat vs lillipup in gen 5. both pokemon are found in the same place, and the evolutions at around level 18 are comparable in power to each other. but the more appealing (aesthetically) of the two, lillipup, has yet another evolution that can hold its own with the strong lategame challenges, while patrat/watchog are stuck being used by plasma grunts and inevitably getting ohko'd by any remotely threatening pokemon that the player has.
as a result, several pokemon lines, each one showing promise to become something greater, are held back. rattata, poochyena, glameow, stunky, patrat, and purrloin, just for some examples, have practically no use for any player who knows what they're doing. the necessity of these weak and "evil" pokemon is somewhat at odds with one of the main ideas of pokemon, that every pokemon has potential to be good or evil, strong or weak, regardless of its species.
it's not even a hard problem to solve. if there's one thing evil teams like doing, it's stealing pokemon. you can still get across the message that these grunts are relatively weak and don't make an effort to understand pokemon in different ways. something like a stolen blissey that uses only offensive moves rather than making use of its ability to take hits would do a great job at nailing down the problems with the evil team's approach to the game. similarly, unevolved forms of pokemon that evolve through happiness, like swadloon or riolu, could show the inherent issues with not being friendly to pokemon.
pokemon has actually used both of these in the past, and it worked great. the koffing line are common among grunts and admins in the johto games. the line is relatively hard to ko physically, but it's held back by mediocre power and special defense. however, it has potential competitively thanks to its access to levitate + will-o-wisp + toxic spikes, giving it a solid niche as a physical wall in lower tiers.
but what they did with the zubat line is even more impressive. throughout the game, zubat and golbat are used by grunts and weak trainers with the occasional use by an evil team admin. the final fights against silver and cyrus feature a powerful pokemon that you likely haven't even seen before: crobat. the mere presence of this pokemon adds so much to an already good fight. you aren't facing just another grunt, you're facing an experienced trainer with strong convictions.
considering this, though, it just makes everything else look that much worse. pokemon like mightyena and liepard really have no excuse to be as bad as they are. that just really annoys me.
the design philosophy of evil teams requiring "cannon fodder" pokemon is harmful to pokemon design as a whole.
it seems that every main series game is plagued with this issue. evil team grunts will consistently use the same couple of pokemon lines. the lines in question tend to be some of the weakest, most uninteresting pokemon in the game. it feels like these pokemon are intentionally gimped in the design phase to allow the player to fight large numbers of them at the same time.
a good example of this is patrat vs lillipup in gen 5. both pokemon are found in the same place, and the evolutions at around level 18 are comparable in power to each other. but the more appealing (aesthetically) of the two, lillipup, has yet another evolution that can hold its own with the strong lategame challenges, while patrat/watchog are stuck being used by plasma grunts and inevitably getting ohko'd by any remotely threatening pokemon that the player has.
as a result, several pokemon lines, each one showing promise to become something greater, are held back. rattata, poochyena, glameow, stunky, patrat, and purrloin, just for some examples, have practically no use for any player who knows what they're doing. the necessity of these weak and "evil" pokemon is somewhat at odds with one of the main ideas of pokemon, that every pokemon has potential to be good or evil, strong or weak, regardless of its species.
it's not even a hard problem to solve. if there's one thing evil teams like doing, it's stealing pokemon. you can still get across the message that these grunts are relatively weak and don't make an effort to understand pokemon in different ways. something like a stolen blissey that uses only offensive moves rather than making use of its ability to take hits would do a great job at nailing down the problems with the evil team's approach to the game. similarly, unevolved forms of pokemon that evolve through happiness, like swadloon or riolu, could show the inherent issues with not being friendly to pokemon.
pokemon has actually used both of these in the past, and it worked great. the koffing line are common among grunts and admins in the johto games. the line is relatively hard to ko physically, but it's held back by mediocre power and special defense. however, it has potential competitively thanks to its access to levitate + will-o-wisp + toxic spikes, giving it a solid niche as a physical wall in lower tiers.
but what they did with the zubat line is even more impressive. throughout the game, zubat and golbat are used by grunts and weak trainers with the occasional use by an evil team admin. the final fights against silver and cyrus feature a powerful pokemon that you likely haven't even seen before: crobat. the mere presence of this pokemon adds so much to an already good fight. you aren't facing just another grunt, you're facing an experienced trainer with strong convictions.
considering this, though, it just makes everything else look that much worse. pokemon like mightyena and liepard really have no excuse to be as bad as they are. that just really annoys me.
SwSh also brings Linoone being fodder for Yell grunts while giving it a threatening evo in Obstagoon, which is used by Piers.
I think you oversell the issue there.
The game needs bad pokemon, and I don't really think they decide that a pokemon must be bad because a specific evul team uses them. If anything the opposite, when they decide which pokemon has to be the "cannon fodder" they look at which of the available one seems more fitting to the theme.
I'd be very surprised if the design behind Rattata or Mightyena was "we need a bad evil pokemon for the evil team".
especially when no one really used the new bad pokemon in some games. Like gen 2, Rocket doesn't use the Sentret, Ledyba or Spinarak lines, and spinarak would be reasonable flavor since its poison type.
Likewise Galactic opted for Glameow and....w-wurmple?? I think? instead of Bibarel and Kricketune.
And hell Purugly & Skuntank arent even that bad Pokemon. More than usuable just kind of mediocre.
I agree that the game needs bad Pokemon and the evil teams don't usually use absolute bottom-of-the-barrel junk, but it does annoy me how their Pokemon are usually Dark or Poison types (or Normal types with dark colors) just because they fit the cliche "bad guy" aesthetic. A little more variety would be nice, even if you're only picking from weaker Pokemon.
On an entirely different note...This was mentioned a long time ago, but after replaying White 2, I just have to bring up how obnoxious it is that, in the first 7 generations of Pokemon, you could not ride the bicycle (or Ride Pokemon in SM) without overriding the unique, mood-setting overworld music in whatever area you happened to be in (with only a few exceptions to let you know that things were getting Very Serious). These games have so much amazing music, but for so long, if you wanted to get around quickly and conveniently you had to ditch it for the same inane jingle. Is there any other series that steps on its own soundtrack like this? Finally changing this was one thing that Sw/Sh got right.
On an entirely different note...This was mentioned a long time ago, but after replaying White 2, I just have to bring up how obnoxious it is that, in the first 7 generations of Pokemon, you could not ride the bicycle (or Ride Pokemon in SM) without overriding the unique, mood-setting overworld music in whatever area you happened to be in (with only a few exceptions to let you know that things were getting Very Serious). These games have so much amazing music, but for so long, if you wanted to get around quickly and conveniently you had to ditch it for the same inane jingle. Is there any other series that steps on its own soundtrack like this? Finally changing this was one thing that Sw/Sh got right.
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I'd point that in Japanese, the "Dark" type is actually called "Evil" type. Which... kinda fits the evil team deal.
And well in the last gen, team Yell despite not being evil at all is literally the Dark Type trainers so :D
I don't even believe the game needs bad Pokémon. Some will inevitably fall to the bottom of a tier list, but that doesn't mean you need to design them as bad or uninteresting from the get-go. You can easily find a balance of making them decent without making them overwhelmingly so in a way that people who picked them up can still use them -- heck, the particular gen we're talking about even met that middle ground perfectly with Stoutland, a Pokémon that's far from being incredible but is still reliable enough to be used late-game. There's no need for Liepard and Watchog to be as bad as they are.
I disagree: I'll just quote the good old "If everything is overpowered, nothing is".
With more and more pokemon coming through, it's literally impossible to make only good pokemon. The game needs diversity, which also means it needs terrible pokemon, meme ones, and early game stuff that falls off hard.
If they tried to design all pokemon as "good" you'd not feel any sense of progression going from your caterpie line to a scyther.
Obviously, it also needs to balance this with availability in order to make compelling choices for the player: do you take that caterpie or sentret that are all over the place and keep going, or do you stay around the area a bit in order to see if a stronger, rarer Pokemon shows up? Do you go for the 3% catch rate rare spawn with the few pokeballs you have, or you rather get that guaranteed Wooloo that'll work until you can replace it with anything better? Do you replace the Pelipper that served you for 30 levels and you potentially developed a emotional bond with for that new fancy Gyarados you just evolved?
If those (and more situations) are made properly, the presence of bad pokemon make for compelling choices. Obviously if your rare spawn is a trash pokemon and you have 100% catch rate garchomps all over the place, it doesn't work out.
And to be fair, I think SwSh has done a good job with this, I think the distribution in (most) zones is spot on, with average and mediocre pokemon being very common, and stronger ones usually being rare or conditional (read: weather) spawns.
But as I said, it's quite easy to meet those requirements without designing the worst ones as literally trash. Again, you've got stuff like Leavanny and Stoutland and even Musharna in this game; stuff that's rubbish but still usable. No excuse for stuff like Liepard and Watchog.
So let's get the obvious out of the way.
This expansion pass costs around half the price of the full SwSh game. I only just bought it and it's downloading, which from the sounds of it was a mistake. Apparently playing through Isle of Armour casually takes around ~2 hours. There are no generic trainers -- only story battles -- and somehow the levels of the few story battles is lower than the Champion even though the game's been out for ages and everyone's already beaten the game.
So, judging at least by Isle of Armour, this was not worth the price. Hell, everyone who's finished Isle of Armour has just been disappointed, so it's not even worth the 2 hour playtime.
And even if Crown Tundra is much bigger and amazing, forcing players to buy both "packs" in a pass (meaning it's the equivalent of one pack with a staggered release for half of it) is awful. Players should have the option not to buy this 2 hour waste of time if they want.
Terrible business practice. 0/10.
This expansion pass costs around half the price of the full SwSh game. I only just bought it and it's downloading, which from the sounds of it was a mistake. Apparently playing through Isle of Armour casually takes around ~2 hours. There are no generic trainers -- only story battles -- and somehow the levels of the few story battles is lower than the Champion even though the game's been out for ages and everyone's already beaten the game.
So, judging at least by Isle of Armour, this was not worth the price. Hell, everyone who's finished Isle of Armour has just been disappointed, so it's not even worth the 2 hour playtime.
And even if Crown Tundra is much bigger and amazing, forcing players to buy both "packs" in a pass (meaning it's the equivalent of one pack with a staggered release for half of it) is awful. Players should have the option not to buy this 2 hour waste of time if they want.
Terrible business practice. 0/10.
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Ema Skye
Work!
Appreciate the post because now I won't get it.