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Metagame Tera Override

about15gals said:
fun metagame, built this team https://pokepast.es/a73d61a37a281894 but i'm noticing tera fairy sand stream isnt boosting fairies spdef? assuming this is a similar bug to the snow one
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we did actually figure this out: at the moment, weather ball, terrain pulse, and snow/sand boosts do not show the tooltips properly, but they do work. for example, if a tera ground pokemon uses weather ball in rain, it will function as a ground-type move, but the move box will still show it as being water-type. similarly, if tera fairy tyranitar sets sand and iron valiant comes in afterwards, the tooltip will not show iron valiant's sp.def as green and bolded with the increased number, but the boost is taken into account during damage calculation.
 
Just wanna say thanks for makin the sample teams, Gunch. Been usin the sun enamorous team (edit: that's the only one gunch didn't make oops, thanks sheepie) to test the ladder. Will say I've still encountered people having difficulty keeping track of information regarding weather and rocks. Less important than fixing the more pressing shit of course but i do wonder if there's an easy way to alleviate that.
 
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polarr (dookieisfunny) said:
I'm not gonna sugarcoat it.
Physical Wall

View attachment 776128

Houndstone @ Leftovers
Ability: Fluffy
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Impish Nature
- Pain Split
- Will-O-Wisp
- Poltergeist
- Protect

(thats if this works like how I want it too)
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I'd say tera normal is probably better here unless you use body press. Scrappy doesn't work so it's not like you're gonna get boombursted to death and tera normal also lets you dodge special ghost attacks you can't tank which does come up because gholdengo is quite good.
 
I'm going to sugarcoat it.
Physical WallBREAKER!

cinder.png
MESSI RONALDO (Cinderace) (M) @ Liechi Berry
Ability: Blaze
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Endure
- Reversal
- Pyro Ball
- Sucker Punch

+1 252 Atk Tera Fighting Cinderace Helping Hand Reversal (200 BP) vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Corviknight: 471-555 (118 - 139%) -- guaranteed OHKO (Helping Hand to simulate Blaze being Active)
+1 252 Atk Cinderace Helping Hand Reversal (200 BP) vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Scizor: 451-531 (131.4 - 154.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
I like blaze :)

edit:
I will add a silly replay!
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9teraoverride-2454523445
 
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gulch said:
yes, for example: dry skin with tera fire puts fire in both slots, so you're immune to fire and therefore have no added weakness (weather interactions work as normal)

council is aware of several bugs atm, but please report anything you find!! things we're already aware of include:
- Stone Axe takes into account opposing pokemon's tera type, not the user's.
- Sun and Rain x1.5 buff the types and give (x0.5) nerf to only Water
- Weather Ball and Terrain Pulse don't care who set the weather/terrain, as long as the field effects are there, they will be 100 BP with active pokemon's tera type.
- Wind Power is bugged, lets go of the Charge status immediately after acquiring it.
- Ground Rocks hitting Ground immune Pokemon, both naturally and through abilities
- Flower Veil isn't preventing status
- Snow defense boost seems to not be working consistently
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Flower veil doesnt block drops either.
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9teraoverride-2455001673-8ey4barwy4j8i5e2n30t2x2kfvvkr9hpw
Shadow ball lowered my spdef. (I would have lost either way)
 
Alr I think I found a glitch
1000000091.jpg

Also, while I don't have screenshots of them, liquid voice acted like normal on prim as well for some reason, even though I tried tera fighting and ground
 
This OM's fun, even if I needed to find a way to OHKO Ninetales-Alola turn 1 without giving myself a headache in the process.


From what I see on the watchlist,
:hawlucha:is fine. Honestly, I think it's boogeyman'd its way into looking like a threat. Mons like :scizor:, :ceruledge:, :raging-bolt: and Aqua Jet users can nuke it from orbit if it sets up unsafely, and mons like :pecharunt:, Flying tera :ceruledge:, Fighting tera :goodra-hisui: or :heatran:, or :zapdos: essentially turn it off. It's still very good, but most good teams should have a way to out it and other fast threats, whether through priority, a solid defensive wall, or never giving it the chance to ever click Swords Dance.

:ninetales-alola: :slowking: :slowking-galar: Snow Warning Aurora Veil is cheese, and a massive matchup fish, begging the opponent to OHKO you on the first turn. If you get off the Veil, great! You have a very good chance of winning on the spot vs. HO structures. If your opponent OHKOs you, or is mostly special attackers, then you're not doing so great! I don't like how fishy it is, but I'm finding ways to instakill Alolatales without compromising on anything, like scarf Flash Cannon :thundurus-therian:. Chilly Reception is fine. Setting up the weather is a nice benefit, but unless you're the madman using Icy Rock Glowking (like me!) then you're getting very limited use out of it, and likely making yours worse without a good defensive tera. And you can't set up Aurora Veil, and gets blocked by Taunt.

:kyurem: Really strong fundamentally, and I think it's kind of too strong at being able to come in whenever and click Freeze Dry willy-nilly. Snow buffing Dragon defense, under Screens, or under Terrain to buff Ice all contribute to it being overwhelming fundamentally. I don't like it.



On a positive note,
:ceruledge: This is the funniest fucking mon in the OM. Dark/Flying/Ground/Ghost are all completely viable Teras to run, giving immunities to Knock Off, :hawlucha:, Earthquake, and opposing :dragapult: :ceruledge: :gholdengo: respectively, and most of which (not so much on Ground) are pretty damn good types to tera into in a pinch. You can also just lure and run Weak Armor, and what's your opponent going to do? Click Knock Off into a potential immunity?






Oh, and I may have made a spreadsheet for all of the Hawlucha Flying Press type combos. I got bored. IMHO Ground, Ice, and Rock are the way to go. Tera Fighting Press SHOULD work like a force multiplier, given that's how it worked in Revelationmons, but I've got no idea.
 
alright, been playing for a bit, wanna talk about some stuff i've seen and tried out

:excadrill:
very cool anti-meta pick, mold breaker is extremely good with heatran-ground running around everywhere, has access to spin and rocks which affords it great role compression and can also be used on sand archetypes that have been taking off a bit since you can get the sp.def boost on top of sand rush making you faster. your base speed being a bit awkward into offense kinda sucks, and rillaboom being popular means that you have to deal with your main source of damage getting cut sometimes, but i think this is really useful for a lot of comps that are looking to beef up the hazard game and provide some sorely missed defensive utilities in one pick.

:gardevoir:
trace shenanigans are really funny! not too much else to say, being able to take advantage of most of the dumb bullshit going on is nice and scarf hits a nice speed tier. stealing immunity abilities can suddenly get really bad for your opponent. access to great utility with trick and healing wish, deals pretty solid damage, and can even opt into setup cheese if you really want to (although i think there are plenty of other options that are just better at that). not excellent or anything but it's definitely viable.

:latias:
this motherfucker is gross LMAO, cm agility stored power sets get a lot dumber when you have access to dragon snow, makes weakness policy much easier to trigger too. you have to run an actual immunity for this if you wanna stop it from bulldozing too, levitate doesn't interact with the meta so trace won't cut it. has insane coverage too, so i imagine we'll be able to see it continuously tech for whatever comes up as the premier counter to it. keeping a very close eye on it personally.

:hawlucha:
echoing the above, it's good but kinda mid compared to what we expected out of it. flying press is bad. however, when you blow shit up, you REALLY blow shit up. just excellent at getting that one big swing off and opening up a hole and can even follow up on its own leads with setup variants. priority makes it kinda hard to just run away with games and thankfully stuff like raging bolt has already proven to be strong, looking like it's just "something you need to keep in mind" and not some game breaking threat.

:kyurem:
of two minds here, on the one hand i've come to the conclusion that freeze-dry isn't as omnipotent as expected since kyurem-steel has a lot of trouble hitting waters and heatran, which pretty much hard counters it, is nearly universal across non-HO structures. having to run focus blast just to hit what seems to be the most common mon in the meta is not swagalicious if i do say so myself. however, outside of that one problem, it's still really strong, and has access to all of the options it does in standard OU play that have made it an extremely controversial presence there while also being able to take advantage of tera weather and custom weather ball. this is to say NOTHING of dragon dance variants which i admittedly have not spent much time with. don't think this will stay a healthy presence as the meta develops and still very wary of it but not quite ready to pull the trigger.

:ceruledge:
i think it's kinda mid, this is the Potential Man of this meta to me LOL. feels like you're really torn between using an immunity ability and weak armor for your stupid cheese bullshit. also doesn't really love most of the common rocks types being stuff it's weak to and the item slot on this mon is also HEAVILY contested between boots or something to help with your burst potential. it IS really scary if it gets going though, and the stab priority is nice to have on deck, i'm just not entirely convinced this is a meta defining presence.

:bombirdier:
mamoswine 2 is super obnoxious, rocky payload is just pseudo-adaptability on either of your stabs and makes this motherfucker HURT. however, the speed tier is super awkward into offense, and you don't have much to do on that front except sucker punch. item slot is also, again, heavily contested (gem, boots, scarf) and holds it back from realizing its full potential often. also has severe competition from hawlucha as a flying attacker. the numbers are absurd but i think it's hard to depict this in a way that reflects the actual in-game nuances surrounding it.

:araquanid:
it's bad LOL, the depth of movepool isn't there so you're not really able to exploit water bubble as much as you'd like, and HO honestly has better things to be doing than webs with how easy veil/weather/terrain cheese is to accomplish and how many mons end up running boots out of fear of rainbow rocks. just not worth the time at all.

:florges:
this will be good once it works i promise

:raging bolt: :rillaboom: :tornadus-therian: :dragonite: :darkrai: :glimmora: :great tusk:
not much to say about these but i do wanna put on the record that i think they're good
 
I think stealth rock might be too much as of right now

I know Pokémon has stockholmed people into not even questioning the absurdity of stealth rock these days myself included but with it being able to be multiple types its just crazy. Stealth rock being able to be better typing than rock and have multiple potential typing's has led to damn near every mon that normally doesn't run boots to want to greatly consider the pros of using it. It ignores immunities when factoring in the damage also. So for example a ground type stealth rock would hit Corv for 25% bc flying doesn't resist ground and steel is weak to ground. It can lead to many trapping scenarios where u can just say no to one of ur checks. For example a knock off/rapid spin/headlong rush/ stealth rock Tusk could click stealth rock. Corv taking little from knock and immunity to ground makes it a safe switch in to where it can either u turn for momentum or defog but since great tusk tera type is ground, Corv takes 25% from stealth rock and is put in a scenario of either having to defog from not wanting to take 25% again leaving itself and/or other mons weak to ground on your team vulnerable or clicking u turn so it you don't lose hard momentum from the Tusk switching into a mon that applies pressure to your Corv. Well some people might just say ok just boots on Corv. The problem with that it can be a wide possibility of good offensive types. Ice stealth rock would chip 50% of Gliscor's and Lando's hp and would chip 25% of Tusk, Ting-Lu, and Bolt's hp. The ability to be able to snipe certain types in a gen where hazard removal isn't as consistent as it should be on such a wide spread and common move to click is just too much in my eyes right now. Especially with how knock off is even more of a free click now that u know even if something that can reliably switch on you with boots suddenly cant but most times having to because its the check on their team for that mon. Another thing people might say is oh just use an immunity ability with knock off so u have an absorber. That would be a genuine point if the main knocker of gen 9 beats MOST of them regardless of their immunity type. Tusk has multiple ways to hit mons like Ceru, Clodsire, and Heatran for super effective or not letting it block knock off and one its strong ground stabs at the same time.


Now im not saying just go straight for it and auto ban it right now but i will put out there that if it does turn out more people start noticing it and it does get banned i told u so
 
Was Corrosion intentionally left off the list of affected abilities? Its description on Showdown says "This Pokemon can poison or badly poison a Pokemon regardless of its typing", but the in-game description says "The Pokémon can poison the target even if it’s a Steel or Poison type."
 
chartung17 said:
Was Corrosion intentionally left off the list of affected abilities? Its description on Showdown says "This Pokemon can poison or badly poison a Pokemon regardless of its typing", but the in-game description says "The Pokémon can poison the target even if it’s a Steel or Poison type."
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admittedly don't know how this functions as it hasn't been tested to my knowledge, but the most effect it would have is forcing you to run tera poison/steel on salazzle since glimmora is always gonna be running toxdebris anyways
 
just a question i wanted to be answered
Hawlucha @ Normal Gem
Ability: Unburden
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Flying Press
- Acrobatics
- U-turn
- Swords Dance
would normal gem activate if i used flying press? cause flying press does take the users tera type into the effectiveness of the move, but doesnt make the move that type, so normal gem wouldnt activate unless my tera type was fighting
just wanted to ask here so i can see if my thought process is correct or not
 
MeevinMelvin said:
just a question i wanted to be answered
Hawlucha @ Normal Gem
Ability: Unburden
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Flying Press
- Acrobatics
- U-turn
- Swords Dance
would normal gem activate if i used flying press? cause flying press does take the users tera type into the effectiveness of the move, but doesnt make the move that type, so normal gem wouldnt activate unless my tera type was fighting
just wanted to ask here so i can see if my thought process is correct or not
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no, for all intents and purposes when interacting with items flying press is treated as a pure fighting type move, this can be seen in vanilla gameplay as even when a flying-weak pokemon holding a coba berry takes supereffective damage from flying press the berry does not activate, nor does it take into account boosts from sky plate/sharp beak
 
readytolose said:
I have some clarifying questions about Toxic Spikes.

- If a Fire (or whatever) Tera Pokemon uses Toxic Spikes, and an opposing Fire-type switches in, does that pokemon become poisoned as well as clearing the spikes? Or does it just clear them?
- If a Flying Tera Pokemon uses Toxic Spikes and a Flying-type switches in, would it clear the spikes? They are not grounded and therefore unaffected by the spikes. What if they hold an Iron Ball?
- What if it’s Steel Tera? Same thing, or…?
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- the fire type would clear the tspikes on switchin and not be poisoned
- Only grounded flying types can absorb flying-tera tspikes, and only on switchin. the only way to achieve this is with an iron ball. This makes flying type tspikes virtually unabsorbable, so this is probably viable.
- Steel tera tspikes funtion identically to all other types except flying. if a grounded steel switches in, the tspikes are removed and the grounded steel is not poisoned. poison and steel types can switch in on any tspikes and not be poisoned because they are immune to poison but will only absorb the tspikes if they are poison or steel tera tspikes respectively
 
I'm testing a beartic team with ice boosting rain and terrain. However when the setup is finished my beartic does * 1.0 damage for some reason, what am i doing wrong here?


Cinderace @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Libero
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Pyro Ball
- Court Change
- U-turn
- Will-O-Wisp

Kyurem @ Choice Specs
Ability: Pressure
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Ice Beam
- Freeze-Dry
- Tera Blast

Rillaboom @ Terrain Extender
Ability: Grassy Surge
Tera Type: Ice
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Grassy Glide
- Wood Hammer
- U-turn
- Knock Off

Beartic @ Life Orb
Ability: Swift Swim
Tera Type: Ice
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Icicle Crash
- Close Combat
- Liquidation
- Swords Dance

Pelipper @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Drizzle
Tera Type: Ice
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpA
Bold Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Hurricane
- U-turn
- Roost

Kingdra @ Life Orb
Ability: Swift Swim
Tera Type: Ice
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Ice Beam
- Surf
- Draco Meteor
- Flip Turn
 
chi yuh yuh said:
I'm testing a beartic team with ice boosting rain and terrain. However when the setup is finished my beartic does * 1.0 damage for some reason, what am i doing wrong here?


Cinderace @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Libero
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Pyro Ball
- Court Change
- U-turn
- Will-O-Wisp

Kyurem @ Choice Specs
Ability: Pressure
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Ice Beam
- Freeze-Dry
- Tera Blast

Rillaboom @ Terrain Extender
Ability: Grassy Surge
Tera Type: Ice
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Grassy Glide
- Wood Hammer
- U-turn
- Knock Off

Beartic @ Life Orb
Ability: Swift Swim
Tera Type: Ice
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Icicle Crash
- Close Combat
- Liquidation
- Swords Dance

Pelipper @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Drizzle
Tera Type: Ice
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpA
Bold Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Hurricane
- U-turn
- Roost

Kingdra @ Life Orb
Ability: Swift Swim
Tera Type: Ice
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Ice Beam
- Surf
- Draco Meteor
- Flip Turn
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Tera Ice Rain nerfs Ice-type moves by 25% (since Rain buffs Water & ALSO nerfs Fire). You should use Tera Stellar to create an ordinary Rain, or some other tera type if there's a specific type you want to nerf.
 
OK, there seems to be a lot of conflicting answers circling around. Currently, stellar works like any other type in the game and does not give you the old mechanics. This could be byproduct of coding and how it is implemented, but yes it is a deviation from the original premise and we're looking into it.

Edit: This is updated in the OP, under FAQ regarding stellar.
 
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Dawn's Piplup said:
OK, there seems to be a lot of conflicting answers circling around. Currently, stellar works like any other type in the game and does not give you the old mechanics. This could be byproduct of coding and how it is implemented, but yes it is a deviation from the original premise and we're looking into it.

Edit: This is updated in the OP, under FAQ regarding stellar.
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what a shame. Guess we have stellar weather ball now, though. And rocks. Stellar rocks is kinda dumb.

Stellar soak could also be funny. “Hey nice stab and resistances you got there. It’d be a real shame…”

Anyways what if you had stab on the 100 base power unresisted move :3

Greninja @ Choice Specs
Ability: Protean
Tera Type: Stellar
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Dark Pulse
- Weather Ball
- Surf
- U-turn
 
Crep50 said:
what a shame. Guess we have stellar weather ball now, though. And rocks. Stellar rocks is kinda dumb.

Stellar soak could also be funny. “Hey nice stab and resistances you got there. It’d be a real shame…”

Anyways what if you had stab on the 100 base power unresisted move :3

Greninja @ Choice Specs
Ability: Protean
Tera Type: Stellar
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Dark Pulse
- Weather Ball
- Surf
- U-turn
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Stellar soak fails (same as how it works with conversion + variants I guess), stellar rocks does work but you need terastallization to see the 25% reduction.
 
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