No,
HO teams inherently have limited defensive options in exchange fo
r greater versatility in offensive win-cons and pressure. HO teams will often rely on
fragile defensive options such as priority, screens and items like sash/choice scarf to respond to offensive pressure. Otherwise,
HO teams will rely on predictions and good positioning of their offensive pieces to
establish their own offensive pressure first and force the opponent to play defensively. Due to this, HO teams (especially versus other HO or frail offense teams) can easily lose games due to
the loss of key offensive/defensive pieces which can result from anything from an incorrect lead to a misprediction on tera. Let's take the
HO vs HO replay mentioned above. In this game at turn 1 "ATKerrr" positioned their chi-yu to take offensive pressure early, ChiefGreenLeaf did not account for this and their team lacked an actual chi-yu switch-in (they had to
lead with something which could threaten chi-yu) and was immediately forced to sacrifice a potential offensive/defensive option (Iron hands). Losing iron hands may not seem like a big deal here, but as we can see from the end game (turns 29-31),
iron hands would have been perfectly able to tank any +1 hit from dragapult ( +1 252+ Atk Dragon Fang Dragapult Dragon Darts (2 hits) vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Iron Hands: 288-338 (56.2 - 66%) -- approx. 2HKO ) and revenge kill it. Aside from a healthy iron hands,
Cheif's team had no real counterplay to dragapult if it had the opportunity to setup even if it was a more standard tera type such as ghost. Iron hands also had great offensive pressure, forcing mons like corviknight and chi-yu to switch if it caught them on a free switch/ double switch.
I want to stress that HO teams
will naturally have poor matchups or be unable to respond to set-up pressure (e.g. sticky web vs a trick room team or a DD dragapult). Poor positioning/failure to keep your useful offensive/defensive options healthy will cause an early loss,
this is not new. Teams which
lack reliable defensive options for set-up pressure (e.g. most HO teams) will naturally be forced to rely on preventing the enemy setting up in the first place, or relying saving health on potential defensive wincons in order to prevent suckerpunch 50/50s or tera 50/50s. If HO teams where
the only defensive option is indeedee psychic terrain fail reliably cover the rare sucker punch DD dragapult if it has tera available, then so be it, either re-build the team to have a better defensive options such as priority, screens or hazard stack or use a more balanced build with an unaware mon ( skeledirge (with tera) or dondozo) or use a reliable phazer like ting-lu.
You have outlined some basic stuff here as far as team archetypes, and you know what you're talking about for the most part. However, it doesn't feel as if you play a lot of pure HO from your post.
Let me illustrate some things you seemingly are unaware of.
Apologies in advance if you are aware of some or all of these things, but it doesn't seem like you are.
As something as a HO expert I can tell you right now that we do whatever it takes to late game clean: sacking/sacrificing in multiple ways, either switching in on moves that kill or staying in on moves that kill. All we care about is the late game- we want mons chipped so they are in range, we want sashes gone, we want all threatening priority gone. All we care about is getting in our threat. Reverse sweeping is one of the reasons I enjoy HO so much- it feels cinematic.
Before the game started
I knew what I needed to accomplish to win: Keep hazards off for Polteageist, find room to set up with Polteageist while psychic terrain is up, and clean with my scarf Chien-Pao once/if psy terrain ran out.
And I did it. I analyzed my opponent's team, found this was the best win-con and executed it perfectly.
As you can see on turn 27- I even predicted Sucker Punch. I had this guy cooked, I was in his head the entire game.
I knew scarf Pao had the win at that point- Pult was either banded Sucker or Dance, but it didn't matter.
Unless they had Terra-Dark Pult- which even if I did know that was the case- it still forces a 50/50.
Ghost:
252 Atk Chien-Pao Crunch vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Dragapult affected by Sword of Ruin: 218-260 (132.9 - 158.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Dark:
252 Atk Chien-Pao Sacred Sword vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Dragapult affected by Sword of Ruin: 328-388 (200 - 236.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Sacking is actually a tool, because as you stated HO does not have much in the way of defensive counter measures.
In a non-Terra meta my win condition would have been much different.
I would have put more stock in Iron Hands, but since Terra exists, my best choice for a late game backbone was Pao to clean.
I say since Terra exists, because Poltea is much more useful as a sweeper with Terra-fighting.
In fact, without Terra, my entire team and strategy would change- anyway, I digress.
Your analysis of my gameplay is flawed, so I'm outlining the goals I had for this game so you can better understand.
"ChiefGreenLeaf did not account for this and their team lacked an actual chi-yu switch-in (they had to lead with something which could threaten chi-yu
"
I did account for this. My only goal, as I said, was to position myself where 1) No hazards up 2) Psy Terrain up.
I don't care what Chi-Yu does to my team, it's just another mon that dies once I set up.
I lead with Indee to get psy terrain up first- to stop parting shot/taunt.
If they lead Glim then I go Hatt.
If they lead anything else I go Iron Hands for the sack then scare out with next mon, which I did.
Good HO is actually very textbook. Sack X to bring in Y. I win the exact same way several games a day, sometimes in a row.
For example, countless times have I let something die to Band Rilla in Gen 8 to bring in Celesteela to set up and sweep.
And many times with this team I played with in the replay, the same exact scenarios occur: Get psy terrain up, healing wish on a slower Phys attacker, send in Poltea and set up.
Another flawed perspective: "Cheif's team had no real counterplay to dragapult if it had the opportunity to setup"
HO gives very little breathing room for the opponent. Pult, as you see, had no chances to set up. It doesn't matter if this team can't handle +1 Pult if Pult can't find room to do so. Also, Sucker is not rare on Pult, it's a mainstay on both Band and Dance.
Another confusing take of yours: "either re-build the team to have a better defensive options such as priority, screens or hazard stack or use a more balanced build with an unaware mon ( skeledirge (with tera) or dondozo) or use a reliable phazer like ting-lu."
My brother in Christ- I'm playing HO lol.
This is how I know you don't actually play much HO or fully understand the playstyle in the actual game, and not on paper.
This team has no defensive backbone for a reason-
Keep hazards off for Polteageist, find room to set up with Polteageist while psychic terrain is up, and clean with scarf Chien-Pao once psy terrain ran out.
That's it- that's literally how this team is played, and to do it successfully you need to be a good HO player, one that positions successfully.
And I did that.
If it's not clean with Scarf Pao, it's take out last mon with Iron Hands, or some small variation like take out a mon early and clean sweep with Poltea.
or Scarf Moth, or Hands, or even set up and win with Hatt. It just depends on my opponent's team. In this case, I choose the win-con I've laid out before you.
I literally only need 1-2 mons to win, all the rest do is support. They chip HP, cripple mons, set up certain conditions, etc.
That's HO. That's how it's played.
An entire game in Gen 8 would be my team chipping/crippling the other team for Scarf Kartana to sweep, as Chien-Pao should have done here.
Pure HO is mostly all glass cannons. You analyze which of these threats the opponent can't handle if all conditions are met such as getting certain mons in range or eliminating them. The rest of your mons are there to make that happen, even if that means doing nothing but dying.
In summary, Iron Hands, in this matchup, might as well have been a Magikarp. It's just there to allow positioning.
From all my years of playing Singles Showdown OU, I did what a HO team is supposed to do, and did it successfully, yet lost due to a terrible gimmick that lets my opponent undo all the work I did positioning my team for a win.
I can't speak with 100% certainty on what other playstyles Terra invalidates, but I know Hyper Offense, and I know the goals of this archetype, and when I execute them successfully and lose only due to a gimmick, then that's a huge problem.
Let me know if there's any other confusion you want me to clear up.
I ignored a lot of other hot takes because they were nonsense, but I respect your post and you as a player so I wanted to give you a fair response.
As soon as we start getting into mental gymnastics on if I should have predicted Dark Terra Pult and Sacred Sword there, then I'm gonna dismiss any counter-arguments.
Again, even if I had a feeling it was Dark, or if we implement something where I know it's Dark-
it still forces a 50/50, which is unhealthy, and uncompetitive.
Late game Sucker Punch mind games can be fun once in awhile- but when it happens every game, that's a really stupid meta to play.
Why did I do all that work to position a win, and again I did so perfectly, for it to come down to a guessing game?
I want to play Pokémon, not Heads or Tails.
My opponent didn't play better than me, I was in control the entire game. I predicted my opponent several times. I accomplished all my goals I set out to do when building the team and only lost because my opponent had a "tech".
If you or anyone wants to respond, please please please focus on the 50/50 argument I'm laying out very clearly. Do not focus on the game anymore since I've fully illustrated my goals and win condition. Everything, every play that game, was all for turn 19. Any other meta, I won that game on that turn. If there was no terra, then my sweeper would not have been Fighting Terra Poltea, it would have been something else, and still swept and/or put big enough holes in their team so Pao could sweep.
I did nothing wrong in that replay, trust me. Focus on the 50/50 aspect of my argument, please.