Metagame NFE Metagame

The No Johns NFE Tournament: Round 2


john |jän|
noun, verb, johned, johning
  • A cheap excuse for losing, missing a recovery, being hit by an attack, or any number of unfavorable events in Smash. It is a statement or action that detracts from the validity or quality of a competition (or its implied significance), irrespective of truth.
This tournament will be contested under USM NFE rules. What makes this different from any other tournament is the fact that the deadlines are short. 3 day maximum. No Johns.

Tournament Rules and Clauses

  • Sleep Clause: A player cannot put two or more different opposing Pokémon to sleep using attacks that induce sleep to opposing Pokémon.
  • Species Clause: A player cannot have two of the same Pokémon on their team. For example, a player cannot have two Koffing on his or her team.
  • Evasion Clause: A player cannot use the moves Double Team or Minimize in their Pokémon's movesets.
  • OHKO Clause: Players cannot use Horn Drill, Guillotine, Sheer Cold, or Fissure in any of their Pokémon's movesets.
  • Timer Clause: If a player exhausts the timer, he/she loses.
  • Endless Battle Clause: Any moveset on any pokemon that is capable of intentionally causing an endless battle is banned from competitive play. Check this thread for more informations.
  • Uber Clause: Players may not use any items, moves, abilities, or Pokemon that appear on our NFE Ban List. If the tiers change or new items, abilities, moves, or Pokemon become available in the middle of a round, the changes will take effect in the following round. There will be an announcement in the relevant round if this occurs. Unlikely in this scenario.
  • Deadlines will be very short. Schedule asap and via Smogon VM if possible. There will be no extensions.
  • Single elimination, best of 1.
Admin Calls

lockjaw was given the win by jcbc

Round 2


vooper vs DadoRossoFuoco
Quagg
vs CrazyStevy
Cheff Gordo vs saba1111
Thimblebony vs WMAR
Marination vs fxl
Thunder~BALLZ
vs mashumarutu
Indol vs Monsareeasy
raf vs lockjaw

Replays are mandatory.
Posting the replay in your win post would be ideal. However, if you wish to re-use teams and do not want to reveal them, you can send the replay to me via Smogon or Discord PMs. I do plan on making all replays available at the end of the tour with usage stats.

Deadline is Saturday 22nd June 23:59 EDT (gmt -4). Round 3 will be up a few hours after the deadline.
 
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Gonna post a team I think is pretty solid in the meta and quite fun too.

Manual Sun​

I wanted to test out manual sun to get an idea of whether Drought would be broken if it got freed. Shoutouts to 1v1sp, he gave me the framework for this team as a meme and I edited it into a decent team.

Wrapped in Plain (Grimer-Alola) (F) @ Eviolite
Ability: Poison Touch
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 228 HP / 252 SpD / 24 Spe
Careful Nature
- Poison Jab
- Knock Off
- Pursuit
- Clear Smog

Giant's Throat (Weepinbell) @ Eviolite
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Solar Beam
- Sludge Bomb
- Weather Ball
- Growth

Bones in the Water (Combusken) @ Firium Z
Ability: Speed Boost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Protect
- Brick Break
- Swords Dance

The First Leaf (Ivysaur) @ Eviolite
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 1 Atk
- Growth
- Sludge Bomb
- Solar Beam
- Hidden Power [Fire]

Sleep and Dream (Dusclops) @ Heat Rock
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 168 Atk / 56 SpD / 32 Spe
Careful Nature
- Sunny Day
- Memento
- Earthquake
- Shadow Sneak

The Lamb (Riolu) @ Heat Rock
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 92 HP / 252 Atk / 164 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Sunny Day
- High Jump Kick
- Copycat
- Protect


Descriptions of what mons do is pretty simple.

Dusc is usually the lead of choice unless your opponent has a Pokmeon either capable of OHKOing or taunting it. It typically sets up Sunny Day then Mementos out of the game for one of the three breakers. EV spread optimised so eq into sneak guarantee kills non evio monf and comb, who are massive threats to the team. You can't afford to give either a free setup chance, especially comb. Also can break sash kad and does a good amount of damage to haunter.

Riolu acts as another Sunny Day setter but using it is slightly more nuanced than dedicated lead Dusclops. Riolu's only job is usually to set up a Sunny Day and die, since it gets OHKOed by any reasonably strong neutral attack. Its bulk is terrible. However, Prankster Copycat can be surprisingly useful in certain circumstances. It can Copycat Stealth Rocks and other hazards, break Sashes from the likes of Kadabra or even clean with Copycat HJK if the breakers have done their job. In most games, it will set up Sunny Day late game and die but it can also clean or get rid of an annoying threat if the opportunity is there. Prankster hjk does not hit dark types tho and u take recoil.

Ivysaur is one of the sun abusers. Fairly standard set. It hits 438 speed under sun and breaks with Growth, STABs and HP Fire. Evio lets it get up a Growth vs a decent amount of the meta.

Weepinbell is the other chloro abuser. It's a bit slower than Ivy but hits a bit harder and has stronger Fire coverage in Weather Ball in sun. Both chloro sweepers break for either each other or for busk.

Combusken is the third sun abuser. Sun boosted Flare Blitz hits very hard especially after SD. Combusken is decent at breaking the fat spdef walls like Slig for Ivy and Weep and it also threatens Steels hard right off the bat. It can also act as a good cleaner outside of sun and provides good speed control out of sun.

Grimer is primarily on the team to break sash kad for the three sweepers. However, max spdef can also trap Scarf Frog and Haunter, two massive offensive threats to the team.

Threats​

Threatlist is primarily Fire Types, especially opposing Combusken and Scarf Torracat. Scarf frog is also very problematic since it outspeeds both chloro abusers under sun and +2 Combusken.

Opposing Combusken is the biggest threat. Ideally the play is to pressure it enough offensively to ensure it never sets up or to get your own combusken or chloro boys set up before it. Never let combusken set up for free.

Murkrows also really annoying.

Scarf Frog can be trapped by max spdef grimer if necessary. Ivy can also run a timid set to outspeed scarf torracat if needed.

Sand stream hippo is an instant forfeit.

Adapting the team​

Sleep and Dream (Dusclops) @ Heat Rock
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sunny Day
- Memento
- Night Shade
- Will-O-Wisp

This was another dusc set I ran, its bulkier and can wisp physical threats. However, it lets comb and monf setup for free. Dusc only needs sunny day and memento on this set, which means the last two slots are fairly free to lure specific threats. I like eq and sneak, but stuff like brick break or counter are also pretty solid.

Weep can realistically also run the following physical set, which improves its matchup vs some threats at the expense of weakening the matchup vs other mons.

Giant's Throat (Weepinbell) @ Eviolite
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Growth
- Poison Jab
- Seed Bomb
- Sucker Punch

The physical set hits hard, especially at +2 and can break through the likes of Quilladin and Sliggoo, who both check the special set. It also maintains coverage on Metang and sucker gives weepinbell good prio against faster scarfers and gives weep a decently strong prio attack outside of sun. In exchange, it cant break ferro, pawn and other steels.

You can also replace Riolu for Murkrow too.

Day of Nights (Murkrow) @ Heat Rock
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Sunny Day
- Brave Bird
- Sucker Punch
- Pursuit

This Murkrow set is similar to Riolu, set up Prankster Sunny Day then die. It's more immediately threatening than Riolu with BB and Sucker. The 4th moveslot is also pretty customisable. Suit forces a 50/50 with sash kad, sub can avoid wisps from haunter and missy, prankster mirror move is situational but can come in clutch to revenge certain pokemon (run Hasty nature if using mm) or twave to cripple faster threats. I personally prefer Riolu more but either work imo.

You can probably swap out Ivy or Weep for other chloro sweepers like Tangela, Nuzleaf and Gloom. I think ivy and weep are the best chloro abusers but there are enough abusers to give manual sun some variety and make it a bit more difficult to check in builder, since all the viable chloro mons provide slightly different niches.





Discussion on drought​

There was some discussion a while ago about potentially freeing Drought but it was vetoed quite quickly. After trying out manual sun, I do think Drought would be pretty busted in the tier. Manual sun did surprisingly well against a decent variety of teamstyles and was able to outpressure mons I thought would be good defensive checks to sun like sliggoo and quilladin. For my team above, Vulpix is far better than Riolu as a sun setter. No free turns are needed to get Vulpix and Sun since it automatically does so when it switches in. A well played vulpix can realistically get 16 turns of sun up in a game, meaning that Dusclops can be taken out of the team for another sun abuser or sth that improves the mu vs scarf frog and fires. Vulpix would make sun far more dangerous as a playstyle since it wouldn't need two slots on dedicated setters and Vulpix itself hits reasonably hard with sun boosted fire blast. It would be too centralising and difficult to prep for in builder along with everything else imo.

TL.DR Manual sun aight, drought should stay banned.
 
Ok so I've been lurking this forum since it's creation and thoroughly enjoying this meta as it has it's month in the spotlight and I think it's time to make some noms for the VR

IMG_20190621_223120.png
Tentacool
Unranked--------->B
I'm pretty surprised that this wasn't already in the VR and I think it definitely merits a spot in B. As a bulky water-poison type it is obviously hopelessly outclassed by mareanie. Without any real recovery and pitiful physical defense it can't hope to be compare to the toxapex of nfe.
However it does have some excellent attributes which I believe give it a place in the metagame. The two most crucial moves that it has over mareanie are acid spray and rapid spin. Acid spray makes it an excellent counter to calm mind clefairy thanks to it's ability to tear through it's SpDefboosts and wall it forever with it's ridiculous special bulk (the sixth best of any available mon in this meta) acid spray also helps alleviate it's poor SpAtk and make scald (which is useful to hit physical attackers as they switch in) be more of a threat.
252+ SpA Clefairy Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Eviolite Tentacool: 25-30 (8.8 - 10.5%) -- possibly the worst move ever
Now obviously Clefairy doesn't typically run 252+ SpAtk and the tentacool user will likely have some PhysDef investment but this calc illustrates how easily tentacool walls an S tier mon. It is likely to be worn down easily and does require wish support (which I'll cover in my next nom) to stay healthy. This is a big hindrance and is why it's other niche is so vital to it's viability.
That niche is as a rapid spinner that can not only come in but stay in on Roselia and clear it's spikes. The only two spinners listed in the role compendium are Wartortle and Staryu. Neither can stop Roselia from getting it's spikes up, a defining part of Roselia's play. Tentacool can, quite easily and chip away with acid spray until the opponent switches or dies. It even has knock off to dent/cripple ghosts that try to block the spin on switch. And as one last kicker it can run liquid ooze to hurt giga drain Roselia. It can do the exact same thing to Quilladin but it can kill Tentacool easier with physical grass stab (though it also dies easier to acid spray so give and take) This is a really useful niche in a meta where spikes are so useful and plentiful and where defogging your own away may cripple you as much as your opponent. It merits a place in B but I believe it can definitely rise in the future.
252+ SpA Roselia Giga Drain vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Eviolite Tentacool: 55-66 (19.3 - 23.2%) -- possible 5HKO
Again these aren't necessarily standard sets but show how bulky this mon is.
Finally it acts as a decent special wall/pivot with it's great bulk however it does need wish support. Speaking of which...

IMG_20190621_223310.png
Jigglypuff
Unranked------->C-
Best wish support in the game. Simple as that. Despite it's crap defenses it's fantastic HP means that with eviolite it is hard to OHKO so it can often get up a clutch wish to save something else late game. It's HP is so large that it can heal a huge chunk from pretty much every other month in this meta. It works really well with dusclops sponging it's weaknesses and healing it while Dusclops can resist poison type attacks for Puff. Puff also has insane utility: Wish, Heal Bell, Stealth Rocks, Thunder Wave, Screens, Disable, Magic Coat, Perish Song and Knock Off or Seismic Toss for damage. It can do whatever you need it to utility wise but is a bit is a momentum sponge and set up bait so C- is probably fine. Never gonna be an influential part of the meta but is pretty useful and the only other wish passer that comes close to it's HP stat is lickitung which outclasses it somewhat but a fairy typing can be useful in some scenarios sooo... C- is fine.
 
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The No Johns NFE Tournament: Round 3

john |jän|
noun, verb, johned, johning
  • A cheap excuse for losing, missing a recovery, being hit by an attack, or any number of unfavorable events in Smash. It is a statement or action that detracts from the validity or quality of a competition (or its implied significance), irrespective of truth.
This tournament will be contested under USM NFE rules. What makes this different from any other tournament is the fact that the deadlines are short. 3 day maximum. No Johns.

Tournament Rules and Clauses

  • Sleep Clause: A player cannot put two or more different opposing Pokémon to sleep using attacks that induce sleep to opposing Pokémon.
  • Species Clause: A player cannot have two of the same Pokémon on their team. For example, a player cannot have two Koffing on his or her team.
  • Evasion Clause: A player cannot use the moves Double Team or Minimize in their Pokémon's movesets.
  • OHKO Clause: Players cannot use Horn Drill, Guillotine, Sheer Cold, or Fissure in any of their Pokémon's movesets.
  • Timer Clause: If a player exhausts the timer, he/she loses.
  • Endless Battle Clause: Any moveset on any pokemon that is capable of intentionally causing an endless battle is banned from competitive play. Check this thread for more informations.
  • Uber Clause: Players may not use any items, moves, abilities, or Pokemon that appear on our NFE Ban List. If the tiers change or new items, abilities, moves, or Pokemon become available in the middle of a round, the changes will take effect in the following round. There will be an announcement in the relevant round if this occurs. Unlikely in this scenario.
  • Deadlines will be very short. Schedule asap and via Smogon VM if possible. There will be no extensions.
  • Single elimination, best of 1.
Admin Calls

Quagg was given the win by CrazyStevy

Round 3

DadoRossoFuoco
vs Thunder~BALLZ
Quagg vs fxl
Cheff Gordo vs Monsareeasy
lockjaw vs WMAR

Replays are mandatory. Posting the replay in your win post would be ideal. However, if you wish to re-use teams and do not want to reveal them, you can send the replay to me via Smogon or Discord PMs. I do plan on making all replays available at the end of the tour with usage stats.

Deadline is Tuesday 25nd June 23:59 EDT (gmt -4). Round 4 will be up a few hours after the deadline.
 
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