Tournament UUbersPL Format Discussion

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Everything other than SS Ubers UU as options look kinda mickey to me, ig my second option would be Bo3 but I'm reluctant on that but I'm not expecting SS to take two slots, that's too ambitious of me. Lemme explain.

I've participated in enough team tours at this point where it just makes sense for a PL of a specific format to include an oldgen slot, unless said team tour wants to focus on OMs (see Monotype OM Premier League for reference.) I am biased towards SS Ubers and by extension, SS Ubers UU and I think showcasing this tier at the highest level will ignite interest in the format in the overall Ubers UU community. It's never going to be that big since it's not CG but a lot of people will look at it and think to themselves "actually this tier looks pretty heat!" No generational mechanic and no Arceus forme really make the format stand out from SV and ND and I'm excited to see if it gets the development it deserves.

Now here's my problems with the other suggestions.

Suspect: I don't really see the point of this slot? Most of the mons banned from this tier are banned for good reasons last time I checked. You could argue that some could deserved to be tested or even freed at some point in the future but let's leave that out of the tour I think?

SV4: Having an extra slot of cg will always bring concerns of quality of games and not that I've ever really cared about that issue myself, it's also harder to get more players for cg that will perform as well as the top people that will be the most expensive to draft. Also it's kinda boring from the viewer experience and just having more variety is always better in my eyes.

Ubers RU: Despite the activity and development this has seen so far, it's not a Ubers UU tier, unless you want to call it "Ubers UU UU" as its basically the UU of Ubers UU. I'd rather SV4 than this imo

Free x2 SS Ubers UU, thanks.
 
Suspect Slot > Bo3 >= SS Ubers UU > SV4 > Ubers RU

Suspect slot could be very interesting. Not sure which is better between SS Ubers UU and Bo3, i guess they are both fine it depends if you are looking for game variety (SS Ubers UU) or something which is less dependant on hax / mu (Bo3).
In my opinion, there is no point adding the fourth SV slot or RU Ubers.
 
cooking time

suspect slots are trash, having managed other tournaments like smpl with them multiple years in a row they rarely lead to any development at all and barely give any info on what the meta would be like with any changes. There's nothing to go off aside from the one slot so people end up reusing or it just becomes the same meta as base game with people not trying.

rubers also bad this is uuberspl not ruberspl, people spamming 1 liners to try and get the tier in should put up actual arguments for it that it has a real playerbase and any amount of forum presence/resources that wouldn't make it a completely isolated slot that no one plays. It has no reason to be directly related to uubers unlike what's been said in this thread, being based off this tier fundamentally doesn't change anything, same as how this tier has no relation to ubers in their forum or tournaments. Worst option to me by a lot, would never include it.

that leaves sv4, bo3, and ss, and I think it would be best to send out a survey to both the main discord and this thread to gauge some opinions here. If a meaningful amount of people respond that they will actively sign up to play ss and it can get some real resources by the time the tour starts, even if minimal, I think it can get a slot. It's essentially the same thing as ND since it's just a different uubers gen/format, so it should be fine if it has enough of a comparable playerbase. But if a tier only exists on discord and just has people chiming in every once in a while that they'd play it then it's not gonna be a successful slot. bo3>sv4 probably between those 2, I think it's just better. More variety.

order of preference:

bo3 + ss (with playerbase + forum resources)
bo3 + sv4
bo3 + ss (playerbase + no forum resources)
6 sv or smth
the rest of the tiers
rubers
 
Fc said:
rubers also bad this is uuberspl not ruberspl, people spamming 1 liners to try and get the tier in should put up actual arguments for it that it has a real playerbase and any amount of forum presence/resources that wouldn't make it a completely isolated slot that no one plays. It has no reason to be directly related to uubers unlike what's been said in this thread, being based off this tier fundamentally doesn't change anything, same as how this tier has no relation to ubers in their forum or tournaments. Worst option to me by a lot, would never include it.
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A perfect time to remind people that this is a discussion thread, not a voting thread. Posting one-liners with no elaboration will not help anything.
 
Here's my two cents on this

1. SS Ubers UU

This is frankly the best way to expand the tier as a whole and it gives most people a chance to play in equal footing. Expanding the tier horizontally into older gens allows us to host these tournaments easier and sparks more interest in the tier as a whole. SS Ubers UU also looks sick as long as the overpowered mons get banned (Lunala was the main offender, but ndw is not that far behind) since it doesn't have tera and has a different assortment of Pokemon (genesect finally has a home)

2. BO3
Best of 3 formats are always better than best of one, and i think that the slot will give the strongest players a chance to show off their skills. While it runs into an issue that I'll talk about later it isn't as bad because it's just one slot + it's very likely many of the top players are allocated to this allowing unknown players to take Bo1 slots which is a positive.

3. Ubers RU
To be frank Ubers RU doesn't belong in this, but it's slightly better than the other options. While it is more established than SS Ubers UU, it shouldn't be in the Ubers UU PL just because it isn't an Ubers UU tier, it's something else.
Expanding the tier vertically is a fruitless endeavor considering that our usage stats aren't stable, meaning that this tier is VR based, committing the same mistake that resulted in old Ubers UU attempts to not function. It doesn't have a stable metagame and i don't think many people would enjoy it. With a new VR coming up soon, the metagame will basically have to start fresh, basically equating as SS Ubers UU but without a ton of Pokemon. However, it is better than the other options because it actually introduces new people into the tier (some people have stopped playing Ubers UU for Ubers RU instead, And some people have only started playing Ubers RU and not Ubers UU). While this playerbase is tiny, it should give enough people to fill the slots and it gives the people a chance to show Smogon that it actually has potential to become an 'official' tier for tournaments in the future.

4. Suspect slot
I think that this doesn't achieve much because realistically, what are we going to use this for? A no Arceus tier? A no tera tier? A no Mewtwo/landorus/zacian/etc tier? Most of these aren't realistic to happen so this doesn't achieve anything but create a temporary interesting metagame that will disappear once the tournament ends. It's better than the last slot at least because it's somewhat interesting

5. 4SV
This option is just lame and doesn't achieve anything but be BO3 but worse. It doesn't add anything to the tournament and it's potentially taking away the ability to play new things for what, comfort? I love SV Ubers UU as much as the next guy but if we're going to run a PL running too many SV slots is just grasping at straws and makes it less interesting overall, which is part of the appeal of PLs

6. 6SV
This is probably the worst option of all because I don't think we have enough of a playerbase to support this. While we do have enough players, we don't have enough good ones. This would either result in people having to draft not very good players or people from the outside of the tier putting strain on the people who know how to build to build for multiple slots every week, alongside potentially playing their own weeks. It's also just lame. I don't like ND Ubers UU but it's genuinely a better option than having 6SV slots

Edit:
I also realize that it's very unlikely for good outside players to sign up in enough numbers for every team to have access to 2-3 of them. Meaning that at best you have 1 if any. Meaning the scenario of having to draft bad players is a lot more realistic.
 
Hello, I am one of the people in charge of Ubers RU. One of the complaints I've heard about Ubers RU is that the cutoff is unusually high. I wanted to let everyone know that we are actually planning/discussing to lower the cutoff to be more in line with other VR tiers (C+) and would love to have a chance to develop the tier further in this UUbersPL with that lowered cutoff. I heard there's a new Ubers UU VR shift coming in the next week or so and so this is about when we would plan on enacting this. I'm hoping for a fun tour for everyone!
 
Taka said:
smuubers
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OceanicGamer said:
Hello, I am one of the people in charge of Ubers RU. One of the complaints I've heard about Ubers RU is that the cutoff is unusually high. I wanted to let everyone know that we are actually planning/discussing to lower the cutoff to be more in line with other VR tiers (C+) and would love to have a chance to develop the tier further in this UUbersPL with that lowered cutoff. I heard there's a new Ubers UU VR shift coming in the next week or so and so this is about when we would plan on enacting this. I'm hoping for a fun tour for everyone!
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I just want to point out that, with the community this eager to get a shot at the big time in UUbers PL, I don't really see a reason why to not give them a shot if we're including other non SV Ubers UU tiers. RUbers is just as much UUbers as NatDex and SS (maybe moreso) and so I don't really buy the arguments that it's not an "Ubers UU" tier. I think that argument is incredibly hollow and doesn't take into account the actual historical development of the tier that intrinsically ties it to Ubers UU in more ways than some of the other tiers up for consideration. The Ubers UU Discord lists it as part of the Ubers UU Family. If there were concerns related to gathering players and producing high quality games, that would be a more solid reason to not include. To my understanding though, there are plenty of people who are waiting, willing, and eager to play this tier in a PL format (I may even want to try it out there). Clearly they are working hard to push the tier forward. We should not be the ones holding them back if all else falls into place here. There is no "RUbers PL" now or ever - this is the only PL format that would make sense for this tier to be included. I promise you it's not the end of the world including a "non-Ubers UU" format - it looks like it will be an entertaining alternative to watching much of the same.

Keep in mind Ubers UU itself had a lot of help in establishing and growing itself through inclusion in formats that, with all due respect, had no real business including the tier. They just did it anyways because they wanted to give the tier a shot to grow. And look where we are now. Don't leave out RUbers UU for these unfair reasons - only leave it out if there are legitimate concerns with the playerbase and quality of games (though I find it hard to believe there would be any issues there with only 6 starting slots, definitely not any more than SS Ubers UU).
 
can we get a 24 or 36-ish hour "this is the current plan" for if folks want to do a last minute push based on what the current idea is? id like to not see this thread locked and a format posted as locked in/not open for further discussion since there doesn't seem to be strong consensus in the thread about what to do. cc Imperial @whoever else idk who's running this behind the scenes
 
o/. This will close on the 18th with an opening of manager signups. We are currently considering the following 6x6 format as the primary slot format selection for this tournament:

SV1
SV2
SV3
bo3
ND Ubers UU
SS Ubers UU

RUbers had quite a bit of support, but it was quite a few one-liners, and it also had significant support against it being added, so we have considered it too controversial for this edition of UUbersPL, maybe next time.
SS Ubers UU had a bit less support, but still a solid amount, and had much less outcry against it, while having much greater activity, so we have decided to include it.
bo3 was an easy inclusion as it had the most widespread support.
sv4 has quality concerns on top of bo3, so we chose bo3 over an sv4 slot.

Thank you everyone who posted their thoughts in this thread, and it will remain open until manager signups go live.
Manager self-buy is planned to be set at 12k, and the budget/self buy will be set in stone by manager signups.
 
I applaud the decision to include SS Ubers UU. I seriously dislike the reasoning of RUbers being "too controversial". I think the reality is that the specific TOs putting this tour together, mostly imperial and vesp, just either don't like the tier and need to swallow their pride, because it's obvious that the Ubers UU community is one and the same with Ubers RU.

Ubers UU is the introduction of a tiering system, and RUbers is the next step of that tiering system. While yes it does not have the name, it is the next logical continuation of the "start from Ubers" tiering. You can go back to older gens and apply the logic, which is how you get SS ubers UU, or you can apply it downwards and get Ubers RU. The tier is the same people, having fun and developing a metagame that uses a lot of the same pokemon and concepts. You're cutting off a big part of the community just because you don't like the metagame.

You quote activity, what activity has there been for SS Ubers UU? The organizers of this PL, vesp and imp, decided to start working on SS Ubers UU. Vesp got the discord active again, and Imp hosted tour after tour of it in the UM room. Vesp was given permission by imperial, a forum moderator, to start a SS Ubers UU thread. Ocean is not as close a friend to imp, nor does he have the forum moderator or room owner status on showdown. The organizers themselves boosted the activity of SS ubers UU and are now saying "welp, activity matters". It was your choice to not boost rubers, and I even requested that you do it but it was shut down. Shame on you for being dishonest like that. RUbers was more active before the PL discussion started, and the organizers decided they didn't want to help them but did want to help SS.

Yes it's controversial, but that's 90% because of two reasons: (1) "It's not named Ubers UU", which I hope I've addressed in the 2nd paragraph, and (2) "The metagame sucks". It's ABOUT to get overturned with the new VR, and when was the last time you played it? When was the last time it got serious development and thought put into it? How do you know it sucks? Even if it does, you don't have to sign up for it.

Yes this wasn't a voting thread, but the people who came out and gave one-liners of support would absolutely sign up for the tier, and would play it. The people who didn't want to play it wouldn't have to sign up for it.

Swap Bo3 for RUbers, or even one of the SV slots because i think Bo3 is still cool. As A fairy suggested, this should NOT be over and we should have some time to respond to what you posted imp.

Also I know this will just get me haha'd so whatever, but imp and vesp haha-ing everyone who likes RUbers feels disrespectful.
 
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Add UbersRU and an extra natdex slot, make tour 8 player format. I understand the 6 player format slot is a result of low sign ups a lot of time, but imo I find the 6 format slot to be quite terrible in the past 6 slot team tours I've played and I wish we would abandon the concept. Idk the logistics of expected sign-ups though so maybe it's a crapshoot but figured I would throw my two cents regarding format.
 
"RUbers was more active before the PL discussion started, and the organizers decided they didn't want to help them but did want to help SS."

Rubers has had 6 documented games played since the first of October until now. SS Ubers UU has had over 100.
My preference would personally be almost mono-sv, but I said I'd add natdex and added the others as an option. A lot of the RUbers votes were one-liners with no elaboration, whereas SS Ubers UU votes had elaboration and thought put into them, and RUbers also had a lot of no-inclusion votes.

Going less than 4sv with 1bo3 seems very silly, and I can't revoke a national dex slot as I said I'd commit to it, and this seems like the option with the least controversy and most consensus in this thread. It is also Ubers UU PL, not Ubers Family PL, and Ubers doesn't include us in their tours, so it makes no sense to include Ubers RU in ours.

As for the 6x8 proposal, I seriously doubt the ability of ND Ubers UU to supply 12 players for their slots. I'm not even entirely confident if SV will field 18/24 good players.

You say I don't "like the tier" and need to "swallow my pride." I would like for a tier to be in a playable and balanced state to an extent and actually be functionally playable before we include it in what is probably one of the most significant Ubers UU subforum tours of the year.
Also, you suggest, "When was the last time I played Ubers RU?" When was the last time anything changed in Ubers RU? in September. I played it, it was unbalance and unenjoyable, i stopped playing it.

(this is my personal thoughts from a hosting perspective, not reflecting the other hosts at this current moment)
also to say that "As a fairy suggested, this should NOT be over, and we should have some time to respond to what you posted imp.," that's why the thread is still open and not locked....

You made the equivalent of a conspiracy theory post and demanded that BO3 (the most popular slot) be taken out for Ubers RU (the most contentious slot). This is incredibly misguided in my eyes, and is relatively nonsensical. No I don't hate Ubers RU for no reason, I just don't want something like that in it's current state in the PL, and would rather develop a metagame that is both actually suited for the subforum (Ubers UU), and that has effort put into it recently, which it appears Ubers RU has not.
 
KineSquared said:
I applaud the decision to include SS Ubers UU. I seriously dislike the reasoning of RUbers being "too controversial". I think the reality is that the specific TOs putting this tour together, mostly imperial and vesp, just either don't like the tier and need to swallow their pride, because it's obvious that the Ubers UU community is one and the same with Ubers RU.

Ubers UU is the introduction of a tiering system, and RUbers is the next step of that tiering system. While yes it does not have the name, it is the next logical continuation of the "start from Ubers" tiering. You can go back to older gens and apply the logic, which is how you get SS ubers UU, or you can apply it downwards and get Ubers RU. The tier is the same people, having fun and developing a metagame that uses a lot of the same pokemon and concepts. You're cutting off a big part of the community just because you don't like the metagame.

You quote activity, what activity has there been for SS Ubers UU? The organizers of this PL, vesp and imp, decided to start working on SS Ubers UU. Vesp got the discord active again, and Imp hosted tour after tour of it in the UM room. Vesp was given permission by imperial, a forum moderator, to start a SS Ubers UU thread. Ocean is not as close a friend to imp, nor does he have the forum moderator or room owner status on showdown. The organizers themselves boosted the activity of SS ubers UU and are now saying "welp, activity matters". It was your choice to not boost rubers, and I even requested that you do it but it was shut down. Shame on you for being dishonest like that. RUbers was more active before the PL discussion started, and the organizers decided they didn't want to help them but did want to help SS.

Yes it's controversial, but that's 90% because of two reasons: (1) "It's not named Ubers UU", which I hope I've addressed in the 2nd paragraph, and (2) "The metagame sucks". It's ABOUT to get overturned with the new VR, and when was the last time you played it? When was the last time it got serious development and thought put into it? How do you know it sucks? Even if it does, you don't have to sign up for it.

Yes this wasn't a voting thread, but the people who came out and gave one-liners of support would absolutely sign up for the tier, and would play it. The people who didn't want to play it wouldn't have to sign up for it.

Swap Bo3 for RUbers, or even one of the SV slots because i think Bo3 is still cool. As A fairy suggested, this should NOT be over and we should have some time to respond to what you posted imp.

Also I know this will just get me haha'd so whatever, but imp and vesp haha-ing everyone who likes RUbers feels disrespectful.
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Stopped reading at "swap bo3 at RUbers".
Come on now. It was the most requested slot.

In all seriousness,

Ignoring the one-liners is valid because it is a blatant disregard to the format of the thread and was announced incorrectly in the Ubers RU server with them framing it as a vote.

Imperial isn't involved with operating SS Ubers UU, and was only running room tours in vesp's place. Saying that there's some sort of collusion because Imperial approved a thread request for pastgen metagame is ridiculous regardless of who posted it, nor has RUbers to my knowledge actually tried getting or even making one.


While I disagree with Imperial mentioning activity in any capacity in the post... they have 0 obligation to help Ubers RU. If Ubers RU suddenly stopped being active after the PL thread went live while SS ubers UU has gained activity... That's the matters of the tiers themselves.

You can very much not like or think a tier sucks on a fundamental level without playing it, simply by seeing what Pokemon are legal. My biggest issue with Uber RU before was the incredibly arbitrary cutoff point being forced to try and balance the tier- which I am glad is being addressed to make it a more proper VR tier, and I am interested to see what it looks like post shifts.

That being said, ultimately no matter how hard it is pushed I don't like the constant insinuations that Ubers RU has to be in this tour and tone of this post overall, and the blatant disregard of the negative sentiment others hold about the tier doesn't change the fact that it's real.
 
the reasons against ubers ru are bonkers and illogical, but the format that was posted makes sense and hopefully there's enough interest in the tour next year to expand to 8 slots and we can look into adding ubers ru then after more development. calling it not a part of ubers uu bc of one letter difference is bonkers to me but to each their own i guess

tldr: format makes sense given a reasonable attempt to not overshoot interest but the only valid reason to exclude ubers ru is that it's about to massively change metagames tbh
 
KineSquared said:
Ubers UU is the introduction of a tiering system, and RUbers is the next step of that tiering system
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Isn't this like only true when it was based on usage rates in uubers? Like I see your point with the "its not uubers" thing cus technically rubers could just be called lower tier uubers or smth else but like I feel like the main thing is just that it isn't usage based, but you can't just write off the fact that it is called what it is since you don't see stuff like RU in UU/OU tours. I also think that the fact that this is the FIRST EVER uuberspl means being extra careful and picky about what tiers are being added (Adding here ive never hosted a tour and am not part of this so take this all with a grain of salt), and making sure that the UU part of the name is kept up just feels like a good idea/important to me. This tour is going to be pretty important, especially running alongside the swiss so keeping consistency feels like the right call.


KineSquared said:
Yes this wasn't a voting thread, but
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This + the controversial line feels like you missed that the VAST majority of ubersru "votes" were either #1 or #5. We have to admit there is some polarization going on here right and the whole purpose of the thread. Is a tier thats averaging around the same spot in support not a better pick if the votes for it are not outliers? And yes I know imperial also said it was controversial, my point still stands that I don't think it was the best word to use in either case.

Like yes maybe imperial could've/should've worded things different but what you said was not the best way to go about having issues with it. I think at the core of the argument what imperial said is reasonable that "of the two tiers with similar support we went with the one that is less polarized" outside of the other stuff
 
SBAP said:
you don't see stuff like RU in UU/OU tours
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RU and UU are different communities in a way Ubers UU and Ubers RU are not. RU and UU have many similar tiers they could pick from, and Ubers UU only has Ubers RU (or maybe ubers proper, but that's a different community) in the "tiers starting from ubers" camp. RU does not need help establishing itself, Ubers RU does.
SBAP said:
the FIRST EVER uuberspl means being extra careful and picky about what tiers are being added
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And this also means not ostracizing the community that likes ubers RU, which, as I said, is the same community as our own. The rpecedents we set now will carry forward into the future, and we should be considerate of that
 
hi kine. awesome post. I love conspiracy theories.
KineSquared said:
You quote activity, what activity has there been for SS Ubers UU? The organizers of this PL, vesp and imp, decided to start working on SS Ubers UU. Vesp got the discord active again, and Imp hosted tour after tour of it in the UM room. Vesp was given permission by imperial, a forum moderator, to start a SS Ubers UU thread. Ocean is not as close a friend to imp, nor does he have the forum moderator or room owner status on showdown. The organizers themselves boosted the activity of SS ubers UU and are now saying "welp, activity matters". It was your choice to not boost rubers, and I even requested that you do it but it was shut down. Shame on you for being dishonest like that. RUbers was more active before the PL discussion started, and the organizers decided they didn't want to help them but did want to help SS.
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See the only time activity was quoted was here, where it is much more of a sidenote than a real argument. Truthfully, the only thing that matters about that post was the part before activity was mentioned as it is the real reason why RUbers was excluded. Activity does not matter to us very much in this regard, it's that there wasn't very much support for it outside of one-liners.
KineSquared said:
The organizers themselves boosted the activity of SS ubers UU and are now saying "welp, activity matters". It was your choice to not boost rubers, and I even requested that you do it but it was shut down. Shame on you for being dishonest like that. RUbers was more active before the PL discussion started, and the organizers decided they didn't want to help them but did want to help SS.
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Hi kine. if you wanted to boost RUbers, you could've, but you didn't. My job isn't to boost RUbers, and I wasn't boosting SS Ubers UU because I liked it more than RUbers, I was boosting it because I MADE THE TIER. The RUbers moderators and leaders chose not to boost activity while I tried to get SS Ubers UU into a competitive state. You're framing me(the fucking tier leader) boosting SS Ubers UU(the tier I lead) as if its some psyop to hurt Ubers RU. Additionally, I would like to inform you that you have roomtour permissions. If you're going to complain about imperial hosting "tour after tour of it [SS] in the UM room." you could've been doing the same. Which by the way, imperial wasn't doing, I had roomtour permissions and I was using them for the tier I ran. You took me taking care of a tier I created and decided to come onto the forums and pretend like it was a psyop of some sort.
KineSquared said:
Swap Bo3 for RUbers, or even one of the SV slots because i think Bo3 is still cool. As A fairy suggested, this should NOT be over and we should have some time to respond to what you posted imp.
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Why would we slot RUbers(the least popular tier, with only 7 people in favor of it excluding 1 liners), over the most popular slot in Bo3 that almost everyone wanted?
KineSquared said:
Ubers UU is the introduction of a tiering system, and RUbers is the next step of that tiering system. While yes it does not have the name, it is the next logical continuation of the "start from Ubers" tiering. You can go back to older gens and apply the logic, which is how you get SS ubers UU, or you can apply it downwards and get Ubers RU.
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I could apply much of this argument to UU and RU, and if you don't believe me, here is me doing exactly that.
"UU is the introduction of a tiering system, and RU is the next step of that tiering system. While yes it does not have the name, it is the next logical continuation of the "start from OU" tiering. You can go back to older gens and apply the logic, which is how you get SS UU, or you can apply it downwards and get RU."
Saying that a past generation of a tier and a tier inspired by Ubers UU are the same amount of related to one another is pretty confusing and frankly just feels like you're grasping at straws.
KineSquared said:
(2) "The metagame sucks". It's ABOUT to get overturned with the new VR, and when was the last time you played it? When was the last time it got serious development and thought put into it? How do you know it sucks? Even if it does, you don't have to sign up for it.
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I would actually argue that people not wanting to put a tier in a for fun tournament because they think it's not fun is perfectly reasonable. "how do you know it sucks" well for one the person who won the kickoff tour said so. Saying that people not wanting a tier in the tournament is stupid because they can "just not sign up for it" is a bad argument, because why have a thread asking for what the community wants if when they don't want a tier to make it into the tournament they can just not sign up for that tier.

Also for the record imperial is the one who brought up the format we decided on, before any of you say me leading SS Ubers UU was some sort of conflict of interest.
 
Ubers RU clearly has enough support in this thread to be included. Its true that it doesn’t have to be included, and the tour will still function without it, but I don’t think its in any way shape or form correct to say it doesn’t have the support. The only argument that has any merit whatsoever over not including it is that the other options had more support. The slander against RUUbers for the other reasons are a bit of a joke, and I do agree much of these argument are forced because people either don’t like it or don’t want to include it.

We could very easily add two more slots like AM says. RUUbers should be included in this tour, but not at the expense of other tiers that got more support. I’m iffy as to whether it actually had more support than SS as I don’t think ignoring one liners is correct either. You can decide not to put a lot of stake in one liners, but they are opinions just like everyone else and you do need to acknowledge they exist. It’s always going to be arbitrary on how much consideration to give them and all the other posts, but it is abundantly clear that RUUbers has enough support to function in the tour.
 
Poosh_i said:
Stopped reading at "swap bo3 at RUbers".
Come on now. It was the most requested slot.

In all seriousness,

Ignoring the one-liners is valid because it is a blatant disregard to the format of the thread and was announced incorrectly in the Ubers RU server with them framing it as a vote.

Imperial isn't involved with operating SS Ubers UU, and was only running room tours in vesp's place. Saying that there's some sort of collusion because Imperial approved a thread request for pastgen metagame is ridiculous regardless of who posted it, nor has RUbers to my knowledge actually tried getting or even making one.


While I disagree with Imperial mentioning activity in any capacity in the post... they have 0 obligation to help Ubers RU. If Ubers RU suddenly stopped being active after the PL thread went live while SS ubers UU has gained activity... That's the matters of the tiers themselves.

You can very much not like or think a tier sucks on a fundamental level without playing it, simply by seeing what Pokemon are legal. My biggest issue with Uber RU before was the incredibly arbitrary cutoff point being forced to try and balance the tier- which I am glad is being addressed to make it a more proper VR tier, and I am interested to see what it looks like post shifts.

That being said, ultimately no matter how hard it is pushed I don't like the constant insinuations that Ubers RU has to be in this tour and tone of this post overall, and the blatant disregard of the negative sentiment others hold about the tier doesn't change the fact that it's real.
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BigFatMantis said:
Ubers RU clearly has enough support in this thread to be included. Its true that it doesn’t have to be included, and the tour will still function without it, but I don’t think its in any way shape or form correct to say it doesn’t have the support. The only argument that has any merit whatsoever over not including it is that the other options had more support. The slander against RUUbers for the other reasons are a bit of a joke, and I do agree much of these argument are forced because people either don’t like it or don’t want to include it.

We could very easily add two more slots like AM says. RUUbers should be included in this tour, but not at the expense of other tiers that got more support. I’m iffy as to whether it actually had more support than SS as I don’t think ignoring one liners is correct either. You can decide not to put a lot of stake in one liners, but they are opinions just like everyone else and you do need to acknowledge they exist. It’s always going to be arbitrary on how much consideration to give them and all the other posts, but it is abundantly clear that RUUbers has enough support to function in the tour.
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The one-liners shouldn't count in the sense that they do absolutely nothing to actually advocate for the tier they want to see in the tour. I haven't yet seen a single argument as to what makes ubers ru actually interesting or unique from a balance or competitive perspective. This is... Kind of important for changing people's views of a tier?

If we genuinely have enough sign ups I would be interested in seeing it bumped to 8 but I'm really not convinced that there will be remotely enough numbers for that. Adding 2 slots requires so many more players to sign up, and that isn't a guarantee of quality
 
I feel like the big issue that people are overlooking here is the REAL reason that imperial is pushing this mysterious "SS Ubers UU" tier. What region does Sword and Shield take place in? What real life location is that region based off of? Once you ask yourself these questions, only then will things become clear to you...

That aside, I did some numbers about the rankings in the thread, including the "one-liners' that everyone is so obsessed about. I know this isn't really a voter thread, but bear with me. Ubers RU had an average rank of around 2.8, while SS Ubers UU had an average rank of ~2.1 (lower=better). More importantly however, is that more than 85% of players wanted SS Ubers UU in Top 2, compared to ~55% for Ubers RU.

Point is, I don't like the notion that the decision to put BO3 (top voted) and SS Ubers UU as the last 2 tiers was some sort of corrupt robbery. People liked those slots, and some provided pretty decent reasons. Hopefully in the future, all of these tiers will have a big enough player base to the point we wouldn't have to choose. But blaming the tournament organizers and tier leaders is ridiculous. I haven't given up on Ubers RU though, and I hope with some good decisions in the future they can gain more attention and acknowledgement. #Ocean2024
 
STRONGLY recommend against attaching some "if signups look good we can make it 8 slots/8 teams/both/whatever" idea, stick to 6 even if signups look good. the easiest way to cause problems for a tour is by changing what people are signing up for partway through signups. it CAN work, SOMETIMES, but doing it in the first existence of a tour? nah. if signups look good, revisit for next year.
 
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