Ladder ORAS Monotype Discussion

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Just wanted to say that I would like to see Zard x banned from flying and Mega Altaria globally banned. I'm seeing a lot of arguments for the bans and not many arguments against which suggests that most people agree with me.

I also wanted to point out that flying would still have access to Mega Gyarados, Mega Charizard Y and Mega Aerodactyl (which isnt as viable but still worth a mention). These are 2 excellent megas and 1 decent mega, so I wouldn't be too worried about flying becoming a weak type, especially considering it is one of the most used types at the moment. I expect flying to remain a strong type despite the bans since it still has access to many secondary typings and 3 good megas.
 
Mega Gyarados is very good as well, as it does the same thing, just in a different way, Flying would not be weakened severely enough that Zapdos would be necessary. PK Kaiser's team, which every knows you know the sample team one, this one: http://monotypeps.weebly.com/pk-kaisers-balanced-flying.html would be completely unaffected and would gain a possible new member who would be better than Mandibuzz at its job. I know it would weaken Flying, but really, Flying just wouldn't have as much choice...Mega Gyarados is just as effective as the other two, just for some reason people think it's less notable, it does the exact same thing, in actually a more beneficial manner than Mega Altaria in my experience. So, what is the problem, I know Mega Charizard is amazing on Flying and it would hamper some teams, but really, you have to change your team to comply with the metagame, by using a different Mega that does the same job in most cases. Really you change the coverage moves, then copy and paste Mega Gyarados in there not so hard...

tl;dr It has been proven that you can make a very effective team in this meta with Mega Gyarados, why do we need to bring back something like Zapdos.
 
Another point supporting the Zapdos ban to be kept is that while removing two megas in Zard X and Altaria would nerf Flyings offensive core, the defensive core would be relatively unaffected. Bringing back Zapdos would only reinstate the notorious stall flying teams that were so problematic for many types.
 
Just to keep you guys in the loop, what we're looking at rn is definitely Flying with the two extremely strong megas in Zard X / Altaria. However Hoopa and perhaps more relevantly Hoopa-Unbound come out in a few hours(apparently) and noone really knows how this is going to affect Monotype. Will those absurd attacking stats push it over the edge or will that frankly terrible physical bulk, ordinary Speed tier and very bland defensive typing keep it manageable? For now we've decided to wait on it and see how it does before making any decisions regarding suspects / future bans, so enjoy Hoopa, try it out and see how it fares and share your opinions here! Also feel free to share any more thoughts on Flying too~
 
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/monotype-250652973

I'm just putting this replay here as an elaboration to what I stated about the mono attacking sets being extremely broken. You have a mon like slowbro who is very good at hindering set up sweepers with T-Wave and scald burns. Altaria just sets itself apart from other sweepers because heal bell makes mons like slowbro who are usually good at checking this stuff just absolute set up bait. And while balanced psychic is an extremely strong type in monotype....Mega altaria single handedly ripped it to shreds and sent that dude packing.

The other sets are good, but I truly believe they are no where near as potent as the mono attacking sets. The mono attacking sets are simply just too much to handle for balance types and they simply just make them look extremely small when faced off against mega alt.

Yeah I understand that you are looking at it from a flying perspective and while it functions extremely well on both, I think it does perform a bit better for dragon so I really hope both are taken into consideration. Its not like the outcome of that replay would've been any different if it was on flying as well.

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/monotype-250671288 lololololol
 
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So hoopa-U is upon us at last... I've been using it on psychic, and have seen it on dark alot. Psyhic mirror matches are really dumb now, since theyt end in a scarf control war between the hoopa and victini both players invariably have, unless one person is caeless enough to get hoppa t waved by a full health slowbro. It's annoying to say the least. I'm tempted to use weakness policy metagross like I used to even, but meboth my medicham and mega gardevoir team managed to hold thei My ghost team on the other hand, got cast aside, since i don't carry dbnd aggresively enough to stop it, and it's scarfed special bulk is enough to switch into shadow ball or dracometeor latias and start attacking with a gurantee that nothing else on either team can tank the hit. Dragon and especially ground can play both these types pretty well atm t however. I found today to be pretty boring all things told, although the meta hasn't descended to an offensive cf... yet.

The most imporant thing to look at hoopa is how it has just enough physical bulk (a smidge above gardevoir) to live a LO bisharp suckerpunch unboosted, mega scizor's bullet punch and dragonite's band espeed. Although with2 turns of stealth rock damage it won't live. Still you can't trade any of these pokemon in the matchup with psychic so lightly, so hoopa can perform at the level of a much more broken mon than it is if they do not SR before it's in a position to spam drain punch o,knock off, or n hyper fury. I ha. I had too much fun abusing it's neutral coverage to abuse it's wide movepool, but it should be equally effective.
 
I've been using Hoopa-Unbound on Dark, and it is pretty good. I'm using a Scarf set with Psyshock / Hyperspace Fury / Drain Punch / Destiny Bond. This mixed set works great, Drain Punch grants it some coverage while at the same time regaining some HP. Destiny Bond is fun because it really does catch a lot of people off guard. You can also put Trick over Destiny Bond if you want to break walls.

I've seen some Assault Vest sets which I suppose could work as well. However I'm not really sure about running anything other than Scarf just because of how slow it is. It has a really bar defensive type and its Defense stat is horrid. But I think it works pretty well and I expect to see it a lot.
 
I've seen Hoopa U on dark type mono teams, and it gives them a much needed power. However, I would like to add that Hoopa U on Psychic is just too powerful.

EDIT : Okay maybe I just suffered too many loses by Hoopa U on psychic type mono teams.
 
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LegendBoy said:
I've seen Hoopa U on dark type mono teams, and it gives them a much needed power. However, I would like to add that Hoopa U on Psychic is just too powerful.
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Do you have some replays or reasons why Hoopa-U is too powerful on psychic teams?

That goes for everyone! It'd be great to see some replays of Hoopa teams in action (whether you're using it or against it). This can help us get a sense for how it fares in the overall metagame.
 
Hello this is Barida, #ImperiumLeague but I would like to state some Major Suggestions to the Monotype Community

1) The ban of Mega Altaria and Mega Charizard-X on Flying Monotype should take place, but some would Argue this would make Flying Monotype to Cripple, this is why I believe that we should Ban
Mega Altaria and Mega Char-X First and then Unban Zapdos for Flying Monotype can obtain a reliable wall, this will allow Flying Monotype to be way more balance and allows people to use the underused Flying Megas of Charizard-Y or Mega Pidgeot, some say that the Skarmory + Zapdos core is what made Flying monotype Over powered but i would like to disagree I believe it was Zapdos+Skarmory + Charizard-X/Mega Altaria.

2) Mega Altaria should also be banned on Dragon, The only type that the Mega Altari, Dragon Dance,Heal Bell,Return/Frustration, Roost set cant touch is Steel, Poison, and Partly Grass due to Ferrothorn and Mega Venu. Dragon Monotype Carys pokmeon like Hydrageio, Kyruem-B, and Garchomp that can deal with Poison,Grass,and Steel for Mega Altaria making this Core overpowered and sadly bringing us back to are Gen 5 monotype Dragon days where it can not be beat.

3) The ban of Mega Pinisir, Now some people may laugh and giggle at me saying this but Mega Pinsir is a Monster if you ask me, Mega Pinsir does almost the exact same thing that Talonflame did and Its crazy that no one has even mention it to being Over Powered, Bug only needs a few backup pokemon in a Mega Pinsir team to make everything work. Mega Pinsir even has the power to sweep Steel.
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/monotype-249091108 This is a battle between Me and ArkenCiel (Hes a great and humble battler, if anyone needs help improving in Monotype, hes the man I would talk to) See in the start of the battle, all I really had to do is make sure everything was set up for me to beat his team with Mega Pinsir (Kaiser screaming at me in the skype call saying I lost and im bad) but thats beyond the point, Mega Pinsir carys the ability Aerilate that boost the Normal type moves on this Pokemon by 1.3x and yeah it doesnt get the Priority that Talonflame got with BB + Galewings, Quick Attack at +2 and Aerilate is doing ALOT vs anything to be honest.

4) The ban of Genesct, this Steel/Bug monotype has been banned, then unban, then banned, then unban, to be honest if we are going to let Mega-Charizard go, were gonna have to get rid of Gensect to balance out the meta because Genesct moveset is enormous, it gets the ability Download, and to be honest, I have spoken about Genesct to many times to explain why its overpowered because, Genesct is a monster, high SPA and Attack,Big Moveset, Good Ability, Its a sweeper and its to overpowered for Monotype and makes the game unbalance.

Thank you For everyone who read through my Points. Its alot of rambling but hope you can get through it safely.^_^

Aerilate
 
I don't support unbanning Zapdos right now, and we should stop trying to predict the future by implying that Flying would be 'bad' if they lose Altarianite and Charizardite X. Maybe it would, maybe it won't. We should concentrate on the current meta, not the future one. And right now, I believe Altarianite is broken, but that is just my opinion and the council will reach a decision soon. We think it's best to wait for the metagame to adjust more, especially with the Smooth Rock ban and Hoopa/Hoopa-U release.

On a side note, I just recently began telling the other council members about Pinsirite, and it is definitely not a joke. I agree with Barida in regards of the Pinsirite and Talonflame comparison. Mega Pinsir is way too overwhelming for types like Fighting, Grass and Bug itself. Though as I said above, we think it's best to wait for those said reasons before addressing other issues.

How is everyone finding Hoopa-U/Hoopa? As scpinion stated, we are all interested in seeing replays and your thoughts. A set I enjoy most right now is the Assault Vest variant.

swag flute (Hoopa-Unbound) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Magician
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Drain Punch
- Ice Punch
- Hyperspace Fury / Knock Off
- Zen Headbutt

If you have any other interesting sets and can showcase them in action, go ahead!
 
Man, if you ban M-Pinsir and Genesect, the reign of bug is over. They are the only thing that make bug useful. I strongly disagree that M-Pinsir and Genesect would be banned.
 
LegendBoy said:
Man, if you ban M-Pinsir and Genesect, the reign of bug is over. They are the only thing that make bug useful. I strongly disagree that M-Pinsir and Genesect would be banned.
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Not True at all, replays of Royatly Rising shows that he made rank 1 on the ladder, by using a Mega Heracross team, not sure if it obtained Genesect but, Mega Pinsir is not needed for Bug to still be a Top Tier type
 
To speak a little about Hoopa-u...

I played this set in dark team:

Marocain Spirit (Hoopa-Unbound) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Magician
EVs: 252 speed/252 Atk/4 SpAtk
Jolly nature
- Drain punch
- Hyperspace Furry
- Psychic
-Gunk shot

EVs spread can be removed. I'm on mobile so I didn't calculate yet the EVs I really need for psychic to 0HKO some Poke mons.

Well I use it in Dark team because I've good combination with him.
Mandibuzz to counter U-Turn move.
M-Sableye for priority moves.

Gunk shot is used to counter Mega-Altaria. I mean as revenge killer or prediction.

Psychic is for fighting mons. I prefer psychic instead Zen Headbutt because it does more damage on Cobalion and a better accuracy.

Drain punch for have a move with I can heal a little or hurt Steel, Normal and Dark type.

Hyperspace Furry for stab. Not Knock off because Dark team is full of Knock off and I like kill Pokemons behind them sub.

One replay against bug:
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/monotype-251110715
 
Nani Man said:
I don't support unbanning Zapdos right now, and we should stop trying to predict the future by implying that Flying would be 'bad' if they lose Altarianite and Charizardite X. Maybe it would, maybe it won't. We should concentrate on the current meta, not the future one. And right now, I believe Altarianite is broken, but that is just my opinion and the council will reach a decision soon. We think it's best to wait for the metagame to adjust more, especially with the Smooth Rock ban and Hoopa/Hoopa-U release.

On a side note, I just recently began telling the other council members about Pinsirite, and it is definitely not a joke. I agree with Barida in regards of the Pinsirite and Talonflame comparison. Mega Pinsir is way too overwhelming for types like Fighting, Grass and Bug itself. Though as I said above, we think it's best to wait for those said reasons before addressing other issues.

How is everyone finding Hoopa-U/Hoopa? As scpinion stated, we are all interested in seeing replays and your thoughts. A set I enjoy most right now is the Assault Vest variant.

swag flute (Hoopa-Unbound) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Magician
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Drain Punch
- Ice Punch
- Hyperspace Fury / Knock Off
- Zen Headbutt

If you have any other interesting sets and can showcase them in action, go ahead!
Click to expand...
Do you know how long it takes us to fix the Meta, we cant sit there and let people get bored of the game, most of the mods in the mono staff are getting bored of playing monotype to, like its time for action and we must experiment but getting to the point. Zapdos is are only Special Def wall that is reliable, it can take ice hits, it helped us deal with stealth rocks, it was are electric switch ins, thundy and thundrus-t can come to a flying team and sweep the floor out of it, and by the way
2) Dragon Users are going to hate me for this and some people might call me biased but Kyruem-B Lifeorb set, Scarf Set fucks everything up def flying to. Earth Power and Ice Beam, deal withs the Skarmory/Heatran combo and everything
 
I believe Mega-Altaria should get banned. Not only does altaria have the ability to set up but it has the bulk+roost to tank attacks and then heal bell so status cannot stop the set up sweep. all this combined make altaria unbelievably overpowered and few mons can stop this behemoth.
 
We've been dicussing these bans for a while now, I feel like we should ban zard x and altaria quickly so we can move on and discuss other things. I think we should wait and see how the metagame develops from these bans before we talk about bringing zapdos back.
 
I've been lurking in the Monotype thread for a while, that's the perks of being a ghost and it's probably time to get out of the shadow and speak. I'm probably alone or maybe not but I'm not finding Monotype that entertaining (see funny, enjoyable) these days. We need a new era of changes which will turn it into something better. I'll state my opinion in two categories firstly, giving my opinion on long discussed bans/suspects and on my own I will open a new discussion about other Pokemon that may be unhealthy for the meta. Again, I don't have to remind you that this is my opinion, and I'm happy to elaborate on my thoughts if you ask to.

Current discussions:

Mega Altaria: Thanks to Gamefreak everyone's dream came true, the introduction of Mega Altaria gave us a long awaited fairy/dragon and on the top of that it got the ability Pixalate one of the -ate abilities which make everything, in my opinion, strong if paired with a Pokemon that has the normal moves and STAB to abuse it. Before getting to the set, we will have to talk about the types that it somewhat usually gives an advantage against, and these types include: Dark, Fighting, Dragon to an extent Electric and Water. It's set feature Dragon Dance, Roost, Return/Frustration, Refresh which is the only set needed to destroy most thing, fairy attacks are only resisted by Steel and Poison which can be taken care of with Fire Blast over Refresh or with Mega Altaria's team mates. In fact, on dragon teams the omnipresence of Garchomp put pressure on the types that threatens Mega Altaria, let's not forget the presence of both Hydreigon and Kyurem-Black which also can damage both types. On flying, we have the presence of Thundurus and Landorus which puts pressure on both types thanks to Thunderbolt/Focus Blast and Earthquake respectively. Due to it's ability of causing an auto win against types or sweep easily after some residual damage, I'd Suggest banishing Mega Altaria to the shadow realm where it can meet other Monotype banned Pokemon.

Mega Charizard X: A subject that got discussed many types before, it's presence on flying gives it an advantage against some types including Grass, Steel, Dark. It is able to run different sets, including: Bulky DD, Will O Wisp-Roost, Offensive DD. As I have more knowledge about dark, I am aware that Will-o-Wisp Zard can 6-0 dark removing Hydreigon factor which is checked by Togekiss/Articuno. I don't really have something other to add other than already mentioned stuff, but to be honest? I'm neutral on Mega Zard X ban.

Genesect: The already great type called bug won another Pokemon some months ago which completes it's title of one of the best types if not the best. Bug's versatility, giving it a neutral match up against most types. Adding to that Genesect's ability to pivot thanks to a strong U-turn which can be boosted by Download giving bug many momentum opportunities while keeping speed by it's side thanks to Scarf, it can create holes in dark, psychic and grass adding Stealth Rock support which gives these types, also it has an effective coverage of Energy Ball, Thunderbolt, Flamethrower, Ice Beam which can sweep easily late game when it's partner weakened the team enough. I still don't know why was Skymin banned but not this but ok. I'm with banning Genesect from Monotype.

Mega Sableye: Long debate happened around Mega Sableye, it got prankster Will-o-Wisp before mega evolving pairing that with it's bulk after mega evolving and amazing hazard control with Magic Bounce, Mega Sableye can wall, weaken or even sweep a large portion of teams. It got the coverage on both Dark and Ghost types, yes ghost users don't defend Sableye-Mega. Thanks to Tyranitar's bulk and typing and even Mandibuzz physical potential, Mega Sableye can easily weaken the opposing team after some Calm Mind and Will-O-Wisp. Meanwhile on Ghost it has better supports in Jellicent, Aegislash and Chandelure. Jellicent and Chandelure both have the ability to sponge fire attacks, and Jellicent have a plus of sponging scalds coming at Mega Sableye, while Aegislash stop fairy moves which isn't present on dark to complete Mega Sableye's utility. Without further words, I suggest sending Mega-Sableye to the shadow realm (see ban).

Suggesting Discussions:

Mega Pinsir: I was talking with Barida about Mega Pinsir impact in the Monotype metagame (guess he sniped me in posting), Thanks to it's ability Aerilate and Quick Attack/Frustration it is able to punch through teams easily. Quick Attack alone can make types such as grass, bug and fighting lose (which was one of main reasons Talonflame got banned) after a +2 which can be easily set with Mega Pinsir, it also has access to Close combat for pesky rock and steel types that dare standing in it's way it also has a base 155 Attk combined with a good speed tier which makes Frustration/Return usable in most case, even unboosted it able to take on types weak to flying easily (see grass, fighting, bug). Let's not forget it's power at +2, it is able to take easily on the odds of Mandibuzz and Slowbro which are two of the bulkiest pokemon in the metagame after rock damage, also it has the power to 2OHKO Skarmory with a resisted move which rarely a pokemon can do. I suggest discussing Pinsirite as it is unhealthy for the metagame.

Manaphy: Many users have complained about it's ability to break the most common Monotype cores but I don't see anyone posting about it. Manaphy has a 100 overall stats which makes it able to pull some great bulk and sweeping potential. It has access to Tail Glow, Ice Beam, Scald, Energy Ball, Psychic which it can abuse freely, with rain dance support this Pokemon will get cured from status adding power to it's main move, scald. It is able to take from the bulkiest core of Chansey+Porygon2 to Gliscor+Skarmory+Charizard Mega X core on flying. It doesn't have a lot of checks, it's two common checks are Ferrothorn and Venusaur-Mega which takes a chunk from rain boosted Scald and the potential of a burn. I find Manaphy unhealthy for the metagame.

Zapdos: People have been suggesting about unbanning Zapdos from flying if we take away both Mega Altaria and Mega Zard X, I find it unlikely to happen since flying can pull other megas effectively like Mega Charizard Y which is starting to show and Mega Gyarados. I disagree about unbanning Zapdos.

And with that I'm done, I might have forgot somethings and I'm pretty sure I'm going to get judged sooner or later so; bring on the hate. *drops mic*


Edit: If I was to pick between Mega Pinsir or Genesect ban, I'd pick Mega Pinsir.
 
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Dream Eater Gengar said:
I've been lurking in the Monotype thread for a while, that's the perks of being a ghost and it's probably time to get out of the shadow and speak. I'm probably alone or maybe not but I'm not finding Monotype that entertaining (see funny, enjoyable) these days. We need a new era of changes which will turn it into something better. I'll state my opinion in two categories firstly, giving my opinion on long discussed bans/suspects and on my own I will open a new discussion about other Pokemon that may be unhealthy for the meta. Again, I don't have to remind you that this is my opinion, and I'm happy to elaborate on my thoughts if you ask to.

Current discussions:

Mega Altaria: Thanks to Gamefreak everyone's dream came true, the introduction of Mega Altaria gave us a long awaited fairy/dragon and on the top of that it got the ability Pixalate one of the -ate abilities which make everything, in my opinion, strong if paired with a Pokemon that has the normal moves and STAB to abuse it. Before getting to the set, we will have to talk about the types that it somewhat usually gives an advantage against, and these types include: Dark, Fighting, Dragon to an extent Electric and Water. It's set feature Dragon Dance, Roost, Return/Frustration, Refresh which is the only set needed to destroy most thing, fairy attacks are only resisted by Steel and Poison which can be taken care of with Fire Blast over Refresh or with Mega Altaria's team mates. In fact, on dragon teams the omnipresence of Garchomp put pressure on the types that threatens Mega Altaria, let's not forget the presence of both Hydreigon and Kyurem-Black which also can damage both types. On flying, we have the presence of Thundurus and Landorus which puts pressure on both types thanks to Thunderbolt/Focus Blast and Earthquake respectively. Due to it's ability of causing an auto win against types or sweep easily after some residual damage, I'd Suggest banishing Mega Altaria to the shadow realm where it can meet other Monotype banned Pokemon.

Mega Charizard X: A subject that got discussed many types before, it's presence on flying gives it an advantage against some types including Grass, Steel, Dark. It is able to run different sets, including: Bulky DD, Will O Wisp-Roost, Offensive DD. As I have more knowledge about dark, I am aware that Will-o-Wisp Zard can 6-0 dark removing Hydreigon factor which is checked by Togekiss/Articuno. I don't really have something other to add other than already mentioned stuff, but to be honest? I'm neutral on Mega Zard X ban.

Genesect: The already great type called bug won another Pokemon some months ago which completes it's title of one of the best types if not the best. Bug's versatility, giving it a neutral match up against most types. Adding to that Genesect's ability to pivot thanks to a strong U-turn which can be boosted by Download giving bug many momentum opportunities while keeping speed by it's side thanks to Scarf, it can create holes in dark, psychic and grass adding Stealth Rock support which gives these types, also it has an effective coverage of Energy Ball, Thunderbolt, Flamethrower, Ice Beam which can sweep easily late game when it's partner weakened the team enough. I still don't know why was Skymin banned but not this but ok. I'm with banning Genesect from Monotype.

Mega Sableye: Long debate happened around Mega Sableye, it got prankster Will-o-Wisp before mega evolving pairing that with it's bulk after mega evolving and amazing hazard control with Magic Bounce, Mega Sableye can wall, weaken or even sweep a large portion of teams. It got the coverage on both Dark and Ghost types, yes ghost users don't defend Sableye-Mega. Thanks to Tyranitar's bulk and typing and even Mandibuzz physical potential, Mega Sableye can easily weaken the opposing team after some Calm Mind and Will-O-Wisp. Meanwhile on Ghost it has better supports in Jellicent, Aegislash and Chandelure. Jellicent and Chandelure both have the ability to sponge fire attacks, and Jellicent have a plus of sponging scalds coming at Mega Sableye, while Aegislash stop fairy moves which isn't present on dark to complete Mega Sableye's utility. Without further words, I suggest sending Mega-Sableye to the shadow realm (see ban).

Suggesting Discussions:

Mega Pinsir: I was talking with Barida about Mega Pinsir impact in the Monotype metagame (guess he sniped me in posting), Thanks to it's ability Aerilate and Quick Attack/Frustration it is able to punch through teams easily. Quick Attack alone can make types such as grass, bug and fighting lose (which was one of main reasons Talonflame got banned) after a +2 which can be easily set with Mega Pinsir, it also has access to Close combat for pesky rock and steel types that dare standing in it's way it also has a base 155 Attk combined with a good speed tier which makes Frustration/Return usable in most case, even unboosted it able to take on types weak to flying easily (see grass, fighting, bug). Let's not forget it's power at +2, it is able to take easily on the odds of Mandibuzz and Slowbro which are two of the bulkiest pokemon in the metagame after rock damage, also it has the power to 2OHKO Skarmory with a resisted move which rarely a pokemon can do. I suggest discussing Pinsirite as it is unhealthy for the metagame.

Manaphy: Many users have complained about it's ability to break the most common Monotype cores but I don't see anyone posting about it. Manaphy has a 100 overall stats which makes it able to pull some great bulk and sweeping potential. It has access to Tail Glow, Ice Beam, Scald, Energy Ball, Psychic which it can abuse freely, with rain dance support this Pokemon will get cured from status adding power to it's main move, scald. It is able to take from the bulkiest core of Chansey+Porygon2 to Gliscor+Skarmory+Charizard Mega X core on flying. It doesn't have a lot of checks, it's two common checks are Ferrothorn and Venusaur-Mega which takes a chunk from rain boosted Scald and the potential of a burn. I find Manaphy unhealthy for the metagame.

Zapdos: People have been suggesting about unbanning Zapdos from flying if we take away both Mega Altaria and Mega Zard X, I find it unlikely to happen since flying can pull other megas effectively like Mega Charizard Y which is starting to show and Mega Gyarados. I disagree about unbanning Zapdos.

And with that I'm done, I might have forgot somethings and I'm pretty sure I'm going to get judged sooner or late so; bring on the hate. *drops mic*
Click to expand...
Sir, I agree with all ur points but I still do believe we should get rid of both Altaria and Charizard X for Zapdos and im neutral about Mega Sab
 
Barida said:
Sir, I agree with all ur points but I still do believe we should get rid of both Altaria and Charizard X for Zapdos and im neutral about Mega Sab
Click to expand...

I agree too but if there's gonna be a ban on bugs I suggest we ban either M-Pinsir or Genesect, and not both of them. As for M-Altaria and Zard-X, M-Altaria is certainly over powered and should be banned. While Zard-X is a lot of trouble to some teams, it isn't to mine. So, because I haven't been swept by Zard-X, I am neutral about it's ban.


Dream Eater Gengar said:
I've been lurking in the Monotype thread for a while, that's the perks of being a ghost and it's probably time to get out of the shadow and speak. I'm probably alone or maybe not but I'm not finding Monotype that entertaining (see funny, enjoyable) these days. We need a new era of changes which will turn it into something better. I'll state my opinion in two categories firstly, giving my opinion on long discussed bans/suspects and on my own I will open a new discussion about other Pokemon that may be unhealthy for the meta. Again, I don't have to remind you that this is my opinion, and I'm happy to elaborate on my thoughts if you ask to.

Current discussions:

Mega Altaria: Thanks to Gamefreak everyone's dream came true, the introduction of Mega Altaria gave us a long awaited fairy/dragon and on the top of that it got the ability Pixalate one of the -ate abilities which make everything, in my opinion, strong if paired with a Pokemon that has the normal moves and STAB to abuse it. Before getting to the set, we will have to talk about the types that it somewhat usually gives an advantage against, and these types include: Dark, Fighting, Dragon to an extent Electric and Water. It's set feature Dragon Dance, Roost, Return/Frustration, Refresh which is the only set needed to destroy most thing, fairy attacks are only resisted by Steel and Poison which can be taken care of with Fire Blast over Refresh or with Mega Altaria's team mates. In fact, on dragon teams the omnipresence of Garchomp put pressure on the types that threatens Mega Altaria, let's not forget the presence of both Hydreigon and Kyurem-Black which also can damage both types. On flying, we have the presence of Thundurus and Landorus which puts pressure on both types thanks to Thunderbolt/Focus Blast and Earthquake respectively. Due to it's ability of causing an auto win against types or sweep easily after some residual damage, I'd Suggest banishing Mega Altaria to the shadow realm where it can meet other Monotype banned Pokemon.

Mega Charizard X: A subject that got discussed many types before, it's presence on flying gives it an advantage against some types including Grass, Steel, Dark. It is able to run different sets, including: Bulky DD, Will O Wisp-Roost, Offensive DD. As I have more knowledge about dark, I am aware that Will-o-Wisp Zard can 6-0 dark removing Hydreigon factor which is checked by Togekiss/Articuno. I don't really have something other to add other than already mentioned stuff, but to be honest? I'm neutral on Mega Zard X ban.

Genesect: The already great type called bug won another Pokemon some months ago which completes it's title of one of the best types if not the best. Bug's versatility, giving it a neutral match up against most types. Adding to that Genesect's ability to pivot thanks to a strong U-turn which can be boosted by Download giving bug many momentum opportunities while keeping speed by it's side thanks to Scarf, it can create holes in dark, psychic and grass adding Stealth Rock support which gives these types, also it has an effective coverage of Energy Ball, Thunderbolt, Flamethrower, Ice Beam which can sweep easily late game when it's partner weakened the team enough. I still don't know why was Skymin banned but not this but ok. I'm with banning Genesect from Monotype.

Mega Sableye: Long debate happened around Mega Sableye, it got prankster Will-o-Wisp before mega evolving pairing that with it's bulk after mega evolving and amazing hazard control with Magic Bounce, Mega Sableye can wall, weaken or even sweep a large portion of teams. It got the coverage on both Dark and Ghost types, yes ghost users don't defend Sableye-Mega. Thanks to Tyranitar's bulk and typing and even Mandibuzz physical potential, Mega Sableye can easily weaken the opposing team after some Calm Mind and Will-O-Wisp. Meanwhile on Ghost it has better supports in Jellicent, Aegislash and Chandelure. Jellicent and Chandelure both have the ability to sponge fire attacks, and Jellicent have a plus of sponging scalds coming at Mega Sableye, while Aegislash stop fairy moves which isn't present on dark to complete Mega Sableye's utility. Without further words, I suggest sending Mega-Sableye to the shadow realm (see ban).

Suggesting Discussions:

Mega Pinsir: I was talking with Barida about Mega Pinsir impact in the Monotype metagame (guess he sniped me in posting), Thanks to it's ability Aerilate and Quick Attack/Frustration it is able to punch through teams easily. Quick Attack alone can make types such as grass, bug and fighting lose (which was one of main reasons Talonflame got banned) after a +2 which can be easily set with Mega Pinsir, it also has access to Close combat for pesky rock and steel types that dare standing in it's way it also has a base 155 Attk combined with a good speed tier which makes Frustration/Return usable in most case, even unboosted it able to take on types weak to flying easily (see grass, fighting, bug). Let's not forget it's power at +2, it is able to take easily on the odds of Mandibuzz and Slowbro which are two of the bulkiest pokemon in the metagame after rock damage, also it has the power to 2OHKO Skarmory with a resisted move which rarely a pokemon can do. I suggest discussing Pinsirite as it is unhealthy for the metagame.

Manaphy: Many users have complained about it's ability to break the most common Monotype cores but I don't see anyone posting about it. Manaphy has a 100 overall stats which makes it able to pull some great bulk and sweeping potential. It has access to Tail Glow, Ice Beam, Scald, Energy Ball, Psychic which it can abuse freely, with rain dance support this Pokemon will get cured from status adding power to it's main move, scald. It is able to take from the bulkiest core of Chansey+Porygon2 to Gliscor+Skarmory+Charizard Mega X core on flying. It doesn't have a lot of checks, it's two common checks are Ferrothorn and Venusaur-Mega which takes a chunk from rain boosted Scald and the potential of a burn. I find Manaphy unhealthy for the metagame.

Zapdos: People have been suggesting about unbanning Zapdos from flying if we take away both Mega Altaria and Mega Zard X, I find it unlikely to happen since flying can pull other megas effectively like Mega Charizard Y which is starting to show and Mega Gyarados. I disagree about unbanning Zapdos.

And with that I'm done, I might have forgot somethings and I'm pretty sure I'm going to get judged sooner or later so; bring on the hate. *drops mic*
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Fine comment, sire. I think about M-Sableye the same way. I wondered why anyone hadn't reciprocated to my thoughts yet. As quoted, M-Sab is a great wall, hazard controller and sweeper too. It is a major threat to physical mons, and the teams consisting of mainly physical mons. I agree about banning it.

About Genesect, it has great coverage, speed, and a huge potential to change the tables around in any kind of game. Although I use Genesect on my team, and losing it would cause my team to weaken severely, I think we should ban it.

I am still uncertain about what we should do about Manaphy and Zapdos.
 
OK guys let's not get excited like lil puppies after a ball over the fact that now we got a council lol. What I mean is one thing at a time. Good to know that the council votes are publicly displayed, props to them for making this very open to the community.

I think after the SR ban/ground nerf, something has to be addressed when it comes to Flying and its megas. I'm not just talking about a particular Mon and how it wrecks this and that type, but rather what they being in terms of defensive typing. That was my issue with CharX on Flying. It completely removed the boltbeam weakness. Mega Altaria is different because ppl are talking about its sweeping potential. Anyways we should look carefully at this before going crazy talk (Pinsirite ban really?)
 
My thoughts on these, Mega Pinsir Mega Altaria, Mega Charizard X, Zapdos, Mega Sableye and Landorus-I.

Mega Pinsir creates the situation in which whoever sets up Swords Dance wins in Bug verse Bug game, although, I believe this is mitigated by its lesser bulk and weakness to Stealth Rock which makes it much more manageable. It really beats only two types because Fighting can easily deal with it, with the likes of Stone Edge on Terrakion. This being said Bug can beat it with Armaldo or Forretress, as they can take one of its moves and Rock Blast or Thunder Wave it respectively. Grass can give it some trouble with Sash Breloom. Moreover, this is the only thing that beats it and Grass also loses to Volcarona, so in general Grass loses this match up. No Ban. Edit: The reason why Talonflame was more deserving of a ban was that Talonflame has more innate power in its priority. Almost doubly so.

Mega Altaria is two monsters, and as such it should be address as Altaria (Flying), and Altaria (Dragon).

Mega Altaria Flying does not see usage and thus should have less reason to be suspected, and if OU banned Altarianite, it would most likely trickle down to Monotype like Baton Pass did. Otherwise, I see absolutely no reason in banning a Pokemon that sees such little usage, like really it is like banning an Underused Pokemon to Ubers, I cannot recall a time where this has happened unless this Pokemon got a huge boost. Um, guess, no ban. If Charizardite X were to be banned I would then agree on this being banned, after seeing how the metagame develops.

Mega Altaria on Dragon is very powerful and is used very often, in comparison, but really does this auto-win verse some types, such as Dark, Fighting, Electric and Dragon itself. For all of you who say it auto-wins verse Water, I personally have never had this happen to me, although I use Water more often than not. So, I count four types it can auto-win against and I feel this is more than enough to be banished to the Uber realm. So, Altarianite on Dragon only should be banned.

Mega Charizard X is extremely potent, versatile threat with solid recovery, and Will-O-Wisp. Mega Charizard gives Flying a way to deal with BoltBeam as well as completely destroy Psychic, Dragon, Ice, Electric, and Grass without much team support barring Heal Bell Togekiss. It also completes defensive cores due to its resistance to Electric and neutrality to Ice. Thus, allowing it to form both Defensive and Offensive cores with ease. It is just literally the perfect Mega for Flying, and the fact it auto-wins verse two types Flying is weak against, makes it more than ban worthy, and should have been banned a long time ago. So needless to say, ban!

Zapdos, ugh, anyone remember the defensive Flying core that cause so many problems, well, even if Flying has both Mega Charizard X and Mega Altaria banned I would never want this defensive core back, it just fucked so many types, and made anyone say that the best type was Flying. Like really, I had difficulty with Flying almost every single time although it has a neutral match up verse Water. Skarmdos is just broken. Please keep this thing banned.

Mega Sableye, um, people have problems with this thing, like I get the fact that it is good, but all in all, this is easy to beat if you play right. You need to avoid the turn it Mega Evolves because it has Prankster and then just beat it with any Attacker that is immune to the burn or outspeeds and can OHKO or 2HKO while being burnt. I just use SubCM Keldeo set up along side it and then Scald it to death, as Burn neuters it so much I even healed my Lanturn of this thing because Thunder Waving it gave me my health back. Just learn how to play around Magic Bounce...

Landorus-I, I take this is just because it was banned from OU, and I get that. Therian is preferred on Flying and Ground just received a nerf calm your nips, and let the meta develop.
 
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RZL said:
Mega Altaria is two monsters, and as such it should be address as Altaria (Flying), and Altaria (Dragon).

Mega Altaria Flying does not see usage and thus should have less reason to be suspected, and if OU banned Altarianite, it would most likely trickle down to Monotype like Baton Pass did. Otherwise, I see absolutely no reason in banning a Pokemon that sees such little usage, like really it is like banning an Underused Pokemon to Ubers, I cannot recall a time where this has happened unless this Pokemon got a huge boost. Um, guess, no ban. If Charizardite X were to be banned I would then agree on this being banned, after seeing how the metagame develops.

Mega Altaria on Dragon is very powerful and is used very often, in comparison, but really does this auto-win verse some types, such as Dark, Fighting, Electric and Dragon itself. For all of you who say it auto-wins verse Water, I personally have never had this happen to me, although I use Water more often than not. So, I count four types it can auto-win against and I feel this is more than enough to be banished to the Uber realm. So, Altarianite on Dragon only should be banned.
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I feel like I have to keep saying this every 10 posts...

Usage or lack thereof does not prove whether a pokemon is broken or not.

I don't care that Altaria isn't common on Flying and neither should anyone else. If it's broken on Dragon teams, it's broken on Flying teams. No ifs, ands, or buts. An Altaria on a Flying team will do just as much damage to Dark or Fighting than an Altaria on a Dragon team will. I'm still not entirely convinced that Altaria is broken, but unless you can think of something besides usage that differentiates Flying Altaria from Dragon Altaria, they are both equally at risk of being banned.

On the topic of Pinsirite, I was honestly quite shocked when the idea was first brought up, but I do remember all throughout XY and even into the beginning of ORAS, I considered Mega Pinsir to be one of the most threatening megas out there. It's definitely no joke. I'm not entirely sure it should be banned, but it is certainly more of a pressing concern than Manaphy (which is outclassed by Keldeo imo).

And for those of you that are concerned about Bug's future if both Genesect and Pinsirite are banned, I guess I just have to be blunt with you. Deal with it. For now it's only a possibility, but even if those two bans happen, Bug will still be viable. It will likely drop in usage but it will still be far from the likes of Grass and Ice. Other types have lost key pokemon and survived (Dark users are probably still salty about Greninja). Bug can survive too.
 
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