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All pidgeots are Timid lmfaoIt has to run speed nature to do anything. Its base 121 is decent against some attackers but its super easy to outspeed.
All pidgeots are Timid lmfaoIt has to run speed nature to do anything. Its base 121 is decent against some attackers but its super easy to outspeed.
Sometimes you have to sack pidgeot just to get a good switch it on a threat.Just saying there are options at dealing with it. Anything is a threat when used right and in UU, most teams are equipped to deal with it and its not because of pidgeot.uhm
Doesn't this apply to basically any fast offensive pokemon? Just because scarfers can revenge kill it does not mean it isn't a problem in the metagame. Scarfers revenge kill S Rank mons, so does that mean these pokemon are not threats? So because a scarfer can kill Hydreigon after it drops a draco, or Salamence after an outrage, these pokemon are balanced? The scarfer prevents said pokemon from forcing you to take a huge hit and potentially sack a mon?
Well, from lower tiers, you also have Jolteon and I believe another poke there with base 145 speed. To be fair though, most teams have scarfed pokemon. Speed is not the only thing going against it though.Let's list off the pokemon in UU that outspeed Mega Pidgeot without a scarf.
1. Mega Aerodactyl
2. Mega Beedrill
3. Mega Sceptile
4. Crobat
If being at a speed tier that outspeeds all but four pokemon isn't good, I don't know what is.
Salamence is 95/80/80, so whats the point here? Pidgeot isnt the only sweeper who can take a hit and dish out the damage. This thing with Moxie and scarf/ DD is a threat, even more so if you cant drop it or cripple it. Pidgeot isn't taking hits well. If it does any the opponents has priority, its a done deal, even more so if they have rocks up.I'd say 83/80/80 defenses for an offensive pokemon are way above normal, allowing it to take, as you've shown, super effective STAB hits from defensive pokemon and still have enough HP to switch in on rocks (though I'm not sure why any Pidgeot would stay in vs a defensive Rotom, but the option is there if you need it). Off the top of my head, the only pokemon that can OHKO Mega Pidgeot with a neutral hit is Darmanitan's Flare Blitz, with Mienshao having around an 80% chance with Reckless HJK. Pidgeot takes almost every other unboosted neutral hit.
my 75 to 80% is from the max I've seen dealt to my pidgeot. Sure it can take one hit in some cases but an explosion from azelf kills in one hit. Any powerful sweeper can drop a pidgeot easy. Pidgeot also has to mega to gain its speed. On the rotom thing, a sweeper rotom KOs it.Well you just showed a calc where a super effective hit did 72% max, so I'm not sure how you got to the conclusion that non super effective hits do 75-80. Even in the calc you posted, a max SpA modest Moonblast does 71% max, so that really doesn't support your claim either.
I would vote no because I play mega pidgeot eveyday in UU (not recently because of the test). Pidgeot has its problems within the tier. It has to mega first to do anything and it has to not hit a team that resit it well. No pidgeot is staying in on a threat and will switch out if it needs to. Not saying none of your points aren;t valid but I'm saying as an avid pidgeot user, its not as bad as people make it out to be.While I don't know myself whether I'm voting ban or not, I will make sure my decision is educated, and I hope yours is, too, because the reasoning behind your decision to vote 'no ban' really doesn't make much sense. I honestly don't mind whether Mega Pidgeot stays, as long as the reasoning behind its fate is a logical one.
and those 3 pokes also outspeed the rest of the meta. There are options to use against it.I suggest the battling 101 sections before you attempt to make serious posts on a suspect -.-
>super easily outsped. How can you be so naive to say it is super easily outsped. It outspeeds the entire metagame bar 3 pokes in driller, mega scept, and aero (And jolteon I even though nobody uses it blah blah blah).
Well, yeah, they have to run timid.All pidgeots are Timid lmfao
Jolteon is bad because it's outclassed by Heliolisk and Mega Ampharos as well as Rotoms and Accelgor? lmao. Pidgeot can just spam Hurricane and 2hko the entire meta, as you said, anything is a threat when used right, a good Pidgeot user WILL take lives of a lot of mons in the opponents team if they do not have anything for it, like Empoleon. Even then, it can predict the switch and U-Turn out to something that threatens Empoleon. Not only it can spam 110 BP never missing move with 30% confuse rate, it can create momentum and a perfect coverage with Heat Wave. Just as you've used Mega Pidgeot in UU, we all have as well, and most of us, can say it is broken. It'd be helpful for us if you stop being biased, and face the reality, your arguments are pointless because SpD Rotom-H is not even viable enough to be listed; it does nothing otherwise. And Florges aren't max SpA Modest lol. Also, just because you cannot set up with Work Up doesn't mean we all can. So yeah, please think a bit more before posting. :)Sometimes you have to sack pidgeot just to get a good switch it on a threat.Just saying there are options at dealing with it. Anything is a threat when used right and in UU, most teams are equipped to deal with it and its not because of pidgeot.
Well, from lower tiers, you also have Jolteon and I believe another poke there with base 145 speed. To be fair though, most teams have scarfed pokemon. Speed is not the only thing going against it though.
Salamence is 95/80/80, so whats the point here? Pidgeot isnt the only sweeper who can take a hit and dish out the damage. This thing with Moxie and scarf/ DD is a threat, even more so if you cant drop it or cripple it. Pidgeot isn't taking hits well. If it does any the opponents has priority, its a done deal, even more so if they have rocks up.
my 75 to 80% is from the max I've seen dealt to my pidgeot. Sure it can take one hit in some cases but an explosion from azelf kills in one hit. Any powerful sweeper can drop a pidgeot easy. Pidgeot also has to mega to gain its speed. On the rotom thing, a sweeper rotom KOs it.
I would vote no because I play mega pidgeot eveyday in UU (not recently because of the test). Pidgeot has its problems within the tier. It has to mega first to do anything and it has to not hit a team that resit it well. No pidgeot is staying in on a threat and will switch out if it needs to. Not saying none of your points aren;t valid but I'm saying as an avid pidgeot user, its not as bad as people make it out to be.
I do understand the game. I've been playing smogon competitive since gen 4. If theres one thing I know about pokemon battles, nothing every goes according to plan.yea i think you have to try and understand this game a bit better crystal pidgeot
thats exactly my point. IF you can setup a work up and the opponent does nothing about it, then good for you. A good opponent will do something about it. Beedrill also can u-turn and create momentum and in most cases, it does it better and goes into something that can be a threat. Even Pidgeots heatwave isn't knocking out a healthy poke. Sure I may have some bias on my end but from my hundreds of hours of playing mega pidgeot, its not as free as people are saying it is. Not all players copy paste pokes either. I know you all live in this perfect world where battle go 100% according to play but this is never the case.Jolteon is bad because it's outclassed by Heliolisk and Mega Ampharos as well as Rotoms and Accelgor? lmao. Pidgeot can just spam Hurricane and 2hko the entire meta, as you said, anything is a threat when used right, a good Pidgeot user WILL take lives of a lot of mons in the opponents team if they do not have anything for it, like Empoleon. Even then, it can predict the switch and U-Turn out to something that threatens Empoleon. Not only it can spam 110 BP never missing move with 30% confuse rate, it can create momentum and a perfect coverage with Heat Wave. Just as you've used Mega Pidgeot in UU, we all have as well, and most of us, can say it is broken. It'd be helpful for us if you stop being biased, and face the reality, your arguments are pointless because SpD Rotom-H is not even viable enough to be listed; it does nothing otherwise. And Florges aren't max SpA Modest lol. Also, just because you cannot set up with Work Up doesn't mean we all can. So yeah, please think a bit more before posting. :)
I agree with your post. Sure Pidgeot is good but its not like people are running things like Empoloeon and other pokes because of Pidgeot. I have notice nothing has changed much as well and well balanced teams should be able to handle it. Right now when I build my teams, its to stop beedrill.The meta without Mega Pidgeot I don't find is that much different other than the abundance of M-Sharpedo, M-Beedrill, M-Aero on a lot of teams I saw then your usual threats with Mamoswine, Feraligatr, Hydreigon, and so forth. There's a bit more team-building freedom, considering your defensive components of the team aren't getting cheesed by Confusion hax which is an aspect that pushes M-Pidgeot over the edge along with the fact its move is already powerful to begin with. I think Mega Pidgeots issue in the meta is the team-building constraint it applies into practice against more balance inclined teams than what is perceived on paper in the fact your Mega Pidgeot checks might not actually be checks in the context of all the nuisances taken into account.
Removing Mega Pidgeot from the meta-game might not make the meta-game entirely better or whatever people are trying to perceive as better in their own line of thinking. It's a start though to remove a team-building constraint on the level of Mega Pidgeot in my eyes, more so eliminating an easy button for a lot of builds simply cause it's fast as hell, hits hard as hell, and most checks are shaky at best or are resorted to roles of revenge killers to actually check it.
I guess my two cents with this last point Mega Pidgeot is pretty "centralizing" but there's a lot of threats right now that are pretty strong or can potentially be on par to Mega Pidgeots level based on a variety of circumstances so granted this suspect is obviously warranted but I wouldn't over exaggerate its capabilities like crazy and say things such as "6-0 stall" or some of the realistically crazy lines I've been seeing.
Also jesus christ these volt-turn teams everywhere wtf dude ;-;
Changed my avatar just for you.This man is making absolutely zero sense and this thread is just becoming cancerous, I say we just stop quoting him as a whole and just move on with the damn suspect because this guy is not going to quit and the thread is just going to be flooded 1000 feebas avatars which nobody wants to see.
I still think Mega Pidgeot should be banned because it's still an enormous team building constraint in practice. Having your most consistent STAB have a confusion rate at the level of what a Scald burn can apply and being one of the faster mons in the tier with an already high special attack isn't exactly a healthy aspect. If there were better flying resists that were more consistent it would be a different story but really a lot of them are kind of bad and the good ones are just playing a gamble to not get worn down or just confused. You have stuff like Mega Ampharos and Empoleon that work pretty well, but eventually just get overwhelmed overtime being a switch in to it. Also the fact it pairs up with all the already strong non megas right now as a focal point of these cohesive unit is a huge selling point to its centralization as well. A lot of the stronger threats in the tier barring stuff like Hydreigon, Infernape, and Lucario are really physically inclined, think Feraligatr and Mamoswine, which made these physically inclined mons even harder to deal with since M-Pidgeots offensive support helps pave the way for them to win. It's not just Mega Pidgeot alone but also the idea that it's amplifying a lot of stuff that right now, without it around in the suspect test, able to be a bit more manageable for balanced teams to go up against.I agree with your post. Sure Pidgeot is good but its not like people are running things like Empoloeon and other pokes because of Pidgeot. I have notice nothing has changed much as well and well balanced teams should be able to handle it. Right now when I build my teams, its to stop beedrill.
Its usage hasn't dropped I don't see why it would. It's a super great check to Mega Beedrill right now and has the same old utility it's always had. That, M-Sharpedo, and M-Beedrill are the only megas I've been seeing on the suspect as of now and a couple of stuff like M-Ampharos as well.I'm wondering if anyone who's been playing the suspect test recently has noticed a sizable drop in m-aero usage?
considering that was a big counter argument to pidgeot's brokenness I'm curious if its absence has had any effect
ah ty i was just tryna get a feel for the new meta so i can build a proper god squawd heheIts usage hasn't dropped I don't see why it would. It's a super great check to Mega Beedrill right now and has the same old utility it's always had. That, M-Sharpedo, and M-Beedrill are the only megas I've been seeing on the suspect as of now and a couple of stuff like M-Ampharos as well.
I haven't seen very much Mega Aerodactyl either, but I have seen a lot of Mega Sceptile. The changes to the meta are definitely very favorable to it; the loss of Pidgeot itself is part of that, but the apparent drop in the usage of Scarf Salamence/Hydreigon, Mamoswine, and Aerodactyl all benefit Sceptile.I'm wondering if anyone who's been playing the suspect test recently has noticed a sizable drop in m-aero usage?
considering that was a big counter argument to pidgeot's brokenness I'm curious if its absence has had any effect
Mega Sceptile is usually seen in low ladder, it was seen usually in the previous suspect test as well, in higher ladder, the usage of Mega Sharpedo and Mega Beedrill rose as well as Mega Blastoise. Mega Aero usage remains the same it seems.I haven't seen very much Mega Aerodactyl either, but I have seen a lot of Mega Sceptile. The changes to the meta are definitely very favorable to it; the loss of Pidgeot itself is part of that, but the apparent drop in the usage of Scarf Salamence/Hydreigon, Mamoswine, and Aerodactyl all benefit Sceptile.
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/uu-233653621.And it only got work up,not nasty plot.I really don't see why a well built and played stall will be simply 6-0ed by it.
well,thanks for sharing.I do believe the bird has some ability to break stall at the beginning.
But Pidgeot makes it really really easier for me to break my opponent's team, that is broken lolwell,thanks for sharing.I do believe the bird has some ability to break stall at the beginning.
But just for that replay,that win is a team cooperation not something like the opponent'm team simply beaten by mega pidg
If people don't have a reliable check to M-Pidge, that's when they run into trouble. Roar Suicune, Blissey, CM Cress, P2 are all okay defensive options. But, I've found it easier to just hit it hard with M-Aero, Scarf Heliolisk, Jolteon, M-Beedrill, Crobat, etc.. In your replay, once they eliminated or weakened Pidge's checks, it was able to WU Refresh sweep. It was great team support and I think it would've gone exactly the same way even if he had decided to sweep with SD Doublade at that point (which would've again had little issue boosting in front of blissey).