Metagame USUM Pure Hackmons

[Child of Night]

I was gonna make an RMT for my Ho-Oh Stall team but I don't think I'm fully finished with building it aaaand my draft of it got deleted so I'm just gonna go a bit into how Ho-Oh can be useful in teambuilding. Another thing I want to mention before starting this is that Primal Kyogre basically does the same thing as Ho-Oh, but with better offensive stats and no Rock weakness. Their bulk is identical on the special side and Ho-Oh is slightly better on the physical side. Almost any statement made from hereon out can also be made for Primal Kyogre. The reason why I am not talking about the big fish over the big bird though is that I have more experience with one over the other and Ho-Oh is cooler :) (and fewer people use it).




HP 106
Attack 130
Defense 90
Sp. Atk. 110
Sp. Def. 154
Speed 90

Fire types are not really known for their defensive capabilities but in my opinion, Ho-Oh should not be used as an offensive mon. It is best suited to being a special wall with its 154 SpD stat that can also hit back the attacker with its 130 Atk stat.

You might already be screaming "Oh but it has a 4x stealth rock weakness, how can it be a wall?" well, It is quite simple. In a metagame where Magic Bounce Zygarde Complete and Mega Steelix exist and you can put defog on any defensive mon, it is not that hard to keep hazards off your side of the field. Yes, that means it can function only with a magic bouncer, but unless you are building an offense team, you shouldn't have a hard time fitting one on your team. The only way you will have issues keeping Rocks off the field is if the opponent has a No Guarder or Mold Breaker mon that can set Rocks which are not the most common and are usually not that long lived so that you can get rid of them most of the time pretty quickly. You can also run additional support with Defog on another defensive Pokemon. It might seem like a lot to have Defog and Magic Bounce on your team so Ho-Oh can function but you would likely have these things on a team anyway even without Ho-Oh on some teams so the cost of supporting Ho-Oh is not as high as it might seem.

The real question with using Ho-Oh isn’t just about keeping Rocks off—it's whether it's worth it at all. If your team needs a special wall and you can fit support for its needs then my answer would be that it's worth considering. I will not claim that Ho-Oh is the end-all-be-all special wall but it can do its job pretty consistently if used correctly.

It takes less than half from any non boosted Parental Bond Moongeist Beam and special Photon Geyser in the game while also resisting Sunsteel Strike. There are very few mons who have these traits and can use them as well as Ho-Oh since it is not weak to any common coverage (unless you are playing low ladder) unlike most defensive Pokemon making it far more consistent compared to a lot of other special walls out there. The only coverage Ho-Oh does fear however are the Z moves of Moongeist beam and Photon Geyser which can KO it if Ho-Oh was chipped and it is coming from a mon with a very high SpA stat at +2 but if you know it is coming in some way, it is possible outplay this scenario since CFZ moves only have 1 PP.

Another distinction from other special walls is its decent Attack stat. With 130 Atk it is possible to OHKO a Mega Gengar with spectral thief at +2 and deal a massive amount of damage to Mega Mewtwo Y. Even without a boost spectral thief can do a lot of damage to a lot of mons out there such as Mega Mewtwo X and Alolan Marowak. Ho-Oh can also run its signature move Sacred Fire to hinder Magic bounce Pokemon or physical attackers coming in on it by burning them. It also does a lot of damage to Steel types, especially Kartana.

Speaking of physical attackers, Ho-Oh is not horrible against them as long as they do not have Huge Power/Pure Power + an insane Atk stat. It can OHKO Kartana with sacred fire and Mega Mewtwo X has a very low chance of KOing it in 2 turns with Photon Geyser. It does die to Pure Power STAB attacks though from most of the biggest threats in the meta so you should scout for your opponents abilities before doing anything. Ho-Oh can also take on a lot of non stab PP/HP Sunsteel strike users (Mega Hera for example).

After using Ho-Oh on ladder for a long time I have come to find that this set works best for the purposes stated above.

Cutest big bird (Ho-Oh) (F) @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Careful Nature
- Shore Up
- Sacred Fire
- U-turn
- Spectral Thief

Ho-Oh Stall team this is used on​

(I have gotten to top 3 in the past with it and am currently hovering around rank 10 on ladder)



I think I have made my point clear as to what Ho-Ohs good qualities are but there are things that it struggles with such as:

- Special attackers with Wonder Guard that are not weak to Fire or Ghost
- Special attackers with No Guard, Zap Cannon or Sing
- +2 LTBTS and MMM while not at full HP
- Stealth Rocks (if not supported properly)
- Physical Shadow Tag can give it some trouble
- Electric Z moves
- It has to stay healthy to take on most special attackers

---

I wrote all this in one sitting with info only from the top of my head so feel free to correct me on anything wrong that I said or if I forgot to say something important. Also please do not make the distinction that this post is meant to portray Ho-Oh as some top tier threat everyone should be looking out for, instead I made this so people can see that it can be useful on some teams as a genuine wall and that it isn't hot garbage (and I do not want to debate that it is hot garbage since I have been having success with it for a while now).

 

[ItzEmanBoss]

Thinks I don't agree with : WHY DON’T I SEE EXCA AND MSCIZOR !!
More seriously :
- 4 S+ is too much, S+ is the tier of the best pokemon that is needed in every team like Electrode in gen 1, MVenusaure in let’s go (iirc) or EEternamax in gen 8. None of this mons are necessary. S is fine.
- MGar (sadly) doesn’t deserves S- rank, contrary to Slak or MMX it doesn't hit strong enough to be centralising.
- Doublade Fur Coat is way to bulky to be in A, it deserves A+ : it’s fudging bulky and doesn’t need Shed Shell since it’s a ghost.
- I believe MHera deserves the Triage ability, not in bold ofc.
- Melo and NDW are to low : they are at A+ rank in WG, they don’t deserve to be in B+.
- Deo-S loses to too much things, being weak to FImp and Shadow Sneak when you want to be fast is bad.
- I see neither Type: Null nor Arceus nor Gigas, for Gigas I can understood since there is Slak but others too good with no remplacement to be forgotten.

Yes I did forgot a lot of Pokémon and I will put in Triage for MHera

 

[Guysmash]

I was gonna make an RMT for my Ho-Oh Stall team but I don't think I'm fully finished with building it aaaand my draft of it got deleted so I'm just gonna go a bit into how Ho-Oh can be useful in teambuilding. Another thing I want to mention before starting this is that Primal Kyogre basically does the same thing as Ho-Oh, but with better offensive stats and no Rock weakness. Their bulk is identical on the special side and Ho-Oh is slightly better on the physical side. Almost any statement made from hereon out can also be made for Primal Kyogre. The reason why I am not talking about the big fish over the big bird though is that I have more experience with one over the other and Ho-Oh is cooler :) (and fewer people use it).




HP 106
Attack 130
Defense 90
Sp. Atk. 110
Sp. Def. 154
Speed 90

Fire types are not really known for their defensive capabilities but in my opinion, Ho-Oh should not be used as an offensive mon. It is best suited to being a special wall with its 154 SpD stat that can also hit back the attacker with its 130 Atk stat.

You might already be screaming "Oh but it has a 4x stealth rock weakness, how can it be a wall?" well, It is quite simple. In a metagame where Magic Bounce Zygarde Complete and Mega Steelix exist and you can put defog on any defensive mon, it is not that hard to keep hazards off your side of the field. Yes, that means it can function only with a magic bouncer, but unless you are building an offense team, you shouldn't have a hard time fitting one on your team. The only way you will have issues keeping Rocks off the field is if the opponent has a No Guarder or Mold Breaker mon that can set Rocks which are not the most common and are usually not that long lived so that you can get rid of them most of the time pretty quickly. You can also run additional support with Defog on another defensive Pokemon. It might seem like a lot to have Defog and Magic Bounce on your team so Ho-Oh can function but you would likely have these things on a team anyway even without Ho-Oh on some teams so the cost of supporting Ho-Oh is not as high as it might seem.

The real question with using Ho-Oh isn’t just about keeping Rocks off—it's whether it's worth it at all. If your team needs a special wall and you can fit support for its needs then my answer would be that it's worth considering. I will not claim that Ho-Oh is the end-all-be-all special wall but it can do its job pretty consistently if used correctly.

It takes less than half from any non boosted Parental Bond Moongeist Beam and special Photon Geyser in the game while also resisting Sunsteel Strike. There are very few mons who have these traits and can use them as well as Ho-Oh since it is not weak to any common coverage (unless you are playing low ladder) unlike most defensive Pokemon making it far more consistent compared to a lot of other special walls out there. The only coverage Ho-Oh does fear however are the Z moves of Moongeist beam and Photon Geyser which can KO it if Ho-Oh was chipped and it is coming from a mon with a very high SpA stat at +2 but if you know it is coming in some way, it is possible outplay this scenario since CFZ moves only have 1 PP.

Another distinction from other special walls is its decent Attack stat. With 130 Atk it is possible to OHKO a Mega Gengar with spectral thief at +2 and deal a massive amount of damage to Mega Mewtwo Y. Even without a boost spectral thief can do a lot of damage to a lot of mons out there such as Mega Mewtwo X and Alolan Marowak. Ho-Oh can also run its signature move Sacred Fire to hinder Magic bounce Pokemon or physical attackers coming in on it by burning them. It also does a lot of damage to Steel types, especially Kartana.

Speaking of physical attackers, Ho-Oh is not horrible against them as long as they do not have Huge Power/Pure Power + an insane Atk stat. It can OHKO Kartana with sacred fire and Mega Mewtwo X has a very low chance of KOing it in 2 turns with Photon Geyser. It does die to Pure Power STAB attacks though from most of the biggest threats in the meta so you should scout for your opponents abilities before doing anything. Ho-Oh can also take on a lot of non stab PP/HP Sunsteel strike users (Mega Hera for example).

After using Ho-Oh on ladder for a long time I have come to find that this set works best for the purposes stated above.

Cutest big bird (Ho-Oh) (F) @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Careful Nature
- Shore Up
- Sacred Fire
- U-turn
- Spectral Thief

Ho-Oh Stall team this is used on​

(I have gotten to top 3 in the past with it and am currently hovering around rank 10 on ladder)



I think I have made my point clear as to what Ho-Ohs good qualities are but there are things that it struggles with such as:

- Special attackers with Wonder Guard that are not weak to Fire or Ghost
- Special attackers with No Guard, Zap Cannon or Sing
- +2 LTBTS and MMM while not at full HP
- Stealth Rocks (if not supported properly)
- Physical Shadow Tag can give it some trouble
- Electric Z moves
- It has to stay healthy to take on most special attackers

---

I wrote all this in one sitting with info only from the top of my head so feel free to correct me on anything wrong that I said or if I forgot to say something important. Also please do not make the distinction that this post is meant to portray Ho-Oh as some top tier threat everyone should be looking out for, instead I made this so people can see that it can be useful on some teams as a genuine wall and that it isn't hot garbage (and I do not want to debate that it is hot garbage since I have been having success with it for a while now).

This is absolutely true, Ho-Oh is cool but as you said, except for SFire STAB, POgre is just better and it isn’t weak WShuriken (Just wanted to precise that Ho-Oh is way better against Kart No Guard since it isn’t weak to Power Whip, so it’s cool!)

And Ho-Oh has a better special bulk than POgre (not that much ik) :

(it’s Ho-Oh then POgre)
Finally, Ho-Oh is immune to Spikes and toxic spikes which are used really often in Stall teams to deal effective damage which means Ho-Oh is probably better than POgre against Stall because it will switch freely without taking damage (if rocks are not set) and would use les PPs.

Conclusion : POgre is probably better but since Ho-Oh is cooler (and has a better bulk) just use Ho-Oh instead of POgre.

 

[Child of Night]

But since Ho-Oh is cooler (and has a better bulk) just use Ho-Oh instead of POgre.

The little extra bulk doesn't matter that much and stab scald (and MUCH higher special attack) can be better in some situations but yeah, Ho-Oh is cooler

 

[Child of Night]

one thing i will say tho is on that ho-oh team u already have 3 wonder guards and innards which is already mlre then enough for no guard so ho-oh really should be magic guard

I don't think I would gain much from magic guard since I already have an answer to basically all passive damage on that team and WG helps Ho Oh beat Magic Guard MMX, Mega Gengar, and other such threats that need to be dealt with direct damage which nothing else on my team has. Maybe poison heal would work better than WG in some scenarios though but I'm not sure. The most flexible mon on my team is that Muk though. If you really wanted a prankster mon it would easily fit there. No guard popularity is really soaring right now though (I think at least) so having 2 shed shell mons is really nice.

 

[ANinjaDude]

(Wonder Guard, Huge Power, Water Bubble)

How are you going to forget No Guard Ash-Gren exists.

 

[aidan amoongus]

slaking is as or is less centralising then the a+ mons. for example hp kart forcing you to run either a prank steel, 4x steel resist, innards, or scarf imp with u turn everywhere. slaking isn't as much of an auto win mon as it was because people have figured out how to answer it as and harvest is not that hard to answer it only requiring like core enforcer/taunt/ect or leppa imp or innards. however this just auto wins vs stall. still a+ imo.

yeah this was just discussed in the phcord b is fine. i imagine ransei liked the post for this reason.

i do think it's higher then b+ but thanks. take back the triage sentence tho triage is fake.

guzzlord can function as support it isn't trying to do damage so more often then not it's actually doing more then lunala and guzzlord works well with harvest mray too. above lunala imo

awful mon idk why you like this so much. dies to all the same things innards chans does unless it just lives random coverage and this mon can't actually do anything. even with stab t arrows it can't actually kill the things it wants to bc it's so weak, m steelix just walls it with reflect/WoW and haze and i honestly wouldn't be suprised if it gets walled without reflect, and fc doublade walls this all day long especially with spec thief. last time i played vs this my band hp mmx just u turned on it and it took 80% and it did literally nothing. definitely c tier or smt.

fair enough put type null in a- but arceus has a niche over type null bc it isn't item locked which is nice if u want goggles

Guzzlord has this niche of dying to special attackers too like via soulblaze.

In the team Ransei made with Harvest Ultra Necrozma-I asked why Innards Guzzlord over Chansey or Blissey. The thing with Guzzlord is it can be a special AND physical innards

 

[aidan amoongus]

Making my own VR cuz I am bored, (Bolded=More common abilities) NOT ORDERED

S+
(Imposter, Innards out, Wonder Guard)
(Imposter, Innards out, Wonder Guard)
(Prankster, Fur coat, Imposter)
(Wonder Guard) Not making a Wonder guard VR
S-
(Huge Power, Magic Guard) Could go in S+ Personal opinion
(Harvest, Huge Power, Wonder Guard)
(parental Bond, Magic Guard, Dazzling)
A+
(Huge Power, Magic Guard, Shadow Tag, Mold Breaker)
(Huge Power, Magic guard, Shadow Tag)
(Wonder Guard, Huge Power, Water Bubble)
A
(Sturdy, Fur Coat, Prankster)
(Huge Power) Maybe B?
(Prankster, Wonder Guard, Fur Coat)
(Wonder Guard, Huge power, Mold Breaker)
B+
(No Guard)
(Innards Out, Wonder Guard)
(Wonder Guard)
(Wonder Guard)
(No Guard, Comatose)
(Psychic Surge, Magic Guard, Dazzling)
(Triage, Aerilate, Mold Breaker, 'Contrary, low ladder players only')
B-
(Psychic Surge, Dazzling)
(Magic Bounce, Wonder Guard)

And the rest of the shit I don't want to talk about

Your forgot a lot of mid wonder guards like MSciz, Steela, and Ferro

Kartana also runs No Guard and Wonder Guard sometimes and Doublade can go Bounce. Gigas deserves to be ranked too IMO, somewhere slightly lower than Slaking.

 

[ItzEmanBoss]

Your forgot a lot of mid wonder guards like MSciz, Steela, and Ferro

Kartana also runs No Guard and Wonder Guard sometimes and Doublade can go Bounce. Gigas deserves to be ranked too IMO, somewhere slightly lower than Slaking.

Yes I am still making edits on a LOT of pkm I missed

 

[Eyeos]

It's been over two months since I last posted a personal VR and the metagame has gone through multiple small phases since. I've tried out more various Pokémon on the viability rankings, including some in the lower ranks, teams have more variety now thanks to spam teams falling off, and new records have been made from people rotating around all sorts of different teams. I've probably seen more games from other players than played games myself after February, but have still managed to play maybe 100ish games since?

I've made a lot of changes to the VR to accommodate to this. To be honest, figuring out the ranks below S was quite difficult for me this time, and I've noticed the game still has quite a ton of room to be developed. I've destroyed the ladder with sets almost nobody else ever runs and realized if more of those sets were around, or even similar sets but slightly altered in some way, this metagame would appear to look quite different than it is now. Well anyway, here is what I have in store now. I'll plan to make a post explaining plenty of these ranks, especially the ones that seem most questionable (like why I placed Pikachu at B and why I placed Mega Scizor so low on the Wonder Guard Viability Rankings)

Art by BlueberryBlanket​

Welcome to the Pure Hackmons Viability Rankings. This is one of the many resources made to help players determine what can be considered viable in the metagame. These rankings are placed in alphabetical order. Any ability ranked is placed last for convenience. Anyone is free to put their thoughts on any Pokémon and debate on whether or not they need a rank change as long as they are reasonable. Provide clear evidence for reasons why a Pokémon should have a change in rank, and be civil about it. We want what we can believe to be closer to fact than subjective opinions.

S Rank
S

Chansey

Mewtwo-Mega-X

‎ Zygarde-Complete

Wonder Guard

Wonder Guard Viability Rankings

S Rank
S

Audino-Mega

A Rank
A+

Greninja-Ash

Hoopa-Unbound

‎ Necrozma-Dawn-Wings

Slowbro-Mega

A

Arceus

Gyarados-Mega

Meloetta

Oranguru

‎ Regigigas

Slaking

A-

Kartana

Mewtwo-Mega-X

Muk-Alola

B Rank
B+

Celesteela

Groudon-Primal

‎Ferrothorn

Magearna

Umbreon

B

Bisharp

Gardevoir-Mega

Gyarados @ Gyaradosite

Houndoom-Mega

Mewtwo-Mega-Y

Sableye-Mega

Scizor-Mega

Type: Null

B-

Cresselia

Gengar-Mega

Kyogre-Primal

C

Blissey

Chansey

Necrozma-Dusk-Mane

Pheromosa

D

Aggron-Mega

Swampert-Mega

‎ Lopunny-Mega

Steelix-Mega

S-

Blissey

Groudon-Primal

A Rank
A+

Doublade

Greninja-Ash

Mewtwo-Mega-Y

Steelix-Mega

A

Gengar-Mega

Kartana

Regigigas

Slaking

Solgaleo

A-

Deoxys-Attack

Diancie-Mega

Lopunny-Mega

Lunala

‎ Necrozma-Dawn-Wings

Necrozma-Dusk-Mane

Rayquaza-Mega

Slowbro-Mega

B Rank
B+

Arceus

Aggron-Mega

Celesteela

Deoxys-Speed

Gyarados-Mega

Metagross-Mega

Necrozma-Ultra

Type: Null

Yveltal

B

Banette-Mega

Cresselia

Giratina

Giratina-Origin

Guzzlord

Kyogre-Primal

Kyurem-Black

Pikachu

B-

Gardevoir-Mega

Gyarados @ Gyaradosite

Bisharp

Ho-Oh

Lugia

Registeel

C Rank

Articuno

Entei

Groudon @ Red Orb

Pheromosa

Sceptile-Mega

Tyranitar-Mega

D Rank

Avalugg

Froslass

Shedinja

Blacklist - Do not discuss putting these on the VR
Wonder Guard:
Any pure Fire-type for their Burn Up sets.

Explanation

Pure Fire-types in the metagame don't stand very well as Wonder Guards as they for the most part are outclassed by other possible Wonder Guards such as Primal Groudon and Alolan Muk for having similar but less weaknesses, and usually higher defensive stats. However, the main strategy of a Pure Fire-type Pokemon with Wonder Guard is to utilize the move Burn Up, a move that removes a Pokemon's Fire-type after successfully hitting. With many viable Wonder Guards in the metagame, these types of Pokemon should find it hard to be able to successfully hit an attack, and even if they do, they can still be forced to switch either by phazing or by matchup, causing them to have to redo their main strategy. It is also worth noting that the ability of Wonder Guards to carry four moves in this metagame is a gift. Most of them use their four moves in order to support, recover themselves, boost stats, inflict status, and/or throw hazards. Their type combination is good enough to handle on their own without the absolute need to provide a move to get rid of their type. Pure Fire-type Pokemon who follow the Burn Up strategy can also struggle more heavily against Mold Breaker/Turboblaze/Teravolt Pokemon or Pokemon that have Photon Geyser or Moongeist Beam, making the entire point of the strategy lose any value it had.
Post to stack on explanation: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/pure-hackmons.3656851/page-3#post-8375359

I disagree very heavily with this vr you made for multiple reasons and I think it’s honestly not very good at all.

For the wg vr I think ash greninja and hoopa are not A+ material, I believe they aren’t as good as they used to be because they don’t have all that much power and their big weakness has become more and more relevant. I also think you heavily underestimating meloetta by putting it in A and also overestimating arceus and oranguru by putting them in A. I don’t know why you put mmx in A- because it hasn’t shown much potential at all and is just not a good wg.

For the regular VR I do have a problem with putting Groudon primal in S- because while Groudon is good it is not S-material and not as good as you act. Equally I think you act like ash greninja is way better than it actually is as of current it’s rarely seen and it’s no guard and water bubble sets are nothing notable. I also disagree that gengar, kartana and slacking are A I think they are well deserving of A+. Solgaleo is most definitely not A material and should be lower. I’m a little confused about your lunala placement because you seem to be a big critic of it yet you put it in A- I also think dawn wings isn’t that good outside of wg. I’m also not sure why you ranked regular Groudon I don’t think it’s notable enough to be ranked because it’s only really seen on Groudon spam which isn’t very popular anymore.

Overall this vr feels very outdated and it looks like a vr somebody would make the very early stages of pure hackmons so I’m not sure why you ranked everything like this and Ransei I expected something better then this since it’s a very bad.

 

[Child of Night]

I’m new to this meta why is deo s in a- when it’s so good with the no guard set

Deoxys Speed is pretty bad into most good teams as anyone who knows anything about Pure Hackmons is going to prepare for it which isn't even that hard. 2 WGs not weak to OHKO moves is the standard but there are some other more niche options that you could run like Froslass and Articuno since they are immune to the two most common OHKO moves (Sheer Cold and Fissure). It might seem strong to such a new player like yourself but Deoxys Speed isn't really worth using against good players and will probably only work well in low ladder. Hope this helps! Btw, Deoxys speed is actually B rank, I don't know where you got the info that its A-? Maybe you were looking at an older post...

 

[mayonnaise. mayo.]

Deoxys Speed is pretty bad into most good teams as anyone who knows anything about Pure Hackmons is going to prepare for it which isn't even that hard. 2 WGs not weak to OHKO moves is the standard but there are some other more niche options that you could run like Froslass and Articuno since they are immune to the two most common OHKO moves (Sheer Cold and Fissure). It might seem strong to such a new player like yourself but Deoxys Speed isn't really worth using against good players and will probably only work well in low ladder. Hope this helps! Btw, Deoxys speed is actually B rank, I don't know where you got the info that its A-? Maybe you were looking at an older post...

eyeos did, this was back before he really dove into the hackmons wormhole

 

[Child of Night]

eyeos did, this was back before he really dove into the hackmons wormhole

Yeah the post is a joke

 

[Guysmash]

Hi, just warning people that I changed Chansey’s set on my sample submission

 

[aidan amoongus]

​

How To Build Balance (with packs!)


This will contain a tutorial on how to build a balance team with with Imposter/Innards Out and packs with sets you can build with. There's not really any guides on team building and the Setpedia is also outdated so I thought this could be helpful.

Building a Balance Team

The structure I'll be showing you how to make is Prankster + Wonder Guard + Wonder Guard or Fur Coat/Magic Bounce + Wall Breaker + Speed Control/Priority or Offensive Wonder Guard + Blob (Imposter/Innards Out). For example, it could look like:

or

There is some things your team will generally need however:
-You need 2 Wonder Guards (Sturdy counts as it blocks OHKO moves too) because of the existance of No Guard. These can either be 2 defensive Wonder Guards or you could run 1 defensive Wonder Guard and 1 offensive Wonder Guard so you are free to run a Fur Coat or Magic Bounce Pokèmon. If one of your Wonder Guard Pokémon is weak to ground, use Innards Out or you will lose to fissure.
-Make sure all of your offensive Pokémon are Imposter proofed. This means that you have an answer to your own Pokémon so when Imposter comes in you don't get sweeped. For example, use a plate or memory on your MMX so it can't hit one of your Pokémon, like a Flame Plate so you can hit opposing Doublade but an Imposter can't hit your own. You can also just have a Pokémon that hard walls one of your offensive Pokémon.
-A Huge Power Kartarna answer (Prankster steel, 4x steel resist, Innards Out, or Choice Scarf Blissey + a way to break it's sash) as other wise it can just sweep you.
-A Harvest Slaking answer (a move like Core Enforcer/Taunt/Magic Room/ect, Innards Out, or just generally a way you can force it out)
-A form of hazards (usually Stealth Rocks), Defog, and Aromatherapy (Aromatherapy can be put on Innards Out if needed).
-At the very least a good MMX switch in (e.g. Wonder Guard Slowbro Mega, Fur Coat Doublade, possibly Prankster Steelix) as otherwise a Choice Band MMX can win by spamming Photon Geyser, if you struggle against MMX consider Innards Out. A true way to wall MMX is unrealistic as it can run coverage for anything but Fur Coat Doublade is the most consistent wall.
-Forms of priority and speed control (e.g. a FakeSpeed Slaking, First Impression on MMX or Choice Scarf Parental Bond Gengar Mega). If you are struggling here consider Choice Scarf Imposter Blissey.
-And finally, don't auto lose to Innards Out. This is done with either multiple physical attackers/double Huge Power or if you have to anti Innards tech like minimum attack U-Turns or Sludge Bomb on Parental Bond Gengar Mega. If you have a team where your main wall breaker is a physical attacker and it's partnered with a special attacker that can't win on it's own you are probably vunarable to Innards Out.

This doesn't have to be done in any paticular order but I suggest you do it in the order I show each Pokémon. Use the packs at the bottom of the post if you want. Remember that 2 Wonder Guards (Sturdy counts) are required.

Wallbreaker

Here I chose MMX, it's the best wall breaker in the game and can run coverage for literally anything whilst being easy to Imposter proof and it can fit priority (First Impression). Often times MMX is the best choice and you'd be missing out by not using it. Other examples can include Heracross Mega and Mold Breaker Primal Groudon.

Second Offensive Pokémon

Here you can do multiple things. You could add a speed control/priority Pokémon like Choice Scarf Parental Bond Gengar or FakeSpeed Slaking. You can also run an offensive Wonder Guard Pokémon allowing you to fit a Fur Coat or Magic Bounce Pokémon in your defensive core. Here I chose Wonder Guard Necrozma Dawn Wings as a strong cleaner that is also 1 of my 2 Wonder Guards freeing up slots later. Again you can use the packs for this.

Defensive Core

Here you will have either 1 defensive Wonder Guard or 2 depending on whether you are running an offensive Wonder Guard. On these Pokémon you can fit Defog, Aromatherapy, and Stealth Rocks. I ran Fur Coat Doublade + Wonder Guard Audino Mega as due to running Dawn Wings I was able to fit Fur Coat Doublade which is the most consistent MMX answer and a strong physical wall, and Mega Audino who is my second Wonder Guard that supports the team and can wall some Moongeist Beam users as well as pair nicely with Doublade. You can use the packs for defensive Wonder Guards, Fur Coats and Magic Bouncers here and I also put some defensive core pairs at the bottom of the post so you can use Pokémon that pair well together.

A Prankhaze

Prankster Pokémon (in paticular Zygarde-Complete) can function as anti setup with Haze and just wall a good majority of the game. Zygarde-Complete solves a majority of physical attackers with Reflect and close to every special attacker that doesn't explicitly run coverage (ice moves) for it. In my opinion, the main reason you would run another Prankhaze like Steelix Mega over Zygarde-Complete is to answer Huge Power Kartarna. You can make balance teams without a Prankhaze (they usually run Innards Out) but Zygarde-Complete is a very consistent choice for balance teams and as this post is mostly directed at new players so I think it's a very good idea you run it. There is a Prankhaze pack too.

Imposter or Innards Out

Balance teams without one of the blobs are possible but most good teams will have one and again they're very consistent choices and they both patch up team holes. Innards Out can be used as a Harvest Slaking answer and if your team struggles against things Kartarna or MMX then Innards out can solve that. You can also fit moves like Aromatherapy here if you are struggling to them else where, you can fit secondary hazards on it, you can fit Magic Coat to answer Comaphase on it and Innards Out can function as a secondary special wall. If you don't need any of that you should run Imposter. If you are lacking priority or a revenge killer Choice Scarf Imposter can help with that and Imposter is incredibly helpful as it can scout sets, function as a revenge killer, function as anti setup as it copies boosts and save you from auto lose matchups. I chose Choice Scarf Blissey here as I wanted a revenge killer as I only had MMX with First Impression and it can also let me play around Huge Power Kartana.

Wonder Guard (And Fur Coat) Pairs

I thought this would be a good idea so new players can use Pokémon that actually pair well together and not just put random things together. Remember, only use a Wonder Guard + Fur Coat/Magic Bounce Pair if you already have an offensive Wonder Guard, and if one of your Wonder Guards is weak to ground use Innards Out.

+

+

Make Doublade Sturdy unless you have an offensive Wonder Guard

+

+

or

(Scizor is terrible)

+

+

+

or

(Scizor is terrible)

+

Already mentioned lol

+

+

+

+

Already mentioned lol

The Packs

And finally, I will now show you the packs. They have sets for every role (e.g. Wallbreaker and Offensive Wonder Guard) and you can use them when building. The Setpedia is outdated so I thought it would be helpful. I apologise for the nicknames it was 2am and the slashes and spaces disappeared from some of the moves too so I'm sorry about that. If you want a set to be added or changed let me know.

-Wallbreakers https://pokepast.es/fa6262e457909d05
-Offensive Wonder Guards https://pokepast.es/60d34199d55073a9
-Speed Control and Priority https://pokepast.es/134c937d48a0800b
-Defensive Wonder Guards https://pokepast.es/491f76ae93da1d08
-Fur Coats https://pokepast.es/94de94a254c3df2c
-Prankster https://pokepast.es/f5019ac0fcb35fd4
-Magic Bouncers https://pokepast.es/e830aa67379b2dab
-No Guard https://pokepast.es/27e03d93b8462fd0
-Shadow Tag https://pokepast.es/375e64484881e177 (can someone correct mhera set i've like never seen it and i found set on ph cord)
-Huge Power Shell Smash Sweepers https://pokepast.es/af0d2adf454aea3a

Just don’t use stag mega Hera

 

[PenultimateToast]

If you want a set to be added or changed let me know.

i mean you did ask (this is a really minor nitpick tbh)

the 2nd slaking under the "speed control and priority" section should have plasma fists over fusion bolt, same base power and accuracy except plasma fists has more pp so it's technically better, probably not that important but it is something and might come up in a longer game

 

[Guysmash]

Things I would change on your importable sets :

​

How To Build Balance (with packs!)


This will contain a tutorial on how to build a balance team with with Imposter/Innards Out and packs with sets you can build with. There's not really any guides on team building and the Setpedia is also outdated so I thought this could be helpful.

Building a Balance Team

The structure I'll be showing you how to make is Prankster + Wonder Guard + Wonder Guard or Fur Coat/Magic Bounce + Wall Breaker + Speed Control/Priority or Offensive Wonder Guard + Blob (Imposter/Innards Out). For example, it could look like:

or

There is some things your team will generally need however:
-You need 2 Wonder Guards (Sturdy counts as it blocks OHKO moves too) because of the existance of No Guard. These can either be 2 defensive Wonder Guards or you could run 1 defensive Wonder Guard and 1 offensive Wonder Guard so you are free to run a Fur Coat or Magic Bounce Pokèmon. If one of your Wonder Guard Pokémon is weak to ground, use Innards Out or you will lose to fissure.
-Make sure all of your offensive Pokémon are Imposter proofed. This means that you have an answer to your own Pokémon so when Imposter comes in you don't get sweeped. For example, use a plate or memory on your MMX so it can't hit one of your Pokémon, like a Flame Plate so you can hit opposing Doublade but an Imposter can't hit your own. You can also just have a Pokémon that hard walls one of your offensive Pokémon.
-A Huge Power Kartarna answer (Prankster steel, 4x steel resist, Innards Out, or Choice Scarf Blissey + a way to break it's sash) as other wise it can just sweep you.
-A Harvest Slaking answer (a move like Core Enforcer/Taunt/Magic Room/ect, Innards Out, or just generally a way you can force it out)
-A form of hazards (usually Stealth Rocks), Defog, and Aromatherapy (Aromatherapy can be put on Innards Out if needed).
-At the very least a good MMX switch in (e.g. Wonder Guard Slowbro Mega, Fur Coat Doublade, possibly Prankster Steelix) as otherwise a Choice Band MMX can win by spamming Photon Geyser, if you struggle against MMX consider Innards Out. A true way to wall MMX is unrealistic as it can run coverage for anything but Fur Coat Doublade is the most consistent wall.
-Forms of priority and speed control (e.g. a FakeSpeed Slaking, First Impression on MMX or Choice Scarf Parental Bond Gengar Mega). If you are struggling here consider Choice Scarf Imposter Blissey.
-And finally, don't auto lose to Innards Out. This is done with either multiple physical attackers/double Huge Power or if you have to anti Innards tech like minimum attack U-Turns or Sludge Bomb on Parental Bond Gengar Mega. If you have a team where your main wall breaker is a physical attacker and it's partnered with a special attacker that can't win on it's own you are probably vunarable to Innards Out.

This doesn't have to be done in any paticular order but I suggest you do it in the order I show each Pokémon. Use the packs at the bottom of the post if you want. Remember that 2 Wonder Guards (Sturdy counts) are required.

Wallbreaker

Here I chose MMX, it's the best wall breaker in the game and can run coverage for literally anything whilst being easy to Imposter proof and it can fit priority (First Impression). Often times MMX is the best choice and you'd be missing out by not using it. Other examples can include Heracross Mega and Mold Breaker Primal Groudon.

Second Offensive Pokémon

Here you can do multiple things. You could add a speed control/priority Pokémon like Choice Scarf Parental Bond Gengar or FakeSpeed Slaking. You can also run an offensive Wonder Guard Pokémon allowing you to fit a Fur Coat or Magic Bounce Pokémon in your defensive core. Here I chose Wonder Guard Necrozma Dawn Wings as a strong cleaner that is also 1 of my 2 Wonder Guards freeing up slots later. Again you can use the packs for this.

Defensive Core

Here you will have either 1 defensive Wonder Guard or 2 depending on whether you are running an offensive Wonder Guard. On these Pokémon you can fit Defog, Aromatherapy, and Stealth Rocks. I ran Fur Coat Doublade + Wonder Guard Audino Mega as due to running Dawn Wings I was able to fit Fur Coat Doublade which is the most consistent MMX answer and a strong physical wall, and Mega Audino who is my second Wonder Guard that supports the team and can wall some Moongeist Beam users as well as pair nicely with Doublade. You can use the packs for defensive Wonder Guards, Fur Coats and Magic Bouncers here and I also put some defensive core pairs at the bottom of the post so you can use Pokémon that pair well together.

A Prankhaze

Prankster Pokémon (in paticular Zygarde-Complete) can function as anti setup with Haze and just wall a good majority of the game. Zygarde-Complete solves a majority of physical attackers with Reflect and close to every special attacker that doesn't explicitly run coverage (ice moves) for it. In my opinion, the main reason you would run another Prankhaze like Steelix Mega over Zygarde-Complete is to answer Huge Power Kartarna. You can make balance teams without a Prankhaze (they usually run Innards Out) but Zygarde-Complete is a very consistent choice for balance teams and as this post is mostly directed at new players I think it's a very good idea you run it. There is a Prankhaze pack too.

Imposter or Innards Out

Balance teams without one of the blobs are possible but most good teams will have one and again they're very consistent choices and they both patch up team holes. Innards Out can be used as a Harvest Slaking answer and if your team struggles against things like Kartarna or MMX then Innards out can solve that. You can also fit moves like Aromatherapy here if you are struggling to them else where, you can fit secondary hazards on it, you can fit Magic Coat to answer Comaphase on it and Innards Out can function as a secondary special wall. If you don't need any of that you should run Imposter. If you are lacking priority or a revenge killer Choice Scarf Imposter can help with that and Imposter is incredibly helpful as it can scout sets, function as a revenge killer, function as anti setup as it copies boosts and save you from auto lose matchups. I chose Choice Scarf Blissey here as I wanted a revenge killer as I only had MMX with First Impression and it can also let me play around Huge Power Kartana.

Wonder Guard (And Fur Coat) Pairs

I thought this would be a good idea so new players can use Pokémon that actually pair well together and not just put random things together. Remember, only use a Wonder Guard + Fur Coat/Magic Bounce Pair if you already have an offensive Wonder Guard, and if one of your Wonder Guards is weak to ground use Innards Out.

+

+

Make Doublade Sturdy unless you have an offensive Wonder Guard

+

+

or

(Scizor is terrible)

+

+

+

or

(Scizor is terrible)

+

Already mentioned lol

+

+

+

+

Already mentioned lol

The Packs

And finally, I will now show you the packs. They have sets for every role (e.g. Wallbreaker and Offensive Wonder Guard) and you can use them when building. The Setpedia is outdated so I thought it would be helpful. I apologise for the nicknames it was 2am and the slashes and spaces disappeared from some of the moves too so I'm sorry about that. If you want a set to be added or changed let me know.

-Wallbreakers https://pokepast.es/fa6262e457909d05
-Offensive Wonder Guards https://pokepast.es/60d34199d55073a9
-Speed Control and Priority https://pokepast.es/134c937d48a0800b
-Defensive Wonder Guards https://pokepast.es/491f76ae93da1d08
-Fur Coats https://pokepast.es/94de94a254c3df2c
-Prankster https://pokepast.es/f5019ac0fcb35fd4
-Magic Bouncers https://pokepast.es/e830aa67379b2dab
-No Guard https://pokepast.es/27e03d93b8462fd0
-Shadow Tag https://pokepast.es/375e64484881e177 (can someone correct mhera set i've like never seen it and i found set on ph cord)
-Huge Power Shell Smash Sweepers https://pokepast.es/af0d2adf454aea3a

Add Ice Shard with Ice hammer on the MHera Wall Breaker and Speed Control sets, iirc it OHKOs Zygod with 3 layers of spikes (which happens frequently in a balance).
I beleive MScizor would be worth addedoffensive WG.
Why is there a Defensive WG set for MScizor ? It’s useless.
For the MBouncers Add Steela, it’s one of the few steel types with a decent special bulk.
For NoGuard, isn’t fissure just better then Sheer Cold for Kart ? Like it beats steel types which sheer cold does not.
Finnaly I think MMX could be added as a Shell Smash HP user

 

[Guysmash]

plasma fists makes normal moves electric so e speed would become electric which isn't ideal

It only works the turn PFists is used

 

[PenultimateToast]

plasma fists makes normal moves electric so e speed would become electric which isn't ideal

doesn't that only happen the turn you use it?

 

[aidan amoongus]

Ok first-what happened to the Yourself and NToTheN post.

Secondly-I will try to do what Yourself did with a little less criticism and my concerns.


First off. Its funny. It seems like a meme team until you see it actually beats really good teams. PDon checks like Mega Slowbro actually can't come in safely on a PDon unless they make sure you aren't Moongeist. This is really just the spam aspect taking place, and just confusing people with less IQ (namely me). However, more experienced players will play safer and probably win. Really IMO is just experience issues.


Actually tried this team out myself, and really nothing to say-its fast HO Psyspam thats pretty good IMO, but is a bit outdated. Works fine personally.


I will defend this team to my last breath. This is a really good team that carries a lot of people to mid/high ladder, including myself. People higher up make a few tweaks, but its around the same idea. Yourself is right about it being a little outdated, but it is a really good team personally. Also Yourself wanted this to be replaced with TriKart, but IMO, TriKart is good, but not sample worthy. TriKart hardcore loses to PBond Gengar after Innards is dealt with making it a little inconsistent.


This sample is fine, but I've stated this before-PDon should be impproofed better. Sample teams should be able to get players experienced in the format, even if they are new. This team doesn't do that because PDon isn't impproofed.

Hi, it's your favorite Amoongus here again!

So, I was looking at the samples, and they all look pretty good. Then, I saw the NToTheN PBond Gengar team. I asked this in the chat before, but why is PDon not Imp Proofed? I mean, if it was N playing this they could probably win with it, but if it's someone with little or no experience, they could get 6-0ed by Imposter. Click Sunsteel on AMuk once, then Bonemerang, and click Smash then Sunsteel on Melo You either have to win speed tie or pray your opponent doesn't know what they're doing, which isn't what a sample should be. Not saying this is bad, but I just feel like it should be reworked a bit to Impproof the PDon.

Edit 1: here's the team for those who want a quicker way to go to it

Additionally, Imposter Chansey should be Shed Shell, as Caz says "when half the meta beats you by trapping you, it's [Shed Shell] surprisingly useful".

its also getting late, so im gonna finish the post here and edit it to include the rest of my thoughts tomorrow

 

[ItzEmanBoss]

Hey friends! After thick and thin I have finally reached the fabled top 100 in Gen 7 Pure Hackmons and this is the team that just put me over the edge.

Now BEHOLD my epic MMX HO team!

Mewtwo-Mega-X @ Choice Band
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Shadow Sneak
- Ice Shard
- Photon Geyser
- Mach Punch

Pretty standard set until HOLY FUCKING SHIT IS THAT MAC PUNCH? Yes, yes it is bully me all you want but it catches a shit ton of Gren and kart sets off guard which I could not have with sunsteel or any other coverage option.

Mewtwo-Mega-X @ Focus Sash
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Shell Smash
- Photon Geyser
- Sunsteel Strike
- Ice Hammer


Mostly a counter to innards Blissey/Chansey and quite frankly my only counter to wg Muk, and Ic Hammer is also a good option against Prank Haze Zy because it 2kos it even after a recover the only think I don’t like about this is that it can miss.

Mewtwo-Mega-X @ Focus Sash
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Let's Snuggle Forever
- Light That Burns the Sky
- Shell Smash
- Close Combat

The most common lead on this team besides MGeng just for its ability to bounce back those pesky stealth rocks, encore, and the occasional toxic.

Blissey (F) @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Innards Out
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Gentle Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Def
- Whirlwind
- Defog
- Shore Up
- Toxic

Egg. But it has toxic, toxic was a last minute change because when I originally had aromatherapy which got almost no use and a good option to throw out when I have a free turn but magic bounce completely fucks this set

Greninja-Ash (M) @ Mystic Water
Ability: Water Bubble
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Water Shuriken
- Moongeist Beam
- Icicle Spear
- Oceanic Operetta

Choice Specs also works but I like the versatility of Mystic Water, also just an all out water special attacker and a very good check to PDon

Gengar-Mega @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Parental Bond
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moongeist Beam
- Sludge Wave
- Bug Buzz
- Ice Beam


Speed control and a lead to put out some immediate damage while outspeeding almost everything in the teir without a speed boost.

And that’s been Eman’s amazing MMX HO team (the account that reached rank 98 is called Itzemanbosss btw)

 

[Guysmash]

Hey friends! After thick and thin I have finally reached the fabled top 100 in Gen 7 Pure Hackmons and this is the team that just put me over the edge.

Now BEHOLD my epic MMX HO team!

View attachment 720230

Mewtwo-Mega-X @ Choice Band
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Shadow Sneak
- Ice Shard
- Photon Geyser
- Mach Punch

Pretty standard set until HOLY FUCKING SHIT IS THAT MAC PUNCH? Yes, yes it is bully me all you want but it catches a shit ton of Gren and kart sets off guard which I could not have with sunsteel or any other coverage option.


View attachment 720231

Mewtwo-Mega-X @ Focus Sash
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Shell Smash
- Photon Geyser
- Sunsteel Strike
- Ice Hammer


Mostly a counter to innards Blissey/Chansey and quite frankly my only counter to wg Muk, and Ic Hammer is also a good option against Prank Haze Zy because it 2kos it even after a recover the only think I don’t like about this is that it can miss.


View attachment 720232

Mewtwo-Mega-X @ Focus Sash
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Let's Snuggle Forever
- Light That Burns the Sky
- Shell Smash
- Close Combat

The most common lead on this team besides MGeng just for its ability to bounce back those pesky stealth rocks, encore, and the occasional toxic.


View attachment 720233

Blissey (F) @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Innards Out
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Gentle Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Def
- Whirlwind
- Defog
- Shore Up
- Toxic

Egg. But it has toxic, toxic was a last minute change because when I originally had aromatherapy which got almost no use and a good option to throw out when I have a free turn but magic bounce completely fucks this set



View attachment 720234

Greninja-Ash (M) @ Mystic Water
Ability: Water Bubble
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Water Shuriken
- Moongeist Beam
- Icicle Spear
- Oceanic Operetta

Choice Specs also works but I like the versatility of Mystic Water, also just an all out water special attacker and a very good check to PDon


View attachment 720235


Gengar-Mega @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Parental Bond
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moongeist Beam
- Sludge Wave
- Bug Buzz
- Ice Beam


Speed control and a lead to put out some immediate damage while outspeeding almost everything in the teir without a speed boost.

And that’s been Eman’s amazing MMX HO team (the account that reached rank 98 is called Itzemanbosss btw)

Hey, the team looks pretty cool. However I think 2 changes could be done to improove it :
- On the MGuard MMX you can’t hit steel types and you already deal good damage to Zygod with Ice Shard and Ice Beam, moreover if you switch on a blob with this MMX the opponent will probably understand that it is MGuard. This is why I believe replacing Ice Hammer by Pursuit would be great.

- Since Blissey doesn't have Aromatherapy, it'd be a real issue if you get your Toxic bounced. And you can’t deal with a MBouncer special attacker with this team. This is why I think you should replace Toxic by MCoat to counter things like ComaPHaze or PShot to keep momentum (because if Blissey doesn’t kill you lose it) and deal with MBouncers.

 

[aidan amoongus]

the post was mostly ragebait outdide of the diamancie rant which is why i deleted my post hence why n deleted their's but i never actually saw n's post. either way im gonna reply to what u said here.

psyterrain- psyterrain isn't rly meta rn, and the team is very old. ntothen wants this deleted so, yeah.

ng lop ho- i get the argument for keeping this but imo it should be replaced with a team like gold's team (which is actually a modified version of the sample) that has had a lot more success on the ladder and is newer, or a team like trikart.

mbounce pdon offense- the team is old and it's not very good. ntothen wants it replaced but no one has actually submitted any bo samples.

You say that Bahamut’s No Guard Lop Team should be replaced by something like Gold’s team which is a variant of the team. Understandable, but don’t you contradict yourself when you say that PsyTerrain isn’t meta? Is it just me or..?

 

[LemonLime78]

Yknow. I didn't really expect to be here. I mostly play ph more on the side. But some-fucking-how I have managed to hit 14th on ladder with 1600+ elo, including wins vs some prominent players. So I figure I'll share the team cuz why not

The Team

https://pokepast.es/34e459642438b5ac

Now, normally I would share my building process. However, as the name suggests, this team was originally conceived as some random bullshit to battle my friend. As such, I will instead be explaining what each member does in practice.

Kartana is an extremely funny lil guy. It's pretty simple, spam the nuke button. Eq to hit steelix better, sub to avoid status and imposter. As kartana is something of a glass cannon, I don't like to bring it in often unless I really want to take a kill or I'm confident it can sweep. Overall, kartana is extremely simple, just bring it in and nuke something when the time feels right.

Gyarados serves dual-purpose as a wguard mon and a mbreaker sweeper. It serves as a wall to various stuff, can later be used as a breaker or sweeper. Ice shard smacks zygod and to a lesser degree mray, not much to say here. Tends to be my gamewinner more than kartana as it has easier setup opportunities.

Tank/pivot/anti-setup. We all know what it does. Funnily enough, it can also pp stall vs a single mon in the endgame if absolutely necessary, tho it's not optimal. Spikes could be used over rocks.

Serves as my priority of choice. Good at sweeping (there might be a pattern here). Oblivion wing and photon geyser smack most stuff, dkiss can target dark wguards. It can't hit psychic wguards, but there are multiple other options for those on this team.

Revenge killer. Moongeist hits a lot of stuff quite well, photon geyser hits others. Trick scarf is great at crippling defensive mons (particularly zygod or utility wguards) or punishing sleep leads, and tail glow is admittedly replaceable. It could sweep slower teams, but most teams will have at least a mon or two faster, especially with modest. So usually on the rare occasion that I use tail glow, it's moreso to force in another offensive mon after I kill the trapped one. Gengar mainly serves as good speed control/revenge killing and can help break bulkier mons.

Regigigas is a bulkier wguard. It's best used when I'm trying to setup without using a glass cannon. Spectral thief is also useful to steal buffs from most mons and hit ghosts. Very simple, very straightforward. Safety goggles could be used, but I prefer lefties for better longevity.

Tips for Usage

I'll usually lead with either steelix or gengar. Steelix can get up hazards, stop anti-lead setup, or pivot out while gengar can chip down lead threats or trick scarf. In the event that I'd rather keep Gengar alive, I'll switch into the appropriate mon.

In terms of breaking/sweeping, Gyarados tends to be my go-to early on. It's much easier to setup than Kartana due to wguard and it hits harder faster than Regigigas. Later on, if I can get the opportunity, Kartana becomes much better as it has obscene firepower right off the bat and can run away with games after a single shell smash. Regigigas tends to leverage its bulk over its firepower to break mons and doesn't usually sweep. On the special side, Gengar will almost never sweep, but stag scarf can be amazing at taking down threats after saccing a mon or otherwise getting valuable chip that can allow my other mons to break through. Megaray is probably my second go-to in the early game as it can be kept healthy rather easily and very quickly hits hard after tail glow.

In general, it's worth it to sac a physical attacker to innards out, given that there's two more of them and that's one less innards out to deal with later. Similarly, it can also be worth it to sac Gengar to get chip on a single mmx to get it within range of Megaray's oblivion wing. If there are multiple, I'll instead have to find an opportunity to set up Kartana, Gyara, or Megaray, which can be difficult but not impossible.

I'll admit it, Kartana isn't improofed very well. However, it's usually fine as I don't bring it in that much anyways. In the event that it does get copied, there are a couple courses of action that I can take: A: if my sash is intact, I can just spam shell smash and kill. B: if the imposter comes in beforehand, I can trick it scarf then to make it much more manageable with steelix. C: If all else fails, it might be worth it to sac steelix to stop a sweep. Obviously, I'd rather not get to this point, but it's there as a last resort. Overall, the best option is to not get copied in the first place.

Proof of peak:

 

[aidan amoongus]

Yknow. I didn't really expect to be here. I mostly play ph more on the side. But some-fucking-how I have managed to hit 14th on ladder with 1600+ elo, including wins vs some prominent players. So I figure I'll share the team cuz why not

The Team

https://pokepast.es/34e459642438b5ac

Now, normally I would share my building process. However, as the name suggests, this team was originally conceived as some random bullshit to battle my friend. As such, I will instead be explaining what each member does in practice.

Kartana is an extremely funny lil guy. It's pretty simple, spam the nuke button. Eq to hit steelix better, sub to avoid status and imposter. As kartana is something of a glass cannon, I don't like to bring it in often unless I really want to take a kill or I'm confident it can sweep. Overall, kartana is extremely simple, just bring it in and nuke something when the time feels right.

Gyarados serves dual-purpose as a wguard mon and a mbreaker sweeper. It serves as a wall to various stuff, can later be used as a breaker or sweeper. Ice shard smacks zygod and to a lesser degree mray, not much to say here. Tends to be my gamewinner more than kartana as it has easier setup opportunities.

Tank/pivot/anti-setup. We all know what it does. Funnily enough, it can also pp stall vs a single mon in the endgame if absolutely necessary, tho it's not optimal. Spikes could be used over rocks.

Serves as my priority of choice. Good at sweeping (there might be a pattern here). Oblivion wing and photon geyser smack most stuff, dkiss can target dark wguards. It can't hit psychic wguards, but there are multiple other options for those on this team.

Revenge killer. Moongeist hits a lot of stuff quite well, photon geyser hits others. Trick scarf is great at crippling defensive mons (particularly zygod or utility wguards) or punishing sleep leads, and tail glow is admittedly replaceable. It could sweep slower teams, but most teams will have at least a mon or two faster, especially with modest. So usually on the rare occasion that I use tail glow, it's moreso to force in another offensive mon after I kill the trapped one. Gengar mainly serves as good speed control/revenge killing and can help break bulkier mons.

Regigigas is a bulkier wguard. It's best used when I'm trying to setup without using a glass cannon. Spectral thief is also useful to steal buffs from most mons and hit ghosts. Very simple, very straightforward. Safety goggles could be used, but I prefer lefties for better longevity.

Tips for Usage

I'll usually lead with either steelix or gengar. Steelix can get up hazards, stop anti-lead setup, or pivot out while gengar can chip down lead threats or trick scarf. In the event that I'd rather keep Gengar alive, I'll switch into the appropriate mon.

In terms of breaking/sweeping, Gyarados tends to be my go-to early on. It's much easier to setup than Kartana due to wguard and it hits harder faster than Regigigas. Later on, if I can get the opportunity, Kartana becomes much better as it has obscene firepower right off the bat and can run away with games after a single shell smash. Regigigas tends to leverage its bulk over its firepower to break mons and doesn't usually sweep. On the special side, Gengar will almost never sweep, but stag scarf can be amazing at taking down threats after saccing a mon or otherwise getting valuable chip that can allow my other mons to break through. Megaray is probably my second go-to in the early game as it can be kept healthy rather easily and very quickly hits hard after tail glow.

In general, it's worth it to sac a physical attacker to innards out, given that there's two more of them and that's one less innards out to deal with later. Similarly, it can also be worth it to sac Gengar to get chip on a single mmx to get it within range of Megaray's oblivion wing. If there are multiple, I'll instead have to find an opportunity to set up Kartana, Gyara, or Megaray, which can be difficult but not impossible.

I'll admit it, Kartana isn't improofed very well. However, it's usually fine as I don't bring it in that much anyways. In the event that it does get copied, there are a couple courses of action that I can take: A: if my sash is intact, I can just spam shell smash and kill. B: if the imposter comes in beforehand, I can trick it scarf then to make it much more manageable with steelix. C: If all else fails, it might be worth it to sac steelix to stop a sweep. Obviously, I'd rather not get to this point, but it's there as a last resort. Overall, the best option is to not get copied in the first place.

Proof of peak:
View attachment 721562

Hi, it’s that guy from OMMs who glazes Amoonguss.

The team seems pretty decent, like a regular team. However, some thoughts:

The Kartana set seems a bit off. Substitute is anti-synergy with Focus Sash, and it's not impproofed well. Substitute should not be your imp proof, but you are close with Steelix. Earthquake is weird on the set though, because Steelix as your impproof can't impproof it well. Gyarados@Gyaradosinite also doesn't seem like your ideal imp proof because it gets 2HKOed iirc. As someone who uses Huge Power Kartana and terrorizes low and mid ladder (sometimes high), I think you should change the set to this:


Kartana @ Focus Sash
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Shell Smash
- Sunsteel Strike
- Searing Sunraze Smash
- Ice Shard

Explanation of why I chose Searing Sunraze Smash and Ice Shard:
Huge Power Kartana at +2 using Searing Sunraze Smash OHKOes every Pokemon in the game except for three. Those three Pokemon are all unviable here, except for one semi-viable. They are Eviolite Magneton, Heatran, and Volcanion. This leaves few counters for this beast other than outspeed and kill it, Innards Out, Scarf Imposter, and most notably Prankster Haze. Even Prankster Haze falls short most of the time though, as Zygarde C, the most common PrankHaze user in the format can get killed by a +2 Huge Power Ice Shard. It can't Haze it because Kartana outspeeds.

I also would recommend changing Steelix to Goggles or Shed Shell mainly because you have no Prankster Haze check unless Gyara has mega evolved. Shed Shell is just generally good at escaping trapping, which isn't as huge of a problem IMO, but still is a problem. This is the same for Gigas.

On Steelix, I recommend dropping Parting Shot because you are Prankster. This lets Dark types stop you from pivoting, and Bouncers annoying you. If you want to pivot, try U-Turn.

Hope that helps!