would rather force only one stab on bronzong and reject the other if body press is rolled. but really, it's fine lol. it's never been an issue before
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Format Discussion Pokemon Sword & Shield Random Battle Sets
- Thread starter Annika
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Ok, who snuck Heatran into Galar?
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Latias too? What's going on here?
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Pokemon Home has been released.
Home didn't add those mons. It's moreso that TI just wants to start adding some of the Pokemon from the DLCs early.
yes we have been trying different sets for jolteon seeing as how it doesn't have a very wide move pool and no good way to hit ground types now that hidden power is gone from gen 8 so toxic is mostly a filler move
I don't think Noctowl should have whirlwind for the following reasons.
1. It is now a defogger. Whirlwind is best used for racking up chip damage with entry hazards, so giving it to a defogger cuts into its viability. Its second best use is preventing setup, however...
2. Dynamax undermines this. Whirlwind is an unreliable response to setup now. Sending out a known whirlwind-user can easily prompt the other person to activate their dyna and set up even further with the free turn you've given them. That's not to say whirlwind is useless, but I think it's better reserved for pokemon whose options are otherwise lacking. Which leads me to...
3. Noctowl is much stronger this gen. Access to Nasty Plot, Max Airstream, and Max Flare turns it into a potent sweeper. That might be hard to believe, but at level 86 (and soon to rise) Noctowl hits surprisingly hard. Access to Roost gives longevity which it can take advantage of due to its great special bulk and usable physical bulk. And Tinted Lens is, in general, an amazing ability for any setup sweeper. Defog slightly undermines this, but I won't argue against it because it's a much more important move to have than Whirlwind. I'm a somewhat good player, currently in the 2100s with a GXE of 77.8, and I've pulled off a game-winning sweep with Noctowl at least half the times it's had a Nasty Plot set (I want to say every time except 2 or 3, but I might be forgetting instances).
This is my case for removing Whirlwind from Noctowl.
1. It is now a defogger. Whirlwind is best used for racking up chip damage with entry hazards, so giving it to a defogger cuts into its viability. Its second best use is preventing setup, however...
2. Dynamax undermines this. Whirlwind is an unreliable response to setup now. Sending out a known whirlwind-user can easily prompt the other person to activate their dyna and set up even further with the free turn you've given them. That's not to say whirlwind is useless, but I think it's better reserved for pokemon whose options are otherwise lacking. Which leads me to...
3. Noctowl is much stronger this gen. Access to Nasty Plot, Max Airstream, and Max Flare turns it into a potent sweeper. That might be hard to believe, but at level 86 (and soon to rise) Noctowl hits surprisingly hard. Access to Roost gives longevity which it can take advantage of due to its great special bulk and usable physical bulk. And Tinted Lens is, in general, an amazing ability for any setup sweeper. Defog slightly undermines this, but I won't argue against it because it's a much more important move to have than Whirlwind. I'm a somewhat good player, currently in the 2100s with a GXE of 77.8, and I've pulled off a game-winning sweep with Noctowl at least half the times it's had a Nasty Plot set (I want to say every time except 2 or 3, but I might be forgetting instances).
This is my case for removing Whirlwind from Noctowl.
got dusknoir @ (idr order) wow / sub / pain split / shadow sneak and this just made me realize that I hate seeing this pokemon and that it has fundamental problems as is
-sub is awful on this pokemon (consider: would you use sub spiritomb); subsplit is an option for fast pokemon and especially ghost types with the offensive pressure to force something out for the free sub
-shadow sneak is honestly bad and I wish it just had night shade. I love priority moves on anything in rands to get you out of a pinch, but its STAB options suck and shadow sneak hits for 0. night shade at least lets it break (most) subs 100% of the time, and subs tend to wall out its two actually important moves
-I don't think its other attacks (ice punch / eq) are valuable either and it would probably be least bad with haze, curse, or even protect. much better pokemon with much better ways to spend their moveslots get memento; curse theoretically doesn't even kill dusknoir!!
dusknoir is consistently bad and although making it a worse version of dusclops is depressing it's probably the best it can do
pls gib l90
innards out pyukumuku is awful and will lose you games.
-sub is awful on this pokemon (consider: would you use sub spiritomb); subsplit is an option for fast pokemon and especially ghost types with the offensive pressure to force something out for the free sub
-shadow sneak is honestly bad and I wish it just had night shade. I love priority moves on anything in rands to get you out of a pinch, but its STAB options suck and shadow sneak hits for 0. night shade at least lets it break (most) subs 100% of the time, and subs tend to wall out its two actually important moves
-I don't think its other attacks (ice punch / eq) are valuable either and it would probably be least bad with haze, curse, or even protect. much better pokemon with much better ways to spend their moveslots get memento; curse theoretically doesn't even kill dusknoir!!
dusknoir is consistently bad and although making it a worse version of dusclops is depressing it's probably the best it can do
innards out pyukumuku is awful and will lose you games.
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Totally agree on Dusk, especially regarding haze. It has some bulk so at least you could switch it on something you know will try to set up to prevent a sweep.
Also innards out pyukumuku is hilarious and I've caused many people to rage quit with it, and it would be sad to lose that entertainment value. :( But yeah, I really think it should run soak, toxic and recover with unaware literally all the time. Not a fan of mirror coat/counter on it either, although it can be useful in some situations to put some pressure, but meh...
IDK if this serves, but stop making set for old gens or introduce new mons, they're lame, got pikachu with focus sash whey exist raichu, or chansey for blissey, so what's the point of introduce the same pokemon but more cheap?
Pretty sure Pikachu is locked to light ball, which makes it a frail, but relatively hard hitter thanks to its near 300 attack and special attack combined with its level 89, and chansey/blissey haven't been introduced. (and when they were, they both were good in their own right, although Chansey was probably better overall due to Eviolite)
Or you're talking about other random battle format for past gens?
Yeah i'm talking about old gens, specifically gen4 idk when or who modified this and put new pokemons(that aren't good in any aspect) also pikachu(without light ball) had the same level of raichu...:/....and chansey has just 2 levels more than blissey so is a weaker version and eviolite doesn't exists, and this goes for rest of thew pokemons like rhydon... what's the point of inserting them?
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Why does gdarm get forced to scarf? CB is quite good as well and guessing between the two is part of what makes gdarm crazy.
got scarf bounce / eq / pwhip / waterfall gyarados.... still functions just fine as a gyarados, but bounce and scarf shouldn't be mixed. either LO or leftovers (bounce recovery lol) is probably more well-suited and multi-turn attacks should reject choice items
got scarf bounce / eq / pwhip / waterfall gyarados.... still functions just fine as a gyarados, but bounce and scarf shouldn't be mixed. either LO or leftovers (bounce recovery lol) is probably more well-suited and multi-turn attacks should reject choice items
bounce on scarf gyara is used primarily for dmax purposes since you would most likely use it in the way of dmaxing then using airstream for the speed and getting moxie boosts as well to then sweep after you get out of dmax with the preferred move
gyarados is either dynamaxing or not dynamaxing
dynamaxing, it has max airstream anyway and unless it's forced to not use it for 3 whole turns, at +1, it outspeeds most pokemon that can give it problems outside of the faster electric types (jolteon / zeraora). post dynamax, without scarf, you can't switch it back out and stay fast, but with scarf it's locked into spamming a +0 no boost waterfall. with LO it's at least doing 1.3 that damage and free to switch moves.
not dynamaxing, scarf bounce is just bad
More like +1 because of max geyser rain haha gottem
Maybe if it has Moxie we give it scarf with bounce but don't allow it if it's Intimidate?
Also what do you mean "it has max airstream anyways"
I would like to propose removing swords dance from the move pool of both zacian and zacian-crowned. with 138 and 148 base speed, respectively, they outspeed almost anything naturally, and already get a +1 attack boost from their intrepid sword ability. If they are able to get a clean switch in from a fainted teammate, and are able to get one swords dance, they OHKO almost anything that the opponent can throw at them, especially zacian-crowned with its behemoth blade. I think that if swords dance were removed, their sweep potential would be reduced significantly.
I honestly put SD Zacian in the same tier Mega Rayquaza was during the short time it could be used in RandBats, before being entirely removed.
And it's not just the combination of its insane attack and its speed (which allows it to outspeed pretty much everything that's scarfed and could kill it in RB)... It sports a very good defensive typing along with good defensive stats (92 base HP and 115 base defense) that makes it take very take little from any priority move, even the unresisted ones (which are all 60 bp). And even the scarfed Pokémon I was referring to, which can hit it super effectively, struggle to KO it because of that...
So, yeah, I'd be entirely in favor of removing SD, even though limiting movesets that are "too good" isn't something that is generally done in RB (I remember TI mentionning that it's not something he wants to do)... But yeah, that's not a case of being "too good", that's a case of being completely unfair and ridiculous.
And as I pointed out, something was done for Mega Ray, so I think it's entirely justified to do something for Zacian. Either removing SD, removing it entirely (I wouldn't go as far as that) or dropping its level to like 65-69 to allow more Pokémon that can do something to it to outspeed it with scarf.
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I disagree. I don't think we should try to make mons less competitive, no matter how good they are. I think that sets a bad standard.
It sucks to be taken out by a +3 Zacian C, but it also feels great to take down a Zacian C and play around it (no matter how rare that is). So long as it's in the meta, I don't think we should clip its wings.
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