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Open Setup Classic Mafia - Game Thread

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apricity said:
Hey Tommy I think it’s a good idea not to go WW hunting until we see hostile kills do you think :)
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I am not trying to werewolf hunt but also I don't really believe its too possible to do so anyways rn, if werewolf claimed I wouldn't even vote them rn though, werewolf is a town ally especially early game as I said before

Give we have already lost our doctor the werewolf should be shooting with us, and given that I broke down werewolf shooting strategy for them already it could generally be either someone who knows what they are doing or someone who doesn't and listened to me so I don't really think it offers much insight to look into that kill even if I wanted to, beyond the fact I am fairly sure that was the werewolf kill
 
I don’t understand, for example, the world in which I win the game with all four of Evie, ItsScaryCary, Phoopes, and AirC alive

I can’t even begin to understand how that is possible

And so I think while it is important to vote out mafia it is also important to vote out people who will not be voting mafia because they are not playing the game

If we can get this list down to like, two, I can see a vision

But we cannot, PHYSICALLY cannot, win a game with these hypothetical teammates
 
liquidrelief said:
ok what was your logic in killing someone who turned out to be a doctor
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I didn't know they were doctor, I voted someone who has been serial afk for many games for a long time now and after the alst game when people were upset said they would reflect and stop signing up if they didn't want to play, then signed up again and once again didn't play

Obviously I don't know peoples roles if they haven't claimed and i DEFINITELY dont know someone's role if they havent even posted
 
apricity said:
I don’t understand, for example, the world in which I win the game with all four of Evie, ItsScaryCary, Phoopes, and AirC alive

I can’t even begin to understand how that is possible

And so I think while it is important to vote out mafia it is also important to vote out people who will not be voting mafia because they are not playing the game

If we can get this list down to like, two, I can see a vision

But we cannot, PHYSICALLY cannot, win a game with these hypothetical teammates
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i really agree with this
 
Tommy said:
I didn't know they were doctor, I voted someone who has been serial afk for many games for a long time now and after the alst game when people were upset said they would reflect and stop signing up if they didn't want to play, then signed up again and once again didn't play

Obviously I don't know peoples roles if they haven't claimed and i DEFINITELY dont know someone's role if they havent even posted
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you could have retracted your vote after he posted
 
Pulsar is she/her woman btw, but also she started posting at like 2am for me after I was in the pub on Saturday night so gg that wasn't happening, she also could've just claimed she was doctor and lived that's not on me

I know this is your first time, but like obviously I don't have tmi on a player as town, so I need to see them post to get a real read on them, I am doing my best to get rid of infinitely poe players because that is probably the best optimal town strategy in a dead game, get rid of the forever afks and then hope the active players mid to late game can make a comeback (or mafia is afk), but the comeback is never possible if you start voting active players
 
Tommy said:
Can we do actual smogon infractinos that would be big?>

<snip>

So yeah sorry again I am aware I am a lot more negative than I usually am I just am a bit emotionally upset and I know I am not going to be able to hold myself in check as well as last game and previous other ones if I do get invested with all the afkness becaus I am so far beyond fed up with it
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cut out the parts that i dont think i need to reply to bc like i said, i understand your pov and even tho i'm upset it's more about having nobody around at dl and not at you choosing your afk that resulted in a doc going over.

i like the idea of smogon infracts for afking in games genuinely. smth to bring up after this game ends in mod/approver chat prob.

re: being negative - negativity is fine, it progresses the game state, see hal's talk abt voting inactives. but like, what isn't going to help is "game's over already gg" on d1 or giving up on d2 yknow. we can still win this game, even if it'll be difficult down a doctor and a vt, let's go for the town fourpeat and not just toss the towel in. the role list is still prob town favored even w/o a doc. i want to make this happen.
 
apricity said:
Hope you had fun, wish I could have been there.

Let’s talk about the game — you haven’t given a non-mechanical opinion in this day 2 yet that I’ve seen.
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Fwiw I did give a bit at eod1 but I ack that that was mostly surface level and I did not have a lot of time to spend on it

1: a fairy - A lot of emotion in her posts which I feel like is a very new thing for early game fairy? But even given that I don't think she gave any reads the entire time despite wanting stuff to happen. It seems pretty clear that she very much wanted to change the day 1 vote but didn't suggest who to change it to and didn't have people online who would change it. Which on one hand reflects well in retrospect because pulsar flipped Town Doctor but on the other hand I don't really understand why she would have a strong opinion here without having an alternate target given that pulsar was very much a null slot.

2: ItsScaryCary - nothing

3: Tommy - His analysis of werewolf gameplay at the beginning is very town-coded. If he is coming from a mafia perspective he is basically just making the game harder for himself and it wasn't like he would trigger any red flags by not saying that. So I'll find it very hard to believe that he's mafia until we get mech stuff or really tinfoily. The rest of his content has been fine. There of course is the potential that he is the wolf but I don't think it's worthwhile to read for that yet so for now I'm trusting him.

4: genisu - Read this with the acknowledgement that there is a bit of OMGUS in here. When I suggested a massclaim (this was just me baiting responses btw I don't want an actual massclaim) he was suprisingly open to massclaim which raised some red flags for me. I feel like he was pretty aggressive and presumptuous in reacting both to DBD and to me and it feels like his reads aren't based off any real substance to me. He is mad about the pulsar vote but also directly contributed to it happening himself. I get he couldn't be on at deadline and I'm not saying pulsar is innocent in that but he still parked his vote there which eventually led to the scenario where there was nothing that could change the vote.

6: AirC - basically nothing

7: Evie - I didn't catch this first time I was reading through but I am really interested to know why she is okay with massclaiming but not with hypoclaiming? (#166). I also think calling for town pretty lady not to be used is kinda weird? I feel like the general rule is that using your role is always going to benefit town more even if you do end up blocking a town PR, because it gives credence to your claim later on. There's a scenario where this is a Werewolf POV because she wants to use the 1-shot werewolf block later on to claim town pretty lady who idled at the beginning. And even outside of that scenario there's also the mafia angle where the kill being blocked is one of the worst things that could happen to them.

8: Celever - I don't really see anything notable, he has only posted mechanical stuff so far and is being standard Celever, none of it raises red or green flags for me.

9: phoopes - Essentially nothing. I would like to point out that #301 strongly implies that mafia performed the kill and ignores the possibility that it could've been werewolf which raises red flags to me as a potential perspective slip.

10: liquidrelief - Zeroing in on Tommy gives not-coached but I also think that given the activity level of this game the activity level in mafia chat could be similar. I think going after Tommy for his vote is misguided but not malicious. I'd mostly call them a null slot since that's their only content so far.

11: Dead by Daylight - As I said before I like his suggestion of hypoclaiming. I'm curious to hear from people more experienced than I am on how good hypoclaiming is for town vs how much info it gives to a mafia perspective because that would shape how much weight can go into that read. I think his approach to day 1 with casting some votes to try and apply some pressure is fine and I think his reactions to genisu and a fairy pushing on him is fine so overall I think he is fine at the moment.

14: apricity - I feel like your approach to today is good enough. The voting off inactives thing is tough to judge because one on hand, we do need to get rid of the inactives, on the other hand, doing votes that no one particularly cares about is easily manipulable by mafia. I would like to have some more rhyme or reason to it than just "we need to get out the inactives" but it's obviously very hard to narrow anything down when they are, in fact, inactive. I see you townread Celever and fairy but I would like to hear more on those reads since all you've said on them so far is that those are your reads. I'm also curious if you have a scumread on anyone who's active even if your priority is still voting off inactives. I'll have a better read on you if you can give some more content to your own reads.

15: Ehmcee - nothing
 
I baked my opinions on AFK votes into the hal section but for obvious reasons it would be much better if the people who are not posting came back and at least gave us something. I feel like while afk votes may be necessary it's also just a 95% chance that we vote out 3 afk townies and afk mafia just slip through the cracks somehow
 
joey said:
1: a fairy - A lot of emotion in her posts which I feel like is a very new thing for early game fairy? But even given that I don't think she gave any reads the entire time despite wanting stuff to happen. It seems pretty clear that she very much wanted to change the day 1 vote but didn't suggest who to change it to and didn't have people online who would change it. Which on one hand reflects well in retrospect because pulsar flipped Town Doctor but on the other hand I don't really understand why she would have a strong opinion here without having an alternate target given that pulsar was very much a null slot.
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This is so awful
joey said:
8: Celever - I don't really see anything notable, he has only posted mechanical stuff so far and is being standard Celever, none of it raises red or green flags for me.
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This is so awful
joey said:
14: apricity - I feel like your approach to today is good enough. The voting off inactives thing is tough to judge because one on hand, we do need to get rid of the inactives, on the other hand, doing votes that no one particularly cares about is easily manipulable by mafia. I would like to have some more rhyme or reason to it than just "we need to get out the inactives" but it's obviously very hard to narrow anything down when they are, in fact, inactive. I see you townread Celever and fairy but I would like to hear more on those reads since all you've said on them so far is that those are your reads. I'm also curious if you have a scumread on anyone who's active even if your priority is still voting off inactives. I'll have a better read on you if you can give some more content to your own reads.
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No.
 
joey said:
11: Dead by Daylight - As I said before I like his suggestion of hypoclaiming. I'm curious to hear from people more experienced than I am on how good hypoclaiming is for town vs how much info it gives to a mafia perspective because that would shape how much weight can go into that read. I think his approach to day 1 with casting some votes to try and apply some pressure is fine and I think his reactions to genisu and a fairy pushing on him is fine so overall I think he is fine at the moment.
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This is actually somehow worse than the previous quotes
 
my consolidated reads list for anyone except hal to look at:

town
Tommy
Dead by Daylight

apricity
Celever
liquidrelief
AirC
ItsScaryCary
Ehmcee

phoopes
genisu
a fairy
Evie
scum

town
Evie
a fairy
genisu
phoopes

Ehmcee
ItsScaryCary
AirC
liquidrelief
Celever
apricity

Dead by Daylight
Tommy
scum
 
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