SwSh Battle Facilities Discussion & Records

[justintr]

Hey all. Don't really have much to report but I've been having fun with this rain team I put together really quickly. I managed to hit 100 wins with it over the past few days. I don't have a way to record my battles just yet, considering changing that in the near future. I've also been using Dynamax for this team as well when needed. Anyway, let's begin...

Rillaboom Rain

Pelipper @ Focus Sash
Ability: Drizzle
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
IVs: 31/xx/31/31/31/31
Modest Nature
- Hurricane
- Brine
- Tailwind
- Protect

Pelipper is pretty self-explanatory. It sets rain, provides speed control with Tailwind, can sometimes nuke stuff with Hurricane, and finish things off with Brine. Not much to really say about this guy except that he's still a pretty damn good rain setter.

Rillaboom @ Assault Vest
Ability: Overgrow
Level: 50
EVs: 44 HP / 196 Atk / 4 Def / 12 SpD / 252 Spe
IVs: 31/31/31/xx/31/31
Adamant Nature
- Fake Out
- Drum Beating
- Knock Off
- U-turn

First off, I LOVE Rillaboom and its signature move Drum Beating. With Speed updating mid-turn, this gal can help Pelipper do whatever most of the time. It also does a considerable amount of damage, which is nice. Of course, Fake Out also helps immensely too. The EVs are very un-optimized and could definitely be better. I just quickly put this together and dove right into the Tower. Knock Off is excellent for removing problematic items such as Quick Claw and Bright Powder. U-turn is great for pivoting. I think this set will be a lot better when Grassy Surge is available, but Overgrow works for now.

Dracovish @ Mystic Water
Ability: Strong Jaw
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
IVs: HT/HT/HT/31/31/31
Bashful Nature (minted to Jolly)
- Fishious Rend
- Psychic Fangs
- Low Kick
- Protect

In case you weren't aware, Dracovish is our lord and savior and demands to be respected. Fishious Rend+Strong Jaw+rain OHKOs nearly everything in the Battle Tower. It's so ridiculous, that Mystic Water is obviously overkill at this point. But I didn't want to give the 'vish a Choice Band or Scarf, and couldn't really figure out a better item so I decided to roll with this. Psychic Fangs and Low Kick are mainly there for coverage but c'mon, why click them when Fishious Rend exists? The best part is, this guy's shiny too. I love this freak of nature.

Manectric @ Choice Specs
Ability: Lightning Rod
Level: 50
EVs: 36 HP / 220 SpA / 252 Spe
IVs: 31/xx/31/31/31/31
Timid Nature
- Thunder
- Volt Switch
- Flamethrower
- Snarl

Since Tapu Koko is no longer available, I needed to find another Electric-type to abuse Thunder stuff. I originally planned on Raichu leading with Pelipper, but I didn't really like the way it looked, so I searched some more. Boltund currently doesn't have access to Competitive, and its coverage is kinda subpar so he was out too. Then, I remembered Manectric. There is no more Mega Manectric, but the vanilla form was still kinda okay? He also has Lightning Rod so he can be used a switch-in for Electric-type attacks directed at Pelipper. Volt Switch is used for pivoting while Snarl is just there for filler. Flamethrower is mainly there for Ferrothorn when rain is expired and I'm free to use it. By the way, Dynamaxing breaking the Choice lock is, uh, very broken.

And uh, that's all I have for now. Hoping to climb higher and higher with the team. See ya.

This team ended up losing at 256 wins about three weeks ago. Didn't really get around to talking about it because the loss was kinda embarrassing. I wrote up the turns on a notepad and have had it sitting on my computer for a while. I've since started a new streak with a new team that I'll post about the team loss blurb.

Loss

vs Cafe Master Rister [Frosmoth-4 / Glaceon-24 / Vanilluxe-4 / ????
turn 1 - Rister leads with Frosmoth and Glaceon. I have Rillaboom use Fake Out on the Glaceon as Frosmoth can roll Shield Dust preventing the flinch from Fake Out. Frosmoth uses Quiver Dance, revealing set 4. Pelipper uses Tailwind.
turn 2 - Rillaboom and Pelipper are able to take out Frosmoth with Knock Off and Hurricane, while Glaceon uses Freeze-Dry on Pelipper (brings it down to Focus Sash).
turn 3 - Rister sends out Vanilluxe, with Snow Warning. I switch out Pelipper for Manectric. Vanilluxe and Glaceon are able to take down Manectric with Ice Shard and Freeze-Dry. Rillaboom uses Drum Beating on Glaceon, does ~40%.
turn 4 - I send Pelipper back out. Vanilluxe finishes off Pelipper with Ice Shard, while Glaceon hits Rillaboom with Freeze-Dry, which does 75%. Rillaboom uses Earthquake, fails to KO either Pokemon. For this turn, it was probably better to send in Dracovish instead and Dynamax Rillaboom. In fact, I should have Dynamaxed Rillaboom regardless I think.
turn 5 - Dracovish sent out. I did not calc Ice Shard's damage on Rillaboom, but I guess she was in range as Vanilluxe uses that to KO Rillaboom. I planned on using Drum Beating to finish off Glaceon, but alas that did not work out. Finally, Dracovish KOs Vanilluxe with Fishious Rend and Glaceon finishes the battle with another Freeze-Dry.

This loss mainly came due to how stubborn I was. I don't know why I didn't dynamax this battle, I did allow it for this streak. Oh well. It was fun while it lasted.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Anyway, new team! This team is currently sitting at 200 wins and it uses the wonderful Alolan Ninetales~! This team does not Dynamax.

Aurora Veil in Galar

Ninetales-Alola @ Focus Sash
Ability: Snow Warning
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
IVs: 31/xx/31/31/31/31
Timid Nature
- Freeze-Dry
- Blizzard
- Aurora Veil
- Protect

This is honestly kind of a boring set. Not really much to say except that with Snow Warning, Ninetales can set up Aurora Veil, making the team pretty damn bulky. Especially vs pshycial stuff thanks to Incineroar's Intimidate. Blizzard does ok damage to a lot of stuff and getting random freezes on opponents is hilarious. Freeze-Dry helps deal with Water-types.

Incineroar @ Assault Vest
Ability: Intimidate
Level: 50
EVs: 156 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def / 92 SpD / 4 Spe
IVs: 31/31/31/xx/31/31
Adamant Nature
- Fake Out
- Flare Blitz
- Knock Off
- U-turn

First, I wanna say I don't really remember where I got this spread from. I imported this Incineroar from Ultra Moon and it had an Assault Vest there, so I figured it could work here as well. I probably got it from some random Battle Tree team. Anyway, Incineroar is still pretty damn good. With Fake Out, Incineroar can help Ninetales set up Veil if needed, and can take a decent number of hits before going down. Yeah, Flare Blitz recoil+hail doesn't sound like a very good idea, but it does the job. Knock Off is really nice for getting rid of problematic stuff like Bright Powder, Quick Claw, Choice Scarf, etc. U-turn is also very good for slow switches. Love this guy.

Dracovish @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Strong Jaw
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
IVs: HT/HT/HT/31/31/31
Bashful Nature (minted to Jolly)
- Fishious Rend
- Psychic Fangs
- Crunch
- Low Kick

This is the exact same Dracovish from the rain squad, except this time it's sporting a Choice Scarf. With the Scarf, I believe it out-speeds everything in the Tower except for Cinderace-15 and Dragapult-24. Fishious Rend is still very strong even without the Mystic Water+rain boost and is pretty much used to clean up. The other moves are mostly there for coverage (have only used Psychic Fangs a handful of times to get of screens or for dealing with Gastrodon).

Jirachi @ Expert Belt
Ability: Serene Grace
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
IVs: HT/31/HT/xx/31/31
Careful Nature (minted to Jolly)
- Iron Head
- Thunder Punch
- Ice Punch
- Protect

And finally, we have Jirachi. I've been waiting to use this little guy ever since it was found out the Tower had no actual banlist. I LOVE Jirachi. It kinda lacks in power, but being able to flinch stuff with Serene Grace Iron Head is nice. Thunder and Ice Punch are used for coverage and they do acceptable damage. I put an Expert Belt on Jirachi because I couldn't really think of a better item to put on it. I'm willing to take suggestions though.

And we're done. Until next time, see ya.

 

[Worldie]

I couldn't really think of a better item to put on it. I'm willing to take suggestions though.

Honestly considering that you're going to use more often than not iron head, might as well go for Life Orb so you get the power boost even on neutral hits. Jirachi tends to tank hits well anyway so it's not like you're really reducing its durability much.
Personally I love scarf Jirachi but you have it on Vish so...

 

[Coeur7]

-

 

[phoenix0wright]

Hi! I got a team that hit 50 wins in singles, so I thought I'd post it. I wanted to use a special attacking core, and settled on Gengar and Hydreigon since they can switch into eachother's weaknesses pretty well. Primarina was mostly for fun, but she handles some pokemon that both of her teammates struggle with thanks to her Fairy typing. I did use Dynamax a few times so this is an Ubers run, but I plan on trying without Dynamax moving forward.

Gengar (Mr.Spook) @ Focus Sash
Cursed Body
Timid Nature, 252 SpA/4 SpD/252 Spe
Shadow Ball
Destiny Bond
Sludge Bomb
Energy Ball

Gengar seems to be a great lead for Battle Tower, and I've used some iteration of this set since Gen 6. Dexit really made its Base 110 speed (which was starting to show its age) shine again, and there's actually very little in the tower that can straight up outspeed it now. Ghost typing is obviously really strong this generation, and between Shadow Ball and Sludge Bomb you're hitting a good chunk of the tower mons super effectively, which usually means a KO. I use Sludge Bomb over Sludge Wave for the higher poison chance; there's a lot of Sash mons in the tower and the extra chance to break through that with residual damage is worth the marginal loss in power. The real star of the show is Destiny Bond, which lets Gengar take out at least two mons in 90% of matches. Very little can survive two hits from Gengar, which lets you 2HKO the first pokemon and then DB on the second if you can't OHKO it. I run Energy Ball over more conventional options like Focus Blast because I highly prefer the reliability, and there's enough that's weak to grass to make the coverage worthwhile. The other two members handle a lot of Focus Blast's would-be targets anyways.

Hydreigon (Alternis) @ Life Orb
Levitate
Timid Nature, 252 SpA/4 SpD/252 Spe
Dark Pulse
Draco Meteor/Dragon Pulse
U-Turn
Flamethrower

Hydreigon is the secondary sweeper on the team. Most of the coverage options are pretty standard. Most of they time you're spamming Dark Pulse, but the Dragon coverage is sometimes useful as well. I originally ran Draco Meteor as the main dragon STAB, but I ended up switching to Dragon Pulse as I became more concerned about missing. One big weakness of the team is that the third member is really only situationally good; I couldn't rely on Primarina to sweep so I couldn't afford to miss with Hydreigon or Gengar. U-Turn is mostly a vestige from the Draco Meteor days, so I could switch out and reset my Special Attack; I'll probably replace it with Flash Cannon. Finally, Flamethrower is useful coverage for stuff like Steels but I rarely used it. Hydreigon really seems to benefit from the suboptimal EVs (and IVs?) of this version of the battle tower since it outsped a lot of things that it really shouldn't have.

Primarina (Missy) @ Throat Spray
Liquid Voice
Modest Nature, 40 HP/252 SpA/216 Spe
Hyper Voice
Moonblast
Ice Beam
Perish Song

Primarina is interesting. Her main job is to handle Dark types - particularly Weavile, who absolutely dumps over the other two members. That being said, she also proved useful in other contexts. For instance, she can OHKO Leon's Charizard while it's Gigantimaxed, and the EVs let it survive the Max Overgrowth it'll take in return comfortably. Hyper Voice is the main STAB, and allows for setup. Moonblast is the secondary STAB, and lets Primarina OHKO the Dark types that it's here for. Ice Beam is generally solid coverage, and Primarina doesn't have a whole lot of other options. Perish Song is mostly filler, but it did get me out of a few jams against super defensive pokemon. This set is definitely suboptimal for tower; for instance, if you want to Dynamax Primarina, you don't have a Water STAB (I personally never bothered, but it's worth noting). Primarina is also super slow, and isn't bulky enough to really make up for it. If you're looking to adopt the core, I would use a different fairy type for sure in the future.

Overall, the biggest strength of this team is consistency. Gengar is extremely good at its job as lead, and the immunities of Hydregion allow for free switches against many of the handful of pokemon that give it trouble. Primarina usually wasn't needed, but filled a niche and could handle the few pokemon it was there for.

In terms of weaknesses, there are a few specific pokemon that can be issues depending on context (e.g. Dragapult). Special sponges obviously were a nightmare. Perish Song ameliorates that, but if Gengar can't 2HKO the opposing lead it really puts me on the back foot. Opposing ghost type leads can also be difficult if they were faster or carried Shadow Sneak (mainly Aegislash), since that forced me to lean heavily on Hydreigon. Finally, Primarina is unreliable outside the few contexts she's there for, meaning some games it feels like you're playing 2v3. But overall, this team is more than capable of tower success (especially because this Gen's tower is so easy...)

 

[phoenix0wright]

Sorry for the double post, but I doubt anyone will mind seeing as it's been over two weeks at this point. I'm here to post a doubles team that reached 286 wins in a row before losing. I went in with the intention of making the worst hail team to reach 50 wins, but it never really got around to losing until today. There were a lot of instances where it seemed the AI could have killed me, but then did something inane like attack the wrong mon or use a set up move with 1 HP and hail up. I also won a lot because of the terrible IVs and EV spreads in tower, meaning my team could outspeed almost everything. The leading duo was Vanilluxe and Frosslass, with uh... Glaceon and Rapidash-K in the back.

The Team

Vanilluxe @ Nevermelt Ice
Snow Warning
Modest Nature, 252 SpA/4 SpD/252 Spe
Blizzard
Freeze Dry
Flash Cannon
Automotize

A fairly standard Vanilluxe; you're spamming Blizzard 99% of the time, and Vanilluxe is surprisingly strong. 79 base speed also goes a long way; way more effective than it has any right to be in the tower. Freeze Dry and Flash Cannon are coverage for Waters and Ice/Steels respectively but I rarely used them. Blizzard is so strong that you usually want to use it unless the opponent both resists ice AND is weak to the other move. Automotize is mostly filler, but had use if Vanilluxe's faster teammates would double KO before it went, so its turn wasn't wasted. Ice Shard would probably be better but I didn't really feel like breeding it onto him. I almost never dynamaxed him; too slow and the appeal was spread Blizzard.

Frosslass @ Focus Sash
Cursed Body
Timid Nature, 252 SpA/4 SpD/252 Spe
Blizzard
Shadow Ball
Aurora Veil
Protect

Frosslass is my speedy veil setter, and is probably the closest thing to a good pokemon on the team. 110 Base Speed gets you past basically everything in the tower, and sash ensures you live to set veil. Immunity to Fake Out is also obviously a boon here. The other moves are fairly standard STABs then protect. Even though veil is a big help for a team this frail, oftentimes it was better to fire of dual blizzards with Vanilluxe, which tandem KOed a good chunk of the time. However, Frosslass is also pretty weak so it rarely got KOs on its own, especially because the AI likes to randomly invest in Special Defense on everything. The only time I wold D-max Frosslass is to re-set hail quickly if Vanilluxe died and something changed the weather.

Glaceon @ Choice Scarf
Snow Veil
Modest Nature, 252 SpA/4 SpD/252 Spe
Blizzard
Freeze Dry
Shadow Ball
Toxic

Poor Glaceon has no good moves, but luckily it's strong enough that Blizzard usually gets you through everything. Freeze Dry hits waters and can deal damage without hail consistently. The other moves are pure filler. With scarf, you outspeed base 105s, which in tower speak is essentially everything. Dynamax breaks scarf to switch moves if I have to, but usually I could save Glaceon until my opponent lost two pokemon, so I could pick an optimal move without any doubts about the opposing team.

Rapidash-K @ Life Orb
Flash Fire
Jolly Nature, 252 SpA/4 Def/252 Spe
Flare Blitz
Wild Charge
High Horsepower
Low

Rapidash is obviously garbage, but it covers a myriad of weaknesses suffered by an otherwise pure Ice team... except Rock, but let's ignore that one. The goal was to make a bad team anyways. If I D-Maxed, Rapidash was almost always the user. It doubles HP, thereby kind of patching your trash tier bulk, reduces relative Life Orb recoil, and removes recoil from its strongest attacks entirely. In short, D-Max solves most of Rapidash's problems. The only thing that was awkward about this mon was that Max Flare removes my own hail, so I had to be sure I didn't need it anymore or switch to the less impressive Freeze Dry. Again, Base 105 speed is plenty for most situations in the tower. Another thing to note is that Rapidash kills Leon's Charizard with Max Lightning most of the time (100% with literally any chip), which was actually relevant given how weak this team is to it otherwise.

How I Lost

I ended up losing almost entirely to a Weavile. The opponent opened with the Mr. Rime-3 and Flareon-2, which was obviously a bad matchup for me initially. I opted to Shadow Ball instead of screens as Vanilluxe took the Fake Out and Flareon set up sun. I basically lost next turn, by autopiloting to D-Maxing Frosslass to reset hail instead of switching out Vanilluxe to sac Glaceon. I definitely should have saved D Max for Rapidash. I did get hail back up and killed Rime with Frosslass, but Vanilluxe did basically nothing to Flareon with Blizzard and Frosslass got chipped a good amount by Weather Ball. They send out Weavile (3? I'm not sure). Weavile is actually a little scary for this team, since the only mon who outspeeds is Froslass (who can't do anything back). Frosslass actually does a ton of damage to Flareon with Max Phantasm, but it hangs on as Weavile Throat Chops to KO Frosslass and Flareon gets to re-set sun. Vanilluxe doesn't kill Weavile with Flash Cannon. From there, it was basically Vanilluxe, Rapidash and Glaceon getting their shit beat in by subobtimal AI play, but Weavile crit twice to OHKO both Rapidash and Vanilluxe. His last mon was a Fake Out Delibird, which may have mattered if Glaceon could KO Weavile with Freeze Dry, but I guess we'll never know.

Thoughts on Tower

Honestly, if anything this indicates to me we may want to reassess the rules we use going forward. This team was utter dogshit, and still hit over 280 wins. I'm a longtime lurker but I don't post a lot (my streak got stopped at 88 twice in Tree), but it'd be a shame to see the Battle Tower thread for this gen die completely. For one, I think we should potentially rethink allowing box legend teams to be on the leaderboard. I don't see a scenario where you can reasonably lose with Zacian or Reshiram or whatever. At the very least, I'd suggest bumping up the streak threshold to at least 100 for the Ubers list. I enjoyed making a trash team like this, and think there's still fun to be had, but we might need adjust our approach.

EDIT: Fixed the loss story, some stuff was out of order.

 

[littlechandler]

Long time lurker here, here's the No Dynamax team I've been running, of which I have a 196 active streak:

Dracovish @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Strong Jaw
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Fishious Rend
- Psychic Fangs
- Crunch
- Outrage

Aegislash @ Muscle Band
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Iron Head
- King's Shield
- Shadow Sneak
- Sacred Sword

Rotom-Mow @ Leftovers
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Modest Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Will-O-Wisp
- Hex
- Leaf Storm

Idea is pretty simple: spam Fishious Rend whenever possible, including against some Pokes that resist but that I can 2HKO and that can't OHKO me back.
Aegislash is to provide priority (I lost a previous streak with this concept due to Sash + Swords Dance + Unburden Hawlucha), be a dragon resist, and take out fairies that I can't OHKO with Dracovish. I haven't tried Life Orb, but some of the more stally teams I've played against I've appreciated not taking self-inflicted chip damage, whereas Muscle Band over lefties allows for some Iron Head + Shadow Sneak kills. I originally was running Metal Coat, but I want to decrease bad matchups as much as possible, and Muscle Band is more general.
Rotom's original idea was to takes out water/grounds, but it also serves as my main answer to DD Gyarados (who I probably could sometimes beat with Aegi but it would be risky), to reduce damage from chip damage sources such as Leech Seed + Protect, and as a special attacker in case Curse users get out of hand. I originally ran Volt Switch but realized that generally if I want to do electric damage I probably want to stay in anyways. Not sure if the EVs are optimized but I appreciate both the immediate bulk and attacking power.

Against Leon only Dracovish can beat Charizard, so I need to preserve it. However the only common Pokemon of Leon that Dracovish can't beat is Rillaboom, which both Aegi and Rotom can deal with. I also switch out against Haxorus since I don't want to be locked into Outrage when Charizard shows up. Also, that Aegi and Rotom are both weak to fire means that if Leon sends out Charizard against them Charizard will reliably use G-Max Wildfire. This means which 1. can allow me to get Dracovish an easy switch in (although I can generally just sack a Poke to get Dracovish in as well) 2. More importantly Charizard doesn't use Max Airstream to get a speed boost.

Threats
- Ditto w/ Imposter: iirc once of them is scarfed (which sets up 50/50 against Dracovish if I stay in), whereas one is Lum Berry (which makes switching out to Aegislash risky as Fishious Rend still does a ton of damage even at -1 Atk).
- Dragapult (special sets only): The physical ones I can deal with via Aegislash spamming King's Shield until they run out of Sucker Punch PP.
- Eiscue: running an Adamant nature means Eiscue can outspeed once I break its Ice Face, and my only special attacker/statuser in Rotom is weak to ice.
- Ferrothorn w/ Toxic + Leech Seed + Protect
- Ninjask w/ Focus Sash, Swords Dance: I don't know if I should switch out to save Dracovish and kill with priority, or if it is the set with Baton Pass and I should stay in and attack.
- Rillaboom w/ Swords Dance: I generally switch out against Rillaboom (although maybe I shouldn't), which makes Swords Dance scary. Also Rillaboom-6 isn't a guaranteed 2HKO with Dracovish after lefties recovery.
- Rotom-Mow: I can 2HKO with Dracovish, but not without taking substantial damage or getting burned.
- Seismitoad w/ Sludge Wave: I can generally get a free switch in for Rotom as Seismitoad uses a ground move, but I am really reliant on Leaf Storm not missing (which it hasn't yet).
- Any fire type if Dracovish dies.
- Setup sweepers if Aegislash is out. Needing to King's Shield to avoid getting OHKO'd can create risk of getting set up on.
- Not sure if it exists, but a team with a Pokemon that forces me to use Outrage, followed by a fairy with a fire-type attack would be really difficult for me to beat.


This is by far my longest streak ever (my previous best in any format was 115 in Gen 6 doubles, and my previous best in singles was 102 in Gen 6 singles), and I'm losing a bit of endurance to continue this full time. I've begun multitasking while continuing the streak, so we'll see if that proves fatal and cause me to lose soon.

 

[Josh C.]

Hey, I'm reporting an ongoing Dynamax streak of 501 wins in Doubles - comprising a team of Raichu/Gyarados/Grimmsnarl/Aegislash.


I say this streak is ongoing but now I've secured a milestone I'm satisfied with, the temptation to halt it indefinitely and move on to other things is pretty high. Cause man, piloting this team got boring quick, haha; even typing now, reflecting on the streak, it was the most mundane road to 500 experience I've had in a Battle Facility by far.


Mundane is also a fitting word to describe my early impression of this gen's Facility - set variety's sufficient but that only accounts for so much when the features of the Tower (aka lack thereof) fail to keep me engaged for extended periods of time. The fact SwSh merely keeps a tally of total wins, and presents no real punishment for losing, has sapped much of my desire to compete; I feel like the satisfaction in crafting a team to combat everything the AI can throw its way, while learning from mistakes, rebuilding it into something better, witnessing it pay off in - y'know, a format where the game tracks losses and resets the streak for you! - has largely been lost. I won't speak for everyone, but I'm sure some of you feel the same.


Given the lack of proper rulesets that we’re used to the games providing us with, self-imposed restrictions are the name of the game, and I wholeheartedly agree with categorising streaks on the leaderboard according to individual preference. The Dynamax mechanic was presented consistently throughout the Gym Challenge/exquisitely fleshed-out story playthrough; I wish the animation was shorter, but I enjoyed its presence overall, and wished to explore the self-buff/enemy debuff dynamic further in Doubles. My memory’s a lil hazy since this happened last decade already, but I believe the first two ‘Dynamax OP!’ instances I saw circulating around the interwebs were Gyarados and Braviary – quickly learning about the former’s to boost Attack and Speed simultaneously while attacking with a 130BP move, I decided to build a team around it to kickstart some BP gains, also hoping that it’d be fun to play. I also could’ve used Zacian or Eternatus here, but opted not to, so maybe this team’s classified as… ‘Uber exc. Legendaries/Mythicals’?


Either way, the point I’m trying to make is ‘Uber’ is a very fitting tag for a Dynamaxing Gyarados – it appears to trivialize approximately 95% of Tower matchups, with this success rate solidified by a more than competent support partner in Raichu. 95% of first turns coincidentally are geared towards setting Gyarados up for a sweep – most commonly via Fake Out + Max Move KO to secure the first Moxie boost with double HP, but FO + Dragon Dance is another option, as is Protecting Raichu first to scout. Once Dynamaxed, Gyarados claims an average of three KOs per battle; and rarely gets KO’d itself before making this contribution.

Raichu

("A Love Song") @ Focus Sash
Nature: Timid
Ability: Lightning Rod
IVs: 31/31/31/31/31/31
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
- Fake Out
- Thunderbolt
- Encore
- Protect

Encore elevates this Electric re-director to superb levels; the AI has a certain penchant for non-attacking moves (friendly wave at Leon's Aegislash), and this disruptive power is bolstered further by Max Airstream, locking the likes of Haxorus and Flygon into DD.

Gyarados

("Amatsu") @ Lum Berry
Nature: Adamant
Ability: Moxie
IVs: 31/31/31/31/31/31
EVs: 4 HP / 220 Atk / 44 Def / 4 SpD / 236 Spe
- Dragon Dance
- Bounce
- Waterfall
- Power Whip

I felt DD here was a non-negotiable move, since Gyara isn't always presented with T1 KOs, and can't always ride one Airstream boost to victory unimpeded. An uncommon play for sure, but seizing a DD safely and delaying Dynamax for a turn is always welcome if the opportunity's available.

Grimmsnarl

("P. Cornish") @ Lagging Tail
Nature: Adamant
Ability: Prankster
IVs: 31/x[HT]/31/31/31/31
EVs: 252 HP / 156 Atk / 44 Def / 20 SpD / 36 Spe
- Spirit Break
- Sucker Punch
- Trick
- Power Swap

Grimmsnarl was the initial Galar native that caught my eye with the most, with a not often seen mixture of power and utility. I think it was through a pre-analysis page here on Smogon that I discovered Grimmsnarl possesses the unique Prankster, Trick and Power Swap trifecta; after learning that Ditto was in the Tower, and the consequent threat of an Imposter reverse sweep, there was just maybe a legitimate reason to use this set. I went all in with Lagging Tail to promote Trick usage on the instances Grimmsnarl is proactively switched in (mainly to preserve Raichu's Sash) - crippling basically any set, forcing it to move last and removing the regular item it would (almost) always prefer to have. High-priority steals, while not always possible to scout for prior, include opposing Sashes, Bright Powders, Quick Claws and the like. Power Swap was primarily present as an emergency button for Imposter Ditto transforming into Gyara, which although failed to happen, did find some use in stealing Attack boosts from Curse users I occasionally ignored until the endgame. Out of hand DDs/QDs/Shell Smashes, which I again was fortunate to have not encountered, are also worthy of mention.

Aegislash

("Tin Soldier") @ Leftovers
Nature: Adamant
Ability: Stance Change
IVs: 31/31/31/x/31/31
EVs: 252 HP / 164 Atk / 12 Def / 36 SpD / 44 Spe
- Swords Dance
- Sacred Sword
- Shadow Sneak
- King's Shield

For the last slot, I was looking for a secondary answer to Rock types in case Gyara was met with a premature death, and despite the base stat cuts, it still performed well enough. Since the frontline's obsessed with doing its own thing the vast majority of the time, I felt Aegi might benefit from a more self-sufficient SD set, with SS as a backup plan for Defense boosters.




I've had such a riveting experience with this team, I'm lost for additional words - definitely not a case of struggling to come up with more things to say..! A charming trait of mine is locking EV spreads in, calcing plenty before I've even undergone the breeding in some cases, then not writing specifics down; surprise, this is yet again in full force. If I feel like it I might run through the calcs again and add them to this post, but know these numbers have good intentions and that I calc/look up sets extensively during play sessions - so they're there for good reason, and I wasn't forced into a position to revise any of them!


Notable threats are scarce, but the few I can immediately think of - Discharge, Freeze-Dry, Rock moves, Foul Play, Trick Room, opposing Fake Out, Sash Counter/Metal Burst - are solved by...Dynamaxing, and FO. Bisharp, Hitmonchan and Lucario complicate matters slightly with the latter by being able to roll Inner Focus, so the solution is to ignore them initially and scout with Protect/FO into the other slot; shielding Raichu from damage can be nice here as it enables to Encore Counter/Metal Burst safely (and disrupt further down the track), if that was the chosen move.


To start, I recorded gameplay for the first 50 battles in their entirety - which I quickly found tiresome, as I don't enjoy having to plug my Elgato in every time I feel like playing some Tower. Instead, after I that switched to a 'record a round of 10 in increments of 50' format, which works quite well; it allows me to showcase the team with adequate screen time, and keep uploading with relative frequency. The earlier uploads are a bit choppy and skip in some places, but I adjusted quality settings in favour of performance for later uploads, which appear smoother. Oh, I should probably mention that the Lighting Rod slot was originally occupied by Togedemaru, and the Ghost slot cycled through Galarian Corsola and Runerigus before settling with the team's final form (installment #8 onwards). This was mainly a case of opting for the more readily accessible rodent/experimenting with new toys, but I realized there were still better backline options in spite of the frontline dominance. This team was certainly something, but unless my BP reserves run dry during a time of need (with the flatlined rewards after Max Rank they might!), it's probably time for Gyara to go on hiatus.

Rental Code

Full Playlist

 

[turskain]

Updated!

Regarding Ubers and Dynamax being clumped together, one possibility would be splitting them once there are more cover legendaries available - right now it's just Zacian, Zamazenta and Eternatus on submitted teams, which would make their listing quite narrow. Once more of them become available besides these and the BW & SM cover legendaries, it could be an interesting split category to theorymon which of them would be most broken.

 

[scoobydoobydrew]

Y'all, when did battle tower trainers start Dynamaxing? Is this something new?

 

[Eisenherz]

Y'all, when did battle tower trainers start Dynamaxing? Is this something new?

Only certain trainers can dynamax certain Pokémon. Beside Leon's mandatory Charizard, the list is:

League Staff Lazlo and Allegra: Rillaboom, Cinderace, Inteleon
Youngster Ander: Boltund, Dusknoir, Drapion
Lass Hestia: Gardevoir, Togekiss, Rapidash
Poké Kid Alan: Vikavolt, Centiskorch, Escavalier
Poké Kid Eva: Vespiquen, Ribombee, Frosmoth
Police Officer Cooper: Sirfetch'd, Lucario, Kommo-o
Beauty Becka: Thievul, Weavile, Hydreigon

Also to note, they can dynamax any set they've been given of these Pokémon, it's not locked to certain sets.

 

[NZtechfreak]

I see lots of streaks reported in 10s, but each round is 11 battles according to the first post?

Anyways, I've done 6 rounds so far with basically a VGC team that I had got shinies for, initially just to grind some BP to get a Modest Mint for the Shiny G-Max Lapras but then kept going. Obviously the strategy is around G-Max Resonance, so I guess that makes it an Ubers run.

The Battle Tower is really quite dull, don't know if I'll keep going apart from when the need to grind BP comes up. Before this team I did three rounds of battles with another VGC concept with Sunny Day/Fake Tears/Tailwind Whimsicott and Specs Solar Power G-Max Zard and it felt hideously broken when next to none of opponents D-max. This team hasn't really looked close to losing any games yet either (apart from the one where Weak Armor Vanniluxe hit two Sheer Cold in a row), but at least feels a bit more like I am exercising some skill since the decision tree is a bit more advanced than deciding whether Zard G-Maxs or just OHKOs both opponents with Heatwave after Sunny Day (a couple of battles were literally two turns long when Zard hit both Heatwaves twice, would have been safer to G-Max but after a while I was just trying to introduce some excitement).

Anyways, the team (all shiny)

Raichu (Kanto)
Assault Vest
Lightning Rod
Timid
4/0/252/4/68/180
Fake Out
Nuzzle
Electroweb
Volt Switch

Lapras (G-Max)
Shell Armour
Light Clay
Modest
252/0/0/252/4/0
Ice Beam (not even got around to getting Freeze Dry on there)
Hydro Pump
Thunder
Perish Song

Incineroar
Intimidate
Figy Berry
Adamant
244/4/92/0/140/28 (just an old AV spread for my 7th gen shiny via Home)
Flare Blitz
Fake Out
Parting Shot
Darkest Lariat

Gyarados
Intimidate
Jolly
Lum Berry
4/252/0/0/0/252
Waterfall
Power Whip
Bounce
Dragon Dance

Basically get Veil turn one with Fake Out support, or sometimes Electroweb or Nuzzle where it will allow Lapras to move next. The Raichu set is designed to outspeed base 100s - in VGC Zard is the reason for aiming for that speed tier and given Leon's presence it seemed appropriate here. After that either continue to annoy opponents with Raichu (Raichu's staying power behind Veil is nice) via Nuzzle, or Volt Switch out to start the cycle of Intimidate/Fake Out/Parting Shot/Intimidate etc. In most games I try to use each of Lapras G-Max moves over the three turns, given rain boosts Lapras Hydro Pump and Waterfall, and allows for 100% accurate Thunders as Lapras enjoys the higher base power moves given its modest damage output, and G-Max Lightning boosts Thunder and Raichu's output and prevents any sleep shenanigans. Apart from setting Veil the other early goal is to try and KO two opposing mons during the G-Max turns, as this allows for Perish Song after G-Max and that seals a lot of games.

Headaches for the team are mainly Defiant and Competitive mons, for obvious reasons, however Raichu and Lapras are usually up to the task with Resonance OHKO'ing all the Braviary I have come across and Nuzzle into G-Max good enough to cripple Obstagoon even if not OHKO'ing (not sure I have faced a Bisharp, can't recall any, but approaches would look similar). Rock types give Raichu/Incin/Gary troubles and make for difficult switches, however Lapras obviously helps and switching in Intimidate behind Veil, even if taking a super effective attack, is generally worthwhile nonetheless.

Now getting shinies for a Venusaur team to give that a whirl. So far have Ninetails and Venusaur and deciding on team mates, probably a Rotom-Wash and something else... I hate breeding for HA this gen though, last gen you could use egg rejection to virtually guarantee getting the HA, but not an option this gen as far as I am aware. Didn't get the Chlorophyll Bulbasaur until after getting two Overgrow ones first (incidentally, have a box of 6IV Friend Ball Chlorophyll Bulbasaur with Nature Power/Toxic/Curse/Ingrain if anyone needs).

 

[Worldie]

The Battle Tower is really quite dull, don't know if I'll keep going apart from when the need to grind BP comes up

I would agree that Tower when using Dynamax tends to be... boringly easy.

I suggest you to try some runs without D-max or uber tiers. It actually offers a decent challenge (not always, but usually).

 

[NZtechfreak]

I would agree that Tower when using Dynamax tends to be... boringly easy.

I suggest you to try some runs without D-max or uber tiers. It actually offers a decent challenge (not always, but usually).

Yes, if I actually set out to do a run proper I will definitely do no D/G-max. Even without that it doesn't track wins, doesn't have progressive difficulty and doesn't incrementally increase rewards, so still pretty dull compared to tree.

 

[justintr]

Anyway, new team! This team is currently sitting at 200 wins and it uses the wonderful Alolan Ninetales~! This team does not Dynamax.

Aurora Veil in Galar

Ninetales-Alola @ Focus Sash
Ability: Snow Warning
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
IVs: 31/xx/31/31/31/31
Timid Nature
- Freeze-Dry
- Blizzard
- Aurora Veil
- Protect

This is honestly kind of a boring set. Not really much to say except that with Snow Warning, Ninetales can set up Aurora Veil, making the team pretty damn bulky. Especially vs pshycial stuff thanks to Incineroar's Intimidate. Blizzard does ok damage to a lot of stuff and getting random freezes on opponents is hilarious. Freeze-Dry helps deal with Water-types.

Incineroar @ Assault Vest
Ability: Intimidate
Level: 50
EVs: 156 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def / 92 SpD / 4 Spe
IVs: 31/31/31/xx/31/31
Adamant Nature
- Fake Out
- Flare Blitz
- Knock Off
- U-turn

First, I wanna say I don't really remember where I got this spread from. I imported this Incineroar from Ultra Moon and it had an Assault Vest there, so I figured it could work here as well. I probably got it from some random Battle Tree team. Anyway, Incineroar is still pretty damn good. With Fake Out, Incineroar can help Ninetales set up Veil if needed, and can take a decent number of hits before going down. Yeah, Flare Blitz recoil+hail doesn't sound like a very good idea, but it does the job. Knock Off is really nice for getting rid of problematic stuff like Bright Powder, Quick Claw, Choice Scarf, etc. U-turn is also very good for slow switches. Love this guy.

Dracovish @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Strong Jaw
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
IVs: HT/HT/HT/31/31/31
Bashful Nature (minted to Jolly)
- Fishious Rend
- Psychic Fangs
- Crunch
- Low Kick

This is the exact same Dracovish from the rain squad, except this time it's sporting a Choice Scarf. With the Scarf, I believe it out-speeds everything in the Tower except for Cinderace-15 and Dragapult-24. Fishious Rend is still very strong even without the Mystic Water+rain boost and is pretty much used to clean up. The other moves are mostly there for coverage (have only used Psychic Fangs a handful of times to get of screens or for dealing with Gastrodon).

Jirachi @ Life Orb
Ability: Serene Grace
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
IVs: HT/31/HT/xx/31/31
Careful Nature (minted to Jolly)
- Iron Head
- Thunder Punch
- Ice Punch
- Protect

And finally, we have Jirachi. I've been waiting to use this little guy ever since it was found out the Tower had no actual banlist. I LOVE Jirachi. It kinda lacks in power, but being able to flinch stuff with Serene Grace Iron Head is nice. Thunder and Ice Punch are used for coverage and they do acceptable damage. I put an Expert Belt on Jirachi because I couldn't really think of a better item to put on it. I'm willing to take suggestions though.

And we're done. Until next time, see ya.

Aurora Veil in Galar falls at 649 wins, meaning my loss was to Leon :(. Before I go into the post, the team remains mostly unchanged from the 200 update, except I changed Jirachi's item from Expert Belt to Life Orb to add a little bit of extra power. I was going to get around to changing around Incineroar as well, but as the streak length grew, I figured I should see how far I could go with it. It worked out quite well honestly. Anyway, here is the loss and some threats I took note of since the 200 update.

Threats

opposing Aurora Veil - While not very big, some Pokemon can get pretty damn bulky when the AI sets up its own Veil on me. And since I give themthe Hail for free, if the Pokemon has it, it will most likely use it. Dracovish's Psychic Fangs can obviously get rid of it as well as Reflect and Light Screen.

Weather setters - I believe Ninetales-A is fastet than every single auto weather-setting Pokemon in the Tower, which means the opposing weather will go up if Drought, Drizzle, or Sand Stream is rolled on the possible sets. This can make setting up Aurora Veil or even using Blizzard a little harder to play around. Usually switching out Ninetales and bringing it back in for later remedies this issue.

Lapras - Very bulky Water/Ice and the team can't hit super hard. Freeze-Dry does pitiful damage, but Dracovish's Low Kick and Jirachi's Thunder Punch can chip it down. Lapras having potential Water Absorb kinda forces me to not lock into Fishious Rend.

Cloyster - Another Water/Ice, but not as bad. Set 4's Shell Smash can be deadly but thankfully, a Freeze-Dry can do decent damage thanks to Cloyster's low Special Defense. Chipping it down with Thunder Punch also helps too.

Status - Mostly paralysis from Body Slam or Thunder Wave. Will-o-Wisp and Scald burns also suck since the backline is two physical attackers. Having no way to block status can be a major streak killer, and paralysis did come into play a couple of times during the streak (mostly from Rotoms or Bisharp).

Defiant/Competitive - Leading with Incienroar means you probably have to deal with these two abilities a bit. Milotic can be a pain in the ass, but Fake Out support does help vs lead Milotic. Freeze-Dry does pretty good damage and can eventually take it out with the helpof Hail chip. Braviary isn't a huge problem honestly as Fake Out+Blizzard packs a wallop.

Trick Room - Fake Out usually helps vs Lead Trick Room users. Double Trick Room lead means you have to play the 50/50 though. Incineroar can put a dent in most of the setters with Knock Off though, and Ninetales' Blizzard usually chips them into range too. Aromatisse-3, however, can live through both Flare Blitzand Blizzard if not hit with any prior damage. Whenever I did face it however, the battle was already mostly over though so not a huge, huge deal.

Dragapult - Sets 1 and 3 have Psychic Fangs and they like to use that on Ninetales a lot so setting Veil is almost always a no-go. Blizzard+Knock Off does 2HKO, but you might have to deal with +1 Fangs or Dragon Darts since Clear Body also blocks Intimidate. Sets 2 and 4 are a little more dangerous since they both out-speed Dracovish, and can OHKO with Draco Meteor(thru Veil too!). Luckily, Ninetales, Incineroar, and Jirachi can handle Dragapult pretty well.

Snow Cloak - *Glaceon has entered the chat*. Seriously, I hate Snow Cloak and I hate that I'm enabling this stupid ability with my Hail. The best thing to do is hope you don't miss your attacks.

Mr. Rime - Lead Mr. Rime isn't too much of a problem. But, backline Mr. Rime can automatially clear Aurora Veil if it rolls Screen Cleaner as its ability.

Inteleon-2-6-10 - This set specifically is annoying as its faster than Ninetales-A and can use Double Team on top of having a Bright Powder. I usually just go for the Fake Out+Freeze-Dry into it if it leads and it goes down if both attacks hit. Otherwise, its best to try and take it out ASAP as the evasion boosts from Double Team and accuracy drops from Muddy Water can be problematic.

Arctozolt - Static, 'nuff said. Paralysis sucks and can really shut the team down (especially Dracovish).

Mimikyu-3 - I'm singling out this set in particular as its a very cruel set. Mental Herb+Trick Room+Disguise is a very nasty combo. I can't even use Fake Out on it as its a Ghost-type! Best thing to do is set up Veil and hope for the best I guess (or hope that Mimikyu's partners are dead-weight).

The Loss

650 - vs Pokemon Trainer Leon
Rillaboom-9 / Aegislash-5 / Haxorus-6 / Charizard-7

Turn 1 - So, we're up against Leon. He leads with Rillaboom and Aegislash. Grassy Surge does not activate so I know Rillaboom has Overgrow as its ability. I immediately switch out Ninetales to Dracovish vs this as I didn't want to have Ninetales out vs Aegislash, and I wanted it to remain healthy just in case Leon had something like Haxorus or Seismitoad (spoiler: he did have Haxorus). I have Ince use Fake Out on Rillaboom, and Aegi uses Iron Head on Dracovish doing minimal damage (also revealing Aegi is set 5).

Turn 2 - Aegislash reverts to Shield form as it uses King's Shield. Dravovish uses Fishious Rend into Rillaboom, which does ~40ish, which I believe puts it into Overgrow range thanks to the additional Fake Out damage from earlier. Grass Pledge ends up doing way more damage than expected to Dracovish, leaving it with ~40ish HP (35 after Hail chip). Incineroar uses Knock Off into Aegislash, which fails thanks to King's Shield, obviously. Incineroar's Attack also drops thanks to KS as well. Boo. I really should have just double-targeted Rillaboom this turn as Aegi using King's Shield was very likely since this particular set couldn't really hit either of my two Pokemon very hard, especially with Ince's Intimidate from turn 0.

Turn 3 - I'm forced to switch out Dracovish as Shadow Sneak would have taken it out. I switch to Jirachi, which didn't sound like an amazing idea. Anyway, Jirachi takes both Shadow Sneak and Grass Pledge likea champ. Incineroar then KOs Rillaboom with U-turn. I should have probably hit Aegislash here with Knock Off or Flare Blitz instead but oh well. Ninetales comes in.

Turn 4 - Leon sends out Charizard and Dynamaxes it. Since I kinda dug my own grave here, I was wondering how I could salvage this. I end up going for Blizzard, hoping for a freezeor something on Charizard but it didn't work out. I did crit Aegislash though, which activated the Sitrus Berry. Jirachi also lost the speed-tie to Charizard and died to G-Max Wildfire, which Aegislash brings Ninetales down to its Sash with Iron Head. Ninetales then faints to the Wildfire flames.

Turn 5 - Incineroar and Dracovish both come out. Thankfully, I get another round of Intimidate down on Aegislash which takes Dracovish out of Shadow Sneak range. Bad news? Aegislash uses King's Shield again. Dracovish KOs Charizard with a Fishious Rend, and Incineroar's Knock Off fails again and Incineroar's Attack falls once again. The hail stops after this turn.

Turn 6 - Leon sends out his final Pokemon, Haxorus. It was right here I figured I probably lost. Anyway, I have Dracovish go for the Fishous Rend on Aegislash, and it fails to KO here, while Haxorus KOs Vish with Outrage, revealing set 6. Incineroar Knocks Off the Lum Berry Hax was holding, and Aegislash uses Swords Dance to erase the Intimidates from earlier. Honestly, here I probably should have just doubled into Haxorus as I'm sure Rend+KOff would have picked up the KO.

Turn 7 - To add insult to injury, Aegislash uses King's Shield AGAIN, while Haxorus brings Incineroar down to 29 HP with Outrage, and gets confused. Incineroar fails to use Knock Off on Aegislash again, ha.

Turn 8 - Haxorus does not hit itself in confusion and takes out Incineroar with another Outrage. And that's all she wrote.

This loss kinda stung. I played poorly and didn't calc when I should have, and obviously I was played by Aegislash and its damn King's Shield. Oh well. The No Dynamax rule definitely made this a lot more fun than I expected and I'm definitely going to follow thru with that for the future I think. Anyway, until next time, see ya.

 

[phoenix0wright]

Aurora Veil in Galar falls at 649 wins, meaning my loss was to Leon :(. Before I go into the post, the team remains mostly unchanged from the 200 update, except I changed Jirachi's item from Expert Belt to Life Orb to add a little bit of extra power. I was going to get around to changing around Incineroar as well, but as the streak length grew, I figured I should see how far I could go with it. It worked out quite well honestly. Anyway, here is the loss and some threats I took note of since the 200 update.

Hey, meant to say congrats on the great streak! That's a great run, especially for non dynamax. Just out of curiosity, how were you thinking of changing Incineroar?

 

[justintr]

Hey, meant to say congrats on the great streak! That's a great run, especially for non dynamax. Just out of curiosity, how were you thinking of changing Incineroar?

Thank you~!

To be honest, I wasn't 100% sure myself, but I was thinking of doing something similar to Eisenherz's Incineroar from his ZapFini streak in the Battle Tree. Without Veil, Incineroar couldn't take super effective hits very well. It was also slow, and took a lot of damage from both Flare Blitz recoil and Hail chip. I figured adjusting the spread and giving it a berry would help but I didn't really want to fiddle with it too much, so I decided to leave it. Parting Shot was also considered over U-turn, but ultimately I stuck with U-turn as it did break Sashes and potential Sturdys (which ofc, didn't matter too much since Hail chip would break both Sash and Sturdy alike from any non-Ice type.

 

[Adamant Zoroark]

For the new year, I decided to try a streak challenge in doubles. The major constraints I set were the following:

1. No Legendary Pokemon
2. No changing any Pokemon on the Battle Team (i.e. must use the same four Pokemon throughout)

I'm at 57 wins (ongoing; streak started with 37 victories recorded in Max Rank and currently at 94 recorded) and I have concluded that the new Speed mechanics are really busted. And so is Dynamax, so next streak challenge I should probably add "No Dynamaxing":

@

, Docile (minted to Adamant), Strong Jaw
EVs: 4|252|0|0|0|252 / IVs: HT/31/HT/HT/31/31
Fishious Rend | Ice Fang | Crunch | Psychic Fangs

(M) @

, Timid, Prankster
EVs: 4|0|0|252|0|252 / IVs: 31/xx/HT/31/31/31
Moonblast | Energy Ball | Tailwind | Taunt

(M) @

, Jolly (minted to Modest), Neutralizing Gas
EVs: 252|0|0|252|4|0 / IVs: 31/xx/31/31/31/31
Dazzling Gleam | Sludge Bomb | Flamethrower | Clear Smog

(M) @

, Jolly, Moxie
EVs: 4|252|0|0|0|252 / IVs: HT/31/HT/xx/31/HT
Waterfall | Bounce | Power Whip | Protect

I think this team's general game plan is pretty straightforward: Set up Tailwind and start nuking things with Dracovish. Galarian Weezing was a random selection that I initially thought would not do much, but it's been surprisingly useful; Neutralizing Gas nullifies Storm Drain, which is critical for situations where Dracovish is locked into Fishious Rend against Gastrodon and also really needs to stay in to take out something next to it. Sure, it also neutralizes Strong Jaw, but it's better than having Fishious Rend do absolutely nothing but give Gastrodon a boost. Furthermore, it switches in on Fairy-types quite well thanks to its Assault Vest and provides STAB spread coverage with Dazzling Gleam. Whimsicott has Energy Ball in order to provide coverage against Water-types (especially Gastrodon and Seismitoad).

Dracovish is definitely the 'mon I most love using on this team, but Gyarados is a very close second. Gyarados is the primary Dynamaxer on this team; doubling its HP helps to ensure it takes anything comfortably, even Electric-type attacks thanks to its Wacan Berry. Max Geyser sets up Rain, which makes Dracovish's Fishious Rend even more of a nuke (I OHKOed a Ferrothorn with it once) and Max Airstream boosts the speed of its allies for when Tailwind runs out, while Power Whip is mainly to have access to Max Overgrowth to gain coverage against Gastrodon. Moxie is the thing that makes a Dynamaxed Gyarados really devastating, as any Singles player will probably tell you; rack up KOs, rack up Attack boosts (and potentially Speed boosts as well thanks to Max Airstream) and things are going to start getting knocked out really easily. Max Overgrowth doesn't quite take out a certain Water-type? Just get a Moxie boost first and then you're good!

Main threats to the team: Fake Out leads, Trick Room, and Gastrodon leads. Against any lead that could potentially have Fake Out, switching out Whimsicott is the play as it is the Pokemon that least wants to take it. For Gastrodon leads, I typically Dynamax Dracovish in order to make use of non-Water coverage to use against Gastrodon without having to Choice-lock myself into something that isn't Fishious Rend. Trick Room setters are tricky as allowing it to go up could mean the end of the streak. I tend to have Dracovish target down any potential Trick Room setter; a lot of them have Mental Herb, which means taunting them won't work. Mimikyu is the toughest one to deal with; the optimal play is to Moonblast to break Disguise and Fishious Rend to take it out, but Mimikyu-4 would simply take out Dracovish with Play Rough. That said, losing Dracovish to Mimikyu-4 is preferable to allowing Mimikyu-3 to set up Trick Room.

One suggestion I got in the Discord was to use Scarf Pelipper as opposed to Whimsicott, but this is not optimal for the main reason that there are plenty of Pokemon that outspeed Scarf Pelipper (Jolteon, Dragapult, and Cinderace-1 immediately come to mind, plus plenty of other faster Pokemon that carry Choice Scarf) that can cause the Tailwind + Fishious Rend strategy to crumble. In terms of abusing the Speed mechanics of this game, Whimsicott is the better Tailwind setter thanks to Prankster.

I do have some clips (mostly of Dracovish one-shotting various things or coming close), which I'll try to post as soon as possible. I'll also include a rental team code whenever the streak ends.

EDIT: Went ahead and uploaded the rental team since another user was looking for something to use in the Tower:

Team oo

Quick update on this. Currently up to 277 wins and still going. Being close to 300 wins and still never having gone for Clear Smog even once makes it basically official that Thunderbolt would be better on Weezing.

Adapting this team into a form for a no Dynamax streak would also be fairly simple; Dracovish/Whimsicott/Weezing by themselves already form a strong core without needing to Dynamax. The only issue is that Gyarados, having two low-accuracy moves, one of which is a two-turn move, is not ideal for a team going for a no Dynamax streak. The team would need something that provides similar coverage without being dependent on Dynamax. The main important things Gyarados provides are coverage for Water-types and Grass-types, so maybe something like Roserade could work if going for a no Dynamax team.

 

[littlechandler]

My Singles No Dynamax team of Dracovish / Aegislash / Rotom-Mow lost a while ago at 262 wins.

I don't remember the exact team I faced, but remember switching out to Aegislash for the first Pokemon (so likely some fairy or dragon type). The second Pokemon would KO Aegislash, but I knew I could weaken it and then revenge kill with Dracovish or Rotom-Mow. I should have switched in Rotom-Mow to revenge kill, as I remember it would have outspeeded, and using Dracovish locks it into a 3rd move for the last Pokemon, but was dumb and had Dracovish revenge kill instead.

The last Pokemon was Ferrothorn2, which sports Rest, Sleep Talk, Curse, Gyro Ball, although I generally don't bother to look up trainers and Pokemon beforehand so didn't know that at the time. I spammed Fishious Rend with Dracovish as Ferrothorn used Curse thinking I could just weaken Ferrothorn enough for Rotom to finish it off. Had I saved Aegislash, I could have 2HKO'd with Sacred Sword. I still could sometimes 3HKO with Rotom with Will-o-Wisp + Hex, and the Ferrothorn sometimes messes up by using Sleep Talk on the turn it wakes up to give me a 4th turn. However I panicked and didn't plan things out, which meant Rotom didn't get a free switch, and Ferrothorn got enough boosts that it could 2HKO Rotom after the speed drops to boost Gyro Ball.

 

[Eisenherz]

I've been wanting to make this post for a pretty long time, but kept pushing it back because it might be slightly controversial, and I was mostly content just enjoying the Battle Tower without stirring the pot. Well, no more procrastinating! I'm currently at 2554 wins in the Battle Tower (pictured above – overall, of course, not in a row!), and I would like share my thoughts about the facility before I start submitting streaks, because there's been a lot of disappointment, and I can absolutely see why, but I think it deserves a more nuanced approach than simply discarding it. This is a pretty long post, but there's a tl;dr at the end for those who can't be bothered! Let's start by looking at what's wrong with the Tower.

Battle Tower: the issues

I think most of what I'm about to list has been mentioned, maybe by several people even, in this thread, so I'll keep the points very brief, and may add a couple of my own (note that I'm only taking MAX tier into account, which is the only one that matters):

Major issues (I'm numbering these just for easier reference later):

• 1. No streak tracking: The Tower only tracks the total number of wins, not the current streak. It functions in stretches of 10 battles, the last of which is Leon. It obviously means that streak tracking needs to be done manually, which is far from ideal for leaderboards like ours. If you lose, you get to resume where you were in the stretch of 10 - clearly, this simply wasn't meant for streaks and records, period. This is the main obstacle for our leaderboard.
• 2. You can use "Ubers": ie. Zacian and co. The AI doesn't get to use them, so using them gives the player an incredible advantage, making the difficulty level a bit of a joke.
• 3. Outside of Leon, very few trainers actually Dynamax: (and all Pokémon dynamaxing have no Dynamax Candy, which means their bulk is nowhere near what Dynamax would usually grant). I don't think many people saw this as a problem early on, but it's been mentioned a few times since in streak reports. This is very similar to the problem above, in that it gives the player who uses Dynamax (with full candies) a huge advantage, which makes the difficulty level a bit of a joke. I've seen some people arguing this is similar to the Mega advantage we had in Gen 6 Maison, for example, but it's absolutely not comparable. The flexibility and power of Dynamax is miles ahead and allows very bad teams to still perform incredibly well (spoken from experience).

Minor issues:

• Imperfect IVs for opponents: The sets we face have imperfect IVs, usually 23 or 27 I think. The exception is Leon, who has 31 IVs on all Pokémon.
• No Battle Videos: Being able to do mock battles against AI teams from battle videos in Gen 7 was a godsend for anyone interested in honing their skills or team. Videos were also a means of sharing losses for our leaderboards, so losing those furthers our blind spot as far legitimacy goes, sadly.
• The BP reward is too low: You get 2 BP per battle, and that's it. It's worth noting that GF is very generous with BP for anyone playing Battle Stadium, handing out 600 BP every month for simply getting to Master Ball rank, which can amount to 1200 if one plays both singles and doubles, not to mention similarly high BP rewards for entering official competitions and only playing the 3 mandatory games, win or lose. I personally see the 2 BP reward as a non-issue, grinding it is not *that* slow, though it's certainly slower than the previous few gens.
• The boss battle is always Leon: cutting down the variety we used to have in Gen 7. I won't speak for everyone, but while I thought this was lame at first, Leon has proven a consistent threat for the many teams I used, his roster is extremely solid and he makes for a fitting boss battle, so this is not something I would see as a negative anymore.

Considering all this, is the Tower a bad facility that should simply be ignored by anyone interested in streaks and leaderboards? I don't think so, but I think we need to reconsider how we approach the climbing to transform it into a challenging enough experience.

I'd like to offer 2 different solutions to the issues I just listed, but before, I'll take the time to list some features of the Tower that I see as positives, just so they don't go unmentioned:

Battle Tower: the positives

• A consistent experience: No more getting to battle 40 or 50 before the "real" thing starts. As soon as you're MAX tier, which should happen very quickly, you stay there and you face the same pool of trainers and Pokémon. These trainers use all possible sets of their Pokémon, unlike Gen 6 and 7 where you would only see the better 2 sets. This means you'll find bad and gimmicky sets at any time, like special Gyarados, but a wider variety is welcome overall, and the unpredictability of these sets means you always need to plan for the worst case anyway (I certainly don't think it makes things easier).
• Running several streaks at once: The upside of no streak tracking is that you can start several streaks with different teams, and given you properly keep track of them, alternate between them to not get too burnt out of a team.
• Mythicals: Many of us have been wanting to run mythicals such as Mew in facilities for a long time, knowing they're not any more powerful than a lot of the stuff already allowed, but the line was drawn by GF's official formats. Freeing these mythicals comes at the cost of issue #2 as a side-effect, sadly, but getting to teambuild with these Pokémon is a very positive thing for a lot of us.
• New sets: Unlike the transition between Maison and Tree, almost all facility sets have been rebuilt, which really provides a fresh experience (I think it's like 900 sets in total). Every single Pokémon of the Galardex is included, and the sets may have been built with doubles slightly more in mind than the past. There is now an (infuriating) abundance of Protect/Detect users, and a lot of Mental Herb Trick Room setters. Other tendencies that make our life miserable is an abundance of Quick Claws, Bright Powders (yes, both of these have even more representation than before) and Rocky Helmets. Shedinja is now a common encounter, and it's a unique sort of threat that we didn't have to deal with last gen; not only a necessity to keep in mind in teambuilding but also for what pieces to preserve against certain trainers - Shedinja can easily solo an unprepared team. Ditto is now a thing as well, and Scarf Imposter can definitely be an issue to several teams that rely on setting up. And there are very few teams that aren't threatened by the Quick Claw Copperajah set that Ultan is guaranteed to have in the back! The point is: the Tower roster provides plenty of new challenges, and while some might get infuriating at times, it's the classic Pokémon battle facility experience! The practical playing part is, all in all, pretty similar to what it used to be.

Solutions

I can see 2 approaches that capitalize on the positives of the Tower and try to circumvent the issues. DaWoblefet already suggested replacing the streak challenge with a speedrun challenge, which I think is a fun idea (as a matter of fact, I've had a go at it myself). However, speedrunning is a very different kind of challenge, it's almost like playing an entirely different game compared to trying to achieve long streaks. I can't say I have much interest in speedrunning personally, and it looks like no one else has taken the challenge yet, but if a surge of interest was to emerge for speedrunning the Tower, I think adding that to our leaderboards would be very nice!

Solution 1: "Fix" the issues – making rules

This is probably the most obvious route. We can make our own set of rules, much like speedrunning does, except it's for streaking. I'm not thinking of a long list of arbitrary rules, only what's necessary to make the Tower a similar challenge to the previous facilities; we enforce the rules that Game Freak left out. Many people have already self-imposed rules for this very purpose, and we even have a separate leaderboard for "No Dynamax", which also prohibits Ubers. To be clear, I'll list the rules I believe are necessary:

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1. No "Ubers": This rule fixes main issue #2. However, I think in addition to cover legends, more Pokémon need to be banned, and the current banlist isn't clear enough. Since the Mythical pandora box has been opened by Game Freak, we have to manage the content it unleashed. I think most of the OP Pokémon are obvious enough, but some are a bit more borderline, here is my suggestion for bans (I have tested all these Pokémon in Tower before making the list):

Banned: Mewtwo, Reshiram, Zekrom, Kyurem-W, Kyurem-B, Solgaleo, Lunala, Necrozma-DM, Necrozma-DW, Marshadow, Melmetal, Zacian, Zamazenta, Eternatus
Allowed: Mew, Celebi, Jirachi, Kyurem (base forme), Keldeo, Necrozma (base forme), Zeraora

I was ambivalent on Marshadow and Melmetal before testing (I actually thought Melmetal would be fine), but not anymore now that I've used them, they're a lot more busted than their base stats had me believe at first. Kyurem and Necrozma may require further testing, they're definitely very good, but I haven't found them carrying about any team like the Pokémon of the banned list do.
This is, of course, an arbitrary line, but it wasn't drawn out of thin air. If we're going to make a No Ubers rule, which is necessary to make Tower streaking somewhat serious, we need to either draw this line or ban all of them. I don't think allowing things like Mew or Celebi is controversial, many of us have actually wished for them to be usable for a long time, so I think drawing this line is fine.

2. No Dynamax: This rule fixes main issue #3. Not allowing Dynamax when it's the main gimmick of the generation might feel strange, but the mechanic makes Battle Tower streaks extremely trivial. The majority of battles with a purposefully-built Dynamax team end up being repetitive sweeps in which the backline never even shows its face. Battles boil down to mindlessly clicking a win button, which in return, rewards mediocre teambuilding like it was never possible in any previous facility. I have used a very large array of teams that made use of Dynamax now in Tower, and at the risk of ruffling some feathers, I'll admit my interest in any team that reaches a high streak using Dynamax is about 0. Meanwhile, enforcing a self-imposed no dynamax rule brings the challenge level of Tower to a similar one to Tree and Maison, perhaps slightly harder at times (making the imperfect IVs an absolute non-issue), but nothing good teambuilding and play can't overcome.

One could argue for a more complex rule, such as "only Dynamax when the AI also Dynamaxes"; I think that rule would be fair as well, but I also think it's unnecessary and that adding complexity to our rules should be avoided when possible.
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These 2 simple rules are enough, in my opinion, to make playing the Tower a similar playing experience to the facilities of the last few gens as far as difficulty goes. However, this is where I think my post might become a bit controversial: I don't think these should be secondary leaderboards, they should be the only leaderboards. I hope this doesn't offend anyone, but I don't see any value in listing streaks that use Ubers and Dynamax; there isn't much impressive about them other than the patience required to get to the number. The Tower, to many, is a joke of a facility because of how easy it is with Ubers and Dynamax, and this makes the Ubers leaderboards a bit of a joke as well.
I used to think that leaderboard was still useful for newcomers who wanted team ideas and possibly rentals. But I don't think the Ubers leaderboard provides much value in that field either; using the "Ubers" should make it trivial for about anyone to achieve plenty of wins. Rentals have exploded a lot more than QRs ever did in Gen 7, and there are hundreds of good rental teams made for Battle Stadium or VGC available all over the internet, all of which are absolutely fine for streaking with no rules. If anything, simply linking to some of these, and/or DaWoblefet's sample team should be enough to help those interested in the BP grind. Leaderboards should be restricted to noteworthy achievements.

So what about issue #1? It's certainly a bother! Nothing can be done about it. Facility leaderboards have always relied on honesty, and more than ever, it has to be the case here, since each is responsible for properly tracking their streak. If we're going to have leaderboards at all (which I believe to be better than none), then it's simply something we need to accept. Capturing and recording footage is easier than ever on Switch, but it still requires an investment in a capture card that we can't request people to make, a rule enforcing the recording of streaks would be way too oppressive, though footage is obviously always welcome.

As far as our leaderboard and records go, I believe this solution should be adopted. It fixes as much of the Tower as is fixable, and ultimately, provides a similar enough experience to old facilities in practice.

Solution 2: Fun above all – random battles

There's another way to look at the Battle Tower and its issues: it becomes a really nice playing ground for a self-made Battle Factory of sorts! ReptoAbysmal and me have been doing these since Gen 7, and far from hindering them, the new format of Tower is pretty much ideal! The idea is simply to get a roster of Pokémon together, then draw randomly from this roster to make a team for a round of 10 battles, then repeat. One can make whatever rules they see fit for their enjoyment (for example, Repto does only Trick Room, and is guaranteed to draw a TR setter, while I draw 6 random Pokémon from my entire roster of 300 and pick 4).

The Tower's division into rounds of 10 is ideal for putting a random team to the test and end with a Leon boss battle every time. No need to be concerned about how OP Ubers or Dynamax may be, since they're used to compensate for the fact you may have drawn a horrible team, or one that simply has very little synergy. About any Pokémon is viable in this format, though depending on what one draws, the difficulty of the challenge will greatly vary (sure, drawing Kyurem-W means you're unlikely to lose, but that safety is only there for that one round! Dynamax makes it possible to have a fighting chance with terrible teams and Pokémon). It's a good way to use the Gen 8 gimmick to the fullest while still having a challenge of sorts, and without getting bored of repeatedly clicking a win button. Using Pokémon such as Cramorant, Stunfisk... or Necrozma-DM, and have them be the star of the show for a few battles, is a lot of fun.

One can track the progress of randos streaks the same way any other streak (yeah...... manually), and Tower certainly makes it easier to achieve long streaks than previous facilities in this mode (my first attempt went over 300!). It presents enough variety to keep things interesting in the long run, as long as your roster is large enough, of course – breeding and training an army of Pokémon for this mode may be the biggest barrier of entry.

Moreover, while I don't think these streaks really belong on a leaderboard (especially with how varied the rules one imposes can be), they most definitely can make for entertaining war stories worthy of being posted in here for everyone's enjoyment!

If you think the Tower is dumb and is beyond fixing as far as leaderboards go, this approach can be a way to still get hours of fun from it, since it runs into none of the issues regular streaks do, outside maybe the streak tracking, but it doesn't matter as much here.

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TL;DR: Battle Tower is actually pretty fun, and can really feel similar to past facilities in practice, but it requires self-imposing rules. We need to enforce 2 simple rules if we're going to have a serious leaderboard, and those mostly correspond to the current "No Ubers" leaderboard. The "Ubers" leaderboards should be nuked, because those streaks don't amount to much (sorry). The most annoying part is that the Tower doesn't keep track of streaks - having to do so manually sucks and might remove the motivating factor for many players, but if you can get over that, the Tower offers a nice challenge!
Otherwise, there's always the option of turning it into a Battle Factory of sorts and doing random battles, a different kind of challenge that doesn't require caring about rules or leaderboards; reporting those adventures on here is certain to be interesting for many readers, too!
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There we go, those are my general thoughts about the Tower, and what its features (or lack thereof) mean for our thread and leaderboards. I have a couple of streaks to report (as well as some ongoing ones), so I'm hoping to get to that in the next few days!

Thanks for reading!

 

[Ranger Squid]

For anyone who is interested in the idea of a speedrun of the battle tower, I just proposed the idea to the PSR discord, and we might possibly get the category up onto the leader board with a set of rules similar to the ones proposed in the link above.

If it shows up on the leader board, I'll link it in a reply to this thread with the rules for anyone to submit to in the future :)

 

[phoenix0wright]

Thanks for the great writeup, Eisenherz. I 100% agree with solution 1a (no Uber pokemon); there's not much to be said that you didn't already say eloquently.

As for 1b (no dynamax), I'm a little torn. On one hand, I think it would be a shame to eliminate the generation's core mechanic from BT discussion entirely. I thought it was neat to see discussion surrounding mons that could never see any serious usage without Dyanamax's power boost. On the other, I agree that dynamax trivializes 90% of battles, even when using shit like Rapidash and Glaceon. When you're facerolling with a trash mon like that, it says something about the power of D-Max. I don't mind nuking the "Ubers" leaderboard necessarily, but I'd like to see if we can't keep some of the positive elements the Uber board brought, like crazy, off-the-wall picks.

In the competitive part of the forums, there was a thread I seem to recall about "heat", or something; basically just teams/mons that weren't top tier, but fun or innovative. Maybe we can do something similar with dmax BT teams? Rentals required, and an explanation about what makes the team fun or unique? That might preserve some of the creativity (for people like me), while renewing the competitive integrity for those who care more about rigorous streaks.

 

[Eisenherz]

On one hand, I think it would be a shame to eliminate the generation's core mechanic from BT discussion entirely. I thought it was neat to see discussion surrounding mons that could never see any serious usage without Dyanamax's power boost.

Oh, I definitely agree with you on that! Just to avoid misunderstandings: I'm not suggesting that the thread should stop discussion of teams that use Dynamax (or Ubers) for those who wish to do that (the random battles I suggest uses them too!), I do think everyone should be able to share whatever Battle Tower stories they see fit in here, no matter the way they want to play it, that's the purpose these facility threads have always had in the past as well. My suggestions of rules are purely for the leaderboard - I don't think we should maintain a leaderboard that allows Dynamax.

In the competitive part of the forums, there was a thread I seem to recall about "heat", or something; basically just teams/mons that weren't top tier, but fun or innovative. Maybe we can do something similar with dmax BT teams? Rentals required, and an explanation about what makes the team fun or unique? That might preserve some of the creativity (for people like me), while renewing the competitive integrity for those who care more about rigorous streaks.

I like that idea! Maintaining a simple list of teams people have posted with rentals, regardless of whether they're making use of Dynamax, would be totally fine in my opinion. Maybe order them alphabetically, or chronologically. I don't know if we could really force these to be "heat", since it could get a little tricky to define what is heat and what isn't, but people should have no problem deciding for themselves what looks interesting and what doesn't from the list. If it ever became too long, it could also just be under a hide tag to not clutter the post. Basically, I'm thinking of something similar to the current "Battle Tower Teams & Rentals" section of the current OP, but only for teams that are provided with rentals. Would that mostly cover what you had in mind?

 

[ReptoAbysmal]

I agree with Eisen in addition to liking that having one concise leaderboard with those limits cuts down on clutter. Most players already abide by this because they can’t enjoy themselves if they aren’t challenged. I don’t plan on ever formally posting a streak, as I solely play randos (which I only posted to Tree leaderboards twice, but the majority of those battles were done by predetermined teams.)

I have no intention of ceasing to use Melmetal or White Kyurem and am counting down the days I can formally add my favorite TR abusing uber to randos: Yveltal. Being banned from the leaderboards is not enough of a deterrent.

That being said, I’d very much like to share a bunch of the randos teams I’ve used! I was extremely pessimistic because of dexit, until realising that a huge portion of my TR abusing flunkies were still in the game (with more to come, like my Aurorus!) Not only that, so many Galar pokes were given either TR-capable speeds, or such fun-looking abilities and moves that I just had to try and make them work. There are very few pokes with speeds not worth halving, and I managed to wind up with approximately the same number of flunkies in gen 8 as in my Tree roster, which was virtually all-inclusive.

I spent a little while combing the discord server for teams I'd used in chronological order, the majority of which logged while talking to Coeur. Unfortunately I didn't screencap all of my EVELYN rolls like I normally do, and using her mostly helpful logging feature didn't help wrack my memory to come up with the missing teams. Still, I managed to compile many teams, and I at least remember using a bunch of things I couldn't properly sort.

In an effort to add a little more variation, and because I was no longer rolling for Mega Evolutions, alternate sets and the Micro box, I added a roll for a Dynamaxing rule. Basically I created the possibility of rolling a stipulation that dmax could be used only three times the entire run, or the final poke only, or only if the user was holding Weakness Policy. These included four "Unrestricted" rolls to prevent me from rolling a strict rule the majority of the time. While I occasionally slip, I do generally try to adhere to that and have actually found that many teams get by just fine without it.

Galarian Molasses, still every bit as sweet

Some miscellaneous tidbits for the uncredited:

• Mystic Water has replaced Life Orb as my item of choice for Araquanid. Because of rain and having three straight turns of it, this is probably one of the more broken pokes in my deck. There's no more Ice Beam due to Mence and Chesnaught being dexited, but for all I know rain-boosted Water Bubble geysers would've fucked them up really badly anyway. Part of me actually wondered if they would nerf Water Bubble because of this, but they didn't. And Araquanid actually has a pretty good Choice Band set in the Tower because of it!
• The fossils are all freaking fantastic between bulk and brutal signature moves. Arctovish is possibly my favorite due to its speed as well as having a really easily exploited nature for triggering WP. I was having an easy time doing this even without dmaxing it for Rend damage.
• I must thank whichever GF employee decided that Cursola and Darmanitan would keep their original movepools and simply build upon them to accommodate their new forms. This gives them so many options for coverage, and they're a blast to use (even with Gorilla Tactics limiting me.)
• Sylveon is a real force to be reckoned with now, and possibly my favorite eeveelution. Mystical Fire and Weather Ball increase its coverage greatly, and it's still just as good for Hyper Voice and Fake Tears spam. It hits 29 speed which is still an excellent benchmark even with the decreased IVs.
• Runerigus made another fine addition to the pool of Fake Tears spammers (which now even includes Aromatisse!) yet I haven't found myself using it as they also gave this thing a usable attack stat as well as Body Press, effectively off a 145 attack stat. With LO this thing has wiped floors and I haven't considered making a dedicated setter out of it.
• I obtained a 0 speed Gmax Charizard without one of my friends RNGing one and, while it successfully finished the streak I rolled it, I learned I need to seriously retool the thing and consider what moves it can use. I originally had Hurricane and Focus Blast on it for the "rare" turns it wouldn't be using Wildfire, as things like Gravity, weather, or other allies liking the attack boost from Max Knuckle making it worth it. Regardless, within ten battles this never seemed to be the case and the moves were more like deadweight and probably made things a lot harder. Hurricane was more useless than Focus Blast so I may try Dragon Pulse or Weather Ball, or both. I won't give up on Zard yet.
• While on the subject of disappointments, Grapploct. Initially I thought its movepool looked usable and, while not particularly weak, it hasn't gone on to really set itself apart from anyone. Neither of its abilities stand out and were it not 40 speed, I doubt I'd have trained one.
• I noted that Dexit cost me a number of Helping Hand users, though Dusclops/Musharna/Aromatisse are rolled frequently enough that I haven't really seen a drought in its abuse. I also picked up a few side users here and there like Alcremie and Rotowash.

One of my earliest teams, and so effective that I ran this team multiple times. Coalossal is also a contender for my favorite gen 8 poke, and the biggest part of that is Volcalith doing insane amounts of passive damage. This thing just fucks everything. It hates sashes, negates almost all recoveries, and opens up a wide array of KOs from hits the target normally survived. Volcalith also allows me to keep sunlight up, and because Hatterene is faster, Mystical Fire for the FF boost is a possibility. While on this team, Iron Ball Duck had Solar Blade and used it regularly, but curiously enough it used Brave Bird more than anything else. Golisopod has been on a number of randos teams for good reason and is a pretty nice glue here.

Both leads can Gmax and on several occasions, leads threatened Coal enough that I switched T1 and allowed Hatty to take the reigns. However, she hits so hard regardless that I didn't necessarily max, and even found keeping the spread property for Dazzling Gleam more beneficial at times.

I don't remember if Eisen or Justin hosted 0-speed Gmax Coalossal, but they're the reason I have one, so thanks!

I was thrilled to learn that Replenish also restores Hatterene's berry when the effect is triggered. This feels like a proper upgrade to Snorlax from last gen and my EV spread hasn't changed; while some of the attack is likely redundant (I made this to guarantee OHKOing Cress2) this set, as well as this team, was so broken that it never mattered. I believe Eisen or Xen hosted this Snorlax.

Necrozma is technically the unit here, but I refer to them as Solgaleo/Lunala for my own ease. I end up running it quite a lot as a backup TR setter. So broken that I've found Photon Geyser can usually be clicked without actually noting the target's stats, though I do use Knock Off often.

Thanks to Eisen for hosting 0-speed Gmax Hatterene! Like Musharna last gen, I gravitate toward Hatterene with very little resistance. Lunala has been discontinued as a potential setter and an earlier undocumented run gave me the impression that it likes Room Service more than Iron Ball, for scooping up some desireable T1 OHKOs. Room Service was used here to that effect and it worked very well.

I was surprised by Throh being pretty useful; evidently so was Coeur, as I mentioned as much to him and he immediately asked if I meant Mat Block. I actually didn't use the move, instead preferring to attack straight away and abuse Guts (Throh was used repeatedly to eat up lead dark moves for Lunala.)

Crustle is quite the force to be reckoned with, and I look forward to rolling it again. It also managed to solo a team without TR by being more than the sum of its parts. Like Crustle, Kommo was born prior to Swsh and only now got a chance to prove itself, but I was actually very pleased with it as well! Even Iron Balled, it was still pulling its weight, and without learning Aura Sphere via TR that may not have been the case.

Do not discount Discount Snorlax! Greedent is ANNOYING AS HELL to face, with or without TR. OHKOing this fucking thing is a lot harder than I imagined it'd be and I rarely do. That being said, it's a phenomenal TR abuser for the same reasons and it trades Gluttony/Replenish for a couple perks of its own.

This run was so noteworthy not for Greedent but because Leon ran an extremely nasty lead pair of Cinderace4/Haxorus4. Some of you may know that both of these are Life Orb sets; Cinderace held it this time, and I've learned to be extremely wary of it in particular because its Pyro Ball easily OHKOs many things I can send against it. On top of having no chance of setting with Jirachi, Haxorus saw fit to murder both Greedent and Hydreigon with Close Combat (T1, Jirachi swapped into Jellicent and T2, Jirachi swapped back into Hydra and both enemies targeted that slot.) A weakened Jellicent managed to set TR, and now I had one and a half pokemon to take down Leon's four.

Fortunately, things got considerably brighter from here. Jirachi (physically offensive setter) OHKOd -2 Haxorus and Jellicent dmaxed, enabling it to KO Cinderace and then Zard as it came in. Rillaboom was then left to the two of them.

Eisen is absolutely right that Melmetal is completely busted. It takes abuse as well as it dishes it out. This particular run saw a league staffer dmax his Rillaboom; Musharna and Melmetal both KOed it in one turn, with Double Iron Bash doing most of the work. Still, seeing as I couldn't obtain a Melmetal by myself and I wanted to use it in TR so badly, I'm not about to grow a conscience and stop.

Musharna has actually reverted back to the days of Maison TR, where it spends more time attacking than supporting the team, though After You and Gravity are still there if my flunkies need them. Obviously this behemoth did not.

Last gen I stated I would never run Dragon Room again, due to the miserable experience I had during randos... maybe if I didn't bring that up no one would have remembered? Ehhhhh

But that was before Whitey broke out of Legitimacy Hell! And the new dragons are all very good! Appletun is not able to gmax, and for the better as it loses too much from sacrificing terrain. For those that aren't aware, this one also goes mixed, with High Horsepower and Sucker Punch adding to its otherwise awful special coverage. Otherwise Appletun is quite competent and I enjoy using it. Wide Lens Hustle Dracozolt was also quite good, and I love its type coverage.

This Escavalier tried out a number of its new toys, those being Razor Shell, Acid Spray and Close Combat. I like them, but there's still a place for my original set.

I learned almost immediately that Indeedee NEEDS Protect. Many flunkies get by without it, but not this one. He was OHKOd by STAB from otherwise average things. Two battles in, I ended up leaving just to patch that weakness. Afterward, Indeedee was much better and is actually a pretty good addition to the Iron Ball club.

The other thing that made this run stand out was the 3-dmax limit, which I adhered to strictly and had many fun battles because of it. Torkoal and Stonjourner had to do their share of work. Power Spot is such a nice ability to have for strong spread moves.

I pulled an Ash Ketchum with my original Trevenant and gave it to Smuckem, so I had to breed a new one. This was its first foray into randos, and I was actually very pleased with it. It also kicked Gourgeist out of the roster in order to join (Dhelmise will always be my favorite grass/ghost.)

If there's any Mega Stone I miss as much as Mawilite, it's easily Abomasite. Abomasnow is a profound disappointment without it, and pending Galar expansions it has a really good chance of being kicked off the roster. It's fast enough to benefit from Iron Ball, but too weak to do much without WP. While it has a decent movepool and hits around as hard as Coalossal, the latter is very fast with better utilities at its disposal.

Abomasnow was used on an earlier rando squad and played a large role in its losing early, but I gave it a second chance and it did much better. The Leon battle was scary and Charizard came down to forcing me to pray for Conk's HHSFLO Rock Slide to connect, which it did, conveniently as partner Aegislash shielded, so I went into the remainder of the battle with more of a chance. I'm not eager to run this set again.

At Eisen's suggestion, I added an Iron Ball Ditto to my roster, and this run was a total blast because of it! Highlights included sweeping a team with special-attacking Gyarados, as well as transforming into a TR Chandelure and sweeping with Shadow Ball as well (I lucked out in that I wasn't Shadow Balled on the Impostor turn, though I was swapping for my elephant.) Copperajah was the Heavy Metal version, still quite strong and useful, though I believe it's still a little worse than SF.

Oh yeah, as fun as Transform can be, we can't forget that GF programmed shit like this

Thanks to JustinTR for hosting 0-speed Gmax Alcremie! I was able to score two of them in the time it took Eisen to get one, which lets me run an offensive and support set. This one was for support. While the leads may have indicated otherwise, this was not an exploding WP Gigalith, but an Assault Vest Sand Force set, supplying sand with Rockfall. Still very strong.

I was eager to run Tsareena for the first time (born last gen) and it became quickly apparent that in my haste I didn't have a good answer for Ferrothorn. This team had to kill two of them, and it mainly came down to Tsareena skirting Iron Barbs and using HH-boosted Knuckles. Dicey. Looking at EVELYN's runlog, this roll produced a Drampa, which I probably should have taken for things like this.

First attempt at using Toxtricity (no 0-speed Gmax in possession) and it did quite well. I was also eager to use Barbaracle, but in my logging to Coeur I noted that Hydreigon stole all of its thunder. I'm pleased that Hydreigon is back to its Maison levels of excellent use in TRandos.

First run for Haxorus, and it did quite well. Happily noted that Mold Breaker applies debuffs from moves like Wyrmwind to White Smoke.

Leon prevented TR via Aegislash, so I had a difficult time. This battle lead me to obtaining Mirror Coat from Eisen's Frosmoth and making Assault Vest a staple for the set with it, though I still plan to use Hurricane/Weather Ball on an alternate if the rolls look primed for it.

Mono-Ice TR can be a thing! While not technically done here, I was able to run an ice setter which looked like it could do the job, unlike Jynx. And Rime was actually pretty adept, both at setting and visibly infuriating the AI with its incessant dancing, drawing attacks away from the much bulkier Whitey, allowing it an even easier time to do its job.

There were a handful of battles where Rime skipped setting in order to use Fake Out; these often involved TR leads, including Sudowoodo x Gigalith and Greedent x Snorlax. Grimmsnarl was able to gmax (thanks to Eisen for hosting!) and while I did do this to OHKO a Wobbuffet, its main perk to this team was providing a second Fake Out, since I wasn't sure Rime would be as effective as it was. My expectations were shattered and Rime did quite a lot of damage with its own Freeze-Dry and Psyshock. He and Kyurem would manage to defeat Leon without incurring a single loss, though they were both near death by the end. I also had the amusement of outspeeding Rhyperior under TR with Choice Specs on Kyurem (Rock Polish set.)

This team included a second meme in addition to Crammy, that being Absorb Bulb Vileplume. Vileplume actually did not fuck around this run, repeatedly tripping sleep from Effect Spore and getting a ton of mileage from Strength Sap. Sadly, Cramorant never spat its catch out once, though it did dmax against Leon and sweep his team.

Bulldoze on Bronzong. Weakness Policy Turtonator. Such was all it took to redeem Turt for all of its failures in randos last gen, as it was a severely dominant force this time. At Eisen's suggestion, I dumped Golurk's Ice Punch for Thunderpunch, and used the latter from time to time. In hindsight, I recall remarking that Gastrodon would protect me from Leon's Inteleon should things go south (ultimately it fell to Bulldoze + Wyrmwind) not considering that Snipe Shot ignores Storm Drain. Whelp.

This isn't Coeurchin's first bout of randos, but I enjoy using it. Still trying to settle on a definitive item for the set, as I've used both Electric Seed, Magnet, and Expert belt. During this run it did plenty of zinging and zapping. I lucked out against a late-game Mudsdale which put me in a rough spot by protecting, and had it a better rock move than Smack Down I might've lost to it. This run also pitted me against a lead QC Arctovish who, as I mused at the possibility, procced three times in a row and did far more damage in those three turns as the Vappy1 that made me lose my shit during Tree. This was partly my fault because I openly considered the risk of not doubling into it, failed to follow through with the safety check, and was punished.

I hope my Randos fans enjoy giving that a quick skim, and I look forward to seeing JustinTR and Josh C. get involved in this format before long! Also, a big thanks to Eisenherz for being very involved in my exploits this gen, from providing many hold items, hosting various Gmax raids, and generally offering many bits of advice and incentive in trying a number of new pokemon.

 

[turskain]

Following the ongoing discussion here and in the Discord I've reorganized the leaderboards in the OP to three categories: Classic, Dynamax, and Unranked. Classic's the same as the old No Dynamax but with a new name to better represent its goal as being closest to past-gen battle facilities. Dynamax is Dynamax, but with Ubers banned. Unranked is where teams & streaks using Ubers, and teams without associated streaks or unusual goals not fitting on the regular leaderboards go.

This is very much a work in progress and if you have anything you'd like to see or have feedback, don't hesitate to post. The exact banlist for Classic & Dynamax is also up in the air - most cover legendaries are going to be on it, but whether Kyurem, vanilla Necrozma, Melmetal and Marshadow (and maybe others) will be no it is something we'll need to discuss further.

 

[ReptoAbysmal]

Welcome back to the Repto Rando Fun Show!!!!! Tonight's episode: "One of these is not like the others"

EVELYN was being cheeky this evening and offered me a few questionable things I hadn't run yet, presumably as a dare. One of them was Roserade, which I liked but felt uncomfortable using, especially if I were going to run Stonjourner (which I usually also Iron Ball.) My reluctance didn't stem from Rosie being bad in TR, but rather because I already had the idiotic idea to run something on the same roll which is undeniably worse.

Yes, that's two Cabbie Navs back to back, and a shitty decision made on T2 of the Leon battle that probably actually did me a huge favor considering the way T3 played out. Mr. Rime is a spiteful bitch. If you notice nothing else, pay special attention to the second turn of the second Nav battle: can you say OUTPLAYED

Vid is normal speed because animations off at double time makes things supposedly harder to follow than they should be, but I did edit out a bunch of fluff (ie gmax morphing) and the dead periods where I contemplated move choices during the Nav2/Leon fights.

Additional bad ideas would be welcome at this time.