Metagame Pure Hackmons [Leader's Choice]

[justideas]

I was worried this meta would be just stupid broken. But so far, nothing has been a real issue besides Eternamax... with a base stat of 1125.... Okay, okay, I get this is Hackmons without the rules, but come on, that's not even a Pokemon. Surely you can make an exception for banning the only G/Dyna/max form available (One that boosts the normal stat changes to max pokemon), and one that looks soooo dumb. So dumb.


Anyway, here's a simple team that seemed to have an easy time with most of the meta, I just kept winning until I got past 1300... I'm guessing that's mostly just because no good players were around at time:


Regieleki @ Mental Herb
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Taunt
- Octolock
- Thousand Arrows
- Magnet Rise

Kartana @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Gorilla Tactics
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Sunsteel Strike
- Wood Hammer
- Close Combat
- Flip Turn

Zygarde-Complete @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Arena Trap
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Shore Up
- Belly Drum
- Sunsteel Strike
- Thousand Arrows

Dialga @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Court Change
- Core Enforcer
- Taunt
- Recover

Calyrex-Shadow @ Focus Sash
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Astral Barrage
- Photon Geyser
- Moonblast
- Shell Smash

Zacian-Crowned @ Assault Vest
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Lonely Nature
- V-create
- Fleur Cannon
- Superpower
- Sunsteel Strike

Basic explanation

I wasn't really forced to adapt much. But i guess i should have been using huge power over gorilla tactics, etc. Still, the team worked as intended.

Regieleki is a busted wonder guard user due to its speed and typing. Against unprepared opponents, it can easily 6-0. Taunt/magnet rise deals with most things that could have touched you, but since no one really can assume your ability, you can usually get away with Octolocking immediately. Octolock is a permanent trapping move, which also comes with the benefit of continually dropping the opponent's def/spdef after every turn, all from just one use of the move... So glad this isn't a common move. It doesn't hit ghost types, but it does allow you to break everything else as eventually, they'll be at -6. -6 defences and still trapped. Thousand arrows is the least resisted move in the game and it hits the other electric type wonderguard users

Kartana is your simple attacker, outspeeds most things and gets a strong hit off. Gorilla tactics+choice scarf of course makes you both banded and scarf at the same time. I only ever press sunsteel strike as it hits everything and beats down most wonderguards, but cc gives you a dynamax boosting option, woodhammer is just there for powerful stab (Probably least useful), and flip turn is just in case your opponent relies on trapping/walls.

Zygarde on paper is unstoppable, and sometimes it does work that way. It's a trapper that can belly drum and kill just about anything, with sunsteel strike (again) to kill wonderguard/unaware, etc, and then thousand arrows for that coverage. Shore up lets you stay healthy and at neutral you live basically everything except the strongest ice moves and OHKOs.

Dialga is kinda just my random support, but it still works well. Sturdy and the support moves basically mean it's always useful somehow and is a OHKO spam check. Being slow with core enforcer lets you do decent damage whilst also removing annoying abilities and crippling most strategies. Taunt is so you don't get set up on and can sack Dialga to bring in your sweeper, court change + boots is of course just the best answer to all opposing hazards.

Calyrex is just a turn 1 sweeper. Set up a shell smash, dynamax so you can't be phased. Too easy. I will mention though that +2, psychic terrain boosted, max mindstorm from this monster still doesn't OHKO Eternamax. But what can you do when you're playing against the virtual embodiment of cheating? It still tends to beat entire teams of them even without the +2 OHKO, and +3 with terrain will improve things..

Zacian is also another reliable sweeper with the basic contrary deal. Fleur cannon for those defensive mons and the occasional ghost/dark wonderguard, superpower/v-create is all the boost you need, and sunsteel (AGAIN?) is an answer to most problematic Pokemon and a good stab option.

..and i didn't realise this was the end of the month. Oh well.

 

[Ransei]

I was worried this meta would be just stupid broken. But so far, nothing has been a real issue besides Eternamax... with a base stat of 1125.... Okay, okay, I get this is Hackmons without the rules, but come on, that's not even a Pokemon. Surely you can make an exception for banning the only G/Dyna/max form available (One that boosts the normal stat changes to max pokemon), and one that looks soooo dumb. So dumb.


Anyway, here's a simple team that seemed to have an easy time with most of the meta, I just kept winning until I got past 1300... I'm guessing that's mostly just because no good players were around at time:


Regieleki @ Mental Herb
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Taunt
- Octolock
- Thousand Arrows
- Magnet Rise

Kartana @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Gorilla Tactics
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Sunsteel Strike
- Wood Hammer
- Close Combat
- Flip Turn

Zygarde-Complete @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Arena Trap
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Shore Up
- Belly Drum
- Sunsteel Strike
- Thousand Arrows

Dialga @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Court Change
- Core Enforcer
- Taunt
- Recover

Calyrex-Shadow @ Focus Sash
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Astral Barrage
- Photon Geyser
- Moonblast
- Shell Smash

Zacian-Crowned @ Assault Vest
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Lonely Nature
- V-create
- Fleur Cannon
- Superpower
- Sunsteel Strike

Basic explanation

Regieleki is a busted wonder guard user due to its speed and typing. Against unprepared opponents, it can easily 6-0. Taunt/magnet rise deals with most things that could have touched you, but since no one really can assume your ability, you can usually get away with Octolocking immediately. Octolock is a permanent trapping move, which also comes with the benefit of continually dropping the opponent's def/spdef after every turn, all from just one use of the move... So glad this isn't a common move. It doesn't hit ghost types, but it does allow you to break everything else as eventually, they'll be at -6. -6 defences and still trapped. Thousand arrows is the least resisted move in the game and it hits the other electric type wonderguard users

Kartana is your simple attacker, outspeeds most things and gets a strong hit off. Gorilla tactics+choice scarf of course makes you both banded and scarf at the same time. I only ever press sunsteel strike as it hits everything and beats down most wonderguards, but cc gives you a dynamax boosting option, woodhammer is just there for powerful stab (Probably least useful), and flip turn is just in case your opponent relies on trapping/walls.

Zygarde on paper is unstoppable, and sometimes it does work that way. It's a trapper that can belly drum and kill just about anything, with sunsteel strike (again) to kill wonderguard/unaware, etc, and then thousand arrows for that coverage. Shore up lets you stay healthy and at neutral you live basically everything except the strongest ice moves and OHKOs.

Dialga is kinda just my random support, but it still works well. Sturdy and the support moves basically mean it's always useful somehow and is a OHKO spam check. Being slow with core enforcer lets you do decent damage whilst also removing annoying abilities and crippling most strategies. Taunt is so you don't get set up on and can sack Dialga to bring in your sweeper, court change + boots is of course just the best answer to all opposing hazards.

Calyrex is just a turn 1 sweeper. Set up a shell smash, dynamax so you can't be phased. Too easy. I will mention though that +2, psychic terrain boosted, max mindstorm from this monster still doesn't OHKO Eternamax. But what can you do when you're playing against the virtual embodiment of cheating? It still tends to beat entire teams of them even without the +2 OHKO, and +3 with terrain will improve things..

Zacian is also another reliable sweeper with the basic contrary deal. Fleur cannon for those defensive mons and the occasional ghost/dark wonderguard, superpower/v-create is all the boost you need, and sunsteel (AGAIN?) is an answer to most problematic Pokemon and a good stab option.

..and i didn't realise this was the end of the month. Oh well.

The entire metagame carries a Neutralizing Gas infestation which is arguably a bigger issue than Eternatus-Eternamax itself. Neutralizing Gas shuts down almost every ability and in addition, shuts down your entire team by itself. This is problematic in your case, since most Pokemon in the highest parts of the ladder carry this ability.

There is almost no real way around Neutralizing Gas either. One of your best bets are to run Gastro Acid on various Pokemon (Pokemon with offense stat boosting abilities won't work as the target can just switch to another Neutralizing Gas Pokemon and soak a hit. Wonder Guard and Shadow Tag are the best for Gastro Acid). You can also run Comatose and if you are using Cramorant-Gourging specifically, Gulp Missile. Both of those are the only viable abilities that don't get shut down by Neutralizing Gas. Alternatively, you should also run Magic Bounce in case of Comatose users run Sleep Talk Whirlwind, and you can run No Guard Pokemon since they function with OHKO moves similarly to that of Neutralizing Gas Pokemon, but also punish Pokemon who lack that ability and aren't Wonder Guard or Sturdy.

 

[justideas]

The entire metagame carries a Neutralizing Gas infestation which is arguably a bigger issue than Eternatus-Eternamax itself. Neutralizing Gas shuts down almost every ability and in addition, shuts down your entire team by itself. This is problematic in your case, since most Pokemon in the highest parts of the ladder carry this ability.

There is almost no real way around Neutralizing Gas either. One of your best bets are to run Gastro Acid on various Pokemon (Pokemon with offense stat boosting abilities won't work as the target can just switch to another Neutralizing Gas Pokemon and soak a hit. Wonder Guard and Shadow Tag are the best for Gastro Acid). You can also run Comatose and if you are using Cramorant-Gourging specifically, Gulp Missile. Both of those are the only viable abilities that don't get shut down by Neutralizing Gas. Alternatively, you should also run Magic Bounce in case of Comatose users run Sleep Talk Whirlwind, and you can run No Guard Pokemon since they function with OHKO moves similarly to that of Neutralizing Gas Pokemon, but also punish Pokemon who lack that ability and aren't Wonder Guard or Sturdy.

Yeah... i quickly started finding games with better opponents... well maybe not better opponents, but far more neutralising/eternamax teams.

Problem is still eternamax though. Any other pokemon you would kill/outspeed easily enough. The stats allow it to run the ability without caring about anything else.

I had been killing them with spect and core enforcer+trap/set up. But as soon as i encountered teams with 2-3 Eternamax all carrying gas, i realised this wasn't the meta for me lol

 

[ISuspectNothing]

I have to agree. I have managed to get into the top 3 on ladder, and I think Eternamax and Neutralizing Gas are problematic, with Neutralizing Gas being the worse offender. I think a ban of both Neutralizing Gas and Eternamax would do wonders for this meta, to be honest - even if it is against the general concept of PH of allowing everything that is doable on cartridge. There are so many interesting concepts, ideas... that all can't be used due to Eternamax walling everything that does not carry an OHKO move (or something like trap + perish song) and Neutralizing Gas shutting down every ability.

 

[Ransei]

Hello

Mbouchon has been added to the Gen 8 Pure Hackmons council. They've been around and active during the DLC2 Overflow meta time period. They have also proven to have valuable insight of the metagame with their input shown in this thread and within the Pure Hackmons community.

 

[aerobee]

Two-part post here!

Part One

Hello

Mbouchon has been added to the Gen 8 Pure Hackmons council. They've been around and active during the DLC2 Overflow meta time period. They have also proven to have valuable insight of the metagame with their input shown in this thread and within the Pure Hackmons community.

Thanks!


Part Two

Section One

I've taken a quick look at the usage stats for last month's ladder, and wanted to voice a few thoughts.

Keep in mind that:

- My understanding of usage stats, raw stats, and real stats is fairly rudimentary. But from what I do know,
- Usage stats are weighted, as they're mostly used to guide less experienced players by encouraging them to try out the most common sets. Players who play more often, and players with a higher Elo, are counted as more.
- Raw stats are unweighted, meaning they're a more apt way to measure the actual Pokemon players ran, experienced or not.
- "Real" stats only record the Pokemon that were actually on the field at some point in the battle. As far as I know this isn't weighted.
- For the purposes of this post, I'm using the data for players with a Glicko-1 of 1760 or more.

Obviously that isn't a detailed explanation, so here's some more information on how usage stats are structured.

Section Two

Here are my thoughts:

Subsection One: Eternamax & Regieleki Usage

When the ladder began, I thought that Eternamax would achieve at least 250% raw usage, and that Regieleki would reach a slightly less obscene 150%. However, the results show quite the opposite:

- Eternamax had far and away the highest weighted usage stat at 243.44% (which is to be expected).
- However, its raw stat was far lower at 96.36%; this surprised me. I thought a much larger portion of less experienced players would try spamming Eternamax on their teams.
- Its "real" stat was even lower at 78.71%, which tells me that instead of carelessly switching into Eternamax in battles, most players actually resorted to switching into another defensive option; I'm guessing less experienced players, for the most part, used Shedinja instead for this role.

- Regieleki's weighted usage stat was far lower than Eternamax's, at 122.30%, despite two Regieleki being the dominant archetype (at least from what I've seen when battling experienced players).
- Its raw stat was less than that of Eternamax, but the drop from weighted stats was less drastic; altogether it was 86.69%.
- Regieleki's real stat was surprisingly higher than Eternamax's, at 88.43% - no doubt inflated by mostly inexperienced players running No Guard and Wonder Guard sets.

Subsection Two: Other Viable Pokemon

Even with other viable Pokemon, there were takeaways that I find interesting.

- Giratina's weighted usage stat was far higher than its raw usage, indicating that virtually only high-ladder players used the Pokemon. This is understandable - it doesn't provide any low-ladder strategies, and at a glance it seems outclassed by Eternamax. However its Ghost typing gives it a valuable role as a Final Gambit/Rapid Spin blocker that's also bulky enough to take multiple Spectral Thief/Knock Off hits.
- Grimmsnarl had an even larger differences between its weighted and unweighted usage stats, with the former being five times as high as the latter.
- The same can also be said for Cramorant-Gorging, Landorus-T, Obstagoon, and even Pokemon like Yveltal to a lesser extent.
- Regigigas was a surprising top 10 Pokemon for me, as I, for one, have never seen it used by "meta" players; however, after thinking of it for a while I think it's definitely viable. Its impressive 110/110/110 bulk, Normal typing, and monstrous 160 base Attack may actually give it a decently large presence in the metagame.
- Interestingly, Pokemon that were more viable in the pre-DLC metagame, such as Dragapult, Necrozma-DW, and Kyurem-W were also relatively common, with all three getting at least 1.5% usage.
- Some niche Pokemon like Kyurem-B and Ho-Oh saw raw usage of over double that of weighted usage - this can be attributed to their niches being relatively tiny.

Subsection Three: Unviable Pokemon

Some of these were just absurd. Keep in mind that the usage stats are ordered from highest to lowest, based on Pokemon's weighted stats. This means that unviable Pokemon's raw usage stats were likely far higher.

- Magikarp had about 2% raw usage.
- Shuckle had over 10% raw usage.
- Shedinja had over 30% raw usage - to be fair, I've seen a ton of these in low ladder; even when weighted its usage was at over 7%.
- There were a few strong physical attackers with no place in the metagame - Pokemon like Kartana and Calyrex-I - relatively high up.
- Burn Up Wonder Guard, as expected, was a prolific strategy on the ladder - Cinderace made the top 25.
- Air Balloon Wonder Guard Pokemon also appeared to be widespread, with Zeraora being the 14th highest.

Section Three

Now I'm going to compare this month's usage stats to those of February 2020.

- Eternamax's weighted usage actually fell during this time period, despite Eternamax having gotten much more important when teambuilding. Ransei says that's because he advocated for Eternamax usage during February's ladder. Its unweighted and "real" usage stats fell as well.
- Zacian-C's usage fell drastically, as it isn't as good as Eternamax anymore.
- Shedinja's usage actually rose - this possibly points towards more (casual) players and less experienced battlers.

For the most part changes in usage have been due to shifts in the metagame.

Conclusion

The Hackmons ladder was pretty fun even if I was only able to ladder for two days; uncovering trends in usage stats and differences between low and high ladder was an interesting experience as well.

 

[supermario1096]

Is Mental Herb or Choice Scarf better on Comaphazing Regieleki? I ask this because some people on Showdown said to run Choice Scarf instead of Mental Herb.

 

[Ransei]

Is Mental Herb or Choice Scarf better on Comaphazing Regieleki? I ask this because some people on Showdown said to run Choice Scarf instead of Mental Herb.

Yeah with Comaphazing, the main thing to worry about is getting outsped by other Choice Scarf users. Taunt is not problematic as Prankster Taunt is really rare and you either outspeed the rest or get reflected on by Magic Bounce/Coat. Pokemon who are faster than a comapahazer have far more opportunities to work around them. Some examples would be comaphazing back and more efficiently or OHKOing with an attack. Choice Scarf is better.

 

[supermario1096]

Ok.

 

[supermario1096]

Overflow and the new DLC invalidates some Pokemon that could've been good in the base game or Isle of Armor when people didn't know about overflow yet.
https://pokepast.es/ec99b828736c7379
A classic Garm-Zen Mode set could work with Fissure and Sheer Cold, but Comaphazing Regieleki invalidates it. But if it runs its regular set, Eternatus invalidates it without the aforementioned moves.

 

[aerobee]

Even though it's been nearly ten months since the Overflow mechanic and DLC2 transformed the metagame into what it is, discoveries are still being made.

I'm guessing you, the Hackmons player reading this post, hates having to use two Eternamax on every viable team. Well, I think I've circumvented that feature.

Here's one set that I've recently been trying out:



Eiscue @ Leftovers
Ability: Ice Face
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Circle Throw
- Hail
- Sheer Cold
- Knock Off

So, you may ask, why would I use this over, say, physically defensive Eternamax?

Well, here are a few reasons why:

- It's an Ice type that, with Ice Face, can take one physical attack. As three OHKO moves are physical and the fourth one is nullified due to its Ice typing, Eiscue is able to survive one OHKO move hit.
- Again due to its Ice typing, Sheer Cold's accuracy is increased to 30%; this is useful because Ice types are nearly non-existent in Hackmons, and therefore Sheer Cold hits virtually everything.
- Eiscue-Noice hits base 130 Speed, which is enough to outspeed Overflowed Eternamax.

Oh, and Ice Face isn't nullified by Neutralizing Gas (from what I know).


Here are a couple of replays to showcase the usefulness of the above:
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8purehackmons-1398362102 - Eiscue pressures defensive Pokemon with Sheer Cold and gets hit by Fissure.
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8purehackmons-1398332140-5ssszyu9wr3ayclmzabdcgw6ol2bzp3pw - Eiscue KOs several Pokemon with Sheer Cold, as no opposing Pokemon aren't affected by the move. While I did get lucky, Ice Face definitely helped in this battle.


The only physical Pokemon that would give Eiscue a hard time would be Zacian-C, as Double Iron Bash can severely dent or KO it, even with Ice Face. I recommend running it with Cramorant-Gorging, because of this.


Have fun with this Pokemon!

e: Ice Face shouldn't trigger when a Neutralizing Gas Pokemon switches, as DaWoblefet said below. However, I still think it can work on teams that need more support against OHKO moves.

 

[DaWoblefet]

Oh, and Ice Face isn't nullified by Neutralizing Gas (from what I know).

Here are a couple of replays to showcase the usefulness of the above:
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8purehackmons-1398362102 - Eiscue pressures defensive Pokemon with Sheer Cold and gets hit by Fissure.
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8purehackmons-1398332140-5ssszyu9wr3ayclmzabdcgw6ol2bzp3pw - Eiscue KOs several Pokemon with Sheer Cold, as no opposing Pokemon aren't affected by the move. While I did get lucky, Ice Face definitely helped in this battle.

One of the things I love about Pure Hackmons is its ability to expose mechanics bugs. As you correctly point out, Neutralizing Gas doesn't impact Ice Face, which means that unlike these replays, Eiscue's Ice Face will not instantly reform upon a Neutralizing Gas Pokemon leaving the field while Eiscue-Noice is in hail. I think this is a huge nerf to Eiscue's role that you propose here, because you don't get a ton of "free Ice Face" so to speak.

 

[Lectrys]

One of the things I love about Pure Hackmons is its ability to expose mechanics bugs. As you correctly point out, Neutralizing Gas doesn't impact Ice Face, which means that unlike these replays, Eiscue's Ice Face will not instantly reform upon a Neutralizing Gas Pokemon leaving the field while Eiscue-Noice is in hail. I think this is a huge nerf to Eiscue's role that you propose here, because you don't get a ton of "free Ice Face" so to speak.

Given how annoying removing the first 2 Ice Faces was on my end (I lost the game in the first link), I think Eiscue is still viable in Pure Hackmons even if/when Ice Face's interactions with Neutralizing Gas are correctly implemented (I'm personally thinking B- or B to start off with since it feels like a less reliable version of Drifblim that takes less than 50% from Eternamax's Knock Off/Spectral Thief and can take advantage of outspeeding most Eternamaxes a fair chunk of the time, but I want to test further). Cramorant-Gorging support is appreciated to scare Sub Taunt Eternamaxes, but I think Eiscue is fine as a hole plugger.

 

[aerobee]

This is likely going to be the last Pokemon "discovered" to have a place in the metagame before an update to the viability rankings.

I'm talking about this little guy:



Ditto @ Quick Powder
Ability: Comatose
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Encore / Substitute / Imprison / Rapid Spin
- Knock Off
- Horn Drill / Guillotine
- Recover

Why use this over other Normal-types?

Miki327: i know there is an item thet doubles ditto speed
Miki327: for that provably
^ihavebestsandteam: oh
Miki327: but still
^ihavebestsandteam: quick powder

Well, that's why. With Quick Powder, Ditto's able to outspeed Eternamax, a quality no other Normal-type possesses.

And why use it over Regieleki? Its Normal typing makes it easier to switch into most Eternamax; that is, Eternamax lacking Knock Off.

Due to its poor bulk (in one of the replays below it took ~40% from Lava Plume Eternamax) and vulnerability to Knock Off, however, I think that at best it's fringe viability in the metagame, and is probably forced to run either Substitute or Imprison to have an optimal set.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8purehackmons-1407018593 - Ditto struggles with Substitute + Taunt Eternamax; however it can Encore and allow teammates to support it with moves like Rapid Spin.
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8purehackmons-1407035366 - Ditto switches relatively liberally into Eternamax, Encores, and then allows a teammate to take advantage of Eternamax being locked into Lava Plume.

It probably shouldn't have been run with Cramorant-Gorging already offering valuable speed control; instead OHKO switch-ins like Ghost-types, Flying-types that are useful in other ways like Yveltal, and Eiscue would help support it.

One last thing: Cinccino and Persian can both outspeed Overflowed Eternamax; the former has better stats, and I think its potentially viable as well.

 

[supermario1096]

So Wonder Guard Gastro Acid sets can be annoying if you don't have the right answers for it, and it is VERY common, but Thousand Arrows can dispose of them.

 

[Ransei]

This is long overdue, but here is an update to the Gen 8 Pure Hackmons viability rankings. This update is to reflect overflow and DLC2 altogether.

Eternamax Rank - [Tip: Run at least one of these on every single team. Preferably 2-3.]

Eternatus-Eternamax

Why does it have its own rank?

Eternamax is literally Gen 8 Pure Hackmons as a Pokemon. With an immense BST of 1125, defenses higher than Ultra Necrozma's entire statspread combined, and stat overflow leaving it invincible in either Defense or Special Defense, it's been given no other choice other than to embody the entire metagame. Everything in Pure Hackmons revolves around defeating this beast whether it's through the use of OHKO moves, Shell Smash + Mixed Super Effective Psychic-type/Dragon-type/Ice-type STAB attacks, Perish Song, Comaphazing, Hazards, or Final Gambit. These methods are often made into full-on strategies used in complete teams to win because this Pokemon's presence single-handedly makes them the only wincons. Eternatus-Eternamax also heavily dictates the entire Viability Rankings. The only Pokemon who are viable are Eternamax, Pokemon who support Eternamax, Pokemon who have methods against Eternamax, and Pokemon who have counteractions to methods against Eternamax. Last but not least, teams without Eternatus-Eternamax are put into a critical disadvantage due to Eternamax being the only Pokemon fully capable of dealing with the entire rest of the metagame. Thanks to Neutralizing Gas, Regieleki, Zacian-Crowned, and Calyrex-Shadow would break the metagame to the point where players could easily win with no effort if their opponent fails to carry Eternamax. Eternamax is mandatory in every team and almost every action taken for victory reflects on its presence.

In summary, not only is Eternamax mandatory in each team, but players have to take Eternamax into consideration in every step they take, whether it's through teambuilding or playing the game, and Eternamax significantly warps the entire Gen 8 Pure Hackmons Viability Rankings. Eternamax can arguably be considered as the most centralizing Pokemon to ever exist in any tier or OM format and it goes way beyond any Pokemon that would usually lie in S or S+ in other Viability Rankings.

S Rank - [Tip: Consider these on most if not every team.]
S+

Regieleki

S

Zacian-Crowned

S-
None

A Rank - [Tip: Consider these on plenty if not most of your teams.]
A+

Calyrex-Shadow

Giratina

A

Cramorant-Gorging

Giratina-Origin

Landorus-Therian

Spiritomb

Yveltal

A-

Aegislash

Doublade

Grimmsnarl

Obstagoon

Regigigas

B Rank - [Tip: Usable but difficult to pull off effectively.]
B+

Eiscue

Kyurem-Black

B

Corviknight

Drifblim

Drapion

Necrozma-Dawn-Wings

Rayquaza

B-

Mewtwo

Mimikyu

Necrozma-Dusk-Mane

Reshiram

C Rank - [Tip: Only use these if your purpose is to fulfill a small niche.]
C+

Dragapult

Gyarados

C

Braviary

Gourgeist-Super

C-

Hydreigon

Krookodile

Zarude

E Rank - [Tip: Not worth using but you can try. This is Pure Hackmons after all! You may find something that works against some teams.]

Everything else

Blacklist: Popular ideas that are forbidden from discussion or ever being considered above E rank.

Shedinja

Why?

Shedinja is a useless sitting duck against every serious Pure Hackmons team. The idea of giving Sturdy to a Pokemon with 1 HP is tempting, but Neutralizing Gas is on more Pokemon than not, shutting down Sturdy and allowing Shedinja to get KOed for free. In addition, Gen 8 Pure Hackmons is a metagame flooded with Ghost-types who block Endeavor, hazards that KO Shedinja in one touch, and phazing to force Shedinja out in front of hazards at random. Against serious teams, Shedinja cannot do anything other than faint. The combination of Ghost-types, hazards, phazing, and especially Neutralizing Gas make Shedinja outright impossible to properly use. It only works at all against opponents whose team is not prepared for the Gen 8 Pure Hackmons metagame.

Wonder Guard Burn Up

Why?

Wonder Guard Burn Up users are useless sitting ducks against every serious Pure Hackmons team. The idea of removing a Wonder Guard's typing to block all attacks is temping, but Neutralizing Gas is on more Pokemon than not, shutting down Wonder Guard and allowing Burn Up users to get KOed for free. Wonder Guard users require Gastro Acid in Gen 8 Pure Hackmons, and Burn Up only just adds fire to the flame. Burn Up users would be left with two moves left to use and the fastest user Cinderace is still outsped by Calyrex-Shadow, Eternatus-Eternamax, Zacian-Crowned, and Regieleki. All three of them can either use Substitute to work around Gastro Acid and fizzle out their Burn Up or outspeed, attack, and switch out. Wonder Guards with better type combinations do not need to rely on Burn Up and can run a third move to work around their flaws more effectively. They also tend to have better stat distributions for Wonder Guards in Gen 8 Pure Hackmons. Here is a more detailed explanation of why Burn Up is not good: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/pure-hackmons.3656851/page-3#post-8375359

This should be relatively accurate because they're based on the state of the metagame. Regieleki and Zacian-Crowned are dominant while every Pokemon below S rank have something similar to other Pokemon below S on the VR. Try to figure out the similarities. What do these Pokemon have in common?

If you have any questions or suggestions about this VR or if you have the answer to the question above, feel free to post about it here.

 

[Ransei]

This is the final post that'll be made on this thread. Two major exploits have been discovered for Pokemon Sword and Shield earlier this year. These exploits would have shown to drastically shift the Pokemon Sword and Shield Pure Hackmons metagame into an even worse state than Overflow left it.

Exploitation #1: pre-Dynamax HP boosts
Pokemon are able to be sent out in their Dynamax formes in battle. These Pokemon are still able to use regular moves and Dynamax on their own after being sent out. This was first thought of as just a visual exploit, but it's been shown that this enables each Pokemon's HP be doubled prior to dynamaxing.

For example, take Blissey

Blissey's maximum HP is 714.
Blissey, when sent out visually as dynamaxed can have its HP at 1428.
Blissey can have its HP at 2856 when it dynamaxes after being visually sent out as dynamax.

How does Exploitation #1 affect the metagame?
The pre-Dynamax HP boost exploitation will completely put an end to Shell Smash sweepers. Despite being unable to Dynamax, Eternatus-Eternamax is able to be sent out in a pre-Dynamax forme and have 1428 HP. Overflow has already handed a heavy burden to Shell Smash sweepers, as they were forced to use mixed attacks moves in order to have any chance against Eternatus-Eternamax. With Eternatus-Eternamax's HP being doubled, any Shell Smasher will now be infeasible to use. OHKO moves have become the main and almost sole method of taking down Eternamax.

In addition, moves such as Water Spout, Eruption, and Dragon Energy are able to have 300 Base Power. Unfortunately, Eternatus-Eternamax is not threatened by this since it can all just overflow to 0 SpD to avoid these moves while still overwhelmingly tanking every physical Shell Smash sweeper.

More Information about Exploitation #1 here: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threa...chanics-research.3655528/page-63#post-9007455

Exploitation #2: HP Editing
A Pokemon's HP can be edited to a maximum of 65,536 and used in local battles through hacking.

How does Exploitation #2 affect the metagame?
HP Editing will affect the metagame very similarly to how pre-Dynamax does, except to bigger extent. This time, Water Spout, Eruption, and Dragon Energy are able to have 65,536 Base Power at maximum and almost every Pokemon can be threatened by these moves. Eternatus-Eternamax can once again overflow to 0 SpD in order to avoid these moves and it will continue to tank every physical Shell Smash sweeper in the metagame.

It may be possible for Exploitation #2 to exist for local matches in previous generations of Pokemon it has yet to be discovered for them. Maybe we'll find out in the distant future.

More information about Exploitation #2 here: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threa...chanics-research.3655528/page-63#post-9015761

These two exploitations have left the Generation 8 Pure Hackmons metagame into nothing more than a complete OHKO fest. Very few Pokemon will be viable if or whenever these exploitations get implemented on PS. The constant downward spiral this metagame has taken since this thread was made has left Sword and Shield Pure Hackmons no longer worth playing. This is credited by the opinion of me, players who succeeded pre-Overflow, and each of the OM Forum Staff members.

Pokemon Brilliant Diamond and Shining Pearl will now serve as the primary host for Generation 8 Pure Hackmons. Pure Hackmons will be the ONLY metagame to do this.

This thread will now be closed and archived into the OM Archive subforum.

 

[Ransei]

In light of recent discussion made in the BDSP Pure Hackmons thread from Daylight, the OM Moderation team sought and found a new definition of Pure Hackmons and Balanced Hackmons. From now on, anything directly hackable onto a set (EVs, IVs, forme, ability, item, and move) and is usable in local battles is allowed. This new premise redirects the focus of Pure/Balanced Hackmons to the Pokémon themselves; meaning that we're only taking all Pokémon already programmed into the respective game a Pure/Balanced Hackmons format is based on and allowing anything that can be hacked onto their set. This effectively changes nothing on the Pure Hackmons and Balanced Hackmons metagames but clears up the policy to prevent future disruption or policy debates regarding Pure Hackmons. This does not make Gen 8 Pure Hackmons playable competitively as the complications of Neutralizing Gas and the Overflow mechanic (this is not a hack) still force the entire game to structure around firing 30% accuracy OHKO moves with very little alternative for a consistent winning strategy. However, it's been found that BDSP Pure Hackmons is not much better and not as appealing to the playerbase. The OM Moderation team and BDSP Pure Hackmons council have both agreed on Sword and Shield being the preferred host of Gen 8 Pure Hackmons despite the complications it holds for the current generation.

Additionally, since the video on Pure Hackmons made by freezai, there has been an upward spiral of demand for this format to be playable again. Gen 8 Pure Hackmons is the only possible format where Eternatus-Eternamax is available to use to its fullest extent and if there's one significant perk Sword and Shield Pure Hackmons has over BDSP, this is it. BDSP Pure Hackmons has an extreme lack of playability, appeal, and development; lots of players are wanting to use Eternamax for themselves; this calls for an exchange.

The OM Moderation team would like to keep only one current gen Pure Hackmons thread up at a time to remain consistent with the rest of the subforum. Both BDSP and Sword and Shield Hackmons will be supported in the Old Gen Hackmons Megathread when Generation 9 comes out. We have now decided to archive the BDSP Pure Hackmons thread and reopen this thread for the remainder of Gen 8. Sword and Shield Pure Hackmons will also be available to play on PS! through roomtours and challenges. Enjoy your eldritch horror!

I'm out! Mbouchon will be taking over as Gen 8 Pure Hackmons leader.​

 

[aerobee]

Glad to see the thread's up again!

Say hello to Pure Hackmons' new council!

BahamutLagoon

Lectrys

Mbouchon (Leader)

Ransei

 

[aerobee]

Unrelatedly, here are some ideas I have that I'd like to throw out:



Kyurem-Black @ Life Orb / Expert Belt / Heavy-Duty Boots?
Ability: Comatose / Neutralizing Gas
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Sheer Cold
- Shell Smash
- Glacial Lance
- Thousand Arrows

A couple days ago Ransei, BahamutLagoon, and I were discussing the Pokemon on the Viability Rankings (which are actually quite inaccurate), and Kyurem-B was given as an example of how terrible Shell Smash sweepers are in the metagame, largely thanks to Overflowed Eternamax. Of course, there are other factors, like Dark-types like Yveltal and Spiritomb walling Pokemon reliant on Stored Power and Psystrike to break through both physically and specially defensive Eternamax (Indeedee, offensive Calyrex-S), most sweepers being overly reliant on opposing Eternamax being heavily chipped (Rayquaza, Regigigas, Obstagoon, Indeedee), and sweepers' chances to sweep being limited, whether it's due to speed control measures like Choice Scarf Zacian-C (Kyurem-B, Rayquaza, Obstagoon, Regigigas) or if it's because of issues with longevity, defensive typing, or status from Cramorant-Gorging and Nuzzle and Glare users (Calyrex-S, Kyurem-B).

Sheer Cold, in theory, mostly remedies this issue. Physically defensive Eternamax, the only real check to Shell Smash Kyurem-B on most teams, is forced to risk getting KOed by the move every time it comes in to check Kyurem-B, meaning things could go very wrong for the opponent if Kyurem-B rids itself of checks for the rest of the game. Glacial Lance is an incredible boon that Kyurem-B gets, making it basically the only Shell Smash user that can realistically KO (specially defensive) Eternamax after a single Shell Smash and some chip damage without Dynamax. Thousand Arrows also seems nice on paper to KO Zacian-C lacking a Choice Scarf after a Shell Smash, and beats random Wonder Guard Regieleki that can annoy opposing teams with Gastro Acid. That's also why I slashed Comatose here - on paper, Kyurem-B has the flexibility to run Comatose in tandem with Thousand Arrows, because no Wonder Guard user is realistically going to be run in the metagame that walls this set. You really want either Life Orb or Expert Belt to KO Eternamax with a lot less chip, though Heavy-Duty Boots seems like a nice option on paper to increase Kyurem-B's longevity.

You could probably also run OHKO on other Shell Smash sweepers, though Horn Drill Calyrex-S and Indeedee would get walled by Spiritomb, and Fissure Rayquaza, Obstagoon, and Regigigas struggle a ton with Yveltal. Kyurem-B's unique in that it can take advantage of a 30% accuracy move that nearly nothing realistically worth using can safely switch into. That makes Eiscue a little better, I guess.

Calcs

+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Kyurem-Black Glacial Lance vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Eternatus-Eternamax: 585-689 (81.9 - 96.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Kyurem-Black Glacial Lance vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Eternatus-Eternamax: 585-689 (81.9 - 96.4%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252+ Atk Expert Belt Kyurem-Black Glacial Lance vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Eternatus-Eternamax: 540-636 (75.6 - 89%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+2 252+ Atk Kyurem-Black Glacial Lance vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Eternatus-Eternamax: 450-530 (63 - 74.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Kyurem-Black Max Hailstorm vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Eternatus-Eternamax: 632-743 (88.5 - 104%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Kyurem-Black Max Hailstorm vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Eternatus-Eternamax: 632-743 (88.5 - 104%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO after hail damage
+2 252+ Atk Expert Belt Kyurem-Black Max Hailstorm vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Eternatus-Eternamax: 583-686 (81.6 - 96%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO after hail damage
+2 252+ Atk Kyurem-Black Max Hailstorm vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Eternatus-Eternamax: 486-572 (68 - 80.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Life Orb Kyurem-Black Glacial Lance vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Cramorant-Gorging: 382-450 (111.3 - 131.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Kyurem-Black Glacial Lance vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Cramorant-Gorging: 294-346 (85.7 - 100.8%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Expert Belt Kyurem-Black Glacial Lance vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Yveltal: 511-605 (112.3 - 132.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Kyurem-Black Glacial Lance vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Yveltal: 426-504 (93.6 - 110.7%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Expert Belt Kyurem-Black Glacial Lance vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Giratina: 434-514 (86.2 - 102.1%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Expert Belt Kyurem-Black Glacial Lance vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Giratina: 434-514 (86.2 - 102.1%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Life Orb Kyurem-Black Glacial Lance vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Giratina: 471-556 (93.6 - 110.5%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Life Orb Kyurem-Black Glacial Lance vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Calyrex-Shadow: 339-399 (83.9 - 98.7%) -- 75% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Life Orb Kyurem-Black Max Hailstorm vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Calyrex-Shadow: 364-429 (90 - 106.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252+ Atk Kyurem-Black Thousand Arrows vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Zacian-Crowned: 378-446 (97.4 - 114.9%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Kyurem-Black Thousand Arrows vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Zacian-Crowned: 378-446 (97.4 - 114.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252+ Atk Expert Belt Kyurem-Black Thousand Arrows vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Zacian-Crowned: 454-535 (117 - 137.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Kyurem-Black Thousand Arrows vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Regieleki: 314-370 (86.2 - 101.6%) -- 12.5% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Kyurem-Black Thousand Arrows vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Regieleki: 314-370 (86.2 - 101.6%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Expert Belt Kyurem-Black Thousand Arrows vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Regieleki: 377-444 (103.5 - 121.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO

+2 252 Atk Eternatus-Eternamax Spectral Thief vs. -1 252 HP / 252 Def Kyurem-Black: 213-251 (46.9 - 55.2%) -- 69.5% chance to 2HKO
252 Atk Zacian-Crowned Double Iron Bash (2 hits) vs. -1 252 HP / 252 Def Dynamax Kyurem-Black: 576-676 (63.4 - 74.4%) -- approx. 2HKO
252+ Atk Zacian-Crowned Double Iron Bash (2 hits) vs. -1 252 HP / 252 Def Dynamax Kyurem-Black: 628-744 (69.1 - 81.9%) -- approx. 2HKO

Zacian-Crowned @ Choice Scarf / Choice Band
Ability: Shadow Tag
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly / Adamant Nature
- Double Iron Bash
- Precipice Blades / Thousand Arrows
- Fissure / Horn Drill / Bolt Beak
- Trick

In the same discussion the idea that Regieleki actually isn't that much better than Zacian-C came up, and now I agree, though I initially dismissed the idea. Being the fastest legitimately bulky Pokemon in the metagame makes it, in theory, a fairly good Shadow Tag user, which would be able to remove Yveltal, Cramorant-Gorging if running Bolt Beak, and other random defensive non-Ghost-types. Even opposing Zacian-C can be trapped and removed if it's not running Neutralizing Gas. Double Iron Bash is just a ridiculous STAB move in general, no explanation's needed for it. Precipice Blades takes care of Regigleki and heavily chipped Zacian-C; if running a Choice Band it OHKOes the former and has a good chance to OHKO the latter. Thousand Arrows OHKOes Regieleki with a Choice Band, though I think Zacian-C would want a Choice Scarf for slower Shell Smash users. Fissure threatens Eternamax, and to an extent Giratina (though it doesn't really like having to withstand Double Iron Bash anyway). Horn Drill hits random checks to Zacian-C, like Celesteela and Corviknight; Bolt Beak does the same, OHKOing Cramorant-Gorging, as well as Yveltal with Choice Band. Trick can potentially hamper an opposing Eternamax, and Zacian-C has the stats to function even without a Choice item. Ghost-types are common so Shadow Tag might be relegated to niche status, but I think it's worth exploring in the metagame.

Calcs

252 Atk Zacian-Crowned Double Iron Bash (2 hits) vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Zacian-Crowned: 174-206 (44.8 - 53%) -- approx. 23.4% chance to 2HKO
252+ Atk Zacian-Crowned Double Iron Bash (2 hits) vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Zacian-Crowned: 188-224 (48.4 - 57.7%) -- approx. 97.3% chance to 2HKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Zacian-Crowned Double Iron Bash (2 hits) vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Zacian-Crowned: 284-336 (73.1 - 86.5%) -- approx. 2HKO
252 Atk Zacian-Crowned Double Iron Bash (2 hits) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Yveltal: 180-212 (39.4 - 46.4%) -- approx. 3HKO
252+ Atk Zacian-Crowned Double Iron Bash (2 hits) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Yveltal: 198-234 (43.4 - 51.3%) -- approx. 2.7% chance to 2HKO
252 Atk Zacian-Crowned Double Iron Bash (2 hits) vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Spiritomb: 164-194 (54.1 - 64%) -- approx. 2HKO
252 Atk Zacian-Crowned Double Iron Bash (2 hits) vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Giratina: 152-182 (30.2 - 36.1%) -- approx. 47% chance to 3HKO
252+ Atk Zacian-Crowned Double Iron Bash (2 hits) vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Giratina: 168-200 (33.3 - 39.7%) -- approx. 3HKO
252 Atk Zacian-Crowned Double Iron Bash (2 hits) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Grimmsnarl: 456-540 (115.7 - 137%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252 Atk Zacian-Crowned Precipice Blades vs. 248 HP / 252 Def Regieleki: 380-448 (104.6 - 123.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Choice Band Zacian-Crowned Thousand Arrows vs. 248 HP / 252 Def Regieleki: 426-502 (117.3 - 138.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ Atk Choice Band Zacian-Crowned Double Iron Bash vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Regieleki: 234-276 (64.2 - 75.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Zacian-Crowned Double Iron Bash vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Yveltal: 294-348 (64.6 - 76.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Zacian-Crowned Double Iron Bash vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Spiritomb: 270-320 (89.1 - 105.6%) -- 25% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Zacian-Crowned Double Iron Bash vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Giratina: 252-296 (50 - 58.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Zacian-Crowned Double Iron Bash vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Grimmsnarl: 744-880 (188.8 - 223.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ Atk Choice Band Zacian-Crowned Precipice Blades vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Regieleki: 624-735 (171.4 - 201.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ Atk Choice Band Zacian-Crowned Bolt Beak (170 BP) vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Yveltal: 554-654 (121.7 - 143.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Zacian-Crowned Bolt Beak (170 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Zacian-Crowned: 267-315 (68.8 - 81.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Zapdos @ Rocky Helmet / Shed Shell
Ability: Comatose / Magic Bounce
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Bold / Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Nuzzle / Discharge / Thunder Cage
- Fissure
- Spikes / Whirlwind / Teleport / Literally Anything Else
- Recover

Electric/Flying Pokemon have gone basically unexplored over the entire generation, though in theory the typing is really nice. On paper Electric/Flying dual types provide impressive role compression, being a Fissure immunity, paralysis immunity, and a hard Zacian-C check (bar rare sets running Bolt Beak) all in one. Nuzzle and Discharge serve the core purpose of spreading paralysis, with the latter OHKOing Cramorant-Gorging and chipping Pokemon that often lack recovery, like Zacian-C, Pokemon weak to the move (Fissure immunities) like Yveltal and Corviknight, and Eternamax itself if not running recovery. Fissure's the obligatory OHKO move, and synergizes with Discharge and Thunder Cage well. The third moveslot's mostly filler from my attempts to fit Zapdos onto a team, and options include Spikes, Whirlwind, Teleport, and probably others like Aromatherapy, a second OHKO move, and Rapid Spin. Recovery is obvious. Rocky Helmet's really nice against Zacian-C using Double Iron Bash against it; it also chips Eternamax using Spectral Thief or Rapid Spin on the switch. Shed Shell prevents easy removals from random trappers. Heavy-Duty Boots can probably work but it doesn't seem useful enough to justify using over the aforementioned two options. Make sure to run a slower Speed stat if you're running Teleport (though you probably want to still be able to outrun paralyzed Calyrex-S).

Here's a team I built around Zapdos if you're curious.

Calcs

252 SpA Zapdos Discharge vs. 248 HP / 252 SpD Cramorant-Gorging: 420-496 (122.4 - 144.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Zapdos Discharge vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Zacian-Crowned: 93-109 (23.9 - 28%) -- 91.4% chance to 4HKO
252 SpA Zapdos Discharge vs. 248 HP / 252 SpD Yveltal: 204-242 (44.8 - 53.1%) -- 30.1% chance to 2HKO

252 Atk Zacian-Crowned Double Iron Bash (2 hits) vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Zapdos: 96-114 (25 - 29.7%) -- approx. 4HKO
252 Atk Zacian-Crowned Bolt Beak (170 BP) vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Zapdos: 181-214 (47.2 - 55.8%) -- 79.3% chance to 2HKO
252 Atk Regieleki Bolt Beak (170 BP) vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Zapdos: 186-219 (48.5 - 57.1%) -- 91.8% chance to 2HKO

Some other random Pokemon that could be worth testing out:



Articuno @ Shed Shell / Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Comatose / Magic Bounce
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Calm / Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sheer Cold
- Nuzzle / Lava Plume
- Recover
- Filler

Articuno as immunities to Sheer Cold and Fissure and decent special bulk (though that doesn't matter much in this metagame). On paper it relies a ton on Heavy-Duty Boots due to its typing, but Spikes' prevalence, being able to run a 30% accuracy OHKO move that not much blocks, and stomaching moves like Lava Plume from Eternamax mean that Articuno has some potential.



Ho-Oh @ Shed Shell / Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Comatose
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Careful / Sassy Nature
- V-Create / Sacred Fire
- Fissure
- Recover
- Filler

Ho-Oh's immune to Fissure, has amazing special bulk, resists Double Iron Bash, and has access to a funny 180 BP STAB move that OHKOes Zacian-C. It's hard to believe that this Pokemon doesn't have some minor niche.

252 Atk Ho-Oh V-create vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Zacian-Crowned: 422-498 (108.7 - 128.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Ho-Oh V-create vs. 248 HP / 252 Def Regieleki: 348-411 (95.8 - 113.2%) -- 75% chance to OHKO



Zacian-Crowned @ Rusted Sword
Ability: Shadow Tag
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid / Jolly Nature
- Spikes / Double Iron Bash
- Encore
- Perish Song
- Recover / Strength Sap

Offensive Shadow Tag sets are probably better, but this also seems interesting if you want to waste Dynamax or something. Spikes is for free hazards against Pokemon you trap (though trappable Pokemon without any counterplay for Shadow Tag/Anchor Shot etc. are rare), Encore usually prevents it from doing anything, Perish Song puts them on a timer, and recovery increases Zacian-C's longevity. Double Iron Bash lets Zacian-C wear most Pokemon not named Eternamax down with attacks, and Rusted Sword prevents Trick from annoying Zacian-C (and lets it remove Choiced Comatose lures if it comes in safely).

 

[The_Bookworm]

Pardon me, since this has something I have been curious about for a while ever since I heard about the gen 8 Pure Hackmons meta, but why is Eternamax-Eternatus treated as a separate form and not a Gigantamax form?

In the actual Sword/Shield game, the boss fight vs Eternamax-Eternatus is treated as a Dynamax battle, with the similar 4v1 format and health bar similar to those type of battles. It would explain why Eternamax has obscenely high defenses. Is there something about Eternamax-Eternatus that treats it differently than the normal Dynamax/Gigantamax forms?

 

[Ransei]

Pardon me, since this has something I have been curious about for a while ever since I heard about the gen 8 Pure Hackmons meta, but why is Eternamax-Eternatus treated as a separate form and not a Gigantamax form?

In the actual Sword/Shield game, the boss fight vs Eternamax-Eternatus is treated as a Dynamax battle, with the similar 4v1 format and health bar similar to those type of battles. It would explain why Eternamax has obscenely high defenses. Is there something about Eternamax-Eternatus that treats it differently than the normal Dynamax/Gigantamax forms?

Eternatus-Eternamax is programmed as a regular Pokemon forme with its own set of base stats, unlike the Gigantamax formes.

It is technically not a dynamax or gigantamax forme but the version you face off against in Pokemon Sword and Shield is an exclusive, dynamaxed version of Eternamax.

 

[Ransei]

View attachment 440783​

In light of recent discussion made in the BDSP Pure Hackmons thread from Daylight, the OM Moderation team sought and found a new definition of Pure Hackmons and Balanced Hackmons. From now on, anything directly hackable onto a set (EVs, IVs, forme, ability, item, and move) and is usable in local battles is allowed. This new premise redirects the focus of Pure/Balanced Hackmons to the Pokémon themselves; meaning that we're only taking all Pokémon already programmed into the respective game a Pure/Balanced Hackmons format is based on and allowing anything that can be hacked onto their set. This effectively changes nothing on the Pure Hackmons and Balanced Hackmons metagames but clears up the policy to prevent future disruption or policy debates regarding Pure Hackmons. This does not make Gen 8 Pure Hackmons playable competitively as the complications of Neutralizing Gas and the Overflow mechanic (this is not a hack) still force the entire game to structure around firing 30% accuracy OHKO moves with very little alternative for a consistent winning strategy. However, it's been found that BDSP Pure Hackmons is not much better and not as appealing to the playerbase. The OM Moderation team and BDSP Pure Hackmons council have both agreed on Sword and Shield being the preferred host of Gen 8 Pure Hackmons despite the complications it holds for the current generation.

Additionally, since the video on Pure Hackmons made by freezai, there has been an upward spiral of demand for this format to be playable again. Gen 8 Pure Hackmons is the only possible format where Eternatus-Eternamax is available to use to its fullest extent and if there's one significant perk Sword and Shield Pure Hackmons has over BDSP, this is it. BDSP Pure Hackmons has an extreme lack of playability, appeal, and development; lots of players are wanting to use Eternamax for themselves; this calls for an exchange.

The OM Moderation team would like to keep only one current gen Pure Hackmons thread up at a time to remain consistent with the rest of the subforum. Both BDSP and Sword and Shield Hackmons will be supported in the Old Gen Hackmons Megathread when Generation 9 comes out. We have now decided to archive the BDSP Pure Hackmons thread and reopen this thread for the remainder of Gen 8. Sword and Shield Pure Hackmons will also be available to play on PS! through roomtours and challenges. Enjoy your eldritch horror!

View attachment 440784​

I'm out! Mbouchon will be taking over as Gen 8 Pure Hackmons leader.​

Eternamax just loves coming back to me doesn't it...

So apparently I am unable escape this eldritch horror; so for now, I am the Gen 8 Pure Hackmons leader again.

Mbouchon has resigned from all Pure Hackmons council positions to take a long break from Pokémon.

 

[Negative Charge]

This has to be the worst pure hackmons generation of all time between Ngas and Eternamax. Excited for Gen 9 to at least drop the latter. Hot take - just ban them. It's addition by subtraction. I think much like AG still banning endless battles, PH can make an exception or two. Pure is a loaded term anyway and is open to interpretation.

 

[Ransei]

This has to be the worst pure hackmons generation of all time between Ngas and Eternamax. Excited for Gen 9 to at least drop the latter. Hot take - just ban them. It's addition by subtraction. I think much like AG still banning endless battles, PH can make an exception or two. Pure is a loaded term anyway and is open to interpretation.

Fully banning anything from Pure Hackmons diminishes the entire concept of the format, effectively turning it into a less restricted Balanced Hackmons. As much as people would like to propose this being an option, it is not an option.

The Endless Battle Clause is different as it isn't really a ban, just a measure to make sure battles end. Pokemon games past Gen 5 normally have a method for this anyway, which is usually in the form of a 60 minute battle timer (Gens 6 and 7), or a 20 minute battle timer (LGPE and Gen 8). The Endless Battle Clause is Showdown's method of handling an endless battle instead of a maximum battle timer limit.

Edit: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/old-gen-hackmons-megathread.3649618/ - The best way to work around Pure Hackmons's complications is to go back and enjoy the old generations if you don't enjoy this one or possibly future ones.