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Metagame Workshop

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Sorry I didn't word that well - I meant maybe have it summon the ability of your primary type by default and secondary type if you're shiny. That could also open up interesting choices - do you give Heatran an in built Focus Sash, or a massive power boost? And what about abilities that clash? Would Volcanion summon Rain or Sun?
 
Basically, if they summon both, it will be randomly determined if rain or sun is setup. Same for the terrains.

And Yah maybe you can replace it with Fire Blast, still gonna hurt a lot though. (forgot Eruption was event)
 
What Types Summon What?
Fire: Sunny Day
Water: Rain Dance
Grass: Grassy Terrain
Ice: Hail
Electric: Electric Terrain
Ground/Steel: Gain Effect of Sturdy
Rock: Sandstorm
Fairy: Misty Terrain
Psychic: Psychic Terrain
Bug: Gain Effect of Compound Eyes
Dark: Gain Effect of Dark Aura
Normal: Gain Effect of Air Lock (Disables All Weather)
Fighting: Gain Effect of Sheer Force
Ghost: Gain Effect of Cursed Body
Dragon: Gain Effect of Multiscale (Does Not Stack With Other Multiscales)
Poison: Gain Effect of Poison Point
Flying: Gain Effect of Aerilate

I think you have to assign better bonuses to worse typings and worse bonuses to better typings. Dragon is the highest BST typing and competitively most viable and it also got the best ability in multiscale. Bug is one of the worst typings and compoundeyes doesnt really salvage the typing when the only thing it does it increase reliability of already usable moves (volcarona is still gunna use fire blast, for example, compoundeyes is best with moves with 75% accuracy and higher which are already viable) . Compare that to gaining a 50% increase damage on STAB which some other mons get from terrains and weather which also trigger weather abilities for sweeping and tanking.
Poison point also is really weak ability on a very mediocre typing. Hail is bad too but i dont really see a solution for that one
 
What about Wonder Skin for Bug types? Halving the accuracy of stuff like Taunt and Toxic will be a huge buff for them.
 
Poison would like having something like Corrosion to make their perfectly accurate Toxic hit steel and other poison types, or Liquid Ooze maybe.

Bug could use Tinted Lens maybe?
 
Mega tyranitar dude. While it's not released yet, it will have 135 / 199 / 185 / 130 / 155 / 106 with a total BST of 910 WITH Sandstorm Spdef boost...
In pretty sure ttar would be banned very quickly.

Edit: forgot I typed this out days ago lol sry Why Nerdy
I want to resuggest this idea with a few changes since it got rejected last gen:

Status Quo

Metagame premise:
All attacking moves are banned! However, all status moves now have a base power, and use your higher base attacking stat to hit off. All moves are non-contact.
In addition all normal type moves are changed to your primary typing.
The criteria for base power is as follows:

  • Protect moves (protect, endure, etc), substitute, destiny bond are 0BP.
  • Priority moves, stat boosting moves (swords dance), self-healing moves are 50BP.
  • Moves that lower your opponents stats (screech), weather setting moves are 80BP.
  • All other moves are 100BP.



Potential bans and threats:

Bans:
-All attacking moves
-Taunt!
-Accuracy lowering status moves
-Nature Power and other "status" moves that would allow you 2 attacks (Bide, Assist, Me First, Metronome, Counter, Mirror Coat Metal Burst etc)
-Snatch and Magic Bounce/Mirror Coat- either these are allowed and dont steal/reflect anything, or banned bc otherwise they affect every move in the game
-Confusion-inflicting moves
-Infatuation moves
-Prankster should be banned unless the moves count as attacking moves and not status moves

-There is a status clause in place, which works the same as sleep clause but with all statuses. So when you use thunder wave the first time it will be a 100BP move that paralyzes your opponent (assuming not ground/electric type or with limber etc). If you then try and use thunder wave on another opponent, you will hit for 100BP, but it wont paralyze them as well. This is to prevent mass spreading of status and also limit haxing techniques.

An attack can still deal damage if the status element fails: for instance using thunder wave on an electric type will still be a 100BP electric move, it simply will fail the status part which will be a secondary effect to the 100BP attack. In that respect you can expect the secondary element to fail if the attack part is blocked or fails: eg. using electric terrain against a ground type will result in a fail because the damage aspect will fail. Using spikes against a flying type will fail. etc

If you use a Z-status move, it will remain the same BP and priority (? if this is how z-status moves work) as before, and adopt the new Z-move properties. Maintaining the same base power might be relevant if it turns into a boosting move through the Z-version.

-Probably Kyurem-B will be banned


Threats:

chandelure.gif

Chandelure @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
- Curse
- Will-O-Wisp
- Spite
- Haze

Ghost type Curse is a really powerful attack here since it hits off 100BP and then also deals 25% at the end of the turn, although it costs half your hp. Will-o-wisp is obviously really powerful, and Spite is a great consistent attack that cuts into your opponents pp. If they are relying on 8PP moves you can run them out of pp in 2 attacks! Haze is a good coverage move and destroys setup.

landorus-therian.gif

Landorus-Therian (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Swords Dance
- Rock Polish
- Confide

Double dance is a good strategy here because both moves double as attacks, giving you more momentum. Stealth Rock and Confide are your two main moves once you boost up, first being a strong and useful 100BP rock move and the second being your main 80BP ground type move.

tapulele.gif

Tapu Lele @ Light Clay
Ability: Psychic Surge
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Reflect
- Aromatic Mist
- Light Screen
- Sunny Day

The best sets in this meta are often ones that provide an immediate offensive threat while also setting up useful supportive team buffs. Thiis lele is a specs pivot that will hit like a truck while setting up screens for the team. Sunny Day is a great and widely accessible coverage move that hits for 80BP turn one and then boosts itself next turn.

omastar.gif

Omastar @ Life Orb
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Rain Dance
- Stealth Rock
- Spikes
- Haze

Omastar is a prime example of a rain abuser. Setting up its own rain turn one, it can then sweep and wallbreak at the same time with +2 speed and its LO + rain boosted rain dance for 80BP. It also boasts one of the nicest coverage combinations in the game with Stealth Rock + Spikes.


Questions for community:

What banworthy things can you see? While it might seem the meta is inherently super offensive there are a lot of defensive options also, such as reflect, charm, calm mind, etc. There are also 6 level of priority to play with.
Atm the main thing that I think could be broken is Block. And any set theorycrafting is welcome!

So wait does Sleep Talk attack then call a move? Also moves like metronome and Assist and others I'm too lazy to list. If so try this set.

Meloetta @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Calm Mind
- Snatch / Toxic / Thunder Wave

Dual STAB that helps you attack, set up that helps you attack, and coverage du jour. Snatch also hits twice. If Sleep Talk calls Snatch do you hit thrice?

Honestly I might ban moves that call other moves, or at least keep an eye on them. Or maybe set them to 0 bp. Moves that can call attack moves like Nature Power and Metronome (but not Assist cuz you won't have attacking moves on your team) should be banned for circumventing the point of the meta.

Overall cool sounding meta and the bp list seems the right mixture of following the logic pix the games and simplicity. 7.6/10 too much resttalk.

I'm withholding the Drampastamp of approval from the weather meta because I find metas based around arbitrarily assigning some trait to each type are pretty universally poorly balanced, difficult to learn because they're not intuitive, and not that fun once you learn them (TCG was the exception imo).

Edit @ below me: you're going to be given hell for making a meta with more hax, especially with the misses.
 
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Lucky-Or-Nothing

~Metagame Premise:
In this OM, secondary effects chance are doubled (it works pretty similar to Serene Grace) but all moves will have less accuracy (-15%).

~Potential Bans & Threats:
  • Potential Bans:
0. Pokémon: OU Banlist

1. Abilitys:
  • Serene Grace
  • No Guard
2. Items:
  • Wide Lens
  • Bright Powder
3. Moves:
  • Accuracy lowering status moves
  • Threats:
metagross-mega.gif

Metagross-Mega @ Metagrossite
Ability: Tough Claws
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Iron Head (60% Flinch) / Meteor Mash (40% Raise Atk +1)
- Thunder Punch / Ice Punch (20% Paralyze / Freeze)
- Zen Headbutt (40% Flinch)
- Agility (+2 Speed + Flinch Moves)

ninetales-alola.gif

Ninetales-Alola @ Choice Scarf / Choice Specs
Ability: Snow Warning
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Blizzard (Can't Miss in Hail + 20% Freeze)
- Moonblast (60% Lower SpA +1)
- Dark Pulse (40% Flinch)
- Hidden Power [Fire]

~Questions for the community:
1. ¿is OU enough or Ubers pokemon are necessary to bear this metagame?
2. ¿Z Moves should be banned?
 
In pretty sure ttar would be banned very quickly.

Edit: forgot I typed this out days ago lol sry Why Nerdy


So wait does Sleep Talk attack then call a move? Also moves like metronome and Assist and others I'm too lazy to list. If so try this set.

Meloetta @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Calm Mind
- Snatch / Toxic / Thunder Wave

Dual STAB that helps you attack, set up that helps you attack, and coverage du jour. Snatch also hits twice. If Sleep Talk calls Snatch do you hit thrice?

Honestly I might ban moves that call other moves, or at least keep an eye on them. Or maybe set them to 0 bp. Moves that can call attack moves like Nature Power and Metronome (but not Assist cuz you won't have attacking moves on your team) should be banned for circumventing the point of the meta.

Overall cool sounding meta and the bp list seems the right mixture of following the logic pix the games and simplicity. 7.6/10 too much resttalk.

I'm withholding the Drampastamp of approval from the weather meta because I find metas based around arbitrarily assigning some trait to each type are pretty universally poorly balanced, difficult to learn because they're not intuitive, and not that fun once you learn them (TCG was the exception imo).

Edit @ below me: you're going to be given hell for making a meta with more hax, especially with the misses.
"Nature Power and other "status" moves that would allow you 2 attacks (Bide, Assist, Me First, Metronome, Counter, Mirror Coat Metal Burst etc) are banned"
"Snatch is banned"

Now some sets that are probably not as good as I think:


Galvantula @ ???
Ability: Compound Eyes
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Spider Web
- Thunder Wave
- Disable
- Gastro Acid / Flash

So here we have a Tarantula that doesn't let you escape, then paralizes you and spits acid on you. Get your arachnophobia for free.

Xurkitree @ Life Orb
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Charge
- Tail Glow
- Electric Terrain
- Rain Dance / Ingrain

Self-Explained?


Salazzle (F) @ Black Sludge
Ability: Corrosion
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Toxic
- Will-O-Wisp
- Torment
- Venom Drench

Since Trick and Switcheroo are probably going to be much more common, Black Sludge is gonne be better. Venom Drench is a very good move, specially since Toxic can poison most things now.



Crobat @ Black Sludge
Ability: Infiltrator
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Defog
- Toxic
- Venom Drench
- Roost

Idk
 
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As everybody knows i love proposing metagames, so here another new idea:

Freeze-Dry Mania

Metagame Premise:
The move in the 1st slot becomes super effective against the type of the move in the last slot, but not very effective against the move in the 2nd slot, keeps its normal effectivess against the other types.

Potential Banlist: OU Banlist

How the metagame works: Basically if i take a Landorus-Therian with this moveset: Earthquake, U turn, Knock Off, Fly, Earthquake is gonna be super effective against Flying but not very effective against Bug. Ground being already not super effective against Bug, the trade off has limited consequences for Landorus as it now gains perfect coverage with STABs alone but it has to run Z fly.

Potential threats: Any offensive Pokemon would benefit from getting additional coverage on their STAB attacks, while limiting the impact of the new resistance by choosing a move with a typing that already takes little from it, like the example of the Landorus just above.

Questions for the community: Would a Pokemon stand above the others as it should be looked as such? Landorus Therian sure gets very good coverage but being obliged to run Fly limits its versatility somehow.

I wait for any feedback!
 
As everybody knows i love proposing metagames, so here another new idea:

Freeze-Dry Mania

Metagame Premise:
The move in the 1st slot becomes super effective against the type of the move in the last slot, but not very effective against the move in the 2nd slot, keeps its normal effectivess against the other types.

Potential Banlist: OU Banlist

How the metagame works: Basically if i take a Landorus-Therian with this moveset: Earthquake, U turn, Knock Off, Fly, Earthquake is gonna be super effective against Flying but not very effective against Bug. Ground being already not super effective against Bug, the trade off has limited consequences for Landorus as it now gains perfect coverage with STABs alone but it has to run Z fly.

Potential threats: Any offensive Pokemon would benefit from getting additional coverage on their STAB attacks, while limiting the impact of the new resistance by choosing a move with a typing that already takes little from it, like the example of the Landorus just above.

Questions for the community: Would a Pokemon stand above the others as it should be looked as such? Landorus Therian sure gets very good coverage but being obliged to run Fly limits its versatility somehow.

I wait for any feedback!
The only change I would suggest is to make the resistance part stack with normal resistances. For example, your Lando-T using EQ would be quad resisted by Bug types. I think that will make the metagame more balanced, and changes how people might build their movesets to cater certain types.
 
Sorry for double posting, but this is a suggestion for Status Quo, and I don't think it would fit in my previous post.

I think AV + Trick / Switcheroo + Klutz should be banned, as it is an easy way to disable anything for the rest of the match. This combination is only legal on Swoobatt and Lopunny, but I think it would be a bad idea to let it stick around.
 
It doesn't quite disable "anything", as you can always bring in your mega/Z-crystal holder to make those moves fail. For Swoobat in particular, since it will be using Trick, any Dark type is also immune to the move, and if you can preempt it with a faster Worry Seed/Entrainment or similar, suddenly the Klutz user finds itself with a completely worthless moveset. It's a gimmick the opponent will easily be able to see coming, like I pointed out from detailing the Lopunny set, and it's cause to have coverage moves rather than blindly clicking Trick at the first possible chance.
 
either way it would still be a very broken effect so like i said before i would be fine just removing assault vest from the meta since klutz can still be of use, trick is a valuable attack in the metagame and something like swoobat might want to use trick orbs for instance on an offensive set.
 
The only change I would suggest is to make the resistance part stack with normal resistances. For example, your Lando-T using EQ would be quad resisted by Bug types. I think that will make the metagame more balanced, and changes how people might build their movesets to cater certain types.

Yeah i thought about that too, and definitely is a good idea, so now yah, the new resistance stack with normal resistances (in the case of Landorus, Bug types now quadruple resists to its Earthquake). Thanks for the feedback :)
 
Sorry for double posting, but this is a suggestion for Status Quo, and I don't think it would fit in my previous post.

I think AV + Trick / Switcheroo + Klutz should be banned, as it is an easy way to disable anything for the rest of the match. This combination is only legal on Swoobatt and Lopunny, but I think it would be a bad idea to let it stick around.
either way it would still be a very broken effect so like i said before i would be fine just removing assault vest from the meta since klutz can still be of use, trick is a valuable attack in the metagame and something like swoobat might want to use trick orbs for instance on an offensive set.
I think you're overselling it. Firstly, neither mon has much of a niche outside Klutz AV, so the set is immediately obvious from Team Preview. Second, Switcheroo/Trick can be blocked by Mega Stones and Z-Crystals (Trick is also blocked by Darks)*. Finally, even if they succeed, they only disable 1 mon at a time, at the cost of then having a subpar mon on your team - let's be honest, nonmega Lopunny fucking sucks and so does Swoobat. It's not too hard to find a switchin, the best one o could think of is Sableye:

cteamed (Sableye) @ [insert Crystal here]
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Impish Nature
- Will-O-Wisp
- Spite
- Recover
- Calm Mind

outplayed imo (Sableye) @ Normalium-Z / Darkinium-Z
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Impish Nature
- Mean Look
- Flatter
- Toxic
- Recover

Ghost/Dark typing with a crystal blocks Trick, Switcheroo, BP (by virtue of being immune), CM, etc, so you don't even give up momentum. The only move you fear is Charm, but neither mon is very strong. Spiritomb can run a somewhat similar set with more bulk but lacking good recovery. It's almost a shame Sablenite is banned because of Magic Bounce. Almost.

*edit @ below:
Only if its Prankster Trick.
Since stat boosts are being treated as happening after damage (according to the meta creator), I'm assuming all effects are treated the same (ie wisp damages then burns, trick damages then switches item). Therefore if the opposing mon is immune to the damage, it should be immune to the after-effect.
 
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I feel like bug should get tinted lens. It's the main reason why something like Venomoth is even viable in the first place, the ability to forego coverage and use whatever status moves you want in your other slots is huge.
It also enables Tinted Lens MHera.
Stall? What's that? what do you mean Heracronite is unreleased

On a more serious note, this meta sounds like more of a Pet Mod to me, as many of the choices are somewhat arbitrary. Ground, Steel, Bug, Fighting, Ground, Ghost, Dragon, and Flying don't really fit with the others (yes Flying makes sense but then why isn't Ice Refrigerate, Fairy Pixilate, or Electric Galvanize?), and arguably Fairy should be Fairy Aura. The others seems fairly standard but I could argue that Fire should be Flash Fire or even Desoland, Water should be Water Bubble (lol imagine Sheer Force Water Bubble Keldeo), etc. It's a cool concept but I don't see how you would address this satisfactorily :L
 
I know that this OM will be Pet Mod material, but I wanted to see if it would work or if I should think about a better Pet Mod.

Metagame name:
Endless Ascensions (aka Uber Theorymonnings)

Metagame premise
: Basically, making as many Pokémon that are ranked in B-/C+ or below and anything not ranked in Uber (most OU Pokémon and below tiered Pokémon) more viable in Uber as possible. A slate-based Pet Mod, this will progressively fill what's missing in Ubers. Pokémon who got a Mega Evolution ranked in Uber as ranked B or higher will not have its base form buffed to avoid complication.

Potential bans and threats: Uber banlist. Which threats would be is all depended on the outcome once its released on a server other than main, like most other slate-based Pet Mods. We will ensure that the likes of Palkia (if B- are allowed) and Aegislash will not get too out-of-offhandedly overpowered.

Questions for the community:
  • Should we be more restrictive on buffing Pokémon that are already ranked in Ubers, especially those at BST 680-700? I do think so, but your opinions will also help.
  • Since I said "progressively fill what's missing in Ubers", would adding/changing the Pokémon's secondary type (not primary type) and give almost any better Ability à la Almost Any Ability availability (which means no Huge/Pure Power), or should we stick with the flavor?
  • How many Pokémon can we put per slate? I can do sometimes 4 unranked Pokémon, or other times 3 unranked and 1 B-/C+ and below Pokémon.
 
TCG Types
I know this has been done before but that mod is dead is and this my own take on it.
Type Changes:
Grass: Bug, Grass
Water: Ice, Water
Fighting: Fighting, Ground, Rock
Psychic: Ghost, Poison, Psychic
Normal: Normal, Flying
Type Chart:
Grass: Weak to- Fire, Normal Resist- Grass, Water
Water:Weak to-Grass, Electric, Fighting Resist- Water, Fire
Fire:Weak to-Water, Fighting Resist- Fire, Grass, Fairy
Electric:Weak to-Fighting Resist-Steel
Psychic:Weak to-Psychic, Dark Resist-Fighting, Steel
Fighting: Weak to- Psychic, Grass, Water Resist-Electric
Normal: Weak to- Fighting, Electric Resist-Psychic, Grass
Dark:Weak to- Fighting, Fairy Resist- Psychic
Steel:Weak to-Fire, Fighting Resist- Normal, Fairy
Dragon: Weak to- Fairy, Dragon,Water Resist- Fire, Electric, Grass
Fairy: Weak to- Steel, Psychic Resist- Dragon, Dark
 
Because trick is psychic type dark types are immune in this meta.

Edit: I don't think dark typing normally blocks prankster trick anyway, but I could be wrong.


Right, its getting hard to keep up with who's talking about what meta and what all the rules are, even with the quotes. I feel like I need to reread every proposal to fully understand any given comment.
 
Speny said:
TCG Types
I know this has been done before but that mod is dead is and this my own take on it.
Type Changes:
Grass: Bug, Grass
Water: Ice, Water
Fighting: Fighting, Ground, Rock
Psychic: Ghost, Poison, Psychic
Normal: Normal, Flying
Type Chart:
Grass: Weak to- Fire, Normal Resist- Grass, Water
Water:Weak to-Grass, Electric, Fighting Resist- Water, Fire
Fire:Weak to-Water, Fighting Resist- Fire, Grass, Fairy
Electric:Weak to-Fighting Resist-Steel
Psychic:Weak to-Psychic, Dark Resist-Fighting, Steel
Fighting: Weak to- Psychic, Grass, Water Resist-Electric
Normal: Weak to- Fighting, Electric Resist-Psychic, Grass
Dark:Weak to- Fighting, Fairy Resist- Psychic
Steel:Weak to-Fire, Fighting Resist- Normal, Fairy
Dragon: Weak to- Fairy, Dragon,Water Resist- Fire, Electric, Grass
Fairy: Weak to- Steel, Psychic Resist- Dragon, Dark

Could you possibly detail some threats or mons that get weakened in this meta? To be honest this idea just seem hella flawed at its core because now any strong mon just easily gets neutral coverage on the entire meta game. In addition, dropping types from the chart has a lot of implications you don't seem to be accounting for. What happens to abilities like Gale Wings or Aerilate? Is Lando-T Fighting/Normal, and is Nihilego Fighting/Psychic? Do dual types exist at all in a TCG typing base meta? IMO these are all things you'd need to address
 
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I want to make a meta were Pokemon like Ledian, Sunflora, Farfetch'd, Kricketune, Wigglytuff, and Delcatty are good that is not too gimmicky.
 
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