on the topic of this I want you guys to know Iron Valiant's physical bulk is just barely better than that of Roaring Moon
Val doesn't warrant a suspect but this is a fact that's haunted me for two years and I loathe it with all my being
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Metagame SV OU Metagame Discussion v4
- Thread starter TPP
- Start date
Val doesn't warrant a suspect but this is a fact that's haunted me for two years and I loathe it with all my being
I think the reason bulky Val sets (probably) aren't going to pop up is that it's only means of recovery is Drain Punch which is a hard sell to fit into physical/mixed sets due to its lack of firepower compared to Close Combat or lack of utility compared to Knock. Though as someone earlier in the thread pointed out, if it had Draining Kiss, bulky CM sets would be experimented with.
Shout outs to Iron Bundle for also having a randomly high phys def stat.
I've recently been testing Yanmega on a fresh account for a couple of days (just got to the 1700s so I think I can now kinda estimate how good it is) and I think...That while not meta or extremely good, it's honestly not that bad.
it's bug season
Gotta give credits to "Yanmega Gaming" since they showed me this set: Tera Ground Throat Spray with Protect, Bug Buzz, Air Slash and Tera Blast.
Yanmega after a speed boost is faster than any non-speed boosted Pokémon in the tier, and since Scarf is basically a dead item asides from H-Samurott and Darkrai, after a protect on Darkrai or a free turn before facing H-Samurott it's really easy outspeed everything.
Yanmega can also live Sucker Punch from full since it has passable bulk, and due to its inicial flying type, it can enter avoiding spikes and T-Spikes. And with its actually strong special attack + throat spray boost it can easily clean usual comps formed with pokemon like Waterpon, Tusk, Raging Bolt, R-Moon, Iron Valiant, Pult after a bit of chip, Gholdengo...
You obviously have to take measures aganist Stealth Rocks, so you have to team it with (in my opinion) multiple anti-hazards mon. I rock a fast Tusk + Hatt comp that I like to spam in every team.
Yanmega of course is stopped by some Pokémon like Corv or Bliss, and it's a bit tera reliant. So you have to prepare for those MUs.
it's bug season Gotta give credits to "Yanmega Gaming" since they showed me this set: Tera Ground Throat Spray with Protect, Bug Buzz, Air Slash and Tera Blast.
Yanmega after a speed boost is faster than any non-speed boosted Pokémon in the tier, and since Scarf is basically a dead item asides from H-Samurott and Darkrai, after a protect on Darkrai or a free turn before facing H-Samurott it's really easy outspeed everything.
Yanmega can also live Sucker Punch from full since it has passable bulk, and due to its inicial flying type, it can enter avoiding spikes and T-Spikes. And with its actually strong special attack + throat spray boost it can easily clean usual comps formed with pokemon like Waterpon, Tusk, Raging Bolt, R-Moon, Iron Valiant, Pult after a bit of chip, Gholdengo...
You obviously have to take measures aganist Stealth Rocks, so you have to team it with (in my opinion) multiple anti-hazards mon. I rock a fast Tusk + Hatt comp that I like to spam in every team.
Yanmega of course is stopped by some Pokémon like Corv or Bliss, and it's a bit tera reliant. So you have to prepare for those MUs.
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Roaring Moon has over base 100 for both HP and special defense. Base 71 defense is low, but not that low when you have high HP. The high HP stat means it can live more hits than people think, especially with an invested set or a Tera that resists an incoming hit. This is compounded by the fact that Roaring Moon already resists a lot of common priority like Grassy Glide, Sucker Punch, or Thunderclap. So a defensive Tera like Steel can be used to compliment remaining priority weaknesses like Ice Shard or even just neutral one like E-speed. And suddenly the priority that was supposed to stop it from going out of control doesn't.
Uninvesteed and unresisted Roaring Moon is frail on the physical side, but there are a lot of things it can use to live a hit. The high base HP also means a bulk invested Moon is a lot tankier than people think. Another trick I found back when Rillaboom was more common was using Grassy Seed, which gave recovery and complimented the lack of natural defense. Screens can also be used if it is HO, though I don't know how viable that team style is these days.
Roaring moon didn’t earn its place, Salamence did
And now, Roaring moon must earn its place or be cast aside for good, its time for us to fight the night.
Salamence @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Moxie
Tera Type: Ground/Dark
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Earthquake/Crunch
- Dual Wingbeat
- Roost/Crunch
What sets the menace apart from his uncle is his access to moxie (which allows for snowballing if you play right) and a typing that fits better on dragon steel fairy cores, though moxie is the only ability recommended as otherwise its outclassed by dragonite with extreme speed since intimidate is mid for a sweeper and this mon’s whole thing is moxie
Iron Crown @ Leftovers
Ability: Quark Drive
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 20 Atk
- Substitute
- Calm Mind
- Psyshock
- Tachyon Cutter
Iron Crown (I know what you’re thinking, don’t mention it this time) is a good partner to salamence since their typings do compliment each other particularly well, i chose this particular set because its something I made rather than the usual booster cm, with the extra bulk strengthening the core.
And now, Roaring moon must earn its place or be cast aside for good, its time for us to fight the night.
Salamence @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Moxie
Tera Type: Ground/Dark
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Earthquake/Crunch
- Dual Wingbeat
- Roost/Crunch
What sets the menace apart from his uncle is his access to moxie (which allows for snowballing if you play right) and a typing that fits better on dragon steel fairy cores, though moxie is the only ability recommended as otherwise its outclassed by dragonite with extreme speed since intimidate is mid for a sweeper and this mon’s whole thing is moxie
Iron Crown @ Leftovers
Ability: Quark Drive
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 20 Atk
- Substitute
- Calm Mind
- Psyshock
- Tachyon Cutter
Iron Crown (I know what you’re thinking, don’t mention it this time) is a good partner to salamence since their typings do compliment each other particularly well, i chose this particular set because its something I made rather than the usual booster cm, with the extra bulk strengthening the core.
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Sticky webs with bulky moon seems really strong to me, you get to still outspeed val andalso have good bulk and the extra dmg of adamant. https://pokepast.es/7d9ae5f6991de101 Found this team on some smogon page and it worked really great after some changes, life orb ghold feels underrated on webs, with the speed control of wens he can really destroy some teams.
If you ever feel like your SV OU experience is getting stale, fret not. Choice Specs Iron Valiant is here to fulfill your needs! It's fast, has great coverage, priority, can help vs Stall with Psyshock, what's not to love? There is no better feeling than just switching this thing in over and over again to break through things. Even has Trick if you wish to cripple Alomomola.
I know it's not really a new set at all, but I just wanted to remind people that this Moonblast spamming machine is truly goated
I know it's not really a new set at all, but I just wanted to remind people that this Moonblast spamming machine is truly goated
Does anyone have an unconventional Roaring Moon set that you've had success with?
I've been having fun with this set.
Roaring Moon @ Choice Band
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Knock Off
- Tera Blast
- U-turn
- Earthquake
It's a minor innovation, but I like the ability to wear down and pivot on the checks to the traditional DD Tera Fairy sets. It plays similarly to pivot Ogerpon-W sets, in that the threat of being a sweeper means you can make try-hard momentum plays. Also, I feel like Outrage is a hard move to click without sacrificing your Moon and giving the opponent free turns. Although DD Moon probably fits on more teams, there is no better feeling than immediately nuking something with banded Tera Blast.
I've been having fun with this set.
Roaring Moon @ Choice Band
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Knock Off
- Tera Blast
- U-turn
- Earthquake
It's a minor innovation, but I like the ability to wear down and pivot on the checks to the traditional DD Tera Fairy sets. It plays similarly to pivot Ogerpon-W sets, in that the threat of being a sweeper means you can make try-hard momentum plays. Also, I feel like Outrage is a hard move to click without sacrificing your Moon and giving the opponent free turns. Although DD Moon probably fits on more teams, there is no better feeling than immediately nuking something with banded Tera Blast.
What team are you running with it?
I posted a max defense roaring moon set months ago before bulky style blew up, tera steel with roost, dd, iron head and knock off. I found it extremely effective. Leftovers and enough speed to hit 285.Does anyone have an unconventional Roaring Moon set that you've had success with?
I've been having fun with this set.
Roaring Moon @ Choice Band
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Knock Off
- Tera Blast
- U-turn
- Earthquake
It's a minor innovation, but I like the ability to wear down and pivot on the checks to the traditional DD Tera Fairy sets. It plays similarly to pivot Ogerpon-W sets, in that the threat of being a sweeper means you can make try-hard momentum plays. Also, I feel like Outrage is a hard move to click without sacrificing your Moon and giving the opponent free turns. Although DD Moon probably fits on more teams, there is no better feeling than immediately nuking something with banded Tera Blast.
4 Atk Iron Valiant Close Combat vs. 208 HP / 252+ Def Roaring Moon: 288-342 (71.4 - 84.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
At the time mixed valiant was everywhere so this was effective to set up on it. Also blocked most common priority with the bulk depending whether you tera or not. Unfortunately the drop in power did require you to dd twice for the sweep and since most people keep kingambit in the back you didn't have great coverage for it and it usually had full HP. But I still think it was MVP more than a few times as midgame sweeper
Its sad to do the suspect test, lose 0 games to the pkm thats about to be banned, but lose 6 games to zamazenta 
So far, i'm just using an RMT of a Specs Valiant team created by LovelyLuna.
Here's the team in case you're interested. It's pretty neat
https://pokepast.es/1484c8bad3d3fa6a
Don’t know if this is already popular consensus but wisp feels borderline mandatory on darkrai rn. It punishes all the bulky physical attackers that try to set up on it like moon and tera’d dnite, and is just such a safe progress maker in general. Nasty plot with dark and ice coverage is already so good, you only really miss out on clef and prim, which admittedly does suck but is usually worth the trade off imo.
I disagree, anything other than 4 attacks is completely false, Darkrai is too frail to ever set up and its coverage is too valuable. Pult is a much better wisp user.
Darkrai baits in and cripples different Pokémon that pult would struggle to. All kinds of dark resists for instance, and ruining the likes of Zama, Great Tusk, Kingambit and
even limiting Ting Lu is big. Whereas it can also slot knock off to lure in and cripple Garganacl or other sponges of its hits removing their items. This can be a much more effective progress making method as even when it finds fatter teams it can’t just break with power, it can still leave a lasting mark on them.
125 Speed is still really good too, outspeeding the entire unboosted meta save for Dragapult (cringe) and Zamazenta, so you're not left wanting to find opportunities by threatening foes
There's also SS OU if you don't like this meta, it is a good bit bulkier but games really aren't as slow as you would think as long as you aren't unlucky and get a stall vs stall match
And if not that good old adv is out there
Hey its been a while since I’ve done posts like this, but I really wanna share some sets I think are underrated or have potential.
BU Ceru (Ceruledge) @ Leftovers/Covert Cloak
Ability: Flash Fire
Tera Type: Grass
EVs: 252 HP / 56 Def / 116 SpD / 84 Spe
Careful Nature
- Bulk Up
- Bitter Blade
- Shadow Sneak
- Taunt
Set Details
The classic Pre-Home set has some merit. In preparation for Tera Fairy Moon, teams have resorted to checks like Clefable, Corv, G-Weez, CB Scizor, and Molt. Bulk Up Ceruledge can dog on these structures with its base typing and burn immunity even after Tera. Gouging Fire’s ban opened up room for another Wisp immune wincon to take its place. Defensively, it checks non-Tera Blast Moth, Cinder, and most variants of Valiant for offensive teams. 84 Speed EVs puts it above 0 speed Gliscor which is fine since most of them either invest entirely on HP and SpD, or go max Speed in the case of SD sets. 56 Def lets Ceruledge after a Bulk Up, eat max attack Tusk’s HLR at full and take a huge chunk of its HP with Bitter Blade. Also eats Gambit Sucker at full after 5 SO boosts. Tera Grass flips your matchup with Waterpon and Ground types. You could also go with Covert to set up on Garg and the stupid Mochi Ghost.
Partners
Veil is the best archetype to fit Ceru. With Ceru benefitting from the added bulk from screens and it being a great Dgleam Moth check which otherwise stomps on the archetype. Hatt is self-explanatory. Keeps hazards off.
As mentioned, Ceru beats most of Roaring Moon’s checks and punishes reckless Will-O-Wisp clicking.
Bulky Rai (Darkrai) @ Leftovers/Heavy-Duty-Boots/Red Card
Ability: Bad Dreams
Tera Type: Poison
EVs: 240 HP / 60 Def / 208 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dark Pulse
- Sludge Bomb
- Nasty Plot/Ice Beam
- Will-O-Wisp/Knock Off
Set Details
Darkrai gets so much milage out of bulk investment, to point I’d argue this is the most optimal way to run it. Still hits pretty hard without investment and makes it easier for Dankrai to click Plot, Wisp, or Knock. Since it can tank almost any hit from Dnite at full, it can save you from being snowballed by random Dnite bullshit. I decided to optimize MAVERICK SHOOTERS ’ spread. 208 Speed to outrun Cinderace cause speed ties are for the weak. 240HP/60Def survives Pre-Tera Acrobatics from +1 Moon at full and eats any hit from unboosted Adamant Waterpon. Red Card is nasty tech that can punish Boosters and possibly give Darkrai an opportunity to get off another boost.
Partners
Anything that appreciates Ting-Lu or Zamazenta being crippled by Wisp is gonna appreciate having Dankrai around.
Darkrai fits well into Spike Stacking BO structures as it can not only support them with fast Wisp/Knock, but also enjoys the pressure from Spikes.
Offensive Tank Chomp (Garchomp) @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Rough Skin
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 56 HP / 252 Atk / 200 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Outrage
- Stone Edge
- Spikes/Stealth Rock
Set Details
Shout outs to Kazt_5 for bringing light to this set. As good as the standard Tankchomp set is, it does suffer from passivity. With max Attack and enough speed to creep past Kyurem, Chomp’s role is to set hazards and kamikaze on physical walls like Tusk, Lando. Stone Edge picks off Moltres and Zapdos. Ting-Lu is generally a better Hazard-setting Ground, but the merit of RH + Rough Skin chip can open up several offensive sweepers. Its similar to offensive Lando, but the speed tier and neutrality to Water grants it a better matchup into Waterpon, Samu, or Kyurem leads.
Partners
All of these appreciate chip damage being forced on mons like Tusk or Gambit. Chomp particularly synergizes well with Pecharunt and Gholdengo who also cover its defensive weaknesses such as Fairies. Forcing Helmet chip onto Corv greedily clicking U-Turn, puts it in range of +1 Moon. Gambit also appreciates Chomp’s traits. This set is designed for BO hazard stack similarly to Ting-Lu and Samu.
Heavy Slam Garg (Garganacl) (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Purifying Salt
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 HP / 52 Def / 204 SpD
Careful Nature
- Salt Cure
- Stealth Rock
- Heavy Slam
- Recover
Set Details
Garg is legit phenomenal rn. With Pecha being the more popular Poison-type pivot over Glowking and teams prioritizing Spike Stacking, Garganacl’s ability to easily force progress via Salt Cure + SR is ever more valuable. Players say things like “It struggles vs Spike Stack” but in reality, Tera Water Garg can legit carry the entire matchup by itself since they tend to lack the immediate power to push through Garg. Storm Zone demonstrated this perfectly in his week 9 game with Fusien .
Curse and Iron Defense are life-savers into the two hottest topics of the month, SD Gliscor and Moon. Ice Punch has been experimented with to smack Gliscor and Hydrapple, but I wanna touch on Heavy Slam. This tech is specifically for its biggest counter, Clefable. Dealing over 38% and outstalling Moonlight
Partners
Part of why I feel Garg is better rn is because of G-Weez’s rise in usage. It covers Garg’s three biggest short-comings. Regenerator walls, hazards, and Magic Guard Clef. Ting-Lu is the other fat progress making wall that like Garg, sets hazards and forces chip via Ruination. Pecha and/or Sinistcha blocks rocks, checks Waterpon, and punishes Tusk as it eats Salt Cure chip. Latios appreciates Tera Water Garg’s ability to assert pressure onto Steels like Ghold or Iron Crown.
Specs Ghold (Gholdengo) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Good as Gold
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Shadow Ball
- Make It Rain
- Thunderbolt
- Recover/Trick
Set Details
This is more on the fun side than being optimal, but if you queue into Balance with Specs Ghold, prepare to see numbers. Make It Rain does ludicrous damage, even to resists. Dealing 39% min to Ting-Lu and being able to 2HKO Gambit and phys def Molt with Tera Steel. Tera Steel also has the benefit of flipping its matchup with Gambit, opposing Ghosts, Rai, and Knock Valiant. Tbolt is so you don’t dud to Tera Water Garg and gives you an option to nuke Moltres without burning Tera. You could run any fourth move on Ghold, like Trick for Stall.
Partners
Since Specs Ghold is mainly to break, its defensive utility for Zama is worse. So you need to circumvent this with another Zama check. Fortunately, Zapdos and Molt perfectly fit this bill *hehe get it, cause bird*
Both of them can also pivot and bring in Ghold. G-Weez is another option, tho more of a momentum drain than the birds.
Specs Ghold prefers to be on structures with 2-3 pivots that can safely bring it in. Lando and Lokix are great choices that can bait in Corviknight for Ghold. The former being a solid soft check to Zama and Moon, while the latter appreciates Ghold’s balance breaking potential. On the slower side, Corv and Mola cover Specs Ghold’s defensive shortcomings vs Tusk and Dnite.
Bulky AV Crown (Iron Crown) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Quark Drive
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 100 SpA / 176 SpD / 232 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 20 Atk
- Tachyon Cutter
- Future Sight
- Psyshock
- Volt Switch
Set Details
The popularity of Moon and Ting-Lu really devestated Iron Crown. Specs variants can break past Ting-Lu with a couple Tachyons or a Focus Blast, but loses its defensive utility. AV achieves this, but can miss out on crucial KOs, and Calm Mind variants are inconsistent in Ting-Lu country. Instead of trying to make Crown muscle past its bad matchups, I’d rather focus on improving its already good matchups. This spread still creeps past Kyurem, but avoids a 3HKO from Prima after SR and even dodges a 2HKO from unboosted defensive Ghold. In general it tanks special hits more easily.
Partners
Anything that has strong offensive synergy with Future Sight and can abuse Ting-Lu are strong partners. Prime Pult is really good at forcing chip with Banded U-Turns. Spike support makes Volt Switch more potent and Tusk removes the hazards that would wear Crown down while having defensive synergy
Specs Moth (Iron Moth) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Quark Drive
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Fiery Dance
- Sludge Wave
- Overheat
- U-turn
Set Details
Another “this is fun but not optimal” set. Specs Overheat can catch Balance teams off-guard as their Ting-Lu takes over 40%. The real kicker of this set is U-Turn which lets it pivot around bad matchups like Garg, AV Mola, or Tera Water Glowking.
Partners
Specs Moth wants to be paired with as much hazard control as reasonably possible. Hatt and Tusk are the best choices. Hatt puts pressure on Moth’s checks with Nuzzle while Tusk has good offensive synergy with Moth. My favorite pairing is other offensive pivots like AV Flip Turn Samu, who asserts immense pressure onto Slowking, and sets Spikes. Ghold appreciates Moth’s ability to overwhelm special walls. You also wanna pair it with stuff that can handle Roaring Moon, since Moth gives Moon a very easy opportunity to set up. None of them are consistent cuz Moon is broken, but Corv, Dnite, and the kanto birds are your best bet.
Bulky Treads (Iron Treads) @ Leftovers
Ability: Quark Drive
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 248 HP / 28 Atk / 128 SpD / 104 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Iron Head/Ice Spinner/Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Knock Off/Iron Head/Ice Spinner/Volt Switch
- Rapid Spin
Set Details
You sometimes see Treads as the spinner of choice on Balances over Tusk for a reason. Its Steel typing means it has a better MU into Ghold and Pecha, the two biggest spinblockers in the tier. It also means Treads can tank Dragon Pulses from Raging Bolt and check it more consistently. You could try out Iron Head for a more consistent matchup into Fairies like Clefable and Bolt who loves to run Tera Fairy. 28 Attack EVs lets it 2HKO defensive Gholdengo always while outspeeding Tusk at 301 speed. Some would say to invest in more speed for Pecha, but I find it better to under speed it, since they often love pressing Parting Shot. So you can click Spin in front of Pecha as they pivot out since ppl play like bots with Pecharunt, and watch them react flabbergasted by losing all three layers of Spikes in an instant.
Partners
Anything that hates Ghold/Bolt or hazards really appreciates having Treads around. Garganacl in particular can run SR, freeing up a slot for Treads and vice versa.
Strength Sap Polt (Polteageist) @ White Herb
Ability: Cursed Body
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 188 HP / 180 SpA / 140 Spe
Modest Nature
- Shell Smash
- Shadow Ball
- Tera Blast
- Strength Sap
Set Details
Whatever mad man/woman/non-binary dude came up with this set in UU, is filled with regret for the damage they have caused. This set is also demonic in OU too, but it’s also not very consistent lol. Strength Sap and Cursed Body cheeses games in an instant. This spread outpaces Dragapult at +2 while dumping the rest into HP and SpA.
Partners
I can only see this thing fitting on Veil. You wanna pair it with mons that can assert pressure onto bulky Dark types like Ting-Lu. Moon, Samu, NP D-Gleam Ghold, and Bolt are all good at forcing chip dmg. Tusk too while spinning hazards off. Hatterene can Nuzzle Gambit on the switch, making end games vs it more doable for Polt.
Standard Slither (Slither Wing) @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Dragon
EVs: 252 HP / 48 Atk / 124 Def / 84 Spe
Impish Nature
- First Impression
- U-turn
- Morning Sun
- Will-O-Wisp/Stun Spore
Set Details
An underrated defensive pivot with great matchups against the three best mons in the tier rn, Zama/Ting/Tusk. Good matchups into several other staples such as Samurott, Gambit, non-Tera Blast/Tera Fire Dnite, Knock/EQ Moon, Darkrai, etc. Also provides priority via First Impression which with 48 Attack EVs, guarantees a one-shot on Waterpon assuming it doesn’t Tera. Alternatively you could run Stun Spore over Wisp to cripple Pecha and Molt who’d otherwise wouldn’t care about Wisp. Helmet is cool tech that punishes U-Turns and can prevent Samu from getting up Spikes in the lead MU. Tera Dragon gives you an out vs Waterpon in case it Terastilizes.
Partners
Slither struggles with fat teams rocking the birds and/or Gliscor. Strong breakers that can pressure these targets such as Kyurem and Ogerpon are well-appreciated. Garg has strong defensive synergy with Slither, and abuses the hell out of Pecha/Molt while Slither swaps into Earthquakea. G-Weez forces Gliscor to lose health everytime Slither clicks U-Turn. Darkrai punishes Ghosts and the birds. Slither covers Ting-Lu’s weakness to Fighting while Ting-Lu sets Spikes that make its pivoting more potent.
Slow AV Torn (Tornadus-Therian) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
Tera Type: Steel/Water
EVs: 248 HP / 212 SpD / 48 Spe
Timid Nature
- Bleakwind Storm
- Knock Off
- Heat Wave
- U-turn
Set Details
Not the first to use slow Torn. Torn this gen hates offense but can toy with Balance via Taunt + Knock. This set does the opposite where it can defensively check Iron Moth, CM Val, Darkrai, and Ghold but struggles with fat. Outspeeds Lando and Kyurem with this spread.
Partners
This set needs removal. The obvious choices are the beyblade elephants, but G-Weez is not a bad option at all. Other defensive pivots like slowking and mola work well. Kyurem and other breakers are amazing to pair with Torn.
SpD Ttar (Tyranitar) (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Sand Stream
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 252 HP / 24 Def / 232 SpD
Sassy Nature
- Knock Off
- Stealth Rock/Protect
- Ice Beam
- Roar
Set Details
I feel like ppl make the mistake of running Ttar to make Drill work, not realizing Excadrill is hot garbage in this meta. Corv is much more popular now and the tier is littered with Drill checks everywhere. Rather, it should be run as a budget Ting-Lu. Sand chip gets overlooked due to the fast-paced nature of the tier, but as things slow down, that 6% starts meaning more. Sand also has the benefit of forcing Dnite to lose Multiscale. It’s Ting-Lu but with Knock Off and the ability to threaten Gliscor/Lando via Ice Beam. Also has a better matchup into Kyurem off its Ice neutrality. Roar Ttar has good matchups into most of the Boosters running around, and its solid for forcing more chip. Protect is nice tech for racking up Sand chip and healing a little extra from Lefties.
Partners
Quit running bum ahh Excadrill and use Tusk with Ttar instead. Ttar’s role compression lets Tusk drop SR/Knock for spicy options like CC or Bulk Up. Ttar pairs well with breakers like Wellspring who could assert pressure in conjunction with Sand chip. Skarm sets Spikes and checks Waterpon…sort of. Pecha checks physical threats that otherwise pressure Ttar while blocking spin. Mola can pass hefty wishes to Ttar.
Band Weavile (Weavile) (F) @ Choice Band
Ability: Pressure
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Triple Axel/Icicle Crash
- Knock Off
- Ice Shard
- Beat Up
Set Details
Band Weavile is a high risk, high reward mon, cause the amount of damage it does is insane. Tera Ice is nuts, but Tera Dark has some practical merit. Removes its SR weakness, giving it more opportunities to come in, and making Beat Up at 90+ power an OHKO/2HKO machine. Muscling through the likes of Tinkaton, Moltres, and Corviknight without ever making contact.
Partners
Like with Specs Moth, this set needs removal. Tusk, G-Weez, and Corv are the best options, with Corv being able to slow pivot into Weavile. Zapdos baits in targets like Ting-Lu and Slowking-Galar which CB Weavile can abuse. Zama appreciates Weavile’s wallbreaking potential and helps boost the power of Beat Up. Pivots like Glowking, Lando, and Pecha are excellent Weavile partners. You wanna fit this on Balance or BO where Weavile can come in safely and serve as a breaker with speed control.
BU Ceru (Ceruledge) @ Leftovers/Covert Cloak
Ability: Flash Fire
Tera Type: Grass
EVs: 252 HP / 56 Def / 116 SpD / 84 Spe
Careful Nature
- Bulk Up
- Bitter Blade
- Shadow Sneak
- Taunt
Set Details
The classic Pre-Home set has some merit. In preparation for Tera Fairy Moon, teams have resorted to checks like Clefable, Corv, G-Weez, CB Scizor, and Molt. Bulk Up Ceruledge can dog on these structures with its base typing and burn immunity even after Tera. Gouging Fire’s ban opened up room for another Wisp immune wincon to take its place. Defensively, it checks non-Tera Blast Moth, Cinder, and most variants of Valiant for offensive teams. 84 Speed EVs puts it above 0 speed Gliscor which is fine since most of them either invest entirely on HP and SpD, or go max Speed in the case of SD sets. 56 Def lets Ceruledge after a Bulk Up, eat max attack Tusk’s HLR at full and take a huge chunk of its HP with Bitter Blade. Also eats Gambit Sucker at full after 5 SO boosts. Tera Grass flips your matchup with Waterpon and Ground types. You could also go with Covert to set up on Garg and the stupid Mochi Ghost.
Partners
Veil is the best archetype to fit Ceru. With Ceru benefitting from the added bulk from screens and it being a great Dgleam Moth check which otherwise stomps on the archetype. Hatt is self-explanatory. Keeps hazards off.
As mentioned, Ceru beats most of Roaring Moon’s checks and punishes reckless Will-O-Wisp clicking.
Bulky Rai (Darkrai) @ Leftovers/Heavy-Duty-Boots/Red Card
Ability: Bad Dreams
Tera Type: Poison
EVs: 240 HP / 60 Def / 208 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dark Pulse
- Sludge Bomb
- Nasty Plot/Ice Beam
- Will-O-Wisp/Knock Off
Set Details
Darkrai gets so much milage out of bulk investment, to point I’d argue this is the most optimal way to run it. Still hits pretty hard without investment and makes it easier for Dankrai to click Plot, Wisp, or Knock. Since it can tank almost any hit from Dnite at full, it can save you from being snowballed by random Dnite bullshit. I decided to optimize MAVERICK SHOOTERS ’ spread. 208 Speed to outrun Cinderace cause speed ties are for the weak. 240HP/60Def survives Pre-Tera Acrobatics from +1 Moon at full and eats any hit from unboosted Adamant Waterpon. Red Card is nasty tech that can punish Boosters and possibly give Darkrai an opportunity to get off another boost.
Partners
Anything that appreciates Ting-Lu or Zamazenta being crippled by Wisp is gonna appreciate having Dankrai around.
Darkrai fits well into Spike Stacking BO structures as it can not only support them with fast Wisp/Knock, but also enjoys the pressure from Spikes.
Offensive Tank Chomp (Garchomp) @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Rough Skin
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 56 HP / 252 Atk / 200 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Outrage
- Stone Edge
- Spikes/Stealth Rock
Set Details
Shout outs to Kazt_5 for bringing light to this set. As good as the standard Tankchomp set is, it does suffer from passivity. With max Attack and enough speed to creep past Kyurem, Chomp’s role is to set hazards and kamikaze on physical walls like Tusk, Lando. Stone Edge picks off Moltres and Zapdos. Ting-Lu is generally a better Hazard-setting Ground, but the merit of RH + Rough Skin chip can open up several offensive sweepers. Its similar to offensive Lando, but the speed tier and neutrality to Water grants it a better matchup into Waterpon, Samu, or Kyurem leads.
Partners
All of these appreciate chip damage being forced on mons like Tusk or Gambit. Chomp particularly synergizes well with Pecharunt and Gholdengo who also cover its defensive weaknesses such as Fairies. Forcing Helmet chip onto Corv greedily clicking U-Turn, puts it in range of +1 Moon. Gambit also appreciates Chomp’s traits. This set is designed for BO hazard stack similarly to Ting-Lu and Samu.
Heavy Slam Garg (Garganacl) (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Purifying Salt
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 HP / 52 Def / 204 SpD
Careful Nature
- Salt Cure
- Stealth Rock
- Heavy Slam
- Recover
Set Details
Garg is legit phenomenal rn. With Pecha being the more popular Poison-type pivot over Glowking and teams prioritizing Spike Stacking, Garganacl’s ability to easily force progress via Salt Cure + SR is ever more valuable. Players say things like “It struggles vs Spike Stack” but in reality, Tera Water Garg can legit carry the entire matchup by itself since they tend to lack the immediate power to push through Garg. Storm Zone demonstrated this perfectly in his week 9 game with Fusien .
Curse and Iron Defense are life-savers into the two hottest topics of the month, SD Gliscor and Moon. Ice Punch has been experimented with to smack Gliscor and Hydrapple, but I wanna touch on Heavy Slam. This tech is specifically for its biggest counter, Clefable. Dealing over 38% and outstalling Moonlight
Partners
Part of why I feel Garg is better rn is because of G-Weez’s rise in usage. It covers Garg’s three biggest short-comings. Regenerator walls, hazards, and Magic Guard Clef. Ting-Lu is the other fat progress making wall that like Garg, sets hazards and forces chip via Ruination. Pecha and/or Sinistcha blocks rocks, checks Waterpon, and punishes Tusk as it eats Salt Cure chip. Latios appreciates Tera Water Garg’s ability to assert pressure onto Steels like Ghold or Iron Crown.
Specs Ghold (Gholdengo) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Good as Gold
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Shadow Ball
- Make It Rain
- Thunderbolt
- Recover/Trick
Set Details
This is more on the fun side than being optimal, but if you queue into Balance with Specs Ghold, prepare to see numbers. Make It Rain does ludicrous damage, even to resists. Dealing 39% min to Ting-Lu and being able to 2HKO Gambit and phys def Molt with Tera Steel. Tera Steel also has the benefit of flipping its matchup with Gambit, opposing Ghosts, Rai, and Knock Valiant. Tbolt is so you don’t dud to Tera Water Garg and gives you an option to nuke Moltres without burning Tera. You could run any fourth move on Ghold, like Trick for Stall.
Partners
Since Specs Ghold is mainly to break, its defensive utility for Zama is worse. So you need to circumvent this with another Zama check. Fortunately, Zapdos and Molt perfectly fit this bill *hehe get it, cause bird*
Both of them can also pivot and bring in Ghold. G-Weez is another option, tho more of a momentum drain than the birds.
Specs Ghold prefers to be on structures with 2-3 pivots that can safely bring it in. Lando and Lokix are great choices that can bait in Corviknight for Ghold. The former being a solid soft check to Zama and Moon, while the latter appreciates Ghold’s balance breaking potential. On the slower side, Corv and Mola cover Specs Ghold’s defensive shortcomings vs Tusk and Dnite.
Bulky AV Crown (Iron Crown) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Quark Drive
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 100 SpA / 176 SpD / 232 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 20 Atk
- Tachyon Cutter
- Future Sight
- Psyshock
- Volt Switch
Set Details
The popularity of Moon and Ting-Lu really devestated Iron Crown. Specs variants can break past Ting-Lu with a couple Tachyons or a Focus Blast, but loses its defensive utility. AV achieves this, but can miss out on crucial KOs, and Calm Mind variants are inconsistent in Ting-Lu country. Instead of trying to make Crown muscle past its bad matchups, I’d rather focus on improving its already good matchups. This spread still creeps past Kyurem, but avoids a 3HKO from Prima after SR and even dodges a 2HKO from unboosted defensive Ghold. In general it tanks special hits more easily.
Partners
Anything that has strong offensive synergy with Future Sight and can abuse Ting-Lu are strong partners. Prime Pult is really good at forcing chip with Banded U-Turns. Spike support makes Volt Switch more potent and Tusk removes the hazards that would wear Crown down while having defensive synergy
Specs Moth (Iron Moth) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Quark Drive
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Fiery Dance
- Sludge Wave
- Overheat
- U-turn
Set Details
Another “this is fun but not optimal” set. Specs Overheat can catch Balance teams off-guard as their Ting-Lu takes over 40%. The real kicker of this set is U-Turn which lets it pivot around bad matchups like Garg, AV Mola, or Tera Water Glowking.
Partners
Specs Moth wants to be paired with as much hazard control as reasonably possible. Hatt and Tusk are the best choices. Hatt puts pressure on Moth’s checks with Nuzzle while Tusk has good offensive synergy with Moth. My favorite pairing is other offensive pivots like AV Flip Turn Samu, who asserts immense pressure onto Slowking, and sets Spikes. Ghold appreciates Moth’s ability to overwhelm special walls. You also wanna pair it with stuff that can handle Roaring Moon, since Moth gives Moon a very easy opportunity to set up. None of them are consistent cuz Moon is broken, but Corv, Dnite, and the kanto birds are your best bet.
Bulky Treads (Iron Treads) @ Leftovers
Ability: Quark Drive
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 248 HP / 28 Atk / 128 SpD / 104 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Iron Head/Ice Spinner/Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Knock Off/Iron Head/Ice Spinner/Volt Switch
- Rapid Spin
Set Details
You sometimes see Treads as the spinner of choice on Balances over Tusk for a reason. Its Steel typing means it has a better MU into Ghold and Pecha, the two biggest spinblockers in the tier. It also means Treads can tank Dragon Pulses from Raging Bolt and check it more consistently. You could try out Iron Head for a more consistent matchup into Fairies like Clefable and Bolt who loves to run Tera Fairy. 28 Attack EVs lets it 2HKO defensive Gholdengo always while outspeeding Tusk at 301 speed. Some would say to invest in more speed for Pecha, but I find it better to under speed it, since they often love pressing Parting Shot. So you can click Spin in front of Pecha as they pivot out since ppl play like bots with Pecharunt, and watch them react flabbergasted by losing all three layers of Spikes in an instant.
Partners
Anything that hates Ghold/Bolt or hazards really appreciates having Treads around. Garganacl in particular can run SR, freeing up a slot for Treads and vice versa.
Strength Sap Polt (Polteageist) @ White Herb
Ability: Cursed Body
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 188 HP / 180 SpA / 140 Spe
Modest Nature
- Shell Smash
- Shadow Ball
- Tera Blast
- Strength Sap
Set Details
Whatever mad man/woman/non-binary dude came up with this set in UU, is filled with regret for the damage they have caused. This set is also demonic in OU too, but it’s also not very consistent lol. Strength Sap and Cursed Body cheeses games in an instant. This spread outpaces Dragapult at +2 while dumping the rest into HP and SpA.
Partners
I can only see this thing fitting on Veil. You wanna pair it with mons that can assert pressure onto bulky Dark types like Ting-Lu. Moon, Samu, NP D-Gleam Ghold, and Bolt are all good at forcing chip dmg. Tusk too while spinning hazards off. Hatterene can Nuzzle Gambit on the switch, making end games vs it more doable for Polt.
Standard Slither (Slither Wing) @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Dragon
EVs: 252 HP / 48 Atk / 124 Def / 84 Spe
Impish Nature
- First Impression
- U-turn
- Morning Sun
- Will-O-Wisp/Stun Spore
Set Details
An underrated defensive pivot with great matchups against the three best mons in the tier rn, Zama/Ting/Tusk. Good matchups into several other staples such as Samurott, Gambit, non-Tera Blast/Tera Fire Dnite, Knock/EQ Moon, Darkrai, etc. Also provides priority via First Impression which with 48 Attack EVs, guarantees a one-shot on Waterpon assuming it doesn’t Tera. Alternatively you could run Stun Spore over Wisp to cripple Pecha and Molt who’d otherwise wouldn’t care about Wisp. Helmet is cool tech that punishes U-Turns and can prevent Samu from getting up Spikes in the lead MU. Tera Dragon gives you an out vs Waterpon in case it Terastilizes.
Partners
Slither struggles with fat teams rocking the birds and/or Gliscor. Strong breakers that can pressure these targets such as Kyurem and Ogerpon are well-appreciated. Garg has strong defensive synergy with Slither, and abuses the hell out of Pecha/Molt while Slither swaps into Earthquakea. G-Weez forces Gliscor to lose health everytime Slither clicks U-Turn. Darkrai punishes Ghosts and the birds. Slither covers Ting-Lu’s weakness to Fighting while Ting-Lu sets Spikes that make its pivoting more potent.
Slow AV Torn (Tornadus-Therian) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
Tera Type: Steel/Water
EVs: 248 HP / 212 SpD / 48 Spe
Timid Nature
- Bleakwind Storm
- Knock Off
- Heat Wave
- U-turn
Set Details
Not the first to use slow Torn. Torn this gen hates offense but can toy with Balance via Taunt + Knock. This set does the opposite where it can defensively check Iron Moth, CM Val, Darkrai, and Ghold but struggles with fat. Outspeeds Lando and Kyurem with this spread.
Partners
This set needs removal. The obvious choices are the beyblade elephants, but G-Weez is not a bad option at all. Other defensive pivots like slowking and mola work well. Kyurem and other breakers are amazing to pair with Torn.
SpD Ttar (Tyranitar) (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Sand Stream
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 252 HP / 24 Def / 232 SpD
Sassy Nature
- Knock Off
- Stealth Rock/Protect
- Ice Beam
- Roar
Set Details
I feel like ppl make the mistake of running Ttar to make Drill work, not realizing Excadrill is hot garbage in this meta. Corv is much more popular now and the tier is littered with Drill checks everywhere. Rather, it should be run as a budget Ting-Lu. Sand chip gets overlooked due to the fast-paced nature of the tier, but as things slow down, that 6% starts meaning more. Sand also has the benefit of forcing Dnite to lose Multiscale. It’s Ting-Lu but with Knock Off and the ability to threaten Gliscor/Lando via Ice Beam. Also has a better matchup into Kyurem off its Ice neutrality. Roar Ttar has good matchups into most of the Boosters running around, and its solid for forcing more chip. Protect is nice tech for racking up Sand chip and healing a little extra from Lefties.
Partners
Quit running bum ahh Excadrill and use Tusk with Ttar instead. Ttar’s role compression lets Tusk drop SR/Knock for spicy options like CC or Bulk Up. Ttar pairs well with breakers like Wellspring who could assert pressure in conjunction with Sand chip. Skarm sets Spikes and checks Waterpon…sort of. Pecha checks physical threats that otherwise pressure Ttar while blocking spin. Mola can pass hefty wishes to Ttar.
Band Weavile (Weavile) (F) @ Choice Band
Ability: Pressure
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Triple Axel/Icicle Crash
- Knock Off
- Ice Shard
- Beat Up
Set Details
Band Weavile is a high risk, high reward mon, cause the amount of damage it does is insane. Tera Ice is nuts, but Tera Dark has some practical merit. Removes its SR weakness, giving it more opportunities to come in, and making Beat Up at 90+ power an OHKO/2HKO machine. Muscling through the likes of Tinkaton, Moltres, and Corviknight without ever making contact.
Partners
Like with Specs Moth, this set needs removal. Tusk, G-Weez, and Corv are the best options, with Corv being able to slow pivot into Weavile. Zapdos baits in targets like Ting-Lu and Slowking-Galar which CB Weavile can abuse. Zama appreciates Weavile’s wallbreaking potential and helps boost the power of Beat Up. Pivots like Glowking, Lando, and Pecha are excellent Weavile partners. You wanna fit this on Balance or BO where Weavile can come in safely and serve as a breaker with speed control.
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Wanted to say, great ideas for all of these mons, and I love the innovation. However, as someone who has used a lot of sap poltea, it really appreciates the evs in defense over spa to let it really leverage the value of sap. It loses a little power for sure, but it’s still far from weak. And this is arguable bc it can’t hit darks as well, but fairy polt with stored is something I’ve had a lot of success with to mitigate said power lossView attachment 724560
Strength Sap Polt (Polteageist) @ White Herb
Ability: Cursed Body
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 188 HP / 180 SpA / 140 Spe
Modest Nature
- Shell Smash
- Shadow Ball
- Tera Blast
- Strength Sap
Set Details
Whatever mad man/woman/non-binary dude came up with this set in UU, is filled with regret for the damage they have caused. This set is also demonic in OU too, but it’s also not very consistent lol. Strength Sap and Cursed Body cheeses games in an instant. This spread outpaces Dragapult at +2 while dumping the rest into HP and SpA.
Partners
I can only see this thing fitting on Veil. You wanna pair it with mons that can assert pressure onto bulky Dark types like Ting-Lu. Moon, Samu, NP D-Gleam Ghold, and Bolt are all good at forcing chip dmg. Tusk too while spinning hazards off. Hatterene can Nuzzle Gambit on the switch, making end games vs it more doable for Polt
Update on the Gardevoir team!
It's bad, actually. I tried laddering reqs with it and I went 27-17. Wish me luck, I built a webs and in testing it seems viable. I have a saved 8-0 alt that I can come back to if the team is good.
It's bad, actually. I tried laddering reqs with it and I went 27-17. Wish me luck, I built a webs and in testing it seems viable. I have a saved 8-0 alt that I can come back to if the team is good.
Thank you for investing in Tyranitar stocks! My goat is not washed!! I'm currently #25 rn with bulky Tyranitar BO! Protect is the crux of the set and lets you abuse the sand chip to the fullest while keeping you topped off. Rocky Helmet Great Tusk is an amazing partner and lets you stack unholy amounts of passive damage against your opponents. Tusk appreciates the freed move slot since Ttar handles Stealth Rock duties. As long as your other 4 can handle the Wogerpon matchup, this pairing is solid.
Tyranitar matches up incredibly well with all the weather offenses running around the mid-high ladder, special Kyurem, and the like. It's great at forcing progress while still being able to annoy most defensive Pokemon, who don't appreciate Knock Off and/or sand chip cutting into them. Investing a bit more (248 HP / 12 Def / 248 SpD) means you survive Life Orb Darkrai Focus Blast and cushions well against Boots/Expert Belt variants, which are running amok right now for some reason.
https://pokepast.es/e09643efd1c6160d
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Roaring moon didn’t earn its place, Salamence did
And now, Roaring moon must earn its place or be cast aside for good, its time for us to fight the night.
Salamence @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Moxie
Tera Type: Ground/Dark
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Earthquake/Crunch
- Dual Wingbeat
- Roost/Crunch
What sets the menace apart from his uncle is his access to moxie (which allows for snowballing if you play right) and a typing that fits better on dragon steel fairy cores, though moxie is the only ability recommended as otherwise its outclassed by dragonite with extreme speed since intimidate is mid for a sweeper and this mon’s whole thing is moxie
Iron Crown @ Leftovers
Ability: Quark Drive
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 20 Atk
- Substitute
- Calm Mind
- Psyshock
- Tachyon Cutter
Iron Crown (I know what you’re thinking, don’t mention it this time) is a good partner to salamence since their typings do compliment each other particularly well, i chose this particular set because its something I made rather than the usual booster cm, with the extra bulk strengthening the core.
hey! pretty new to understanding how specific ev’s affect on certain mons. i’ve seen ur zama w that specific spread multiple times over and always wondered why the extra bulk over utilizing its extreme speed stat to the fullest. i suppose i have the same question about the 60 speed on kg but i assume that’s to out speed certain mons (albeit i can’t think of them cause it’s something i never really considered)
Usually you can work backwards from the Speed stat to figure out what a specific spread is trying to do, because Speed is such an absolute stat (don't have to account for stuff like damage ranges). Zamazenta has a Speed stat of 389 with the posted spread, which lets it outspeed base 80 neutral nature Choice Scarf users (or something with a +1 boost). I assume from other current discussions that there aren't other relevant targets with, say, a Speed stat of 130 that Zamazenta would need to outspeed, so may as well just get to a specific benchmark and put the rest in survivability
I don't play the ladder so I can't tell you which Pokémon this lets Zama get a leg up on, but it should at least give you an idea of what to look for (and how to evaluate other Speed investment EVs).
I believe it is 1 point above adamant dnite after a dragon dance boost. If this isn't a concern, 384 is a good number to hit since it puts you one point above darkrai and weavile, 2 mons zama is commonly tasked with handling. Other than other zama, max speed on zama tends to not be a huge deal since there is really nothing in between 383 and dragapult at 421.
I have played older gen ladders; I forgot if Dragonite had 80 or 81 base speed (since it needs that extra 1 stat somewhere to give it that nice 600 BST. It turns out I was thinking of Gyarados when considering DDers with base 81 speed!