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NOC Smallstreet Mafia v2 Won by the Mafia (Clouds, Ehmcee, Dead By Daylight, Duskfall98)

vote M2H

i'm pretty much caught up. kicking up some dust for now, since this isn't a version of M2H i've seen before & passivity is at a high. i thought i remembered them saying they could be busy at some point so it's possible that's factoring in, i couldn't find the post looking back. even with that, something feels off here compared to typical M2H D1s and i wouldn't be surprised to see the "let's massclaim" through the megaphone be an attempt to come across looking like a villager attempting to force progress or something, seems like an approach they'd take as mafia

here's where i'm at roughly for my early village build:

townread: lechen, angrypidgeon
townlean: ehmcee
light townlean: dead by daylight, pulsar(?)

lechen is a read i feel pretty confident in, partially secret reasons but feel free to ask questions if you have any doubts here

angrypidgeon has trended up throughout the course of the day to the point where they'd have to be powerwolfing out of their mind and i'm not gonna entertain that at the moment considering they're the closest thing to a townleader we have, so i'm penciling in their slot as town for now. nothing feels in bad faith enough to have concerns that they're attempting to steer the ship in the wrong direction and even though i don't see level with some of their reads & think some of those townreads are hasty, it doesn't reflect poorly on their alignment

ehmcee i continue to feel good about bar that 1 strange recent post that may have just been me misunderstanding, still not at a place where he compares to the above two for me when i lay my cards out on the table so i'm keeping him a tier down for now

dead by daylight i have more subdued reasons for including where i did, but basically i think that the way he's posting feels "alone" and not like he's being coached. for example, i think the post about the neon policy is something that doesn't get hurled into the night sky in the way he did there if he's mafia without being discussed in a mafia chat first, but this is also rooted in my understanding that he's relatively new to the game

Dead by Daylight how many games have you played prior to this if you don't mind sharing? sorry if i'm incorrect about the above & you do have more experience, i just don't think we've been in a game together or that i've spectated one you've been in

pulsar i've been back and forth on more than anyone else here and i struggle to read her consistently for some reason, but there's been more positive than negative so far and i liked this stretch of posts. there's a level of comfortability here that mafia generally struggle to emulate when laying down reads in thread. it's only bad if she was partnered with ehmcee, but i'm leaning ehmcee town anyways, so i'm stowing away that tinfoil

also, not aligned on the alice townread as of now AngryPidgeon, so would appreciate if you can shed some light on that when possible
 
I like this post

Also Clouds I can confirm DBD has had a grand total of one NOC and one OC game, namely the last ones that have been held. I remember him mentioning during our Diplomacy game that he'd never touched mafia before at that point
 
Although I do feel kinda bad about this, I genuinely believe lynching dbd is the play here, because all three outcomes don't hurt us much
if dbd flips scum, we can be pretty sure mafia recruited and know their lineup to some extent
If dbd flips town and nobody got a bpv, then mafia is 3 person
If dbd flips town and someone got a bpv, we know the mafia lineup

yes on the first line re: recruit, but i'm not sure we learn a ton about the lineup other than that maybe the outer edge high credit role(s) are less likely to be mafia unless mafia recruited and also chose one of those roles & assumed a bunch of debt in the process. i think this is only the case if they went with 1 higher power role and 3 basically zero cost roles, but i'm also agreed that they likely selected 1 healer, so it throws a slight wrench in that

second line... i don't think this scenario locks in a 3-person mafia team

not understanding what you mean by the third line or how we'd know the lineup from that

i strongly dislike the idea of "info flips" as a general rule, but if you guys truly think there's enough red flags with dead by daylight here then it's not like i can stop the vote and i understand the low risk re: them being vanilla and us not losing a power role even if they are town. i'm just afraid they're beginning to look like the town slot that everyone, including mafia, gets to dogpile because their posting is surface level awkward or questionable
 
Ok back at the hotel, I have my flight tomorrow so going to go inactive again but a few things

the “policy neon” post was misguided for sure

I do have some reads but I will share them tomorrow, once I get home
take your time, but yeah anything helps. you don't even have to be super confident in it, any sort of thought we can trace to see if the logic tracks or something like that is enough to get an idea of whether your approach to the game is pure or not. hope the trip was nice!
 
There is absolutely no way that DBD flipping town confirms no recruitment. Assuming scum went for public vanilla is only useful as far as WIFOM tactics are useful, which is to say not very much so. However I do buy the idea that DBD flipping town + BPV going out gives us a lot of info as to what roles have been bought, namely the high-cost stuff like doublevoter, MFH, gov, etc.

I see where you're sorta getting these ideas Lechen but it's not the open-and-shut case that'd make me get on a wagon by itself.
 
my thoughts re: mafia choosing pure vanilla as a role are mainly like

the level one line of thinking is that it looks good(?) because it's a useless role and so like why would mafia pick it etc etc, but i think any mafia team that looks even just a bit beyond this will realize that it becomes more of a double negative. it's both a role town is generally comfortable flipping and also has no material value, and it's not like anyone familiar with the theme will see the announcement and think it makes that player a villager

again, the fatal flaw here is of course that just because i wouldn't choose pure vanilla on mafia myself doesn't mean some other mafia team thinks the same way i do, i just disagree that it's a likely mafia role and disvibe heavily with these random use cases for the flip that are half based on what we'd learn if dbd flipped town. if we think someone's flipping town with enough confidence, we shouldn't vote them, point blank

i'm not to that point to put my foot down on the dead by daylight vote yet, but my thoughts on his slot are captured at the top of the page here and i'll wait to see what he posts re: the reads he said he has before passing any further judgment here

in the interim: anyone have thoughts on alice, skipper & nightemerald so far?
 
in the interim: anyone have thoughts on alice, skipper & nightemerald so far?
I think you summed the vanilla stuff up well

Read my 220 for thoughts on Alice, long story short I don’t like her so far in a vacuum. However I should note that in Town of Salem, where we were scummates, I noticed Alice felt more inclined to wallpost and do more generic “high-effort townplay” posts, so perhaps watch out for that. For me she’s a scumlean but I want that to evolve with more content

Skipper is whatever, idt I like his playstyle so I’ll abstain

NE made like one post that I remember raising an eyebrow at but he’s null if I’m being reasonable
 
NE made like one post that I remember raising an eyebrow at but he’s null if I’m being reasonable
Found it upon ISO review, I found his 194 questionable. It seemed very silly to nitpick about a quick “most skilled players” list from me, especially as what is currently his only piece of content not related to easy setup discussion. The fact that he did it after pulsar was already shading me also kinda scumpings to me
 
yes on the first line re: recruit, but i'm not sure we learn a ton about the lineup other than that maybe the outer edge high credit role(s) are less likely to be mafia unless mafia recruited and also chose one of those roles & assumed a bunch of debt in the process. i think this is only the case if they went with 1 higher power role and 3 basically zero cost roles, but i'm also agreed that they likely selected 1 healer, so it throws a slight wrench in that

second line... i don't think this scenario locks in a 3-person mafia team

not understanding what you mean by the third line or how we'd know the lineup from that

i strongly dislike the idea of "info flips" as a general rule, but if you guys truly think there's enough red flags with dead by daylight here then it's not like i can stop the vote and i understand the low risk re: them being vanilla and us not losing a power role even if they are town. i'm just afraid they're beginning to look like the town slot that everyone, including mafia, gets to dogpile because their posting is surface level awkward or questionable

for the second line, mafia should go into debt if they pick any other role apart from vanilla cuz its like healer+tracker+gladiator+neighborizer I think

for the third line, I meant lineup as in the role lineup, because if no recruit, its basically doublevoter + vengenful+ healer (maybe gladiator instead of healer?) I think
 
Side note, but in the other game, when flandrs was mafia, he was strongly for info flips so i feel less confident about scumleaning flandrs
 
Could you give an example here? All I remember about my voting was hopping on genisu because yes and tunneling on psy for different (fake) reasons
You said this in tos
"JALMONT has given us information, and that information may be useful, but his terrible thread behavior makes it so that we literally have to pry the remaining info from his cold, dead hands to verify that it's even true and/or useful."
Why do you want me to give an example lol when I'm saying you feel a bit more town than scum atm
 
Clouds
I agree some of my reads are hasty. I intentionally avoided using strong words to describe them. And Alice maybe does deserve to drop a level. My townread on Alice is somewhat gut that she feels like shes interacting with people comfortably.

In the previous game she was scum and I think felt obligated to force some fluffy content such hasn't happened here.
Does the mafia know who has the bpv? this could backfire if they don't.
This did seem like something shed know as mafia. Ya could be a fake townslip of course, but I do think this was real.
 
AngryPidgeon: First time I'm playing with him in a NOC but I like him being so proactive, there is not a single post that I felt it was immediately scummy so far from him.

Dead by Daylight: if this slot is mafia I don't think mafia turned on encrypt day 1. I read him as town that got the lower end of stick as a role, in vacation and panicking because there are a few scumreads based on role. I don't like his posting so far but I don't feel like it comes from scummy intentions. It could be that they actually turned on encrypt day 1 but there is lack of communication between him and his mafia team because of his circumstances but I think it's more probable him being town here.

Flandrs: Overall positive thread presence. I don't understand his scum equity read on me and pulsar to be honest. It's based on the fact that I made a couple of posts last morning, one of them apparently me backing her up then pulsar doing like 10 posts in a row with ended up with me doing a couple of "fluffy" posts and leaving. I don't get that line of reasoning.

HydrogenHydreigon: I didn't interact with him at all in zorbees district game where he was scum but in all other games he has been town. His thread behaviour is definitely in line with previous town games.

Duskfall98: I don't understand his vote on clouds nor his take on him being town if apricity is mafia. I'd like to hear an explanation because if there was I missed it. I wouldn't oppose a vote on him for now. Please explain!

Lechen: He feels mostly in line with his behaviour during ehmcee's game, only a bit more proactive I guess?. It's his second game and it's exactly how I would expect him to evolve.

Pulsar: In zorbees game she was confirmed town and I thought it was a bastard game because her actions were far away from what you'd expect as a confirmed town. That says everything about my abilities to read this slot. However I agree with flandrs view on her thread behavior being a bit more proactive than usual but I don't think it indicates that she is mafia.
 
This did seem like something shed know as mafia. Ya could be a fake townslip of course, but I do think this was real.
I was honestly asking if mafia knows who they sent the bpv to. In case they don't know claiming it would backfire greatly because we had the potential of randomly blocking a kill later and I'm sure that claiming it after the kill is blocked is better.
 
M2H is hard to read because they have never been this inactive but they are working full time now so it's justified.

I don't think neon is scum based on seriousness like saber said. I feel like his town or scum meta can change to something closer to TOS game if he tries.

ElectricityCat can be a lost town newbie or scum newbie being told to not speak too much in thread. There is nothing that have made me think it was one option over the other.

I feel like we put Ehmcee on the defensive with the fake townslip thing but didn't gain much info from it, at least I can't get a read.

I don't like skippergamez reads on m2h and duskfall town and pulsar scum so far. He did say that he will give us his thoughts today so I will be waiting for it!

I've been with clouds only for a single game and he was alingment cop (town) and I think his play so far is in line. This slot is probably the one who has the most potential to be recruited if they are recruiting based on skill alone.

Nightemerald posting could be done from both alignments and be fine honestly.

I'd like to hear more from saber and apricity!
 
relpying to me saying “neon is town”

are you sure on that? what's making you think so?

mainly asking cause i have zero read on the guy whatsoever whereas in past games i've at least seen glimpses of alignment indicative content

i've never seen him as mafia before either
This was an earlier post from me, I hadn’t seen him as mafia before I went on “hiatus”, so I always assume he’s town but now I know he’s been scum before so I need to read that game
 
Duskfall98 kinda willing to give you the benefit of the doubt for now that i think that'd be almost too ridiculous for you to post as mafia knowing how it'd come across, but i hope you're not thinking that one-dimensionally re: recruits. you're not the only one to have aired similar thoughts, but i think the idea of recruiting a mafia member just based on experience or perceived skill is obvious enough of a choice that it easily can be avoided for that reason

+ are you voting me for any specific reason? if you believe the hal thing you said, then how come you landed on me?

maybe, but its worth considering at least, honestly I wouldve considered it a very good chance hal was recruited (if not in first 3), but its maybe me just being behind the times, which i reconsidered when someone earlier didnt even realise hal was highly regarded

i didnt at rand believe that hal was likely to be mafia though, wont pretend i didnt
 
my vote on you was mostly because you had done nothing rvs, and youre the person who i recently had an interesting game with so wanted to see how you would treat me when you enter thread
 
Hahahaha. Its entirely fair to say I am a compulsive poster who has tendencies to flood the thread. I would probably do that as mafia too, but I do think my content is town this game so wont disagree there. Ive been somewhat restrained because all my posts have been from phone.

Gonna do this with a heavy heart for now
Vote m2h

whats town about your posting, in regards to what would you have done different as mafia?
 
i know what he meant, it doesn't make it any less bizarre to me considering he knows better

it was phrased like a serious statement, but he veered off with his vote, so the actions aren't matching the words

there is a limited pool of people who ever get recruited in this game, my perspective of who that may be may be slightly off/limited due to bias but the pool is never bigger than like 5 people imo

that being said if the pool was 5 possibilities it wouldnt be helpful at that point
 
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