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np: OU Suspect Testing Round 1 - ...wait, I'm not Jumpman16!

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The cutoff ends in 12 hours! I'll be taking a screen shot of the ratings at 12:00am EST, so make sure you get as high as you can before then!

Also, the new rating may or may not now be 1400...
 
it might just me but incos smeargle isnt as broken as i thought.
But i havent tried the recovering variants though
Now for the others
 
I agree with most above me, that Inconsistency turns a match into a luck based game, but even more than that. Unless the Inconsistency pokemon (me talking about octillery) has an attacking move that is only water type, it is ridiculously hard, if not almost impossible to beat, if luck doesn't fall your way (which won't in almost all cases of inconsistency). And even then, an Octillery with toxic takes care of that. Even what would normally be considered a hard counter can't take it out.

Natorie for instance. I run a Specially Defensive set, resistance to surf, not to mention he has tremendous bulk. However, I came across an octillery w/ Surf, Sub, Protect, Toxic. (i believe that was the set). Well, it can't toxic me, and I resist surf, not to mention my Special bulk, I figured no problem, especially since I have STAB power whip. But with octillery's combination of sub+ protect eventually got his defenses high enough that my SE, STAB Power Whip wouldn't even break his subs! And he eventually killed me with his surfs since his SpA eventually got sky high as well.

Does that make me a less skilled battler? In any other case Natorrie would have no problem taking on octillery. To tell me I HAVE to carry a vappy or suicune on my team, and HOPE that he doesn't run energy ball is ridiculous. Inconsistency gives the user an advantage so great that it becomes nearly impossible to defeat in many cases. I ALSO run an Unaware Quagsire. Still toxic-stalled, not much I can do.

I can't think of a single pokemon that isn't uber that can unquestionably take on Inconsistency Octillery. And if you about those of you who don't want to ban it "because pokemon should be banned only according to power", take this into account: Salamance was banned last gen. Without access to Dragon Dance I think it's safe to say he wouldn't have been banished to ubers. But he could set up. And when he set up he was monstrous. Inconsistency allows the pokemon to set up while protecting, or subbing! He doesn't have to waste turns DDing or SDing. His ability allows it to set up.

So yes, it may be slightly luck based, but it isn't luck in the sense that "there's a 30% chance to flinch", but that "there is a 100% chance you get a +2 boost to one stat, and -1 to another". And with 6 (i believe) stats that can be upgraded, and only 1 that is useless to octillery, that means there in a sub + protect combination, the odds of him getting +2 boosts in 2 desirable stats is 25:36. That's WAY more than half, meaning it isn't really a coin flip at all.
 
okay something weird just happened.
Toxic bounce back with synchronize. This means the only broken octilerry set is the offensive one (i think only octi that is broken with inconsistent tbh)
 
JSND said:
okay something weird just happened.
Toxic bounce back with synchronize. This means the only broken octilerry set is the offensive one (i think only octi that is broken with inconsistent tbh)
Click to expand...

What exactly has Synchronize that you can't KO with Surf after a boost or two?
 
Nanoswine said:
What exactly has Synchronize that you can't KO with Surf after a boost or two?
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The idea is that you put something in that can't be KO'd with surf, switch to the Synchro type predicting a Toxic, and then go back to whatever can't be killed Surf. Problem solved. The problem is that the list of synchronizers is rather meager and most of them have other abilities to be using. Mew looks decent though
 
Kiorein said:
The idea is that you put something in that can't be KO'd with surf, switch to the Synchro type predicting a Toxic, and then go back to whatever can't be killed Surf. Problem solved. The problem is that the list of synchronizers is rather meager and most of them have other abilities to be using. Mew looks decent though
Click to expand...

Oh, that's actually a pretty cool idea. But like you said, the only Synchronize pokemon I think would be worth using is Mew. Also, to pull this off successfully, you need a pokemon that will bait a toxic, a Mew, and Nattorei (or something else it can't take down with surf)

And what if they try to set up a sub instead of going for the toxic right off the bat? Then your strategy doesn't work anymore, because they know it's coming.
 
stall mew is so threatening in this meta its not funny really. Also i bet over 9000 bucks that when statistics come out stall mew will be the most common mew set to show how good it is(because im the only one using it and i mostly use mew (lol joking))
I just cant count how many team i raped with my proper use of right variants of stall mew so yeah it works. To fit your team, mew has movepool to do it. In stall mew term you can have aura shere, Toxic, Thunder Wave, Light Screen, U-Turn to name some of the best choice making it a great adition in most team making the sync reflecting idea quite nice seeing how actualy good mew is.

and the toxic variants lose to toxicroak who noticably can bulk up or SD on your face, and yeah counter having is not ubroken. While toxicroak might be a badass in this metagame the fact that he counters defensive octi doesnt mean octi not broken despite the fact that toxi is a nice pokemon on itself. So to say octilerry doesnt have 100 % safe counter seeing theres just too many variants it can run


(mew is funny thought he can AS and thunderbolt octilerry and risk toxic bounce back)
 
I'm telling you guys, running rest in the 4th slot makes octo soooo much harder to take down. Sure he's completely walled by vaporeon and suicune, but not only are they only really found on rain teams, you also have teamviewer to spot them from a mile away. Even on teams that do carry vaporeons and suicunes, they usually play a pretty big role, so the odds that they are around when you're trying to pull off your octo sweep arent that good
 
lone said:
I'm telling you guys, running rest in the 4th slot makes octo soooo much harder to take down. Sure he's completely walled by vaporeon and suicune, but not only are they only really found on rain teams, you also have teamviewer to spot them from a mile away. Even on teams that do carry vaporeons and suicunes, they usually play a pretty big role, so the odds that they are around when you're trying to pull off your octo sweep arent that good
Click to expand...

FYI, Burungeru is REALLY common, and Vaporeon and Suicune are found anywhere BUT rain teams...

Nanoswine said:
Oh, that's actually a pretty cool idea. But like you said, the only Synchronize pokemon I think would be worth using is Mew. Also, to pull this off successfully, you need a pokemon that will bait a toxic, a Mew, and Nattorei (or something else it can't take down with surf)

And what if they try to set up a sub instead of going for the toxic right off the bat? Then your strategy doesn't work anymore, because they know it's coming.
Click to expand...


You can do this with Shinpora too, y'know. Magic Guard plus Psycho Shift.

Not to mention Shinpora can out-boost an inconsistant user.
 
PS roost and then 2 more slot.
I dunno what its item will be but mew can actualy beat BOTH bandtar and scarftar while shinpora cant beat ttar reliable which is a plus
But as an offensive minded he work well in paper
 
JSND said:
PS roost and then 2 more slot.
I dunno what its item will be but mew can actualy beat BOTH bandtar and scarftar while shinpora cant beat ttar reliable which is a plus
But as an offensive minded he work well in paper
Click to expand...

Nasty Plot Life Orb Roost? But then, Choice Scarf Tyranitar is (I think) virtually nonexistant now considering it is still pwned by Mach Punchers and Scizor; Deoxys-A, Darkrai, and Shaymin-S out speed regardless, Wobbuffet can handle Scarf easy, GARCHOMP exists again, etc. I think it is more safe to use Nasty Plot Mew than before (once Darkrai and peeps are down) because it's number one counter Spiritomb (lol, Deoxy's also best counter, Spiritomb is amazing at taking out offensive psychics) is rarely seen and even then it might Baton Pass and it might not, considering Mew's extreme bulk.

And SCREEN/STALL Mew is BULKY. Dude, the thing is nearly impossible to kill, I know because I calculated a whole bunch of stats for it to support why Mew was one of the most threatening but oddly less used pokes.
 
Shinpora doesn't work, substitute blocks psycho shift. The point of synchronize is that it goes through sub. And it doesn't work if octillery doesn't have toxic and is instead receiving toxic spikes support (or even if it doesn't have it, it really only needs it for a select few pokemon- whom it could probably beat by going mixed with waterfall/energy ball). Since inconsistent needs a grounded poison, and a lot of grounded poisons learn tspikes themselves, tspikes is not uncommon alongside an inconsistent user.
 
Get darkrai,inconsistent & shaymin out of there.

Have Deoxys-A,Doryuuza & manaphy up for suspects in round 2.
I Q_Q at laddering at one point I made it to those precious 1300's...for like a round Q_Q....then I got smahed back down into oblivion from octillery and my teams never recovered.
Oh well.
 
Man with the smogon server crashing all the time sure is tough to get this rating...the great ala is not completely deterred though as long as it comes back up in the next hour or so >_>

Anyways, final thoughts on the broken shit:

Skymin-The most broken bitch of them all, sub Skymin nearly always gets a KO once it gets a sub up and with Wobb on the same team that is almost guaranteed. Scarfmin is still a beast too, able to almost single-handedly defeat Rain teams and is ridiculously easy to clean late game with.

Darkrai-A huge bitch. Dark Void with the new sleep mechanic puts it over the edge for me. Decent bulk, great combo of moves and sub is super awful on him too...scarf is a beast too. Uber this shit!

Wobb-This is probably my least fave poke to face, aside from Skymin. To the people that say "Hurrrrr but I never see it used so it must not be uber LOL" I say you better thank fuck it isn't used more because it would be impossible to achieve a decent rank. When it's used in combination with Darkrai and Skymin it becomes an almost undefeatable team.

Deo-A/N/S: All brutal. A Is obviously ridiculously strong and has like 2 counters (Metagross, Jirachi). Extremespeed limits its counters to very few and makes it really awesome late game. N is also uber because with the extra bulky actually survives some weaker priority hits and becomes arguably more of a pain in the ass. The lesser attack stats don't really matter when you take into account it's cleaning late game when everything is weakened so yeah. S makes it stupidly easy to lay down hazards, especially with Magic Coat, allowing it to beat pretty much every lead. It makes it unfair for that reason, turning every game into a speed tie involving two Deo-S.

Possible Ubers I'm on the Fence About:

Doryuuuuuuuzu-604 Speed, 369 Attack, and if your counter gets weakened/KOd it's GG? Fuck that lol. Good thing there are a lot of checks for him though, so I'll probably play around with him some more before I decide.

Manaphy-Love or hate this thing, you can't deny it's power. Calm Mind is arguably the toughest set to defeat, but I've been playing around with a bulky Tail Glow set and it's crazy what this thing can live from. That said it loses considerable power so it's really a trade off. Plenty of pokes threaten it, but once some of those are gone it'll be another story.

Kingdra-Best rain sweeper including Manaphy. A Dory with better typing and not weak to priority? Yes please. Granted it can't boost but when it comes out late game does it really need to? Mixed is my set of choice, but sub DD and Specs are pure bitches too.

Latios-Still has that crazy Draco Meteor spam that banned it last gen, and not much can take hits from it. Pair it with Magnezone and its counters get reduced to...well not many. Tough to decide because he makes the game so much fun :D

Anyways that's what I'm thinking for now, hope the server comes back up soon, I want that check mark! lol
 
ensoriki said:
Get darkrai,inconsistent & shaymin out of there.

Have Deoxys-A,Doryuuza & manaphy up for suspects in round 2.
I Q_Q at laddering at one point I made it to those precious 1300's...for like a round Q_Q....then I got smahed back down into oblivion from octillery and my teams never recovered.
Oh well.
Click to expand...

Yes, but you might as well throw in Deoxys and Manaphy in now as well. Deoxys in the right hands is a nuke that pretty much 1-2 hit koes EVERYTHING and just because people suck at prediction using it, despite the TREMENDOUS help it gets from Team Viewer to form those predictions, that doesn't mean it isn't any less powerful or broken. Manaphy is a bulky rain that is honestly only held in place by one poke (Nattorei) and once he's gone, Manaphy and Rain will often wash you away EASY.
 
Fluffy Otters said:
Nasty Plot Life Orb Roost? But then, Choice Scarf Tyranitar is (I think) virtually nonexistant now considering it is still pwned by Mach Punchers and Scizor; Deoxys-A, Darkrai, and Shaymin-S out speed regardless, Wobbuffet can handle Scarf easy, GARCHOMP exists again, etc. I think it is more safe to use Nasty Plot Mew than before (once Darkrai and peeps are down) because it's number one counter Spiritomb (lol, Deoxy's also best counter, Spiritomb is amazing at taking out offensive psychics) is rarely seen and even then it might Baton Pass and it might not, considering Mew's extreme bulk.

And SCREEN/STALL Mew is BULKY. Dude, the thing is nearly impossible to kill, I know because I calculated a whole bunch of stats for it to support why Mew was one of the most threatening but oddly less used pokes.
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Nope stall mew i mean he laugh at ttar if the first turn he doesnt miss or Ttar use Pulse. Even without screens this thing s just insane
 
XienZo said:
FYI, Burungeru is REALLY common, and Vaporeon and Suicune are found anywhere BUT rain teams...
Click to expand...

Buru can't really do anything to an octo, especially once it's set up, and I have only seen 1 or 2 vaporeons on a non rain team, suicune is just rare to begin with. Even still, if you see your opponent has one of these three pokemon, make it a priority to remove them and then octo is free and clear.
 
Deo-A/N/S: All brutal. A Is obviously ridiculously strong and has like 2 counters (Metagross, Jirachi). Extremespeed limits its counters to very few and makes it really awesome late game. N is also uber because with the extra bulky actually survives some weaker priority hits and becomes arguably more of a pain in the ass. The lesser attack stats don't really matter when you take into account it's cleaning late game when everything is weakened so yeah. S makes it stupidly easy to lay down hazards, especially with Magic Coat, allowing it to be pretty much every lead. It makes it unfair for that reason, turning every game into a speed tie involving two Deo-S.
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And even then, if it happens to have Hp Fire, it will 2 hit ko and OHKO in the Sun on the switch in. If Jirachi isn't Scarf, he's dead meat so that mainly leaves Metagross vrs those without Hp Fire. Or even Shadow Ball can do a ton of damage and if it has other damage/spikes, they'll be 2 hit koed. But most fortunately (for the steels) carry Icebeam (not so fortunate for Latis, Garchomp, Dragonite, etc. Dragonite that doesn't have special defense has a chance of being ohkoed even with Multi-Scale and it sure won't like Psycho Boost either if Multi-Scale isn't active)
 
Deoxys a might 1-2 HKO many but psycho boost isnt as broken insane OMG as everyone point it to be. To be exact, stall mew (dude i love this bitch) isnt 2HKO factoring SR and can heal off the damage. Non orb superpower has chance to not OHKO bliss too. So boost power isnt exactly why hes broken
If someone reason his brokeness its going to be his mixed stats and movepool although movepool argument is pointless seeing most just use same move over and over again.
(ES Super T bolt or Ball Boost) AND ES isnt as powerul as we thought off to sadly.
 
Fluffy Otters said:
Yeah, but you were saying something about Mew ohkoing Tyranitar, not walling it (which is also very fun).
Click to expand...

I havent said a thing about mew OHKO ttar. SINCE Its plain impossible.
Second im proud to say im the people that use stall mew the most among many players so im not going to talk about other set i havent tried.

I only say that as offensively minded counter, Shinboraa do well against octilerry if we use the synchro toxic reflect tactics against it

to be more exact
PS roost and then 2 more slot.(PS roost is usualy used on Shin not on mew)
I dunno what its(shin's following the PS pass it is important to note) item will be but mew can actualy beat BOTH bandtar and scarftar(With Burn seeing band is outsped while scarf dont 2HKO with crunch at full health making mew a bit shaky counter more of an check and crippler) while shinpora cant beat ttar reliable which is a plus
But as an offensively(to toxic tillery) minded COUNTER he(CMShin seeing its mentioned that he boost faster than lerry) work well in paper

Sorry for confusing
 
JSND said:
I havent said a thing about mew OHKO ttar. SINCE Its plain impossible.
Second im proud to say im the people that use stall mew the most among many players so im not going to talk about other set i havent tried.

I only say that as offensively minded counter, Shinboraa do well against octilerry if we use the synchro toxic reflect tactics against it

to be more exact
PS roost and then 2 more slot.(PS roost is usualy used on Shin not on mew)
I dunno what its(shin's following the PS pass it is important to note) item will be but mew can actualy beat BOTH bandtar and scarftar(With Burn seeing band is outsped while scarf dont 2HKO with crunch at full health making mew a bit shaky counter more of an check and crippler) while shinpora cant beat ttar reliable which is a plus
But as an offensively(to toxic tillery) minded COUNTER he(CMShin seeing its mentioned that he boost faster than lerry) work well in paper

Sorry for confusing
Click to expand...

+2 LIFE ORB AURA SPHERE MEW TO MAX HP/MAX SDEF TYRANITAR:100.99-118.81% IN SANDSTORM. It sure as hell is if you're running an offensive variant. But Stall Mew can win but Adamant Band Tar is fairly strong with Crunch, but that just begs a horse to come in so that is dangerous.
 
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