NU Discussion Thread (Mark II)

[Al_Alchemist]

...It's the only pokemon in the entire tier that learns Nasty Plot AND Agility AND Baton Pass.

Actually Plulse and Aipom are both also able to learn all three moves (Nasty Plot, Agility, Baton Pass) as well. However, Plulse is just a worse Minun in terms of Baton Passing skills.

Aipom on the other hand, while it has much worse defensive stats, and would likely not survive any decent offensive Pokemon's STAB attack, has something that only 4 (give or take) pokemon in the whole game can boast, Taunt + the aforementioned moves above. While this might not be that amazing on a one pokemon baton pass chain (not a fan of that strategy anyway), it is definitely an excellent move in a full fledged baton pass team. However, Gligar is probably better for that job either way (whom has all of those moves, except replacing Nasty Plot with Swords Dance), but if you really want a Special-Oriented receiver in a Baton Pass chain, then Aipom could be considered as a Baton Passer.

Earthquake is pretty rare in NU...

What?! I'm sorry, but this statement is completely wrong. EQ is very common in NU, I mean the #1 used Pokemon in May was Sandslash for example. I doubt you'd see that many Sandslashes running around without EQ. Tauros, Gligar, Solrock, Quagsire, Nidoqueen, Gastrodon, etc.. are all pretty common EQ users as well.

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I've also learned how devastating Pure Rain Dance and Sunny Day teams can be in NU, Scarf Typhlosion with Eruption in the sun is crazy as anything that does not resist it is OHKO'd or 2HKO'd, usually, even if they do. Not to mention it doesn't exactly always go down in one hit. And if you have ever battled a Rain Dance team you know how powerful late game Gorebyss can be, if it gets Rain Dance up, that usually means game over. If any Pokemon were to be suspects at the moment, I would vote those two as they simply destroy almost, if not all, of the entire metagame. It's not even that hard to get the weather up at all either. (Typhlosion doesn't even need the sun to be devastating too).

I myself have made a Sunny Day team that completely destroyed teams and rocketed me to the top of the leaderboards in NU. Pure weather teams are so offensively destructive and fast paced they make LC look like stall wars. Almost all of my battles have ended at around 15-20 turns or (usually) under. While there are some Pokemon that can kick some serious Sunny Day / Rain Dance pokemon ass, they can usually only take out 1-2 Pokemon at most before being taken out, against an experienced weather team, and most normal teams only carry 1 to 2 of those guys, leaving the rest of the team to be trampled by the remaining sweepers.

These pokemon, while unreasonably powerful for NU are rarely used in higher tiers because of them usually only appearing on Sunny Day or Rain Dance teams. This keeps their usage down, but still devastating even in higher tiers, while in NU, dare I say, broken?

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One more thing, I'm not going to say any names, but could all the people whom are senselessly arguing on this thread stop. Not only are you making a fool out of yourselves, but you are giving everyone an eyesore and turning this thread into a joke. Take it to PMs or something please, just keep this thread only about NU please :(. I'm sure we would all appreciate that.

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Edit:

Still, it's not worth running Magnet Rise.

Lol yeah, that's probably not a good idea anyway ;). But yeah, Aipom probably isn't suited for a one pokemon baton passer, I was referring to a chain, and yeah his defenses do suck :P.

 

[PK Gaming]

Meh, I wouldn't run Aipom simply because it can't take a hit. I'm serious, those defenses are god awful, they are simply terrible. Sure it has taunt, but what exactly are you going to taunt anyway? If I see an Ambipom I'm attacking it, no question's asked. Besides, I was reffering to Minun being a good single boosting passer.

I wanna say my bad for the EQ but no... I guess that was pretty retarded. Still, it's not worth running Magnet Rise.

 

[shrang]

Why are we considering AIPOM?! That piece of crap doesn't even have Technician. There's a reason Persian isn't used as much in UU, it's because Ambipom exists.

EDIT:

I've also learned how devastating Pure Rain Dance and Sunny Day teams can be in NU, Scarf Typhlosion with Eruption in the sun is crazy as anything that does not resist it is OHKO'd or 2HKO'd, usually, even if they do. Not to mention it doesn't exactly always go down in one hit. And if you have ever battled a Rain Dance team you know how powerful late game Gorebyss can be, if it gets Rain Dance up, that usually means game over. If any Pokemon were to be suspects at the moment, I would vote those two as they simply destroy almost, if not all, of the entire metagame. It's not even that hard to get the weather up at all either. (Typhlosion doesn't even need the sun to be devastating too).

I myself have made a Sunny Day team that completely destroyed teams and rocketed me to the top of the leaderboards in NU. Pure weather teams are so offensively destructive and fast paced they make LC look like stall wars. Almost all of my battles have ended at around 15-20 turns or (usually) under. While there are some Pokemon that can kick some serious Sunny Day / Rain Dance pokemon ass, they can usually only take out 1-2 Pokemon at most before being taken out, against an experienced weather team, and most normal teams only carry 1 to 2 of those guys, leaving the rest of the team to be trampled by the remaining sweepers.

Please don't bring this up. We've had enough bullshit of "BAN DAMP ROCK" in UU already. Thanks for your cooperation!!

 

[Mazaki Anzu]

Any one try phione? It's got decent stats (80 on all) good typing, a vast move pool and a great ability. I use it in rain dance teams since it can pretty much just use rest as a healing move and you can run something like rest/surf/grass knot/ hp electric, ice beam or *insert coverage move here*

I've used rain dance/waterfall/u-turn/rest Phione before in standard AKA OU and NU

It's a pretty cool guy, but you have to increase one defense more than the another one, for example give him 220 Spc def and 150 Def (It's just an example, I don't remember exactly the EVs)

I give him Waterfall because of Blissey (OU) and, in an extent, to hit harder special walls that may try to come in, also to increase U-turn's power a bit.

 

[Raikaria]

Last thing I remember doing in NU forums was saying that Dodrio owned 99.9% of that failed metagame, when Dodrio usage was not high.

Oh, the irony.

Just popping in to defend the three-headed bird.

Well, Dodrio DID own 99% of the metagame. The March 2010 stats show that the most used Flying resist in the teir was Manetric, at 23rd, with 6.81% useage [Which, in a teir as centralised as Nu, is low]. At that point, Dodrio was 76th, below things like Roselia, and Bastoodon, with 1.47% of useage.

Then, people realised that the meta was flying-weak. I couldn't find stats for April, but in May, Dodrio has raised all the way to 38th, with 5.82% of useage, and the teir is far less centralised as of that time, with only a single pokemon having more than 20% of useage, instead of 7. Gaining that much ground as the teir de-centralises is a feat, especially when the likes of Manetric and Magneton also gain a massive useage boost, both pokemon that Resist flying, and either outspeed, or can shrug off every move Dodrio has.

Then, people started to use things like mid-game Gligar more often, with Steath Rock.

While they were around before, their useage really spiked, from 59% to 70% of Gligars, although, this wasn't utterly Dodrio's fault, blame things like SpecsZard's STAB Air Slashes ruining the whole teir, especially when most defensive NU pokemon are physically defensive. We have no Blissey of NU.

Dodrio was an anti-meta pokemon. Just like Porygon2 is anti-meta in OU... and once people realised this, Dodrio's use spiked, even as the natural changes in the metagame turned against it.

 

[Aeolian]

Hmm i think the only thing i can really say about NU is that Regigigas doesnt belong in it. UU maybe more so.

Simply because of its defences.

So what if its ability chops its attack and speed in half when its defences and HP are off the scale.
Plus when you can easily just twave and confuse away..
Even worse with swagger and psych up.

Id say it needs revising for NU..

 

[wavedash]

First of all, there is no revising.

Second, it has no recovery, the basic necessity of every wall.

 

[Aeolian]

Leftovers is all the recovery it needs.
i believe it also has rest yes?

 

[Class]

It does not.

 

[Aeolian]

It does not.

ooo so it hasnt D:
sleep talk but no rest..
even so leftovers is enough.

if you really wana take it higher than you can utilize drain punch but again it depends on the move set.

 

[MegaKick]

The problem with regigigas is I send in medicham/primeape/hitmonchan. And leftovers is not all he needs, he's probebly gonna be 3hkoed by any decent neutral attacks. And if he has sub/t-wave/confuse ray/return, magneton can come in and start charge beaming, then outspeed and kill your whole team is sandslash is dead (yes i run charge beam on scarfmagneton, it rocks, sue me). Plus, iirc, drifblim fell so it turns regi into complete setup bait resisting it's amazing attacks of return and earthquake.

 

[wavedash]

Leftovers is all the recovery it needs.

This kind of made me laugh

 

[PK Gaming]

The problem with regigigas is I send in medicham/primeape/hitmonchan. And leftovers is not all he needs, he's probebly gonna be 3hkoed by any decent neutral attacks. And if he has sub/t-wave/confuse ray/return, magneton can come in and start charge beaming, then outspeed and kill your whole team is sandslash is dead (yes i run charge beam on scarfmagneton, it rocks, sue me). Plus, iirc, drifblim fell so it turns regi into complete setup bait resisting it's amazing attacks of return and earthquake.

Regigigas has enough bulk to survive CC and Twave your Primeape, thus rendering it utterly useless. It's hard to outright switch into Regigigas because of Twave / Sub.

Really it's not broken, but once it gets going it's really hard to stop.
And come on, charge beam on Choice Scarfed Magneton... really!

Edit: But you just said he should not be in NU...

 

[Aeolian]

and thats my point..

 

[EpicTurtle]

Regigigas would belong in UU if there wern't so much fighting types and CC running around crazily ...

 

[Raikaria]

The thing with Regigigas, is, sure, it's hrd to stop one it gets going... but... that takes ages, and before then, it's easy to stop.

How?

1: Send in a fighting-type. Unless parahax strikes, Regigias has to switch out, resetting Slow Start
2: Toxic = dead Regigias
3: Burn
4: Paralysation
5: Ghost types [If you're carrying T-Wave and Confuse Ray to stall, you've probobly got Return, and maybe Drain Punch to heal...]
6: Just keep hitting it hard

5 turns is plenty of time to do any of these.

Hmm, Charge Beam Scarfneton... sounds decent...

 

[Benlisted]

The thing with Regigigas, is, sure, it's hrd to stop one it gets going... but... that takes ages, and before then, it's easy to stop.

How?

1: Send in a fighting-type. Unless parahax strikes, Regigias has to switch out, resetting Slow Start
2: Toxic = dead Regigias
3: Burn
4: Paralysation
5: Ghost types [If you're carrying T-Wave and Confuse Ray to stall, you've probobly got Return, and maybe Drain Punch to heal...]
6: Just keep hitting it hard

5 turns is plenty of time to do any of these.

Hmm, Charge Beam Scarfneton... sounds decent...

There's always the good old phaze method too, which completely screws the golem over. I've seen some amazing things done with him in doubles, but never in singles play tbh.

 

[PK Gaming]

The thing with Regigigas, is, sure, it's hrd to stop one it gets going... but... that takes ages, and before then, it's easy to stop.

How?

1: Send in a fighting-type. Unless parahax strikes, Regigias has to switch out, resetting Slow Start
2: Toxic = dead Regigias
3: Burn
4: Paralysation
5: Ghost types [If you're carrying T-Wave and Confuse Ray to stall, you've probobly got Return, and maybe Drain Punch to heal...]
6: Just keep hitting it hard

5 turns is plenty of time to do any of these.

Hmm, Charge Beam Scarfneton... sounds decent...

1. You have to send it on Regigigas after a revenge kill. Switching them DIRECTLY into Regigigas is a no-no. Substitute or Thunderwave make them useless.
2. That's why it all good Regigigas players run substitute. It's somewhat difficult to Toxic it because it's first move (unless if it's pressured by something) is always going to be substitute)
3.Same as the above really.
4.Same as the above.
5.Whore Tank says hi. And really, they can't switch in. Haunter doesn't like being Thunder Waved. Dusclops is the only switchin because he's got Seismic Toss to break subs and is just stall machine.
*Standard Regigigas moveset should be: Return, Substitute, Thunder Wave, Confuse Ray
6. Yup.

CS Charge Beam ton sounds awful... I mean it's incrediibly weak first of all, and it takes a ridiculous amount of time to setup AND it's unreliable. Charge Beam has a 64% chance of being pulled off the first time. (That's not to bad) but the consequitive increases are much lower. (takin in accuracy and chance of boost in account)

Edit: Not mention that 1+ Charge Beam is weaker than 0+Thunderbolt and 2+ Charge Beam only does slightly more than 0+ Thunderbolt. Over the course of 3 Thunderbolts I'm going more damage than 3 Charge Beam's. (That is, if it actually hits AND gets the SpA increase)

Choice Scarf Charge Beam is useless.

Regigigas would belong in UU if there wern't so much fighting types and CC running around crazily ...

Err... how does that work. UU Pokemon are determined by their usages in UU, not NU. Even if Regigigas was broken in NU (which he's not) he would stick in NU, since it's not standardized by Smogon yet.

 

[xGinx]

Regigigas should be NU, IMO. Anyone ever heard of the Choice Specs regigigas? Anyone have success with it? Personally, I haven't...doesn't have any STAB Normal special move.

 

[PK Gaming]

Should? There is no should. It's either is, or isn't. Sorry, but that's the way it works. Regigigas has like an amazing special movepool... but no STAB and poor special attack (base 80) make Choice Specs kinda bad on Regigigas.

 

[wavedash]

*Standard Regigigas moveset should be: Return, Substitute, Thunder Wave, Confuse Ray

I dunno about standard, but definitely for a late-game sweeper after Haunter, Drifblim, and the odd Dusclops are gone.

 

[Leman]

And you have to remove every bulky Ground, Rock, Magneton, anything with Substitute, anything with Encore, anything with Taunt, and all Fighting types and then pray you don't get statused while you stall for 5 turns, where you cannot switch, and after that you can still get revenged buy anything more than Base 100 Spd. Why would you go through all that trouble, when there are so many better, easier to set up just as powerful sweepers out there? Ex, after two Dragon Dances Charizard gets 534 Atk and 656 Spd, compared to 460 Atk and 236 after five. And Charizard can be a threat of the bat too, if need be.

 

[M BLADE]

Extending to here:
I rather use Lickilicky over Regigigas. It's also bulky as hell, gets Wish, and has that crazy movepool (and it isn't hampered by the ability: though Lickilicky ones are nearly useless).
It doesn't learn Thunder Wave though.
Strenght issues can be remedied with Curse, Swords Dance or Belly Drum (yea good luck with this one).

It's also a very good fighting lure, surviving nearly anything if you invest EVs on defense/HP and Countering them. Using Wish as your opponent switches a fighting poke in and Counter said poke=priceless.

 

[Pancham]

Extending to here:
I rather use Lickilicky over Regigigas. It's also bulky as hell, gets Wish, and has that crazy movepool (and it isn't hampered by the ability: though Lickilicky ones are nearly useless).
It doesn't learn Thunder Wave though.
Strenght issues can be remedied with Curse, Swords Dance or Belly Drum (yea good luck with this one).

Lickilicky is also the only poke with STAB Explosion, if I recall correctly.

 

[SHUCKLE MAN]

I agree with some others about Regigigas. Ignore it's ability. Forget about the fact that its Attack doubles after a number of turns.

Just think of it as a Pokemon with 110/110/110 defenses, and use it accordingly. Its ability is just an added bonus, in the extremely rare occurance that it does manage to stay in battle for so long.