RU National Dex RU Metagame Discussion

[Gangsta Spongebob]

[No art yet]


Welcome to National Dex Rarelyused! Here you may discuss all things Nat Dex RU, from thoughts on the Meta to theorymonning! Every Pokemon under the 4.52% cutoff in the National Dex Underused that is not banned to RUBL is allowed in the tier.

What people considered to be unthinkable, for even those that regularly played this tier has actually happened, a new generation bringing forth a huge amount of mons with many of the OU and UU staples stepping into the tier, it's going to be one hell of a ride. Join us in our Discord Server and be ready!


Council:
Velcroc
Runo (Tier Leader)
DerpyBoi
Kinzo
Adriyun
seth

VR Council:
Rafadude
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Posting Rules

1. Stay on topic; make sure whatever you post has some relation to the Nat Dex RU Metagame.
2. Avoid responding solely with jokes or one-liners; make sure to have some substance in your posts. Jokes and one-liners are fine in a post; just make sure you add something to the discussion as well.
3. Simple questions, such as "How good is Mega Houndoom?" are allowed, but we highly recommend looking at our resources and asking the Discord before asking them here (But since this is the opening, I will allow it for a bit, just more controlled)
4. Absolutely no shittalking or toxicity, posts attacking anyone will be deleted and possibly met with an infraction.

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National Dex RU Banlist

Nat Dex RUBL

Note that many of these Pokemon may have risen to higher tiers since their ban

Pokemon

• Aerodactyl-Mega
• Alakazam
• Altaria-Mega
• Bisharp
• Blacephalon
• Buzzwole
• Conkeldurr
• Dondozo
• Enamorus
• Gallade-Mega
• Gardevoir-Mega
• Gengar
• Gyarados
• Hawlucha
• Haxorus
• Heracross-Mega
• Iron Hands
• Iron Leaves
• Jirachi
• Keldeo
• Keldeo-Resolute
• Kyurem
• Latias-Mega
• Latios
• Latios-Mega
• Lilligant-Hisui
• Mamoswine
• Manaphy
• Mew
• Mienshao
• Moltres-Galar
• Pecharunt
• Porygon-Z
• Quaquaval
• Salamence
• Sableye-Mega
• Scolipede
• Terrakion
• Victini
• Xurkitree
• Zapdos-Galar
• Zoroark-Hisui

Items:

• Light Clay

Abilities:

• Drizzle

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Viability Rankings- https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/national-dex-ru-metagame-discussion.3713801/post-9455247

Tiering History

1/1/23 - Initial Usage Banlist:


4/1/23 - Espathra and Mawile-Mega have been quickbanned from UU, thus affecting RU

1/2/23 - National Dex RU Leaves Alpha Stage

Tier Shifts

Raises:
From RU to OU
From RU to OU
From RU to UU
From RU to UU
From RU to UU
From RU to UU
From RU to UU
From RU to UU
From RU to UU
From RU to UU
From RU to UU
From RU to UU
From RU to UU
From RU to UU
From RU to UU

Drops:
From UU to RU
From UU to RU
From UU to RU
From UU to RU
From UU to RU
From UU to RU

9/2/23 - () Drizzle, Manaphy, Polteageist and Xurkitree have been banned from National Dex RU

28/2/23 - Dondozo, Iron Hands, Kyurem, Gardevoir-Mega and Victini have been banned from National Dex RU

1/3/23 - National Dex RU Leaves Beta Stage

Tier Shifts

Raises:
From RU to UU
From RU to UU
From RU to UU
From RU to UU

Drops:
From UU to RU
From UU to RU
From UU to RU
From UU to RU
From UU to RU
From UU to RU
From UU to RU
From UU to RU

11/3/23 - Jirachi, Gallade-Mega, Gyarados, Latios, Latios-Mega, Salamence, Porygon-Z and Light Clay have been banned from National Dex RU

1/4/23 -

Tier Shifts

Raises:
From RU to UU
From RU to UU
From RU to UU

Drops:
From UU to RU
From UU to RU
From UU to RU

3/4/23 - Hawlucha, Mew, Moltres-Galar, Latias, Latias-Mega, Zapdos-Galar and Heat Rock have been banned from National Dex RU

1/5/23 -

Tier Shifts

Raises:
From NDRUBL to NDUU
From NDRUBL to NDUU
From NDRUBL to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU

Drops:
From NDUU to NDRUBL
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU

7/5/23 - Alakazam, Gengar, Heracross-Mega, Keldeo and Terrakion have been banned from Nat Dex RU

1/6/23 -

Tier Shifts

Raises:
From NDRUBL to NDUU
From NDRUBL to NDUU

Drops:
From NDUU to NDRU

17/6/23 -
Mega Aerodactyl, Bisharp, Deoxys-Defense, and Iron Leaves have been banned from Nat Dex RU

1/7/23 -

Tier Shifts

Raises:
From NDRUBL to NDUU
From NDRUBL to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU

Drops:
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU

11/7/23 - ()
Drought has been quickbanned from Nat Dex UU, thus affecting RU

31/7/23 - /
Mega Altaria and Cresselia have been banned from Nat Dex RU, while Heat Rock has been unbanned.

1/8/23 -

Tier Shifts

Raises:
From NDRUBL to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU

Drops:
From NDUU to NDRUBL
From NDUU to NDRUBL
From NDUU to NDRUBL
From NDUU to NDRUBL
From NDUU to NDRUBL
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU

22/8/23 -
Enamorus Therian and Hisuian Lilligant have been banned from Nat Dex RU!

24/8/23 - Terastalization has been banned from Nat Dex UU, effecting RU!

1/9/23 -

Tier Shifts

Raises:
From NDRUBL to NDUU
From NDRUBL to NDUU
From NDRUBL to NDUU
From NDRUBL to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU

Drops:
From NDUU to NDRUBL
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU

1/10/23 -

Tier Shifts

Raises:
From NDRU to NDOU
From NDRUBL to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU

Drops:
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU

1/11/23 -

Tier Shifts

Raises:
From NDRUBL to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU

Drops:
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU

2/11/23 - /
Mega Sableye and Hisuian Zoroark have been banned from Nat Dex RU, while Cresselia, Enamorus-Therian, Latias, and Polteageist have been unbanned!

1/12/23 -

Tier Shifts

Raises:
From NDRUBL to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU

Drops:
From NDUU to NDRUBL
From NDUU to NDRUBL
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU

10/12/23 -
Mamoswine has been banned from Nat Dex RU!

1/1/24 -

Tier Shifts

Raises:
From NDRUBL to NDUU
From NDRUBL to NDUU
From NDRUBL to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU

Drops:
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU

7/1/24 -
Buzzwole and Blacephalon have been banned from Nat Dex RU!

31/1/24 -
Quaquaval has been banned from Nat Dex RU!

1/2/24 -

Tier Shifts

Raises:
From NDRUBL to NDUU
From NDRUBL to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU

Drops:
None

1/3/24 -

Tier Shifts

Raises:
From NDRUBL to NDUU
From NDRUBL to NDUU
From NDRUBL to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU

Drops:
From NDUU to NDRUBL
From NDUU to NDRUBL
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU

1/4/24 - 3 month Tier Shifts are in effect now.

Tier Shifts

Raises:
From NDRU to NDUU
From NDRU to NDUU

Drops:
From NDUU to NDRUBL
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU
From NDUU to NDRU

27/4/24 -
Enamorus has been banned from NatDex RU!

1/6/24 -
Mega Swampert quickdrops from NDUU to NDRU

22/6/24 -
Pecharunt has been banned from National Dex RU!

 

[Runo]

Nightmare Blunt Rotation



None of these mons are healthy, none of these mons are holy, and I'm sure as hell that none of these mons should be down here. Some of these mons are sleeper threats, some of these threats are already fucking wide-awake. Hell, there are mons here that aren't even on this list that are super fucking broken. What the fuck was NDUU ladder smoking to drop Mawile-Mega, Kommo-o, Weavile, Blaziken, Rillaboom, etc to RU, BUT KEEP SWELLOW OF ALL MONS IN UU!?!? This tier is going to be a wild one for the first month and I don't even know if I'm gonna enjoy the ride.

Good luck and enjoy Hell everyone!

 

[bogglywoods]

Nightmare Blunt Rotation



None of these mons are healthy, none of these mons are holy, and I'm sure as hell that none of these mons should be down here. Some of these mons are sleeper threats, some of these threats are already fucking wide-awake. Hell, there are mons here that aren't even on this list that are super fucking broken. What the fuck was NDUU ladder smoking to drop Mawile-Mega, Kommo-o, Weavile, Blaziken, Rillaboom, etc to RU, BUT KEEP SWELLOW OF ALL MONS IN UU!?!? This tier is going to be a wild one for the first month and I don't even know if I'm gonna enjoy the ride.

Good luck and enjoy Hell everyone!

"Man, the first month of NatDex UU wasn't very fun" we all said, before the usage statistics turned RU into whatever the hell this is.

 

[Peum]

My reaction to this information

Banned from OU

Kyurem @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Pressure
Tera Type: Ice
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Freeze-Dry
- Roost
- Earth Power
- Dragon Dance

Explanation

Kyurem was banned from OU last gen, and for good reason! This guy being in Natdex RU is just stupid, with most of its counters being gone, this guy is a threat with a Freeze Dry + Earth Power combination which cant be resisted and hurts badly most of the tier. The ability to boost its speed makes this guy one of the best late game sweepers in the tier, being capable of enduring any hit and doing big damage with its combination of moves.

We may have been saved from Greninja's tongue, but we still have 30 mons to go to make this tier healthy, at this point Zamazenta could drop and no one would be surprised, so much power creep.

Thanks Natdex OU

Regidrago @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Dragon's Maw
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dragon Energy
- Dragon Pulse
- Tera Blast
- Earth Power

Explanation

With Tera not being banned in Natdex OU for some reason, this little Jaw is full of steroids in form of terastelization, with the addition of a good steel move and earth power to hit grounds, being able to click Dragon Energy or Dragon Pulse is easy and effortless.

In these moments, I ask myself, didnt Natdex OU expect this? They have a whole tera ice Regieleki going on in their tier and yet still decided to not ban terastelization? This is dumb.

 

[Gangsta Spongebob]

| 91 | Donphan | 1.82222% | 1466 | 1.733% | 1232 | 1.897% |

While we've got mountains of insanity, can we all just take a moment to appreciate this historic occurrence?

On other news, enjoy playing our totally fair and balanced tier. Expect to see many bans when we leave Alpha.

 

[ShaunShen]

Swellow is in NDUU while ESPATHRA AND KYUREM are in this tier. This boutta be a repeat of NDUU Alpha. I will say it wont be as powerful as Alpha NDUU, but it will be very strong. I am looking forward to trying out a few Pokemon in this tier. Im at class rn so I'll probably edit this comment, but I do wanna try out Mega Hera and Mega Gardevoir to see how good they are here.

 

[Furret4ssb]

with all of the tier drops i think its getting pretty confusing so im going to make a list of mons that dropped from last gen, hopefully i dont miss any lol:

OU

kommo o
kyurem
mega mawile
rillaboom
serperior
slowbro
victini
weavile

UUBL

mega aerodactyl
alakazam
blacephalon
blaziken
mega gallade
mega gardevoir
gengar
hawlucha
mega heracross
hoopa unbound
jirachi
latias
mega latias
latios
mega latios
mew
galarian moltres
porygon z
mega sableye
mega slowbro
thundurus
thundurus therian
galarian zapdos

UU

mega altaria
amoonguss
the bee
breloom
chandelure
the don
hippowdon
hydreigon
infernape
krookodile
mamoswine
mandibuzz
mienshao
moltres
nidoking
nihilego
mega pidgeot
rotom heat
salamence
scizor
slowking
swampert
zeraora

RUBL

mega absol
mega aggron
azumarill
bisharp
conkeldurr
deoxys-d
diggersby
dracozolt
durant
haxorus
heracross
keldeo
lycanroc-d
necrozma
polteageist
primarina
reuniclus
scolipede
mega sharpedo
slowbro-galar
staraptor
tapu bulu
terrakion
tornadus
venomoth

and also the mons that have left us

Leaving RU

cresselia
ditto
gastrodon
swellow (why)
porygon2

in all this leaves us with 79 new mons, and also the gen 9 mons including garg, dondozo, espathra, and orthworm.
Im looking forward to the new meta, hopefully people will want to play this even though this is disgusting LOL, if you ever want matches or teams just ping me.

 

[TH1N3 H4MM3R]

well damn doesn't this look like a perfectly healthy and balanced tier? absolutely nothing looks comically out of place! :O

 

[georgebowserjr]

aw nah weavile down here is shivering my timbers, at least we got the goat mega areoplane. However, it is sad to see the gastro leave and the P2, fortunately MAGG is freed so thats 1 ticked off the free list.

 

[TH1N3 H4MM3R]

honestly? the latis, mega mawile, former ubers kyurem and blaziken, and weavile are complete shit. down to nu you go, your times have passed.
however, i'm glad that swellow and porygon2 aren't around to ruin what is otherwise the epitome of stability and fairness. was pissed when the former swept my OU teams w/ boomburst (my pb in the NU ladder was 1100 elo but with a 100% win rate, so i must be good!) and the latter statusing and recovering off any damage i dealt to it.

can't wait to see how the meta shakes out, and whether or not people can find uses for the aforementioned, but it looks like it'll be a tough endeavor.

 

[Your Hopes and Dreams]

Espathra and Mega Mawile were just quickbanned from NatDex UU, so naturally they're banned from RU as well. Two less demons to have to worry about.

 

[JyGein]

this tier looks fucked up rn, can't wait for natdex zu!

 

[blooclipse]

can yall just qb everything so the tier becomes actually playable ty

 

[Gangsta Spongebob]

can yall just qb everything so the tier becomes actually playable ty

We cannot at the moment we're in Alpha

 

[KrookKing]

I'm sorry for you guys, losing Swellow was the biggest loss for me. ;(

 

[Runo]

It's getting closer to the end of the month and I'm a bit bored lately, so let's put all my time and energy into my third most favorite tier by making a VR Tierlist. The mon list should cover every viable mon but there's also 40+ shitmons thrown in there since they're sorta viable ig? But realistically you'd rarely use them unless it's really specific or you're memeing. Have fun with it :)

The Tiermaker

Ok here's mine to start off. Idt there's any awful takes, but I'm not super sold on Mega Slowbro or Volcanion so that's why they're B for now. I've also heard talk of Iron Hands being really good but someone might have to explain this to me. It's fine but not a top threat in my opinion. Every mon in S - A+ tiers are broken in some form. Hydrei to S tier might be a stretch but I stand by it. Mon is super broken.

 

[TH1N3 H4MM3R]

Mlatios in B-?! down to NU with you!!!

 

[Velcroc]

National Dex RU is about as chaotic as one can expect with all the drops from UU. However, I anticipate the metagame to get even more chaotic with shifts from UU and incoming bans. I haven't played too many games of National Dex RU compared to OU and UU (where I had >100 games by the end of the first month), but I have played enough to gain an overview of the metagame.

National Dex RU is National Dex UU++. The beats are the same, but a few notes are changed. National Dex UU lacks the uber walls of Clefable, Ting-Lu and Gliscor nor do we have the pink blobs Chansey and Blissey who made a debut in SV RU. However, we do have alternatives such as Mega Aggron, Mega Steelix (a slightly better Lati check), Mega Altaria, Dondozo, Garganacl, Iron Hands, Slowbro, Slowking and Mandibuzz. Nonetheless, a lot of things have more reliable answers in the tiers above (such as Latis having TTar in UU) and building RU is a tightrope at the moment.

I'll give a brief rundown of the significant playstyles - not in order since all 4 are pretty close:
1) Hyper Offense

This might just be me but I haven't had the drive to build hyper offence. I have Mew and Azelf sitting in my builder doing nothing and I have had inconsistent results with the aurora veil teams I have made. I will say that hyper offence is viable with better suicide leads than the last gen (like Mew, Azelf and Scolipede), and an abundance of scary threats that appreciate the support like Z-Victini. But right now, I prefer bulkier teams. A nice segway into...

2) Bulky Offense

Most confident building with this archetype. Defensive Steels are non-negotiable. Outside of having a scarf Lati@s or Scizor, HO can't fit reliable checks to dragons. Bulky Offense can. Likewise, priority and opposing Weather are the best bets for HO against rain. Bulky Offence can fit more reliable checks like Amoonguss, Quag/Seis/Volcanion, Mega Slowbro etc. With the combination of offensive and defensive tools available, Bulky Offence seems to stand out. Not to mention, insane threats such as Regidrago, Hydreigon and non-scarf Latios all appreciate the support from a sturdy backbone.

3) Balance
In NDUU, Balance was very hard to justify. However, RU has a better time with it since things like Hippowdon, Mega Latias, Mega Altaria, and the 3 amigos ( ) are all a lot easier to slot in this tier. It also helps that something like Hydreigon and Lati@s provide nice one-off defensive utilities.

4) Stall
Suprisingly, Stall is pretty scary to face. Bar Clefable and the Steel/Flyings, we have an all-star cast here, with particular emphasis on Garganacl and Dondozo. Aside from the big two, a lot more tools have been that give stall a buff. In fact, of all the archetypes here, Stall has the easiest time fitting dragon checks (able to slot spdef raichi easier than balance or Offense with spare change for a fairy), ghost/psychic checks (e.g. Umbreon and Mandibuzz) and rain checks (pretty much all of the defensive ones).

Other playstyles

Other Playstyles

DragMagneton
Seems redundant since a lot of the dragon types here already break through steel types relatively easily. It also misses Magnezone very dearly since it can manage the steels here better and has the bulk to pivot in and out.

Trick Room
Losing its best setters and a significant pool of offensive mons to abuse it, making it marginally worse compared to OU and UU. However, it still has access to Stakataka which can snowball pretty easily.

Psychic Spam
Seems potent but you need to keep an eye out in the builder since these teams stack multiple weaknesses to Hydreigon and Weavile.

Ghost Spam
Pretty much Blacephalon + Polteageist or Gengar + Polteageist since most teams are packing good measure checks to ghosts and psychics. That's the main combination that beats ghost-type checks.

Weather varies quite a bit.
Rain
Clear best. Expect prep for it with 1-2 checks on every single team.

Sun
Significantly less prep but you have access to impeccable breakers such as Victini, Mega Houndoom and Blaziken. You also have access to Protosynthesis mons such as Sandy Shocks and the nice Slither Wing. Chlorophyll users are lacking outside of Shiftry, Scovillain and Victreebel.

Sand
Could utilise an offensive variant with Dracozolt to go brr. But I prefer more balanced builds since Dracozolt teams have to manoeuvre around all sorts of threats like Rillaboom and Rain. However, with a more balanced or Bulky Offensive build you have the luxury of an extra team slot for something like Mandibuzz or Mega Latias, Garganacl or even something like CB Terrak.

Hail
Seems the weakest disregarding Veil. Cetitan seems fishy and arctozolt's speed tier is nowhere near as significant as it was last gen (pretty much any reasonable scarfer beats it). Instead, I think the way to good is to exploit the defensive capability of the 1.5x boost with threats such as Kyurem, Baxcalibur, Cloyster, Mamoswine and the odd weavile. I have also been considering flat-out balance since Mega Abomasnow has the potential to live crazy hits like Choice Banded Close Combat from Terrakion.

252 Atk Choice Band Terrakion Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Abomasnow-Mega in Snow: 272-324 (70.8 - 84.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Dynamics
When building in National Dex RU you have to keep a few major things in mind. It can be easy to get lost in this metagame but dividing the metagame into nice bite-sized chunks is a way to help make sense of all the chaos that is unfolding. What I mean by "dynamics" are the common interactions you are likely to see in this tier. For instance, Dark types are solid offensive checks to psychics and you'll see a lot of dark types pivoting into psychics and psychics types adapting to it. Likewise, Pursuit on something like Aerodactyl-Mega picks off frail/weakened ghosts and psychics.

Right now, National Dex RU has 4 main interactions you need to be aware of: Ghosts/Psychics, Dragons, Rain and Darks - and their respective checks and counters. I'll explore this by looking at the main offensive threats in the metagame right now.

Psychics and Ghosts
()



Take a good look at that list again. Every single one of these pokemon has been banned from National Dex RU in the last generation. A good majority weren't allowed in RU because they were banned in UU. And here we are one generation later. Thanks to Terastalisation, a lot of these Pokemon can overwhelm their supposed checks. Tera Fighting Poltergeists overpower Dark and Normal types. Tera Fire Blacephalon can punch through even the mighty Assault Vest Muk-Alola. The strong Psychic and Ghost types we have right now are a big reason for the broken-check-broken dynamic we have in the current metagame. Jirachi, for example, checks many psychic types but runs a scary Normalium-Z set. Weavile is another prominent check that itself is too much for the tier to contain.

In a broken-check-broken metagame, offence is the best defence. Super effective sucker punches and first impressions, strong neutral priority like Scizor's Bullet Punch and Rillaboom's Grassy Glide. However, Indeedee cancels this and is a common polteageist and psychic spam associate. Faster pokemon like Weavile and Mega Aerodactyl can outspeed and win the 1v1. However, a certain few are faster thanks to speed boosting (Blacephalon and Polteageist) and screens may disrupt this strategy. Fast pursuit trappers might also get stuffed by colbur berry but not a lot of Pokemon can afford to run it right now.

Defensively, you've got bulky dark types and steels for a few key psychic types. We have no splashable normal-type special wall like Blissey, Chansey or even Porygon-2 outside of bar Mega Audino and Snorlax. Jirachi is perhaps the least exploitable of all steel types with Tinkaton being a close second. Incidentally, Tinkaton might struggle with a few calcs since it is also the resident Band Weavile answer. The rest are either exploitable or one-time switch-ins. We have a handful of bulky dark types with the best of the bunch being Mandibuzz and Muk-Alola. The issue with the other bulky dark types is their specificity. Incineroar and Umbreon are niche, Guzzlord and Wo-Chien even more so.

Checks and Counters

Bulky Steels:
| (if sciz rises)
Bulky Dark Types:

Revenge Killers:

Pursuit: |

Priority:
:
Exploit: (with tera, applies for many things)

Rain
/ |
Listed the main abusers here. However, rain can slot any offensive water type (swift swimmer or not) and anything that spams thunder and hurricane. Even rain dish Tentacruel and the dry skin mons Heliolisk and Toxicroak appreciate it. But rn, the main star of Rain is Floatzel and to a lesser extent Barraskewda.

Floatzel might tip the scales for rain since a handful of Pokemon can even afford to switch in. If just Floatzel were to be banned, Barraskewda could take the top spot. Even Kingdra and Seismitoad can potentially escalate. Had terastalisation been banned, perhaps rain would have been manageable. For now, here are two calcs to chew on:

252+ Atk Choice Band Tera Water Floatzel Wave Crash vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro in Rain: 188-222 (47.7 - 56.3%) -- 85.9% chance to 2HKO

252+ Atk Choice Band Tera Water Floatzel Wave Crash vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Avalugg: 170-202 (43.1 - 51.2%) -- 4.7% chance to 2HKO

Checks and Counters

Keep in mind that these "rain" checks are just for floatzel. Kingdra and Seismitoad are a whole different ballpark and Barraskewda can 1v1 some of these.

Water immunes including: and if you're adventurous ( etc.)

Tanks: (XCOM odds outside hail)

Aside from that, a hail-mary weather change, priority status (paralysis or burn) or are your best bets. In a pinch, a sturdy resist will do. But keep in mind, even the 105/105 Zarude can be OHKO'd with rocks.

Dragons
|

Quite a few of these got to go. Even without Tera, I doubt we'll have a healthy metagame centred around a lot of these. Haxorus isn't even on this list (Thanks Runo) and I'd still wager it'd be banned at almost any other time. The metagame right now has devolved into a broken-checks-broken affair so it's hard for me to tell which is broken, and which isn't. For example, Kyurem is being looked at in UU right now for being too overbearing there but to be honest, I've forgotten we had this thing multiple times.

I'll highlight the two egregious dragons here: Hydreigon and Regidrago. Hydreigon has 0 counters. This statement has been said for the past 5 generations. However, here you can fold the metagame with one set: Choice Specs. No need for superpower or iron tail; tera dark or tera dragon STABs busts through everything that doesn't resist. For the fairies you miss out on, you have got flash cannon (tera steel optional), tera blast poison for Primarina and Azumarill and flamethrower for Tinkaton. Regidrago is like Regieleki in OU but as a dragon type that can also run both physical and special sets. Terastalisation flips the scripts by allowing you to beat the fairy types that would otherwise wall you.

The best all-encompassing check would probably be Tinkaton. Mega Aggron can stomach a weaker hit in a pinch and retaliate. Aside from that, the counterplay to each of these dragons is unique. Some simply have to be dealt with through offensive means or defensive teratypes whilst others have a pool of counters available. Defensive fairies aren't that common in this metagame simply because they can be overwhelming by coverage or rendered completely useless with tera steel.

Offensive Dark Types


These 4 are the big players. I would love to talk about Mewoscarada and Mega Sharpedo but they are either not broken or niche. Naturally, dark types would rise in popularity since they happen to soft-check a lot of the psychics and ghosts running around but they are oppressive in their unique ways. Like dragons, they appreciate defensive fairy types being either uncommon, completely absent or exploitable. Bulky Dark types can take hits but don't dish that much back. Finally, Fighting types are somewhat common but the vast majority of them do not want to switch directly to any of these.

I've gone through Hydreigon already. Hoopa-U can run lethal physically and specially offensive sets - lending it unpredictability - but it is somewhat slow. Band Weavile is perhaps the scariest Pokemon to be face-to-face against with Knock-Off and Triple Axel being incredibly tricky to pivot into outside something like Tinkaton. One good utility weavile has is its ability to outspeed and trap virtually any Psychic or Ghost type in the tier which is nice for something like Heracross Mega. Moltres-Galar is an aurora veil staple at the moment but once the metagame settles down, I would imagine the rest talk sets would pop up more on bulkier offensive teams.

Tinkaton (again) handles a lot of these. Something like defensive Iron Hands could take a hit and retaliate but I would hesitate to call it anything more than a check. Incidentally, Slither Wing is nice at forcing dark types out with First Impression. Lokix and Scarf Fighting types perform a similar role as revenge killers. Finally, I have been running Z-moves on something like Scizor + investment to tank Weavile's Knock Off.

 

[Peum]

MY TIERLIST

I've made a lot of awful takes, but here it is, the Tierlist of all the pokemon who will be quickbanned in 10 days, I wanted to emphasize on how broken is garganacl in the actual meta, it is the encarnation of dont think and just click, here are some steps to get a win with Garganacl:
1 - Click Iron Defense
2 - Click Salt Cure/Body Press
3 - Click Recover if you are lower than 70%
4 - Win the game

Other honorable mentions are Regidrago who clicks Dragon Energy/Tera Blast Steel and destroys the whole meta, Tinkaton, one of the only mons that walls Regidrago, Choice Specs Hydreigon and finally Mega Slowbro who is completely outclassed by normal Slowbro/Slowking.

 

[BolTingBlazie]

Victini, Dondozo, Serperior, Mega Mawile, Kommo-o, Quaquaval, Meowscarada, Garganacl, MEGA LATIAS!?!??!?! These are literally mons that are either OU or UUBL worthy most likely.

Most of these guys (Execpt maybe meowscarada) are probably gonna get banhammered from uu at some point, especially Victini, Kommo-o, Garg, the latitwins, and mega mawile especially (Already just got banned from UU and dropped somehow wow). All these guys are pretty good or pretty alright in OU and most will probably get banhammered in UU if they rise.

 

[Lupla]

When the TL doesn't play the meta (lol)

After finally being able to make some progress in here, i can say a few things now


This mon is still as obnoxious as it was before in UU and probably even worse due to the lack of Clefable and Gliscor around for instance. While ID BPress is an amazing set, i have been playing around with Rocks Tect, having the Rocks rack up chip damage alongside Salt Cure is already bad enough but with Protect easily scouting anything the opp wants to do, you basically have the entire game in your hand with very little options to do anything about it. I would go on much further detail in some of its aspects but honestly the mon has been discussed enough plenty of times (Check ND UU thread to laugh) and with matches like these you can see how this mon is not even fair.

This Is PAIN



For the dragons i have yet to test them out but atm i really didn't had the same problems as everyone just yet and while i did see Regidrago in action (those rolls are disgusting) Hydreigon is something im not convinced yet, especially on a meta with Weavile, Tera Garganacl or the HO fest that's just casually chilling here. As for that Tinkaton hype idk :skull:



If you played UU then almost everything here applies the same except that the cplay is even less common (It probably doesn't even exist) it's like if we were playing Gen 8 ND UU in the Weavile meta all over again with Z-Crystals on hold or else Knock Off destroys everything. Try to out-offense one of the fastest mons around that doesn't require a boost or an item to do so, even then you have to switch into it first and not be weak to Ice Shard. SD sets are also a possibility as you abuse the switchins you force out to boost and demolish anything that's not Scizor or Tinkaton, this also removes one of the methods people use which is trying to force it out with hazards on the field thanks to Boots (A Z-crystal is an option too).



Honestly im in the opposite as to what people say about these two, by themselves they are outclassed sure but when Glowbro is capable of flipping around problematic matchups whenever it wants then that's where things start to look more clear. Not only is the change from Poison to Water great but you also gain the bulk needed to play around would-be bad matchups like Weavile, Bugless SD Scizor, etc. Overall this mon is actually kinda fun and not as bad as i thought it would given that it still struggles with the dragons but def a decent pick.


I would probably go for more but there's already too much broken shit in the tier to the point where everyone can figure out one thing and they are pmuch set. In case anyone wonders, yes a banwave will be arriving but that will be done not only after the shifts but also AFTER the wave UU is about to do (more than half of the list are RU mons haha) so for now let's just appreciate this weird meta a lil bit and take care!

 

[Triton_da_g.o.a.t]

is there is any complete list of what makes this meta "fucked up"?

 

[Melons-N-Soda]

Nightmare Blunt Rotation

To Triton_da_g.o.a.t, here you go.

To not make this a one-liner though I kinda wonder how the shifts coming up will change the meta. How many of these mons will go away, will the Swellow meme die off? (Mega Mawile already got banned from UU for instance despite being RU by usage)

 

[Gangsta Spongebob]

To Triton_da_g.o.a.t, here you go.

To not make this a one-liner though I kinda wonder how the shifts coming up will change the meta. How many of these mons will go away, will the Swellow meme die off? (Mega Mawile already got banned from UU for instance despite being RU by usage)

Note that I don't have any insider knowledge on how Ladder works, I'm purely guessing here.

Mega Mawile, like you said, and Espartha have already been Quickbanned from ND UU. Out of the rest of the Nightmare Blunt Rotation, Garganacl is probably the most likely to rise, as it is absurdly good in Nat Dex UU, and has 0 reason to be here. Beyond that, Weavile, Mega Lati@s, Serperior, Mega Slowbro, Victini, Mega Sableye, and Kyurem all could rise as they're really good in ND UU as well.

However, Ladder works in mysterious ways and thus I have no idea which broken or shitmon they'll steal, especially since nearly all of those listed threats have a decent chance of finding a footing in UU. In the case of Swellow all logic dictates it should drop, but for all I know Noctowl might be joining it very soon.

 

[Joseph Gomes]

Hoopa-U went from RU to OU lol