Resource ORAS OU Metagame Discussion

[Creator of Chaos]

I post CB Rhyperior in creative sets thread and now I started a revolution. What have I done?!

Let's talk about something more relevant and less brain melting (I'm gonna regret saying this I know it).....like Garchomp.

Screw garchomp, I started using t-wave clef last year and now everyone does it. Let's talk more about thunder waving fairies and how awesome they are ;). I'm sure everyone would agree given there our favorite thing right now.

On serious note I think garchomps offencive sets are better then Rocky helm sets right now. Defensive sets are fairy bait, very much prepared for and unless you need to ironically protect fairies from steel moves lando is better for the role. Offensive chomp however can remove its checks by luring them and since I think very much under-appreciated.

 

[MANNAT]

One thing that I think we should stop doing is comparing garchomp and lando since their roles have kind of diverted and they both do different things now. Garchomp is most optimally used as an offensive rocker on HO and such that can surprise people that expect a bulkier set and can help out vs mega sab if you're running like sd lum berry whereas lando is mainly used as a defensive pivot that can check key threats like zardx and excadrill that can be troublesome for offense as well as a revenge killer and late game wincon (since most teams only have one ground resist) for offense in general. That's just my opinion, but garchomp and lando do two different things though and people that think tankchomp is garchomp's main set now need to get their head out of the clouds because that's frankly not true and tankchomp is only a niche set for teams that need a bulky rocker that can take on bisharp/mscizor.

 

[dk]

What do y'all like running in Lop's fouth moveslot? After Fake Out/Return/HJK?

 

[Ramses]

Believe it or not, I believe that Bulky Garchomp is actually regaining a decent amount of relevance in the metagame.

The sole reason I believe this is that its a superior check to Mega Scizor and it functions as a feasible Rock resist that a large amount of teams take for granted. However, offensive sets are still king in the current metagame as defensive Landorus-T still reigns as the best defensive Ground-type currently.

Garchomp @ Life Orb
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Earthquake
- Dragon Claw
- Fire Fang / Aqua Tail

This is usually the Garchomp set I use these days since it pairs very well with other offensive Stealth Rock setters. Fire Fang is a pretty great move overall in it since it directly pressures Mega Scizor, Ferrothorn, and Skarmory a lot more especially Skarm. Aqua Tail is something I've fiddled with since its not too shabby when you're looking to weaken defensive Landorus for the main wincon.

Garchomp @ Life Orb
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Fire Blast
- Earthquake
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Stone Edge

This is actually a pretty set that's appreciates Garchomp's ability to lure in certain mons such as the aforementioned Landorus-T and weaken them through the appropriate coverage move. It also capitalizes on the fact that Dragon STAB isn't necessary at all Garchomp sets. Made by AM I think.

Garchomp @ Salac Berry
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Dragon Claw
- Endure / Substitute
- Sword Dance

Salac Berry Garchomp is really starting to become a standard set actually. It's a pretty fun and effective set that allows it to clean very effectively and terrorize offense teams. The choice between Substitute and Endure depends upon whether you care if you could be crippled by status and shit down by Intimidate or not. All in all its a pretty nice set overall.

Garchomp @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 240 HP / 176 Def / 92 Spe
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Dragon Tail
- Swords Dance

Swords Dance Tankchomp is something I've used a lot lately when i do get around to using this variant. It solves the issue with its dreaded passivity and functions very similarly to SD Defensive Landorus-T. Obviously the lack of Fire Blast leaves it prone to things like Mega Scizor, but residual damage and a boosted hit actually does a number on them. As i said before its a Rock resist and many teams that forgo one get heavily pressured by Terrakion. I'm guilty as well since it happens a lot.

Am I the only one who doesn't /really/ sweat Volcanion when building? It's Specs set is good and all, but it's not that huge of a constraint when team building, not like I initially thought. Maybe it's due to the fact that most of the time I'm using offense that doesn't mind losing 1 partner since the other 5 can, in some shape or form, deal with Volcanion. Not to mention that a lot of player like myself just slaps on a Roost Latios and call it a day since it checks it well enough.

Finally, I've also noticed how hazard removal is becoming near nonexistent these days unless you're specifically using something that needs it such as Mega Pinsir or Talonflame. Defog Latios or Latias is honestly underwhelming these days since it just leaves you so vulnerable to Pursuit ot making a Bisharp user's day. 3 Attacks + Roost is pretty much the best set it can run these days since Thunderbolt is pretty excellent and keeps Skarmory at bay, as a ton of builds are left at the mercy of Spikes since its just invited each and every time to just set them up. Surf is also swell since it does solid damage to Tyranitar and catches Heatran. Heal Block is also cool since denying recovery is always nice. I find myself using builds that include Thundurus, Volcanion, etc without hazard removal regardless of typing simply because hazard removal sucks and mandates a certain direction you have to take the team.

So what's something everyone else has noticed? And btw Mega Aerodactyl is actually good, you should try it.

 

[Cheryl.]

What do y'all like running in Lop's fouth moveslot? After Fake Out/Return/HJK?

Usually Ice Punch or PuP, but Healing Wish is a nice tool on certain teams that have wallbreakers that get worn down easily like, say, LO Garchomp.

 

[Norne]

I love batton pass, if you can predict a switch in of his checks the ability to bring a wallbreaker safely is remarkable.

Ice punch is better if you dislike Garchomp and Lando T.

 

[Eclipse]

I also like Toxic on Lop, as it's nice to cripple your common switchins like Lando/Chomp/Slowbro/Physdef Growth without having to dedicate a moveslot specifically for Lando/Chomp with Ice Punch; it's been a very solid option that I highly recommend, imo.

 

[Creator of Chaos]

I like sub honestly. Good for trolling stuff like talon or togekiss who think they can freely switch in on fake out or hjk. Not the best option but it has its uses and it's a buffer against priority. Pup, encore, quick attack, thunder wave and healing wish are good utility options as well

 

[Random Passerby]

I like sub honestly. Good for trolling stuff like talon or togekiss who think they can freely switch in on fake out or hjk. Not the best option but it has its uses and it's a buffer against priority. Pup, encore, quick attack, thunder wave and healing wish are good utility options as well

Do you have a Thunder Wave fetish or something? Thunder Wave Clef is annoying enough lol.

While we're talking about Choice Band mons (Terrakion, Rhyperior, Tyrantrum, Tyranitar), what do you people think of Banded Garchomp? Outclassed by SD Chomp / SD Lando-T or might be viable?

 

[Norne]

Not viable in my opinion. Garchomp lacks coverage outside of the piss poor fire fang, stone edge and aquatail.

It is not worth to give up the versatility Garchomp entails for a couple of surprise 2hkos.

 

[bludz]

In terms of those mons Garchomp is most easily compared to Terrakion for these purposes, given their speed / offensive stats.

Terrakion is a good Choice Band user because its STAB combo is extremely difficult to switch into on the correct predictions. It however suffers when attempting to use SD sets since it has a ton of common weaknesses and can't really set up without predicting a switch. Plus CB can 2HKO Unaware walls / Sturdy Skarm whereas SD doesn't OHKO (2HKO on switch is same # of turns as SD then attack).

Garchomp on the other hand has easier STABs to switch into given that they both have immunities and common resists. Furthermore it has pretty good typing and isn't weak to a lot, meaning it can utilize SD sets much better. The ability to switch moves on Chomp is nicer since it can actually set up a Swords Dance relatively easily.

so yeah I wouldn't consider CB Garchomp on a serious team

 

[Josh]

which set of azu do you guys preffer in teambuilding av bd or cb azu.

lum
fuck scald

 

[Imperator Romanum]

Why would you run lum berry azumarill when you can run rest talk with rocky helmet???

Azumarill @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Play Rough
- Waterfall
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

It's pretty much a Keldeo, but better. Azumarill handles volcanions stab better but watch out for sludge wave, it acts a nice switch in into threats such as bulky talonflame, weavile, mega lopunny and the rest. best mon and a true meme

 

[Norne]

Why would you run lum berry azumarill when you can run rest talk with rocky helmet???

Azumarill @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Play Rough
- Waterfall
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

It's pretty much a Keldeo, but better. Azumarill handles volcanions stab better but watch out for sludge wave, it acts a nice switch in into threats such as bulky talonflame, weavile, mega lopunny and the rest. best mon and a true meme

You must really hate bisharp, cleffable and non thunder latios.

 

[Creator of Chaos]

Do you have a Thunder Wave fetish or something? Thunder Wave Clef is annoying enough lol.

While we're talking about Choice Band mons (Terrakion, Rhyperior, Tyrantrum, Tyranitar), what do you people think of Banded Garchomp? Outclassed by SD Chomp / SD Lando-T or might be viable?

Haven't you heard ? Thunder wave is the best move in the game. Why use 1 Thunder wave mon when you can troll with 2.

Banded chomp is outclassed by other banded mons pretty hard. Chomp just has to much utility to waste on a choiceband for now gain. SD, scarf and helm are superior for a reason

 

[Ojo46]

I still enjoy running the defensive Rocky Helmet Chomp set. He's still an excellent Stealth Rocker despite his flaws.

 

[Sun]

I think Garchomp is a great pokemon in this moment, it is true, the offensive set is much more common and effective since there are more rock-type and volcanion in the metagame; but honestly I think "tankchomp still remains the best set" if we compare them, have very different utilities, offensive chomp, as well as being an offensive presence fairy as Clefable, Azumarill, manages to "deal with" some grounds bulky type as Landorus-t using SD version, or Draco meteor or Hp ice as -Magic- mentioned above, the offensive sets have need to be supported for Togekiss (in the absence of S.edge) or be supported for Skarmory unless you have coverage fire; speaking instead of Chomp band, I think it is completely wasted, chomp has the ability to be much more lethal on SD, because it also has the ability to play more roles, and not just to Wallbreaker; speaking of defensive comparing sets, I think it gives a more useful, since it uses dragon tail, toxic, they can weaken bulky pokemons fact Tankchomp by supporting other pokemon, what however contrary if you use offensive set (in that case has chomp needs support).

 

[zbr]

Haven't you heard ? Thunder wave is the best move in the game. Why use 1 Thunder wave mon when you can troll with 2.

Banded chomp is outclassed by other banded mons pretty hard. Chomp just has to much utility to waste on a choiceband for now gain. SD, scarf and helm are superior for a reason

wrong. any move that induces paralysis is considered as a superior move in this game called pokehaxmon, because i am certain we all get frustrated when random serps glare torn, random spdef rachis going for body slam to para your stupid lando and if you rly wanna be hip, just give your pikachu light ball and use fling so that you can hit those incoming garchomps and para the fuck out of them xd.

 

[Giagantic]

Banded / Scarf Garchomp is in general more of "SURPRISE BIATCH" set, rather then something I'd recommend over its other more popular sets. As a ground type Scarf Landorus-Therian and even Scarf Excadrill (which isn't the most common) are likely more consistent as the former has access to Intimidate and better moves like U-Turn and Knock Off, while the later has access to Mold Breaker which means it is slightly harder to punish outside of Flying types. Banded sets face similar issues with it being outclassed offensively by Kyurem-black outside of speed and is again fairly abuse-able by the opponent, however, as I mentioned beforehand I wouldn't recommend it to anyone immediately and would only use it in some rare occasions (like when you purposely want to bluff a different set or counter the opponents team).

 

[Gary]

Healing Wish Mega Lopunny is bad lol. Why would you sacrifice your Mega which is pretty much always considered the most crucial member of a team, instead of using something like HW Jirachi to heal up Mega Lopunny itself? In all honesty, its last moveslot isn't really expendable in the current meta, especially with Lando-T running around and other things like Gliscor being a thing, Ice Punch is practically mandatory. The only other move I'd consider is PuP because it can potentially muscle through like Hippo, Slowking, Bro, or Gliscor, as well as I think OHKOing Latios with Return at +1. PuP is nice because it just makes Mega Lop less useless versus fat teams, which it doesn't really appreciate too much, but Ice Punch is still great when Lando-T is what most teams use as their primary check.

Anything else is too situational or just straight bad. Toxic is decent, Thunder Wave is god awful when all of its switch-ins are either immune to it or you'd rather Toxic anyway. Quick Attack was better when offense was more popular but it's not anymore, and Sub sucks because again, it really doesn't help Mega Lop break balance any better. Like I said, HW looks awesome on paper but when it really comes down to it, you're going to want to keep Mega Lopunny around most of the time considering that it's a pretty big threat and not something that you want to sacrifice to heal up something else.

 

[Norne]

So again I'm the only one who likes BP mega lopunny, I mean it ain't as good as the old days of gothitrap but it still gains so much momentum it's ludicrous if you pair it with some wallbreakers.

 

[staticladder]

Banded / Scarf Garchomp is in general more of "SURPRISE BIATCH" set, rather then something I'd recommend over its other more popular sets. As a ground type Scarf Landorus-Therian and even Scarf Excadrill (which isn't the most common) are likely more consistent as the former has access to Intimidate and better moves like U-Turn and Knock Off, while the later has access to Mold Breaker which means it is slightly harder to punish outside of Flying types. Banded sets face similar issues with it being outclassed offensively by Kyurem-black outside of speed and is again fairly abuse-able by the opponent, however, as I mentioned beforehand I wouldn't recommend it to anyone immediately and would only use it in some rare occasions (like when you purposely want to bluff a different set or counter the opponents team).

Yeah, it works really well on HO teams, as most people would be expecting TankChomp. You can get your SR up, and deal some heavy damage.

 

[TudeTen]

I've been using Mega Beedrill in my OU Team and it puts in the work. The only things that I dislike about Mage Beedrill is it's clear lack of any good defense. Sucker Punches from Weavile destroy it, or any Priority that it doesn't resist.

The set I usually run is...

Beedrill - Sniper - Beedrillite
252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 HP
Jolly Nature (So I can speed tie Max Speed, Timid Nature Mega Sceptile, if he is not Timid, I can easily OHKO it)
Moveset:
Poison Jab (STAB Coverage)
X-Scissor (STAB Coverage)
Protect (So I can get the Speed after Mega evolving, Speed does not add until the next turn of Mega Evolving)
Swords Dance (One Swords Dance, and Mega Beedrill destroys teams, or at least rips holes in them)

I know that this Mega is in UU, but I always use it in OU because I never see it in OU. I have never battled against it in OU. This Pokemon rips through teams, being an immediate counter to Breloom and Mega Alakazam. Another downside is called a Pokemon called Weezing. On a Defensive Weezing, and I use X-Scissor I only do 18.5 to 22.1% of it's health. Possible 6HKO after Black Sludge. Mega Beedrill overall, is by far my favorite mega.

 

[MANNAT]

run u-turn over x scissor to get switch initiative and drill run or knock off over sd on that set and you're golden. TudeTen

On a related note Megabee is fun to use, and megabee+mag cores are really good and can form really potent volturn teams quite easily

 

[TudeTen]

run u-turn over x scissor to get switch initiative and drill run or knock off over sd on that set and you're golden. TudeTen

On a related note Megabee is fun to use, and megabee+mag cores are really good and can form really potent volturn teams quite easily

I used Knock Off Before, and it never worked perfectly. U-Turn I won't put because I would like to stay in to hit Ferrothorns and other Pokemon weak to Bug. Drill Run would be fun though...