LOL
Why doesn't anyone mention dragonite as a counter?
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Skymin Discussion Thread
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Why doesn't anyone mention dragonite as a counter?
someone already did a while back in this thread.
I hardly see 4-attack shaymin as the best build. He's going to lose a lot of potential flexibility gained by substitute and/or leech seed, and if you run choice you're obviously walled by a number of enemies. Face it, Shaymin can't do everything. >>
essentially it comes down to this: No 1 pokemon can counter all of shaymin's sets (except maybe regice), but each set is stopped by a number of pokemon. How is this any different from all the discussions we've had regarding other OU sweepers? The point is it isn't, and we can't really say until people develop real opinions based on battle.
essentially it comes down to this: No 1 pokemon can counter all of shaymin's sets (except maybe regice), but each set is stopped by a number of pokemon. How is this any different from all the discussions we've had regarding other OU sweepers? The point is it isn't, and we can't really say until people develop real opinions based on battle.
Have we confirmed its base stats as 120 SpAtk, 127 Speed?
About the Yanmega as a counter/revenge killer for Skymin debate...
Sub Skymin owns Yanmega pretty harsh =(
Yanmega would have to predict the Sub and Air slash instead of protecting. A misprediction means you die (subsequently a Skymin misprediction in the same circumstance means he dies). Still, not very reliable IMO. Substitute Skymin will probably be just as popular or more so than all out attacking.
Sub Skymin owns Yanmega pretty harsh =(
Yanmega would have to predict the Sub and Air slash instead of protecting. A misprediction means you die (subsequently a Skymin misprediction in the same circumstance means he dies). Still, not very reliable IMO. Substitute Skymin will probably be just as popular or more so than all out attacking.
so skymin has been forced out and must now switch in to probably take another 25% damage later on, I mean I know that doesn't make it necessarily OU but if you're going to throw around pointless theorymon then so will I.
And it has Swords Dance, and Seed Bomb, and Natural Gift. You could even attempt to use Quick Attack on a few sets though that probably isn't that useful.
What shaymin sky needs is to be tested in the standard enviroment, shoddy can offer that now. I think this should be considered in order for its placement to be fully autheniceted.
I really think that Skymin should be Uber, 127 Spe coupled with Serene Grace Seed Flare + Air Slash, making most of its counters obsolete. Only Aero / Jolt / Electrode / Deoxys-S and Ice Sharders can down it without a Scarf, and it can get past its "counters" quite easily. Regice and Registeel don't have reliable recovery outside of Rest, not to mention LO HP Fire / Earth Power 2HKOs them both, and Skymin can run SubSeed to get past its counters as well as neutralising said faster pokemon. Something like Sub / Leech Seed / Seed Flare / Air Slash would enable Shaymin to get past its counters as well as having good offensive power to boot.
Sorry, I'm not going to go through 18 pages of messages to see if this has been
said yet.
But FlinchKiss does better than Skymin because
-FlinchKiss learns Thunderwave and Aura Sphere
-Is bulkier
-Is immune to 2 types, allowing more switch-ins.
So Skymin will try to ATTEMPT to do better than FlinchKiss. But it won't.
said yet.
But FlinchKiss does better than Skymin because
-FlinchKiss learns Thunderwave and Aura Sphere
-Is bulkier
-Is immune to 2 types, allowing more switch-ins.
So Skymin will try to ATTEMPT to do better than FlinchKiss. But it won't.
I'm not convinced. I've been on the official server most of the morning playing around with new stuff and I've been completely underwhlemed by the new Shaymin, both when I've been using it and when its been used against me.
Admittedly this might have something to do with peoples lack of experience in using it (myself included), however the team that I've been using is hardly top notch OU material and its not proved that much of a problem.
Subsequently I don't think it should be immediately placed in Ubers without any testing.
Seed Flare has the same accuracy, PP, BP as Fire Blast and Hydro Pump, so the chance to lower the SpD is 68%, lower than the old Hypnosis accuracy. We all know how many times Hypnosis missed for us, so if you miss or don't get the drop on a switch in Special Wall, then you have to switch out if not behind a sub. And with sub+SR you are dead fast if you switch alot
We have have to test it before moving it to Uber, thats sure(The few I battled on the official server were KOed fast(Yay for Trick gross) and mine did not do much.)
We have have to test it before moving it to Uber, thats sure(The few I battled on the official server were KOed fast(Yay for Trick gross) and mine did not do much.)
I did a few battles on Official with Skymin, and the results were positively underwhelming. Skymin doesn't seem to sweep at all with SR weak even with Sub / Seed, but I got haxed to death by a Sub / Seed / Air Slash / Seed Flare variant (Air Slash flinch-hax), so I'm kind of on the fence with this one now.
was that me by any chance? XD
Yeah, I'm getting plenty of easy wins with that set. it would be easier if I didn't have wobbuffet and Garchomp flying around everywhere
Shaymin doesn't seem to cause high-speed teams much trouble, but slow, defensive teams all seem to have a lot more problems with it. Substitute variants are really quite annoying though.
I beg to differ: Skymin's speed couple with it's decent dual STAB combination and ability to force switches is really a big problem for those Flimsy teams, since you can come in on Infernape(example), sub on the switch(assuming they do so), and then proceed to Air Slash it from behind the sub. Or seed flare. or hell, leech seed if it's something like heatran that usually run scarf
Porygon2 may be able to counter it, if it gets a boost from Download Then Ice Beam is an easy KO or it can T-Wave or Agility Skymin and then KO. 240 HP Ev's, Max Sp Def with Calm Nature 2 takes about 40% from it when it switches in from Timid 252 Special Attack. If it doesn't get a special defence drop (Big If) he can Take down Skymin.
Otherwise Bright Powder Snow Veil Froslass, Ice Beam will def KO and neither Seed Flare nor Air Slash are 100% accurate anyway so you may be able to avoid two hits and KO with Froslass.
Otherwise Bright Powder Snow Veil Froslass, Ice Beam will def KO and neither Seed Flare nor Air Slash are 100% accurate anyway so you may be able to avoid two hits and KO with Froslass.
Looks liek HpIce Jolteon might make a come back, resisting Air Slash, outspeeding and being able to 1HKO back. Just watch out for Seed Flare, which im quite sure wont 1HKO on the switch.