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Resource Simple Questions, Simple Answers Thread (read the op before posting a thread)
- Thread starter Celticpride
- Start date
Why are the following mons ranked so highly?
- Alolamola
- Hippowdon
- Suicune
- Alolan Golem
- Uxie (Why is this ranked at all?)
- Avalugg
- Ribombee
NylaTheWolf
This one could probably drop to B- and I don’t have much experience with it, but its a really fat wish passer that some specific teams do appreciate. It has a tool or two to distinguish itself from the multitude of bulky Water-types, so that’s mostly the reasoning behind its ranking.
Hippowdon’s been having a rough time this generation, but fat teams once again can really appreciate it. It’s probably one of the better Mega Mawile switch ins avaiable and it has an advantage or two to distinguish itself from other Ground-types like Gliscor and Landorus-T. Obviously not great, but deserving of its spot.
Suicune is actually a pretty threatening Calm Mind user and PP Staller. Its VinCune set (Substitute, Protect, Calm Mind, & Scald) is still a good win condition, and other sets like CroCune (RestTalk) and ToxCune (Toxic over Calm Mind) are pretty good as well.
Alolan Golem actually has a pretty distinct niche as it can trap Heatran thanks to the combination of Magnet Pull, Earthquake, and Choice Scarf. And it still traps most stuff Magnezone does too.
Uxie was initially ranked for its merits as a Trick Room setter, it could probably be unranked because it’s been a while since the playstyle last succeeded in high level play, but it’s still useable enough for a spot in C-.
Avalugg is in actually one of Stall’s best bets against Mega Mawile, but it also tackles threats like SD Gliscor, SD Landorus-T, and Zygarde, and is, all in all, a solid pick on Stall teams.
Ribombee, alongside Araquanid, is the prefered Sticky Web user for offensive teams that do choose to utilize this hazard. The main thing going for Ribombee is a really fast Speed tier—notably getting the jump on Ash-Greninja prior to transformation—and the likes of Quiver Dance and Stun Spore that add some extra depth to its niche.
I hope I answered all your questions :)
I hope I answered all your questions :)
Just a question about Mega-Latios. Does it have any versatility in its sets at all? It's usage on the ladder is pretty low so I only see it like once every fifty games or so (Mega-Latias is much more common), but I'm pretty much always seeing Calm Mind psychic stab Earthquake draco/ice. I know back in the day (like early ORAS) it ran a pretty bad mixed dragon dance set which resulted in it getting memed but earthquake seems to be its main feature in USUM. Anyone use a dragon dance or double dance set at all, or is it still a really bad idea?
I havent really tried it myself but double dance will probably just be bad, given only 2 moveslots and lack of recovery. A straight DD set might be more viable but the standard set is still probably going to be its best.
I'm actually planning to post about Alolomola dropping, so don't steal my thunder ;)NylaTheWolf
This one could probably drop to B- and I don’t have much experience with it, but its a really fat wish passer that some specific teams do appreciate. It has a tool or two to distinguish itself from the multitude of bulky Water-types, so that’s mostly the reasoning behind its ranking.
Hippowdon’s been having a rough time this generation, but fat teams once again can really appreciate it. It’s probably one of the better Mega Mawile switch ins avaiable and it has an advantage or two to distinguish itself from other Ground-types like Gliscor and Landorus-T. Obviously not great, but deserving of its spot.
Suicune is actually a pretty threatening Calm Mind user and PP Staller. Its VinCune set (Substitute, Protect, Calm Mind, & Scald) is still a good win condition, and other sets like CroCune (RestTalk) and ToxCune (Toxic over Calm Mind) are pretty good as well.
Alolan Golem actually has a pretty distinct niche as it can trap Heatran thanks to the combination of Magnet Pull, Earthquake, and Choice Scarf. And it still traps most stuff Magnezone does too.
Uxie was initially ranked for its merits as a Trick Room setter, it could probably be unranked because it’s been a while since the playstyle last succeeded in high level play, but it’s still useable enough for a spot in C-.
Avalugg is in actually one of Stall’s best bets against Mega Mawile, but it also tackles threats like SD Gliscor, SD Landorus-T, and Zygarde, and is, all in all, a solid pick on Stall teams.
Ribombee, alongside Araquanid, is the prefered Sticky Web user for offensive teams that do choose to utilize this hazard. The main thing going for Ribombee is a really fast Speed tier—notably getting the jump on Ash-Greninja prior to transformation—and the likes of Quiver Dance and Stun Spore that add some extra depth to its niche.
I hope I answered all your questions :)
Thanks so much! Kind of ironic that Avalugg helps stall beat Mawile, considering type advantage. Why is that?
Avalugg has a good match up against most Mega Mawile sets because very few Mega Mawile run Iron Head and any other move pretty much bounces off, while Earthquake/Tectonic Rage will hurt Mega Mawile in return.
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It's frequently confined to one truly-versatile move. It's always running Recover, it's always running Psychic, and it's always running Earthquake. Draco Meteor packs a lot of nuking power, Ice Beam packs incredible coverage without Draco Meteor's violent drawbacks, and HP Fire can bop Scizor and Ferrothorn incredibly hard. Giving up any of those moves requires a very good reason to do so, as otherwise it considerably limits its ability to check top threats.
The set that made Mega Latios so good a few months ago was a very standard offensive mixed wallbreaker with access to reliable recovery to properly check Heatran, among others. You could probably make a Dragon Dance set work, but there are so many better options in OU, including but especially not limited to Zygarde and Mega Charizard X, who pack a tremendous amount more power, neutral coverage, bulk, or utility options. A Double-Dance set seems completely out of the question considering how heavily you'd end up restricting your movepool and this set seems hopelessly outclassed by Magearna, who does something similar with Shift Gear+CM but leverages a far superior typing to make it work.
Mawile almost never runs Iron Head currently since it doesn't offer as much coverage as its superior options (Fire Fang, Thunder Punch, Play Rough, or the especially-uncommon Focus Punch) and thus it has a harder time actually breaking past Avalugg. Moreover, Avalugg also checks a great deal of other stuff - most notable of which is Zygarde, which is frequently completely walled by Avalugg - and can offer a means of hazard control, allowing it to compress a ton of roles pretty reliably.
Why isn’t Cloyster ranked? Shell Smash plus Skill Link is frickin scary
It might be "frickin scary" around ~1250, but it's not actually worth being used in higher level games, let alone remotely viable. If you feel it should change, you can always nominate it with replays and sufficient evidence in the thread yourself.
Shoot, Finch, you’re hitting close to home with the 1250 thing... I was stuck down there for a while.
Yeah, I’ll try to use it and figure it out!
It's not ACTUALLY bad, but the 125-power, 100% accurate Ice STAB coming off of something relatively fast that hits like a nuke actually isn't as good as it sounds considering the insane amount of support Cloyster needs to function about half as well as Hawlucha, Volcarona, Zygarde and OU's other incredibly dangerous setup sweepers do with one or two teammates at most providing support.
Even unranked stuff can be considered "viable," but the biggest difference between something in S/A+ and something that couldn't even make the C- cut is that the stuff you'd see in the higher ranks on the VR are the things you build your team to beat and the things you use to build your team, while things like Cloyster are the things you build your team around. Cloyster, and in that sense most of the fringe-viability stuff that could see a tiny bit of OU usage but can't even hope to become mainstream, is incredibly selfish in that regard: you need something to cover its potential revenge killers, you need something to cover the things +2 moves can't OHKO, you need something to cover the things that can wall you even at +2, you need something to cover the stuff that can outright OHKO Cloyster right off the bat, and you need something to cover hazard control should you run Focus Sash, exacerbating its damage output issues or its compromised bulk.
TL;DR: Cloyster is unranked because the amount of stuff you need to cover on your team to allow Cloyster to function frequently compromises the team's ability to function in the first place, since building to make Cloyster work whatsoever could be better spent building to make a different setup sweeper work even better than it already does.
That makes sense. I'll try it out to see how it works, and if I still think it's good enough to make C-, I'll post a nomination
What's a good chat to ask for people's opinions on their opinion of a nom? (Srry about that unnessary post on Vr earlier)
Well when you nommed it a few days ago there was already some discussion about it. You could ask in the OU discord but 99% of that is just people memeing so I wouldn't bother. The best advice I can give is to just wait to see if anything happens when the next slate happens and if not you can maybe bring it back up. Most of the time when someone noms a new Pokemon it will be discussed for a bit but eventually people just move onto something else.
We currently don’t have a check compendium, but we do have something similar named the BRMT (first result on google; on mobile so I can’t exactly link it) which does something similar, but it’s rather dated at this point in time.
I feel like I frequent here too often, but what EV spread (at least roughly) and nature does stall Moltres typically use? There's no analysis of the fire bird for OU (yet). I imagine it might run enough speed for timid Heatran, but would this compromise its bulk too much (for other threats, as Heatran is walked by virtue of Moltres' typing)?
Also, I'm sure roost and defog are givens, and likely flamethrower to check Kartana and provide a means of damage, but what else does it run? As a Heatran check, I imagine HP ground would be nice, or substitute to avoid status.
Also, I'm sure roost and defog are givens, and likely flamethrower to check Kartana and provide a means of damage, but what else does it run? As a Heatran check, I imagine HP ground would be nice, or substitute to avoid status.
The analysis got delayed a bit but it should be on site soon. Anyway the spread is:
nature: Timid
evs: 208 HP / 60 Def / 240 Spe
This lets Moltres outrun Jolly Excadrill and Timid Heatran. In addition, it can stomach a Thunder Punch from Mega Mawile from full.
The moves you listed are the preferred ones yeah. You can go with either Substitute or Hidden Power Ground, but I found the former more consistent overall.
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I run a team with physically defensive CM clefable, CB Zygarde, Mega charizard Y, specially defensive SD Tapu Bulu, physically defensive Zapdos and Chansey. I’ve had some trouble with Volcarona and fast physical threats like Mega Medicham and Mega Lopunny. I’m considering using Assault vest Tyranitar or Gigalith in place of Clefable to wall and OHKO volcarona. But that doesn’t solve my other problem. Any suggestions?
You could change Clefable into something that brings you Speed control.
However, was do you have Problems with volcarona in you have Chansey? That is a Little Bit paradox.
And this is Not the right Place for Team advice
However, was do you have Problems with volcarona in you have Chansey? That is a Little Bit paradox.
And this is Not the right Place for Team advice
I was guided here by someone. I had already posted a thread in RMT forum. Please review if possible https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/bulky-offense.3644470/
Chansey can’t do much to volcarona apart from toxic while +2 volcarona 2HKOs Chansey after stealth rock with a combination of savage spin out and fire blast, post which it sweeps the rest of the team.
Can anyone hook me up with the Pokepaste for a common offensive USUM OU team? The one I'm looking for has Sub CM Blace, Mold Breaker Exca w/Rock Tomb, Modest Magearna, M-Gyara, and Zygarde I think?
Are you refering to this sample build? If so, just scroll down a bit.
Thats it. Thanks