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The reason I suggested SlowBro was to deal with heavy physical attackers like D-Nite and Haxorus. Threaten with Ice Beam or Phaze with Yawn. Either way, it can take a few hits and hopefully ruin a Dragon Sweep.
You really need to do calcs before making claims like that. Most of the time the only way to deal with Haxorus is with Steels or offensive checks. Slowbro is an excellent physical wall, just not against Dragons.
I think the best way we can consistently deal with Haxorus (something nearly all teams struggle with, to be fair) is by switching Jirachi or someone else out for Skarm. However, I do think this taints the current synergy the team has right now, and would probably require some major shifts. The team definitely struggles against Heavy Offense teams.
I haven't heard anyone say much positive things! :P I think the team works really well in most matchups, have other people found this?
Not sure if I should say this yet but I think a tinkerbell celebi would be a better fit than Virizion. Celebi doesn't really fear anything that Gastrodon can throw at it so we can run willowisp/hp fire rotom now. hp fire on celebi also makes scizor easier to deal with, something like 64 evs or something to ensure the ohko. Just my thoughts for now, might suggest something later but I suggest that you guys test this out.
mainly because LO SD Virizion is pretty awful as a synergetic component, it definitely cant do its job of countering waters + rotom w with all that passive damage. also why add another late game sweeper that has similar checks to Nidoking?
celebi can SR, u turn for free nido switchins, bait scizor (which this team hates) and just be awesome
After testing this team out a bit, I found it weak to sun. fire grass isn't resisted by the team at all and the reliability of terrakion's stone edges worries me. I would need to fit preferrably a dragonite so that at least venusaur wouldn't be a problem.
Also the team needs SR so that Dnite wouldn't sweep this team
Thanks for the quality input guys. The team's weakness to Haxorus is egregious; one can tell even by just glancing at the team. Although Grass - Fire combination is unresisted by the team, Jirachi does have a sufficient special defense to stomache a Sun-boosted Hidden Power [Fire] and follow it up with T-Wave, imo. Another issue is stall-breakers, such as Sableye and Mew burning the team.
One easy fix may be giving Virizion Lum Berry over Life Orb, so it fears less from switching into Scald, and it wont be drained by LO recoil. I need to play more to decide whether Virizion is pulling its weight.
I think Scizor is a great addition to this team, revenging Haxorus locked into Outrage, as well as removing Chloro Sweepers that may be faster than Terrakion. I think I would remove either Gengar or Rotom-W for Scizor.
As far as stall-breaker Mew / Sableye, there's LO Gengar for the former and Lum Virizion and LO Nidoking for the latter.
EDIT: Good catch, ginganinja. One interesting option is Gyarados > Rotom-W. Gyarados and Rotom-W pretty much checks similar mons, except Rotom-W can check bulky Water-types that usually walls Gyarados. However, Gyarados is a much more solid answer to physical sweepers than Rotom-W could ever be.
The big problem with dropping Rotom W tho Pocket is that SD Scizor (and CB) still wreck this team. Yeah, o.k Jirachi can FB but that means giving up SR leaving us very Dragonite weak. The fact of the matter is that Virizion, Terrakion, Gengar and Nidoking cannot really switch into a CB Bullet Punch safely, while Rotom W and Jirachi hate U-Turn. Rotom W hates likely Celebi switch in afterwards while Jirachi hates the Landorus switch in from Scizors U-Turn. Both Celebi and Landorus are common enough on teams with CB Scizor which gives this team quite a large problem.
I still think a bulky Gyarados somewhere would really help. It can still spread para support, opens up room for SR on Jirachi and it can phase Volcarona out with D-Tail. We even have a spinblocker in Gengar which can keep SR up if needed. That SR weakness really hurts but it still does a fine job at supporting the team with T-Wave, spreading Intimidate to cushion blows from offensive physical powerhouses, acting as a solid check to Scizor and a decent Volcarona check, AND still has excellent synergy with Jirachi (who can pass wishs to it with ease as it lures in pokemon such as Heatran and Gliscor which Gyarados can switch in on), (Nidoking can switch in on Rock and Electric attacks aimed at Gyarados). It really just seems the perfect fit.
This is probably gonna be a long post. I'm gonna start with all the slashes and my opinion of which move should be used there, before I'll suggest some major changes.
Fire Blast on Nidoking: Let's take a look at some calculations. First of all, there's Choice Band Scizor in the rain. Seeing as this team lacks a weather starter, rain will almost always be up if the opponent has a Politoed. This means that Nidoking's Flamethrower is much less powerful than it should be. This is notable against the aforementioned Scizor. Without Stealth Rock on the field, Flamethrower only has a 51% chance of OHKOing 248 HP / 0 Def Scizor. Fire Blast, on the other hand, is a guaranteed OHKO even without Stealth Rock as it does 116% minimum. If the Scizor is actually a bulky variant with 252 HP / 216 SpD, Flamethrower does 86% maximum which means that it will never KO even with Stealth Rock. This lets Scizor sets up a Swords Dance and that's something this team especially doesn't like. Fire Blast, on the other hand, does 91% minimum so it always KOes after Stealth Rock. Even if no hazards are up there's a 51% chance of OHKOing Scizor. Another possible foe is Specially Defensive Ferrothorn, an extremely common on rain stall teams. In the rain, Flamethrower only has a 12% chance of 2HKOing that Ferrothorn, meaning that Ferrothorn gets two free turns to do what it wants. Fire Blast, on the other hand, always 2HKOes Ferrothorn even in the rain. Note that even if rain isn't up Flamethrower only has a 81% chance of KOing Specially Defensive Ferrothorn, making Fire Blast still superior!
Stone Edge on Virizion: Hidden Power Ice is there for only reason: Gliscor. Gliscor tries to wall every physical threats and that means Virizion as well. However, is it worth cutting Virizion's Special Defense and ability to take on rain teams to be able to put the hurt on Gliscor with Hidden Power Ice? My answer is no. Note that Hidden Power Ice never OHKOes Gliscor, though the 2HKO is guaranteed. However, so is +2 Leaf Blade. +2 Leaf Blade only does slightly less than Hidden Power Ice to Gliscor, and is still a 2HKO unless you roll two minimum damage rolls while not having the negative side-effects, such as missing Stone Edge and cutting its bulk. Virizion doesn't even need Hidden Power Ice because Virizion can also set up on Gliscor quite easily. Uninvested Ice Fang does about 40% to Virizion which means that though it takes a little damage, Virizion can still set up on Gliscor. Also, let's take a look at what happens when Virizion has to use a Naive nature. Let's say Virizion has to switch in on a 252 SpA Starmie with Leftovers as an item, and rain as current weather. Starmie uses Hydro Pump as Virizion switches in and uses Ice Beam as its next move. Against a Jolly Virizion, this does a combined damage total of 73 - 86%, which means Virizion can live even with Stealth Rock and retaliate with Leaf Blade. However, against a Naive Virizion, the combined damage total is 81-95%. That way, Virizion risks being 2HKOed if Stealth Rock is up, or dieing to its own Life Orb damage if it isn't.
Stealth Rock on Jirachi: As someone who has used Life Orb Nidoking with SmashPass, I know you need Stealth Rock for Nidoking to succeed. Often, Nidoking barely misses out on the KO on a lot of things, including but not limited to OHKOing Specially Defensive Scizor with Fire Blast in the rain, OHKOing Dragonite with Ice Beam, 2HKOing Rotom with Thunderbolt, OHKOing Scarf Tyranitar after two Stealth Rock switchins, etc, etc. Stealth Rock is also necessary on almost every team to keep threats like Dragonite and Volcarona check. The former especially is important as if it sets up with Multiscale intact, Terrakion can't revenge kill it which results in a clean sweep.
Earthquake on Terrakion: Earthquake is absolutely necessary. There is an important reason for that. Namely, Swords Dance Toxicroak, who doesn't have a lot of problem sweeping this team. It can set up on Terrakion itself, or Virizion. It can also force something out such as a weakened Rotom-W or Jirachi if you don't want to risk losing it. After it's at +2, nothing can reliably stop it. Rotom-W and Jirachi fall to a +2 Cross Chop, Virizion and Terrakion will fall to Ice Punch and Cross Chop respectively and they can't KO Toxicroak with their combined Close Combats, due to Dry Skin healing Toxicroak. Nidoking is taken out by +2 Sucker Punch, and so is Gengar. Subsitute can help, but playing mindgames with Ice Punch / Sucker Punch is risky and Shadow Ball will never KO Toxicroak, while +2 Ice Punch always will KO Gengar. Giving Terrakion Earthquake lets Terrakion revenge kill Toxicroak thanks to its resistance to Sucker Punch, even gaining an Attack boost from it. This lets it freely use Earthquake, which will always KO Toxicroak (it does 100% minimum).
Now for problem . As everyone pointed out, Scizor can give this team a lot of problems. Set up Swords Dance against Terrakion, Virizion, Gengar, or even low-health Nidoking, and sweep. With just Bullet Punch it beats Nidoking, Gengar, Terrakion, and Virizion, as they are all KOed by a strong +2 Bullet Punch. Rotom-W is outsped by a fast spread with 252 Speed EVs and +2 Life Orb Bug Bite KOes after Stealth Rock damage. Jirachi outspeeds Scizor but can't really threaten it (Fire Punch is not worth giving up Stealth Rock), and Bug Bite KOes in return. Paralysis doesn't really bother Scizor because Bullet Punch still attacks with priority and Hydro Pump from Rotom-W does 68% maximum to a Scizor with no bulk.
Haxorus is also a problem like everyone said. Choice Band Haxorus OHKOes everything easily, with the only not being OHKOed by Earthquake being Virizion, who falls to Outrage. Dance Haxorus can also sweep the team with a little bulk invested, setting up on Jirachi, or Rotom-W with a Lum Berry. After a Dance it KOes everything with Claw / Earthquake, while Terrakion never KOes 36 HP Haxorus with Close Combat, leaving you open for a sweep. Wearing it down with Life Orb recoil is also impossible if it carries a Lum Berry instead.
I feel that Rotom-W can be a problem as well. This team doesn't exactly have a reliable switchin into it, as Water / Electric coverage is only resisted by Virizion. However, Virizion is effectively neutered with Will-O-Wisp, making it near useless. I feel that it can be handled by this team, but it does a major impact unless Hydro Pump or Will-O-Wisp misses or something similar.
As the last big threat, sun teams with Venusaur can cause trouble. With STAB Grass-type attacks, and sun-boosted Fire-type attacks, Chlorophyll sweepers have an easy team with this team. If Venusaur can force out Rotom-W, Virizion, or Terrakion it can set up a Growth. With a Growth boost, sun-boosted Hidden Power Fire does 97% - 114% to Jirachi, which is a clean KO with Stealth Rock up and even has a 85% chance of KOing without. The rest of your team obviously falls to SolarBeam / Energy Ball and Hidden Power Fire without much trouble. Scarf Terrakion outspeeds Modest Venusaur with one point, but Stone Edge does 62 - 74% damage which means Venusaur will just survive and continue sweeping. Timid Venusaur obviously outspeeds Terrakion as well, but only does 88% - 104% to Jirachi (still likely to KO after Stealth Rock).
Now, I can't help but think that Scarf Jirachi would be a great option this team. It deals with pretty much all the offensive threats to this team. Scizor can't hurt Jirachi with Bullet Punch thanks to the resistance, and Fire Punch is a clean OHKO even on bulky variants. Haxorus is also outsped even at +1 and one Iron Head flinch lets Jirachi get past it. All the other dragons like Dragonite and Salamence are taken out with Ice Punch. Scarf Jirachi also combines the roles of Jirachi and Terrakion, freeing up a spot. However, that spot has several requirements:
Must be able to set up Stealth Rock.
Must be a reliable switchin into Rotom-W.
Must be able to beat Volcarona and Venusaur.
Therefore, I think that a Chansey in this last slot would be a perfect fit. It is able to set up Stealth Rock, and can take on those special attackers. Rotom-W's Will-O-Wisp, or even Thunder Wave or Toxic isn't a big problem for Chansey, thanks to Natural Cure. Its attacks are even easier to take, thanks to its high HP stat and Eviolite. Volcarona and Venusaur are also taken on with those 704 HP / 369 SpD defensive stats, and Thunder Wave + Seismic Toss outstalling them. Chansey still has Wish to help recover the team, and provides more Thunder Wave support for Nidoking.
All these problems seem to point (at least how I see it) directly towards physically bulky gyarados. Resisting both of scizor's STABs as well as completely nullifying them with intimidate, he can easily force the switch and get an easy DD. If haxorus is a problem, intimidate will make his outrage easier to handle (even if gyarados switches out straight away) as well as this, he is immune to haxorus' MB EQ so it will definetely make the opponent think twice before spamming EQ on a scarfed haxorus.
Also, like tomahawk said, the team will have a tough time with Rotom-W. Chansey would be a very good member, BUT I think Specially defensive tyranitar a very good job as well. Yes, he's weak to two of volca's and venusaur's STABs, but being solar-beam weak isn't really an issue to someone who sets up sand, bug buzz, on the other hand, is a problem. Gyarados can switch in on the bb though, bait a HP rock, and then switch to scarfed terrakion and hit it hard. The only problem would be to open the slots. Tinkerbell celebi could also be used over tyranitar but that still leaves us pretty vulnerable to weather sweepers.
Another thing I've found that really hampers this team:
No priority whatsoever, and that leaves it vulnerable, imo. Especially to Scarfers.
I've found that the Offensive Swords Dance Scizor really has his way with most of this team, it isn't just choice band.
Also, Scarf Landorus isn't really threatened by anything on this team. Rotom-W can force him to switch, but no smart player leaves him in to take a Hydro Pump.
Maybe it was this team's intent to avoid the whole Volt-Turn fad, but CB Scizor over Virizion would probably alleviate a lot of this team's problems.
As for Nidoking's role as a wallbreaker, I'm seeing some good things. Most of the walls he faces don't run enough speed to outrun him anyway, and his coverage guarantees that you're going to dent SOMETHING, if not KO it.
agreeing with Tomahawks move suggestions above. Also pushing for Bulky Gyara over Rotom W (seeing as Rotom W running all that defence is just trying to be a Gyarados anyway) and Id prefer Lum on Virizion. You lose the power boost LO gives you but it makes it much easier to switch into Rotom W, as well not worry about a WoW or Toxic or T-Wave or whatever flying around.
Haha, Tomahawk, thanks for bringing your quality rates to this forum! Personally, I have never touched Scarf Jirachi and Chansey. Scarf Jirachi seems like an overall weak Scarfer, thanks to its relatively low base Atk and low-powered moves. I may even think of using Scarf Heatran over Scarf Jirachi, as it can easily deal with Scizor and Haxorus locked into Outrage, but I've faced Dual Chop variants, which would screw me over. I am a little skeptical about Jirachi being able to deal with Haxorus, though, since Iron Head is only doing ~40% to Haxorus, but combined with Outrage-locking, Serene Grace, and SR damage, it probably works. I need to try it out :d. U-turn is another option over Trick for the switch advantage.
The reason why I try to avoid using Chansey is because it forfeits any offensive pressure that this team has gained. It lets SR / Spikers in effortlessly to set up their hazards, as well as mons such as Breloom, Terrakion, SubGengar, etc. However, aggressive double-switches back to our aggressive mons can help regain the offensive momentum, while Chansey absorbs all the special abuse for the team, so I'm intrigued by this suggestion. The Chansey probably needs Softboiled > Wish for immediate recovery, though.
Thanks for the thorough rate, Tomahawk! You've brought new suggestions to the table, which is a big welcome at this stage of CCAT.
From a quick glance it appears the 2 big problems the team has are physical dragons and sun teams.
Solution 1: scarfed latias, bulky, can take hits and outspeed and ko dragons and chlorophyll sweepers.
Solution 2: Cloyster, nice physical bulk and can set up a counter sweep on physical dragons with shell smash. Also wrecks the average sun team after a shell smash, but can only set up on dugtrio who shouldnt be too hard to lure in.
I also think nidoking should be dropped to help patch up some weaknesses. This team is meant to be an example of our OU metagame, and nidoking has negligible usage, it's not even OU. Hell if you want a team that represents the metagame might as well just make a voltturn team.
From a quick glance it appears the 2 big problems the team has are physical dragons and sun teams.
Solution 1: scarfed latias, bulky, can take hits and outspeed and ko dragons and chlorophyll sweepers.
Solution 2: Cloyster, nice physical bulk and can set up a counter sweep on physical dragons with shell smash. Also wrecks the average sun team after a shell smash, but can only set up on dugtrio who shouldnt be too hard to lure in.
I also think nidoking should be dropped to help patch up some weaknesses. This team is meant to be an example of our OU metagame, and nidoking has negligible usage, it's not even OU. Hell if you want a team that represents the metagame might as well just make a voltturn team.
I don't think latias would work very well as for 1, it doesn't outspeed venusaur with a sun boost, and 2 it adds on even more to the big scizor weakness. Cloyster can't switch in to scizor really either or survive a couple of outrages from scarfed haxorus and won't KO him with a normal ice shard at full health.
Can't drop Nidoking as the whole team is based around it. It's supposed to be a team with an unusual center, at least to my understanding.
From a quick glance it appears the 2 big problems the team has are physical dragons and sun teams.
Solution 1: scarfed latias, bulky, can take hits and outspeed and ko dragons and chlorophyll sweepers.
Solution 2: Cloyster, nice physical bulk and can set up a counter sweep on physical dragons with shell smash. Also wrecks the average sun team after a shell smash, but can only set up on dugtrio who shouldnt be too hard to lure in.
I also think nidoking should be dropped to help patch up some weaknesses. This team is meant to be an example of our OU metagame, and nidoking has negligible usage, it's not even OU. Hell if you want a team that represents the metagame might as well just make a voltturn team.
Have you even read the OP? We can't drop Nidoking. Anyway, those suggestions are good, but I think Scarfed Latias is trapped too easily. Maybe Scarf Haxorus? It doesn't carry quite as much speed and bulk but it makes up for it in immediate power. And in terms of speed, I think being able to revenge DNite is the main goal.
Razza, the goal of this project is to create a successful team that utilizes under-appreciated Pokemon or moveset. Anyone can use a bog-standard team and do well on the ladder; what's the challenge in that?
As for your suggestion I would prefer Scarf Latios for the extra power to OHKO Haxorus even through Light Screen. Scarf Latios is an exceptional revenge killer that performs well against Rain and Sun teams as well. Probably better than Scarf Haxorus, since it can reliably take out opposing Haxorus and DDMence.
As spuds, have mentioned, it does leave us more vulnerable to Scizor. After a special fall, Latios also opens this team wide open to SD Lucario, although Gengar can check non-Bullet Punch variants. Not only that, if you replace Terrakion for Latios, Volcarona easily eats this team up.
Shell Smash Cloyster doesn't exactly like taking +1 Outrage, so it's not much of a help. This team doesn't support Cloyster well either, with no Rapid Spin support.
o.k im adding a summery post here so we can actually go about fixing this.
Firstly, this team (as many have pointed out) is critically weak to Haxorus which can mangle pretty much everything on this team. Dragonite is also a rather large problem since Stealth Rock is'nt even the first slash on Jirachi and without it, Dragonite can easily set up a DD or 2 with no problems. CB Dragonite is also difficult since Jirachi is the only reliable switch in to it and we cannot afford to put so much emphasis on Jirachi to take Physical AND Special hits.
Conkeldurr is also a lesser seen pokemon but it utterly destroys this team. Its not likely to fully sweep the team cold, but its going to mangle the team regardless, especially if it picks up a Guts boost from random paralysis. Gengar, Nidoking, Virizion and Rotom W all outspeed however the latter two risk having all there damage healed off thanks to Drain Punch, and Virizion cannot really touch a +1 Conkeldurr anyway. Gengar hates Payback and Nidoking doesn't have the best amount of bulk to handle it. Terrakion just gets destroyed by Mach Punch.
The Team is also critically weak to Sun Teams. Venusaur rips this team apart, and while Terrakion can outspeed Venusaur that run Modest, it does'nt actually KO with Stone Edge (well it didn't in my experience) which makes it exceptionally difficult to handle.
Lastly, this team is exceptionally weak to Scizor and, by extension, Volt Turn. We have 2 switch ins to CB Scizor, Rotom W and Jirachi, neither of which like eating a STAB U-Turn and both hate the common pokemon Scizor then brings in. For example a standard, Rotom W / Celebi / Landorus / Scizor U-Turn team shuts this team down with ease since Landorus makes Jirachi its bitch and Rotom W hates Celebi.
Basically then, this team is (and I had to put this so bluntly) weak to most of the metagame. Chances are, when your weak to the #1 most used pokemon in the game sitting a 30% usage, and you don't really like the #2 most used pokemon either, then your team has problems.
To fix this, I have a few suggestions that I used and tested. Did'nt get too much use out of testing them since I just get haxed like fuck whenever I ladder (seriously its fucking stupid and depressing /endrant)
O.k, I first ran bulky Gyarados over Rotom W. I ran Chesto Rest T-Wave (just for the free rest to help offset that SR weakness if Jirachi was unable to heal) and it worked pretty decently as a Scizor check. It was also able to lure in and T-Wave Rotom W although it lured in Celebi a fair bit too (why?).
Second, I dropped Virizion for a Bulk Up Breloom. Yes, Breloom does not technically "beat" Volt-Turn, but it does a damge good job at checking it, much better than Virizion anyway which was good I guess.
Thirdly, I ran Reflect + CM Latias over Gengar to provide screen support, tank Venusaur and weaken it enough for Terrakion to KO, act as a secondary switch into Rotom W and Celebi etc etc. It was also good for beating CB Scizor and CB Tar (tho Scizor and Tar would ALWAYS crit me the moment I set up reflect). Swords Dance Scizor was a little trickier but its still handled better than the current team as it stands.
Anyway thats just what I tested and it works o.k tho obviously, the team loses a bit of its initial punch with Virizion and Rotom W and Gengar gone. There are just ideas anyway
Yea, Breloom complements well with Jirachi - Gyarados core, since it can deal with Bulky Water & Ferrothorn that the core hates. Celebi works for the same reason, also being able to spread paralysis on different targets than Jirachi - Gyarados. Celebi breaks the Rotom-W / Scizor core, but doesn't fare well when faster U-turners like Landorus enters into the mix.
Latias can work as a deterrent against Chloro Sweeper and somewhat Volt-Turn. Alternatively, we can check Dragons, Sun, and Rain with Scarf Latios and make Terrakion a more formidable Sub Dance / Polish Dance / Choice Band to compensate for the loss of SD Virizion. With Gyarados to check Lucario, Scizor, and Volcarona, throwing around Draco Meteors isn't as risky anymore (although Latios still needs to be wary of TTar).
trouble with Scarf latios is that we lose our revenger if they carry Pursuit Scizor or Pursuit Tar. Thats pretty big considering Scarf Latios is out check for fast dragons etc.
Okay, I've been testing Tomahawk's suggestion and I have to say that it's effective! I'm actually surprised how useful Chansey and Scarf Rachi have been. Ginganinja's Bulky Gyarados actually comes in handy to solidify Tomahawk's advice, since Chansey opens up to Fighting-types that Gyarados can easily handle.
Thanks for your revision, Tomahawk! I'll certainly test other suggestions that have been made during this phase. I wanted to try Tomahawk's idea first, since his suggestion was distinctive from the rest of ours :d
Posting to say that it is very unusual to successfully address a structural problem that a team has, in this case weaknesses to a variety of fast sweepers and coverage schemes, by adding a choice scarf pokemon. This is especially true when you already have one scarf pokemon (terrakion), and for this reason I advise against scarf Jirachi (or at least that you choose between Rachi and Terakkion).
And on that note, I think the weak link of this team is Gengar, it simply doesn't do much for the team. Gengar is good for weakening things like Jirachi, Tyranitar, Scizor, and other steel types, but this team already does very well against them via the combination of Rotom-W and Nidoking. So without having a replacement in mind, I think it would be appropriate to look at a different pokemon for this team.
I've actually replaced Scarf Terrakion for Scarf Rachi, since having 2 scarfers is not really useful in most cases.
As for Gengar, I have found it to be very instrumental to the success of this team. For one, LO PainSplit Gar is just a dangerous set on its own. It really works well with the paralysis provided by the team, and is a good early- mid-game wall breaker to allow Nidoking to sweep with its LO Sheer Force goodness.
Rotom-W can only wear down so much with Volt Switch & SR, so I wouldn't say Rotom-W alone is a reliable way for wearing down the opponent's special walls, especially when our Chansey provides an easy opportunity to heal back up. On a different variant of this team without Chansey, though, you may be right.
I agree with Pocket, I've found Gengar to be on of the handiest additions to this team. Gengar does very well against Rain stall and Rain offense alike once it gets a sub up, and gives many Sand teams a lot of trouble.
We will start voting tomorrow on the different suggested changes to this team that would patch up the team's flaws, which were left unnoticed before. Submit any new changes you have done to this team, so that it is taken into account! This is also a good day to show support to any of the suggested changes listed already.
I've actually tried DetroitLolcat's suggestion of trying out Ferrothorn > Jirachi, SD Scizor > Virizion, and Wisp on Rotom-W, and the team was rather effective, although I gave Ferrothorn Power Whip > Thunder Wave to hit Starmie and U-turn / Superpower on Scizor. It functioned somewhat similarly to spike-stacking Volt-Turn offense, spamming hazards and then wearing down the opponent with Volt-Turns. During my few battles testing this, Nidoking found little action with ScarfTerrakion and Gengar taking most of the action instead, but I need to play with it more to really confirm Nidoking's use in the team.
