TEAM NACHTMUSIK - SUSPECT STALL

TEAM NACHTMUSIK

Eine Kleine Nachtmusik was written by Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart. This team is designed to reflect the beauty of this piece. My team is dynamic and at times capable of subtlety but at others it is ferocious and violent much like the music. Enjoy.

This is a team that i have used to great success on the suspect ladder. Having played a large amount of rain offense on the suspect ladder i decided it was time for something new. I love stall and decided it was the perfect time to once again indulge in the beautiful art. This is your typical stall team but i like to think i have varied the theme and created a cohesive team with great synergy that also has a great win ratio. Im currently 3rd on the leaderboard.

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Abomasnow (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Snow Warning
EVs: 252 HP/4 Atk/252 SDef
Sassy nature (+SDef, -Spd)
- Leech Seed
- Wood Hammer
- Protect
- Blizzard
---
In the current climate a certain pokemon has taken advantage of their unparalelled ability to wall manaphy as such he makes a great addition to my team. Abomasnow laughs at all the suspects sets taking pitiful damage even after SR and can in return deal crushing blows
back with wood hammer. Easily beating perhaps the most dangerous crophy set by autohail to prevent hydration rest then leech seed helping and finally wood hammer finishing manaphy off. In this situation i often come out with more hp. So im covered on the subject of the suspect. As a lead Abomasnow functions well. He starts hail can protect on potential trick and attacks greatly easing prediction for me. Blizzard can score freezes and often causes serious damage. Whilst leech seed and protect can recover health whilst whittling down my opponent when in conjuction with spikes and stealth rock.


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Skarmory (M) @ Shed Shell
Ability: Keen Eye
EVs: 252 HP/252 Def/4 Spd
Impish nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Whirlwind
- Roost
- Spikes
- Drill Peck
---
Part 1 of the famed SkarmBliss combo central to most stall teams. The main use of this is to set up spikes and whirlwind for boosters
and to rack up spikes damage. On countering pokemon it can take on dddra, outraging mence and choice flygon being my only steel it is invaluable i dont lose it to magnezone so i opt to use shed shell and therfore use drill peck so i dont die in one turn. Forry could be used here instead but i prefer the roosting and whirlwinding capabilities of skarmory over rapid spin. Skarmory also takes tricks when ttar is down and uses its 4X resist to bug to take predicted U-Turns and crunches from Scizor and TTar respectively.


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Blissey (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 Def/252 SDef
Calm nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Wish
- Protect
- Seismic Toss
- Stealth Rock
---
Blissey is beauteous. If you dismiss her you havent lived as in experienced pokemon to the full. Blissey can counter the less annoying manaphy sets ie. tail glow as well as other special sweepers and sets up SR on them. I like to protect on physical sweepers /trickers taking prediction out of the element and easing switching to counters and racking up spikes damage and sr. Seismic toss provides me with reliable damage whilst wish can heal others but i rarely use it for that more for stalling out pp. Lastly blissey takes status well.

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Tyranitar (M) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spd
Jolly nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Crunch
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Fire Punch
---
This is my little gimic and perhaps the reason this team is so succesful. TTar can take scarfs pesky trick rotom-A and can provide some midgame suprises with ferocity by outspeeding many non speed set up sweepers and nailing them with his powerful attacks. Revenge killing the likes of SDlucario, MIX and SDinfernape, starmie and mixmence to name a few particularly the ape as this is the only thing on my team which can beat it. I like to use him on free switches to relieve some pressure from my walls by killing or scaring out gyarados and mence as well as other frail sweepers two pokemon one should be afraid of when running a stall team . TTar can also serve as a special wall in a pinch. I chose jolly so not to lower defense and therefore went with eq and fire punch. This also has another role to revenge kill rain teams as they will often not expect ttar to outspeed them when the rain is stopped with sandstorm.

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Gliscor (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Hyper Cutter
EVs: 252 HP / 40 Atk / 140 Def / 76 Spe
Impish nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Earthquake
- Taunt
- Roost
- Thunder Fang
---
Heracross Lucario, and TTar counter especially ddttar who was rife. Takes these 3 on who are otherwise cause havoc to my team. Can take the odd outrage too. Taunt on this is an excellent move and again is unexpected allowing me to prevent dual screeners and annoying cursers from cursing me, as well as sleep talkers and pokemon looking for a free set up (manaphy). It also plays havoc against stall. Thunder fang allows me to beat
gyarados tempted to switch in as if it fliches my rotom i can be in a serious problem.EVs have been working but better would probably help i prefer the defense so i can beat ttar otherwise ddtar would cause me severe problems as would Stone Edge from CBtar.

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Rotom-h @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP/252 Def/4 SDef
Bold (+Def, -Atk)
- Thunderbolt
- Will-o-wisp
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
---
I adore rotom's stalling capabilities and in the highly offensive metagame this is probably the best rotom set for stall. WoW makes dangerous physical attackers like scary Tyranitar turn into pathetic children. I tend to burn everything causing further residual damage on them. Thunderbolt dispatches gyarados as i can live all 1Dragon Dance hits bar flinches and crits and strike back for the KO as many gyarados users arent aware of this too which is nice. This takes status from other users. Rotom also takes on steels and exploder stalling out physical flinch jirachi burning metagross and beating even SD scizor though i have to be wary of the rare CM rachi.

I ended up not finding a space for manaphy but dont worry i have tested it i just cant find a place for it here.

Finally feel through to use, abuse and alter to your hearts content. Comments are highly appreciated but keep them sensible, EV specific comments are particularly helpful.
Please dont just say ice fang over thunder fang on gliscor. Put effort into your rate like i have put into this rmt. I have already havily tested this team and if you do have something to say please think about this.
Threat list on the way.

If any major changes need to be made grammatically PM me and i will fix them up.
 
Threat List

Toxic Spikes:These cause huge problems for me i dont really have anything to absorb or spin them away and they destroy my special walls if 2 layers get up. My best bet is to let abomasnow get poisoned (not badly poisoned) and hopefully kill manaphy so they are not using the toxic spikes fully to their advantage.


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Gengar: Sub set is very dangerous as blissey cannot break it if it has FP switch between blissey and gliscor. Revenge killed with Tyranitar.
Otherwise blissey tricks go to ttar.

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Blissey: Try and set up spikes with skarmory. Or taunt with gliscor.


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Gyarados: I have to go to rotom if rotom falls i can try skarmory but that is often unsuccesful without lefties.


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Tyranitar: Gliscor is my only chance really.
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Lucario: Straight to Gliscor and scare it out otherwise revenge it with ttar. If it has Ice Punch and not Crunch use Rotom-H.


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Heatran:Blissey revenge kill with TTar.

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Bronzong:Rotom-H and taunt with gliscor.

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Salamence:

---MixMence: Revenge kill with ttar. LO wears it down in conjuction with weather.
---DDMence: My team hates dd mence its basically just prediction to kill it. I try to use skarm bliss to force it to outrage that is my best bet. Then protect in the vain hope it will kill itself with confusion.
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Metagross:
Rotom-H is easily the best counter in the game taking on all sets and burning him.

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Infernape:
---All versions have to be revenge killed with tyranitar.
---------------------------------------------

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Weavile: Skarmory.
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Swampert: Abomasnow, Skarmory spikes.

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Skarmory: Rotom -H, Gliscor taunts.
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Gliscor: Skarmory sets up spikes ,rotom burns.

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Starmie: Offensive=Blissey. Spinner = rotom H.

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Celebi: Blissey and TTar revenges.

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Forretress: Very problematic as it can easily set up spikes against me and cause me severe problems with toxic spikes. However Rotom H scares it out and Gliscor can taunt it.

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Cresselia: Taunt this and then crunch.

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Togekiss: Tyranitar revenge kills.

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Heracross: Gliscor.

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Jirachi: Physical = Rotom. Special blissey then ttar.

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Breloom: Rotom + skarmory i can revenge kill with TTar.

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Vaporeon: Abomasnow and Blissey.

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Electivire: Rotom lols @ this.

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Hippowdon: Abomasnow and Skarmory sets up spikes gliscor can taunt.

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Azelf: Tyranitar for revenge kill rotom for explosion and blissey for general.

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Snorlax: Skarmory use Whirlwind. Gliscor use taunt.

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Mamoswine: Im afraid of endeavour and mix sets so i use rotom to counter this.
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Scizor:CB skarmory or Gliscor take U-Turns. SD burn it with rotom and thunderbolt it.

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Porygon-z: Blissey revenge kill with Tyranitar.

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Magnezone: Blissey or Rotom h.

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Yanmega: Blissey.

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Zapdos: Blissey or Tyranitar.


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Machamp: Rotom-H or Skarmory. But as usual can be problematic.

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Ninjask: Skarmory.

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Kingdra: Skarmory whirlwinds and ttar can revenge kill rain mixdras.

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Abomasnow: Blizzard it with abomasnow.


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Alakazam: Dual Screener is first so i always wood hammer as they light screen . Otherwise Blissey or TTar can take the trick.


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Aerodactyl: Quite problematic usually use Rotom or Skarmory.

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Raikou: Blissey
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Jolteon:Blissey

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Flygon:Skarmory flamethrowers to blissey i can burn scarf variants with rotom-H.

Is it OK if use EW's threat list.
 
This team is quite successful, since I have played it a few times. I'll get straight to the main issues.

You have Lucario covered nicely with both Gliscor and Rotom, but it seems that Salamence is a major pain for this team. Lucario and Salamence are basically the two things that dismantle stall teams, and you're falls prey to the latter.

After a DD, Salamence proceeds to hit every member of your team hard. If Skarmory falls via Fire Blast, you have nothing to stop it. Alternatively, if you are facing a MixMence, you will have a major problem bringing anything into its attacks. Sure Tyranitar can revenge-kill, but nothing can withstand the combination of Draco Meteor / Outrage / Fire Blast.

I feel that Gliscor is the weakest link on the team, basically providing extra-insurance against things like Scizor and Lucario, for whom you already have checks to as is. Something like Cresselia could benefit the team trememdously, giving you a Salamence check as well as possibly a screener. You say that Taunt helps you against opposing stall teams, yet it seems quite easy for one to set up spikes against the other members of this team (Skarmory can put a layer down against Blissey, Tyranitar, and your Skarmory, making Taunt virtually useless). If you really like, you can consider both Charge Beam and Ice Beam on the same set to deal with Gyarados and Salamence, as well as Reflect to support the team as a whole, and of course, Rest.

Hope some of this helped, good luck, and I enjoyed facing this team on suspect.

Edit - I forgot to mention, Gengar is a pain for this team, and without any special attacks on Blissey, you will end up losing to it more often than not. Sub Focus Punch variants defeat this team handily, easier than Salamence does lol. Is Wish + Protect really necessary for you? I mean, the only possible Pokemon you are healing are Abomasnow and Tyranitar, with the former being able to Leech Seed back some health, and the latter being a revenge-killer. Consider something like Flamethrower for Blissey, especially if you see a rise in Gengar on the suspect ladder. For now though, I'd leave it as is. Just future food-for-thought.
 
Why do you use Impish on rotom instead of Bold? You're reducing your Sp.attack by doing so.
 
I've faced this team several times on the suspect ladder, and I can say that is a very good team. The two weather changers block every rain dance team and the suspect is stopped perfectly by Abomasnow and Blissey.
The only problem I see is swords dance Infernape which usually runs mach punch along with CC, fire punch and swords dance. If your gliscor is not at full health, that thing can OHKO every member of your team after a swords dance, and you can't revenge kill it with Tyranitar because of mach punch.
Overall I think this is a very well structured team and I compliment you for its creation.
 
I feel that Gliscor is the weakest link on the team, basically providing extra-insurance against things like Scizor and Lucario, for whom you already have checks to as is. Something like Cresselia could benefit the team trememdously, giving you a Salamence check as well as possibly a screener.

The only major problem with this is that i will have no ttar counter who will procced to 2hko everything in my team with Stone Edge if choiced. And if a dancer my problems will be worse. Worse TTar will be able to set up on Cresselia leaving me even more vulnerable.

Edit - I forgot to mention, Gengar is a pain for this team, and without any special attacks on Blissey, you will end up losing to it more often than not. Sub Focus Punch variants defeat this team handily, easier than Salamence does lol. Is Wish + Protect really necessary for you? I mean, the only possible Pokemon you are healing are Abomasnow and Tyranitar, with the former being able to Leech Seed back some health, and the latter being a revenge-killer. Consider something like Flamethrower for Blissey, especially if you see a rise in Gengar on the suspect ladder. For now though, I'd leave it as is. Just future food-for-thought.

Flamethrower on blissey is a really good idea and one I will likely consider. Blissey never heals anything but wish is more for the protect wish combo. Protect being the real bonus here. I had an idea myself to try and fix my problems by including another sandstorm inducer namely Hippowdon who is capable of taking on Lucario,Tyranitar and even Salamence to some extent i will test this out in the near future probably. Thanks alot for your help ToF.

In regards to:

Why do you use Impish on rotom instead of Bold? You're reducing your Sp.attack by doing so.

Yeah this is a mistake i wonder i fi have been running this the whole time. I also had to edit out 40Sp A EV's on Blissey. LOL.

The only problem I see is swords dance Infernape which usually runs mach punch along with CC, fire punch and swords dance. If your gliscor is not at full health, that thing can OHKO every member of your team after a swords dance, and you can't revenge kill it with Tyranitar because of mach punch.

Infernape's are very problematic but dont really run 2 fighting moves they run the set Fire Punch/Flare Blitz, Mach Punch and Stone Edge. or forgo Mach Punch for CC. So if im lucky i should be able to beat a variant without Mach Punch. Luckily SDnape is rare for some reason.

Thanks guys for the help.
 
Gliscor's nature is all wrong. Running a Jolly nature with no Speed investment is a waste.

If you're relying on him to counter Jolly Ice Punch Lucario you're looking for Jolly 252 HP / 40 Def / 216 Spe. Otherwise just go with Impish 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def (or more Atk at the expense of Def if you'd prefer).

Just to demonstrate the wastefulness of your current set-up, at the moment you have:

354 HP / 236 Atk / 340 Def / 248 Spe

If you were to switch over to Impish 252 HP / 40 Atk / 96 Def / 88 Spe you'd have the exact same spread (you'd actually have one more Def point as it's a bonus number) only with 34 EVs remaining to spend as you see fit.
 
Gliscor's nature is all wrong. Running a Jolly nature with no Speed investment is a waste.

If you're relying on him to counter Jolly Ice Punch Lucario you're looking for Jolly 252 HP / 40 Def / 216 Spe. Otherwise just go with Impish 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def (or more Atk at the expense of Def if you'd prefer).

Just to demonstrate the wastefulness of your current set-up, at the moment you have:

354 HP / 236 Atk / 340 Def / 248 Spe

If you were to switch over to Impish 252 HP / 40 Atk / 96 Def / 88 Spe you'd have the exact same spread (you'd actually have one more Def point as it's a bonus number) only with 34 EVs remaining to spend as you see fit.

Yeah i was going to run the Lucario outspeed spread but i ended up preferring my erroneous spread as I had a lot more defense to survive against TTar and never got round to fixing up the nature. I mainly wanted it to outspeed Bulky Gyarados. And i was certainly never outsped so it seemed to work well. What speed investments will allow me to outspeed x dangerous sweepers around that speed tier except for base 90's? Also are those attack ev's really necessary for anything.
Thanks a lot for the new spread i'll edit in the changes.

It would also be really helpful if you could link me to where you got the information on the EV's as right now im appaling with them.

Once again thanks.
 
I wasn't neccesarily suggesting that as a new spread - I was just using it to illustrate how ineffective your current one was (remember that it's 34 EVs short!)

The Atk EVs aren't really neccesary for anything specific...they don't guarantee any OHKOs or 2HKOs to my knowledge but it's nice to have a little added bite (PS Use Stone Edge over Thunder Fang to hit Salamence and Zapdos as well)

What speed investments will allow me to outspeed x dangerous sweepers around that speed tier except for base 90's?

36 Spe brings you to 235, outspeeding the new Bulky Gyara spread.

56 Spe brings you to 240, outspeeding Adamant Breloom and any weird max speed Metagross.

76 Spe brings you to 245, outspeeding Jolly Tyranitar and other shit like Celebi and Zapdos that sit at 244 in order to outspeed Jolly Tar themselves.

216 EVs beats Adamant Lucario.

236 EVs beats + nature 80 basers like Mamoswine and Medicham.

Take your pick.
 
Thanks Lee for these EV recomendations.
Ive gone with the spread
Impish 252 HP / 40 Atk / 140 Def / 76 Spe
I wonder what you think about this spread or is there a more optimal spread.
Also can you link me to where you got this knowledge on" optimal spreads"
and "bonus points" or anyone else for that matter.
 
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