Pokémon Medicham

[Deleted User 220884]

I never said it was to be a revenge killer. Bullet Punch is there to kill weaker threats, that would be faster than medicham, and possibly ko it. Also, Medicham shouldn't even dare to stay in against Aeigislash, King shield or shadow sneak/shadow ball screws you over.

 

[Random Passerby]

I never said it was to be a revenge killer. Bullet Punch is there to kill weaker threats, that would be faster than medicham, and possibly ko it. Also, Medicham shouldn't even dare to stay in against Aeigislash, King shield or shadow sneak/shadow ball screws you over.

What are you even Bullet Punching in OU?

 

[Raegar]

Question, Mega Medicham gets 60/85/85 defenses and learns both, recover an substitute. Can it not run a bulky set that takes advantage of its natural atk bases to deal damage?

 

[Sergeant Spooky]

There's no reason to use any move that's not High Jump Kick.

I mean not really, but usually you want to use High Jump Kick.

 

[KingHeracrossTheBug]

Question, Mega Medicham gets 60/85/85 defenses and learns both, recover an substitute. Can it not run a bulky set that takes advantage of its natural atk bases to deal damage?

It doesn't have many good resists, and it's weak to many common types, so I think not.

 

[Aragorn the King]

Question, Mega Medicham gets 60/85/85 defenses and learns both, recover an substitute. Can it not run a bulky set that takes advantage of its natural atk bases to deal damage?

60/85/85 is dreadful bulk no matter how you put it. Yes, its attack is marvelous, but part of the reason is the investment. Without investment, it can't 2HKO Skarmory.

With maximum Defense investment, you're taking 70% from a Life Orb Excadrill's Earthquake and 83% from a +0 Mega Charizard-X. You do avoid the 2HKO from Mawile and Bisharp's Sucker Punch, but you can't OHKO the former any longer, so it's rather pointless. If you're using Mega Cham, you should be using HJK (never Drain Punch) / Zen Headbutt / Fire Punch / Substitute | Ice Punch | Thunder Punch

 

[Raegar]

60/85/85 is dreadful bulk no matter how you put it. Yes, its attack is marvelous, but part of the reason is the investment. Without investment, it can't 2HKO Skarmory.

With maximum Defense investment, you're taking 70% from a Life Orb Excadrill's Earthquake and 83% from a +0 Mega Charizard-X. You do avoid the 2HKO from Mawile and Bisharp's Sucker Punch, but you can't OHKO the former any longer, so it's rather pointless. If you're using Mega Cham, you should be using HJK (never Drain Punch) / Zen Headbutt / Fire Punch / Substitute | Ice Punch | Thunder Punch

Thanks for the calculations, that`s really what I wanted to know. I`m good on the set, just was curious if it could pull a bulky set with recover.

 

[Anjunadeep]

60/85/85 is dreadful bulk no matter how you put it. Yes, its attack is marvelous, but part of the reason is the investment. Without investment, it can't 2HKO Skarmory.

With maximum Defense investment, you're taking 70% from a Life Orb Excadrill's Earthquake and 83% from a +0 Mega Charizard-X. You do avoid the 2HKO from Mawile and Bisharp's Sucker Punch, but you can't OHKO the former any longer, so it's rather pointless. If you're using Mega Cham, you should be using HJK (never Drain Punch) / Zen Headbutt / Fire Punch / Substitute | Ice Punch | Thunder Punch

I've been running a substitute+drain punch set with some success. Sure, it becomes less of a wallbreaker, but it stays in the battle longer as it can make many more substitutes.
Then again, I am the noob who suggested meditate medicham

 

[Turducken64]

I've been running a substitute+drain punch set with some success. Sure, it becomes less of a wallbreaker, but it stays in the battle longer as it can make many more substitutes.
Then again, I am the noob who suggested meditate medicham

Sub drain punch is an okay set in my opinion as you can ignore status and be really annoying to stall however HJK is an absolute nuke that obliterates everything that isn’t bulky and resists it or immune this is why cham often enjoys something that can pursuit trap gengar and aegislash

Why is people still discussing Fake Out? Almost every single user has pointed out that it's horribly useless.

I run fake out mostly for chip damage and being able to out priority things like talonflame and mega pinsir as well as getting safe mega turn and speed boost. It is kinda useful if you have issues with birdspam and I use it to get things in range of dragonites espeed if I lose something I need early in the game. The free chip damage can do wonders sometimes.

 

[thdhted]

Sub drain punch is an okay set in my opinion as you can ignore status and be really annoying to stall however HJK is an absolute nuke that obliterates everything that isn’t bulky and resists it or immune this is why cham often enjoys something that can pursuit trap gengar and aegislash



I run fake out mostly for chip damage and being able to out priority things like talonflame and mega pinsir as well as getting safe mega turn and speed boost. It is kinda useful if you have issues with birdspam and I use it to get things in range of dragonites espeed if I lose something I need early in the game. The free chip damage can do wonders sometimes.

yes, but you are sacrificing coverage for an otherwise useless move, just to get the boost. It's quite simply easier to mega against slower mons instead of sacrificing coverage for a move that becomes useless after the first turn. By running fake out, you are losing out on coverage, substitute, baton pass, and other moves that are much more useful. I ran fake out early in XY and thought it was good, until I switched to thunderpunch. Coverage beats fake out evey time.

 

[Turducken64]

Eh I like picking off talonflames and mega pinsirs and have other stuff for aegis and Slowbro. Forms a good priority core with band nites espeed. I don't really know tbh I guess it depends what u need +3 priority on fake out has a little bit of a niche. I really don't need the extra coverage on my team. Bisharp handles Slowbro and aegi rather well and fake out ha saved my butt a ton when I needed a little extra damage on a nasty plot thundurus i let set up or a plus two mega pinsir after zapdos went down it is fairly niche but useful when extra coverage isn't needed. Sub is not good with hjk in my opinion and baton pass passed intimidate drops which sucks.

 

[Arcanine is Regal]

Fsr I am watching this thread, but while I am here I might as well throw in what I think about fake out and bullet punch.

If you run fake out and bullet punch I hate you and think you are a noob, because it is not as good as running coverage moves. That being said I have admittedly lost games because megacham was able to dance around my weakened team fake outting and bullet punching things to oblivion, I have lost 1-3 games that I would have won if they were not running fake out + BP, It was the most frustrating thing ever and I think they are retarded...but it worked. So yeah maybe having the double priority will benefit you in a few situations, it doesnt make sense to use it on a wallbreaker and a mega, it is a waste and he should be using coverage moves in order to wallbreak effectively.

 

[Turducken64]

Fsr I am watching this thread, but while I am here I might as well throw in what I think about fake out and bullet punch.

If you run fake out and bullet punch I hate you and think you are a noob, because it is not as good as running coverage moves. That being said I have admittedly lost games because megacham was able to dance around my weakened team fake outting and bullet punching things to oblivion, I have lost 1-3 games that I would have won if they were not running fake out + BP, It was the most frustrating thing ever and I think they are retarded...but it worked. So yeah maybe having the double priority will benefit you in a few situations, it doesnt make sense to use it on a wallbreaker and a mega, it is a waste and he should be using coverage moves in order to wallbreak effectively.

Agree with u completely both on one set is stupid but being able to pick stuff off with priority can save your butt

 

[thdhted]

Agree with u completely both on one set is stupid but being able to pick stuff off with priority can save your butt

how about this, instead of fake out, how about bullet punch instead? It at least more reliable than fake out. Besides, I run t-punch because otherwise flame, gyrados, slowbro, and azumarill can switch in for free a lot of the time. In those cases, fake out is useless, and the opponent gets a kill or free turn, as medicham is threatened Out by all four/ can't do much to them.

 

[KingHeracrossTheBug]

Eh I like picking off talonflames and mega pinsirs and have other stuff for aegis and Slowbro. Forms a good priority core with band nites espeed. I don't really know tbh I guess it depends what u need +3 priority on fake out has a little bit of a niche. I really don't need the extra coverage on my team. Bisharp handles Slowbro and aegi rather well and fake out ha saved my butt a ton when I needed a little extra damage on a nasty plot thundurus i let set up or a plus two mega pinsir after zapdos went down it is fairly niche but useful when extra coverage isn't needed. Sub is not good with hjk in my opinion and baton pass passed intimidate drops which sucks.

252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Fake Out vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Talonflame: 96-114 (32.2 - 38.2%) -- 97.4% chance to 3HKO

If you can get Talonflame so low on health, you should be able to kill it right away. Also, why the fuck does M-edicham's "Usage" set have both HJK and Drain Punch?

Fsr I am watching this thread, but while I am here I might as well throw in what I think about fake out and bullet punch.

If you run fake out and bullet punch I hate you and think you are a noob, because it is not as good as running coverage moves. That being said I have admittedly lost games because megacham was able to dance around my weakened team fake outting and bullet punching things to oblivion, I have lost 1-3 games that I would have won if they were not running fake out + BP, It was the most frustrating thing ever and I think they are retarded...but it worked. So yeah maybe having the double priority will benefit you in a few situations, it doesnt make sense to use it on a wallbreaker and a mega, it is a waste and he should be using coverage moves in order to wallbreak effectively.

If you think double priority is close to good because of losing 1-3 games, I think you're the noob

 

[Always!]

Something that's bugging the fuck out of me are Drain Punch sets. The fact that they're completely inferior to HJK sets, and arguably outclassed by things like Conkeldurr that another user pointed out really bugs me. HJK is why you use MCham in the first place, the only thing Drain Punch really helps would be recovering off passive/chip damage, as you should be KOing or fleeing the opponent, or using a smart move like Substitute or Baton Pass to gain the higher ground. So can someone please explain to me why people keep using that move, as it actually seems like a bigger issue than Fake Our rn, even more so that people are running Fake Out + Drain Punch?

 

[KingHeracrossTheBug]

Something that's bugging the fuck out of me are Drain Punch sets. The fact that they're completely inferior to HJK sets, and arguably outclassed by things like Conkeldurr that another user pointed out really bugs me. HJK is why you use MCham in the first place, the only thing Drain Punch really helps would be recovering off passive/chip damage, as you should be KOing or fleeing the opponent, or using a smart move like Substitute or Baton Pass to gain the higher ground. So can someone please explain to me why people keep using that move, as it actually seems like a bigger issue than Fake Our rn, even more so that people are running Fake Out + Drain Punch?

The fact that the standard PS! Calculator set uses both HJK and Drain Punch is worse than FO + DP.

 

[Zardex]

My personal favorite Mega Cham build is:
Medicham (M) @ Medichamite
Ability: Pure Power
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Fake Out
- High Jump Kick
- Psycho Cut
- Thunder Punch (If you don't have other ways to nail those Dragons, Gliscors, and Lando-Ts then Ice Punch is the better choice.)


Honestly,I don't see that much of a problem with Fake-out. It's my favorite set on Mega-Cham as it allows me to beat a bunch of standard leads in the metagame.

Breloom, Terrakion, Mamoswine, Galvantula, Smeargle, Deoxys-S (depends on your damage rolls) nvm, bbye :[ Here's something pretty cool: let's get a bit weird here and assume for some obscure reason a lead Garchomp doesn't carry Outrage; you actually beat it. It's a given that Mega Cham will be taking some damage from taking on some of them (which Cham doesn't need his HP that much anyway, aside from surviving a HJK miss), such as Galvantula, Terrakion, and Chomp, it's still nice to see how fake-out screws them over rather convincingly as people don't expect the fake-out most of the time.


Fake-Out also offers some crucial chip damage a times:
252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Thunder Punch vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Azumarill: 328-388 (81.1 - 96%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Psycho Cut vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Mega Venusaur: 320-378 (87.9 - 103.8%) -- 25% chance to OHKO

[Edit]: I just felt like adding a few more damage calcs for Mega Cham

252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Fake Out vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Talonflame: 96-114 (32.2 - 38.2%) -- 97.4% chance to 3HKO (people have talked about this a lot already, so I'm just putting it out there again)

252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Ice Punch vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Multiscale Dragonite: 284-336 (87.6 - 103.7%) -- 25% chance to OHKO

252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Fake Out vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Greninja: 102-120 (35.6 - 41.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO (This one isn't really anything, but might help someday)


Moreover, Fake-out lets me gauge the build of some pokes.

Rotom-W:
252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Fake Out vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Rotom-W: 69-82 (22.6 - 26.9%) -- possible 5HKO after Leftovers recovery

252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Fake Out vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Rotom-W: 51-60 (16.7 - 19.7%) -- possible 7HKO after Leftovers recovery


This lets me know if it's worth risking the HJK. If my rolls are low, Cham has a chance of missing out on the KO on the Phy. Defensive Rotom-W, whilst it's always a sure KO on the SpDef Rotom-W.

Fake-out is still a situational move at best, but that doesn't mean it should be exiled from the viable moves :]

 

[Caliber Champ]

I see that some people have the wrong mindset when it comes to counters in general. When a counter shows up, switch... NO! Specifically make a build to counter that counter! That's why Fire Punch is NEEDED on Mega Medicham to fight against Aegislash. Another counter to Mega Medicham is Will O Wisp, so use Substitute for that, it also prevents it from getting revenge killed by things like sucker punch, gale wings bravebird, m. pinsir quick attack and so on. Mega Medicham needs a good coverage move and Ice Punch works great for that. Now, for the last slot... its not going to be Hi Jump Kick. Why not? Because a ghost type will easily switch in on you or a pokemon with protect will screw you over. Again, you want to be able to counter your counters. Drain Punch acts as a strong attack and is pretty much a recovery move all in one. Mega Medicham has the strongest Drain punch in the game, so it will recover plenty of health to make an unlimited amount of substitutes and it will still cause massive damage especially if you go for adamant nature. Hi Jump Kick is too much of a gamble especially against a smart player. Versatility is more important than Power especially in pokemon.

 

[Sergeant Spooky]

Using Mega Medicham without High Jump Kick is like visiting Detroit and not getting shot, or going on a cruise and then drowning, and yet people still don't run it (it doesn't even break 70% usage on the ladder.) Drain Punch can extend its longevity (it's one-shot by a large variety of moves anyway but w/e,) but not running HJK detracts from its main job, which is nuking the loving shit out of everything and lobbing off as much as 75% from offensive pokemon trying to switch in. Without HJK, you're also checked by Wisp X-zard and Quagsire walls you.

Yeah Ghosts can switch in, but you liquify Gengar with Psychic STAB (btw, Zen Headbutt is also non-negotiable, you need it for Mega Venusar and Clefable) and Aegislash switching in to Drain Punch isn't all that great either, cause it's getting a free turn. It's better to try to Fire Punch it on the switch or just double switch.

 

[MikeDawg]

I like fake out bullet punch, or one of then at the very least (probably the latter imo).

If I can't hjk something, I'm probably double switching to something that can handle the obvious switchin (the opponent doesn't have much choice given how much pressure cham causes). Does it get baton pass? That would be helpful too if you really hate predicting things.

In general, the scariest thing ever is the thought of cham having a priority move, because later in the game when it has the best chance to really dismantle my team, most of the faster things are weakened, and a bullet punch to a weak thunderus can be good game.

Run ice punch to kill gliscor and you're set imo. Cham doesnt have much busines taking on most of its switchins anyway.

 

[Anjunadeep]

Does it get baton pass? That would be helpful too if you really hate predicting things.

Yes, It does, by breeding with Mr. mime and Lopunny/Buneary. Made it viable for a bulk-up+baton pass during gen 3 or something iirc. I doubt that would be viable anymore, what with the power creep and all. I ran it with some success pre-BP nerf and it's mind-blowing power was beautiful, but it still often ended up losing to lolsmogonbird.

I like fake out bullet punch, or one of then at the very least (probably the latter imo).

lol people are gonna attack you for that
Some form of priority is nice, yeah, but steel is not a really good offensive type IMO. Fake out used to make for a decent anti-lead.
Running both of them would send you straight to This thread (too bad it's locked). Do I need to explain?
I'd rather run substitute>fake out/bullet punch anyway, it's bulk is pitiful, and it needs an anti-WoW.

 

[Anjunadeep]

Using Mega Medicham without High Jump Kick is like visiting Detroit and not getting shot, or going on a cruise and then drowning, and yet people still don't run it (it doesn't even break 70% usage on the ladder.) Drain Punch can extend its longevity (it's one-shot by a large variety of moves anyway but w/e,) but not running HJK detracts from its main job, which is nuking the loving shit out of everything and lobbing off as much as 75% from offensive pokemon trying to switch in. Without HJK, you're also checked by Wisp X-zard and Quagsire walls you.

I like my medicham to live more than five turns in a battle, so I'll take sub+Dpunch over HJK, checking BalkZard.
As for quagsire though...
252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Drain Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Quagsire: 163-193 (41.3 - 48.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
Over which I'd prefer-
252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham High Jump Kick vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Quagsire: 283-334 (71.8 - 84.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Which I understand and all, but-
252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Zen Headbutt vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Quagsire: 175-207 (44.4 - 52.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
Assuming you're running a substitute set, like I do, you could possibly 2HKO Quagsire anyway. Loss of the more reliable 2HKO is a bit sad, but with the fact that quagsire has to waste a turn breaking sub while subjecting itself to a possible 2HKO kind of makes up, doesn't it?
More so, if it's going to spam recover instead of trying to break sub (which is more likely), there's the chance of Zen headbutt flinch. I agree, that's incredibly unreliable, but it's going to take a lot of zen headbutts if it's going to stay in... I'd even go on to say that the medi-user would be unlucky if he didn't eventually get a flinch.
Yes, it's very iffy, but I don't think it would be stupid for sub+drain punch to be a viable set.

Yeah Ghosts can switch in, but you liquify Gengar with Psychic STAB (btw, Zen Headbutt is also non-negotiable, you need it for Mega Venusar and Clefable) and Aegislash switching in to Drain Punch isn't all that great either, cause it's getting a free turn. It's better to try to Fire Punch it on the switch or just double switch.

Which brings me to a question I've been meaning to ask everyone. Why do people run Psycho cut over Zen Headbutt? Is it the lack of contact?
Anti Rocky-Helmet Chomp/Ferro? (which are fairly rare anyway)
Anti KS aegi? (Which is impossible to see on offensive Aegislashes)
Or Anti Spiky-Shield Chesnaught?(lol)

 

[Hiddenfreezer]

Psycho Cut is my option over Headbutt because it has 100% acc, running it alongside with HJK, is like having a save move STAB option. Furthermore, now that you mention it, having no contact with it is actually pretty useful in some situations(Low Health Aegis trying to -2 you while you try to cut it, A situation in which Iron Barb/Rough Skin puts you in a KO Situation etc. These happen more often than people think)

Fake Out is also a good move. People doesn't seem to realize that a Talonflame which switched into rocks and revenged an other pokemon of yours is most likely in the 30% range of fake out. Fake Out is also a move which allows you to deal (22.8 - 27.3%) to it. This isn't much, I know, but it can safe you in the end.

Bullet Punch on the other hand...no. Sorry but I have no use for it in mind: Tflame and Pinsir are faster and using priority to destroy your life anyways, while Aegisslash is resistent to it and runs Ssneak and drops your attack unlike Fake Out.

My set for Medicham would be:
High Jump Kick
Psycho Cut
Fake Out (Zardex makes even better points than me about this move btw)
Ice Punch(Gliscor...)

Finally, treat Fake Out as Chip Damage people. I really liked the point Zardex made with Azumarill!

 

[Anjunadeep]

My set for Medicham would be:
High Jump Kick
Psycho Cut
Fake Out (Zardex makes even better points than me about this move btw)
Ice Punch(Gliscor...)

Decent but completely walled by aegislash and friends.