Metagame UU Crown Tundra Speculation (SPOILERS!!)

Lilburr

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idea shamelessly ripped off from OU



WARNING: This thread contains major spoilers for the upcoming Crown Tundra DLC. If you wish to remain unspoiled, be sure to click away!
Following an announcement made two days ago, we now have information regarding the Crown Tundra DLC for Pokemon Sword and Shield. This includes a release date of October 22nd, a mere three weeks from now! A lot of Pokemon are returning and UU is sure to be shaken up massively. This thread serves as an area for our community to give their thoughts about what they think might drop to (or from) UU, primarily as a result of the following returning Pokemon. Please use this thread instead of the standard metagame thread when posting about upcoming DLC!


Here's a tier list maker that was yoinked from the OU version of this thread (thanks Finchinator!). You can use this to make a list of Pokemon that will drop to UU or below and reflect your thoughts on how they'll perform in the UU meta. Here's my own five minute list.


Note: These Pokemon are receiving movepool changes! A list of these changes can be found here, the most notable of which are here, and this post even shows them by generation. This list includes Isle of Armor Move Tutor moves.

Finally, here are some questions that you can answer if you want to contribute but don't know what to say:
  • Do you think anything will knock Noivern from of its seemingly eternal UU throne?
  • Do you think the removal of moves like Hidden Power and Pursuit will make some Pokemon shoot up or down in viability?
  • Which Pokemon will benefit from Heavy-Duty Boots the most? Are there any Pokemon that previously had no niche in UU that may gain one as a result of this addition?
  • Do you think any OU staples will fall to UU? We saw Skarmory and Tyranitar drop to UU earlier in the generation, after all.
  • Do you think Galarian Slowking will drop to UU? Will it be a good addition to the tier, or will it be outclassed?
  • Is there anything else you're excited about?
Be sure to abide by the standard forum rules, and don't be afraid to use the UU Posting Guide to help when putting your post together. Happy posting!
 

Bandkrook

flower boy
is a Pre-Contributor
Since I don't have much experience posting, I'll answer the questions lmao

  • Do you think anything will knock Noivern from of its seemingly eternal UU throne?
    • I think the big 3 that can deal with Noivern in the most effective way are: :suicune: :swampert: :metagross:
    • Both Suicune and Metagross commonly run Ice coverage on their sets (Ice Beam and Ice Punch), while Swampert could adapt to the metagame and also start running Ice Punch in place of Waterfall/Scald/Liquidation (it gets Liquidation now, yay)
:sm/suicune:
Suicune @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Ice Beam
- Scald
- Calm Mind
- Rest
:sm/swampert:
Swampert @ Leftovers
Ability: Torrent
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Impish Nature
- Ice Punch
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- Roar / Scald
:sm/metagross:
Metagross @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Rock Polish
- Meteor Mash
- Zen Headbutt
- Ice Punch

  • Do you think the removal of moves like Hidden Power and Pursuit will make some Pokemon shoot up or down in viability?
    • The relevant ones I can see being affected by this are: :raikou::azelf: :metagross: :absol: :latias: :latios:
    • Raikou loses Hidden Power coverage (Grass and Ice), but now it also gets Scald, so it's not that bad I guess? Azelf and the Lati Twins love Pursuit being gone, so I can definitely see them rising up to OU. Metagross unfortunately loses Pursuit, it's main way to trap the Latis and Azelf, and Absol also loses it. If Latias was already amazing in UU last gen, now it's even better. Definitely will rise to OU and join her brother.

  • Which Pokemon will benefit from Heavy-Duty Boots the most? Are there any Pokemon that previously had no niche in UU that may gain one as a result of this addition?
    • Right off the bat (pun very much intended) the ones who love boots: :salamence: :dragonite: :ho-oh: :lugia: :crobat: :entei: :zapdos: :moltres: :articuno: :aerodactyl: :archeops: :cryogonal: :magmortar: :regice:
    • Oh boy. Boots Salamence, Dragonite, Ho-oh and Lugia are gonna shake up their respective tiers. Especially the latter 3. Not having their Multiscale broken or take 50% on rocks is HUGE for them.
    • Zapdos is already a great defensive option on NatDex with Boots+Static, so it'll stay there.
    • In UU, Crobat and Entei are the two ones I can see gaining even more viability (and they were already good mons). Entei could miss the CB boost and Crobat may miss the Black Sludge recovery, but not taking hazard damage is very, very good. I could see Aero and Moltres in UU. Aero has a niche as a very fast rocker and Moltres just likes not dying by coming in on rocks two times.
    • In the lower tiers, I think the one that benefits the most from Boots is Archeops, not having to worry about Defeatist as much, and it also gets Dual Wingbeat now, so it doesn't have to rely on Acrobatics and run no item. It's defenitely gonna rise to at least RU. Cryogonal can now spin more safely; Magmortar also appreciates immunity to hazards, same with Regice and Articuno.

  • Do you think any OU staples will fall to UU? We saw Skarmory and Tyranitar drop to UU earlier in the generation, after all.
    • Can't really say, I don't play OU that much.

  • Do you think Galarian Slowking will drop to UU? Will it be a good addition to the tier, or will it be outclassed?
    • If it's anything like it's brother, it'll probably stay around RU/UU, maybe see some usage in OU. We'll see if it's signature move Eerie Spell is that broken depending on how much PP the move has

  • Is there anything else you're excited about?
    • :tapu-bulu: :tapu-koko: :tapu-lele: :kartana: :archeops:
      Screenshot_19.png
      Screenshot_20.png
      (credit to @sindorman on twitter for the birb sprites)
    • I really wanna try the new galarian birds (Zapdos and Articuno more especifically) and see if they're any viable in UU or just too good for it. I'm also really looking forward to using Boots Archeops, because that's a really big improvement for it. Also, Grassy Glide Bulu and Kartana seem fun on Mono-Grass teams. Oh, and fuck Rising Voltage Koko and Expanding Force Lele, wtf was GF thinking. They're gonna be fun in Ubers tho.
 

Fusion Flare

Formerly Datsplashtho
:bw/tornadus:
This is the one im most excited for, because if the Datamines are anything to go off of, Tornadus gets Nasty Plot now, which is downright amazing for this pokemon, especially considering it’s obscenely powerful STAB alongside useful coverage in Grass Knot and Heat Wave, which, combined with its STAB, is nearly perfect coverage all by itself!
There’s also the fact that it can’t even get chipped by Rocks thanks to Boots!
...But how would it wear them? Does it even have feet?
 
:bw/tornadus:
This is the one im most excited for, because if the Datamines are anything to go off of, Tornadus gets Nasty Plot now, which is downright amazing for this pokemon, especially considering it’s obscenely powerful STAB alongside useful coverage in Grass Knot and Heat Wave, which, combined with its STAB, is nearly perfect coverage all by itself!
There’s also the fact that it can’t even get chipped by Rocks thanks to Boots!
...But how would it wear them? Does it even have feet?
Gygalith can come back to check him especially tranks to Sand
 
Posted this in the metagame thread before this one came out. So here it is!

So. With the next DLC coming out soon we will most likely be having multiple UU staples of the past couple generations returning among the confirmed mons that are returning. As such I'd like to promote some discussion on them.

The Good.

Nidoking


Nidoking has been a UU staple since gen 5. It does one thing and that one thing really well, it is a phenomenal wall breaker. One that I'm extremely excited to use once more. The two sets I see being uses most are AoA and SR + 3 attacks. This thing is gonna be a great offensive addition to the meta. It'll slam Sylveon, Doublade, Non-levi Weezing and Bronzong. And with its access to sheer force Boltbeam little will wanna switch in on this. I can see this becoming a staple of offense/HO due to it's ability to break so many crucial that stop other competent sweepers in there tracks. A/A+ tier definitely.

Nidoqueen

Nidoqueen will function very similar to King except bulkier, it'll be able to handle the likes of Terrakion, Coballion, Wak-A and such while also being one of the best and most consistent new SR setters in the tier. A- Tier Roughly.

Moltres

Acess to HDB will breath a new life into this mon. While it's cramped on by Terrak. It can run a good offensive set with Hurricane/Fireblast/U-turn that Zard only wishes he could run. Not too mention bulky Talonflame? Please this thing gets access to flame body with the new ability capsules meaning it's basically better than Talon in every single possible way. A-/A tier probably

Metagross

Metagross does what Meta gross has always done. Wallbreak, while also being an incredibly bulky steel type and a decent SR settee. Nice to have a new mon that beats Sylv/Weezing and with Thunderpunch it can do a decent dent to Bro/King as well. Lack of pursuit means also helps it a lot this gen. Not much to say other than its gonna be a solid mon overall. B+ tier.

Swampert

Bulky Water/Geound type. Good tank with great all around stats both defensively and offensively. Access to SR and not week to fighting/water like Perior. I could see this being one of the premier walls in UU but it still gets shat on by Lisk/Mow and hates the burn from Washtom. B tier

Raikou

The loss of hidden power sucks for Raikou but it also was gifted with Scald of allthings this gen. This means that it's at least not walled by most ground types and a lot of physical attackers don't wanna switch in on it either. I still think Lisk is better but only time will tell + maybe it can pull of a nice calm mind set. B/B+ tier

Crobat

Crobat is back and faster than nearly everything in the tier. Quad resistances to Fighting and bug, access to U-turn, Defog, Brave Bird, Nasty plot, Rssistance and super effective against Fairies. Most of All HDB making this thing an even better pivot then ever before? I could see this thing giving old Noivy a run for its money for most dominant fast flying type/pivot. Look out forthis mon, I could see it being one of the best. A+/S Tier definitely.

The Niche

Entei


HDB are very nice for this thing. It gets access to flash fire with all its moves now and can endlessly spread Sacred Fire to its hearts content. Still think Arcanine is better due to Tele + Intimidate and Arcanine is niche its self. Still I could see this finding its self some use especially on Sun Teams. C+

Articuno

Again HDB breathes new life into this thing and it also gets Hurricane now. With Freeze Dry and Roost + Toxic I could see it doing decent on offense or Stall but I don't see it doing too much. Still could fulfill a nice niche of a new offensive ice type. C tier

Aerodactyl

Fast, good offenses and access to SR and Taunt make it definitely decent. However theres no way it possibly breaks the Bro/Weese cores that plague the tier. Not too mention how frail this thing is. I could see a solid C+ tier.

Registeel

Stall Mon for the stalliest of teams but it'll do its job well. Stealth Rock + Seis Toss and Toxic though no reliable recovery hurts it. Still nice to have a new mon ththaththat can tank Noiv again I see around C+/B-
 

Twilight

is a member of the Site Staffis an official Team Rateris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
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Sure why not, I'm excited about potential DLC drops and have discussed it plenty on Discord so why not compress my opinions into a post.


UU is probably going to get hit with a load of new offensive Flying-types with this DLC and I expect all of these to drop at some point. Heavy-Duty Boots is obviously a huge buff to all of them. Tornadus-I, Thundurus-I, and Salamence are the most sus candidates that might be too overwhelming for the tier. Tornadus was RUBL last gen but it now gets Nasty Plot with its fantastic movepool, which means it can now break a majority of its prior checks. I think it will take time for Moltres to drop personally but its defensive utility would be fantastic here. Articuno has always been super niche but there is a chance that Boots makes offensive sets viable? I'm pretty excited about the bat because its typing and Speed tier is going to be great. No longer must we use Noivern as Speed control.


Latios probably overshadows Latias and at some point, I presume it will drop to UU. It got so many buffs in Mystical Fire and Aura Sphere, which gives it the coverage to pick and choose what is going to wall it. There is a high chance it is now too problematic for the tier especially with Pursuit gone, but I could see it being a suspect Pokemon over anything else.


New Steel-types will always be welcome. Metagross's typing is going to be great for building. It has the flexibility to run rocks and offensive sets. Registeel is the sturdiest Steel-type that isn't garbage Bronzong so will definitely have viability. Celesteela isn't a guaranteed drop but its typing would be great as shown with Skarmory.


Thankfully we are going to be getting more Rock-types with all the Flying-types we are getting. Nihilego looks fantastic in this tier, great offensive and defensive typing with Toxic Spikes and SR. Stakataka has an interesting typing that would let it handle something like a Latias better assuming no Aura Sphere. It can run a defensive rocks set, CB, OTR, looks fun. Diancie finally gives us another Fairy-type but one that can set rocks. It completely walls Noivern and has other utility in Heal Bell. Tyrantrum is an offensive Rock-type that probably drops to RU but can have viability here. If the datamine is true then it gets access to Close Combat now too.


New Ground-types that are likely to drop. Both Nidos are welcome in the tier and whether you use Queen or King will be situational based on the team. Swampert looks pretty nice with defensive rocks, CB, and offensive rocks. It also gets Bulk Up apparently, which could allow it to run some kinda 3 Attacks set up set.


I assume all three of these guys will have viability. Personally, Entei looks like the worst of the three but Heavy-Duty Boots could be nice. I assume Sacred Fire is added back into the game otherwise it's gonna be really subpar. Raikou losing HP Ice sucks but it does get Scald so it can break Ground-types. It looks pretty flexible with CM, SubToxic, Boots Pivot, Choice-locked sets. Suicune will do Suicune things if it drops.


I didn't know where to clump these two but they would be cool additions. Boots is a big buff to Volcanion and its typing is really nice. Xurkitree I'd assume gets overshadowed by Tapu Koko's presence in OU. I'm not sure whether Tail Glow is returning or not but if it isn't, then it would be easier to handle maybe? Feels like a big question mark but at least it's 'walled' by the Nidos.


These are the niche Pokemon that come to mind. Omaster might have viability with a Shell Smash + Meteor Beam set this gen, which gives it a bit more of a dangerous sweeper. Azelf can be a suicide lead or run Nasty Plot. Maybe I'm underselling its potential in the tier but it just seems pretty middle tier. Cresselia will just be a fat wall that sponges hits but will fall to RU.


I assume that these Pokemon fall off at some point from OU. Scizor looks like it has a much harder matchup with the new drops for OU but ban it from UU, cool. Zeraora is finally going to be at the point where it can't break the tiers Ground-types but would fair really well here. Alakazam and Hydreigon have a lot lower usage based on recent stats so I guess there is a good chance they drop. Both seem pretty borked though with Nasty Plot and probs get the boot if they do.

Assuming we get a vast majority of these things sooner than later, the tier looks so much more enjoyable. I assume council might look at UUBL again though idk how many of these actually look like they have a chance of being manageable in the tier. Free Lycanroc-D and Dracozolt though.
 
Sure why not, I'm excited about potential DLC drops and have discussed it plenty on Discord so why not compress my opinions into a post.


UU is probably going to get hit with a load of new offensive Flying-types with this DLC and I expect all of these to drop at some point. Heavy-Duty Boots is obviously a huge buff to all of them. Tornadus-I, Thundurus-I, and Salamence are the most sus candidates that might be too overwhelming for the tier. Tornadus was RUBL last gen but it now gets Nasty Plot with its fantastic movepool, which means it can now break a majority of its prior checks. I think it will take time for Moltres to drop personally but its defensive utility would be fantastic here. Articuno has always been super niche but there is a chance that Boots makes offensive sets viable? I'm pretty excited about the bat because its typing and Speed tier is going to be great. No longer must we use Noivern as Speed control.


Latios probably overshadows Latias and at some point, I presume it will drop to UU. It got so many buffs in Mystical Fire and Aura Sphere, which gives it the coverage to pick and choose what is going to wall it. There is a high chance it is now too problematic for the tier especially with Pursuit gone, but I could see it being a suspect Pokemon over anything else.


New Steel-types will always be welcome. Metagross's typing is going to be great for building. It has the flexibility to run rocks and offensive sets. Registeel is the sturdiest Steel-type that isn't garbage Bronzong so will definitely have viability. Celesteela isn't a guaranteed drop but its typing would be great as shown with Skarmory.


Thankfully we are going to be getting more Rock-types with all the Flying-types we are getting. Nihilego looks fantastic in this tier, great offensive and defensive typing with Toxic Spikes and SR. Stakataka has an interesting typing that would let it handle something like a Latias better assuming no Aura Sphere. It can run a defensive rocks set, CB, OTR, looks fun. Diancie finally gives us another Fairy-type but one that can set rocks. It completely walls Noivern and has other utility in Heal Bell. Tyrantrum is an offensive Rock-type that probably drops to RU but can have viability here. If the datamine is true then it gets access to Close Combat now too.


New Ground-types that are likely to drop. Both Nidos are welcome in the tier and whether you use Queen or King will be situational based on the team. Swampert looks pretty nice with defensive rocks, CB, and offensive rocks. It also gets Bulk Up apparently, which could allow it to run some kinda 3 Attacks set up set.


I assume all three of these guys will have viability. Personally, Entei looks like the worst of the three but Heavy-Duty Boots could be nice. I assume Sacred Fire is added back into the game otherwise it's gonna be really subpar. Raikou losing HP Ice sucks but it does get Scald so it can break Ground-types. It looks pretty flexible with CM, SubToxic, Boots Pivot, Choice-locked sets. Suicune will do Suicune things if it drops.


I didn't know where to clump these two but they would be cool additions. Boots is a big buff to Volcanion and its typing is really nice. Xurkitree I'd assume gets overshadowed by Tapu Koko's presence in OU. I'm not sure whether Tail Glow is returning or not but if it isn't, then it would be easier to handle maybe? Feels like a big question mark but at least it's 'walled' by the Nidos.


These are the niche Pokemon that come to mind. Omaster might have viability with a Shell Smash + Meteor Beam set this gen, which gives it a bit more of a dangerous sweeper. Azelf can be a suicide lead or run Nasty Plot. Maybe I'm underselling its potential in the tier but it just seems pretty middle tier. Cresselia will just be a fat wall that sponges hits but will fall to RU.


I assume that these Pokemon fall off at some point from OU. Scizor looks like it has a much harder matchup with the new drops for OU but ban it from UU, cool. Zeraora is finally going to be at the point where it can't break the tiers Ground-types but would fair really well here. Alakazam and Hydreigon have a lot lower usage based on recent stats so I guess there is a good chance they drop. Both seem pretty borked though with Nasty Plot and probs get the boot if they do.

Assuming we get a vast majority of these things sooner than later, the tier looks so much more enjoyable. I assume council might look at UUBL again though idk how many of these actually look like they have a chance of being manageable in the tier. Free Lycanroc-D and Dracozolt though.
Dracozolt gets sand rush now though, assuming hippo or ttar drop zolt will tear through the tier
 
Entei can run Extremespeed with any nature and ability it wants. It's still not that strong of a breaker, although it might prefer now to go for more mixed sets still with the priority like Arcanine (now with other natures other than Adamant).
 
Registeel (and Regirock and Regice but that's likely less important in UU) apparently gets Body Press which could be a pretty nice upgrade from Seismic Toss. Body Press is worse against Substitute users that resist Fighting, or if Registeel is burned, but it lets Registeel 2HKO stuff like Terrakion, Krookodile, Bisharp, and Cobalion (in this case, Registeel needs to run a Bold Nature or have some Defense investment and have a Spike up). Sure they outspeed and threaten Registeel (which often avoids the OHKO from them even with a SpDef set), but earlier Registeel was a pretty free switch in, and with Body Press they can't come in as easily.
 

Bandkrook

flower boy
is a Pre-Contributor
On the topic of Dracozolt, it doesn't even need Hippo or Ttar to drop, as we have Gigalith, who can set up sand, rocks and be a good wall. So even if Hippo/Ttar don't drop, if Zolt does drop, it'll be just as viable.
 

Lilburr

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Here are my own thoughts on a few mons I can see being quite good.

:ss/diancie:
Diancie has always been in an awkward spot in UU, facing big competition as a bulky Fairy from stuff like Florges. Nowadays, that competition is Sylveon and Galarian Weezing, neither of which can quite do what Diancie does. In particular, it's probably the best counter to Noivern that we'll ever get, but it also checks a lot of current threats like Incineroar, Obstagoon, Porygon-Z and as for new threats, Galarian Birds, regular Moltres, Nihilego, Tornadus, Entei etc are all covered pretty convincingly. It'll kind of fulfill a role TTar filled while we had it. It also has a great offensive presence, Diamond Storm and Moonblast are both no joke and are surprisingly hard to come in on since it has Earth Power to hit Pokemon like Galarian Slowbro, Copperajah etc. that'd otherwise handle similar mons like defensive Sylveon. Also has rocks. Should be a great one, probably the mon I'm most excited for rn.

:ss/metagross:
REAL STEEL TYPES, bless. Metagross is a very tough mon to handle and it's SUPER versatile, I'd be really surprised if it doesn't end up being a top tier mon. Being a great rocker, solid check to so many things both defensively and offensively, having coverage out the ass to pick its counters and just being so hard to come in on, they're all great traits. It might suffer a bit as long as Slowbro is around but it can even Toxic that. One set I'm definitely looking forward to is Hammer Arm + Eject Pack; might not be great, but you can get a strong hit off on checks like Incineroar and Rotom-W before pivoting out into the appropriate check. Should be good!!

:ss/nidoqueen:
Takes a dump on Electric-types, is very hard to come in on, acts as a real fairy resist, gets rocks up and walls Terrakion all in one slot. You really can't ask for more of a mon. I would be SHOCKED if Nidoqueen isn't a top tier Pokemon, it should be absolutely bonkers given how powerful it is and how many things it checks. The amount of times I've been building and wished I could fit a Nidoqueen there has been astounding tbh, I really hope it drops so I get the opportunity to use it.

:ss/suicune:
Demon Pokemon.

:ss/tyrantrum:
Not much to say here but we honestly lack decent Rock resists rn, with most teams using Cobalion/Doublade and uh... Slowbro for the job. It got Close Combat to take Cobalion on, has always had Earthquake/Crunch for Doublade, and Slowbro is no answer. I don't think this'll be meta defining but CB Head Smash seems like it'll be a lot of fun to play around with.

There's other stuff that I think will be cool like Zeraora, Azumarill, Kommo-o etc if they drop so I'm looking forward to that (though they're definitely not guaranteed), but I figured I'd keep this list to new mons exclusively sooo yeah.
 
Might as well talk about some OU pokemon we are likely to get from the DLC power creep. While none of these are truly given, I'll start with the ones that are more likely than others based on what we know is returning and how each have been faring in the meta even before dlc.
1601854887605.png
- surprised this guy didn't drop last shifts considering olt is over. Ditto is a gimmick that only really fits on very few archetypes and while it has OU viability, I do not think it will get consistent usage to stay OU.
1601854943908.png
- rhyperior rose all the way from RU to OU a few days ago due to it being a phenomenal breaker and fantastic check to cinderace, who they were retesting last month. However, rhypeiror, if anything, is a flavor of the month mon that regardless of DLC would have likely dropped back down. New grounds like lando-t and chomp giving it competition and a bunch of special breakers to abuse its weak spDef means its not cut out for OU. I do think it will be UU viable, but in terms of usage it will likely be RU.
1601854953306.png
- another mon who i was surprised didn't drop, toxtricity is great at dismantling the common clef/corv/pex cores seen in OU. However, its low speed will hold it back as faster threats like lele, lati-twins, victini, lando-t, garchomp, and zygarde returning overall limit tox's viability and usage. It'll return home to UU, where i wonder how it will fare against stuff like nidos, swampert, and more.
1601854963126.png
- this mon is bad lol. In all seriousness, this mon hasn't been good in OU due to the amount of viable grasses in OU, having 4 solid grass types. It faces competition from other waters like crawdaunt, urshifu-rapid, and primarina, and was bound to find itself here sooner than later, but the drop will now be accelerated by dlc as so many things like tapu bulu, kartana, tapu koko, thundurus, xurkitree, and many more ruin its day. Whether it'll be stuck in UUBL for eternity or actually allowed in UU is yet to be seen.
1601854812930.png
-most thought this mon would fall off a cliff with tangrowth returning, yet it still has remained strong. however, lando-t, zygrade, and chomp returning all will single handily send zera down to UU. Its speed is good, but compared to tapu koko who has better offenses (it might be broken) means that zera will be outclassed as an offensive pivot. I believe that this will be a top mon in UU should it drop and it may even contribute to the unbanning of UUBL mons like primarina or even gyarados.
1601854896640.png
-all hail the mantis overlord. We all know he's coming, the question is whether we ban him or not. Moltres, entei, swampert, celesteela, volcanion, and a couple of other mons that are on this list like skarm, heat tom, and mandi could all check/counter it depending on if it drops. All i know is that it will make diance's life miserable.
1601854828316.png
-one of the mons that if they drop they are likely to get banned. While hydra is very solid, it has been dropping in usage more and more and with so many faster dragons, fairies, and fighters coming back, hydra is having a tough time more than ever. If this drops, i expect it to be banned relatively quickly.
1601854836945.png
-another mon that is likely to be UUBL, alakazam has barely survived dropping for 2 months now, and with psychic like tapu lele and latios coming back and new toy syndrome from dlc means that alakazam is another likely drop to UU. Its less broken than hydreigon, but it still may very well be sent to UUBl due to its fast speed and special attack.
1601854851634.png
-mandibuzz gets a large amount of usage in Ou from dealing with mons like aegislash, dragapult, and urshifu. However, it faces competition from things like corv and skarm. Now, dlc is bring many flying types that offer the same utility that mandibuzz brings and more. Pokemon like zapdos, moltres, torn-t, and even galarian moltres (who shares the same typing) may likely outclass it. At least if it drops it can make it's home in UU.
1601854975024.png
-crawgod rose to OU due to its phenomenal breaking abilities. However, many new faster threats and wall breakers may cause crawdaunt to fall off from either being outclassed or new toy syndrome. Its one of the less likely drops on the list though, and its breaking abelites may or may not be too much for UU, so lets see.
1601854867086.png
-skarm faces severe coemption from corv, who has u-turn and better speed. Now, plenty returning mons like tapu koko, victini, blacephalon, blaziken, latios, and moltres all threaten it, so it has a decent chance to drop to UU due to all of these likely being very good in OU.
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-another mon who was briefly UU before rising to take its place back in OU, ttar is one of the lesser drops actaully. the ability to check things like dragapult and volcarona is valuable in the metagame at the moment. However, mons like heatran, garchomp, and lando-t all returning means Ttar isn't the sole volc check while potential threats like the tapus might take its place to deal with dragapult, Once again, this is one of the less likely drops on this list, but between many mons returning that can threaten it with its many weaknesses or deal with the same things it does means TTar might return to its new home in UU.
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-this is urshifu rapid btw. Anyway, many top threats are returning. Who deal with some of the best offensive threats in the meta? Toxapex. And who deals with urshifu for the most part? Toxapex. It might get a solid amount of usage due to rain having a resurgence with new abusers, but unless its scarfed this mon is going to get killed by so many new things. Alongside crawdaunt and Tyranitar it might drop later than some of these other mons, but urshifu rapid is something that is not off the table.
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-Kommo-o, while solid, dies to so many new things coming back. The tapus, torn-t, zygarde, lati twins, nagandel, dragonite, salamence all beat it with their stabs not to mention common mons like pult and clefable will always be there to kill it. IT might barely hang on, get eclipsed by new toy syndrome or drop but later rise up, but it's not off the able that we might get kommo-o, whos crippling fairy weakness may or may not keep it in check.
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-while likely to still be a great mon in OU and probably the least likely mon to drop on this lost, amoongus has to deal with new threats in the metagame. tapu lele, torn-t, blaziken, latios, victini, and blacephalon all severely threaten it and look to be very viable pokemon. it'll be a fantastic mon in UU if it drops, but I'm torn on whether it stays OU or not due to it walling tapu koko for the most part and... that's it. yeah maybe it isn't too crazy that amoongus may drop.
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-hippo, while also a good mon and one of the best ways to deal with blaziken, now faces competition from grounds like zygarde, lando-t, and garchomp, who all will get great amounts of usage. THIS might be the least likely mon we get on the list. Nothing else to say, fantastic physicals wall but special attackers and other ground give it problems. If it drops it will likely be one of the best mons in the tier.
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-Last for OU to UU is rotom heat. While very good, other pivots like koko, electrics like zapdos, and fires like moltres and heatran all make take up it's usage. Furthermore, this will likely get eclipsed by new toy syndrome and fall as a result. Will definitely be one of the best drops for UU though.
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-While 3 of these are OU by usage, they all are likely to fall, yet will go back to UUBL. gengar is still probably too much due to tis insane breaking ability with nasty plot, jirachi may or may not be too much depending on what drops we get, it has a very diverse amount of sets but some sets will not be too viable with some drops we are getting. primarina can get un banned if we get get more grasses and electrics who can deal with it, it still one of the more likely UUBls to be unbanned. Finally, even though we just banned lycanroc-dusk, i think it will be fine. We can get more priory and much more pokemon to stomach hits from this dog. It was banned because the power level was too low for it, but now the level is going to be jacked up higher and it should be unbanned as a result.

Wow, that's a long list. Like the last DLC, they UU metagame is going to get shaken up with lots of new top tier mons entering the tier, making some old ones more manageable and edging out some others. As for others, do you agree or disagree with my list? What would you add or take off? Also, is there any UUBls that should get unbanned other than dusk roc for the most part. DLC 2 is coming in 18 days!
 
not mew? mew is getting outclassed as a HO lead by azelf, offensively its outdone by azelf with higher speed and offenses
prim to, seems to slow to get started in this hostile environment which is DLC 2
 
With the rather sizeable tier shifts we are going to see starting next month, it's pretty clear that the tiers are going to see a rather massive shift in terms of power level. As with the last DLC drop, this naturally raises the question of the Borderline mons. Assuming we get the drops that most people are expecting, would any of them be more balanced now? Before I start, I'll say that we should probably wait until the December shift before anything gets retested since the fairly brief period we'll have between Crown Tundra drop and November shift (thanks a lot, GF) means that we'll probably see a lot of wonkiness in the initial shift; frankly, our attention is better given to dealing with any obviously broken drops that slip through in the chaos before we consider the stuff that was already banned.

Currently UUBL
Conkeldurr:
Oh, definitely not! Conkeldurr just hits way too hard, and none of what's expected to drop really switches into it that well.

Diggersby: We got physically defensive Suicune, but other than that nothing of note defensively. The most reliable way to counteract Digger is to get the right predictions on Choice sets, which does not scream "not-broken" to me.

Dracozolt: Normally, I'd be willing to at least try it; however, the HA Capsule (or whatever it's called) has thrown a monkey wrench into any notion of Zolt coming back, more than making up for the loss of Hustle's sheer power with the ability to outspeed most of the meta under Sand, which is perfect for Bolt Beak. Even if we have to make do with Gigalith, I have no doubt this thing would be a burden to teambuilder, as it basically mandates a Ground type on every team. Still, maybe it'll finally be good in OU.

Durant: The thing about Durant, at least on paper, is that it still goes ham on everything, but it now struggles a bit more with 4MSS. It needs Rock coverage for Moltres and Volcanion, needs Tantrum or Superpower for Staka, and without boosting via Hone Claws it straight up can't break Suicune unless you go Band Thunder Fang, while Swampert requires at least +1 (initially) Superpower. However, you might be tempted to keep Impression since otherwise Slowbro doesn't care about you until you get at least +2; you could choose to drop Iron Head to make room- which leaves you hard-walled by Geezing. This competition for slots means that Durant no longer has room for everything it needs, meaning it likely has to drop the set that made it so overwhelming before (that being Band with Impression/Head/Superpower/Tantrum, or some variation of such) in order to optimally adapt to the post-Tundra meta; what's more, having to set up Claws potentially leaves it vulnerable due to its non-existent special bulk. In this case, I think that might just be enough to keep Durant in check simply because of how vital Impression was to its prior success, and Impression isn't really optimal for a set-up sweeper. This need to swap up its playstyle given what will probably be the relevant threats may very well let it be more manageable than before.

Gyarados: A transition to post-Tundra UU sees Gyarados necessitating Power Whip, as otherwise even +1 Dos fails to 2HKO defensive Suicune and Swampert. At +1, Gyara can swap EQ for Bounce since Waterfall sufficiently handles most Steels, plus Bounce actually does better than EQ against Volcanion and is Dos' only way to handle Mowtom. Thus, having the defensive backbone to stop that initial Moxie boost is still out of UU's reach, sadly.

Haxorus: I can't believe I'm seriously about to argue that something with 147 Attack and multiple boosting options can't get through UU on muscle alone anymore, but competitive Pokemon is a rather bizarre thing. It wants CC since it's CC, it wants EQ since otherwise it flails against Nidoqueen and Geezing while falling short in the 1v1 with Metagross, it wants Poison Jab for that pesky defensive Sylveon, and it wants STAB since otherwise it struggles to consistently break Suicune, Swampert, Slowbro and defensive Moltres, all of which can cripple it with a burn if it lacks Lum Berry, but having Lum means it doesn't have a power boosting item. And that's with boosting; Band sets are definitely strong, but can (somehow) lack a bit of punch against those previously mentioned mons (plus you're more open to prediction and revenge killing). So, as shocking as it sounds to me, on paper Haxorus isn't quite the monster you'd initially think it'd be post-Tundra. Honestly, I could see this coming back, although it being broken is still possible.

Duskroc: Looking specifically at the AoA set (which was best pre-ban), Swampert and Suicune once again stand out as two mons that just don't care about unboosted Duskroc and KO it back with ease. Outside of that, though, I'm a bit torn on whether Duskroc would still be broken or not. On the one hand, AoA still gets the 2HKO on many mons and that speed tier is still great, but it still faces the problem of being KOed by basically anything with any offensive presence that does manage to survive a hit. Still, I'm leaning towards "no".

A. Ninetales: Let's see: this shift will undoubtedly give us access to more sweepers that abuse Aurora Veil, which does not sound particularly appealing, so probably no.

Scolipede: Not counting the potential return of Skarmory or drop of Celesteela, we still have functionally nothing that handles STABs and Earthquake well. Maybe Moltres?- Oh wait, it gets Aqua Tail too. If there's anything that does make Scolipede more manageable, it's that it may have 4MSS now, having to choose between STABs, EQ for Steels and Aqua Tail for Moltres (it needs SD since 100 Attack isn't enough on its own). But it probably wouldn't be enough to keep it in check.

Venusaur: As much as I hate to say it, Venusaur probably won't come back as long as Drought is legal while Drizzle isn't. Simply put, the legal Sand and Hail setters just don't check Sun enough to be answers. Moltres is probably the best new check, but Molt doesn't want to eat Sludge Bomb. Drizzle is the only thing that could halt Sun, and thus Chloro Venusaur, but Drizzle probably won't be unbanned with all the strong Waters running around.

Weavile: *sigh* The question of whether Weavile can come back is more so a question of "Can UU handle Triple Axel?" Axel will have a few new resists in Suicune, Metagross and Stakataka- of course, Gross doesn't eat Knock Off and Banded Low Kick OHKOs Staka easy, so we really have one new Weavile answer. Still not enough defensive counterplay, so no.

Previously Banned, Currently OU by Usage
There's no guarantee that any of these guys will drop off (and I am highly dubious several of them will at any point), but just in case-

Aegislash: No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. .. I can keep doing this all day, but I think you get the point.

Gengar: Once this ghastly ghost gets a Plot up, it can effectively 2HKO most of the meta with just Shadow Ball or Focus Blast. Sure, it can't actually stay in on Swampert or Nidoqueen, but most of the other mons on the bulkier side don't really do much in return; Chansey is usually not 2HKOed by +2 FB, but the standard set literally can't do anything in return. Plus, Gengar can still run a viable Specs or Scarf set, and you don't want your walls getting tricked.

Hawlucha: To be clear, the hawk is not dropping off anytime soon, given that terrains are about to get a lot better in OU. But if it did, it would have two new defensive answers in Nidoqueen and defensive Moltres, struggles to break Slowbro or Geezing and falls short of the OHKO against Tornadus, who OHKOs back; outside of those, nothing really handles it that well. There are a few answers, but I'm unconvinced they'd be deemed enough.

Jirachi: Jirachi is a bit hard to unpack on paper alone. By far the most obvious thing is that this new UU meta suffocates the old Scarf set, with Trick being that sets only way to handle the new bulky waters, as well as defensive Moltres, Nidoqueen and Stakataka. Of course, one set is not the reason Rachi was banned; in this new meta, we'd likely see an uptick in either SR lead Rachi and/or CM sweeper Rachi. Whether or not that's "healthy" really depends on whether UU players can sufficiently deal with non-Scarf Rachi, so can't say for certain.

Kommo-o: Ah, it seems like forever ago when this thing got banned. Yeah, as nice as this might seem, Clangorous Soul still exists. And once that boost is on the table (+ another +1 SpA from Throat Spray)- yeah, almost nothing reliably lives this thing. The Fairy trio of Sylveon, Geezing and Mimikyu are the only things that can live a hit and actually KO back, at least form what calcs I've done. Therefore, you either have to run one of those three or have a (p)hazer. You might call this "rather restrictive to teambuilder". Sorry, but Kom cannot come back if it still gets to use C. Soul.

Primarina: Primarina is probably going to drop off at some point considering Fini can use its OU CM Sweeper role more effectively due to greater bulk and Misty Terrain. Rina mainly struggles against Special walls, with Sylveon, Chansey, Volcanion and Registeel all giving it trouble, not to mention having to endure Pressure stalling with CM Suicune, although Suicune doesn't do much in return. Honestly, Rina never struck me as too overtly overwhelming, but if you get multiple CM boosts it's rather hard to stop. Could see this going either way, but unsure.

Ultimately, I don't think many of them would be made not-broken by the upcoming power-creep. If anything does become unbroken, I'd have to say it'll be Durant and Haxorus (and maybe Jirachi and Primarina if they fall off in OU, although even then I'm not completely sure about either), and even that depends on whether what we think is going to drop actually does so in time for the retesting period. As such, we have no choice but to wait and see what the next-phase of UU has to offer before a more accurate assessment can be made on the UUBLs.
 
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Do you think anything will knock Noivern from of its seemingly eternal UU throne?
If my prediction is correct, and UU become the territory of Dragon like Hydreigon/Latias/Noivern (I think he will still a great poké, A+ at minimum) Sylveon could take his throne. Maybe Scizor too if he comeback.
Do you think the removal of moves like Hidden Power and Pursuit will make some Pokemon shoot up or down in viability?
Krook is maybe who have lose the most of Pursuit being gone and Roserade would be a huge top tier if he would threathen Steel type, beside thats, most of Pursuit user/HP User don't seem to be in the tier.
Which Pokemon will benefit from Heavy-Duty Boots the most? Are there any Pokemon that previously had no niche in UU that may gain one as a result of this addition?

I think Articuno will be the best user with his Buddy Bird Moltres of Heavy duty boots, but where Moltres had already a good place in UU last gen, Articuno was only seen in some Stall. With Boots + Pressure + a really good bulk, it can become a staple for Stall and a good check to some poké like Latias or Sylveon. Archeops too could be a really offensive presence with his great stats and not caring of SR
Do you think any OU staples will fall to UU? We saw Skarmory and Tyranitar drop to UU earlier in the generation, after all.

I'm don't know if i should be for or against, but i think Hydreigon will claims his title of Apex predator of UU. If OU doesn't respect his way of torn apart Balance with NP or/and DD, pretty sure UU will, and i don't find him as "bannable" than Lycanrock and Gengar, since is Average at best, and with the high probability of seeing Latias coming back, and Sylveon a staple of the tier, no reason to banish him if he fall... Right ?
Do you think Galarian Slowking will drop to UU? Will it be a good addition to the tier, or will it be outclassed? For what we have seen, i don't think this pokémon will be UU, his Signature move + Regenerator a really good poké who will maybe stay in OU. But if he had to fall, it will be extremely good, like his buddy Slowbro.
Is there anything else you're excited about?
I pretty hype to see if like my preview, Fini will become UU, but this could be a great pokemon, and a staple for balance/Bulky offense. Nihilego could be really cool to play with his unique typing a scizor gone from the tier (for the moment) and great coverage. Moltres Galarian hype me a lot too, but i'm not sure it will be UU.

Sorry for my bad english.
 
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Gut feeling tiers with a dash of basis on Nat Dex and past gen history.

:volcanion: :moltres: :entei:

I've seen some people put Volcanion in OU, and maybe it'll get there by virtue of its typing, but it sacrifices a lot of power in exchange for hazard immunity. Moltres and (to a lesser extent) Entei are in the same boat. I think this trade-off will be what keeps them UU.

:xurkitree:

Glad to have my beautiful daughter back, though without Z-moves and Hidden Power she will have a harder time getting the ball rolling. Can see Choice sets becoming her best bet with Tail Glow next in line. Sticky Web support will help too.

Might add to this post later about potential UUBL drops but for now here you go.
 
I made a controversial Hot Take tier list:


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You may think I'm crazy for saying Kartana and Blacephelon will fall to UU, but I just don't see them surviving that well in OU.

I think Metagross, Latias, and Victini will fall too, but they will be too much for UU to handle.

Dragon Dance Sceptile might be fun, but don't think it's enough to put it in UU.

But of course none of this matters at all because none of us have any idea how it will play out at all whatsoever. I do hope we have a few days of chaos with everything unbanned to see how things shake up, so every mon can have their fair shake in the UU metagame.
 
I think Metagross, Latias, and Victini will fall too, but they will be too much for UU to handle.
I think Vicini definitely with Boots and Latias with it's new coverage is stupid. However I think Metagross won't be top bad. Considering we got Bisharp, Krook, potential Nido's Suicune/Swampert Moltres and stuff like Slowbro, Slowking, Noivern, Coballion, Golurk etc.

He's gonna be a top tier mon and hard to switch into but I don't think he'll be broken. If he is I'll film myself eating my own shorts!
 

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