We can’t have acces to the team, like there is no link to the paste (or I am just dumb)So, this is my first time posting here so, i'mma just make this quick.
- Dual HP& Bounce (Pretty good on offense and defense, made it to 1700 with my account: High Bullsht & Adapting Bullsht)
-Weakness () Random No Guards are a pain to scout for
() Parental Bonds yea also scout for these too
() Innards Out you will only have to rely on which mon you will have to sac for it
() Priority Moves/Abilities who even uses Triage?
() Harvest If you're lucky enough if it doesn't harvest for at least 20/30 turns
-
Welcome to Smogon! Take a moment to read the Introduction to Smogon for a run-down on everything Smogon, and make sure you take some time to read the global rules.
Metagame USUM Pure Hackmons
- Thread starter NToTheN
- Start date
they fixed it (click on the pokemon icons)
This doesn't block EEvoboost if the move is clicked the turn the mon is affected by taunt (because it’s a Z-move)
This is how it works : https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7purehackmons-2281501268
Face Zygod MBreaker infestation + spore + sunseed and see if it is 'slow'.
Didn’t you mean less Atk ?
This is true but imo entrainment is better because it blocks MBouncer as well (like y’aint gonna have 0 ability and block status from MBouncers) and except having Lovely Kiss no Sturdy or WG runners have low accuracy moves
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Recently I did my first RMT, and I would like to submit it as a sample.
https://pokepast.es/45698e275b608945
Triple Kartana HO (or TriKart for short)
Introduction
Welcome to my first RMT! Hyper Offense has always been my favourite playstyle. But lately I've been using balance because it's easier to use for laddering and I even reached #1 with Zenith Mode. So I wanted to make a HO team that doesn't struggle with cursed teams on the ladder, while still being good against viable teams. So here it is: Triple Kartana HO...
Introduction
Welcome to my first RMT! Hyper Offense has always been my favourite playstyle. But lately I've been using balance because it's easier to use for laddering and I even reached #1 with Zenith Mode. So I wanted to make a HO team that doesn't struggle with cursed teams on the ladder, while still being good against viable teams. So here it is: Triple Kartana HO...
I really like the team but the fact that every single offense mon loses to MGar Scarf PBond Moongeist is kinda sad.Recently I did my first RMT, and I would like to submit it as a sample.
https://pokepast.es/45698e275b608945Triple Kartana HO (or TriKart for short)
Introduction
Welcome to my first RMT! Hyper Offense has always been my favourite playstyle. But lately I've been using balance because it's easier to use for laddering and I even reached #1 with Zenith Mode. So I wanted to make a HO team that doesn't struggle with cursed teams on the ladder, while still being good against viable teams. So here it is: Triple Kartana HO...
It relies also a lot on Sashes with only 1 defogger.
And Kart's Pursuit can’t OHKO (iirc) neither Blissey nor Lunala if they don't switch out, if you feel that you need to OHKO them you can run HoopaU (but it’s slower and hasn't Sunsteel STAB)
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VR Update for Jan 19, 2025
Regular VR Changes
S- to S
A+ to A
A to B+
A to B+
A to A+
A to A+
A- to A
A- to B+
A- to B+
B+ to A
B+ to A-
B+ to B
B+ to B
B+ to B
B to B+
B to C
B to B-
B to B-
B- to C
B- to C
B- to C
B- to B
B- to C
C to UR
C to B
C to B-
C to UR
All previously D rank mons have been unranked. They are not viable.
Wonder Guard VR Changes
S to A+
A+ to A
A+ to A
A to A-
A- to B
A to A-
A- to UR
B+ to B-
B to B-
B to B-
B to UR
B to C
B to B+
B- to B
B- to UR
B- to B
B- to B
B- to B
C to UR
UR to C
C to B+
D to C
D to C
D to UR
UR to B-
Regular VR Changes
All previously D rank mons have been unranked. They are not viable.
Wonder Guard VR Changes
A few questions-Who uses Wonder Guard Chansey and Blissey?VR Update for Jan 19, 2025
Regular VR Changes
S- to S
A+ to A
A to B+
A to B+
A to A+
A to A+
A- to A
A- to B+
A- to B+
B+ to A
B+ to A-
B+ to B
B+ to B
B+ to B
B to B+
B to C
B to B-
B to B-
B- to C
B- to C
B- to C
B- to B
B- to C
C to UR
C to B
C to B-
C to UR
All previously D rank mons have been unranked. They are not viable.
Wonder Guard VR Changes
S to A+
A+ to A
A+ to A
A to A-
A- to B
A to A-
A- to UR
B+ to B-
B to B-
B to B-
B to UR
B to C
B to B+
B- to B
B- to UR
B- to B
B- to B
B- to B
C to UR
UR to C
C to B+
D to C
D to C
D to UR
UR to B-
Who is using Heracross other than Zeus? What did Sceptile to do to deserve that rank? If you say its a good No Guard because of its Speed, might as well use Deoxys-Speed.
Also why did Maud get ranked lower
Got 5 things to say (only 1 interesting)VR Update for Jan 19, 2025
Regular VR Changes
S- to S
A+ to A
A to B+
A to B+
A to A+
A to A+
A- to A
A- to B+
A- to B+
B+ to A
B+ to A-
B+ to B
B+ to B
B+ to B
B to B+
B to C
B to B-
B to B-
B- to C
B- to C
B- to C
B- to B
B- to C
C to UR
C to B
C to B-
C to UR
All previously D rank mons have been unranked. They are not viable.
Wonder Guard VR Changes
S to A+
A+ to A
A+ to A
A to A-
A- to B
A to A-
A- to UR
B+ to B-
B to B-
B to B-
B to UR
B to C
B to B+
B- to B
B- to UR
B- to B
B- to B
B- to B
C to UR
UR to C
C to B+
D to C
D to C
D to UR
UR to B-
-
UR to C is red and not green- Same for MRay :
A- to B+- So no more WG S ?
- Imo Exca shouldn't be rank changed : it is one of the few innards that can reasonably switch in a Special move and die : Lunala an Solgaleo has a lot of Def as well as Tina and Ariyama is way to slow (rn I don’t think of any other good innards except blob family)
And YES, Blissey Kartana and Scizor-Mega are getting the rank they deserve, finally.
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Ik WG bliss/chans are good special walls because people stopped running sword in favor of bug buzz, meaning there isn't consistent coverage for them, while also they can just take advantage of their absurd special bulk. Mhera, despite how often the ladder sets misuse it, has good stabs for current meta, and the combination of fantastic attack + stab First impression means it can be a threatening revenge killer, while it's lack of moldy move stab holds it back, it still has the ability to pressure both offensive and defensive psychic or dark types.
First of all, I realized several days ago that it's now been over 1 year since USUM had its permaladder. First of all, happy belated 1st year anniversary to the Gen 7 Pure Hackmons permaladder. It's been a wonderful time so far with lots of new developments made. I hope this continues as we move forward.
I'm using this opportunity to create a new post I've had in mind since. I apologize for how messy this post is. I've been having my thoughts on it scattered around all week and struggled with trying to piece it all together.
Hardcounting Wonder Guard Mega Audino goes two ways.
1) You either spam Poison-type moves in the game and get walled by a bunch of different Pokémon, whether they're Steel-types, Zygarde-Complete, or other Wonder Guards, as Poison-type coverage only ever exists for Mega Audino and is not great against anything else ever. Even for Poison chip damage.
2) You go out of your way to spam high power Sunsteel Strike or Searing Sunraze Smash alongside coverage, making virtually no Wonder Guard a consistently suitable wall.
You cannot successfully hardcounter Mega Audino teams as much as possible without more than just Mega Audino being punished as a Wonder Guard.
Mega Audino should not be harshly punished for losing against Searing Sunraze Smash or Light That Burns The Sky attackers because
On top of the calcs above, the most heavy attackers in this game have a very small window of Pokémon being able to wall their move at all, allowing them to run specific coverage moves to target whatever opposing Wonder Guard would come closest to being able to overcome them.
If Kartana raises up in usage, Mega Audino should not be punished, because no Wonder Guard takes the best Kartana sets very well.
If Z-Moves rise up in usage, Mega Audino should not be punished, because no Wonder Guard handles Z-Move attackers very well and the few that could survive in particular circumstances can be overwhelmed by coverage that could easily fit into their set.
Mega Slowbro tends to be used as a wall for Mega Mewtwo X and Kartana, but there are plenty of Huge Power Mega Mewtwo X who run Bug-type moves and more Kartana as of late running Grass-type attacks. Additionally, Mega Slowbro's 5 weaknesses leave it vulnerable to Mega Mewtwo X running a large variety of coverage options for it.
Mega Audino's biggest weaknesses just happen to be the very moves designed to take down all Wonder Guards. When it's not this, it's moves that do nothing against any other Wonder Guard Pokémon, portraying a bigger opportunity cost than running other types of coverage. While Mega Audino is weak to Sunsteel Strike, the greatest Wonder Guard Pokémon who take the move neutrally do not switch into a Huge Power Sunsteel Strike. Otherwise, Mega Audino tends to be bulky enough to find chances of switching into non-Huge Power Sunsteel Strike off most attackers. In addition, Mega Audino's overall bulk is notably higher than every other great defensive Wonder Guard Pokémon in the metagame when Defense and Special Defense are factored, allowing it to take its weaknesses better than non-Sunsteel/Poison weak Wonder Guard Pokémon could take their own weaknesses. While Sunsteel Strike is everywhere, managing Sunsteel Strike isn't as overbearing as Alolan Muk managing Ground-type moves, Meloetta managing Dark-type or Bug-type moves, or Mega Slowbro managing many Grass, Bug, Electric, Ground, and Ghost-type moves. All of which are also very common.
Meloetta is weak to Dark-type moves and Bug-type moves. The latter has become very common as many of the top Wonder Guard Pokémon are weak to Bug. Dark-type attacks are not as common and Meloetta in particular is not a very strong presence in the metagame. However, if it ever becomes significantly problematic, there is little stopping teams from running the valuable Pursuit alongside Bug-type moves. This would stop Meloetta from being able to switch out, punish it significantly with Sunsteel Strike and Bug-type attacks, and render Meloetta significantly less effective as a Pokémon.
Alolan Muk is weak to Ground-type moves. Fissure is now what I'd argue to be the best OHKO move in the metagame due to its merits in hitting and defeating Alolan Muk teams over what Sheer Cold could otherwise do. Flying-type Pokémon are immune to Fissure, but can be counteracted by Zap Cannon and are otherwise not too great of Pokémon in USUM Pure Hackmons altogether. It is rare to see a Flying-type Pokémon serve high effectiveness in this game from what I've seen. Alolan Muk is forced to run Air Balloon in order to overcome Fissure, which is a liability of its own because it makes the Wonder Guard prone to Spore and prone to Shadow Tag Primal Groudon simultaneously. The Air Balloon is also not very difficult to pop in most games as many teams have either Moongeist Beam or Sunsteel Strike somewhere to hit Muk. Once Air Balloon is popped, Alolan Muk is vulnerable to Fissure from No Guard Pokémon and Thousand Waves from the best defensive Pokémon in the game. These combined liabilities are what Mega Audino does not have to go through. While Alolan Muk has the supposed advantage of not being weak to Sunsteel Strike, it hates getting hit by Sunsteel Strike despite this and cannot switch into its best users very effectively. I'd argue it hates Sunsteel Strike more than certain sets of Mega Audino even.
One major error I've seen personally is people trying to rank Wonder Guards based on their physical prowess; particularly, in terms of handling Mega Mewtwo X. Ranking Wonder Guards by how well they can take on Mega Mewtwo X is a fool's errand. If you try to do this, the best Wonder Guard of today would be the worst Wonder Guard by next Tuesday. Let's be real; this is Huge Power Mega Mewtwo X. If a Wonder Guard Pokémon just happens to tick it off a little bit more than the rest, Mega Mewtwo X will go through every coverage move in the book to ensure that Wonder Guard doesn't get a chance to breathe until it becomes less relevant. Mega Mewtwo X in high level gameplay can, will, and should run moves to take down any Wonder Guard they feel is a big enough threat to the team Mega Mewtwo X is in. Not doing so is either a skill issue on the builder or proves the Pokémon was not a great enough threat to concern Mega Mewtwo X in the first place.
Many less powerful Searing Sunraze Smash Pokémon, Light That Burn The Sky, Photon Geyser, and Sunsteel Strike Pokémon exist, which harm Mega Audino more than Wonder Guard Pokémon below it, but these Pokémon are more manageable by other walls in general until they run more extreme, more viable sets. Additionally, unlike any other Wonder Guard, Mega Audino can also pair very well with just about any other wall. I find one of the primary things that make Mega Audino a cut above the rest are its unique weaknesses and overall bulk. Mega Audino serves a better chance of sealing in wins as it can pair with many Pokémon who take Poison-type and Steel-type moves while also not being weak to anything extra, such as Bug-type pivoting moves, Dark-type utility moves, or the load of coverage options the likes of Mega Slowbro and Mega Gyarados can suddenly get nuked by.
There's a message I'm trying to convey in all of this, but I'm honestly not sure I made it understandable enough, so I'm cutting right to the chase here:
If Mega Audino falls off, all of Wonder Guard falls off. There is no specific way for Mega Audino alone to fall off as the very moves that target Mega Audino are the same moves that target all Wonder Guard Pokémon and no Wonder Guard Pokémon can be consistently relied upon to fight back against those moves without struggling due to brute coverage. Major non-Wonder Guard walls such as Zygarde-Complete, Mega Steelix, Doublade, and perhaps even Fur Coat Mega Slowbro are better at dealing with Photon Geyser, Sunsteel Strike, and their Z-Move counterparts than any Wonder Guard Pokémon is. Alongside this, Innards Out has shown to be a suitable replacement for Wonder Guard when given to Chansey or Blissey, making teams not need a Wonder Guard Pokémon in some cases. The best Wonder Guard Pokémon in this metagame should primarily focus on walling Moongeist Beam and to a more limited degree, special Photon Geyser. They should also focus on preventing their team from losing to OHKO moves as these moves hit everything except for Wonder Guard and Sturdy Pokémon. Walling these moves is their primary job and what they do best in the metagame. That being said, if you are running a Wonder Guard at all, it is usually best to run two Wonder Guard Pokémon. The dual-Wonder Guard archetype remains dominant enough in the metagame to still place Wonder Guard itself in S rank.
Tl;dr: The best moves that cause Mega Audino to fall off affect every Wonder Guard simultaneously, making things worse for every Wonder Guard if more Pokémon run stronger moves to fight off Mega Audino.
Now because Mega Audino falling off cannot be done without Wonder Guard falling off as a whole imo, I see Mega Audino as a pure reflection of Wonder Guard itself in the Gen 7 Pure Hackmons metagame. This isn't something any other Pokémon could achieve so here's a quote I have prepped up for this:
"Mega Audino is the health of Wonder Guard. The weaker Mega Audino is, the weaker Wonder Guard is in the metagame."
but then you also have this quote from dramlamb
"Wonder Guard is the health of Hackmons. The weaker Wonder Guard is, the less competitive the metagame." -dramlamb
So you know what this means?
"Mega Audino is the health of Hackmons. The weaker Mega Audino is, the less competitive the metagame." -Ransei
This logic only applies to Gen 7 Pure Hackmons specifically and it's not exclusively tied to Mega Audino, but also some of the metagame's other great defensive units such as Chansey, Blissey, Zygarde-Complete, Doublade, and more. This exclusively ties to Mega Audino under Wonder Guard but multiple Pokémon outside Wonder Guard also glue this metagame together.
Despite Mega Audino being the health of Wonder Guard and a reflection of it, I can justify Mega Audino being on A+ as no Wonder Guard in this metagame is perfect. Mega Audino is still in need of partners to take on its weaknesses oftentimes and there are plenty enough Wonder Guard cores you could get away with without having Mega Audino involved. Mega Audino isn't extremely dominant in the metagame, which would otherwise consistently justify an "S" rank, but Wonder Guard as a presence is extremely dominant through the use of 2 per standard team in order to counteract No Guard.
I'm using this opportunity to create a new post I've had in mind since. I apologize for how messy this post is. I've been having my thoughts on it scattered around all week and struggled with trying to piece it all together.
Earlier I said I've already said I had nothing new to say about Mega Audino in the Gen 7 Pure Hackmons metagame but after reflecting on the VR changes made as of recent, some things have struck me. Here's what's possibly my final bout of me rambling about Mega Audino in Gen 7 Pure Hackmons. I believe I've already said everything else I needed to say, making future posts about it redundant.Mega Audino
I got nothing new to say here. I just want people to express their honest thoughts on Mega Audino lol. It's still the most used Wonder Guard in the metagame and quite successful in many team compositions as it provides great synergy in many cases, but there's also lots of teams that opt out of this Pokemon.
Given my explanation over why I found Mega Audino to be the best Wonder Guard in the metagame, I'm here explain a core reason Mega Audino finds itself in the specific circumstance it's in and why Mega Audino can never truly fall off despite Sunsteel Strike, Searing Sunraze Smash, or other moves Mega Audino does not serve well against being present everywhere in the metagame.
Hardcounting Wonder Guard Mega Audino goes two ways.
1) You either spam Poison-type moves in the game and get walled by a bunch of different Pokémon, whether they're Steel-types, Zygarde-Complete, or other Wonder Guards, as Poison-type coverage only ever exists for Mega Audino and is not great against anything else ever. Even for Poison chip damage.
2) You go out of your way to spam high power Sunsteel Strike or Searing Sunraze Smash alongside coverage, making virtually no Wonder Guard a consistently suitable wall.
You cannot successfully hardcounter Mega Audino teams as much as possible without more than just Mega Audino being punished as a Wonder Guard.
Mega Audino should not be harshly punished for losing against Searing Sunraze Smash or Light That Burns The Sky attackers because
252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Searing Sunraze Smash vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Muk-Alola: 604-711 (145.8 - 171.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Searing Sunraze Smash vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Meloetta: 595-700 (147.2 - 173.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Searing Sunraze Smash vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Arceus: 405-477 (91.2 - 107.4%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO
Neutrally effective Wonder Guard Pokémon do not survive +0 itemless Searing Sunraze Smash from Mega Mewtwo X
+2 252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Light That Burns the Sky vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro-Mega: 447-527 (113.4 - 133.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Light That Burns the Sky vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Steelix-Mega: 367-432 (103.6 - 122%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Resisted Wonder Guard Pokémon do not survive Huge Power Light That Burns The Sky Mega Mewtwo X after 1 Shell Smash or Extreme Evoboost
+2 252+ Atk Huge Power Kartana Searing Sunraze Smash vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro-Mega: 432-508 (109.6 - 128.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Huge Power Kartana Searing Sunraze Smash vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Steelix-Mega: 354-417 (100 - 117.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Resisted Wonder Guard Pokémon do not survive Searing Sunraze Smash Kartana after 1 Shell Smash or Extreme Evoboost
252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Searing Sunraze Smash vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Meloetta: 595-700 (147.2 - 173.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Searing Sunraze Smash vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Arceus: 405-477 (91.2 - 107.4%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO
Neutrally effective Wonder Guard Pokémon do not survive +0 itemless Searing Sunraze Smash from Mega Mewtwo X
+2 252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Light That Burns the Sky vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro-Mega: 447-527 (113.4 - 133.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Light That Burns the Sky vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Steelix-Mega: 367-432 (103.6 - 122%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Resisted Wonder Guard Pokémon do not survive Huge Power Light That Burns The Sky Mega Mewtwo X after 1 Shell Smash or Extreme Evoboost
+2 252+ Atk Huge Power Kartana Searing Sunraze Smash vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro-Mega: 432-508 (109.6 - 128.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Huge Power Kartana Searing Sunraze Smash vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Steelix-Mega: 354-417 (100 - 117.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Resisted Wonder Guard Pokémon do not survive Searing Sunraze Smash Kartana after 1 Shell Smash or Extreme Evoboost
If Kartana raises up in usage, Mega Audino should not be punished, because no Wonder Guard takes the best Kartana sets very well.
If Z-Moves rise up in usage, Mega Audino should not be punished, because no Wonder Guard handles Z-Move attackers very well and the few that could survive in particular circumstances can be overwhelmed by coverage that could easily fit into their set.
Mega Slowbro tends to be used as a wall for Mega Mewtwo X and Kartana, but there are plenty of Huge Power Mega Mewtwo X who run Bug-type moves and more Kartana as of late running Grass-type attacks. Additionally, Mega Slowbro's 5 weaknesses leave it vulnerable to Mega Mewtwo X running a large variety of coverage options for it.
Mega Audino's biggest weaknesses just happen to be the very moves designed to take down all Wonder Guards. When it's not this, it's moves that do nothing against any other Wonder Guard Pokémon, portraying a bigger opportunity cost than running other types of coverage. While Mega Audino is weak to Sunsteel Strike, the greatest Wonder Guard Pokémon who take the move neutrally do not switch into a Huge Power Sunsteel Strike. Otherwise, Mega Audino tends to be bulky enough to find chances of switching into non-Huge Power Sunsteel Strike off most attackers. In addition, Mega Audino's overall bulk is notably higher than every other great defensive Wonder Guard Pokémon in the metagame when Defense and Special Defense are factored, allowing it to take its weaknesses better than non-Sunsteel/Poison weak Wonder Guard Pokémon could take their own weaknesses. While Sunsteel Strike is everywhere, managing Sunsteel Strike isn't as overbearing as Alolan Muk managing Ground-type moves, Meloetta managing Dark-type or Bug-type moves, or Mega Slowbro managing many Grass, Bug, Electric, Ground, and Ghost-type moves. All of which are also very common.
Meloetta is weak to Dark-type moves and Bug-type moves. The latter has become very common as many of the top Wonder Guard Pokémon are weak to Bug. Dark-type attacks are not as common and Meloetta in particular is not a very strong presence in the metagame. However, if it ever becomes significantly problematic, there is little stopping teams from running the valuable Pursuit alongside Bug-type moves. This would stop Meloetta from being able to switch out, punish it significantly with Sunsteel Strike and Bug-type attacks, and render Meloetta significantly less effective as a Pokémon.
Alolan Muk is weak to Ground-type moves. Fissure is now what I'd argue to be the best OHKO move in the metagame due to its merits in hitting and defeating Alolan Muk teams over what Sheer Cold could otherwise do. Flying-type Pokémon are immune to Fissure, but can be counteracted by Zap Cannon and are otherwise not too great of Pokémon in USUM Pure Hackmons altogether. It is rare to see a Flying-type Pokémon serve high effectiveness in this game from what I've seen. Alolan Muk is forced to run Air Balloon in order to overcome Fissure, which is a liability of its own because it makes the Wonder Guard prone to Spore and prone to Shadow Tag Primal Groudon simultaneously. The Air Balloon is also not very difficult to pop in most games as many teams have either Moongeist Beam or Sunsteel Strike somewhere to hit Muk. Once Air Balloon is popped, Alolan Muk is vulnerable to Fissure from No Guard Pokémon and Thousand Waves from the best defensive Pokémon in the game. These combined liabilities are what Mega Audino does not have to go through. While Alolan Muk has the supposed advantage of not being weak to Sunsteel Strike, it hates getting hit by Sunsteel Strike despite this and cannot switch into its best users very effectively. I'd argue it hates Sunsteel Strike more than certain sets of Mega Audino even.
One major error I've seen personally is people trying to rank Wonder Guards based on their physical prowess; particularly, in terms of handling Mega Mewtwo X. Ranking Wonder Guards by how well they can take on Mega Mewtwo X is a fool's errand. If you try to do this, the best Wonder Guard of today would be the worst Wonder Guard by next Tuesday. Let's be real; this is Huge Power Mega Mewtwo X. If a Wonder Guard Pokémon just happens to tick it off a little bit more than the rest, Mega Mewtwo X will go through every coverage move in the book to ensure that Wonder Guard doesn't get a chance to breathe until it becomes less relevant. Mega Mewtwo X in high level gameplay can, will, and should run moves to take down any Wonder Guard they feel is a big enough threat to the team Mega Mewtwo X is in. Not doing so is either a skill issue on the builder or proves the Pokémon was not a great enough threat to concern Mega Mewtwo X in the first place.
Many less powerful Searing Sunraze Smash Pokémon, Light That Burn The Sky, Photon Geyser, and Sunsteel Strike Pokémon exist, which harm Mega Audino more than Wonder Guard Pokémon below it, but these Pokémon are more manageable by other walls in general until they run more extreme, more viable sets. Additionally, unlike any other Wonder Guard, Mega Audino can also pair very well with just about any other wall. I find one of the primary things that make Mega Audino a cut above the rest are its unique weaknesses and overall bulk. Mega Audino serves a better chance of sealing in wins as it can pair with many Pokémon who take Poison-type and Steel-type moves while also not being weak to anything extra, such as Bug-type pivoting moves, Dark-type utility moves, or the load of coverage options the likes of Mega Slowbro and Mega Gyarados can suddenly get nuked by.
There's a message I'm trying to convey in all of this, but I'm honestly not sure I made it understandable enough, so I'm cutting right to the chase here:
If Mega Audino falls off, all of Wonder Guard falls off. There is no specific way for Mega Audino alone to fall off as the very moves that target Mega Audino are the same moves that target all Wonder Guard Pokémon and no Wonder Guard Pokémon can be consistently relied upon to fight back against those moves without struggling due to brute coverage. Major non-Wonder Guard walls such as Zygarde-Complete, Mega Steelix, Doublade, and perhaps even Fur Coat Mega Slowbro are better at dealing with Photon Geyser, Sunsteel Strike, and their Z-Move counterparts than any Wonder Guard Pokémon is. Alongside this, Innards Out has shown to be a suitable replacement for Wonder Guard when given to Chansey or Blissey, making teams not need a Wonder Guard Pokémon in some cases. The best Wonder Guard Pokémon in this metagame should primarily focus on walling Moongeist Beam and to a more limited degree, special Photon Geyser. They should also focus on preventing their team from losing to OHKO moves as these moves hit everything except for Wonder Guard and Sturdy Pokémon. Walling these moves is their primary job and what they do best in the metagame. That being said, if you are running a Wonder Guard at all, it is usually best to run two Wonder Guard Pokémon. The dual-Wonder Guard archetype remains dominant enough in the metagame to still place Wonder Guard itself in S rank.
Tl;dr: The best moves that cause Mega Audino to fall off affect every Wonder Guard simultaneously, making things worse for every Wonder Guard if more Pokémon run stronger moves to fight off Mega Audino.
Now because Mega Audino falling off cannot be done without Wonder Guard falling off as a whole imo, I see Mega Audino as a pure reflection of Wonder Guard itself in the Gen 7 Pure Hackmons metagame. This isn't something any other Pokémon could achieve so here's a quote I have prepped up for this:
"Mega Audino is the health of Wonder Guard. The weaker Mega Audino is, the weaker Wonder Guard is in the metagame."
but then you also have this quote from dramlamb
"Wonder Guard is the health of Hackmons. The weaker Wonder Guard is, the less competitive the metagame." -dramlamb
So you know what this means?
"Mega Audino is the health of Hackmons. The weaker Mega Audino is, the less competitive the metagame." -Ransei
This logic only applies to Gen 7 Pure Hackmons specifically and it's not exclusively tied to Mega Audino, but also some of the metagame's other great defensive units such as Chansey, Blissey, Zygarde-Complete, Doublade, and more. This exclusively ties to Mega Audino under Wonder Guard but multiple Pokémon outside Wonder Guard also glue this metagame together.
Despite Mega Audino being the health of Wonder Guard and a reflection of it, I can justify Mega Audino being on A+ as no Wonder Guard in this metagame is perfect. Mega Audino is still in need of partners to take on its weaknesses oftentimes and there are plenty enough Wonder Guard cores you could get away with without having Mega Audino involved. Mega Audino isn't extremely dominant in the metagame, which would otherwise consistently justify an "S" rank, but Wonder Guard as a presence is extremely dominant through the use of 2 per standard team in order to counteract No Guard.
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I totally agree with almost every thing especially this :
Also, this
exists.
That being said, according to this description, Meloetta would be the best Wonder Guard, even if it has worse special and physical bulk and is fatser (I do agree MAud is better but not according to this).
Also, this
exists.I got nothing to say other than
Meloetta is weak to Dark-type moves and Bug-type moves. The latter has become very common as many of the top Wonder Guard Pokémon are weak to Bug. Dark-type attacks are not as common and Meloetta in particular is not a very strong presence in the metagame. However, if it ever becomes significantly problematic, there is little stopping teams from running the valuable Pursuit alongside Bug-type moves. This would stop Meloetta from being able to switch out, punish it significantly with Sunsteel Strike and Bug-type attacks, and render Meloetta significantly less effective as a Pokémon.
posed advantage of not being weak to Sunsteel Strike, it hates getting hit by Sunsteel Strike despite this and cannot switch into its best users very effectively. I'd argue it hates Sunsteel Strike more than certain sets of Mega Audino even.
(Adding this the month after I made this post, but I think this could be better and I'll update it at some point)
As a big fan of Meloetta, I am going to defend it and give my opinion here. You mention Meloetta's bug and dark weakness but I believe they are not as bad as you make out to be. For starters, neither Meloetta or Mega Audino wants to stay in on any physical attacker that runs bug coverage (for example MMX but ig that's pretty obvious) as they both die to them due to them running sunsteel strike anyways. As for the special attackers, dark coverage doesn't really exist outside of the mons who get STAB on it like Hoopa and Ash Greninja that aren't the most amazing mons anyways who Mega Audino isn't saying in on unless maybe it has U-turn which Meloetta can and often does run too. And as for bug coverage, the strongest bug attack that can ever threaten Meloetta is a +2 bug buzz from Gengar Mega. This does 74-93% max iirc and Meloetta runs spec thief hitting it for big damage it can't recover (70% roughly) and outspeeds it afterwards meaning that Gengar does't really want to stay in on it anyways. And this is at +2, at +0 it can't really do anything. Gengar is the most common bug buzz user, and the other mons who run it don't hit as hard and have a harder time into Meloetta (such as Dawn Wings who is weaker, is 4x weak to spec thief and doesn't run a sash). The only real problems I believe Meloetta's weaknesses bring it is that it has worse synergy then Mega Audino does.
You also said "The best Wonder Guard Pokémon in this metagame should primarily focus on walling Moongeist Beam and to a more limited degree, special Photon Geyser". By this description Mega Audino isn't the best wonder guard, it is Meloetta. Mega Audino cannot be relied on as the main special wall unlike Meloetta. Mega Audino often functions as a support mon whereas Meloetta is a consistent special wall, and the mons ran along side Meloetta often function similar to Mega Audino as support mons such as Celesteela so I believe Meloetta brings more value to a team. All of what I've said is why I personally believe Meloetta is better then Mega Audino.
I'm not the most well known player nor do I have the most popular opinion on this but I hope what I've said here is helpful. Thanks for reading, bye.
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Yo, I made this post but nobody replied, so I'm assuming that the team
Replays will be at the end of this post.
So, enough of the mundane, let's get down to business.
HO 2 innards + Kartana Magic Guard
(Slaking) @ Leppa Berry
Ability: Harvest
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Substitute
- Shore Up
- Extreme Evoboost
- Searing Sunraze Smash
(Gengar-Mega) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Parental Bond
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sludge Wave
- Moongeist Beam
- Bug Buzz
- Ice Beam
(Scizor-Mega) @ Fire Memory
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Impish Nature
- Shell Smash
- Strength Sap
- Sunsteel Strike
- Multi-Attack
(Kartana) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Spectral Thief
- Defog
- Sunsteel Strike
- Pursuit
(Excadrill) @ Leftovers
Ability: Innards Out
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Naughty Nature
IVs: 0 Def / 0 SpD
- Sunsteel Strike
- Shell Smash
- Thousand Arrows
- Magic Coat
(Blissey) @ Shed Shell
Ability: Innards Out
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 252 SpD
Gentle Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Def / 0 Spe
- Transform
- Parting Shot
- Whirlwind
- Shore Up
TEAM BUILDING PROCESS :(Slaking) @ Leppa Berry
Ability: Harvest
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Substitute
- Shore Up
- Extreme Evoboost
- Searing Sunraze Smash
(Gengar-Mega) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Parental Bond
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sludge Wave
- Moongeist Beam
- Bug Buzz
- Ice Beam
(Scizor-Mega) @ Fire Memory
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Impish Nature
- Shell Smash
- Strength Sap
- Sunsteel Strike
- Multi-Attack
(Kartana) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Spectral Thief
- Defog
- Sunsteel Strike
- Pursuit
(Excadrill) @ Leftovers
Ability: Innards Out
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Naughty Nature
IVs: 0 Def / 0 SpD
- Sunsteel Strike
- Shell Smash
- Thousand Arrows
- Magic Coat
(Blissey) @ Shed Shell
Ability: Innards Out
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 252 SpD
Gentle Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Def / 0 Spe
- Transform
- Parting Shot
- Whirlwind
- Shore Up
I started this team after being traumatised by Slaking Harvest CFZs spam. So totally logical thinking: I'm going to use it to traumatise other people.
The problem is that this set doesn't effectively hit any steel type with good physical bulk.
To counter this, I chose to use MGar, the best Moongeist Beam user and therefore one of the best pokémons for hitting specials. MMY has a better SpA but the steel type resists Photon Geyser. Admittedly, the set isn't super effective against steel type, but it is capable of 2HKOing a huge majority of steel type, particularly Celesteela. And they're not really capable of inflicting much damage on MGar (except with Spectral Thief).
Other excellent Harvest Slaking counters are Zygod (especially Core Offencer) and Innards Out (mainly Chansey and Blissey).
To counter this I put Ice Beam on MGar and I decided to run Kart with Pursuit and Magic Guard as my third mon (I'll explain why Kart specifically in its description) to counter blobs.
After that, to be relatively viable in Ladder, you need to have a good Wonder Guard, otherwise... check this page... Well, you know the rest...
That's why I've chosen a WG that's certainly subject of debate (in fact, only I like it, but it went up in the last VR), but which fits the role perfectly. In my opinion, MScizor is a perfect match because he's immune (with WG) to the vast majority of attacks used by No Guard (except inferno).
MScizor is also a really good mon to tank physical attacks.
(For example : 252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Photon Geyser vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Scizor-Mega: 135-160 (39.2 - 46.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO) So MScizor can switch-in on any physical attack (except fire attacks, a Flame Charge from MMX is enough to OHKO at 100%). He can also regain the lead in the duel thanks to Strength Sap.
Then, for a good HO, you need at least 1 Innards Out. I decided to take 2 to be sure. The first is Excadrill... yeah, the one that's rank C. Of course nobody likes it, but in my opinion it is excellent for the team. In fact, its weaknesses in fire and fighting make it useful to switch-in in order to punish attackers that threat Kartana and MScizor as well as Slaking and Kart.
He can also be used against POgre/GrenAsh's water attacks as well as ground attacks, which are everywhere. Also it has a good offense so it is not that passiv and has good STABs.
Then I decided to use the most basic Innards Out user of all times... CHANSEY !! The set is pretty classic so I'll talk about it later. (Which I replaced later by blissey)
WHAT THE TEAM IS WEAK AGAINST :
- The team is kinda weak against classic offence (not HO). If the opposing team has too many pokémons that hit hard and have a good bulk (like PDon), it can be complicated to manage them.
- Like all good HOs, the team struggles a little against the Bullshit of the low ladder because it's complicated to anticipate the sets.
SETS’ EXPLANATIONS :
(Slaking) @ Leppa Berry
Ability: Harvest
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Substitute
- Shore Up
- Extreme Evoboost
- Searing Sunraze Smash
Ability: Harvest
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 HP
- Substitute
- Shore Up
- Extreme Evoboost
- Searing Sunraze Smash
This set is particularly classic for Harvest Slak, I use Searing Sunraze Smash over Sunsteel Strike because SSS has the advantage of only having one PP, so if an Imposter manages to transform it can only hit once. It is one of the most threatening set of the meta. As said earlier it can only be countered by few sets such as Zygod (with Core Offencer) and all Innards with 150 base HP or more.
I guess that running it Jolly instead of Adamant could be smart to outspeed other Slak Harvest but I haven't felt this need yet.
I run it with 30 IVs in HP because if no its HPs are divisble by 4 which is a problem with sub.
(Gengar-Mega) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Parental Bond
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sludge Wave
- Moongeist Beam
- Bug Buzz
- Ice Beam
Ability: Parental Bond
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sludge Wave
- Moongeist Beam
- Bug Buzz
- Ice Beam
This set is particularly usefull for this team. It gives a lot of speed control with the Choice Scarf (it outspeeds every single mon without boost).
It is particularly good with Parental Bond to kill a lot of mons used in low ladder as well in mid ladder (OHKO Deo A, Deo S, MMX, Kart with PBond and has over 50% to OHKO MMY 252+ SpA Parental Bond Gengar-Mega Moongeist Beam vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Mewtwo-Mega-Y: 380-452 (91.3 - 108.6%) -- 51.6% chance to OHKO).
With Moongeist it 2HKO many mons that doesn't resist it.
Ice Beam is used to deals massive damage to Zygod (76.7 - 91.1%). Blizzard has 68.4% chance to OHKO it but it can miss.
I run Sludge Wave to deal good damage to MAud (77 - 91.7%) and it's the best STAB to hit normal mons.
Finally I decided to run Bug Buzz in order to hit Meloetta and dark types(It isn’t close to OHKO melo but it will 2HKO almost every time allowing MGar to block it from switching safely every time : 252+ SpA Parental Bond Gengar-Mega Bug Buzz vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Meloetta: 200-238 (49.5 - 58.9%) -- approx. 99.9% chance to 2HKO).I can’t hit normal type WG but these are not really played currently.
(Scizor-Mega) @ Fire Memory
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Impish Nature
- Shell Smash
- Strength Sap
- Sunsteel Strike
- Multi-Attack
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Impish Nature
- Shell Smash
- Strength Sap
- Sunsteel Strike
- Multi-Attack
I know this WG isn't the best but, as I said earlier, it's really useful for this team. I took him to have a more defensive aspect while threatening the opposing team.
He has a more than decent physical bulk, and, having a steel STAB, all he has to do is use Sunsteel Strike to do damage to ALL existing pokémons. Obviously this set is used with Shell Smash to not be to passiv while remaining tanky with -1 Def. I use Multi-Attack with Fire Memory to be self-improofed. Finally, the last attack is Strength Sap, which allows you to heal yourself almost completely from pokemons that hit physicaly. Unfortunately, this healing move won't be as effective against experienced players, as they'll anticeperate and switch to a Magic Bouncer or a pokemon with low Atk.
Finally MSci is also used to improof Kartana even at +6 (note that from +2 and above if you switch in Sunsteel Strike you'd be in range from 2 max roll and one crit) : +6 252 Atk Kartana Sunsteel Strike vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Scizor-Mega: 237-280 (68.8 - 81.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
(Kartana) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Spectral Thief
- Defog
- Sunsteel Strike
- Pursuit
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Spectral Thief
- Defog
- Sunsteel Strike
- Pursuit
Imo Kart is an excellent MG because it has a decent speed (109 Base Stat) and Sunsteel STAB. It has a Focus Sash, thanks to MG it will survive any hit (that doesn’t come from PBond). This will allow Kart to use Spectral Thief and Defog safely. Defog is not that important because this team doesn’t rely on Sashes but it’s needed to keep Innards Out with high HP.
Spectral can be used to avoid sacrificing an Innards.
Pursuit : pursuit traps Innards Out. You'll have to anticipate the switch or click Sunsteel Strike / Spectral Thief (without switch it will kill neither Lunala nor Blissey).
I know that with the Adamant Nature Pursuit has 50% chance to OHKO Innards Out Blissey (252+ Atk Kartana Pursuit (40 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0- Def 0 IVs Blissey: 659-776 (92.2 - 108.6%) -- 50% chance to OHKO) but with Jolly Nature Kartana outspeed pokémons until 121 BS (included).
This is particularly useful against MDiancie which will be outspeeded and OHKO'd (252 Atk Kartana Sunsteel Strike vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Diancie-Mega: 624-736 (205.2 - 242.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO). It is also usefull against Arceus and MRay (and MHoundoom ig).
(Excadrill) @ Leftovers
Ability: Innards Out
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Naughty Nature
IVs: 0 Def / 0 SpD
- Sunsteel Strike
- Shell Smash
- Thousand Arrows
- Magic Coat
Ability: Innards Out
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Naughty Nature
IVs: 0 Def / 0 SpD
- Sunsteel Strike
- Shell Smash
- Thousand Arrows
- Magic Coat
Excadrill is an Innards mon that fits the team perfectly. As I said earlier, it can come up against threats from other pokemons to punish them. It has enough HP to kill many monsters, especially both Mewtwo, and PDon as well as having low HP to die quickly (unlike Guzzlord).
It has 2 excellent STABs, so I play Sunsteel Strike and TArrows. Shell Smash is obvious for doing more damage while losing defences to die faster.
Finally, I chose Magic Coat. I'd originally chosen Spore but Excadrill doesn't have enough Atk to threaten even with Spore.
Thanks to MCoat Exca can counter the Comatose in addition to a huge number of moves, giving it a more utilitarian role.
(Blissey) @ Shed Shell
Ability: Innards Out
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 252 SpD
Gentle Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Def / 0 Spe
- Transform
- Parting Shot
- Whirlwind
- Shore Up
Ability: Innards Out
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 252 SpD
Gentle Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Def / 0 Spe
- Transform
- Parting Shot
- Whirlwind
- Shore Up
The most classic Innards Out user, I use Whirlwind to remove pokémons, especially special attackers that can't OHKO Blissey. Parting Shot to keep momentum (and force MBouncers to switch ig).
Transform is very useful for keeping PPs and threatening opponents, but especially for scooting sets. You have to be careful, though, as your opponent could get something like TWaves and kill Blissey.
Shore Up is used to heal Blissey and do maximum damage with Innards Out.
Why I think this team should be added as a Sample :
- It is an HO and HO are (according to me) easier to play because you don’t have to keep your mons at a certain ammount of health and you don’t need to do a lot of anticipations.
- It has "a threat an answer" mentality for many things. As examples, if the opponent has a physical threat (without MG) -> switch on Chansey. It has a Deo-S No Guard -> use MGar with MGeist.
- It can put pressure on many teams.
- It is easy to use and has no strange strats or Z-Move that you need to use at the correct time.
Thank you very much for reading this far, the replays are available just below, so thanks in advance for your feedback.
Yeah I won every single one of this replays, not because I'm good but because I only kept one where I won. These replays only come from my main account Guysmash, I have many others from diverse alts like Adapting Smash.
Replays where Slaking wins by stalling the opponent's PP or because they lost their Zygarde :
Versus arkeis : https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7purehackmons-2283982386-w5gm7nmwi2awwh6nijydheg4ss6yn3xpw?p2
Versus Pure Stallmons : https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7purehackmons-2293110578
(Exca helped a lot by killing the Steelix which was annoying because of its bulk and Toxic)
Versus mrmediocreteams : https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7purehackmons-2271968537?p2
(My favorite mole helped here too when it killed the MBro which were the Prank Haze of the opposing team)
Replays where MGar killed many mons and helped the team :
Versus Random Bullsht : https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7purehackmons-2279624112-x6bgz0fclb94zcal74cfbr6a2huzlpnpw (note that I only won because Slak slept 1 turn)
Versus Zeus the Ruin. : https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7purehackmons-2285962666?p2
In these replay I won with a MScizor Clutch. I got another versus assassinkoen but it seems I didn’t save it :/
Versus Zeus the Ruin. : https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7purehackmons-2292414559
Finnaly I got two more recent replays (which aren’t outdated) in which Exca saved the day by killing mons at the correct time :
Versus Slothy0wl : https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7purehackmons-2321841958?p2
(Kart helped a lot too by killing the innards early in the game)
Versus Guest 16175494 :
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7purehackmons-2322617179?p2
Replays where Slaking wins by stalling the opponent's PP or because they lost their Zygarde :
Versus arkeis : https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7purehackmons-2283982386-w5gm7nmwi2awwh6nijydheg4ss6yn3xpw?p2
Versus Pure Stallmons : https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7purehackmons-2293110578
(Exca helped a lot by killing the Steelix which was annoying because of its bulk and Toxic)
Versus mrmediocreteams : https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7purehackmons-2271968537?p2
(My favorite mole helped here too when it killed the MBro which were the Prank Haze of the opposing team)
Replays where MGar killed many mons and helped the team :
Versus Random Bullsht : https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7purehackmons-2279624112-x6bgz0fclb94zcal74cfbr6a2huzlpnpw (note that I only won because Slak slept 1 turn)
Versus Zeus the Ruin. : https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7purehackmons-2285962666?p2
In these replay I won with a MScizor Clutch. I got another versus assassinkoen but it seems I didn’t save it :/
Versus Zeus the Ruin. : https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7purehackmons-2292414559
Finnaly I got two more recent replays (which aren’t outdated) in which Exca saved the day by killing mons at the correct time :
Versus Slothy0wl : https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7purehackmons-2321841958?p2
(Kart helped a lot too by killing the innards early in the game)
Versus Guest 16175494 :
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7purehackmons-2322617179?p2
EDIT : I replaced Chansey by Blissey and changed lefties by Shed Shell and set 30 IVs for Slak's HPs, therefore all replays above are outaded (Except the last 2, those which show how Excadrill is really useful).
EDIT 2 : Yeah I got to the top 1 of ladder with this team, this is probably the best one I've ever done
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It shows like this for me with "this team" in blue
https://pokepast.es/27b385fb0acfc2a4 Got top 500 on ladder with this team, any teambuilding tips are welcome :)
Wonder guard dialga lmaoFirst of all, I realized several days ago that it's now been over 1 year since USUM had its permaladder. First of all, happy belated 1st year anniversary to the Gen 7 Pure Hackmons permaladder. It's been a wonderful time so far with lots of new developments made. I hope this continues as we move forward.
I'm using this opportunity to create a new post I've had in mind since. I apologize for how messy this post is. I've been having my thoughts on it scattered around all week and struggled with trying to piece it all together.
Earlier I said I've already said I had nothing new to say about Mega Audino in the Gen 7 Pure Hackmons metagame but after reflecting on the VR changes made as of recent, some things have struck me. Here's what's possibly my final bout of me rambling about Mega Audino in Gen 7 Pure Hackmons. I believe I've already said everything else I needed to say, making future posts about it redundant.
Given my explanation over why I found Mega Audino to be the best Wonder Guard in the metagame, I'm here explain a core reason Mega Audino finds itself in the specific circumstance it's in and why Mega Audino can never truly fall off despite Sunsteel Strike, Searing Sunraze Smash, or other moves Mega Audino does not serve well against being present everywhere in the metagame.
Hardcounting Wonder Guard Mega Audino goes two ways.
1) You either spam Poison-type moves in the game and get walled by a bunch of different Pokémon, whether they're Steel-types, Zygarde-Complete, or other Wonder Guards, as Poison-type coverage only ever exists for Mega Audino and is not great against anything else ever. Even for Poison chip damage.
2) You go out of your way to spam high power Sunsteel Strike or Searing Sunraze Smash alongside coverage, making virtually no Wonder Guard a consistently suitable wall.
You cannot successfully hardcounter Mega Audino teams as much as possible without more than just Mega Audino being punished as a Wonder Guard.
Mega Audino should not be harshly punished for losing against Searing Sunraze Smash or Light That Burns The Sky attackers because
On top of the calcs above, the most heavy attackers in this game have a very small window of Pokémon being able to wall their move at all, allowing them to run specific coverage moves to target whatever opposing Wonder Guard would come closest to being able to overcome them.252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Searing Sunraze Smash vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Muk-Alola: 604-711 (145.8 - 171.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Searing Sunraze Smash vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Meloetta: 595-700 (147.2 - 173.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Searing Sunraze Smash vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Arceus: 405-477 (91.2 - 107.4%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO
Neutrally effective Wonder Guard Pokémon do not survive +0 itemless Searing Sunraze Smash from Mega Mewtwo X
+2 252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Light That Burns the Sky vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro-Mega: 447-527 (113.4 - 133.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Light That Burns the Sky vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Steelix-Mega: 367-432 (103.6 - 122%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Resisted Wonder Guard Pokémon do not survive Huge Power Light That Burns The Sky Mega Mewtwo X after 1 Shell Smash or Extreme Evoboost
+2 252+ Atk Huge Power Kartana Searing Sunraze Smash vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro-Mega: 432-508 (109.6 - 128.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Huge Power Kartana Searing Sunraze Smash vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Steelix-Mega: 354-417 (100 - 117.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Resisted Wonder Guard Pokémon do not survive Searing Sunraze Smash Kartana after 1 Shell Smash or Extreme Evoboost
If Kartana raises up in usage, Mega Audino should not be punished, because no Wonder Guard takes the best Kartana sets very well.
If Z-Moves rise up in usage, Mega Audino should not be punished, because no Wonder Guard handles Z-Move attackers very well and the few that could survive in particular circumstances can be overwhelmed by coverage that could easily fit into their set.
Mega Slowbro tends to be used as a wall for Mega Mewtwo X and Kartana, but there are plenty of Huge Power Mega Mewtwo X who run Bug-type moves and more Kartana as of late running Grass-type attacks. Additionally, Mega Slowbro's 5 weaknesses leave it vulnerable to Mega Mewtwo X running a large variety of coverage options for it.
Mega Audino's biggest weaknesses just happen to be the very moves designed to take down all Wonder Guards. When it's not this, it's moves that do nothing against any other Wonder Guard Pokémon, portraying a bigger opportunity cost than running other types of coverage. While Mega Audino is weak to Sunsteel Strike, the greatest Wonder Guard Pokémon who take the move neutrally do not switch into a Huge Power Sunsteel Strike. Otherwise, Mega Audino tends to be bulky enough to find chances of switching into non-Huge Power Sunsteel Strike off most attackers. In addition, Mega Audino's overall bulk is notably higher than every other great defensive Wonder Guard Pokémon in the metagame when Defense and Special Defense are factored, allowing it to take its weaknesses better than non-Sunsteel/Poison weak Wonder Guard Pokémon could take their own weaknesses. While Sunsteel Strike is everywhere, managing Sunsteel Strike isn't as overbearing as Alolan Muk managing Ground-type moves, Meloetta managing Dark-type or Bug-type moves, or Mega Slowbro managing many Grass, Bug, Electric, Ground, and Ghost-type moves. All of which are also very common.
Meloetta is weak to Dark-type moves and Bug-type moves. The latter has become very common as many of the top Wonder Guard Pokémon are weak to Bug. Dark-type attacks are not as common and Meloetta in particular is not a very strong presence in the metagame. However, if it ever becomes significantly problematic, there is little stopping teams from running the valuable Pursuit alongside Bug-type moves. This would stop Meloetta from being able to switch out, punish it significantly with Sunsteel Strike and Bug-type attacks, and render Meloetta significantly less effective as a Pokémon.
Alolan Muk is weak to Ground-type moves. Fissure is now what I'd argue to be the best OHKO move in the metagame due to its merits in hitting and defeating Alolan Muk teams over what Sheer Cold could otherwise do. Flying-type Pokémon are immune to Fissure, but can be counteracted by Zap Cannon and are otherwise not too great of Pokémon in USUM Pure Hackmons altogether. It is rare to see a Flying-type Pokémon serve high effectiveness in this game from what I've seen. Alolan Muk is forced to run Air Balloon in order to overcome Fissure, which is a liability of its own because it makes the Wonder Guard prone to Spore and prone to Shadow Tag Primal Groudon simultaneously. The Air Balloon is also not very difficult to pop in most games as many teams have either Moongeist Beam or Sunsteel Strike somewhere to hit Muk. Once Air Balloon is popped, Alolan Muk is vulnerable to Fissure from No Guard Pokémon and Thousand Waves from the best defensive Pokémon in the game. These combined liabilities are what Mega Audino does not have to go through. While Alolan Muk has the supposed advantage of not being weak to Sunsteel Strike, it hates getting hit by Sunsteel Strike despite this and cannot switch into its best users very effectively. I'd argue it hates Sunsteel Strike more than certain sets of Mega Audino even.
One major error I've seen personally is people trying to rank Wonder Guards based on their physical prowess; particularly, in terms of handling Mega Mewtwo X. Ranking Wonder Guards by how well they can take on Mega Mewtwo X is a fool's errand. If you try to do this, the best Wonder Guard of today would be the worst Wonder Guard by next Tuesday. Let's be real; this is Huge Power Mega Mewtwo X. If a Wonder Guard Pokémon just happens to tick it off a little bit more than the rest, Mega Mewtwo X will go through every coverage move in the book to ensure that Wonder Guard doesn't get a chance to breathe until it becomes less relevant. Mega Mewtwo X in high level gameplay can, will, and should run moves to take down any Wonder Guard they feel is a big enough threat to the team Mega Mewtwo X is in. Not doing so is either a skill issue on the builder or proves the Pokémon was not a great enough threat to concern Mega Mewtwo X in the first place.
Many less powerful Searing Sunraze Smash Pokémon, Light That Burn The Sky, Photon Geyser, and Sunsteel Strike Pokémon exist, which harm Mega Audino more than Wonder Guard Pokémon below it, but these Pokémon are more manageable by other walls in general until they run more extreme, more viable sets. Additionally, unlike any other Wonder Guard, Mega Audino can also pair very well with just about any other wall. I find one of the primary things that make Mega Audino a cut above the rest are its unique weaknesses and overall bulk. Mega Audino serves a better chance of sealing in wins as it can pair with many Pokémon who take Poison-type and Steel-type moves while also not being weak to anything extra, such as Bug-type pivoting moves, Dark-type utility moves, or the load of coverage options the likes of Mega Slowbro and Mega Gyarados can suddenly get nuked by.
There's a message I'm trying to convey in all of this, but I'm honestly not sure I made it understandable enough, so I'm cutting right to the chase here:
If Mega Audino falls off, all of Wonder Guard falls off. There is no specific way for Mega Audino alone to fall off as the very moves that target Mega Audino are the same moves that target all Wonder Guard Pokémon and no Wonder Guard Pokémon can be consistently relied upon to fight back against those moves without struggling due to brute coverage. Major non-Wonder Guard walls such as Zygarde-Complete, Mega Steelix, Doublade, and perhaps even Fur Coat Mega Slowbro are better at dealing with Photon Geyser, Sunsteel Strike, and their Z-Move counterparts than any Wonder Guard Pokémon is. Alongside this, Innards Out has shown to be a suitable replacement for Wonder Guard when given to Chansey or Blissey, making teams not need a Wonder Guard Pokémon in some cases. The best Wonder Guard Pokémon in this metagame should primarily focus on walling Moongeist Beam and to a more limited degree, special Photon Geyser. They should also focus on preventing their team from losing to OHKO moves as these moves hit everything except for Wonder Guard and Sturdy Pokémon. Walling these moves is their primary job and what they do best in the metagame. That being said, if you are running a Wonder Guard at all, it is usually best to run two Wonder Guard Pokémon. The dual-Wonder Guard archetype remains dominant enough in the metagame to still place Wonder Guard itself in S rank.
Tl;dr: The best moves that cause Mega Audino to fall off affect every Wonder Guard simultaneously, making things worse for every Wonder Guard if more Pokémon run stronger moves to fight off Mega Audino.
Now because Mega Audino falling off cannot be done without Wonder Guard falling off as a whole imo, I see Mega Audino as a pure reflection of Wonder Guard itself in the Gen 7 Pure Hackmons metagame. This isn't something any other Pokémon could achieve so here's a quote I have prepped up for this:
"Mega Audino is the health of Wonder Guard. The weaker Mega Audino is, the weaker Wonder Guard is in the metagame."
but then you also have this quote from dramlamb
"Wonder Guard is the health of Hackmons. The weaker Wonder Guard is, the less competitive the metagame." -dramlamb
So you know what this means?
"Mega Audino is the health of Hackmons. The weaker Mega Audino is, the less competitive the metagame." -Ransei
This logic only applies to Gen 7 Pure Hackmons specifically and it's not exclusively tied to Mega Audino, but also some of the metagame's other great defensive units such as Chansey, Blissey, Zygarde-Complete, Doublade, and more. This exclusively ties to Mega Audino under Wonder Guard but multiple Pokémon outside Wonder Guard also glue this metagame together.
Despite Mega Audino being the health of Wonder Guard and a reflection of it, I can justify Mega Audino being on A+ as no Wonder Guard in this metagame is perfect. Mega Audino is still in need of partners to take on its weaknesses oftentimes and there are plenty enough Wonder Guard cores you could get away with without having Mega Audino involved. Mega Audino isn't extremely dominant in the metagame, which would otherwise consistently justify an "S" rank, but Wonder Guard as a presence is extremely dominant through the use of 2 per standard team in order to counteract No Guard.
Ok so-Why are you Seismic Toss Chansey? Make it Recover, also Defog is probably better over rocks on Chansey.
Mega Gengar is also not impproofed the best, so I'd want to something about that, unless Chansey is the imp proof. I don't really like Chansey being an impproof but ok
MMX also requires a Wisp to hit in order to not sweep your team and you might get unlucky so keep that in mind
also future reference could you please not post 3 times
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For the WG VR I'm not triggered because of MAud under Melo but because Pogre is rank A, why ?My personal VR, I'm making this out of boredom. Abilities in bold are the mon's main abilitys and abilities in italics are abilities that aren't common but could be ran, and this isn't in alphebetical order. After or later into PHPL I will update this and add my reasoning for every mon.
S Rank
S
Chansey (Imposter, Innards Out, Wonder Guard)
Blissey (Imposter, Innards Out, Wonder Guard)
S-
Mewtwo-Mega-X (Huge Power/Pure Power, Shadow Tag, Magic Guard)
Zygarde-Complete (Prankster, Magic Bounce)
Wonder Guard
A Rank
A+
Meloetta
Muk-Alola
Audino-Mega (ransei im sorry, if anyone is triggered enough to ask i'll reply with my reasoning)
Slowbro-Mega
Necrozma-Dawn-Wings
A
Kyogre-Primal
Ferrothorn
Hoopa-Unbound
Kartana
Celesteela
A-
Groudon-Primal
Oranguru
Arceus
Swampert-Mega
Scizor-Mega
Gyarados-Mega
Greninja-Ash
B Rank
B+
Mewtwo-Mega-Y
Type: Null
Sableye-Mega
Regigigas
B
Blissey/ Chansey (probablys should be higher but they're unexplored as of rn)
B-
Gardevoir-Mega
Magearna
A Rank
A+
Gengar-Mega (Parental Bond, Magic Guard) ik there's more but that's like the main real abilities
Kartana (Huge Power, No Guard, Magic Guard, Prankster, Wonder Guard)
Slaking (Harvest, Huge Power, Wonder Guard)
Doublade (Fur Coat, Sturdy)
Steelix-Mega (Prankster, Fur Coat, Magic Bounce)
Groudon-Primal (Huge Power, Mold Breaker, Shadow Tag, Wonder Guard, Magic Guard?)
A
Regigigas (Harvest, Huge Power, Wonder Guard) same mon as slaking with slightly less special bulk
Aggron-Mega (Prankster, Fur Coat, Magic Bounce) same mon as steelix but not weak to water and loses ground stab. if ur not running t waves aggron is better.
Mewtwo-Mega-Y (Dazzling, Psychic Surge, Wonder Guard, Tinted Lens, No Guard)
Lopunny-Mega (No Guard)
A-
Gyarados-Mega (Huge Power, Magic Guard, Magic Bounce, Shadow Tag, Poison Heal)
Yveltal (Huge Power, Magic Guard, Magic Bounce, Shadow Tag, Poison Heal)
Slowbro-Mega (Wonder Guard, Prankster, Fur Coat)
Necrozma-Dusk-Mane (Harvest, Huge Power) i have never used dusk mane or played against it a lot so forgive me if there is more
Solgaleo (Harvest, Huge Power, Prankster) same as dusk mane
B Rank
B+
Deoxys-Attack (Dazzling, Psychic Surge, Wonder Guard) im unfamiliar with deo attack so again forgive me if im wrong
Lunala (Innards Out, No Guard)
Rayquaza-Mega (Shadow Tag, Mold Breaker)
Celesteela (Wonder Guard, Prankster)
Diancie-Mega (Pixilate)
Deoxys-Speed (No Guard, Comatose)
Greninja-Ash (Huge Power, Water Bubble, Wonder Guard)
B
Pheromosa (Huge Power, No Guard, Comatose)
Type: Null (Wonder Guard, Magic Bounce)
Heracross-Mega (Huge Power)
Banette-Mega (Huge Power)
Pikachu (Imposter)
Alakazam-Mega (Dazzling, Psychic Surge, Wonder Guard) i copy pasted from deo attack but as i said im unsure for it
Necrozma-Dawn-Wings (Wonder Guard, Tinted Lens?)
Necrozma-Ultra (Huge Power)
B-
Arceus (Wonder Guard, Shadow Tag, Magic Bounce)
Articuno (Magic Bounce)
Gardevoir-Mega (Wonder Guard, Triage)
Guzzlord (Innards Out)
Kyurem-Black (Refrigirate)
Marowak-Alola (Huge Power)
Sceptile-Mega (No Guard, Magic Guard, Dazzling if you're Zeus the Ruin)
C Rank
Ho-Oh (Wonder Guard, Magic Guard)
Excadrill (Innards Out)
I understand that I have may have triggered you with some of my rankings, like Mega Audino as the #3 Wonder Guard, so if you want you can ask me about any paticular ranking. Thanks for reading, goodbye.
But I totally do agree with MScizor being A- that’s nice.
For the regular VR, why did you say that gigas has less SpD than Slak ?
And why everyone ranks Excadrill so low ??
Ok thanks for the tips also I will keep not posting 3 times in a row in mind
pogre is that high because it's really good on offence as a mon who sponges a few hits and gains momentum. it's shell smash/water shuriken/electric judgement/sunsteel set is also pretty cracked so it can kinda function like dawn wings.
as for the scizor ranking, while yes it is in a-, i don't think it's that good anyways if u are saying that it is good. it's only a- bc it's around the level of the other mons i had in a-.
for the regigigas thing, slaking and regigigas are the same mons except regigigas has slightly less special bulk then slaking so it's technically worse. just felt worth pointing out, aggron and regi are both a+ realistically.
also excadrill is in c because you are the only person who's used it, and the official vr put excadril in c as a hypothetical ranking so i just went off that and i have never seen an excadrill ever. it could be higher, i also said the same thing with wg chans/bliss since they are unexplored.
I see the point of Pogre, indeed its selfproof with sunsteel is very good but hitting special walls with only sunsteel with 150 BS is mid.
Yeah for MSiczor A- seems alright
Gigas has actually more special bulk than Slak but it has less HP so less good
Exca is (imo) very underrated because it has good hp but really bad Def ans SpD so it gets killed early (where lunala tanks a bit to good non-set up mons). Or maybe it’s just because it fits my team very well
Bored so I'm going to rant about my thoughts on balance teams. (I changed the wording a bit on this post)
Why I Think Balance Is Worse
Balance is the most common archetype in USUM, and it's also the most consistent. Balance teams consist of an equal or close to equal balance of offense and defense. Their goal is usually to get offensive mons in to output damage while also being able to wall stuff. I think that there are many problems with balance that lead me to believe it is worse which I am going to talk about in this post.
One: Innards Out
Innards Out Chansey is downright busted and is awful to play against. It can trade with any physical attacker in the game and can also function as a special wall who only loses to MGuard Secret Sword whilst fitting secondary hazards and Aromatherapy if needed. This is a major problem for balance, I will demonstrate why:
This is a common balance team. Zygarde is the Prankhaze who walls setup sweepers and walls physical attackers with Reflect, Mega Audino is a support Wonder Guard who can function as a special wall, Mega Slowbro who is a secondary Wonder Guard to not auto lose to No Guard and can function as a physical wall as well as fitting moves like Stealth Rocks, Mega Mewtwo X who functions as a wall breaker, Mega Gengar who can function as a cleaner or as speed control, and Chansey (let's say it's Imposter) who can scout sets and function as a revenge killer as well as patch up a team's holes. There is a major problem with this. If Innards trades with MMX then the team cannot really win. Gengar either functions as a cleaner or as a scarf speed control mon, and cannot win by itself. This is not just a problem with this team, this is a problem with most balance. A team's wall breaker is usually a physical attacker and the mons paired with it will struggle to win by themselves due to either being a special attacker or not Huge Power.
Two: Harvest Slaking Semistall
Harvest Slaking is again a stupidly broken mon. It can spam Extreme Evoboost and CFZs and has warped the meta around it. It PP stalls would be checks such as Prankhazes and is also self improof. It's only checked by Perish Trap and soft checked by Core Enforcer/other niche moves and Innards Out. While yes, Harvest Slaking runs over balance which makes balance worse, that is not actually the point I am going to make. Instead, I believe that balance is outclassed by Harvest Slaking Semistall. I will again demonstrate what I mean:
This is a Harvest Slaking Semistall team. Zygarde is the Prankhaze who walls setup sweepers and walls physical attackers with reflect, Mega Slowbro as one of the 2 Wonder Guards who can function as a physical wall, Alolan Muk who is a support Wonder Guard and can function as a special wall, Harvest Slaking who beats everything but Innards Out, MGuard Gyarados who pursuit traps Innards letting Slaking win and can trick a Choice Band to a Prankhaze, and Innards Chansey who walls what Alolan Muk can't and makes up for Muk's fissure weakness, fits Aromatherapy on the team and removes physical attackers the team can't deal with. Now outslde of a tour where balance may be preferable for mu reasons, why would you want to run balance over this? This doesn't have the innards out problem and doesn't have to worry about coverage due to Slaking beating everything. Teams like these also do not take much skill to run. It just seems to simply outclass balance.
Three: Huge Power and Offense
Due to the nature of balance and the fact it has to fit at least 2 offensive mons, it can sometimes struggle defensively. Cteaming balance is quite easy as all you need to do is have coverage for all their defensive mons and balance can get ran over by mons it is unable to wall. I think Huge Power is especially tricky for balance. An MMX with the right coverage will run you over and you can still very much lose to it if it overwhelms you. You also can't often run a fur coat to fix this problem as it is hard to fit. Mons like Huge Power Kartarna with Shell Smash/Ice Shard/Sunsteel Strike/Searing Sunraze Smash also run over balance unless you fit a Prankster steel type or Innards Out (if you don't have either you have to resort to scarf Imposter Blissey) which can be very restraining to team building. The teams Huge Power Kartarna often finds itself on are bulky offense/hyper offense which is aswell problematic. It is very hard for a balance team's defensive core to handle 4 or 5 offensive mons, and such teams often have Innards Out to make matters worse. Balance is also forced to run anti offense measures such as scarf Pbond Mega Gengar or heavy priority.
Conclusion
Therefor, due to Innards Out being able taking out balance's wall breaker which balance often loses to, getting ran over by Harvest Slaking Semistall and being outclassed by it, and balance's poor matchup into offense and struggling to answer Huge Power, I believe that balance is worse. If you have gotten this far thank you for reading and I'd love to hear your opinions on this. Goodbye.
Why I Think Balance Is Worse
Balance is the most common archetype in USUM, and it's also the most consistent. Balance teams consist of an equal or close to equal balance of offense and defense. Their goal is usually to get offensive mons in to output damage while also being able to wall stuff. I think that there are many problems with balance that lead me to believe it is worse which I am going to talk about in this post.
One: Innards Out
Innards Out Chansey is downright busted and is awful to play against. It can trade with any physical attacker in the game and can also function as a special wall who only loses to MGuard Secret Sword whilst fitting secondary hazards and Aromatherapy if needed. This is a major problem for balance, I will demonstrate why:
This is a common balance team. Zygarde is the Prankhaze who walls setup sweepers and walls physical attackers with Reflect, Mega Audino is a support Wonder Guard who can function as a special wall, Mega Slowbro who is a secondary Wonder Guard to not auto lose to No Guard and can function as a physical wall as well as fitting moves like Stealth Rocks, Mega Mewtwo X who functions as a wall breaker, Mega Gengar who can function as a cleaner or as speed control, and Chansey (let's say it's Imposter) who can scout sets and function as a revenge killer as well as patch up a team's holes. There is a major problem with this. If Innards trades with MMX then the team cannot really win. Gengar either functions as a cleaner or as a scarf speed control mon, and cannot win by itself. This is not just a problem with this team, this is a problem with most balance. A team's wall breaker is usually a physical attacker and the mons paired with it will struggle to win by themselves due to either being a special attacker or not Huge Power.
Two: Harvest Slaking Semistall
Harvest Slaking is again a stupidly broken mon. It can spam Extreme Evoboost and CFZs and has warped the meta around it. It PP stalls would be checks such as Prankhazes and is also self improof. It's only checked by Perish Trap and soft checked by Core Enforcer/other niche moves and Innards Out. While yes, Harvest Slaking runs over balance which makes balance worse, that is not actually the point I am going to make. Instead, I believe that balance is outclassed by Harvest Slaking Semistall. I will again demonstrate what I mean:
This is a Harvest Slaking Semistall team. Zygarde is the Prankhaze who walls setup sweepers and walls physical attackers with reflect, Mega Slowbro as one of the 2 Wonder Guards who can function as a physical wall, Alolan Muk who is a support Wonder Guard and can function as a special wall, Harvest Slaking who beats everything but Innards Out, MGuard Gyarados who pursuit traps Innards letting Slaking win and can trick a Choice Band to a Prankhaze, and Innards Chansey who walls what Alolan Muk can't and makes up for Muk's fissure weakness, fits Aromatherapy on the team and removes physical attackers the team can't deal with. Now outslde of a tour where balance may be preferable for mu reasons, why would you want to run balance over this? This doesn't have the innards out problem and doesn't have to worry about coverage due to Slaking beating everything. Teams like these also do not take much skill to run. It just seems to simply outclass balance.
Three: Huge Power and Offense
Due to the nature of balance and the fact it has to fit at least 2 offensive mons, it can sometimes struggle defensively. Cteaming balance is quite easy as all you need to do is have coverage for all their defensive mons and balance can get ran over by mons it is unable to wall. I think Huge Power is especially tricky for balance. An MMX with the right coverage will run you over and you can still very much lose to it if it overwhelms you. You also can't often run a fur coat to fix this problem as it is hard to fit. Mons like Huge Power Kartarna with Shell Smash/Ice Shard/Sunsteel Strike/Searing Sunraze Smash also run over balance unless you fit a Prankster steel type or Innards Out (if you don't have either you have to resort to scarf Imposter Blissey) which can be very restraining to team building. The teams Huge Power Kartarna often finds itself on are bulky offense/hyper offense which is aswell problematic. It is very hard for a balance team's defensive core to handle 4 or 5 offensive mons, and such teams often have Innards Out to make matters worse. Balance is also forced to run anti offense measures such as scarf Pbond Mega Gengar or heavy priority.
Conclusion
Therefor, due to Innards Out being able taking out balance's wall breaker which balance often loses to, getting ran over by Harvest Slaking Semistall and being outclassed by it, and balance's poor matchup into offense and struggling to answer Huge Power, I believe that balance is worse. If you have gotten this far thank you for reading and I'd love to hear your opinions on this. Goodbye.
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Holy yap. I think this is mostly correct only because another check to harvest leppa Slak is sacred sword MMx. Also you don’t need to let your wallbreaker go down? What’s so wrong with switching? (Asking out of curiosity)And why is Slak so meta defining when it can be checked so easily by sacred sword or PrankHaze zygarde? Maybe I’m coping being a balance player with 3 offense 2 defense and a fatass egg.Bored so I'm going to rant about my thoughts on balance teams.
Why I Think Balance Might Fall Off
Balance is the most common archetype in USUM, and it's also the most consistent. Balance teams consist of an equal or close to equal balance of offense and defense. Their goal is usually to get offensive mons in to output damage while also being able to wall stuff. I think that there are many problems with balance that may lead to it falling off which I am going to talk about in this post.
One: Innards Out
Innards Out Chansey is downright busted and is awful to play against. It can trade with any physical attacker in the game and can also function as a special wall who only loses to MGuard Secret Sword whilst fitting secondary hazards and Aromatherapy if needed. This is a major problem for balance, I will demonstrate why:
This is a common balance team. Zygarde is the Prankhaze who walls setup sweepers and walls physical attackers with Reflect, Mega Audino is a support Wonder Guard who can function as a special wall, Mega Slowbro who is a secondary Wonder Guard to not auto lose to No Guard and can function as a physical wall as well as fitting moves like Stealth Rocks, Mega Mewtwo X who functions as a wall breaker, Mega Gengar who can function as a cleaner or as speed control, and Chansey (let's say it's Imposter) who can scout sets and function as a revenge killer as well as patch up a team's holes. There is a major problem with this. If Innards trades with MMX then the team cannot really win. Gengar either functions as a cleaner or as a scarf speed control mon, and cannot win by itself. This is not just a problem with this team, this is a problem with most balance. A team's wall breaker is usually a physical attacker and the mons paired with it will struggle to win by themselves due to either being a special attacker or not Huge Power.
Two: Harvest Slaking Semistall
Harvest Slaking is again a stupidly broken mon. It can spam Extreme Evoboost and CFZs and has warped the meta around it. It PP stalls would be checks such as Prankhazes and is also self improof. It's only checked by Perish Trap and soft checked by Core Enforcer/other niche moves and Innards Out. While yes, Harvest Slaking runs over balance which makes balance worse, that is not actually the point I am going to make. Instead, I believe that balance is outclassed by Harvest Slaking Semistall. I will again demonstrate what I mean:
This is a Harvest Slaking Semistall team. Zygarde is the Prankhaze who walls setup sweepers and walls physical attackers with reflect, Mega Slowbro as one of the 2 Wonder Guards who can function as a physical wall, Alolan Muk who is a support Wonder Guard and can function as a special wall, Harvest Slaking who beats everything but Innards Out, MGuard Gyarados who pursuit traps Innards letting Slaking win and can trick a Choice Band to a Prankhaze, and Innards Chansey who walls what Alolan Muk can't and makes up for Muk's fissure weakness, fits Aromatherapy on the team and removes physical attackers the team can't deal with. Now outslde of a tour where balance may be preferable for mu reasons, why would you want to run balance over this? This doesn't have the innards out problem and doesn't have to worry about coverage due to Slaking beating everything. Teams like these also do not take much skill to run. It just seems to simply outclass balance.
Three: Huge Power and Offense
Due to the nature of balance and the fact it has to fit at least 2 offensive mons, it can sometimes struggle defensively. Cteaming balance is quite easy as all you need to do is have coverage for all their defensive mons and balance can get ran over by mons it is unable to wall. I think Huge Power is especially tricky for balance. An MMX with the right coverage will run you over and you can still very much lose to it if it overwhelms you. You also can't often fit a fur coat to fix this problem as it is hard to fit. Mons like Huge Power Kartarna with Shell Smash/Ice Shard/Sunsteel Strike/Searing Sunraze Smash also run over balance unless you fit a Prankster steel type or Innards Out (if you don't have either you have to resort to scarf Imposter Blissey) which can be very restraining to team building. The teams Huge Power Kartarna often finds itself on are bulky offense/hyper offense which is aswell problematic. It is very hard for a balance team's defensive core to handle 4 or 5 offensive mons, and such teams often have Innards Out to make matters worse. Balance is also forced to run anti offense measures such as scarf Pbond Mega Gengar or heavy priority.
Conclusion
Therefor, due to Innards Out being able taking out balance's wall breaker which balance often loses to, getting ran over by Harvest Slaking Semistall and being outclassed by it, and balance's poor matchup into offense and struggling to answer Huge Power, I believe that balance may fall off. If you have gotten this far thank you for reading and I'd love to hear your opinions on this. Goodbye.
The problem of secret sword is losing to innards and Slak can just PP stall any PrankHazer without Core Offencer.
And about switching your wall breaker : the issue is the oppo is just going to switch in its innards the turn you think you'll hit a random mon.