Lockdown Mafia 2: Hail To The Chief - Game Over, Mafia Wins!

Sorry for defending Mekkah. I would rather have him on my side than a random no name player. I jump up at the sound of his name because I'll admit it, I really don't want him lynched. If he is on village, I'm pretty sure he could help a lot. I just don't want people to go around thinking people are mafia right away.

P.S. I don't really necessarily think that Tenken (or anybody else) is mafia. I probably will change my vote, once we as a village have gathered more information.
 
If he is villy, then your right in defending him. But if he isn't, you're helping a mole/mafiaman. Don't go defending people unless you know they won't stab you in the back when your use ends.
 

Seven Deadly Sins

~hallelujah~
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Oh, I forgot to mention a revision to the BG rule.

The Corporate Spin Doctor (Free Agent) may protect one person an infinite number of times. However, if the mafia targets a protected individual, they receive the Free Agent's identity instead of successfully killing the target. The Free Agent may not protect himself.
 

cim

happiness is such hard work
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If he is villy, then your right in defending him. But if he isn't, you're helping a mole/mafiaman. Don't go defending people unless you know they won't stab you in the back when your use ends.
Then no one can defend anyone ever. You can't trust anyone fully in NOC mafia (the way it should be) except mayor.

Personally I like the way he thinks with deciding whether or not to vote for someone like Mekkah. The reward of having a good player around is worth the risk they're mafia, on Day 1 when you don't know anything.
 
Hi, just saying I do follow the game even if I can't discuss much for now as I'm at a friend's. Also, Mekkah's acting kinda like he did in the previous NOC, where he was part of the mafia - but then again, that attitude is the same one as that of a caring villager, so takes it as you will. For those who weren't in the first NOC though I'd still suggest reading the thread, it should be interesting.

Also of course we have to discuss and all but let's not get too aggressive.
 
@Everyone, if you were mafia, who would you recruit?
Anyone who is at least above average. An above average person's faults counterbalance the added risk involved with choosing the best person. A stupid person helps no one.

As for a specific person, I'd probably randomise from the best 6-7 names.
 
Out of anyone, Mekkah is striking me as the most suspicious actually.
I'd love to hear your reasoning on that.

I don't think mafia would recruit one of the big names, considering those are often the ones that get inspected first, or expected to die early barring a bodyguard protect. I would try to recruit someone like billymills, who isn't anywhere near a big name, but still competent.

And yes, I expect to die pretty early in the game unless the mafia try to frame me by leaving me alive or I'm protected by the bodyguard.

Mekkah may be waiting for more posts, but isn't it strange for someone supporting a lynch position to not be voting anyone. Again it could just be due to there not being enough people posting for him to attack.
There's plenty of time for that. But if it's so important to you, I will just fire jumpluff since she hasn't posted yet.
 
Oh, I didn't notice that there had been an update yet. Sorry, I'll be more active now.

Mekkah, it isn't a given that the mafia are competent enough to know you shouldn't be recruited early, or know that someone like billymills is competent, although I agree, that isn't enough to make Mekkah more suspicious than anyone else at this stage.

I would like to see Class provide reasoning for casting suspicion upon Mekkah. I can't tell if he's just being a clueless villager lashing out randomly or has actual reasons.

My main thoughts are this: Tenken is looking worse and worse as time passes.

Wow, you really want me lynched.

I may not be the best player, but where was it decided that you were amazing? I rarely play mafia games on smogon, so most games I play actually are mafiascum-style. And in those games, Day 1 usually does end in No Lynch from what I see.

So your plan is to kill bad townies randomly, because that doesn't hurt us? Well if they are a bad townie, they are most likely a bad mafia, which means they will slip. If they will slip, then there is no reason to start killing them randomly lowering our numbers. You are just trying to justify mislynches.
Frankly, this looks along the lines of 'LYNCH ME? YOU'LL BE SORRY!', which is often a pretty obvious bluff. It even includes personal attacks, lol. The post is even full of desperate, senseless lines like 'Well if they are a bad townie, they are most likely a bad mafia'. That's terrible reasoning. It feels like he's trying to buy time, with 'I'll slip eventually if I'm mafia, otherwise I'm not!', which is what his defense boils down to. He's also trying to hide behind being unskilled, which just reeks of 'I don't have anything better to defend myself with'. Lastly, his appeal to everyone -- 'who would you recruit?' -- doesn't look so great combined with everything else.

Personally, I don't see anything as badly wrong as Chris says with a no lynch, because numbers are always a problem, and there's always the possibility we hit someone important, but that's true of any day we could make a mislynch, so given that logic, we shouldn't vote any day, just in case we hit ourselves. In fact, I fully expect we'll hit ourselves at least once this game, due to people being dumb, people being paranoid, mafias attempting to misdirect us, and people behaving oddly when really they are an innocent villager. I also disagree with Chris that lynching a stupid villager isn't a problem, but I feel here the potential rewards really exceed the risk, given my increasing certainty about Tenken.

Fire Tenken.

aska, I'd like it if you didn't sit back so much, please; you have the leadership role here. I'm not saying 'start bandwagons', I'm just saying you can contribute to the discussions too. Your words are the most valuable of all. Rook and Chris aren't more suspicious for posting, they each have their own defining suspicious features. Chris's pushiness and insistence on lynching, even disregarding the possibility of a mislynch, which can be suspicious (although I somewhat agree, as expressed above), and Rook's blind defence of Mekkah, even if he says it's just because Mekkah is a big name.
 
Jumpluff is playing the vanilla card. Didn't notice the game started (no pm). But it seems odd when this thread has been at the top of the list for most of the day and hasn't gotten in here until mentioned.

RVS is usually used just to get reactions, not to get actual kills. The fact that people are fine with a blind lynch amazes me.

So far Jumpluff seems to be the only one who has provided a real attack against me. How can I defend myself when people don't post reasons for voting me (Real reasons, not kill noobs).

I'm trying to show Chris how stupid his justification is. Killing a player because he is new/unproductive is dumb. If he sucks so bad, he would eventually expose himself (sort of like I believe Rook defending Mekkah (But I'm not 100% on that)).

Where have I tried to hide behind unskilled? That is just what everyone is calling me. I've said I'm not the best. But I haven't used that as a defense at all. I haven't even made a defense, because people haven't given me things to defend against.

Ask has already said he thniks the town is wrong on this lynch, so you guys obviously don't care what he has to say.

As for my question, I am new here and do not know how people play. It also gives information to the town, isn't that what you guys are complaining about (lack of information)?

Hopefully more people will answer my question before I die, so I can at least help out a little more (If I have at all lol).
 

cim

happiness is such hard work
is a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus
Jumpluff is playing the vanilla card. Didn't notice the game started (no pm). But it seems odd when this thread has been at the top of the list for most of the day and hasn't gotten in here until mentioned.
To be fair pluff doesn't frequent Smogon / is Australian / etc etc. Still something to note for the future.

RVS is usually used just to get reactions, not to get actual kills. The fact that people are fine with a blind lynch amazes me.
All lynches in NOC Mafia are "blind". In fact, that's the worst part of normal Smofia in my opinion: Lynches are never blind and the game becomes "who manages power best", which is just a function of how well constructed the game is.

So far Jumpluff seems to be the only one who has provided a real attack against me. How can I defend myself when people don't post reasons for voting me (Real reasons, not kill noobs).
I've posted several reasons. I think you're stupid, and no one else had aced stupid when I initially voted for you. Your defense of course is actually swaying my vote from "you're stupid and we have no one else" to "you're the most mafia like player around".

I'm trying to show Chris how stupid his justification is. Killing a player because he is new/unproductive is dumb. If he sucks so bad, he would eventually expose himself (sort of like I believe Rook defending Mekkah (But I'm not 100% on that)).
The point of killing a "bad townie" is that even if you're not mafia, bad townies do more harm to the town than good. And you want to be sure a "good townie" is mafia before you elect to lynch them lest you lose a good player. Though I'm having a hard time believing you're not mafia as of late.

Where have I tried to hide behind unskilled? That is just what everyone is calling me.
You're the only one who's said it.

I've said I'm not the best. But I haven't used that as a defense at all.
You said:
I may not be the best player, but where was it decided that you were amazing? I rarely play mafia games on smogon, so most games I play actually are mafiascum-style.
Yeah....

Dude, scroll the fuck down. You defend yourself that way later in your post. I don't see how it's relevant to why I think you're mafia but w/e.

Ask has already said he thniks the town is wrong on this lynch, so you guys obviously don't care what he has to say.
You said:
Ninjask has as much information as the rest of us do.
granted he is a confirmed townie so we know he's not trying to bullshit us but his gut feelings are still just that.
 
Post all reasons you think I am stupid. That is obviously the basis of your attack, so it should be easy.

I did misspell ridiculous. Sorry I don't use Firefox/wasn;t thinking.

I already knew sign-ups were closed. I never once said they were open. It was stupid of you to attack me for that. I said this game should just end, if it isn't going to go anywhere, so we can sign up for future games.

That is why you started attacking me, which appeared to be part of RVS, but you are obviously taking it much further.

you say I also seem scummy to you, so can you provide instances where, so I can defend myself?

"Blind" lynches are fine, if they are informed with good reasons, not BS "I think he is dumb."

Where did I use being a new player as a defense? I never have, show me, because I must be so dumb I missed it.
 
Now you're trying to straw man me, good work. I never said or thought you were stupid. I explained why I think you're bad, and it isn't 'Tenken is stupid'. I already provided reasoning with quotes. I don't think I said anything about you being new; I did refer to this:

'I may not be the best player,'
 
I am talking to Chris. I already posted replying to you.

Edit:
That is just me saying I am not the best player. Not being the best =/= being bad. Even if it did, I never used being bad as a defense.
 
Oh, I missed a few posts. Sorry.

My point stands.

Jumpluff is playing the vanilla card. Didn't notice the game started (no pm). But it seems odd when this thread has been at the top of the list for most of the day and hasn't gotten in here until mentioned.
If I am a vanilla, then it's bad for me to claim that outright, because the mafia will know not to kill me. However, what I meant was that because I am in Australia (time zone) and don't check Smogon daily, I didn't notice until SDS brought it to my attention on IRC.

Now to attend to business:

I'm trying to show Chris how stupid his justification is. Killing a player because he is new/unproductive is dumb. If he sucks so bad, he would eventually expose himself (sort of like I believe Rook defending Mekkah (But I'm not 100% on that)).

Where have I tried to hide behind unskilled? That is just what everyone is calling me. I've said I'm not the best. But I haven't used that as a defense at all. I haven't even made a defense, because people haven't given me things to defend against.

Ask has already said he thniks the town is wrong on this lynch, so you guys obviously don't care what he has to say.

As for my question, I am new here and do not know how people play. It also gives information to the town, isn't that what you guys are complaining about (lack of information)?

Hopefully more people will answer my question before I die, so I can at least help out a little more (If I have at all lol).
Like I said, I am in semi-disagreement and semi-agreement with Chris. A stupid person (I don't think you are stupid) is bad for the village, but it isn't a justification for mislynching. However, I'm beginning to be convinced this isn't an issue of 'should we risk lynching an unskilled player?', but instead an issue of 'I think this person is mafia, and is my prime suspect'.

I addressed the unskilled issue in my other post. Chris did as well.

aska may be president, so his words carry the most weight because we know he isn't mafia (I think Chris said this as well, and I believe I said that before), but he's as educated as the rest of us are. I think you are trying to hide behind other people too much. aska, everyone else (like I said, your appeal to everyone with 'who would you recruit?')... etc., in lieu of an actual defense.
 
I never considered it hiding behind aska, but I guess you can see it that way. I am simply saying he disagreed with lynching me, but you went for it and then asked for him to give more input. It is like saying talk more, but I won't listen.

My question, as I stated, was to gather information without blindly killing a player. No one will answer it now.
Townies will likely flock to one of the more experienced players. Some may overthink the question to really get into it, but the result should be a popular player.

Mafia will probably try to avoid it (unless everyone is answering it). If they did answer it, it probably wouldn't be a straight answer. If it was a straight answer, well that is really iffy, since then the question becomes "was he bold enough to throw his own under?" (Probably not)

I could be completely wrong, but that is how I see the quetsion/intent.

Billymills has defended me, since the start of this. I don't know much about him (besides he is semi-experienced based off of what Mekkah said), but he really has no reason to keep defending me.
His first defense was completely valid imo, because it was true.
But then he defended me again without asking, but it wasn't a very hardcore defense. It was just "this is a mistake." I guess he might have strong convictions and belief in me.
I didn't like his answer to my question. Instead of just giving me a name (or two) he says he'd randomly select from a list.

I don't want to vote him, especially since if he is town it'd be horrible to kill one of the guys that is protecting me, since it means he actually thinks. But it just seems like a mafia member trying to buddy and gain the trust of the town.
1. If I don't die, I will start trusting him.
2. If I die, he can play, I tried to protect Tenken.

I doubt this will do anything, since I'm as good as dead. But maybe it'll help down the road, if I'm not completely wrong =\.

Fire Billymills.

Others
Jumpluff - coming in right when mentioned. Not sure on. But that is strange.
Rook - Defending Mekkah unprompted.
Mekkah - Not really gathering much information, even though that is his plan. Association with Rook.

I think Pluff is probably town. If Mills is town, I'd be stronger on rook/mekkah. If mills is mafia, I'd lean away from rook/mekkah.

Ehh just a bunch of thoughts with the little out there =\ sorry if I'm wrong on this.

Edit:
Also guys selectively read a lot. I never even voted No Lynch, which was a reason I was attacked. I even said I usually like Day 1 lynches. That post was just to point out that the town is being very aggressive, when usually day 1 is a no lynch.
 
I don't even understand your question, can you post it in question form? It's late and I'm tired and I'm going to go to bed soon, in case someone jumps on me for sleeping.

I assume SDS let me know because Mekkah had posted a lynch vote on me.

I asked aska to post more because we can trust his words, even if we can't rely on them. I think aska is unwilling to back a hesitant lynch, but the president isn't a 'neutral' position, per se.

Rook's blunder -- just like yours -- may have been the results of inexperience, but they certainly are suspicious. After all, inexperience is just as likely in a mafia. There were a few moments in the last NOC mafia where we as the mafia cringed.
 
My blunder? Do you mean my post asking to end the game? I don't see how that is a blunder at all, and people are giving it too much time.

I don't even know what uestion you mean lol. If it was themafia recruit question, that is old. If it is you coming in at a convenient time, that isn't really a question.
 

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