Metagame Revelationmons

[Eeveepunter]

Rhyperior @ Choice Band
Ability: Reckless
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Double-Edge
- Megahorn
- Superpower

Just wanted to share another poke that has been fun to play around with. I'm a simple man and just like to click buttons. Choice band rhyperior is a great button clicker, pretty much nothing wants to take a rock Double-edge. There aren't many bulky fighting types or ground types being used right now, though that may change with the two recent bans to the bad B's. Steel types don't want to take an earthquake. 2hko anything that is unresisted, calc below for the ever dangerous fully defensive Slowbro. Eq is still dangerous and can also threaten 2hko on fully phys def Ferro and Slowbro. I've been using this in trick room as a breaker and momentum grabber after double-edge takes its toll. From the calc, double-edge does about 50% more damage to neutral foes for reference.

252+ Atk Choice Band Reckless Rhyperior Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro: 276-325 (70 - 82.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252+ Atk Choice Band Rhyperior Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro: 192-226 (48.7 - 57.3%) -- 94.1% chance to 2HKO

252+ Atk Choice Band Rhyperior Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Ferrothorn: 169-201 (48 - 57.1%) -- 37.9% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

 

[Abocoabo]

Avalugg @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Impish Nature
- Body Press
- Rapid Spin
- Recover
- Iron Defense

I have been having some luck with Avalugg recently since the blace ban. There aren't many special attackers and avalugg has unrivaled physical bulk. Ice type Body Press can be spammed pretty well with the nutty 513 defense and no immunities especially after an iron defense. Sturdy, HDB, and rapid spin ensure that you can remove hazards at least once, and recover lets this easily stave off chip damage. Avalugg isn't a decent situational pick that can get good value in the current physical oriented metagame.

 

[Poké_Legend]

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8revelationmons-1476360897-r41iewqa7azp2deognqj7t1bq6yryjapw

Believe I might've found an error. Electrify doesn't affect the moves despite it affecting revelation dance, which I'm pretty sure is what the OM is based on considering its name.

Revelation Dance is unaffected by Normalize, Pixilate, Refrigerate, Aerilate, and Galvanize. However, it is affected by Ion Deluge (if the move would be Normal-type) and Electrify.

#MakeElectrifyGreatAgain

 

[ponchlake]

Okay, your residential no-life 2021 Revelationmons try-hard has come to give his thoughts on the meta and share some cool mons/teams he's tried this month. First off, I was really pleasantly surprised by how fun this meta was. Typically, the incredibly fast-paced and offense dominated metas tend to get stale for me after a certain point, because so many things get banned as the month progresses. I played this during my breaks from work or studying for finals, and I actually ended up getting hooked as evident by me topping the ladder with 6 different accounts. The SS was from a few days ago, so the ladder probably doesn't look like that anymore. But all of the accounts you see except for "CaptMicrowave" were mine or testing alts that I peaked with.


Zarude Version 1
Zarude Version 2

The first mon to really surprise me was Zarude. I absolutely love Inheritance and AAA, so that was kind of my inspiration for wanting to try out Zarude in this meta as well. It is incredibly niche in this meta I feel, but when it works it just steamrolls people. Dark STAB CC mauls just about everything, if not 2HKO's almost anything that isn't Steelix or Avalugg. The defensive typing is quite amazing, as you can offensively check rain by outspeeding Thundurus-T and threatening just about everything on their team with an OHKO. Ferrothorn are almost never Iron Defense on rain teams, so that is just a free switch-in for you in most cases. You also have the option of tanking a hit from something and firing back an attack of your own. But outside of rain teams, my biggest success was bringing this thing in on Slowbro. Slowbro has 0 answers for you coming into this unless they teleport. If they stay in, you OHKO it. If they switch out, something is likely taking 70%. 105/105 physical bulk is fantastic, Zydog is another mon I just love to bring Zarude in on. You can tank the ground move and immediately threaten with one of your STABS or U-turn. I'll put a bunch of calcs against standard fat you see in Revmons

Calcs

252 Atk Choice Band Zarude Close Combat vs. 248 HP / 8 Def Scizor: 276-325 (80.4 - 94.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Choice Band Zarude Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 159-187 (47.6 - 55.9%) -- 82.4% chance to 2HKO
252 Atk Choice Band Zarude Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Ferrothorn: 220-259 (62.5 - 73.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Choice Band Zarude Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Blissey: 502-592 (70.3 - 82.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Choice Band Zarude Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 80+ Def Cresselia: 404-476 (90.9 - 107.2%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO
252 Atk Choice Band Zarude Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Uxie: 332-392 (93.7 - 110.7%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO
252 Atk Choice Band Zarude Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro: 374-444 (94.9 - 112.6%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO
252 Atk Choice Band Zarude Close Combat vs. 248 HP / 168+ Def Corviknight: 208-246 (52.1 - 61.6%) -- 97.7% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

CB T-tar
Specs T-tar

Ah, surprise surprise.. Dark STAB is great in Pokemon. Rock STAB is also amazing, but I always found myself just spamming my dark move on T-tar. I ran two different sets of either CB or special T-tar. The specs set is part of why I love this meta so much. It is just the pinnacle of creative/fun teambuilding that works. No one ever expects it first of all. It is not even a gimmick set either, because specs T-tar just hits like a truck. Both of your stabs are very spammable, and it perfectly exploits the meta's inherent lack of SpDef in favor of physical bulk. You pretty much have perfect coverage at your disposal along with your dual STAB moves + the defensive typing and bulk is great. I found myself hard switching it in on stuff like Entei or Skarmory a lot and then threatening with my own attack. The ability to change weather is nice too. You pretty much perfectly counter sun teams, as well as have a great offensive check to rain teams. I'm too lazy to include the calcs for physical T-tar, so just imagine big damage.

Calcs

Fire Blast = Rock and Ice Beam = Dark
252+ SpA Choice Specs Tyranitar Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Skarmory: 316-373 (94.6 - 111.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ SpA Choice Specs Tyranitar Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Skarmory: 259-306 (77.5 - 91.6%) -- 25% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ SpA Choice Specs Tyranitar Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Slowbro: 285-336 (72.3 - 85.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after sandstorm damage
252+ SpA Choice Specs Tyranitar Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Slowbro: 468-552 (118.7 - 140.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Tyranitar Fire Blast vs. 248 HP / 92 SpD Corviknight: 246-289 (61.6 - 72.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Choice Specs Tyranitar Ice Beam vs. 248 HP / 92 SpD Corviknight: 201-237 (50.3 - 59.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Choice Specs Tyranitar Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Avalugg: 876-1032 (222.3 - 261.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Tyranitar Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Avalugg: 358-423 (90.8 - 107.3%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Tyranitar Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Steelix: 277-327 (78.2 - 92.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

Double Z

Last mon I want to highlight is regular Zapdos. You rarely see this thing because of how broken Thundurus-T is (please suspect). The defensive typing is great as always, especially when paired with Static and Flying type Discharges. Zapdos checks, if not counters, a lot of the ID mons. Heat Wave + Thunderbolt tag just about everything super effectively for a ton of damage. I completely forgot what the SpAtk EV's were for, but I remember they were to 2HKO something with Discharge. My brain needs a nap, so I'm going to be lazy and not include calcs for that or try to figure out what Discharge was supposed to 2HKO. But kind of like the mons above, this is another offensive check to a lot of stuff you see in the meta. It punishes fat, but it also has great defensive and offensive MU's against popular offensive threats like Rillaboom, Kartana, or Lando-T. Not much to say here, because it's just Zapdos doing what Zapdos does. Only now, the chicken has a reliable flying type move and incredible offensive coverage against the meta.

Final Thoughts:
As you can sort of see in the pokepastes, as well as if you played me on the ladder using other teams, I re-use the same defensive cores on just about EVERY team with almost no variation. As enjoyable as the meta was to find gems or cool mons to try out, teambuilding eventually got stale for me because how little variation there was in defensive mons. This is very much just a personal problem with how I like to play Pokemon, so it got to a point where I'd try to figure out or use a different defensive core only to switch back to the same ones I've been using. I hate losing to weather, and especially Thundurus-T in this meta. Which is why you see Rillaboom and Thundurus-T (irony) in just about all of my teams. Other than the mon I wanted to build around, there was never anything unique with the mons I surrounded it with. However, I do not really think anything needs to be changed at this point. All of the broken mons have been taken care of, and the meta has answers for just about anything you can complain about.. Except for maybe Thundurus-T. Though I'm slightly biased in my hate for that thing, and my refusal to use Blissey doesn't help there. So that might just be another personal problem. Overall this has been a very enjoyable meta for me. I loved how rewarding being creative was in this OM. I had a lot of fun brainstorming cool sets, and I'm glad that the results showed it too.

 

[UT]

Hello Revmaniacs, and happy New Year! Sadly, the new year means that Revelationmons is no longer Other Meta of the Month, so we have a little housekeeping to take care of.

Sample submissions are open!
If you have any teams you like, have had success with, and are intuitive to use, we'd love to make them sample teams! Please feel free to post them below!

We're working on a VR!
That's right, we're going to make a Viability Rankings! If you have any mons that you think are particularly good, or perhaps underrated, make their case here and we may end up ranking them!

Please keep challenging me to Rev games!
Even though Revmons is losing it's ladder, it will still be a challengeable format on main, and I would love to keep playing and innovating! If you see my online, give me a shout and let's play!

That's all for now, thanks for playing, and hope to still see y'all around!

 

[longhiep341]

This is a team I used to ladder to #1. It's a fairly easy team to pilot, utilizing sand and bulky mons to chip down teams, with Dracozolt acting as an offensive mon to clean up or weaken the opposing team when needed. This team however was created before even Blacephalon and Barraskewda were banned. It still worked well when I laddered after the 2 bans though, with Gastrodon still coming in handy to deal with Toxtricity and Water mons that threaten the team. Tyranitar still works fine, however its main caveat was countering Blace so I leave 2 versions of the team, version 1 with the original team (with Tyranitar), and version 2 I replace it with Stunfisk to better deal with Thundus-T (Untested, however should be better since I rarely need to send out Tyranitar anyway)
Version 1: https://pokepast.es/3689275f961db826
Version 2: https://pokepast.es/34e10f473b18f826

Meta thoughts: The meta overall is in a good spot, although defensive cores seem to be limited because a lot of mons are checked by the same mons. Physical threats still dominate the meta though, which makes Skarm better, then special threats see more plays. This feels like a cycle between the 3 phases of Revelationmons. There are definitely still some discoveries to be made though.

Now I will try to contribute to the VR by raising some mons that I think are the top threats, as well as underrated mons.

Top threats

This is definitely the best special breaker in the tier. Flying and Electric STAB moves are hard to deal with as most Electric mons aren't bulky enough to stop it, especially at +2. The meta trend also favors it, as it's faster than a lot of offensive mons while resisting some priority such as Lucario's ESpeed. It usually uses HDB with its NP set, however I believe Scarf is great when the meta is more offensive, with NP replaced by Grass Knot to nail Ground. NP can also 2HKO Blissey at +2 with Focus Blast into STAB so it can deal with pretty much everything. A solid A/A- mon for me as it's still slower than some top threats while being frail.

While Lele doesn't exactly benefit from the mechanics, it's seen a lot to enable other offensive partners to thrive and set up. Its presence also deters opposing ESpeed as a correct hard Lele switch can turn the game around quickly. Its speed is still middling though so it usually needs Scarf to do its job well. Terrain Extender is another option, however with Koko running around it's really not desireable. Probably A-

Outside of being weak to Electric, Gyarados is a very good pick. Intimidate comes in handy, its STABs are nearly unresisted, allowing it to run utilities like Taunt in the 4th slot. A

While not very common, Ninetales-A is still a good pick. Besides what it's known to do, hail can pop random Sash found on offensive mons, which is always nice. A-

Either you bring a bulky Ground or this will nuke you with Banded Rock CC. Fun time for sure (Not for your opponent though). I nominate Lycandusk for A+ since it has Accelerock as well, you can't really go wrong with it. A+

Fast, hits hard, overrides Psychic Terrain, the only weakness is locking into Electric can be disastrous. A+

Double Dance is still the best set, you force your opponent to hard switch into their special attacker, which can allow you to just Body Press and win the long game. A+/S-

Underrated mons

Steelix can wall Koko and Rock CC Lycandusk, while having Sturdy allows it to always be useful regardless of matchup with Stealth Rock. It's also a very good Body Press abuser with Iron Defense. Another option is Rock Head with Head Smash and Double-Edge, which can catch off guard a lot of mons. It's still weak to stuff like Terrakion and no recovery so B/B+ should be fine.

Celesteela is a very solid special attacker, Flying Giga Drain and Steel Meteor Beam allow it to threaten both offense and balance alike, making it unable to be stopped by Blissey. Autotomize meanwhile helps its offense matchup very well. Definite should have seen more plays. A-

Speaking of Ninetales-A, these 2 work well with it. Even though Arctozolt has to settle with Electric Bolk Beak still, it can still put dents into unprepared teams, with Low Kick to target Ferro. Arctovish meanwhile has to go mixed to beat Slowbro, however Ice Fishious Rend is quite funny to play with. I'd put both B-/C+.

While not exactly the best pick, Ice Double-Edge can 2HKO even physically defensive Corvi, and it has Shard, Rock and Knock so not too shabby if you want a physical wallbreaker. C/C+

While not exactly underrated, Zydog turned out to be better than initially thought. Ground Espeed with Thousand Arrows and Dragon Earthquake can steal games, especially when it boasts a nice speed tier along with Dragon Dance as well. B+/A- since it still struggles to beat bulky walls like Slowbro and Hippo.

Definitely something I didn't see very much, however it put in work almost every game. It can check Terra and Lycandusk, provides an Electric immunity, its STABs are amazingly strong with Mega Kick and Dynamic Punch, the latter help it can muscle past some walls it should not otherwise with confusion. B/B- at least

While this mon is stopped by Ground, I think its best role is not an attacker, but rather Dual Screen, as it forces a Ground switchin frequently. Electric ESpeed and Explosion should work well. I do need to see this more to rate it though.

Surprisingly nowhere to be seen. Good against Lycandusk, Entei, Zydog, can handle Lucario and a lot of physical setup like Mimikyu as well. It also provides a switchin against Electric. Definitely could see more usage, but I theorize this to be around B.

Fire Body Press in sun slaps. Role compression with Rock and Spin all in one slot, what more could you ask for? B/B-

The Rhino brothers are bulky enough to survive pretty all the common unboosted physical attacks, even SE ones. Rhydon gets to use Double-Edge as well, which gives it some edge cases against its evolution. No recovery kinda sucks though. C/B-

FEAR on paper should be better, especially against pure offense, however Ground and Steel being quite common limits this strat quite a bit. I didn't get to try this in the end, maybe next time.

 

[UT]

Your Revelationmons Council is hard at work, and we've done a thing.

We now have a Viability Rankings! This should hopefully make the metagame much more accessible for anyone who is looking to get into it, and we are always open to feedback! Is something too high? Too low? Missing entirely? Let us know, and we will always take community feedback into account!

We have also slightly updated the sample teams, including adding longhiep341's Sand Offense team! We will keep the sample submissions open for the foreseeable future, so if you find a team that you think is sample worthy, drop it here and we'll take a look!

That's all for now, but as always, feel free to challenge me to Rev matches, share cool ideas, and keep playing!

 

[shnowshner]

It's been a while since I've played but Steelix in C is hard underselling its value IMO, it's got very good matchups into a lot of dangerous, common Pokemon like Tapu Koko and Lycanroc, helps a lot versus other ID Body Press users (especially with Smack Down), can be a serviceable ThundT check if you play it right, and is straight-up counters Toxtricity if that mon gives you problems. Most physical attackers can struggle to really break it unless they hit absurdly hard, something Steelix can abuse further with Iron Defense to both wall out and sweep late-game with Body Press.

Its got flaws like lacking recovery, poor Speed, and unimpressive SpDef, but it's way more consistent and easy to build with than the stuff in the C ranks. I think B- would be a good place for it right now, especially as there is still a lot to explore in the post-bans metagame and Steelix heavily appreciates Blacephalon's departure.

 

[ponchlake]

It's been a while since I've played but Steelix in C is hard underselling its value IMO, it's got very good matchups into a lot of dangerous, common Pokemon like Tapu Koko and Lycanroc, helps a lot versus other ID Body Press users (especially with Smack Down), can be a serviceable ThundT check if you play it right, and is straight-up counters Toxtricity if that mon gives you problems. Most physical attackers can struggle to really break it unless they hit absurdly hard, something Steelix can abuse further with Iron Defense to both wall out and sweep late-game with Body Press.

Its got flaws like lacking recovery, poor Speed, and unimpressive SpDef, but it's way more consistent and easy to build with than the stuff in the C ranks. I think B- would be a good place for it right now, especially as there is still a lot to explore in the post-bans metagame and Steelix heavily appreciates Blacephalon's departure.

Agree completely. I think Steelix can be A rank or B+ rank. The typing is a bit of a coin toss depending on what you're playing against (rain for example), but otherwise fairly disadvantageous match-ups can suddenly turn very favorable with a single Iron Defense. Its ability to run SpDef and still be a very potent Body Press threat is something you don't get from a lot of the other Iron Defense mons. I've had a lot of situations where I either traded a lot of Steelix's HP for a kill against one the biggest threats against my team, or I outright won the game after getting up a single Iron Defense. I've also had both instances happen to me multiple times as well. Another big thing is that it completely destroys popular glue Pokemon like Skarmory, Corviknight, and Slowbro sets without Scald, which is a lot. The mon is practically an instant-win against Trick Room a lot of times as well if you play it even decently.

Other possible changes I'd make is Stakataka down to B-. I feel like Trick Room struggles a lot in this meta, and it doesn't help that Stakataka is horribly weak to a lot of the popular E-Speed mons or common offensive threats, as well as the defensive threats. The damage output is also fairly lackluster as well. I think Zapdos can move up to B+. It's a poor man's Thundurus-T offensively, but the defensive utility in this meta is crazy. You have great match-up against a lot of popular pokemon, especially the bulky Iron Defense mons, and Static + Flying type Discharge is amazing. Lycanroc-Dusk can go up to A or even A+ tier. Lycanroc is very susceptible to getting worn down, especially in this meta, but I'd put it up there due to the insane wallbreaking potential it has, even against Steelix. I think Sirfetch'd also deserves a spot on the Viability Rankings somewhere. I think B- tier can be a good place for it. I feel like it's a great mon, but I've noticed that a lot of people don't play it as well as it could be. It doesn't have crazy wallbreaking power like Lycanroc-Dusk or Aegislash, but I feel like it's great at forcing switches. Leek + the coverage it gets is great, and you don't even have to limit yourself to Fighting type First Impression either. A lot harder to use, but I think it has a lot of potential.

 

[Discordual]

Other possible changes I'd make is Stakataka down to B-. I feel like Trick Room struggles a lot in this meta, and it doesn't help that Stakataka is horribly weak to a lot of the popular E-Speed mons or common offensive threats, as well as the defensive threats. The damage output is also fairly lackluster as well.

Stakataka has higher defence, higher SpD, and higher attack (if you even use it, of course) than Steelix, trick room to allow it to outspeed offensive threats, and a rock type body press to win body press wars against other pressers like Skarmory and Corviknight, but you think it should be B- and Steelix should be B+? The only advantage Steelix has over Stakataka is a 2x weakness to fighting and ground instead of 4x, but at just +2 defence Stataktaka can 1v1 these threats anyway (Life orb Lucario fighting extreme speed does less than 50%, while rock body press has a great chance to 2HKO in return). Trick room is the key to Stakataka's higher placement because it allows it to defeat special attackers much more easily than other body pressers.

 

[CaptMicrowave]

Sample team submission: https://pokepast.es/387a93b72088d514

Guardian (Ferrothorn) @ Leftovers
Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 244 HP / 16 Def / 248 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Knock Off
- Body Press
- Leech Seed
- Stealth Rock

Octorok (Slowbro) (M) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Body Press
- Foul Play
- Teleport
- Slack Off

Wizzrobe (Slowking-Galar) (M) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 248 HP / 24 Atk / 236 SpD
Sassy Nature
- Sludge Bomb
- Future Sight
- Flamethrower
- Earthquake

Lizalfos (Hydreigon) @ Chople Berry
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 248 HP / 148 Def / 112 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Earth Power
- Taunt / Nasty Plot
- Defog
- Roost

Farosh (Thundurus-Therian) (M) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Volt Absorb
EVs: 8 HP / 248 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sludge Bomb
- Sludge Wave
- Volt Switch
- Grass Knot

Molduga (Steelix) @ Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 216 HP / 252 Def / 40 Spe
Impish Nature
- Iron Defense
- Body Press
- Smack Down
- Rest

I incorporate several bulky Pokemon to answer common threats, and thanks to the formats type change effect Body Press and other utility moves keep them from being to passive. Most games open with Ferro to set hazards, Slowbro to pivot, or Thundurus to break early, then you simply switch into the relevant wall and wear down the opposing team with utility moves. With the offensive nature of the metagame, Body Press and Foul Play are often doing huge amounts of damage to the opponent's frailer offensive team. After eliminating either the opponent's faster pokemon or special attackers, you can clean up with either Thundurus or Steelix respectively.

16 Defense EVs on Ferrothorn guarantee the KO on Tapu Lele.
40 Spe on Steelix creeps Toxapex and other players' Steelix. You also outspeed min-speed Marowak-Alola and Crawdaunt outside of Trick Room.
24 Atk on Slowking Galar helps guarantee the 2hko against Leftovers SpDef Heatran.
112 Spe on Hydreigon creeps Adamant Mamoswine and Modest Heatran. The defense allows you to wall Marowak Alola and Crawdaunt from full, while Chople allows you to take Sacred Sword from Aegislash or Focus Blast from Gengar.

The teams main flaw is being incredibly slow, but overall it only struggles with the typical nigh-unwallable pokemon (Aegislash, Terrakion, Thundurus Therian).

I hope you can pick up a few tour wins with my team!

 

[UT]

It's been a while since I've played but Steelix in C is hard underselling its value IMO

Agree completely. I think Steelix can be A rank or B+ rank.

I think Zapdos can move up to B+.

Thank you for y'all's feedback! Steelix has been moved up to B, and Zapdos has been moved up to B+. Please feel free to add any more suggestions, and we will consider them.

Sample team submission: https://pokepast.es/387a93b72088d514

Thank you for the sample team submission, I've seen it in action several times and it is quite strong! It has been added to the list.

 

[ponchlake]

Stakataka has higher defence, higher SpD, and higher attack (if you even use it, of course) than Steelix, trick room to allow it to outspeed offensive threats, and a rock type body press to win body press wars against other pressers like Skarmory and Corviknight, but you think it should be B- and Steelix should be B+? The only advantage Steelix has over Stakataka is a 2x weakness to fighting and ground instead of 4x, but at just +2 defence Stataktaka can 1v1 these threats anyway (Life orb Lucario fighting extreme speed does less than 50%, while rock body press has a great chance to 2HKO in return). Trick room is the key to Stakataka's higher placement because it allows it to defeat special attackers much more easily than other body pressers.

The simplest way to put it is that Steelix is just better in this meta than Stakataka despite everything you just mentioned. Is Stakataka a better Pokemon than Steelix? Of course it is. Is it better than Steelix in Revelationmons? No.

Does Stakataka has better stats than Steelix? You bet it does. Does Stakataka do more with its kit than Steelix does with its kit in Revelationmons? Not even close.

But how come? Well it has everything to do with Steelix's "only advantage" being its typing. The meta is infested with powerful Ground and Fighting type threats, as well as a very heavy emphasis on pivoting and bringing in those threats. Steelix has such a far superior type advantage defensively and offensively than Stakataka in Revelationmons that all of the "advantages" Stakataka has over Steelix is just moot. Steelix only has that one thing over Stakataka, but it only needs that one advantage to be one of the best mons in the meta. You should also keep in mind that Steelix and Stakataka do two completely different things in Revelationmons. Steelix is mostly used for its defensive utility, and Stakataka is mostly used for its offensive utility under TR.

It also does not help Stakataka's case that Trick Room is not good in Revelationmons either. Outside of Trick Room and/or without boosts, Stakataka is not that menacing. You also can't just brush off having a 4x weakness to two of the meta's most common and best offensive typing. It is very hard to threaten Steelix with an OHKO, and it is even harder to do so because of (Ground) Body Press. Again, you can comfortably trade a lot of Steelix's HP for a kill against stuff like Terrakion or Aegislash. You cannot do that with Stakataka. The lack of longevity and increase in popularity of Taunt towards the end of meta also makes Stakataka's odds in a Body Press war questionable at best. Steelix beats Skarmory/Corviknight 100% of the time without needing Iron Defense because of Smack Down + Body Press. I don't even need to get into +2. Of course a +2 Stakataka is going to be threatening, especially if it is under Trick Room, but the fact of the matter is that competent players are not just going to let you get cozy and set up in their face. I mean Steelix being fairly common and as good as it is is part of the reason why Stakataka and/or Trick Room aren't that good in this meta. As Shnowsher and I said in our original posts, the match-ups is what makes Steelix so good in this meta. You don't need to look any further than how many people topped the ladder with Steelix versus with Stakataka/TR.

EDIT: Electric immunity is good.

 

[UT]

Hey y’all, quick update.

You may have seen the recent announcement that the Perma Ladder OMs are switching to NatDex. I just wanted to let you know that I have made the executive decision that Revelationmons will not be following suit, for a few reasons:


I refuse to buff Tapu Koko. The return of Return would probably break it, and then I have to re-build all my teams.


Are these guys broken? I don’t know, Flying STAB Facade is probably dumb, and I don’t feel like disrupting a completely balanced tier like Revelationmons.


This guy does absolutely shatter the meta. Gaining Fighting type on mega-ing allows it to bypass restricted moves, so say hello to Fighting STAB U-turn Mega Lopunny ig. Or don’t say hi, cause I’m not allowing it.


How does Hidden Power work in Rev? But UT, isn’t a 60 BP STAB move awful? Yes, but one of you is going to try it, and I don’t know, so can’t allow it.

TL;DR: Revelationmons will not be converting to NatDex, solely because I am lazy and for no other reason.

Edit: forgot to mention the most important reason: Happy April Fools!

 

[Keyacom]

Hey y’all, quick update.

You may have seen the recent announcement that the Perma Ladder OMs are switching to NatDex. I just wanted to let you know that I have made the executive decision that Revelationmons will not be following suit, for a few reasons:


I refuse to buff Tapu Koko. The return of Return would probably break it, and then I have to re-build all my teams.


Are these guys broken? I don’t know, Flying STAB Facade is probably dumb, and I don’t feel like disrupting a completely balanced tier like Revelationmons.


This guy does absolutely shatter the meta. Gaining Fighting type on mega-ing allows it to bypass restricted moves, so say hello to Fighting STAB U-turn Mega Lopunny ig. Or don’t say hi, cause I’m not allowing it.


How does Hidden Power work in Rev? But UT, isn’t a 60 BP STAB move awful? Yes, but one of you is going to try it, and I don’t know, so can’t allow it.

TL;DR: Revelationmons will not be converting to NatDex, solely because I am lazy and for no other reason.

Just make the restricted moves (such as U-turn) unable to be in the first two slots, regardless of typing.

 

[Ducky]

Took a little break, but I've started to play again and wanted to talk about Zarude.

Zarude-Dada @ Choice Band
Ability: Leaf Guard
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly / Adamant Nature
- Close Combat
- Body Slam
- U-turn
- Power Whip

This thing is a beast. End of post.

Just kidding, but in reality Zarude is actually insanely strong and very underrated. If you look at the current VR, Zarude threatens pretty much everything with its dual 120 base power STAB moves. Want to swap in your Rocky Helmet Skarmory, Corviknight, or Ferrothorn? Zarude has a 70% or better chance to 2HKO them with Dark-type CC if its Jolly, and the 2HKO is guaranteed if its Adamant. Offensive Landorus-T? Takes over 65%. Max Defense Landorus-T? Takes 40%. Combine that with Landorus's lack of recovery and the chip is takes from Stealth Rock, and that Landorus is not going to stay alive for much longer. Tapu Koko can never switch in safely either, it gets OHKOed by Power Whip and takes over 50% from CC. Entei, Lele, Thundurus, Zygarde-10%, and Aegislash all get OHKOed by CC. Most of these Pokemon are also outsped by Zarude, with the exception being Entei with Fire-type Extreme Speed and Zygarde-10%, which cannot OHKO Zarude. Zarude also has amazing bulk for an offensive Pokemon, which allows it to survive many neutral hits, such as Electric-type Brave Bird from Tapu Koko. Now, you may be asking yourself, how does I beat Zarude? Well you have two option, make perfect defensive plays every time, or use faster offensive Pokemon that can revenge kill it, such as Terrakion or Choie Scarf Lele.

Wall of Calcs

Calcs with Jolly

252 Atk Choice Band Zarude Power Whip vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tapu Koko: 318-375 (113.1 - 133.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Choice Band Zarude Close Combat vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tapu Koko: 159-187 (56.5 - 66.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Choice Band Zarude Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Corviknight: 195-229 (48.7 - 57.2%) -- 94.1% chance to 2HKO
252 Atk Choice Band Zarude Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 159-187 (47.6 - 55.9%) -- 82.4% chance to 2HKO
-1 252 Atk Choice Band Zarude Close Combat vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Landorus-Therian: 202-238 (63.3 - 74.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
-1 252 Atk Choice Band Zarude Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Landorus-Therian: 144-169 (37.6 - 44.2%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Choice Band Zarude Close Combat vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Entei: 316-373 (85.1 - 100.5%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO
252 Atk Choice Band Zarude Close Combat vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tapu Lele: 352-415 (125.2 - 147.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Choice Band Zarude Close Combat vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Aegislash-Shield: 414-488 (158.6 - 186.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Calcs with Adamant

252+ Atk Choice Band Zarude Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Corviknight: 211-250 (52.7 - 62.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Zarude Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 174-205 (52 - 61.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Zarude Power Whip vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tapu Koko: 349-412 (124.1 - 146.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Zarude Close Combat vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tapu Koko: 174-206 (61.9 - 73.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Zarude Close Combat vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Entei: 348-409 (93.8 - 110.2%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO
-1 252+ Atk Choice Band Zarude Close Combat vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Landorus-Therian: 220-261 (68.9 - 81.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
-1 252+ Atk Choice Band Zarude Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Landorus-Therian: 157-186 (41 - 48.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

Anyways, I would like to nominate Zarude from B+ to A, as in my opinion it is on par with other A-ranked mons such as Zygarde-10%. Anyways, I suggest everyone who reads this to at least try out Zarude. Anyways, that it from me, Duck signing off.

P.S: Close Combat is broken and should be looked at closely.

 

[Clas]

How does Hidden Power work in Rev? But UT, isn’t a 60 BP STAB move awful? Yes, but one of you is going to try it, and I don’t know, so can’t allow it.

I actually know this one from outside testing prior to this post, but Hidden Power changes typing if it is in the 1st (and 2nd) slot. This was also the same last gen, and I have no idea why.

 

[Codename C.A.T]

hey, im back to playing the meta. figured i should post the most broken mon in the tier since its an aaa classic that got ported over to revmons: facade koko.

@ Flame Orb
Ability: Electric Surge
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Facade
- Volt Switch
- Roost

this thing is, to put it lightly, absolutely insane. i could end the post here, but lets go into why its insane.

so starting off, koko is very good. we all know that koko is very good. its probably top 3 minimum in the meta atm. thus, we use koko very regularly. but surprisingly, i have yet to see flame orb facade once. thats mostly surprising due to the fact that it melts fucking everything. thund-t drops, lando drops, corv/skarm/bro drop from tbolt, everything that isnt a steel neutral to electric gets mauled. and those steels neutral/resistant to electric? ferrothorn, heatran, steelix? all of them are very easy to get spikes up on, which are easy to slot in on most balance teams thanks to skarm and ferro. these spikes can wear down other pseudo checks like cb aegi, and the worst part is, koko is not at all a frail pokemon. it can live a +2 elec terrain boosted thund-t electric sludge bomb from full, which is quite impressive. so, how do you beat this thing?
honestly, i dont know a way to beat it defensively other than running ferro/tran/steelix on every single team. if you dont, you will die. either that or you have a fast scarfer/espeeder in the back that can try to revenge once its chipped. to end the post, here's some calcs to show that im not just saying shit to make it seem impressive

Wall of Calcs (11200/11200)

4 SpA Tapu Koko Thunderbolt vs. 248 HP / 92 SpD Corviknight in Electric Terrain: 252-296 (63.1 - 74.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
4 SpA Tapu Koko Thunderbolt vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Skarmory in Electric Terrain: 324-384 (97 - 114.9%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO
4 SpA Tapu Koko Thunderbolt vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Slowbro in Electric Terrain: 290-344 (73.6 - 87.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
-1 252 Atk Tapu Koko Facade (140 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Landorus-Therian: 153-180 (47.9 - 56.4%) -- 85.5% chance to 2HKO
252 Atk Tapu Koko Facade (140 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Thundurus-Therian: 280-331 (93.6 - 110.7%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO

tl;dr koko is very very very VERY broko

 

[Cuddly]

so starting off, koko is very good. we all know that koko is very good. its probably top 3 minimum in the meta atm. thus, we use koko very regularly. but surprisingly, i have yet to see flame orb facade once.

It’s probably because of the fact that you can do a similar thing with Brave Bird. It’s naturally 120 BP, which is noticably weaker and has heavier recoil, but you get the freedom to choose your item. Namely being able to use Heavy Duty Boots, Pixie Plate, and Life Orb. Even without the extra 20 BP, it really just means you need a tiny bit of chip damage to reach the same thresholds, while Pixie Plate is also stronger.
-1 252 Atk Tapu Koko Brave Bird vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Landorus-Therian: 130-154 (40.7 - 48.2%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
-1 252 Atk Pixie Plate Tapu Koko Brave Bird vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Landorus-Therian: 157-186 (49.2 - 58.3%) -- 64.5% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

252 Atk Tapu Koko Brave Bird vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Thundurus-Therian: 241-285 (80.6 - 95.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Pixie Plate Tapu Koko Brave Bird vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Thundurus-Therian: 289-342 (96.6 - 114.3%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO

Yeah, Facade doesn’t have to worry about Status and especially burns (as much that is), but being immune to Hazards on a Pivot. Pixie Plate Brave Bird is also stronger without burn recoil. And Life Orb makes both Thunderbolt and Brave Bird stronger too and the recoil only occurs when using an attacking move.

 

[Ducky]

hey, im back to playing the meta. figured i should post the most broken mon in the tier since its an aaa classic that got ported over to revmons: facade koko.

@ Flame Orb
Ability: Electric Surge
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Facade
- Volt Switch
- Roost

this thing is, to put it lightly, absolutely insane. i could end the post here, but lets go into why its insane.

so starting off, koko is very good. we all know that koko is very good. its probably top 3 minimum in the meta atm. thus, we use koko very regularly. but surprisingly, i have yet to see flame orb facade once. thats mostly surprising due to the fact that it melts fucking everything. thund-t drops, lando drops, corv/skarm/bro drop from tbolt, everything that isnt a steel neutral to electric gets mauled. and those steels neutral/resistant to electric? ferrothorn, heatran, steelix? all of them are very easy to get spikes up on, which are easy to slot in on most balance teams thanks to skarm and ferro. these spikes can wear down other pseudo checks like cb aegi, and the worst part is, koko is not at all a frail pokemon. it can live a +2 elec terrain boosted thund-t electric sludge bomb from full, which is quite impressive. so, how do you beat this thing?
honestly, i dont know a way to beat it defensively other than running ferro/tran/steelix on every single team. if you dont, you will die. either that or you have a fast scarfer/espeeder in the back that can try to revenge once its chipped. to end the post, here's some calcs to show that im not just saying shit to make it seem impressive

Wall of Calcs (11200/11200)

4 SpA Tapu Koko Thunderbolt vs. 248 HP / 92 SpD Corviknight in Electric Terrain: 252-296 (63.1 - 74.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
4 SpA Tapu Koko Thunderbolt vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Skarmory in Electric Terrain: 324-384 (97 - 114.9%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO
4 SpA Tapu Koko Thunderbolt vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Slowbro in Electric Terrain: 290-344 (73.6 - 87.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
-1 252 Atk Tapu Koko Facade (140 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Landorus-Therian: 153-180 (47.9 - 56.4%) -- 85.5% chance to 2HKO
252 Atk Tapu Koko Facade (140 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Thundurus-Therian: 280-331 (93.6 - 110.7%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO

tl;dr koko is very very very VERY broko

I have been using a very similar set recently, but with a few changes.

Tapu Koko @ Flame Orb
Ability: Electric Surge
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Facade
- Roost
- Nature's Madness
- U-turn

The two biggest changes is that Facade is now Electric-type, and I having been using Nature's Madness. I prefer this set as most of the tier's physically defensive Pokemon are either weak to Electric (Corv, Slowbro), or lack reliable recovery (Ferrothorn, Landorus-T, Steelix) and thus do not appreciate taking a Nature's Madness into a U-turn. In my opinion, this makes using Electric-type Facade worth it, as it does more damage to neutral targets. Having Facade boosted by terrain also means that it is more powerful than using Brave Bird and a Fairy Plate, which is more powerful than Fairy-type.

tl;dr my koko is more broko

 

[Codename C.A.T]

hey, back in forum. figured it would be a good idea to share this team i've made around DuckeryDoodle 's koko set. might as well do a quick team report on them
https://pokepast.es/474637a4193319fa



Primal Instinct (Zarude) @ Choice Band
Ability: Leaf Guard
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Close Combat
- Body Slam
- U-turn
- Power Whip



Tribal Worship (Tapu Koko) @ Flame Orb
Ability: Electric Surge
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Facade
- Roost
- Nature's Madness
- U-turn

you've already seen the posts on why these guys are great, i dont think i need to explain the individual sets. however, they have good synergy together, since nature's madness can force walls like hippo to slack off and thus be brought into cb zarude range



First To Walk (Slowbro) @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Body Press
- Teleport
- Slack Off
- Future Sight

second thought was "hey, i need a fire resist or i lose to sun/entei." then i remembered slowbro existed and used that. bro gives a lot of utility too, since it beats lando and spdef steel birds. overall just a great mon to have on the team



Harsh Desert Heat (Hippowdon) @ Leftovers
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Body Press
- Slack Off
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic

one thing i was missing on this team was a koko answer, so i threw this together. its quite standard, but its all i really need. also worth noting this is one of the only answers to nature's madness koko



Protect The Young (Blissey) (F) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Thunder Wave
- Seismic Toss
- Soft-Boiled
- Teleport

even when i have a pretty bulky team already, it does bad against special threats. because i was worried about that specifically, i decided to add blissey. with blissey, the team becomes sturdier and its easier to spread para for the main threats, which can be invaluable



Excalibrated (Aegislash) @ Choice Band
Ability: Stance Change
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Head Smash
- Close Combat
- Gyro Ball
- Sacred Sword

aegi is standard. it just hits hard and doesnt let anything switch in. gyro is there if i dont want recoil.
if you have any suggestions to improve feel free to reply to this, had a lot of fun so far

 

[Clas]

Nomming Luxray to B tier (yes B)

Luxray @ Flame Orb
Ability: Guts
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Facade
- Ice Fang
- Superpower
- Agility

Luxray @ Flame Orb
Ability: Guts
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Facade
- Ice Fang
- Superpower
- Volt Switch

Luxray's niche comes from its insane STAB breaking power via Guts Facade paired with an equally great move for it in Ice Fang. Being able to OHKO +2 Defense Corviknight/Skarmory/Slowbro, neutral Blissey and sometimes even Tapu Koko with Facade, and 2HKO Landorus-Therian and OHKO every frail Ice-weak Pokemon with Ice Fang like Thundurus-Therian, Nidoking and Garchomp, is amazing. Superpower is there as a backup for Magnezone, Mamoswine, Stakataka, and chipping Ferrothorn and Kartana. Agility allows it to punish swaps and possibly close out a game there and then, while Quick Attack allows it to finish off a weakened opponent (although still very weak itself). Volt Switch allows it to create momentum, but this is limited as often a Ground-type will switch in to absorb a Facade and you usually want to be clicking a breaking move anyway.

The catch? You're walled by Hippowdon, Steelix, and Ferrothorn. This is why partners like OU IronPress Magnezone and Choice Specs Keldeo are useful as a result, with the former 1v1ing Ferrothron and the latter 1v1ing Hippowdon and Steelix. Extreme Speed is also an issue, especially for Agility sets, so partners like Tapu Lele and Landorus-Therian help as a result, although no Extreme Speed Pokemon can switch into Luxray in fear of being OHKOd.


Replay examples
vs - vs iapt
vs - vs gimmickyasitgets
I also had a game against IBM, although I did not save it (happened in the same roomtour). I beat UT with Luxray semi-recently too, with it claiming 5 KOs over the course of the game, but again no replay (un?)fortunately.


Why B-Tier?
The biggest drawback with Luxray is that it is decently hard to slot into a team. Luxray functions as a wallbreaker and cleaner, but requires safe switch-ins every time and good synergy to be at all effective. It also struggles in the HO playstyle despite the instant power it gains from Guts thanks to its weakness to Extreme Speed. However, it provides insane breaking power and support for Pokemon like Kartana, Volcarona, and Tapu Lele as a result, and defines itself as one of the scariest threats in the tier in the right hands.


Extras

enjoy team

 

[Ducky]

had a conversation with ponchlake today about the meta and after going over it again in my head i wanted to share my thoughts on the meta.

Koko is definetly one of the best Pokemon in the meta, but isn't broken yet, so I wouldn't like to see it banned.

Thundy-T is too much for the tier IMO. With its 3 main sets (Nasty Plot, Choice Scarf, Choice Specs) all being very good and playing differently, it makes it hard to play around. Even though Pokemon like Chansey and Blissey wall it forever, they are vulnerable to just getting Volt Switched on into one of the many insanely powerful physical attackers the tier has. I would like to see action or a suspect on Thundy-T when rev gets a ladder again.

Extreme Speed: This may come off as weird but I believe that espeed in broken but in a healthy way. While the move itself is broken, all of its users (lucario, entei, arcanine, zygarde, and eleki) have hard counters and other exploitable flaws, but if those counters get KOed then the espeed user just wrecks havoc (this is me telling everyone to use Thundy-t + Espeed). I don't think Espeed deserves to be restricted yet, but it is something I would keep my eye on.

Close Combat: I've been quite vocal about this but I think Close Combat is very unhealthy for the meta. Most of the meta's physical walls do not have reliable recovery (Ferrothorn, Steelix, Lando) and are prone to be worn down be repeated hits from the Close Combat users, and the walls with reliable recovery (Corviknight, Slowbro, Pex) are threatened by Tapu Koko and Thundy-t. I would love to see CC restricted.

Overall thoughts on the meta: I think that the meta is struggling from having too many strong attackers, including but not limited to the ones I mentioned in this post, and that it feels you have to use more extreme teamstyles (Stall/Fat, HO, or Pivot heavy offense) in order to succeed, as balance and BO simply cannot check enough threats, and using those archetypes requires you to hope your breakers got a better matchup than your opponent's breaker. Despite this however, I still really enjoy the meta and am only hoping I can enjoy it even more when it gets a ladder again! Thanks for reading!

 

[ponchlake]

had a conversation with ponchlake today about the meta and after going over it again in my head i wanted to share my thoughts on the meta.

Koko is definetly one of the best Pokemon in the meta, but isn't broken yet, so I wouldn't like to see it banned.

Thundy-T is too much for the tier IMO. With its 3 main sets (Nasty Plot, Choice Scarf, Choice Specs) all being very good and playing differently, it makes it hard to play around. Even though Pokemon like Chansey and Blissey wall it forever, they are vulnerable to just getting Volt Switched on into one of the many insanely powerful physical attackers the tier has. I would like to see action or a suspect on Thundy-T when rev gets a ladder again.

Extreme Speed: This may come off as weird but I believe that espeed in broken but in a healthy way. While the move itself is broken, all of its users (lucario, entei, arcanine, zygarde, and eleki) have hard counters and other exploitable flaws, but if those counters get KOed then the espeed user just wrecks havoc (this is me telling everyone to use Thundy-t + Espeed). I don't think Espeed deserves to be restricted yet, but it is something I would keep my eye on.

Close Combat: I've been quite vocal about this but I think Close Combat is very unhealthy for the meta. Most of the meta's physical walls do not have reliable recovery (Ferrothorn, Steelix, Lando) and are prone to be worn down be repeated hits from the Close Combat users, and the walls with reliable recovery (Corviknight, Slowbro, Pex) are threatened by Tapu Koko and Thundy-t. I would love to see CC restricted.

Overall thoughts on the meta: I think that the meta is struggling from having too many strong attackers, including but not limited to the ones I mentioned in this post, and that it feels you have to use more extreme teamstyles (Stall/Fat, HO, or Pivot heavy offense) in order to succeed, as balance and BO simply cannot check enough threats, and using those archetypes requires you to hope your breakers got a better matchup than your opponent's breaker. Despite this however, I still really enjoy the meta and am only hoping I can enjoy it even more when it gets a ladder again! Thanks for reading!

I wanna touch upon this and talk about Body Press and Victini.



If you take a look at some of the most common defensive cores or walls, you'll notice that practically all of them run Body Press in most cases. What this means is that the tier's best walls can also double as some of its best set-up sweepers. Iron Defense Steelix for instance started to rise in popularity towards the end of the ladder's monthly cycle and quickly became one of the tier's best mons because it doubled as a Tapu Koko counter and a nigh unwallable Body Press sweeper. Body Press is undeniably broken in the current state of the meta in my opinion, but it is a good type of broken I feel. I genuinely believe that Body Press is healthy for the meta, and restricting it in any way would hurt the meta if anything. If the meta loses Body Press, then I think the offensive threats of the meta, especially the tier's rampant physical attackers, would get out of control. Defensive checks being able to threaten strong Body Presses has helped keep the tier from exclusively being HO, and it's the very thin piece of string that is keeping Balance together. Isn't this just a case of something broken checking other broken things though? Kinda. But I don't think the meta has had enough time to be fully fleshed out. Does setting up a single Iron Defense outright win you the game in some instances? Yes, and I've lost count as to how many times I've won off a single Iron Defense. But that isn't a problem with Body Press. It is quite literally a teambuilding issue. This is not one of those cases of "just run the check/counter" either. Body Press is broken in the current state of Revmons because all people run are physical attackers. I only ever see Tapu Koko (most are physical anyways), Tapu Lele, Thundurus-T, and whatever Weather sweeper people are running e.g. Venusaur, Kingdra, etc. being used as special attackers. There is an overwhelming lack of special attackers in the meta currently, which is why I think the Body Press problem will solve itself once we get more playtime to explore other options, especially if Close Combat gets restricted. I'm guilty of this as well, but if a single Iron Defense means that Body Press sweeps your whole team, then that just means your team has too many physical attackers. A quick glance of the forum will tell you that most of the teambuilding from the last cycle revolved around physical attackers. From my testing with Ducky and UT, I can 100% tell you that there are some crazy special attackers in this tier. No one has just gotten around to using them yet.




Speaking of a crazy special attacker that doesn't get used.. Why is Victini not banned? Well because absolutely no one runs for it some reason despite it being insanely broken. A quick look at Victini's movepool will have you licking your lips. This thing is the most unwallable mon in Revelationmons. This thing has too many viable sets and it is what Genesect is for OU but for Revelationmons. You have quite literally 0 clue what it could be running because it can run anything. Heatran to counter Victini? Psychic-type V-Create under Psychic Terrain sends you and the rest of the tier packing. Landorus-T for Intimidate? This one is special and you just died from Glaciate or Blue Flare after Stealth Rocks. Brought Blissey in on Blue Flare to tank it? It's also running V-Create as well. Slowbro as a pivot? This one actually doesn't have V-Create, it's fully special with Energy Ball to kill Slowbro. You found the one Victini set in the tier that cannot touch your defensive core? Well it still has U-turn to bring in something to threaten you or Trick to cripple your mon. And you wanna know what arguably one of the best things about Victini is? Its dual stab is resisted by Slowbro, one of the most popular mons in the tier. But how is that a good thing? It's a good thing because they know what type their moves are but you don't. You have no way of knowing whether or not you should switch into a Fire resist or a Psychic resist on the base 180 or 130 moves this thing throws off. Well can't you just stay in with Slowbro? You could, but that gamble is extremely unfavorable for you. If you're running Slowbro on your team, it is probably one of the very few things on your team stopping something like Terrakion or Zygarde from just steamrolling you. Staying in and potentially getting popped by a super effective move because you have no idea what the set is can just lose you the game. Victini is broken by itself, but it just fits so well into teams and enables so many threats. Tapu Koko and Victini cover each other perfectly and Electric Terrain Bolt Strike annihilates bulky Waters. Tapu Lele abuses the tier's lack of special walls while bosting Victini's Psychic STAB or Expanding Force (Fire or Psychic) to obscene levels, and anything that can check Lele gets destroyed by Victini. Even if you don't run terrain, physical attackers like E-Speed spammers appreciate Victini's ability to outright remove their walls/checks. Victini simply has too many viable sets, and the moves it can run are way too powerful to the point of it being unwallable. I think we should keep a very close eye on this.

 

[Discordual]

But that isn't a problem with Body Press. It is quite literally a teambuilding issue. This is not one of those cases of "just run the check/counter" either. Body Press is broken in the current state of Revmons because all people run are physical attackers. I only ever see Tapu Koko (most are physical anyways), Tapu Lele, Thundurus-T, and whatever Weather sweeper people are running e.g. Venusaur, Kingdra, etc. being used as special attackers. There is an overwhelming lack of special attackers in the meta currently, which is why I think the Body Press problem will solve itself once we get more playtime to explore other options, especially if Close Combat gets restricted.

This is something I've been saying for a while. Similarly, the reason I believe people find Thundurus-T 'broken' is because they're all running physically defensive mons. Special options are perfectly good and viable, but just benefit less from the gimmick of the meta, since most special attackers already get good STAB options.