You going to mention names or we just going to do inflammatory rhetoric?
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Serious The Politics Thread
- Thread starter Oglemi
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You going to mention names or we just going to do inflammatory rhetoric?
I'm not going to position myself in line with some other participants in this discussion and I don't agree with the general idea that Democrats and Republicans need to be equally resisted when one of them objectively seeks to do more damage than the other, but this line of questioning borders way too closely on sealioning for my tastes. It's a bit like expecting people to name every single IDF soldier who committed a war crime in Gaza before stating that there's a genocide going on there. There are plenty of Democrats who avidly support sending weapons and money to Israel and those weapons and that money is being used to kill Palestinians. Do you want names for each and every one of them before you're willing to see what is obvious for most people?
You can debate whether or not describing this as Democrats personally killing Palestinians is accurate (the fact that there's even room to debate this should be appalling enough) but if you hand a man a gun and he uses that gun to commit a murder, you're an accessory in that crime at the very least. Even more so if he's already commited several murders in front of you and told you blatantly that he intends to keep committing them. It's not a distinction that matters very much in the big picture; Democrats are responsible for Palestinian deaths. That's something you need to reckon with instead of denying.
Disagree that the distinction doesn't matter. There are Democrats in this thread. Are they mass murderers? I didn't make the comment.
"Democrats are murdering Palestinians with glee" is both inaccurate and inflammatory as hell. It's surprising that level of trolling is even allowed in the thread. It is supposed to be a serious topic.
Given that elected Democrat officials are voting to send more military aid to Israel and a Democratic President continuously caves to Netanyahu's demands, it is not inaccurate or particularly inflammatory. Its pretty clear that there wasn't a smug finger being pointed at every single poster in this thread who votes left saying that WE PERSONALLY are killing Palestinian babies. Come on.
It can also be argued "with glee" isn't inaccurate or inflammatory, as notorious "didn't care enough to wear real clothes so as to make the Senate Dress Code change" John Fetterman, made sure to dress up in full suit and tie for Netanyahu's address to Congress.
Responsible dialogue means not indiscriminately throwing around allegations of mass murder. If you want to lay such a charge, either be specific or don't post bullshit like "Democrats are murdering Palestinians with glee."
I wholeheartedly agree with you that Palestinian civilians deserve humanitarian aid and Israel needs to be heavily sanctioned to stop the current pattern of genocide. I'm just pointing out that this isn't a realistic idea in the current political landscape.
This is disingenuous. It is readily apparent that lily was using the term "Democrats" to refer specifically to politicians aligned with the Democratic Party, as everyone else in this thread has been doing this entire time, rather than everybody who is affiliated with the party or votes for them.
At any rate, I'm really not sure what you expect to gain from continuing to engage with them. They're clearly just using this thread as a space to vent their anger and sadness at what is happening in Gaza, and they're almost definitely not going to present you with some sort of McCarthy-esque list of guilty politicians if you continue badgering them about it. If you think that the posts are irresponsible or inflammatory, you'd be better off taking it to the mods.
Democratic politicians will happily discuss humanitarian aid, but what they need to be discussing, and doing right now this instant, is stopping the endless flow of weapons to Israel. They refuse to do this because they are quite content for the slaughter to continue.
The rape, displacement, and murder of Palestinians must end, and the parties responsible--including the democratic party--must be dismantled forever, whatever it takes. If you personally want to sit on the sidelines as that happens because you view it as unrealistic, that is your business
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I'd love to see the fall of the two-party state more than anyone but we're a long, long way from that happening. It isn't going to happen in November; either Harris or Trump is going to win, not Jill Stein or whoever else. These two options are not equally bad as you seem to believe. Democrats at least pretend to tolerate leftists for the most part while the Trump campaign actively wants to roll back the rights of workers, women, and LGBTQ+ people. Which regime do you think it's going to be easier to dismantle both parties under? Which regime is more likely to veer back into McCarthyism and start black bagging leftists in the streets for their political activism? Personally, I'd rather operate under a Democrat regime and not have to worry about being thrown in the slammer for being a commie, or have all the progress we've made building working class unity over the past few years yanked out from underneath me because the Republicans legalized strikebreaking.
Trump is an embarrassment. I'd RIOT if he got back in office. a majority of the issues we had in yhe US when he was IN office still linger to this day. So its gonna be wild guess what he'll do if he gets re-elected, and thats not a good thing as someone had mentioned
You have a habit of saying absolutely nothing in all too many words, which is why I don't tend to respond to you after a certain point. There's no point continuing such conversations. The last time you responded to me, you typed up a flowery essay that boils down to "I don't like people hyping up Tim Walz and I won't vote for the Dem ticket, but I don't really care if you do". Your previous post before that was much the same, in essence, but aimed at hype around Harris instead of Walz. What more is there to discuss there? You didn't "deepen the conversation"; you actually made it shallower. You write your posts the way a high schooler writes an essay; you stretch every minute point into as much text as you possibly can to cover the fact that what you're saying doesn't really have that much substance. I can give you a token "fair enough, agree to disagree" if you want but dedicating an entire post to that serves no purpose.
In neither post did you address why you feel that a Democratic regime would be as bad as a Republican one to operate under as a leftist.
What you could have said is "I don't comprehend your posts," which you have now made very apparent. Whether that's my fault or yours, I guess we have to leave as a matter of perspective. What's strange is that you apparently think my posts suck and have no content, and yet you continue asking me questions and badgering me as if I'm going to give you a different response. It will be the same response. Sounds like a waste of time to me.
Anyway, here is a semi-relevant tweet from a Palestinian journalist in Gaza, so this post can have some good value to it:
Anyway, here is a semi-relevant tweet from a Palestinian journalist in Gaza, so this post can have some good value to it:
Theres like, no way out of it sadly. I'd rather have Kamala than Trump, Trump will make things 10x worse for Palestine knowing what we know about him up to this day.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I'm going to be so fucking smug when we both find ourselves in an internment camp because self-described "leftists" kicked up enough dust in the faces of the Democrats to let the Republicans run away with the election. I'm sure Trump will end the war in Gaza and hold all the Israeli war criminals to justice though, so it'll be worth it!
I'm going to be so fucking smug when we both find ourselves in an internment camp because self-described "leftists" kicked up enough dust in the faces of the Democrats to let the Republicans run away with the election. I'm sure Trump will end the war in Gaza and hold all the Israeli war criminals to justice though, so it'll be worth it!
If I end up an an internment camp for any reason, then so be it. It's literally nothing compared to the monstrousness of what the democrats are doing to Palestinians right now. I will never, ever, ever support them. Your attempts to scold me into supporting these psychopathic nazis will never work in a million years.
Whoever wins, we must do absolutely everything in our power to fight against them and end this madness.RodentTamer said:
I know this is a Pokémon forum and all, and I gotta be nice but....
You calling the Democrats Nazis while previously quoting Hamas and North Korean state media as fact while also writing walls of text explaining why terrorist civilian massacres at a music festival are okay because Palestine sad is pathetic. You've explained that somehow you live in hell despite living in a comfy first world nation and consistently seem to take some of the weirdest most stereotypical far left views I have ever seen.
Every single one of your posts contributes absolutely nothing to the discussion, generally boiling down to you waiting for the discussion to move away from Palestine for you to jump in and quote some garbage Twitter propaganda to reshape the discussion to what you want. Generally people don't reply to you because you will just dump wall of texts that contribute nothing.
I'll make you a deal buddy. If you never post in this thread ever again so will I. An honorable sacrifice from both of us. Come on friend, together we can set the world free.
You misread me if you think I don't want you to post in this thread. I'd like you to post as much as possibly, actually. I can come off as abrasive online, so it massively helps me make my points when the people who represent liberal ideology have as little credibility as possible. I stand by every single post I've made in this thread, especially the ones about Hamas and North Korea that you mention. I invite anyone to read the accurate posts I made on those topics if they want to, but for now that is not really the topic of discussion.
I have to say, the tone deafness and extremism inherent in American politics, speaking as an outsider, is just breath taking.
Yes, the Republicans would be awful for anyone supporting the Palestinian cause.
However "Genocide Joe" has literally armed the country carrying out the genocide and run almost daily cover for Israel whilst it's been carrying it out.
So the Democrats are actually in power, and are using every bit of leverage they have...on the defenceless Palestinians to enable Israel to take more and more land in Gaza and the West Bank.
That isn't debatable - it's happening, on the ground, right now, reported, with video and photographic evidence and every public statement from members of the IDF and Israeli War Cabinet. The current talk is of Israel maintaining the border with Egypt - this literally cuts off Gaza and the Palestinians from the rest of the world.
They've killed nearly 41,000 Palestinians, over 70% are women and children.
Polio is now in danger of becoming endemic.
Over 70% of the civilian infrastcuture is destroyed or damaged.
Palestinians are now cramped into just 11% of the total landmass of Gaza.
Think about this. 2.3 million people in an area the size of half of Heathrow airport. Living in squalor, without access to clean water, aid or food.
Sure, in theory, the Republicans would be worse from this point.
But the Democrats have in reality enabled exactly what the hard line, Zionist Republicans wanted in the first place.
Yes, the Republicans would be awful for anyone supporting the Palestinian cause.
However "Genocide Joe" has literally armed the country carrying out the genocide and run almost daily cover for Israel whilst it's been carrying it out.
So the Democrats are actually in power, and are using every bit of leverage they have...on the defenceless Palestinians to enable Israel to take more and more land in Gaza and the West Bank.
That isn't debatable - it's happening, on the ground, right now, reported, with video and photographic evidence and every public statement from members of the IDF and Israeli War Cabinet. The current talk is of Israel maintaining the border with Egypt - this literally cuts off Gaza and the Palestinians from the rest of the world.
They've killed nearly 41,000 Palestinians, over 70% are women and children.
Polio is now in danger of becoming endemic.
Over 70% of the civilian infrastcuture is destroyed or damaged.
Palestinians are now cramped into just 11% of the total landmass of Gaza.
Think about this. 2.3 million people in an area the size of half of Heathrow airport. Living in squalor, without access to clean water, aid or food.
Sure, in theory, the Republicans would be worse from this point.
But the Democrats have in reality enabled exactly what the hard line, Zionist Republicans wanted in the first place.
Tone deaf response there.
I wonder if you would have said the same thing about the Jewish populations that the Germans decimated in their own country and the surrounding states during WW2?
"Palestine sad" - what a dumb, uninformed, cold and thoughtless commentary on a literal ongoing mass displacement and genocide.
I think the total comms disaster has been avoided, at least in the context of the DNC. Wasn’t there at least some expectation the DNC would be “1968 part 2”? Protest organizers were hoping for between 30k and 50k for some of the marches and it seems the actual size was closer 5,000.
Same thing applies to you tbh. I say this in the nicest possible way but 99% of your posts say the exact same thing. You just info dump the exact same stats over and over twice per day as though it somehow proves what every single person in this thread already knows. Yes Israel bad, and repeating that to infinity doesn't do anything to help discussion in this forum.
Also you compared the war in Gaza to the holocaust just now? What is this, middle school debate class?
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It doesn’t help your points, your credibility, or the Palestinian cause to post saying you have “evidence” of your claims yet give no evidence because you fear that the evil moderators will ban you from posting said evidence.
Let me correct that for you:
“I invite anyone to read the unsourced posts I made on those topics if they want to, but for now that’s not really the topic of discussion because I think I’m right and you’re supposed to believe my view despite the total lack of evidence I provide.”
No, I asked you whether you would post similarly if you replaced Palestine and the Palestinians with the Jews in Germany during WW2.
And you know that is what I said, but you're a bad faith actor here, clearly. Go read my post again and answer properly, if you can.
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