-
Welcome to Smogon! Take a moment to read the Introduction to Smogon for a run-down on everything Smogon, and make sure you take some time to read the global rules.
Resource Simple Questions, Simple Answers Thread (read the op before posting a thread)
- Thread starter Celticpride
- Start date
It will have a separate thread when it is completed.
What's the standard spread for AV Magnezone?
Will the thread be in the SM OU part of the forum or somewhere else on the forums?
it'll be in sm ou
If I'm not mistaken, Trace can't copy signature abilities.
Why is Tapu Lele such a strong Pokemon in OU?
It has an amazing ability that lets it wallbreak very well. Said ability also protects it and its teammates from priority. It has a decent STAB combination and movepool that lets it hit Psychic-type switch ins. Its scarf set is an amazing revenge killer/cleaner. Specs is an excellent wallbreaker. The stallbreaker set is also one of the biggest threats to stall teams.
There was a lot of discussion surrounding this at the time of the games' release. But honestly, outside of Chansey and AV Magearna, what is your switch in to this? With a pretty great Special Attack of 135 combined with access to Nasty Plot, perfect coverage in Dark Pulse, Focus Blast + Sludge Bomb, not to mention other options such as Taunt, Hypnosis, Thunderbolt and Trick; it's a mon which would put so much pressure on the tier. Z-moves only aid in Darkrai's prowess, with Black Hole Eclipse doing stupid amounts of damage, as well as All Out Pummeling, a +2 version of which does up to 80% to both Chansey and AV Magearna, meaning all it needs is a couple of rounds of Spikes in order to KO.
I actually wouldn't mind seeing a suspect, as it has been heavily nerfed, but I've said since the beginning that the tier will not cope particularly well with Darkrai in it.
I realize that, like any Pokémon with the correct set up, it can destroy teams with its high special attack and nasty plot and spikes and good coverage etc.
Yes, not a lot would like taking a hit from it, so you can't just switch in anything. But using that argument, not a lot likes taking a hit from Pheromosa (relevant because it was legal when SM came out), Xurkitree (tail glow or not), Kartana (swords dance or not), Hoopa, Landorus, Buzzwole, Zygarde, Tapu Lele, Tapu Koko, Tapu Bulu, A-Marowak, Greninja (battle bond or protean), Heatran, Excadrill, swords dance Mimikyu, tail glow Manaphy, Tyranitar, Magnezone, pretty much any offensive Mega Pokémon like Charizard, Beedrill, Lopunny, Alakazam, Metagross, Garchomp, Medicham, Mawile, Pinsir, Scizor, Gyarados, Heracross, Swampert, etc etc. Hell, name me one thing that enjoys switching in to a Mega Pidgeot's Hurricane? At least Dark Pulse doesn't confuse you
When you compare Darkrai to that list of offensive threats... it just feels meh
I would argue that no Pokemon on that list, apart from maybe Pheromosa (which is banned for a reason), has the combination of incredibly high Special Attack, great coverage and utility options, and amazing Speed tier that Darkrai has. Darkrai's bulk also isn't actually that bad by OU standards, it was pretty poor in Ubers but is respectable in OU. I also think that you're overstating how much the Dark Void nerf has actually hurt Darkrai; it literally does the same thing with 20% less accuracy.
There are so many answers to the mons you named. Pheromosa was made legal because it was a new non-cover legndary mon so we had to allow it in OU. There are legitimate counters to every single mon you mentioned, I'm sorry but most of the pokemon you mentioned aren't even that good and are fairly easy to counter to due certain exploitable weaknesses. Oh and so many mons switch into Pigeot's Hurricane.
Trace basically can't copy abilities that have unique form changes associated with them, most likely because game freak didn't want to program those in. Think of the unique animation for a disguise being busted, or the form changes caused by Forecast, Flower Gift, Multitype, Zen Mode, Stance Change, Schooling, Shields Down, RKS System, Battle Bond and Power Construct. The second thing trace likes to avoid is redundancy: trace can't copy trace, receiver or power of alchemy because that would just delay the effects of trace. Illusion would be worthless since you're already on the field and imposter would end up transforming you into yourself just with all your pp reduced. Comatose is the only exception and is just a very unique ability that can't be surpressed in any way.
That's enough of a nerf. How often do you see Hypnosis used competitively?
But I see your other points.
What are the chances of Z-moves being suspected ever in the future? Is it even remotely possible? I don't have much personal experience with them as I haven't played much recently, but to me Z-Moves seem to be absurdly powerful and allow pokemon to plow through walls or something otherwise countered by it, unleashing an extremely powerful Z-Move. Once the only real stop to your pokemon is crippled by being hit by the possibly unpredictable Z-Move, the game could possibly be over right there, not having an item anymore won't make that much of a difference at that point. It is especially powerful with pokemon using abilities such as Moxie, Soul Heart or Beast Boost, snowballing from a single "random" Z-Move.
I am not salty or care that much myself, but I find offensive Z-Moves to be uncompetitive and reducing the amount of skill it takes to win games by allowing "cheap" wins by using powerful Z-Moves to surprise KO something that was designed to stop whatever took it down. Am I alone here or is there such talk going with the good players at all? Is this something we should talk about? If there is a thread where this is being discussed by experienced players, please provide a link.
Finally, status Z-Moves are awesome in my opinion and that's what Z-Moves should be about. Being able to use any status move even under taunt or boosting your stats while providing utility in weather or terrain effects or just basic stuff like Z-Conversion. If we were to assume offensive Z-Moves were found too powerful and banned, would there be any chance of status Z-Moves remaining or would it fall under Smogons dislike for complex bans?
I know this is all just theoretical stuff but OU is the main metagame and where Z-Moves probably have the biggest impact so I felt this is the right place to ask this.
I am not salty or care that much myself, but I find offensive Z-Moves to be uncompetitive and reducing the amount of skill it takes to win games by allowing "cheap" wins by using powerful Z-Moves to surprise KO something that was designed to stop whatever took it down. Am I alone here or is there such talk going with the good players at all? Is this something we should talk about? If there is a thread where this is being discussed by experienced players, please provide a link.
Finally, status Z-Moves are awesome in my opinion and that's what Z-Moves should be about. Being able to use any status move even under taunt or boosting your stats while providing utility in weather or terrain effects or just basic stuff like Z-Conversion. If we were to assume offensive Z-Moves were found too powerful and banned, would there be any chance of status Z-Moves remaining or would it fall under Smogons dislike for complex bans?
I know this is all just theoretical stuff but OU is the main metagame and where Z-Moves probably have the biggest impact so I felt this is the right place to ask this.
Z-moves are part of the game. They make some mons more viable now. They also create more sets for viable mons. Having a strong STAB with Z-moves (like Mimikyu) or a better coverage (like Heatran) is not the only thing. Being able to use it or counter it is now a new mechanic in teambuilding.
I won't think Z-moves will be suspected. If so, it will be on exclusive Z-moves, like Eevee in LC.
1. Yes
2. No
Can anyone recommend a bulky EV spread for Rotom-H in OU? I'm most likely running Volt Switch / Overheat / Pain Split / Will-o-Wisp.
Rotom's base HP stat is much lower than its defenses. You get much more bulk by increasing HP instead of both defenses.